Commons Chamber
Monday 8th June 2026
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14:33
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Order, Order, order. Order, order. Before Order, order. Before we Order, order. Before we come Order, order. Before we come to Order, order. Before we come to the start of today's business, can I welcome in the gallery? Her Excellency, the president of the German Bundestag. Right. We come to questions. Secretary of State for the Home Department, doctor Danny Chambers Mr Speaker, home secretary. Yeah.
14:34
14:34
14:34
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Dodson Danny Chambers. Home Secretary for her response. In Winchester Hospital, we have 104 different nationalities working there and also throughout Hampshire. Over one third of the workers in the social care sector are born outside the EU. And we know statistically we're more likely to be waiting or be cared for or treated by an immigrant than we are treated by an immigrant than we are to be waiting behind one for a GP appointment. Does the Home Secretary recognise that the Secretary recognise that the current visa rules for healthcare workers are actually driving away? Many of the people who are keeping Many of the people who are keeping our NHS and social care services running?
14:35
Dr Danny Chambers MP (Winchester, Liberal Democrat)
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Dr Danny Chambers MP (Winchester, Liberal Democrat)
Home Secretary let me say to the hon. Gentleman, no one disputes the tremendous contribution that international workers make to our NHS. The picture he describes is replicated in constituencies across the country. We will always welcome that contribution. But overseas recruitment in the NHS is falling. But that is primarily because the NHS is leading by example and doing NHS is leading by example and doing what we want all employers to do, which is look first at domestic recruitment to ensure that the recruitment to ensure that the skills and expertise of the health service is home grown.
I believe that these two systems can sit hand in hand together, but we do have to make changes at the same time.
I believe that these two systems can sit hand in hand together, but we do have to make changes at the same time.
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14:36
Christine Jardine MP (Edinburgh West, Liberal Democrat)
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Christine Jardine MP (Edinburgh West, Liberal Democrat)
sectors are telling me that despite their efforts to recruit domestically first, the Home domestically first, the Home Secretary's changes to indefinite leave to remain are making it very leave to remain are making it very difficult for them to attract the skilled workforce from abroad that they need to keep the sector going. they need to keep the sector going. So will the Home Secretary reconsider in light of that impact, and lighten the regulations to make it possible for these companies to survive?
14:36
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Well, I do say to the hon. Lady that we have to remember that at this point in our country, we have over a million young people who are over a million young people who are not in employment, education and training. And she should want, like all members should want, for us to turn that around and make sure turn that around and make sure there are employment opportunities in many of the sectors that she describes for those young people to have a positive economic future in their own country.
And we are the government that has formalised that link between migration and skills reforms to make sure that companies are investing in the domestic workforce first and foremost before recruiting from abroad.
And we are the government that has formalised that link between migration and skills reforms to make sure that companies are investing in the domestic workforce first and foremost before recruiting from abroad.
14:37
Dr Rupa Huq MP (Ealing Central and Acton, Labour)
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Dr Rupa Huq MP (Ealing Central and Acton, Labour)
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It's a proud fact that four out of ten of proud fact that four out of ten of the world's greatest universities on the global rankings are in the UK, including Imperial College UK, including Imperial College London's White City campus in my seat. So we punch way above our seat. So we punch way above our population weight and are genuine engines of growth. But the evidence does show that the withdrawal of the Post-study work visa, coupled with the rumours about changes in ILR, are driving some of those brightest brains that cause those statistics to competitor countries.
Would my right hon. Friend meet with me, education Ministers and my two vice Chancellors to thrash out a solution? There are real problems, but we don't want to scare off genuine innovators and wealth creators.
Would my right hon. Friend meet with me, education Ministers and my two vice Chancellors to thrash out a solution? There are real problems, but we don't want to scare off genuine innovators and wealth creators.
14:37
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Secretary. >> Secretary. >> Well, again, I say to my hon. Friend, firstly, we have this is the government that has increased routes at the very top end of the routes at the very top end of the skill spectrum, like our global talent, visa and other routes to make sure we are attracting talent make sure we are attracting talent from all over the world. We have a good track record in doing so. We will continue that as we move forward. There are there are there is work to do with our university sector to make sure that students recruited to this country are good courses making a contribution.
And then obviously, we want to be able to make sure that we use the best of that global talent in the future. As well, the changes that we are making are not about students. Students don't come to attain indefinite leave to remain in our country. They are for other parts of the migration system. I'll make sure, though, that she gets a meeting with the Migration Minister to discuss these matters in more detail.
And then obviously, we want to be able to make sure that we use the best of that global talent in the future. As well, the changes that we are making are not about students. Students don't come to attain indefinite leave to remain in our country. They are for other parts of the migration system. I'll make sure, though, that she gets a meeting with the Migration Minister to discuss these matters in more detail.
14:38
Mr Jonathan Brash MP (Hartlepool, Labour)
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Mr Jonathan Brash MP (Hartlepool, Labour)
Jonathan Brash. globalisation and taking advantage of these unprecedented falls in immigration. Thanks to this Home Secretary and training our own, whether it's through our Health and Social Care Academy, our Civil Engineering academy, our Centre of Excellence for welding or our Nuclear Trades Academy. Does the Secretary of State agree with me that rather than seeing this as an economic threat, falling immigration is an economic Secretary.
14:39
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. It is imperative at a point where we have over a million young where we have over a million young people not in employment, education or training that we do not make progress in this area. We would be progress in this area. We would be letting our young people down. If we do not take this opportunity to make sure that we are investing in our domestic skills workforce. This is a cross-government priority and the Home Office is playing its full part.
14:39
Katie Lam MP (Weald of Kent, Conservative)
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Katie Lam MP (Weald of Kent, Conservative)
Minister Katie Lam. latest estimates indicate that 627,000 non-EU migrants, mostly from low income countries, came to the UK between December 2024 and December 2025. Meanwhile, 61,000 Brits aged 16 to 24 left the UK, as did another 65,000 aged 25 to 34. In recent years, for every young Briton who has been employed, 27 young migrants from outside the EU have also joined the workforce. Does the Home Secretary accept that mass migration has wrecked economic opportunity for young people, and how will that inform any changes she makes to the Immigration Rules? When almost two thirds of a million non-EU migrants still came to this country last year?
14:40
14:40
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
Douglas McAllister question number two, please, Mr. Speaker. Mr. >> And there were several large scale events in London. >> On the 16th of May, Unite the Kingdom being one of them. And I had several briefings with the met had several briefings with the met who took a robust approach to the United Kingdom rally. And I was in the control room on the 16th of May to see the operation for myself.
14:40
Douglas McAllister MP (West Dunbartonshire, Labour)
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Douglas McAllister MP (West Dunbartonshire, Labour)
Douglas McAllister thank you, Mr. Speaker. What happens in our Mr. Speaker. What happens in our capital city has a knock on effect across our entire country. My West Dunbartonshire constituent contacted me to express her deep concern and shock at the abhorrent displays. At the United Kingdom rally, participants openly incited racial hatred with inflammatory speeches, but more significantly, provocative Islamophobic stunts involving mocking the religious dress of Muslim women. I understand that those responsible were not arrested, and I share my constituents disgust.
Can I ask the Minister if she is satisfied with the Metropolitan Police response, and what future action will be considered to prevent a reoccurrence? Minister.
Can I ask the Minister if she is satisfied with the Metropolitan Police response, and what future action will be considered to prevent a reoccurrence? Minister.
14:41
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
I would say to my hon. Friend that the Metropolitan Police Service maintained public order and Service maintained public order and kept Londoners safe on a day of very unprecedented large scale events. 43 arrests were made at the events. 43 arrests were made at the United Kingdom rally and the 78th March for Palestine, and indeed in advance. 11 foreign nationals were prevented from entering the UK to speak at the event and prevented by the met from broadcasting into the event. So I of course, I understand the concerns that his constituent is raising, but I think the Metropolitan Police, with their 4000 officers on that day, did a very good job.
14:42
Shockat Adam MP (Leicester South, Independent)
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Shockat Adam MP (Leicester South, Independent)
Shockat Adam thank you, Mr. Speaker. Many in the Muslim community are feeling bewildered, community are feeling bewildered, besieged and absolutely beleaguered when they exercise their democratic right to vote. And if the results right to vote. And if the results don't go a certain way, they are accused of sectarianism when they take to the streets to protest peacefully against a genocide, they are accused of hate marches, all the while witnessing not one, but two unite the kingdom marches where? Where there are open calls for their expulsion from this country with apparent indifference.
So can I ask the Home Secretary what steps is she taking to protect this community from further alienation? And what message does she send to them?
So can I ask the Home Secretary what steps is she taking to protect this community from further alienation? And what message does she send to them?
14:42
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
Yeah, Minister. all forms of hate crime, including anti-Muslim hostility, and we are actively seeking to ensure the safety and protection of all individuals and communities. The UK has a proud tradition of racial and religious tolerance within the law, and this government is absolutely committed to to building a strong and integrated society that I think thank.
14:43
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You, Mr. Speaker. Last week I met with one of my constituents who had faced horrible racist abuse on the train home by those who had been on the Unite the Kingdom rally. As someone of mixed white and As someone of mixed white and Middle Eastern heritage, she told me that for the first time, she felt scared in her own country. Does the Minister agree with me that we have a responsibility to tackle racial divisions across our country and not ignite them, and that when the leader of reform UK takes to the airwaves in the aftermath of heightened racial tensions to tell the public they must react with pure cold rage.
It is people like my constituents who pay the price.
It is people like my constituents who pay the price.
14:43
14:43
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
about. I notice that reform are very quick to slam into the TV very quick to slam into the TV stations as soon as something occurs, but they don't then come to this place to debate it in the this place to debate it in the normal way. Members of this House and beyond have a critical role to play in building the strong and play in building the strong and integrated society that we all want to see, one not fuelled by hatred and division.
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and division. Lisa Smart Mr. Speaker, the Minister, I think, speaks for the whole House in thanking the Metropolitan Police for policing, riots and protests that go beyond the realms of what's legally
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and division. Lisa Smart Mr. Speaker, the Minister, I think, speaks for the whole House in thanking the Metropolitan Police for policing, riots and protests that go beyond the realms of what's legally
14:44
Lisa Smart MP (Hazel Grove, Liberal Democrat)
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Lisa Smart MP (Hazel Grove, Liberal Democrat)
appropriate or acceptable. And that should happen to everybody, whatever the subject of their protest. I wonder if she agrees with me, though, that the rules regarding donations to fund these rallies, which one of the organisers, Stephen Yaxley-Lennon, has thanked his donors for? He's a prominent member of a political party. The rules should apply to party. The rules should apply to him as much as anybody involved in politics about declaring those donations and the transparency that donations and the transparency that comes with the expectation of this House and my Hazel Grove constituents.
Does she agree with me that anybody receiving money
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from domestic or foreign sources should declare them? I'm not quite sure it fits in
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I'm not quite sure it fits in with policing of you now. That's the trouble. Very good question, but not for today. Luke Charters Mr. Speaker, several of my constituents have had several of my constituents have had their identities stolen with devastating consequences. Question number three, I do apologise.
Does she agree with me that anybody receiving money
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from domestic or foreign sources should declare them? I'm not quite sure it fits in
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I'm not quite sure it fits in with policing of you now. That's the trouble. Very good question, but not for today. Luke Charters Mr. Speaker, several of my constituents have had several of my constituents have had their identities stolen with devastating consequences. Question number three, I do apologise.
14:45
Q3. What steps her Department is taking to help tackle identity fraud. (900264)
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Q3. What steps her Department is taking to help tackle identity fraud. (900264)
number three, I do apologise. >> Number three. Yes, Mr. Speaker, we've launched a new £250. >> Million.
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Million. Fraud strategy focussed on preventing fraud, protecting victims and strengthening enforcement. We're working closely with the City of London Police to establish referral routes to identity fraud. Victims can access identity fraud. Victims can access identity repair services and we will continue to develop guidance, tools and partnerships to help tools and partnerships to help victims recover quickly and reduce repeat harm.
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Million. Fraud strategy focussed on preventing fraud, protecting victims and strengthening enforcement. We're working closely with the City of London Police to establish referral routes to identity fraud. Victims can access identity fraud. Victims can access identity repair services and we will continue to develop guidance, tools and partnerships to help tools and partnerships to help victims recover quickly and reduce repeat harm.
14:45
14:45
Mr Luke Charters MP (York Outer, Labour)
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Mr Luke Charters MP (York Outer, Labour)
member of our armed forces had his house purchase delayed after his credit file was risk. And too often credit file was risk. And too often we see identity theft has been bundled into other offences like computer misuse and not pursued at all. And so, having been a counter-fraud specialist, I know how widespread this has become. So will my right hon. Friend meet me will my right hon. Friend meet me and campaigners to discuss the case for how identity fraud should
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become a standalone offence? Well, Mr. Speaker, I am grateful to my hon. Friend who speaks with real authority on these matters. He will know that the theft of personal information is already criminalised under legislation,
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become a standalone offence? Well, Mr. Speaker, I am grateful to my hon. Friend who speaks with real authority on these matters. He will know that the theft of personal information is already criminalised under legislation,
14:46
Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
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Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
including the Fraud Act of 2006, the Computer Misuse Act of 1999, and the Data Protection Act of 2018. But to ensure these laws remain effective, we commissioned the independent Review of Disclosures and fraud offences and the review has now been submitted its final report to government and will be published shortly. We will consider its findings carefully, including what further action may be needed what further action may be needed to strengthen our response to identity fraud. I am sure that the noble Lord Hanson would happily meet with my hon.
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meet with my hon. Friend Gregory Stafford. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My constituency surgery on Friday, Mr. de Mesquita spoke to me about how he had concerns that report fraud were not passing on to local police forces, information about those victims of identity fraud, given those victims are often vulnerable and likely to be victims of other crimes, can the Minister let us know what he is doing to ensure know what he is doing to ensure that report fraud is passing on to local police forces of details of local police forces of details of victims of these crimes?
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meet with my hon. Friend Gregory Stafford. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My constituency surgery on Friday, Mr. de Mesquita spoke to me about how he had concerns that report fraud were not passing on to local police forces, information about those victims of identity fraud, given those victims are often vulnerable and likely to be victims of other crimes, can the Minister let us know what he is doing to ensure know what he is doing to ensure that report fraud is passing on to local police forces of details of local police forces of details of victims of these crimes?
