Commons Chamber

Thursday 26th June 2025

(began 11 hours, 24 minutes ago)

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09:34
09:34
None Portrait Oral questions: Transport
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Order, we start with questions.
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None Portrait Q2. What steps she is taking to help improve local bus services. (904827)
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Question number two.
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Simon Lightwood Portrait Simon Lightwood MP, Parliamentary Under-Secretary (Department for Transport) (Wakefield and Rothwell, Labour )
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I'm not going to take lectures from the party opposite who were responsible for 300 million fewer miles driven by buses under their watch and as I have explained on various occasions, the franchising in Greater Manchester is just one kind and full franchising, as it is commonly known exist and there are various other means including the model adopted in Jersey, which is a partnership between the operators and local transport authorities and they can benefit from skills and knowledge as well.

I've corrected this in committee and I do not recognise the figures he is referring to because it is delivering faster, better, smoother, more reliable services to the people of Manchester at an affordable price. Sting we have four hours of price. Sting we have four hours of build committee to rehearse these issues it again later today and the issues it again later today and the Minister said he is providing £1 billion of support for buses this billion of support for buses this year but he knows, surely, that £700 million of that goes to help local authorities navigate the huge burdens that come with franchising burdens that come with franchising and the other schemes, leaving just £255 million for services across the whole of England, just enough to whole of England, just enough to satisfy Andy Burnham for one year satisfy Andy Burnham for one year but there is full fat being followed by Liverpool and the West Midlands by Liverpool and the West Midlands down the line.

Where is the money to support these ambitions, I ask again. He is aware that places like Greater Manchester are part of the group of authorities that received £15.6 billion in order to spend in their local areas and, of course, it's important to recognise the extraordinary performance of buses in Greater Manchester and once again we are not telling local areas which model to adopt with buses. It could be franchising, improved and enhanced partnerships, removing the barrier on municipal bus companies.

barrier on municipal bus companies.
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None Portrait Business Statement: Business Questions to the Leader of the House
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Will the leader give the house the forthcoming business?
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Jesse Norman Portrait Rt Hon Jesse Norman MP (Hereford and South Herefordshire, Conservative)
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Thank you. I am afraid to say that the past week has been another horror show for the government. This is Armed Forces week, as the house will know. It is a time to celebrate and champion all those who serve and have served in our Armed Forces, and nowhere more than in my own county of Herefordshire. We must also note that, far from celebrating the Armed Forces, this government deliberately opened the door last year to unfair and vexatious prosecutions of veterans who served decades ago in Northern Ireland, and it has helped keep that door open.

What else? The abortion act was debated for more than a year, but the government allowed no notice for public debate on the amendment last week, and it gave just two hours of debate in the chamber on the biggest change in abortion law in nearly 60 years. What anyone thinks of the issue, it is a bad way to make legislation. What else? Defence ministers were left out of the loop of nuclear facilities and were unable to say whether or not they support this action by the closest ally.

We expressed deep concerns of the welfare bill and the government has promised to bring the bill forward next week. Let's see if it does. Having only just you turned on the winter fuel payment, and again on grooming gangs last week, the government prepared itself for a U- turn on the Child Benefit, less than a year since it suspended seven Labour MPs for voting against that. And this is just one week. Is it any wonder that the prime ministers personal reputation has continued to plummet? Only yesterday, The Times of London said not quite a year has passed since his general election victory, and already has political stock has called it status with the stock has called it status with the Zimbabwean dollar.

You may recall that this was a monetary instrument which led to hyperinflation and political collapse. This is coming from The Times of London. Why don't we dig in further to one reason why the prime ministers reputation might have fallen so much. Following the pay settlements of last year, the doctors have announced that they are excited at the idea of six months of strike action. Meanwhile, hospital consultants are looking to see if they will strike as well. There is a 22% increase after Labour took office, and other junior doctors are demanding a further pay increase of 29%.

These are I watering numbers, and of course, we will all end up paying if they are granted, but of course, this is exactly what you would expect from a government that has pledged the cash since the elections. It is hardly surprising that the unions think they have an open door to extract money from the Treasury, and has made the money worse with nationalisations and by abolishing NHS England. It acted as a firebreak on union lobbying because it operated so independently by abolishing it.

The government has removed the few means they have to face down extortionate demands for more pay and more restrictive finances. The same is true with railways as each one is nationalised. So, the obstacles demanded are being removed. The house will report a massive pay settlement with no attempt to negotiate to any efficiency gains, so the amount of time before those unions come back for more as doctors are doing. These are not paid bargains but an abject surrender. Ministers themselves are reported to be union members.