14:47
14:47
Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
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Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
he will see that the government have invested £250 million of investment into working with a range of different organisations to range of different organisations to draw down on the levels of fraud that we're seeing. That includes, of course, law enforcement, Gchq, of course, law enforcement, Gchq, banks, telecommunications and tech partners, and civil society. We've also invested £31 million for a new online crime centre. But I look carefully at the points that he makes and refer them to Lord Hanson.
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makes and refer them to Lord Hanson. Cat Smith Mr Speaker Minister. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Our immigration system must operate in a way that attracts the best and the brightest, and settlement will reward those who integrate and contribute to this country with shorter pathways for higher earners and those in public service roles, amongst others. We are now carefully considering responses to our public public consultation our public public consultation before setting out next steps.
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makes and refer them to Lord Hanson. Cat Smith Mr Speaker Minister. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Our immigration system must operate in a way that attracts the best and the brightest, and settlement will reward those who integrate and contribute to this country with shorter pathways for higher earners and those in public service roles, amongst others. We are now carefully considering responses to our public public consultation our public public consultation before setting out next steps.
14:48
14:48
Laura Kyrke-Smith MP (Aylesbury, Labour)
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Laura Kyrke-Smith MP (Aylesbury, Labour)
skilled worker visas. The proposed changes to ILR put many of my local residents, including Sri Lankans and Indians, in a very uncertain and Indians, in a very uncertain and difficult position. When they arrived, the clear path to settlement was five years. Now they settlement was five years. Now they don't know what to plan or to hope for, and it's equally difficult for their employers, whether that's the care sector, nurseries or hospitality businesses like Crawley. So can the Minister tell me what reassurance I can offer to these skilled legal migrants who are such
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skilled legal migrants who are such an important part of our communities? Minister. I thank my hon. Friend for her question. It sounds like a fantastic restaurant, but like the Home Secretary has already laid out, there are around 1 million young people currently out of education, employment or training. We are creating a system that's firm, that
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skilled legal migrants who are such an important part of our communities? Minister. I thank my hon. Friend for her question. It sounds like a fantastic restaurant, but like the Home Secretary has already laid out, there are around 1 million young people currently out of education, employment or training. We are creating a system that's firm, that
14:49
Mike Tapp MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Dover and Deal, Labour)
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Mike Tapp MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Dover and Deal, Labour)
protects the economy, that protects welfare from rising further, avoids more pressure on our social housing more pressure on our social housing demands, but is also fair. So it encourages and rewards genuine encourages and rewards genuine economic contribution and integration. We have consulted and had 200,000 responses and are had 200,000 responses and are working on a final solution, and that will be announced in due course. Ben Obese-Jecty thank you, course. Ben Obese-Jecty thank you, Mr. Speaker. Last week, the government voted against my amendment to the Armed Forces Bill, new clause five, which would have seen visa fees waived for the spouses and children of armed
14:49
Ben Obese-Jecty MP (Huntingdon, Conservative)
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Ben Obese-Jecty MP (Huntingdon, Conservative)
forces personnel and veterans. This was, of course, a Labour manifesto pledge, as it was a conservative manifesto pledge as well to ensure manifesto pledge as well to ensure that the family of those who have fought to defend this country are allowed to reside here without being charged. Now £3,229 per person just to remain in the country following service. I understand that it's a Home Office understand that it's a Home Office issue rather than a defence issue that this hasn't been pursued. So could the Minister explain to me why this hasn't been progressed in why this hasn't been progressed in two years, and could he give an update on whether this will be amended when the changes come later
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in this year? Minister, it's not quite. I thank the hon. Member for his question. As a veteran, this is an important question. I absolutely respect it. What I will say is I'm working with colleagues in the
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working with colleagues in the Ministry of Defence at this moment to deliver this important manifesto commitment. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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in this year? Minister, it's not quite. I thank the hon. Member for his question. As a veteran, this is an important question. I absolutely respect it. What I will say is I'm working with colleagues in the
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working with colleagues in the Ministry of Defence at this moment to deliver this important manifesto commitment. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
14:50
Mike Tapp MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Dover and Deal, Labour)
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Mike Tapp MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Dover and Deal, Labour)
>> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. >> Question number five, please. >> Minister. >> As with new technology,
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As with new technology, decisions around procuring and using AI are a matter for operationally independent chief constables, and the Home Office is supporting the police to adopt AI rapidly and responsibly. We have £115 million of investment over the next three years, which includes investing in the National Centre investing in the National Centre for AI, which will help the police making make informed decisions.
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As with new technology, decisions around procuring and using AI are a matter for operationally independent chief constables, and the Home Office is supporting the police to adopt AI rapidly and responsibly. We have £115 million of investment over the next three years, which includes investing in the National Centre investing in the National Centre for AI, which will help the police making make informed decisions.
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14:50
Martin Wrigley MP (Newton Abbot, Liberal Democrat)
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Martin Wrigley MP (Newton Abbot, Liberal Democrat)
I thank the Minister for that answer. of avoiding competitive, tender and scrutiny by using free trials and locking up the contract specifications after getting a foot in the door. I congratulate the London mayor for stopping the recent potential contract offered by the Met Police without competitive tender process. However, last week the estimated £17 million contract for the National Firearms Licensing Management System was won by a bid from Palantir, offering just £7.5 million for a £17 million contract, which is just 44% of the expected price.
This suggests either a massive error estimation or Palantir buying the job, giving them unfettered access to whisper in the ear of all 43 police forces. Will the Minister pause the signing of the contract, due this Thursday, for appropriate scrutiny to take place to ensure that competitive, tender process has been followed transparently? Minister.
This suggests either a massive error estimation or Palantir buying the job, giving them unfettered access to whisper in the ear of all 43 police forces. Will the Minister pause the signing of the contract, due this Thursday, for appropriate scrutiny to take place to ensure that competitive, tender process has been followed transparently? Minister.
14:51
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
I can assure the hon. Gentleman that Palantir aren't buying the job that Palantir aren't buying the job in the Home Office. We have very robust processes which were followed in full. The current licence management system is approaching its end of life, and it is very important that we have a good one to maintain safety. There was an open and competitive process by the police digital service and Blue Light commercial who do these things on behalf of policing. He's right.
The contract is yet to be signed. They are the preferred supplier and all of the right processes were followed.
The contract is yet to be signed. They are the preferred supplier and all of the right processes were followed.
14:52
Chris Vince MP (Harlow, Labour )
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Chris Vince MP (Harlow, Labour )
Chris Vince thank you, Mr. Speaker. I welcome the new legal framework around facial recognition framework around facial recognition technician. And we've seen successful trials of this in Harlow. However, does the Minister agree with me that it's essential this with me that it's essential this technology is deployed lawfully, proportionately and with accountability, and this is taken into account when any government contract is granted.
14:52
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
I agree with my hon. Friends that live facial recognition is that live facial recognition is extraordinarily innovative, new technology that helps us to catch really nasty criminals in my own really nasty criminals in my own constituency and in other parts of the country, and we are investing in it through our police reform agenda. We are also legislating for it because we totally recognise that there is some uncertainty about what it's used for and how it should be used. So we want to put that right.
Be really clear, put it on the face of legislation.
Be really clear, put it on the face of legislation.
14:53
Mike Tapp MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Dover and Deal, Labour)
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Mike Tapp MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Dover and Deal, Labour)
Jack Rankin number six, please, sir. sir. >> Minister thank you, Mr. Speaker. Living in this country permanently is a privilege and one that should is a privilege and one that should be earned, not granted by default. We're currently analysing 200 000 consultation responses, and we expect to introduce major reforms in the autumn.
14:53
Jack Rankin MP (Windsor, Conservative)
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Jack Rankin MP (Windsor, Conservative)
Thank you, Mr. Zoe Franklin. >> Thank you, Mr. Zoe Franklin. >> January 25th. I urge the government to act on indefinite leave to remain to prevent the fiscal calamity of locking in the fiscal calamity of locking in the Boris wave. I thank the Ministers for their movement in this regard. It's important that we're transparent with the public about who is using visas as a route to a life on benefits. Can the Minister provide an estimate of the number and proportion of individuals holding ILR who are currently in
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receipt of Universal Credit? Minister thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Minister thank you, Mr. Speaker. As of January 2026, 222 000 people were actively claiming Universal
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receipt of Universal Credit? Minister thank you, Mr. Speaker.
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Minister thank you, Mr. Speaker. As of January 2026, 222 000 people were actively claiming Universal
14:54
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14:54
Jo Platt MP (Leigh and Atherton, Labour )
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Jo Platt MP (Leigh and Atherton, Labour )
Jo Platt thank you, Mr. Speaker, >> Jo Platt thank you, Mr. Speaker, and and can I thank the Home Secretary as we welcome the creation of the government's High Street Organised Crime Unit and particularly its focus on strengthened partnership working between enforcement agencies. So in Leigh and Atherton, communities can see this commitment, but are asking when they will see action on dodgy shops operating in plain sight. So, given the national campaign I have launched with colleagues, will the Minister set out when enforcement will begin locally, how partnerships will be delivered and ensure these criminal enterprises are shut down without delay?
14:55
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Home Secretary. work in this area. Greater Manchester is one of three hotspot areas selected for an enhanced operational crackdown in addition operational crackdown in addition to the nationwide campaign. I obviously can't comment on specific dates due to operational sensitivities, but the public can expect to see the start of a major offensive against dodgy shops beginning this year.
14:55
Rt Hon Dame Karen Bradley MP (Staffordshire Moorlands, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Dame Karen Bradley MP (Staffordshire Moorlands, Conservative)
Dame Karen Bradley, chair of the Select Committee. The Home Secretary will, I'm sure, be aware of the Select Committee's inquiry that we're conducting on the role organised criminality plays in the crime that we see on plays in the crime that we see on our high streets. We heard a very compelling evidence recently about counterfeit goods and the role they play, and the the role that forced labour plays throughout that supply chain. So could the Home Secretary explain what she's doing to combat forced labour? And I look forward to putting more questions to her when she plays before my committee, before the summer recess.
14:56
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Home Secretary it's always a >> Home Secretary it's always a pleasure to appear before the Home Affairs Select Committee, and let me thank her for her work and that of her Committee on this important area. She will know that the recent money that we've announced will money that we've announced will fund work for trading standards for HMRC and immigration enforcement as well. And of course, if we pick up cases of forced labour that will engage the modern slavery obligations that we have.
So it is very much part of a full spectrum response to what we know is a complex issue. I've seen some of those counterfeit goods myself. When I joined the police on a raid at the end of last week. It is a
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real problem and the government is making sure that we are funding every aspect of how we fix it. The.
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Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Extremism in the UK. Question
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number eight. Mr. Speaker, the government is
So it is very much part of a full spectrum response to what we know is a complex issue. I've seen some of those counterfeit goods myself. When I joined the police on a raid at the end of last week. It is a
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real problem and the government is making sure that we are funding every aspect of how we fix it. The.
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Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Extremism in the UK. Question
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number eight. Mr. Speaker, the government is
14:56
Q8. What steps her Department is taking to help tackle extremism. (900269)
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Q8. What steps her Department is taking to help tackle extremism. (900269)
>> Mr. Speaker, the government is delivering a fundamental reset of how we counter extremism. This includes publishing an annual State includes publishing an annual State of Extremism report, which will arm frontline public sector workers with the information they need to tackle extremism in the UK.
14:57
14:57
Damien Egan MP (Bristol North East, Labour)
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Damien Egan MP (Bristol North East, Labour)
being fuelled by increasingly brazen interference from foreign states. We need to be clear eyed states. We need to be clear eyed about these threats. At a recent summit hosted by Wilton Park, I heard how countries like Norway now heard how countries like Norway now treat extremism as a national security priority, linking it more to defence. So I'd like to ask if the Minister will consider establishing a proper mechanism so we can designate domestic extremist groups. And will they commit to recognising extremism and social cohesion as a first tier national security priority?
14:57
Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
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Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
Well, Mr. Speaker, I'm grateful >> Well, Mr. Speaker, I'm grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his attention to these important matters as set out in protecting what matters. The government recognises countering extremism and enhancing social cohesion as a priority area, and we set out a range of commitments in order to achieve this. Although there is no explicit offence of extremism, the police have a range of tools and powers to counter the activities of extremists. We are fast tracking the creation of a new state threats designation power, which will further clamp down on individuals and groups carrying out hostile activity for foreign states.
14:58
Rt Hon Sir Oliver Dowden MP (Hertsmere, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Sir Oliver Dowden MP (Hertsmere, Conservative)
So, Oliver Dowden, thank you, >> So, Oliver Dowden, thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm sure the Minister will have seen footage of a recent attack on Helen Mirren, where she attack on Helen Mirren, where she is described as an excuse. My language, Mr. Speaker, a Zionist. language, Mr. Speaker, a Zionist. This is just another example of deliberate extremist intimidation aimed at frightening off anyone in public life, from either supporting the existence of the state of Israel or defending the Jewish community.
Now, whilst Helen Mirren decided not to press charges. Does the Minister agree that the police should treat such assaults with the utmost seriousness as they are attacked not just on individuals but on our shared values? In this place of freedom of speech and freedom of expression?
Now, whilst Helen Mirren decided not to press charges. Does the Minister agree that the police should treat such assaults with the utmost seriousness as they are attacked not just on individuals but on our shared values? In this place of freedom of speech and freedom of expression?
14:59
Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
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Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
Yes, Minister. the right hon. Gentleman. I think he raises an important point, and I have seen the footage and I'm sure like, all right, honourable and like, all right, honourable and hon. Members will have been shocked but not surprised by it. Clearly, the police have got an important job to do in terms of cracking down on this kind of activity. But let me give him an absolute assurance of the priority that this government attaches to anti-Semitism. We've seen a range of abhorrent anti-Semitic attacks in recent times.
We will do everything we can to stand against them.
We will do everything we can to stand against them.
14:59
Matt Vickers MP (Stockton West, Conservative)
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Matt Vickers MP (Stockton West, Conservative)
Matt Vickers the Minister. >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. >> We've seen the devastating impact of extremism on our country, with the Jewish community with the Jewish community experiencing disgraceful attacks. Does the Minister share my concern that in recent elections, that in recent elections, candidates such as Kate Hollern were threatened with beheading? And more recently, we've seen convicted terrorists stand for election? What will he do to prevent this? And does he believe that individuals with terrorist convictions should be allowed to stand for election?
15:00
Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
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Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
Well, I'm grateful. >> To the shadow Minister, who I think does raise a very important point. He will know that, as the chair of the Defending Democracy chair of the Defending Democracy Task Force, we're looking very carefully at the issues that he's raised, which are abhorrent. I think he makes a powerful point. think he makes a powerful point. The government is considering whether further action is required in this area, and I'd be very happy to work with him on it.
15:00
Q9. What recent progress her Department has made on tackling antisocial behaviour. (900270)
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Q9. What recent progress her Department has made on tackling antisocial behaviour. (900270)
Jim Dickson question number nine, please, Mr. Speaker. Mr. >> Through our Police. >> Crime and Policing Act, we now have new and enhanced powers to have new and enhanced powers to enable local agencies to tackle anti-social, anti-social behaviour offenders, and our Neighbourhood Policing Guarantee has ensured that every police force in England and Wales now has a dedicated anti-social behaviour lead and a anti-social behaviour lead and a local action plan in place to crack down on offenders who blight our communities.
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15:01
Jim Dickson MP (Dartford, Labour)
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Jim Dickson MP (Dartford, Labour)
persistent nuisance due to the anti-social riding of motorbikes anti-social riding of motorbikes and quad bikes in local woodlands over the last few years. And I know from my conversations with the new from my conversations with the new district commander for Dartford and Gravesham that they're starting to use the powers in the Crime and use the powers in the Crime and Policing Act 2026 to seize and crush vehicles and issue community crush vehicles and issue community protection notices to offenders. Can the Minister perhaps tell residents in Dartford how these new powers and other measures put in place by the government will finally tackle this anti-social behaviour at source? Hello Stafford.
15:01
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
Can I thank my hon. Friend for his question and of course, I think we all share the hunger to tackle this awful crime that blights this awful crime that blights communities and through the bill that we have just passed, the Crime and Policing Act as it now is, we have strengthened police powers to swiftly seize vehicles used Antisocially. We have stripped away the requirement to issue a warning, which enables officers to act immediately to take vehicles off the streets.
We're introducing new respect orders, which can tackle persistent offenders in this space and in other spaces, and we are. We've just consulted and will shortly be looking at what we can do to shorten the period for police dispersal so we can crush these things quicker.
We're introducing new respect orders, which can tackle persistent offenders in this space and in other spaces, and we are. We've just consulted and will shortly be looking at what we can do to shorten the period for police dispersal so we can crush these things quicker.
15:02
Jess Brown-Fuller MP (Chichester, Liberal Democrat)
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Jess Brown-Fuller MP (Chichester, Liberal Democrat)
Jess Brown-Fuller thank. we've seen a troubling rise in violence towards wildlife, often using catapults and wildlife. Crime is not an isolated incident. It is not an isolated incident. It usually speaks to something else. In fact, studies have shown that seven out of ten victims of domestic violence who owned a pet said that their domestic abuser was also threatening or harming or killing those pets. So would the Minister please look, Holly's law, which would create an animal cruelty register so we can seriously deter wildlife crime, which often leads to other violent crimes?
15:03
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
Mr. >> Mr. >> We'll certainly look at anything that people are suggesting to tackle wildlife crime. I know that catapults and the use of catapults catapults and the use of catapults is a particular issue. And indeed, I'm having a round table this week with with lots of interested with with lots of interested parties, including people who will, I suspect, be saying the same thing as the hon. Lady. We do fund the Wildlife and Rural Crime Unit, which which brings some some more resource to this as well.
But certainly we'll keep all options on the table.
But certainly we'll keep all options on the table.
15:03
Q11. What recent progress her Department has made on implementing the violence against women and girls strategy. (900272)
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Q11. What recent progress her Department has made on implementing the violence against women and girls strategy. (900272)
Jas Athwal question number 11, please, Mr. Speaker. Foreign Secretary thank. >> You, Mr. Speaker. With your permission, I will answer questions. 11 and 16. Together, we have made the landmark commitment to halve violence against women and girls in violence against women and girls in a decade, and already this government has begun to implement domestic abuse protection orders, which are protected. Over 1000 victims already runs law placing domestic abuse experts in 999 control rooms and specialist rape and sexual offence teams in all police forces in England and Wales.
police forces in England and Wales. Our ambition is clear, but there is much more work to be done. much more work to be done.
police forces in England and Wales. Our ambition is clear, but there is much more work to be done. much more work to be done.
15:04
15:04
Jas Athwal MP (Ilford South, Labour)
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Jas Athwal MP (Ilford South, Labour)
Nearly two years on, her husband, an alleged killer, has still not an alleged killer, has still not been arrested and is believed to be hiding in India. A few weeks ago, I was humbled to meet Harshita parents who had made the journey to trace her last steps. They deserve justice and they deserve closure. Does the Home Secretary share my horror at this vile murder? And will she meet me to discuss what further steps can be taken working with the Indian authorities to bring Harshita alleged killer to Justice.
15:04
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Home Secretary Mr. Speaker, my deepest sympathies are with her family for their unimaginable loss. family for their unimaginable loss. No one should have to go through what she and her loved ones have endured. As this investigation is live, I cannot comment further. I live, I cannot comment further. I hope my hon. Friend will understand that to do so could prejudice the investigation and the path to justice for Harshita and her family.
15:05
Mary Kelly Foy MP (City of Durham, Labour)
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Mary Kelly Foy MP (City of Durham, Labour)
Mary Kelly Foy thank you, Mr. >> Mary Kelly Foy thank you, Mr. Speaker. At my recent market stall at Durham Pride, local Labour members and I spoke to many people members and I spoke to many people about the government's strategy. The message we received was clear that it strongly welcomed but is that it strongly welcomed but is long overdue. The clock is ticking and there's still no published timetable. So can the Minister tell me when the government will action the plan and the necessary grassroots consultation, and can she tell me how progress will be publicly reported? So women and girls in Durham and beyond can feel reassured that this is a government that takes serious and stamping out violence against women and girls.
15:05
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
I thank my hon. Friend for her, >> I thank my hon. Friend for her, for her question. But let me say to her, first and foremost, this government's commitment is evidenced by the landmark commitment that we have made to halve the levels of violence against women and girls over a decade is a deliberate ten year vision. In order to do that, because it is a wider societal change that we are seeking to enact, we are delivering that transformational change to keep more victims safe.
Work has begun. There is much more to be done. But as she will know, these matters are discussed regularly in the House and I will of course keep members updated.
Work has begun. There is much more to be done. But as she will know, these matters are discussed regularly in the House and I will of course keep members updated.
15:06
Jim Shannon MP (Strangford, Democratic Unionist Party)
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Jim Shannon MP (Strangford, Democratic Unionist Party)
Jim Shannon thank you, Mr. Speaker. I thank the Home Secretary for her response. In the last 2 to for her response. In the last 2 to 3 weeks in Northern Ireland, we've had two horrific are two cases of horrific, horrific murders against horrific, horrific murders against women and their unborn child, and on both occasions, how heavy sentences have been carried out in response to the the hon. Lady's question and answer to the hon. Gentleman. I think it's important that we have similar rules in Northern Ireland for those who carry out vile, horrific murders, killing their partners and their unborn children, that there must be a law and there must be a sentence that equals that.
15:07
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Home Secretary. >> Well, let me assure him, to the extent that the criminal law applies across the whole of the UK, those are, of course, things that we track as a government. I will, we track as a government. I will, of course, look at the substance to see if there is a change in the law that is discussing. We do, of course, work with our colleagues in in Northern Ireland very closely, and I will make sure that the ministerial team discuss these matters with their counterparts in Northern Ireland.
15:07
Alicia Kearns MP (Rutland and Stamford, Conservative)
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Alicia Kearns MP (Rutland and Stamford, Conservative)
Minister Alicia Kearns. my sympathy to the families and colleagues of Sir Alex Younger? He was a true patriot. Two years ago, this government pledged to halve this government pledged to halve violence against women and girls within a decade, but the Minister responsible for delivering his promise has now resigned. In her resignation letter, she laid a damning charge that government progress came from the fear of embarrassment, from threats made in light of catastrophic mistakes, and that it was only when the Prime Minister's shameful decision to appoint paedophile apologist Lord Mandelson bubbled up that number ten would kick into gear and finally do anything about women and girls.
Two years and we still don't know how this government is going to measure violence against women, girls, whether it's halved. So my ask is simple, something that government can do today. Extradite Andrew and Tristan Tait to the UK today to answer CPS charges that were laid in 2024. It is a political decision a year since I asked them to be extradited, do what is right when they are in Dubai or Hong Kong. They can be extradited here and if not, why not?
Two years and we still don't know how this government is going to measure violence against women, girls, whether it's halved. So my ask is simple, something that government can do today. Extradite Andrew and Tristan Tait to the UK today to answer CPS charges that were laid in 2024. It is a political decision a year since I asked them to be extradited, do what is right when they are in Dubai or Hong Kong. They can be extradited here and if not, why not?
15:08
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Secretary? >> Secretary? >> Well, let me say to the Shadow Minister she will know. I know that we would never comment on matters we would never comment on matters relating to extradition or any of those specific cases. I wouldn't ever want to say anything at this ever want to say anything at this Dispatch Box that prejudices any future action. She knows that well enough. She's obviously made her point in relation to those two men, and I'm sure that point has been heard.
15:08
Q12. What steps her Department plans to take to help support the response to alleged abuse at workplaces connected to Mohamed Al Fayed. (900273)
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Q12. What steps her Department plans to take to help support the response to alleged abuse at workplaces connected to Mohamed Al Fayed. (900273)
Dave Robertson thank you, Mr. >> Dave Robertson thank you, Mr. Speaker. Number 12, please. >> Minister. Well. >> It's an.
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It's an. Honour to be by the side. Of the Prime Minister. When he met Fylde victim survivors last week. I was proud survivors last week. I was proud that it was one of the first acts imposed to help facilitate the first meeting of this kind with these brave women. No one is above the law, and those who perpetrate the law, and those who perpetrate or facilitate abuse must be held to account. I'll continue to engage with my hon. Friends APPG.
So with my hon. Friends APPG. So victim survivors know that this government is listening.
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It's an. Honour to be by the side. Of the Prime Minister. When he met Fylde victim survivors last week. I was proud survivors last week. I was proud that it was one of the first acts imposed to help facilitate the first meeting of this kind with these brave women. No one is above the law, and those who perpetrate the law, and those who perpetrate or facilitate abuse must be held to account. I'll continue to engage with my hon. Friends APPG.
So with my hon. Friends APPG. So victim survivors know that this government is listening.
15:09
15:09
Dave Robertson MP (Lichfield, Labour)
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Dave Robertson MP (Lichfield, Labour)
facilitating the historic meeting last week, between the first time a sitting Prime Minister has met a group of survivors in in this space. group of survivors in in this space. And it was a great meeting. But survivors are very understandably very sceptical because they've been let let down so severely by so many institutions for so long. So can institutions for so long. So can she outline the steps that she can take in the short and medium term to make sure that those survivors start seeing some of the justice
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start seeing some of the justice that they've been denied for far too long? I'm sorry.
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start seeing some of the justice that they've been denied for far too long? I'm sorry.
15:10
Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
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Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
I thank my hon. Friend for the work that he is doing as part of work that he is doing as part of the APPG. As the Prime Minister made clear, the government is committed to engaging with these survivors and ensuring that the concerns of victim survivors are addressed. I will be in contact with them shortly to follow up on the meeting that we had last week, and we will set out the the the form of engagement that will take. But absolutely, we will make sure that this is a start of a process and not the end.
These women absolutely need to be heard.
These women absolutely need to be heard.
15:10
Wendy Chamberlain MP (North East Fife, Liberal Democrat)
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Wendy Chamberlain MP (North East Fife, Liberal Democrat)
Chairman. >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. >> Alongside my hon. Friend the Member for Litchfield. I, too, was present at the meeting with the Prime Minister last week, and I Prime Minister last week, and I welcome the Minister to her place and for her time at the meeting there. What we have heard consistently from survivors is that they were trafficked in many locations by many different people. Given that this does fit some of the category for organised crime, what consideration has the Minister given to getting the National Crime Agency involved with this investigation? This would really help build some of the confidence and trust by survivors in the on going investigation.
15:11
Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
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Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
Minister. >> I thank the Member for her work on the APPG and the vital work that she's carrying out, supporting these women. Where there is evidence of criminal activity, it is the police's duty to investigate, and it would not be appropriate for me to comment on the specifics. My job and the role of government is to support the police to ensure that justice is delivered as swiftly as possible, and I am absolutely committed to that.
15:11
Q13. What steps her Department is taking to help reduce levels of illegal migration. (900274)
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Q13. What steps her Department is taking to help reduce levels of illegal migration. (900274)
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you. >> Mr. Speaker. >> Question 13.
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Minister thank you, Mr. Speaker. This government is taking decisive action to restore order and control at our borders. We have removed at our borders. We have removed nearly 7000 people who have no right to be here. We are overhauling our asylum system to reduce pull factors, and we funded more officers to disrupt organised immigration crime within with interventions at their highest interventions at their highest rates and arrests linked rising by over 55%. over 55%.
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Minister thank you, Mr. Speaker. This government is taking decisive action to restore order and control at our borders. We have removed at our borders. We have removed nearly 7000 people who have no right to be here. We are overhauling our asylum system to reduce pull factors, and we funded more officers to disrupt organised immigration crime within with interventions at their highest interventions at their highest rates and arrests linked rising by over 55%. over 55%.
15:11
Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
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Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
I thank the Minister for his answer and also for visiting my constituency of North Warwickshire and Bedworth recently. My constituents will strongly welcome the fact that the most recent data shows that small boat arrivals are massively down this year. But can the Minister confirm to me that the Minister confirm to me that this important progress is just the beginning when it comes to restoring order and control at our borders? borders?
15:12
Rachel Taylor MP (North Warwickshire and Bedworth, Labour)
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Rachel Taylor MP (North Warwickshire and Bedworth, Labour)
I am grateful to my hon. Friend for her question. When I visited her community, I heard in no uncertain terms on the doorstep just how important this is to people. It's the same for my community and the rest of the country. That's why we're stepping up the international action that we have, including the important New deal with France, but also domestically legislating through our immigration and asylum bill to create the system that I know her constituents want wants, which is a constituents want wants, which is a fair one, but a firm one.