As far as I can see, leader of the is an exception to this. She is not a union member, and all credit to her for that. She is in fact a union member and therefore fully complicit in the same problem. But it means that the Treasury itself is now the only holdout against union demand. Little wonder the chances look so unhappy and out of sorts, and that is before the deputy minister started seeking memos in tax increases. The unions know the government is vulnerable and they have come back for more.

We know that the government is running scared as well, led by committee chairs who are starting to get organised. So, can the leader positively and personally now confirm that the welfare ill vote will take place next Tuesday? will take place next Tuesday?
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Lucy Powell Portrait Rt Hon Lucy Powell MP, Lord President of the Council and Leader of the House of Commons (Manchester Central, Labour )
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Can I start by wishing to jeopardy speakers are happy birthday? As the honourable gentleman said, this week marks Armed Forces week where we thank and show our support for the men and women who serve or who have served in our Armed Forces over many years. It is nice to see the honourable gentleman in his place this week because we have missed him quite a bit recently. But I might gently suggest that, if he was here last week, he could have asked last week's question last week and said this week instead.

But he asked me about the welfare bill. I have announced the house at Universal Credit and personal independent payment bill will take place next Tuesday, and the committee in remaining stages of that bill will be on the floor of the house the following week. I want to reassure colleagues that we take parliamentary scrutiny and process of goals extremely seriously, and that is what our democracy is all about. Hills are introduced, principles are considered at second reading, details received are robust and they are often amended at Committee stage before we consider third reading.

As the house would expect, the government actively engages with Parliamentary opinion throughout the Bill's passage as we are doing intensively with the Universal Credit and personal independent payment bill. I'm sure the whole house can agree that our welfare system needs reform. Too many people are consigned to benefits for life without support to work and to get on. During the pandemic in particular, those on sickness and disability benefits rose significantly. In the previous government did nothing to re-engage people with the labour market afterwards.

One in eight young people are now not earning or learning. Many post-industrial communities have been scarred over generations by worthlessness and little job creation, and as constituency MPs, we have all seen the inadequate and degrading nature of disability benefits reassessments. Addressing these deep-seated problems is core to our labour principles and what we are trying to do with our welfare reforms. And just to remind colleagues, these include the biggest permanent increase to the standard out of work benefits since 1980.

An end to reassessment for all those with serious health conditions, and creating a more holistic and professionally led assessments process. The biggest back to work programme in a generation, the right to try work, and ending era of consigning people as unable to work. To be clear, it is the party opposites legacy that this government has to sort out. Their legacy of one in 10 working age people on sickness and disability benefits. Their legacy of a generation of young people with no mental-health support and poor skills.

Their legacy of over 7 million people on the NHS waiting list, and their legacy of inaction of welfare reforms over years and years. And quite honestly, he does have the brass neck because they have written the book on government chaos, haven't they? Three prime ministers in three years. They sent the markets into chaos with budgets down on the back of a fag packet. They really did write the book on that one. By-election after by- election. Over 40 ministers resigned in a single day.

Billions wasted on COVID contracts, public services left on their knees, and industrial action sweeping the nation, costing us all dear, all leaving ordinary people paying the price with higher bills, higher mortgages, and higher waiting lists. But it is not all about welfare reform. It is about the context that it sits in as well, and that is what this government is getting on with doing. This mission to create good, decent, well-paid jobs in every community. This governments mission to bring down waiting lists and deal with the deep-seated health inequalities in this country.

This governments mission to tackle child poverty, to build more affordable and social housing giving people the bedrock in life, and this governments mission to revolutionise skills and opportunities for young people. This is the Labour government with our labour values getting on with the job and delivering for people.

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Just remind people, I am only going to run this to 1130 because of the important statement that is
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Bobby Dean Portrait Bobby Dean MP (Carshalton and Wallington, Liberal Democrat)
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Can I join the leader of the in congratulating the Deputy Speakers on the birthday and in celebration of our Armed Forces? Earlier this year, when the Secretary of State announced the welfare reform, she made the argument to this house that it was all about getting people back into work. I think that argument was undermined somewhat by the timing with the spring statement coming the following week, and we discover that the £5 billion saving we achieve from these welfare reforms make up fully half of the fiscal effluent that the Chancellor is relying on.