15:12
15:12
Rt Hon Chris Philp MP (Croydon South, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Chris Philp MP (Croydon South, Conservative)
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Nigerian illegal immigrant gift Oladele was recently jailed for the brutal rape recently jailed for the brutal rape of a teenage girl. He dragged her into isolated woods, leaving her terrified and she now has recurrent terrified and she now has recurrent nightmares. Oladele had committed previous violent sexual offences and the Home Office rightly tried to deport him. Yet an immigration judge allowed him to stay because Oladele human rights. He then went on to violently rape a teenage girl. I believe the rights of women and girls to be protected are more important than the supposed human rights of foreign rapists to stay here.
So isn't it time to leave the ECHR so all criminals like Oladele can be deported? Well, let me start by saying I agree that that is an awful case, a truly awful case, and shows just how important it is that we do remove people who commit crimes. We've removed nearly 8000
So isn't it time to leave the ECHR so all criminals like Oladele can be deported? Well, let me start by saying I agree that that is an awful case, a truly awful case, and shows just how important it is that we do remove people who commit crimes. We've removed nearly 8000
15:13
Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
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Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
foreign offenders since we came to office, but the hon. Gentleman's prescription to that problem simply doesn't match up to the solution. doesn't match up to the solution. Leaving the ECHR will undermine returns agreements that we have around the world. Instead, our contention is that we can improve contention is that we can improve it. We know already we will legislate to to narrow the domestic interpretation which has sprawled interpretation which has sprawled around article eight. He'll have seen the progress that we've made internationally around article three.
That's the sensible case. three. That's the sensible case. Rather than chasing a sugar high that he knows won't work. And the reason we know that to be true, Mr. Speaker, is because he didn't do it when he could. spokesperson.
That's the sensible case. three. That's the sensible case. Rather than chasing a sugar high that he knows won't work. And the reason we know that to be true, Mr. Speaker, is because he didn't do it when he could. spokesperson.
15:14
Max Wilkinson MP (Cheltenham, Liberal Democrat)
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Max Wilkinson MP (Cheltenham, Liberal Democrat)
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Brexit has seen off a number of prime Ministers in this country. But as we approach the 10th anniversary of the referendum, the Prime Minister has apparently been given a period of indefinite leave to remain in number ten. Ministers are clearly feeling unusually generous. But are they aware, Mr. Speaker, of a report by the Oxford Migration Observatory showing that Brexit is actually a pull factor for dangerous small boat crossings? It is now obvious that this government's one in, one out scheme with France is never going to work at the scale required.
So will Ministers today restate for the official record that Brexit is a large contributor to the small boats crisis, and will they commit to pursuing a new comprehensive asylum deal with the entirety of the EU?
So will Ministers today restate for the official record that Brexit is a large contributor to the small boats crisis, and will they commit to pursuing a new comprehensive asylum deal with the entirety of the EU?
15:15
Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
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Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
Mr. like to take this opportunity to wish my fellow class of 2017 intake a happy ninth anniversary today. a happy ninth anniversary today. And our ninth anniversary has been full of Liberal Democrat spokespeople trying to pin every single thing on Brexit. I say to him, these conversations, designed just to create division in the country, do not serve common aims of making sure that we have a robust asylum system. We can do that through our ordinary, ordinary collaboration with our neighbours on the continent.
I do that frequently. My right hon. Friend does that frequently. Look at the action that has delivered with
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France alone. I think that's the better way forward. Hyndburn 14. Mr. speaker.
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Hyndburn 14. Mr. speaker. I'm grateful to my hon. Friend for his question. The government committed to new, safe and legal routes in the Restoring Order and Control statement, and my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary announced that the student refugee route will that the student refugee route will open this autumn, with arrivals in autumn 2027. We are working with partners to design new routes to
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ensure that a safe and controlled and will provide an update to the House in due course. Mr. speaker.
I do that frequently. My right hon. Friend does that frequently. Look at the action that has delivered with
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France alone. I think that's the better way forward. Hyndburn 14. Mr. speaker.
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Hyndburn 14. Mr. speaker. I'm grateful to my hon. Friend for his question. The government committed to new, safe and legal routes in the Restoring Order and Control statement, and my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary announced that the student refugee route will that the student refugee route will open this autumn, with arrivals in autumn 2027. We are working with partners to design new routes to
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ensure that a safe and controlled and will provide an update to the House in due course. Mr. speaker.
15:16
Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
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Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
And I thought the the hon. Member was my friend, Mr. Speaker, but what what he says speaks to the innate goodness of the Cornish people, as in my own community as across the country, whether it's the Syrian scheme, the Afghan the Syrian scheme, the Afghan scheme, Hong Kong, BNO, homes for Ukraine, the British people have lent in. When schemes have been ordered and controlled. We're working with stakeholders at the moment about what that looks like, but I would say to my hon. Gentleman that it is crucial to the success of that programme that we do get them right, which is why it does take a little bit longer and it will take us the time to get it right.
But I make no apologies for that, and I will say that further course.
But I make no apologies for that, and I will say that further course.
15:17
Gideon Amos MP (Taunton and Wellington, Liberal Democrat)
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Gideon Amos MP (Taunton and Wellington, Liberal Democrat)
Gill German thank. my Taunton constituency is doing vital medical work. In normal circumstances, his wife would be circumstances, his wife would be allowed to visit her him on appropriate visa, but because she is in Gaza and she would have to travel to Israel to or to other cities get the give the biometric information, she cannot travel or visit him. Will the government change the rules in the way they did for the evening scholars so that people in Gaza can give biometric details in other ways?
15:17
Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
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Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
Minister, I. areas of conflict where there aren't visa centres open, that, of course, leads to challenges. We have taken, I think, quite a pragmatic and flexible approach, pragmatic and flexible approach, not just with students but also with medical evacuations as well. So he's able to write to my hon. Friend the Minister for Migration and Citizenship. We will look at that case accordingly.
15:18
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Come to topicals. Doctor Danny Chambers Kieran Mullan. Mr Speaker Home Secretary. >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I believe that we in this House have a duty to protect the children of this nation, but there can be little doubt that collectively, we little doubt that collectively, we have failed to keep pace with the changing threats that they face. Nowhere is this more apparent than in the horror of online sexual exploitation and abuse. But we have now begun to change the story. Today, we laid down the gauntlet to tech firms.
We have told them that they must block nudity on children's phones. We know the tech is there. We know there is a way. The question is, do they have the will? The tech firms now have three months? The clock is ticking. If they do not introduce these controls, we will legislate and force them to do so. This is a landmark moment in the protection of children in this country. So may I end by paying tribute to the woman who has pushed for this harder than anyone else.
My friend and former colleague in the Home Office, the hon. Member for Birmingham Yardley. The children of this country will be safer as a result of her work.
We have told them that they must block nudity on children's phones. We know the tech is there. We know there is a way. The question is, do they have the will? The tech firms now have three months? The clock is ticking. If they do not introduce these controls, we will legislate and force them to do so. This is a landmark moment in the protection of children in this country. So may I end by paying tribute to the woman who has pushed for this harder than anyone else.
My friend and former colleague in the Home Office, the hon. Member for Birmingham Yardley. The children of this country will be safer as a result of her work.
15:19
Dr Danny Chambers MP (Winchester, Liberal Democrat)
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Dr Danny Chambers MP (Winchester, Liberal Democrat)
Doctor Danny Chambers. pay tribute to the Member for for Birmingham Yardley for her immense campaigning and work in this area. campaigning and work in this area. Yeah. Could the Minister be more specific about what actions will actually be taken to prevent women and girls becoming victims of AI generated sexual content? Because this really can ruin lives?
15:19
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Secretary the hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. It can ruin lives. absolutely right. It can ruin lives. The government has already been holding different platforms to account. He will know, of course, of our row with Grock and the action that we forced. As a result action that we forced. As a result of that, we are very alive to the online environment and what that means for deepfake images, for notification apps, all our areas that we have already taken action on this, this action today on device level controls to block nudity for children is a game changing moment because it will prevent children from becoming sex offenders before they even know what sex is.
It will prevent them from being victims of sextortion. And this is the right way forward.
It will prevent them from being victims of sextortion. And this is the right way forward.
15:20
Laura Kyrke-Smith MP (Aylesbury, Labour)
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Laura Kyrke-Smith MP (Aylesbury, Labour)
Laura Kyrke-Smith Mr. Speaker, my local Jewish community does not have a dedicated building to meet have a dedicated building to meet and worship in. This means that they're not eligible for the government's expanded support for Jewish communities, which is Jewish communities, which is primarily aimed at these fixed places of worship. I really welcome the government's expanded commitment, and I welcome and I'm grateful for their engagement with me on this. But could I ask the Minister, please, for an update, including on this idea of whether support could be extended to security guards?
15:20
Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
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Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
Mr. >> Mr. speaker, my hon. >> Friend may be aware that I recently met with the Member for Mid Buckinghamshire and the Rabbi for South Buckinghamshire. She will for South Buckinghamshire. She will know the Jewish Community Protective Security Grant scheme administered by CST funds security administered by CST funds security measures such as CCTV alarms and fencing, which requires a fixed site to install and maintain. However, I fully recognise the fear and concerns raised by mobile Jewish congregations and we are working closely with CST to understand what more support we can give.
15:21
Rt Hon Chris Philp MP (Croydon South, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Chris Philp MP (Croydon South, Conservative)
So Secretary of State Home Secretary Chris Philp. Secretary Chris Philp. >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The police anti-racism commitment. >> A copy of which I have here
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A copy of which I have here published in March 2025 by the MPC, asks police to reverse engineer the asks police to reverse engineer the same arrest rates for different ethnic groups, even though offending rates are different. It expressly calls for different racial groups to be treated differently, saying, and I quote, people should not treat everyone the same and quote, not being colour-blind. This is a formal policy requirement for two tier policing. I have been raising this for over a year and I have never had an answer, including from the Home Secretary last Tuesday.
So let's try again. Does she agree that this racist and dangerous policy document should be immediately withdrawn, yes or no?
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A copy of which I have here published in March 2025 by the MPC, asks police to reverse engineer the asks police to reverse engineer the same arrest rates for different ethnic groups, even though offending rates are different. It expressly calls for different racial groups to be treated differently, saying, and I quote, people should not treat everyone the same and quote, not being colour-blind. This is a formal policy requirement for two tier policing. I have been raising this for over a year and I have never had an answer, including from the Home Secretary last Tuesday.
So let's try again. Does she agree that this racist and dangerous policy document should be immediately withdrawn, yes or no?
15:21
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Secretary Mr. Speaker, he knows >> Secretary Mr. Speaker, he knows full well that the Npcc, which is independent of government, is rightly reviewing the wording of rightly reviewing the wording of its policy policing, anti-racism commitment to ensure that there is commitment to ensure that there is no ambiguity or suggestion of differential treatment. He speaks from a sedentary position. Let me just say I've taken more action on preventing differential treatment in the criminal justice system than he or his party ever did.
15:22
Rt Hon Chris Philp MP (Croydon South, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Chris Philp MP (Croydon South, Conservative)
Yeah, first of all. >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Still, still no clear answer. Now moving on. We have repeatedly raised serious concerns with the serious concerns with the government's Islamophobia definition. Now, South Wales Police has instructed staff to record anything that goes beyond, quote, legitimate discussion of Islam. Even if there is no crime. This could then be disclosed on someone's DBS Police officers in South Wales will now have to decide what is legitimate discussion of Islam. No other religion is treated that way in South Wales.
This is completely wrong. Parliament has repealed rightly blasphemy laws. Criticising religion is part of free speech. So does the Home Secretary agree that this guidance is wrong and should be immediately scrapped? Let's try a simple yes or no.
This is completely wrong. Parliament has repealed rightly blasphemy laws. Criticising religion is part of free speech. So does the Home Secretary agree that this guidance is wrong and should be immediately scrapped? Let's try a simple yes or no.
15:23
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
Home Secretary well given, given that this he represents a party in that this he represents a party in a former government that didn't take any action at all either on dealing with hate crimes, dealing with hate crimes, anti-Muslim hatred, or other forms of hatred. I'm not going to take any lessons from him. Let me just make very clear from this Dispatch Box the police, wherever they are, South Wales or anywhere else, must always police without fear or favour. And we are all and must always be equal before the law.
15:23
Liam Conlon MP (Beckenham and Penge, Labour)
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Liam Conlon MP (Beckenham and Penge, Labour)
Yeah. >> Liam Conlon speaker. >> Organised car crime has affected residents in Beckenham and Penge for many years, with cars stolen to for many years, with cars stolen to order and quickly shipped abroad. Could I ask the Minister what powers and supports have been given to the police to crack down on to the police to crack down on vehicle theft, and how she is working with manufacturers to ensure modern vehicles are harder to steal?
15:24
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
Minister. Around half. manipulation of signals from remote devices and through the new Police and Crime and Policing Act, we have and Crime and Policing Act, we have criminalised the possession, importation, making, adapting and supply of the electronic devices used to commit vehicle theft, which will make a real difference in his constituency.
15:24
Max Wilkinson MP (Cheltenham, Liberal Democrat)
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Max Wilkinson MP (Cheltenham, Liberal Democrat)
Max Wilkinson Liberal Democrat spokesperson. week we discussed the murder of Henry Novak, which has shocked this country and continues to. His father, Mark, as we said last week, father, Mark, as we said last week, asked politicians not to use the tragedy to stoke division and hatred. With that request in mind, Mr. Speaker, and considering the need to maintain trust in policing, would the Home Secretary like to take this opportunity to urge Vice President JD Vance and the US Department of Justice to butt out of our politics, leave British law enforcement to Britain and, just as
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importantly, show respect for British victims of crime. Home Secretary.
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Home Secretary. I would urge all commentators, would be commentators, wannabes of every description that they leave
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importantly, show respect for British victims of crime. Home Secretary.
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Home Secretary. I would urge all commentators, would be commentators, wannabes of every description that they leave
15:25
Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
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Rt Hon Shabana Mahmood KC MP, The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Birmingham Ladywood, Labour)
every description that they leave our criminal justice system to us. We've been going for a very long time and we will carry on in that vein. >> Sureena Brackenridge thank.
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Sureena Brackenridge thank. You. Mr. Speaker. Following investment in police operations targeting predatory behaviour in Wolverhampton's night time economy, including the deployment of specially trained undercover officers, alongside the much welcomed support given by the late night safe haven and night late night safe haven and night Guardians, what further action will the government take to strengthen prevention so women and girls feel safe in night time settings and other high risk areas?
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Sureena Brackenridge thank. You. Mr. Speaker. Following investment in police operations targeting predatory behaviour in Wolverhampton's night time economy, including the deployment of specially trained undercover officers, alongside the much welcomed support given by the late night safe haven and night late night safe haven and night Guardians, what further action will the government take to strengthen prevention so women and girls feel safe in night time settings and other high risk areas?
15:25
15:26
Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
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Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
Project Vigilant, where Plainclothed officers are deployed to the night time economy to identify and de-escalate behaviours known to precede sexual offending. known to precede sexual offending. We are providing £13.9 million to improve policing response to Vogue improve policing response to Vogue nationally, and new legislation means that someone causing intentional harassment, alarm or distress because of a person's sex can now face up to two years in prison.
15:26
Edward Morello MP (West Dorset, Liberal Democrat)
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Edward Morello MP (West Dorset, Liberal Democrat)
Rather Mr Speaker. >> Worst funded. >> Forces in the country. They face higher operating costs due to our rural geography and during the rural geography and during the summer have to contend with a population that increases by 40%. They have already had to make cuts worth £2.8 million over the last three years. Will the Secretary of State reform the police funding formula to properly account for Rurality lower council tax growth and seasonality?
15:26
Rachael Maskell MP (York Central, Labour )
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Rachael Maskell MP (York Central, Labour )
Minister the hon. Gentleman is a bit behind the times. We've already announced that we are reforming that. Yes. that. Yes. >> Rachael Maskell thank you, Mr.
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Rachael Maskell thank you, Mr. Speaker. Academics. environmentalist experienced dozens of judges upheld. And when recently they had a vigil And when recently they had a vigil for the trees, there were more police there than there were protesters. Can the Minister meet with me to discuss the policing operations, the over policing operations around my constituents who are literally standing up for nature and ensure that we see off these draconian Tory policies, which overegg the amount of policing that is needed for environmentalists.
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Rachael Maskell thank you, Mr. Speaker. Academics. environmentalist experienced dozens of judges upheld. And when recently they had a vigil And when recently they had a vigil for the trees, there were more police there than there were protesters. Can the Minister meet with me to discuss the policing operations, the over policing operations around my constituents who are literally standing up for nature and ensure that we see off these draconian Tory policies, which overegg the amount of policing that is needed for environmentalists.
15:27
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
Minister. >> Can I thank my hon. Friend for the question, the right to. The right to peaceful protest and public assembly is a is a one that public assembly is a is a one that we, of course, must protect, but it has to be balanced to with the need to maintain public order and keep the public safe. So if she wants to write to me with further detail, if she wants to have a meeting with me
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that. Just help the member, if you can understand it, was answering to the understand it, was answering to the to the member on the front bench went straight across both of us. That's what it was. So if you want
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That's what it was. So if you want to know the reason, that's why it was no. That shall be explained. John Lamont thank you, Mr. Speaker. Immigration remains too high, especially non-EU migration. high, especially non-EU migration. Speaking to my constituents in the Scottish Borders, many of them want to see a cap on the number of
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that. Just help the member, if you can understand it, was answering to the understand it, was answering to the to the member on the front bench went straight across both of us. That's what it was. So if you want
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That's what it was. So if you want to know the reason, that's why it was no. That shall be explained. John Lamont thank you, Mr. Speaker. Immigration remains too high, especially non-EU migration. high, especially non-EU migration. Speaking to my constituents in the Scottish Borders, many of them want to see a cap on the number of
15:28
John Lamont MP (Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk, Conservative)
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John Lamont MP (Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk, Conservative)
to see a cap on the number of people who can come into the United Kingdom. So will the Home Secretary introduce a binding cap set by Parliament to bring immigration
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down once and for all? Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Under the last government we saw 2.5 million arrive in just four years. million arrive in just four years. That's 1 the country at this very time. This government's brought migration down
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down once and for all? Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Under the last government we saw 2.5 million arrive in just four years. million arrive in just four years. That's 1 the country at this very time. This government's brought migration down
15:28
Mike Tapp MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Dover and Deal, Labour)
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Mike Tapp MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Dover and Deal, Labour)
government's brought migration down by eight since its peak and 41% in the last year. >> Catherine Fookes thank you, Mr. Speaker, and I'd really.
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Speaker, and I'd really. Like to. Welcome my friend the Minister to her place today. Surviving economic abuse estimates that around 750 000 women are trapped in a joint mortgage with an abusive
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Speaker, and I'd really. Like to. Welcome my friend the Minister to her place today. Surviving economic abuse estimates that around 750 000 women are trapped in a joint mortgage with an abusive
15:28
Catherine Fookes MP (Monmouthshire, Labour)
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Catherine Fookes MP (Monmouthshire, Labour)
partner or ex-partner, with the only way out often being letting only way out often being letting their home be repossessed, or as abusers refuse to contribute to their share of repayments, or they prevent the sale of the property. So I welcome the fact that the government wants to explore solutions, including what could be solutions, including what could be done by the Financial Services Bill, but what steps will the government take to stop joint mortgage abuse, take to stop joint mortgage abuse, as part of its wider commitment to halving violent violence against women and girls? Yes, sir.
15:29
Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
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Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
Thank you. I thank the Member que >> Thank you. I thank the Member que and financial inclusion commitments to tackle the issue of financial abuse. The government is determined to embed the prevention of violence against women and girls across all departments. Our Vawg strategy and the Financial Inclusion Strategy committed to explore how we can make it abusers to use joint financial products, including support victim survivors. Last week, the Economic Secretary to the Treasury and I hosted a round table with 16 banks and financial service organisations to underscore government priorities and share best practice within the financial services sector and agree how we can work together to deliver commitments in the strategy and the speaker.
15:30
Helen Maguire MP (Epsom and Ewell, Liberal Democrat)
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Helen Maguire MP (Epsom and Ewell, Liberal Democrat)
There's been an exponential rise of e-scooters, which are incredibly of e-scooters, which are incredibly dangerous, as some can reach speeds of up to 70mph. I'm talking to the police. They said to me that whilst police. They said to me that whilst at the moment they're having to adapt existing powers and there's a lack of central guidance, I wonder if the Minister could outline to me if there's going to be some more central guidance that's actually forthcoming on the apprehension of individuals using these e-scooters. Thank you.
15:31
Jess Phillips MP (Birmingham Yardley, Labour)
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Jess Phillips MP (Birmingham Yardley, Labour)
Jess Phillips thank you, Mr. >> Jess Phillips thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would take this opportunity to pay tribute back to opportunity to pay tribute back to the Home Secretary, who worked in sending and receiving. Can she just for the House, say that actually what it will do is also stop children ever taking naked images of themselves and give us some assurances that her department is working on robust legislation and legislative vehicle to make sure that this can happen.
15:31
15:31
Gareth Bacon MP (Orpington, Conservative)
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Gareth Bacon MP (Orpington, Conservative)
Bacon Robin Swann. >> Police officers has fallen by 3000, is now at a lower level than it was in May 2016, when Sadiq Khan became mayor of London. Overall crime in London has increased by 26%. Knife crime is up by 27% now. It is true that policing in London is partially devolved, but over 70% of the funding to the Metropolitan Police comes from the Home Office, and that makes the Home Secretary a key player here. So what is she doing to reverse this dismal decline that we've seen in Sadiq Khan's decade of failure?
15:32
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
Minister. >> And the murder rate is at its lowest level ever recorded in London. The police have more money, London. The police have more money, more resources to tackle crime, and we are working very closely, closely with them as they do that. And I would just gently remind the hon. Gentleman that his party, when they recruited police officers, put them behind desks. We are putting them in our streets fighting crime.
15:32
15:33
Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
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Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
I can. are closing hotels, not opening them. >> Jerome Mayhew my constituents hate seeing organised shoplifting, hate seeing organised shoplifting, apparently with impunity. Norfolk Police recognise this and they have identified suspects in more than a third of all these cases. But what's the point when the government's assumption is that any, any sentence shorter than 12 months any sentence shorter than 12 months will automatically be suspended? What's the government going to do about it?
15:33
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
We are making some progress in this space. It may seem small, but this space. It may seem small, but there was a 1% fall last year in shop theft offences, and there was a 30% increase in the last year of a 30% increase in the last year of his government of the hon. Gentleman's government. So we are making progress. We're working very hard on prolific offenders, in particular how we target them more. We're using new technology. We're working with, of course, the private sector.
Our policing bill brought in new powers, so we are going to tackle shop theft in a way that the previous government didn't. We're launching the centre for AI soon, which is going to give us new technology that we can also use. We are bearing down on shoplifting. Speaker.
Our policing bill brought in new powers, so we are going to tackle shop theft in a way that the previous government didn't. We're launching the centre for AI soon, which is going to give us new technology that we can also use. We are bearing down on shoplifting. Speaker.
15:34
15:34
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
Station. But what further. criminals like these to come off our streets and businesses can operate safely? >> Minister and we are working hard
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Minister and we are working hard to introduce respect orders, which I think will be really important in this space. I am very happy to come and visit the hon. Lady and see exactly what the problems are and what we can do, but we are introducing whatever we can, the powers to tackle this kind of low level, called by the previous government, antisocial behaviour that actually blights our communities.
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Minister and we are working hard to introduce respect orders, which I think will be really important in this space. I am very happy to come and visit the hon. Lady and see exactly what the problems are and what we can do, but we are introducing whatever we can, the powers to tackle this kind of low level, called by the previous government, antisocial behaviour that actually blights our communities.
15:34
Dr Neil Shastri-Hurst MP (Solihull West and Shirley, Conservative)
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Dr Neil Shastri-Hurst MP (Solihull West and Shirley, Conservative)
Neil Shastri-Hurst thank. listened carefully to the Minister's response to my hon. Friend from Broadland and Fakenham. But the reality is that every day shopkeepers are facing abuse threats and being stolen from a direct consequence of the the fact direct consequence of the the fact that the Sentencing Act prohibits those with or takes a presumption that those with a sentence of 12 months or more will not face prison is that there is no deterrent. So can the Minister genuinely say that our streets are safer as a result?
15:35
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
Minister so firstly, we're introducing a new offence. We have introducing a new offence. We have introduced a new offence against assault of a shop worker which this the previous government failed to the previous government failed to do. And of course, we're using every single tool in our armoury. Unfortunately, the previous government didn't provide the prison places that they promised, so we have to deal with the situation as we find it.
15:35
Janet Daby MP (Lewisham East, Labour)
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Janet Daby MP (Lewisham East, Labour)
So, David. >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The role of the faith liaison officer is extremely important within Lewisham, extremely important within Lewisham, and this post has been deleted. They're important with regard to preventing extremism and building preventing extremism and building community cohesion. They meet with faith leaders and have been integral, an integral, I mean, in terms of the Interfaith Peace Walk. Now, I just ask the Minister to look again at this role to see what more can be done, because it's important not just for Lewisham, but across the met and across the country.
Indeed.
Indeed.
15:36
Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
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Sarah Jones MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Croydon West, Labour)
As my hon. Friend knows, it's a decision for the met in terms of decision for the met in terms of how they allocate their resources. But I do hear what she says, and I think, obviously, in light of the think, obviously, in light of the tensions that we have faced in recent months, I think there is a role for policing in building relationships with our faith communities. I'm sure.
15:36
Pete Wishart MP (Perth and Kinross-shire, Scottish National Party)
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Pete Wishart MP (Perth and Kinross-shire, Scottish National Party)
Pete Wishart Mr Speaker. Every >> Pete Wishart Mr Speaker. Every few weeks, I supported far right activists to descend on my peaceful city of Perth to holler abuse at asylum seekers placed by the Home Office in hotels. They come tanked Office in hotels. They come tanked up on misinformation and loathing, and the people of Perth are getting thoroughly sick of it. Some who attend have even been served bans in their own communities. But yet they roll up in Perth. What will the Home Secretary do about those individuals, and will she consider something like buffer zones between the protesters and the hotels themselves?
15:37
Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
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Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for raising something that's very important. We know that that's very important. We know that across the country, where there are those hotels, these are providing a focal point for people to do things focal point for people to do things they absolutely should not do, and that we condemn in its fullest terms. You know, goal one is to shut those hotels. I think that's the priority. And I make that commitment to the community of Perth. But alongside that, we work with the local police and I can support the hon.
Gentleman doing the same to make sure that those areas are supported and that all possible.
Gentleman doing the same to make sure that those areas are supported and that all possible.
15:37
Tom Hayes MP (Bournemouth East, Labour)
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Tom Hayes MP (Bournemouth East, Labour)
Tom Hayes thank you, Mr. Speaker. >> We're a patient people, a compassionate community in Bournemouth, but there is also a feeling in town that we are being asked to do more than our fair asked to do more than our fair share with our three asylum hotels. Can the Minister please set out for my constituents that Bournemouth is uppermost in his mind as he is closing hotels, and that Bournemouth's asylum hotels are being prioritised for closure? Yeah.
15:38
Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
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Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
I'm grateful to my hon. Friend. He raises this with me very, very He raises this with me very, very frequently indeed and for good reason. I totally accept his characterisation. You know, the people of Bournemouth have three such hotels. That's an extraordinary pressure, not just on public services but also on community tensions. I don't want them open a minute longer than they have to be. So of course, Bournemouth absolutely is uppermost in our minds. Joe Robertson.
15:38
Rt Hon Suella Braverman KC MP (Fareham and Waterlooville, Reform UK)
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Rt Hon Suella Braverman KC MP (Fareham and Waterlooville, Reform UK)
The race and faith network at Greater Manchester Fire Rescue Greater Manchester Fire Rescue Service earlier this year wrote to its firefighters targeting anyone its firefighters targeting anyone who might be representing reform UK at the local elections in what can only be described as an attempt at intimidation. Firefighters can legitimately stand at local elections. So does the Secretary of State agree that this kind of politicisation and institutional bullying is wholly unacceptable? And what will the Defending Democracy Task Force do to investigate this and stop it from happening again?
15:38
Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
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Dan Jarvis MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Barnsley North, Labour)
Listen very carefully to what the right hon. Lady said, and I will give it due consideration. As will give it due consideration. As the chair of the Defending Democracy Task Force. >> Euan Stainbank speaker, the government have cut the asylum backlog, reduced the number of backlog, reduced the number of people arriving illegally and shut more than half of the hotels opened by Tory Ministers. Places in Scotland like Falkirk, Perth and Dundee must see further progress this year. When will the next phase of the hotel exit plan be, and how will Ministers ensure it is will Ministers ensure it is equitable across the nations and Minister.
15:39
Euan Stainbank MP (Falkirk, Labour)
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Euan Stainbank MP (Falkirk, Labour)
I am grateful for that question. I am conscious and think also of the Clarion Hotel in Falkirk and the impact that that has on the local community. Again, because the hon. Gentleman is is rightly very dogged in raising that with me. I want to see that hotel closed. You want to see that hotel closed. You know, we are, of course, in the slightly better weather of the year, which puts pressure on services. which puts pressure on services. Nevertheless, we want those hotels closed.
We've made a commitment within this Parliament, but I would say to colleagues they will not be say to colleagues they will not be open a minute longer than they have to be.
We've made a commitment within this Parliament, but I would say to colleagues they will not be say to colleagues they will not be open a minute longer than they have to be.
15:39
Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
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Alex Norris MP, The Minister of State, Home Department (Nottingham North and Kimberley, Labour )
Mr. smart. publicly thanked the donors who funded the recent Unite the Kingdom marches, which needed a significant police presence. We've heard mention several times this afternoon of equality before the law, Mr. Speaker. So does the Home law, Mr. Speaker. So does the Home Secretary agree with me that the laws regarding the reporting of donations, both from the UK and from overseas, apply to members of all political parties equally. all political parties equally.
15:40
15:40
Perran Moon MP (Camborne and Redruth, Labour)
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Perran Moon MP (Camborne and Redruth, Labour)
workers scheme. The scheme numbers are announced annually at the end of the year, but the daffodil season in Cornwall begins in January. Can Ministers meet with me to discuss an earlier announcement to discuss an earlier announcement and a two year rolling scheme? Minister I thank the hon. Friend for his question. It's important for his question. It's important that we do continue our strategy to bring net migration down, whilst
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15:41
Rt Hon Sir Roger Gale MP (Herne Bay and Sandwich, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Sir Roger Gale MP (Herne Bay and Sandwich, Conservative)
Roger Gale Mr. Speaker. >> Further to the answer given to the hon. Gentleman, the Member for Lichfield earlier this afternoon, Lichfield earlier this afternoon, Mohamed Fayed, is beyond the reach of terrestrial justice, but many of the ladies who he abused are still waiting for justice. The Metropolitan Police has been conducting an inquiry into the activities of those who aided and abetted Fylde for many months. Will the Home Office ask the met to expedite this inquiry so that these ladies can at last have justice?
15:41
Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
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Natalie Fleet MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Bolsover, Labour)
Minister? confirm how close this is to my heart. Within the boundaries of operational independence, the Home operational independence, the Home Office is regularly engaging, rightly so, with the Metropolitan Police. These women absolutely deserve justice, and I will do everything within my power to make sure that they get it.
15:42
Dr Al Pinkerton MP (Surrey Heath, Liberal Democrat)
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Dr Al Pinkerton MP (Surrey Heath, Liberal Democrat)
Thank God for Al Pinkerton. >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My Surrey Heath constituent, Richard, has been unable to work now for four months because of delays from four months because of delays from the disclosure and barring service. Things are getting desperate at home. He faces the prospect of defaulting on his mortgage this month. This is a ten month delay from point of application to now. Can I ask one of the frontbench team to look at this case in particular to help him out, but also to try and take a hand of the you.
15:42
Greg Smith MP (Mid Buckinghamshire, Conservative)
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Greg Smith MP (Mid Buckinghamshire, Conservative)
Certainly. Very happy to look at the particular case. Perhaps you could write to me and I will look into it. >> Final question. Speaker. >> As if the government's
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As if the government's announcement to water down the provisions of the Equipment Theft Prevention Act 2023 weren't disappointing enough. The secondary disappointing enough. The secondary legislation to enact what's left of it still hasn't been tabled. Where is it?
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As if the government's announcement to water down the provisions of the Equipment Theft Prevention Act 2023 weren't disappointing enough. The secondary disappointing enough. The secondary legislation to enact what's left of it still hasn't been tabled. Where is it?
15:43
Points of Order
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Points of Order
Point of order Edward Morello. question earlier, I asked the Minister if they would, if the Department would reform the police funding formula to account for seasonality and rurality. The Minister said that that announcement had already been made. Actually, the only review into the funding formula has been announced, and I wonder if the speaker will give me some guidance on how I can get information on what will be included.
15:43
15:43
Mr Speaker
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Mr Speaker
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In March, I requested two briefings from the Home Office as His Majesty's loyal opposition, one on Islamist opposition, one on Islamist terrorism and one on security threat in Northern Ireland. After months of chasing. At the end of last month, I received a reply from private secretary informing them that we will need to decline the request of a briefing for Alicia Kearns on the security threat Kearns on the security threat picture in Northern Ireland and the Islamist terrorist threat. It is not unreasonable, Mr.
Speaker, to request two briefings in six months request two briefings in six months as the opposition. What advice can you kindly give and guidance on how we get the briefings we need so we we get the briefings we need so we can hold the government to account?
Speaker, to request two briefings in six months request two briefings in six months as the opposition. What advice can you kindly give and guidance on how we get the briefings we need so we we get the briefings we need so we can hold the government to account?
15:44
Alicia Kearns MP (Rutland and Stamford, Conservative)
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Alicia Kearns MP (Rutland and Stamford, Conservative)
First of all, the chair has no responsibility for this. What I would say is responsibility of government to ensure the opposition is briefed, and I'm sure that point will have been noted. Right. Let us go to the Urgent Question when the go to the Urgent Question when the front bench change over. Take care, front bench change over. Take care, take care. Maldon Mr. Speaker, right. We come to the urgent right. We come to the urgent question. Munira Wilson.
15:44
15:45
15:45
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
expectations on technology companies to introduce crucial safety measures on children's phones. The government is clear phones. The government is clear that children are facing unacceptable levels of sexual harm online, including grooming, sextortion and coercion into sextortion and coercion into sharing intimate images. A single image can trap a child in a cycle of abuse, something I've personally of abuse, something I've personally heard of from young people, from families, from civil society, and I hold them in my mind and heart as hold them in my mind and heart as we take action to stop this harm at source.
To address this, we have set out expectations that technology companies introduce device level protections for children. These protections will prevent children from taking, sharing or viewing nude imagery across all core device functionalities. This includes camera messaging apps, search functions, and file sharing, and these protections are built directly into the operating system. We recognise that companies have already developed and implemented nudity detection on devices. We want to work collaboratively with industry to build solutions, to call on companies to take action. Within three months, we have been clear that if industry does not meet our high expectations, we will not hesitate to legislate.
Furthermore, the government's growing up in the online world consultation closed on the 26th of May. The government is currently reviewing the responses and will weeks.
To address this, we have set out expectations that technology companies introduce device level protections for children. These protections will prevent children from taking, sharing or viewing nude imagery across all core device functionalities. This includes camera messaging apps, search functions, and file sharing, and these protections are built directly into the operating system. We recognise that companies have already developed and implemented nudity detection on devices. We want to work collaboratively with industry to build solutions, to call on companies to take action. Within three months, we have been clear that if industry does not meet our high expectations, we will not hesitate to legislate.
Furthermore, the government's growing up in the online world consultation closed on the 26th of May. The government is currently reviewing the responses and will weeks.
15:46
Munira Wilson MP (Twickenham, Liberal Democrat)
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Munira Wilson MP (Twickenham, Liberal Democrat)
Munira Wilson thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, for granting this urgent question and for the this urgent question and for the Minister's response. Today and over the weekend, we see a Prime Minister who spent months completely disengaged from the digital threats facing our young people, suddenly experiencing an 11th hour Damascene conversion. This sudden rush seems driven entirely by a looming ballot box in Makerfield and a full scale rebellion on his own backbenches. Now, we Liberal Democrats won't criticise someone for reaching the correct position, even if it's taken them some time.
But unfortunately, this government's actual approach remains profoundly weak. Mr. speaker, it's shameful that the Prime Minister has to beg Big tech to stop the proliferation of child sexual abuse imagery. He could and he should, make these changes anyway. So I make this appeal to the Minister and to the Prime Minister too. If he's watching, just do it. Just bring forward the legislation. Why is he still asking Big Tech to co-operate with him when they've constantly shown total disregard for our children and young people? Now, Mr.
Speaker, I want to also turn to the broader proposals which have been briefed to the newspapers over the weekend regarding a ban on harmful social media for teenagers. Liberal Democrats welcome these reports and urge Ministers once again to move quickly and decisively. Only through a smart film style age rating system can we protect children from harmful online content and algorithms. I'm delighted that it seems that in pursuit of a legacy, the Prime Minister is borrowing more Liberal Democrat ideas.
Wholesale tiered age rated access, ending, infinite scrolling and tackling online gaming, not just social media. Despite ordering his MPs and his peers to vote repeatedly against many of these proposals during the passage of the Children's Wellbeing and Schools Bill. But today, Mr. Speaker, it's not about who voted which way. I want to ask the Minister and through him, the Prime Minister, to remember the children who have lost their lives due to the harms they have encountered online, those whose mental and physical health and education has been harmed by what they've been exposed to online.
It is for those children that we must work together to bring about change. The Prime Minister must stop begging tech companies to protect our children and start acting himself now. Yes.
But unfortunately, this government's actual approach remains profoundly weak. Mr. speaker, it's shameful that the Prime Minister has to beg Big tech to stop the proliferation of child sexual abuse imagery. He could and he should, make these changes anyway. So I make this appeal to the Minister and to the Prime Minister too. If he's watching, just do it. Just bring forward the legislation. Why is he still asking Big Tech to co-operate with him when they've constantly shown total disregard for our children and young people? Now, Mr.
Speaker, I want to also turn to the broader proposals which have been briefed to the newspapers over the weekend regarding a ban on harmful social media for teenagers. Liberal Democrats welcome these reports and urge Ministers once again to move quickly and decisively. Only through a smart film style age rating system can we protect children from harmful online content and algorithms. I'm delighted that it seems that in pursuit of a legacy, the Prime Minister is borrowing more Liberal Democrat ideas.
Wholesale tiered age rated access, ending, infinite scrolling and tackling online gaming, not just social media. Despite ordering his MPs and his peers to vote repeatedly against many of these proposals during the passage of the Children's Wellbeing and Schools Bill. But today, Mr. Speaker, it's not about who voted which way. I want to ask the Minister and through him, the Prime Minister, to remember the children who have lost their lives due to the harms they have encountered online, those whose mental and physical health and education has been harmed by what they've been exposed to online.
It is for those children that we must work together to bring about change. The Prime Minister must stop begging tech companies to protect our children and start acting himself now. Yes.
15:48
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Speaker, it is astonishing to hear the Liberal Democrats mention hear the Liberal Democrats mention lack of action on this government, stood up to the richest man in the world, stood him down and as a world, stood him down and as a result, secured protections for people in this country on cyber flashing, on strangulation and pornography, on banning nude unification tools, on criminalising unification, on putting personal criminal liability on tech bosses if they don't act. I understand the Liberal Democrats are doing a strategy review to seek relevance, but I think that complaint is still too much.
15:49
Justin Madders MP (Ellesmere Port and Bromborough, Labour)
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Justin Madders MP (Ellesmere Port and Bromborough, Labour)
Justin Madders Mr. Speaker, I welcome this. >> Announcement. >> But is it shocking that these companies have to be told what is unacceptable, that sending and receiving naked images to children is something that they shouldn't already be doing? So I want to ask the Minister, is this a tech problem or is this an issue of a lack of understanding and decency at the heart of these companies?
15:49
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
And for a point well made? We have consistently been robust with tech companies on this question. Can I particularly pay tribute to Can I particularly pay tribute to my hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham Yardley in her leadership on this particular question, it is to me not a technology problem. We have the technology to be act on this, and we're now going to deliver that in the real world as well.
15:50
Peter Fortune MP (Bromley and Biggin Hill, Conservative)
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Peter Fortune MP (Bromley and Biggin Hill, Conservative)
Shannon Minister Peter Fortune. >> And I congratulate the hon. Member for Twickenham on having secured this important question and perhaps suggest that the Minister should show a touch more humility with this important issue. His Majesty's loyal opposition would welcome measures to prevent under 16 seconds from accessing harmful social media. After all, it has been our policy for quite some time and we are glad that the government is finally starting to catch up, because this government's record of kicking the can down the road on children's online safety contrasts starkly with the action on these benches.
In the last government, we brought in the Online Safety Act, which is already cutting the number of children accessing porn. When it became obvious that more needed to be done, the Leader of the Opposition stood alongside parents and campaigners calling for more. Only then did the Prime Minister leap swiftly into action by announcing a four month consultation on an issue so necessary and so blindingly obvious to the rest of us. And let us not forget that just six months ago, this Prime Minister was personally opposed to a ban.
Now, with nothing else to show for his time in office, he has performed yet another U-turn and discovered that protecting children was his priority all along. Mr. speaker, this is not leadership. This is legacy hunting thin gruel. Mr. speaker, after so many missed opportunities, the safety of the Safer Phones Bill, the Data Use and Access Act amendment, my noble friend Lord Nash's amendment opposed not once, not twice, but three times before they finally conceded. Labour constantly voted down the very protections they now say are required.
So why now? Is it a genuine epiphany? Or is it the by elections, or the rather inconvenient fact that a rival from the North has already staked out this ground, leaving the Prime Minister with little choice but to follow? Time and time again, this is a government that has to be forced to do the right thing, and only after they have exhausted every other option first. But, Mr. Speaker, I do want this to work. So I ask the Secretary of State, via the Minister, three questions will these protections extend to existing devices or only to new handsets? Because if it is the latter, I'm concerned that there's only 90% of 12 year olds have hand-me-down phones.
It will leave the most vulnerable children as the least protected.
In the last government, we brought in the Online Safety Act, which is already cutting the number of children accessing porn. When it became obvious that more needed to be done, the Leader of the Opposition stood alongside parents and campaigners calling for more. Only then did the Prime Minister leap swiftly into action by announcing a four month consultation on an issue so necessary and so blindingly obvious to the rest of us. And let us not forget that just six months ago, this Prime Minister was personally opposed to a ban.
Now, with nothing else to show for his time in office, he has performed yet another U-turn and discovered that protecting children was his priority all along. Mr. speaker, this is not leadership. This is legacy hunting thin gruel. Mr. speaker, after so many missed opportunities, the safety of the Safer Phones Bill, the Data Use and Access Act amendment, my noble friend Lord Nash's amendment opposed not once, not twice, but three times before they finally conceded. Labour constantly voted down the very protections they now say are required.
So why now? Is it a genuine epiphany? Or is it the by elections, or the rather inconvenient fact that a rival from the North has already staked out this ground, leaving the Prime Minister with little choice but to follow? Time and time again, this is a government that has to be forced to do the right thing, and only after they have exhausted every other option first. But, Mr. Speaker, I do want this to work. So I ask the Secretary of State, via the Minister, three questions will these protections extend to existing devices or only to new handsets? Because if it is the latter, I'm concerned that there's only 90% of 12 year olds have hand-me-down phones.
It will leave the most vulnerable children as the least protected.
15:52
Mr Speaker
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Mr Speaker
I'm welcome, the Minister shadow Minister to the Dispatch Box. But Minister to the Dispatch Box. But it is two minutes. He's now nearly three minutes. So I'm sure that the Minister will have grasped what he had to say.
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had to say. Minister thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can I firstly point out that the Can I firstly point out that the opposition and government took seven years to pass a bill and then found that bill inadequate in law
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had to say. Minister thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can I firstly point out that the Can I firstly point out that the opposition and government took seven years to pass a bill and then found that bill inadequate in law
15:53
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
to be then proposing all the things that they have tried to do. This government, Mr. Speaker, is listening to the people of Britain. listening to the people of Britain. I have been around listening to thousands of young people and families, and they say they have a government listening and with government listening and with humility, getting the right action on this central question, they say on age assurance for adult content, this government has listened and acted robustly. They say so on. When the opposition was missing in When the opposition was missing in action on a particular question of the shadow Ministers point around existing devices, I will point to him that a major provider has already applied age assurance of the device level for existing devices as well.
We will learn the
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lessons and make sure that we're acting robustly in protecting young people. Thank you. Mr. Speaker. I welcome the announcement today.
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I welcome the announcement today. The Education Select Committee recently took evidence from social media and gaming companies, which media and gaming companies, which left every member of the committee profoundly concerned. They downplayed the issues, denied the downplayed the issues, denied the scale of harm and overplayed the magnitude and effectiveness of
We will learn the
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lessons and make sure that we're acting robustly in protecting young people. Thank you. Mr. Speaker. I welcome the announcement today.
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I welcome the announcement today. The Education Select Committee recently took evidence from social media and gaming companies, which media and gaming companies, which left every member of the committee profoundly concerned. They downplayed the issues, denied the downplayed the issues, denied the scale of harm and overplayed the magnitude and effectiveness of
15:54
Helen Hayes MP (Dulwich and West Norwood, Labour)
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Helen Hayes MP (Dulwich and West Norwood, Labour)
their own responses. So we have very little confidence that Big Tech knows what is required and has any motivation to do it. So if, as seems likely, legislation is required after three months, can the Minister provide assurance that the drafting of that legislation is already underway so that we do not lose any more time before our children are safe online?
15:54
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
My hon. Friend is absolutely >> My hon. Friend is absolutely right to say that time is of the essence here. I can confirm to her that we are working closely with the Home Secretary and the Home the Home Secretary and the Home Office to make sure that we're ready to go. If the companies don't act in the way they need to. Democrats.
15:54
Dr Danny Chambers MP (Winchester, Liberal Democrat)
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Dr Danny Chambers MP (Winchester, Liberal Democrat)
Thank you, Mr. Speaker, for granting my hon. Friend an granting my hon. Friend an Twickenham this urgent question, and I have to say I'm very disappointed with the Minister's disappointed with the Minister's response by bringing in petty party politics, when we have been consistently, consistently providing a proposed legislation that would have taken months of this could have been implemented months ago, and I speak on behalf of parents, children, teachers, carers and and actually the children themselves. When we ask, why is the Prime Minister pleading with tech companies about this? Here's the Prime Minister.
He should be leading the charge on blocking child sexual abuse material on smartphones. And it is absolutely baffling that we've now only reached this point. We saw the horrifying effects of grok and other chat bots that are able to generate and share explicit content of women and children at the request of online users earlier this year. Now children defer. They deserve far more than the dither and delay. The tech companies do not even deserve this three month ultimatum. The Prime Minister should not be begging.
He should be telling the big tech companies no to to the proliferation of child sexual abuse imagery and no to putting profit over the safety of children here.
He should be leading the charge on blocking child sexual abuse material on smartphones. And it is absolutely baffling that we've now only reached this point. We saw the horrifying effects of grok and other chat bots that are able to generate and share explicit content of women and children at the request of online users earlier this year. Now children defer. They deserve far more than the dither and delay. The tech companies do not even deserve this three month ultimatum. The Prime Minister should not be begging.
He should be telling the big tech companies no to to the proliferation of child sexual abuse imagery and no to putting profit over the safety of children here.
15:55
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Well, thank you, Mr. Speaker. >> Well, thank you, Mr. Speaker. >> I thank the hon. Member, perhaps didn't listen to his own side's questionings about politics. But questionings about politics. But let me say two things. One, when I go around the country and speak to parents and young families, young people as well, they say to me that the fact that 116,000 people have engaged with our consultation shows that this is a question on which the British public has strong views, but also that it has a British government that is now putting those strong views directly into public policy action as well.
And on the question of pace, I will simply point to the hon. Member that it is pace that we're moving with on this question. In particular, the Prime Minister secured changes. When I went to Australia two weeks ago, they said to me, why was the UK the first place to secure changes on nudity, blurring already on operating systems for a major provider as a result of the robust engagement we have had? I know the House is rightly questioning the pace of legislation. I'm interested in the pace of outcome.
That's what we're delivering.
And on the question of pace, I will simply point to the hon. Member that it is pace that we're moving with on this question. In particular, the Prime Minister secured changes. When I went to Australia two weeks ago, they said to me, why was the UK the first place to secure changes on nudity, blurring already on operating systems for a major provider as a result of the robust engagement we have had? I know the House is rightly questioning the pace of legislation. I'm interested in the pace of outcome.
That's what we're delivering.
15:56
Fleur Anderson MP (Putney, Labour)
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Fleur Anderson MP (Putney, Labour)
Fleur Anderson thank you, Mr. Speaker. There's been a social experiment conducted by social media companies on our children for too long, and parents have been too long, and parents have been left trying to take the burden. Can the Minister, who I thank very much for many meetings together over many months, tell us the criteria for determining which platforms are going to be deemed safe or unsafe when determining what young people should have access to, at what age, and in particular, reassure the House that this won't be left to parents, as YouTube, for example, are still pushing for.
Thank you.
Thank you.
15:57
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Well. remarkable champion for young people and families on this question. I have deeply valued her input and expertise on it as well. On her particular question of definition. I won't pre-empt the particular decisions as a result of the consultation, but I will say to her that her representations on harmful parties are very much top of mind for me, and I can assure her very much that it won't be parents who will bear the burden of enforcement. It will very much be the platforms that we're making sure are responsible for enforcement and acting.
15:57
Rt Hon Sir Edward Leigh MP (Gainsborough, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Sir Edward Leigh MP (Gainsborough, Conservative)
Father of the House Edward Leigh rather than trading party political rather than trading party political points, can we all agree that these huge companies are rotting our huge companies are rotting our children's minds with addictive algorithms? And whilst we know that banning things seldom works because people circumvent it and it leads to criminality? Will the Minister and the Prime Minister go to these companies and say they are in the last chance saloon? Either they take decisive action, which we know they can do, or we will ban
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children from going on social media. Well. Mr. Speaker, I think in
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Mr. Speaker, I think in characteristic fashion, the Father of the House is wise counsel. I will be very much taking that to heart in the way that this government acts.
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children from going on social media. Well. Mr. Speaker, I think in
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Mr. Speaker, I think in characteristic fashion, the Father of the House is wise counsel. I will be very much taking that to heart in the way that this government acts.
15:58
15:59
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Can I thank my hon. Friend? And I think the point he makes about the inadequacy of what the tech companies have done so far is absolutely one that I feel the absolutely one that I feel the weight of as well. We are acting to make sure that young people in this country are secured from the harms they experiencing. We have done that already by engaging robustly with the companies. So far, as I said, already, world leading in the fact that a major operating system has been reformed only in the United Kingdom to secure our children.
If that doesn't happen, we are already working in parallel
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to make sure that the force of the law is felt as well. Kit Malthouse Mr. Speaker, it's
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a pity that the Minister has chosen attack as the best form. Of. Defence when so many across this
If that doesn't happen, we are already working in parallel
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to make sure that the force of the law is felt as well. Kit Malthouse Mr. Speaker, it's
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a pity that the Minister has chosen attack as the best form. Of. Defence when so many across this
15:59
Rt Hon Kit Malthouse MP (North West Hampshire, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Kit Malthouse MP (North West Hampshire, Conservative)
chamber have raised this issue repeatedly. >> Over many years now as something
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of concern. Nevertheless, setting aside. His bombast and hoping that it would be more thoughtful in the implementation of these welcome changes, can I ask, as part of the guidance, I know he's going to be issuing guidance, as I understand it, for parents about screen usage, particularly for very young children. Can I ask if part of that guidance will also be to parents about their screen usage in the presence of their young children? There's growing evidence that what's now called techno fear is, is having a strong impact on the attachments that parents form with children in the very early months and years of of life.
And that's being felt certainly in my constituency in Andover and elsewhere in primary school, as they as they arrive. I think it'd be helpful for parents to understand the impact this is having on them and their attachment to their children, to.
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of concern. Nevertheless, setting aside. His bombast and hoping that it would be more thoughtful in the implementation of these welcome changes, can I ask, as part of the guidance, I know he's going to be issuing guidance, as I understand it, for parents about screen usage, particularly for very young children. Can I ask if part of that guidance will also be to parents about their screen usage in the presence of their young children? There's growing evidence that what's now called techno fear is, is having a strong impact on the attachments that parents form with children in the very early months and years of of life.
And that's being felt certainly in my constituency in Andover and elsewhere in primary school, as they as they arrive. I think it'd be helpful for parents to understand the impact this is having on them and their attachment to their children, to.
16:00
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
I think the hon. Member makes an incredibly thoughtful point, incredibly thoughtful point, something that I have heard an anecdote in engaging with young families as well. I am conscious families as well. I am conscious that we are running a large scale media literacy campaign to support parents in their understanding of social media and its impact on them and their relationships with their kids as well. I will take his comments and make sure that they're fed into the guidance that is prepared.
16:01
Becky Gittins MP (Clwyd East, Labour)
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Becky Gittins MP (Clwyd East, Labour)
Thank you again. >> Twickenham mentioned delay on this issue, and I wonder whether that's a shame that perhaps she didn't enjoy the same level of consultation that I and many of my colleagues on this side of the House did with our constituents. When I was in my recently consulting with groups of parents and young people, students there, I was surprised by how much commonality they had in what they asked for. From this consultation. It was my privilege to present that to the Minister last week.
Does he agree with me and indeed them, that it's the responsibility of this government to call the tech companies to the table so that there is that opportunity for parents, young people, government and tech companies to all be working together to protect our young people.
Does he agree with me and indeed them, that it's the responsibility of this government to call the tech companies to the table so that there is that opportunity for parents, young people, government and tech companies to all be working together to protect our young people.
16:01
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Can I thank my hon. Friend, first and foremost, for the depth of engagement she has done with of engagement she has done with young people and families in her constituency in representations that she has made to me. Mr. Speaker, one of the things I have heard consistently from young people, both here and abroad is that in the way we have engaged on this question, we have made sure that we are doing politics differently, that we are listening to the voices of young people and families and putting it right at the heart of our decisions.
She has done that in her community. We will do that across the country.
She has done that in her community. We will do that across the country.
16:02
Caroline Voaden MP (South Devon, Liberal Democrat)
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Caroline Voaden MP (South Devon, Liberal Democrat)
Reliability. >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It's funny how the thought of his legacy has suddenly spurred the Prime Minister on to take action to Minister on to take action to protect our children, when he has resisted for so long. That being said, it is welcome that the government is listening to the harms based approach that the Liberal Democrats have proposed and are considering restricting different social media sites at different ages, rather than a blanket ban that will have unintended consequences and be unworkable.
But could the Minister confirm that the government will include addictiveness as a factor when determining age restrictions for different sites, platforms, games and features? Yeah.
But could the Minister confirm that the government will include addictiveness as a factor when determining age restrictions for different sites, platforms, games and features? Yeah.
16:02
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
In the spirit that has been recommended by the House, I will ignore the first part of political ignore the first part of political attack from the hon. Member, but can I just point to her that I can I just point to her that I think the particular point she makes on addiction as a really important vector of harm is very much on our minds as we think about the appropriate action here.
16:03
Rachel Taylor MP (North Warwickshire and Bedworth, Labour)
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Rachel Taylor MP (North Warwickshire and Bedworth, Labour)
Rachel Taylor thank you. >> Mr. Speaker. Parents and teachers across North Warwickshire and Bedworth are worried sick that tech companies are wilfully allowing young people to share and access explicit content on their platforms and devices. They're crying out for help. Does the Minister agree with me that it's high time the tech giants are held to account and forced into action to keep young people safe, and the government will legislate without
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delay? Well, I wholeheartedly agree with my hon. Friend. She has been also a remarkable champion in also a remarkable champion in having engaged people in her community and representing those voices to me. We will make sure those voices result in quick as
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delay? Well, I wholeheartedly agree with my hon. Friend. She has been also a remarkable champion in also a remarkable champion in having engaged people in her community and representing those voices to me. We will make sure those voices result in quick as
16:03
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
those voices result in quick as well as deeply robust action. >> Jeremy Wright thank. >> You very much, Mr. Speaker. >> I think the Minister is aware.
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I think the Minister is aware. My concern is about the interaction of whatever the government may choose to ban and the workings of
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I think the Minister is aware. My concern is about the interaction of whatever the government may choose to ban and the workings of
16:03
Rt Hon Sir Jeremy Wright KC MP (Kenilworth and Southam, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Sir Jeremy Wright KC MP (Kenilworth and Southam, Conservative)
choose to ban and the workings of the Online Safety Act that we already have. I know the Minister recognises that that's an important interaction. Would he reassure me that the government is fully aware of the need to ensure that, whether it bans access to social media entirely for children, or indeed bans specific functionalities, we will need to ensure we do not undermine the duty of care that the OSR requires of social media platforms and others.
16:04
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
May well. I think the hon. Member makes an incredibly Member makes an incredibly thoughtful point, given all his expertise and experience on this. On this theme. He has made this point to me before, and I can assure him it is on my mind to make sure that whatever we do, that there is no levelling down of the there is no levelling down of the force of the child safety duties under the Online Safety Act on the platforms. If anything, there's a levelling up.
16:04
Melanie Ward MP (Cowdenbeath and Kirkcaldy, Labour)
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Melanie Ward MP (Cowdenbeath and Kirkcaldy, Labour)
Melanie Ward thank you. claim that their teen accounts provide age appropriate content, I set up a teen account as a 17 year old boy called David without old boy called David without searching for anything. It took just 11 minutes of scrolling for David to be shown antisemitic conspiracy theories. Does the Minister agree that this is a disgrace, and is just one example of why it's time to stop asking social media companies to make their products safe, and instead time to start requiring them to do so through regulation.
They.
They.
16:05
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Well, my hon. Friend makes an incredibly important contribution, and I was horrified when I brought and I was horrified when I brought together Jewish leaders to make sure that they got time with the companies, to tell them the depth companies, to tell them the depth of prejudice that they experienced online, and faced a very similar set of anecdotes as well. I agree with her. This government will continue to make sure that we're bringing the full weight of regulation and policy against the tech companies.
16:05
Christine Jardine MP (Edinburgh West, Liberal Democrat)
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Christine Jardine MP (Edinburgh West, Liberal Democrat)
Christine Jardine thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. And while we all welcome the fact that the government is finally acting, I government is finally acting, I would point out to the Minister that not a single parent of the very many who have been in contact with me in Edinburgh West has requested that the government ask the tech companies to behave differently. Every single one is concerned about their child, a child who is not the problem, who is the victim of the tech companies.
Is it not time that we recognise that over decades we've made this mistake with the press? We left them to self-regulate and we ended up with Leveson. We ended up with all sorts of problems. Why are we doing the same thing with the tech companies? We want change. We should demand change, and we should legislate for the change and not let the people who have created the problem decide when and how they're going to fix it.
Is it not time that we recognise that over decades we've made this mistake with the press? We left them to self-regulate and we ended up with Leveson. We ended up with all sorts of problems. Why are we doing the same thing with the tech companies? We want change. We should demand change, and we should legislate for the change and not let the people who have created the problem decide when and how they're going to fix it.
16:06
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Yes. >> Yes. >> Mr. Speaker, I was visiting young people and families in Leith young people and families in Leith in Scotland just a few weeks ago. The thing I heard more than anything else was the scale of harm anything else was the scale of harm that young people were experiencing in those families, but also a desire that we focus on the thing that stops that harm. And that is why we will, of course, act robustly on the consultation that we have done in this instance.
As I've mentioned before, we have already secured major changes. We will continue to do that, and in parallel, we will prepare legislation. What I'm interested in is that young people in Edinburgh and across the country are protected from the horrific harms.
As I've mentioned before, we have already secured major changes. We will continue to do that, and in parallel, we will prepare legislation. What I'm interested in is that young people in Edinburgh and across the country are protected from the horrific harms.
16:07
Matt Rodda MP (Reading Central, Labour)
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Matt Rodda MP (Reading Central, Labour)
Rotherham thank you, Mr. Speaker. decisive action? >> Mr. speaker, there have been the most appalling tragedies across the country, including my constituency, country, including my constituency, where parents have lost children due to online harms. I know that the Minister and the Prime Minister are working closely with parents. Could I urge him to continue to do this and to continue to carry out the type of engagement he's been carrying out, and to listen to the example from Australia, and we look forward to hearing more decisive action in the near future.
16:07
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Mr. speaker, one of the big lessons of both the Australian experience and beyond is that policy in this context is not just about short term impact, but about long term norms. And we only long term norms. And we only achieve that impact if we bring parents and families with us. And so can I pay tribute to my hon. Friend who has been a remarkable champion, in particular for bereaved families in his constituency who have experienced the utmost tragedy and through it shown the most remarkable resilience.
16:08
Rt Hon Sir John Whittingdale MP (Maldon, Conservative)
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Rt Hon Sir John Whittingdale MP (Maldon, Conservative)
John Whittingdale thank you, Mr. Speaker. While I welcome the Speaker. While I welcome the government's belated intention to act on this area, does he agree that there is no need for to wait for legislation? The social media companies actually started to companies actually started to enforce their existing requirements on age in order to participate online. There are many children under the age of 13 who are able to create accounts and interact, despite the fact that this is completely against the terms of the platform.
16:08
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
The hon. Gentleman is totally right in saying that social media companies have a requirement already to enforce age assurance thresholds that they face under the existing legislation, where that is not acting. We're continuing to not acting. We're continuing to back off to make sure that it acts robustly, uses every single power that it has, and we will continue to review whether more is needed to make sure that is robust action. Indeed. Speaker.
16:08
Ms Julie Minns MP (Carlisle, Labour)
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Ms Julie Minns MP (Carlisle, Labour)
It's over 20 years since I. >> It's over 20 years since I. >> Was one of half a dozen people who co-wrote. >> The world's first code. >> Of practice.
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Of practice. To protect minors from age inappropriate content. One of the biggest challenges we faced then was age verification. Can the Minister please assure us that the technology and the devices are now there and in place, so that under 18 seconds can age verify.
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Of practice. To protect minors from age inappropriate content. One of the biggest challenges we faced then was age verification. Can the Minister please assure us that the technology and the devices are now there and in place, so that under 18 seconds can age verify.
16:09
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
But. >> But. >> Well, I I've been very conscious of my hon. Friend's expertise in this domain, but I'm glad to hear her pioneering experience on the particular question of age verification. Two the reason we've taken this action is because through the engagement we've done, we've made sure that the technology is now in a good place to do exactly that, to verify age, the the threshold of 18 robustly. That is why we want to see it extended to make sure young people are secured online.
16:09
Rt Hon Suella Braverman KC MP (Fareham and Waterlooville, Reform UK)
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Rt Hon Suella Braverman KC MP (Fareham and Waterlooville, Reform UK)
Suella Braverman. >> Suella Braverman. >> I've met victims of online sexual exploitation and it is absolutely devastating crime that absolutely devastating crime that needs to be stopped. But I really fear that the government's plans are going to make things worse for are going to make things worse for everyone, whilst taking little action to protect children online. The Australian model hasn't worked, and I fear that these government plans will effectively open the door to state mandated surveillance and digital ID on the entire population.
We all want children to be safe online. Brilliant technology exists like parental control software and excellent other mechanisms. We can use that technology. Can't we use that technology more? Rather than imposing an authoritarian ID database on the entire population?
We all want children to be safe online. Brilliant technology exists like parental control software and excellent other mechanisms. We can use that technology. Can't we use that technology more? Rather than imposing an authoritarian ID database on the entire population?
16:10
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Mr. speaker, that is a remarkable mischaracterisation of what this government is looking to do, and I think the bulk of the do, and I think the bulk of the House will feel the weight of what the hon. Member has just said. But let me say very clearly, Mr. let me say very clearly, Mr. Speaker, there is a straight choice here between backing parents and their families in a context where they are experiencing remarkable difficulties in keeping up with modern technology or backing platforms. And I'm astonished that the member has said that the Reform Party is backing tech billionaires and platforms, not parents.
16:11
Naushabah Khan MP (Gillingham and Rainham, Labour)
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Naushabah Khan MP (Gillingham and Rainham, Labour)
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Unfortunately, I don't believe that the tech giants will do as they say the tech giants will do as they say and act in the right way when it comes to this issue. And so I ask the Minister what consideration he is giving to legislation, is giving to legislation, particularly when it comes to ensuring that all platforms can meet the same standards, but also that we can future proof against new future platforms as well.
16:11
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
So I share my hon. Friend's scepticism. So let me say two things. One, actions matter more than words. We have already demonstrated in action that we can demonstrated in action that we can move in a pioneering way. The world first action that we were able to get on a major operating system earlier this year. Thanks. Something that has been praised by international partners as well. But secondly, on her particular point on law, as I mentioned at the outset, the Home Secretary and Home Office and I are working very closely to make sure that we're preparing law and in parallel, to ensure that no stone unturned in securing our young people's future.
16:11
Alicia Kearns MP (Rutland and Stamford, Conservative)
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Alicia Kearns MP (Rutland and Stamford, Conservative)
Alicia Kearns thank you, Mr. Speaker. I welcome the government's belated move on social media, but belated move on social media, but can the Minister clarify, does the technology prevent photos being taken in the first place, or does taken in the first place, or does it scan your device to prevent you sending photos because there are understandable privacy concerns? But can the Minister also clarify? His department has briefed the media that YouTube kids will be excluded from any such action by the government.
Can he explain why?
Can he explain why?
16:12
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. >> On the first question, whilst we will continue to look at the most effective ways of making this happen, the existing technology happen, the existing technology largely largely uses classifiers that ensure, even at the point of that ensure, even at the point of taking of the images, that camera rendering can prevent those from being taken so that technology exists already. On her second point, as a matter of course, she'll be aware. I will not comment on briefings.
16:12
Laura Kyrke-Smith MP (Aylesbury, Labour)
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Laura Kyrke-Smith MP (Aylesbury, Labour)
Laura Kyrke-Smith thank you. >> Laura Kyrke-Smith thank you. >> Mr. Speaker. I spoken to many young people in Aylesbury and the villages about this, and one boy villages about this, and one boy told me about the content he'd seen from terrorist beheadings to sexual abuse. And this is what he said to me. He said, please don't stop us communicating with our friends. We want to do that, but please stop us seeing this illegal and traumatising material and please help us manage our addiction to these social media platforms.
Does the Minister agree that the tech companies cannot be trusted with our children's safety or their futures, and that the government has to step in now?
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Yes. I agree entirely with my hon. Friend, and she has also been a Friend, and she has also been a persistent campaigner on this question, and I valued her input and conversations on it as well. Clearly, Mr. Speaker, the Clearly, Mr. Speaker, the experiment that we have allowed our young people to be a part of has not worked. We must put it to an
Does the Minister agree that the tech companies cannot be trusted with our children's safety or their futures, and that the government has to step in now?
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Yes. I agree entirely with my hon. Friend, and she has also been a Friend, and she has also been a persistent campaigner on this question, and I valued her input and conversations on it as well. Clearly, Mr. Speaker, the Clearly, Mr. Speaker, the experiment that we have allowed our young people to be a part of has not worked. We must put it to an
16:13
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
not worked. We must put it to an imminently. >> Vikki Slade thank you, Mr. Speaker. I welcome the. >> Proposals announced today, but I
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Proposals announced today, but I am concerned that they appear to be limited to nudity and children who have been the subject of self-harm,
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Proposals announced today, but I am concerned that they appear to be limited to nudity and children who have been the subject of self-harm,
16:13
Vikki Slade MP (Mid Dorset and North Poole, Liberal Democrat)
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Vikki Slade MP (Mid Dorset and North Poole, Liberal Democrat)
or been encouraged to take their own lives, and those who have seen extreme violence don't appear to be extreme violence don't appear to be covered. My son. George told me that without any attempt at trying to find it, he was fed the images to find it, he was fed the images of Charlie Kirk's murder pretty much as soon as it had happened, and I don't see anything in here to and I don't see anything in here to prevent something like that happening again. So can the Minister confirm that this will include extreme violence, as well
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include extreme violence, as well as those awful sites that are causing children to hurt themselves? Yeah.
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include extreme violence, as well as those awful sites that are causing children to hurt themselves? Yeah.
16:14
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Well, I really value the particular harms the hon. Member has raised. Can I assure her that extreme violence and self-harm content of the sort she's described are significant and priority offences under the Online Safety Act? Already, platforms have a liability to make sure that that sort of content is rooted out proactively. And where that's not happening, the regulator has the powers to act against. It will continue to do so. The particular change being considered here is about a very specific classifier of nudity.
It's much harder to build classifiers for particular types of violence. I will, of course, continue to work with her and any others interested to look at where more we can go.
It's much harder to build classifiers for particular types of violence. I will, of course, continue to work with her and any others interested to look at where more we can go.
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16:33
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Of growing up in a world without social media and with social media, but young people today have not had that benefit. They've grown up with lives intimately intertwined with the digital world, and in lockdown, were pushed even deeper online were pushed even deeper online without being given a say. So whatever we do next, we must bring whatever we do next, we must bring the
16:33
16:33
Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
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Kanishka Narayan MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Science, Innovation and Technology) (Vale of Glamorgan, Labour)
Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Well, can I say that my hon. Friend has been one of the most vocal people on this question, in particular on engaging young. There are two things on my mind. One, the trust that I have felt, Madam trust that I have felt, Madam Deputy Speaker, in engaging with young people in every nation and region of our country on these questions, whether it's over basketball, cricket, football, netball and indeed toasting marshmallows with the Cumbrian scouts. My trust has only been affirmed on this question.
The second thing to say is that I think he is right to raise an important point, in particular for a series of young people from LGBTQ groups, but from rural groups too, who have talked to me about finding community online. And so we have to bear that in mind in ensuring that they have appropriate resources to feel supported in forming community as well.
The second thing to say is that I think he is right to raise an important point, in particular for a series of young people from LGBTQ groups, but from rural groups too, who have talked to me about finding community online. And so we have to bear that in mind in ensuring that they have appropriate resources to feel supported in forming community as well.
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