And we take a closer look at reforms, most of those savings are generated by changing legibility criteria for Personal Independence criteria for Personal Independence These are entitlements given to those in work, out of work, those unable to work and those who will miss out will not be incentivised into work because they will already be in work or unable to join the workforce any time then. It is no wonder that is when the bell was published last week, there was condemnation from all sides of the House and if the books must be balanced, let's make sure they are not balanced off the backs of the disabled and the Leader of the House will be aware of the issues on this side of the House and I would ask the procedure for doing that.

If there is an amendment, we understand there is an amendment, we understand that would kill the bill entirely. What are the options for concessions? Will it be withdrawn? Are there compromises they could Are there compromises they could make with the backbench before next week?
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Bob Blackman Portrait Bob Blackman MP (Harrow East, Conservative)
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Following the successful

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Following the successful experiment of Estimate Day Bates, yesterday we agreed we would introduce that and bring forward introduce that and bring forward proposals for standing order change proposals for standing order change ease and in addition to this, on ease and in addition to this, on Thursday, there will be a debate on that, followed by a debate on children's health and on Tuesday there will be a debate on the there will be a debate on the billing to businesses and a debate billing to businesses and a debate on the future of music education and followed by a debate on safeguarding followed by a debate on safeguarding children with allergies and skill.

On 8 July, a debate on alcohol and cancer. On the 10th on alcohol and cancer. On the 10th on alcohol and cancer. On 10 July, a debate on statements for victims of terrorism followed by a debate on London's followed by a debate on London's contribution to the national contribution to the national economy. Across India, tomorrow will economy. Across India, tomorrow will be an annual festival and it has been held and a procession takes place through the streets with the deities that the Hindu people worship.

On Sunday, will be an event taking place between the temples and the heat will be 31 degrees at the procession will take place over a route of 7 miles and will take over four hours to complete and the good news is the course is upheld this year so will the leader join with me, and for those Hindus celebrate, me, and for those Hindus celebrate, I wish them all the best. (SOEAKS HINDU) (SOEAKS HINDU)
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None Portrait Ministerial statement: G7 and NATO summits
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Prime Minister. Keir Starmer. Thank you. This Labour government is focused on delivering security
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Keir Starmer Portrait Rt Hon Sir Keir Starmer MP, The Prime Minister (Holborn and St Pancras, Labour)
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is focused on delivering security for the British people. National security, economic security and social security. On Social Security, I recognise there is consensus across the House and the urgent need for reform of our welfare system. Because the British people deserve protection and dignity when they are unable to work. And supported to work when they can. At the moment they are failed every single day, by the broken system created by the Conservatives which achieves neither. I know colleagues across the house are eager to start fixing that, and so are my.

And that all colleagues want to get this right, and so do Y. We want to see reform implemented, with labour values of fairness. That conversation will continue in the coming days, so we can begin making change together on Tuesday. I will update the house on the G7 and NATO summits, where the Middle East was at the forefront of our minds. For decades it has been the stated policy of the UK and our allies that Iran must never obtain a nuclear weapon.

No one who cares about the security of our country or the future of the Middle East could live with that eventuality. For decades, we have worked to prevent it. And on Saturday night the US took a big step towards resolving that sweat. There is now a window for peace. We urge Iran and Israel to honour the ceasefire. And sees this opportunity to stabilise the region. That is our priority. To get Iran back around the negotiating table with the US.

Ultimately, this is how we will ensure a complete, verifiable and irreversible end to Iran's nuclear program. We are using every diplomatic lever to support this effort, because further instability would pose grave risks to the region and beyond. Taking us even further away from freeing the hostages, easing the intolerable suffering of the Palestinians. There is also an opportunity now to push for a ceasefire in Gaza, and we must seize it. I have been discussing this with other leaders and we will keep pushing to put the region on a better path.

I have also spoken to the Emir of Qatar to express our solidarity after Iran's unacceptable attack on the Al Udeid airbase. We took the necessary action to protect British military personnel ahead of that attack, and we will continue to support all our citizens in the region. This crisis has punctured once again the mistaken idea that domestic and foreign policy concerns are separate. That action in one area is at the expense of the other. The truth is, now more than ever, that international problems rebound on us at home.

Impacting our security and our economy. Our national security strategy is clear, in this era of radical uncertainty, faced with growing conflicts, state threats, illegal migration, organised crime and terrorism, the only way to respond to these issues is by being strong both at home and on the world stage. By pursuing a foreign policy that answers directly to the concerns of working people. And that is the approach I took to NATO and the G7. NATO is the most successful military alliance the world has ever known.

The cornerstone of our defence for over 75 years. But our duty is not merely to reflect on that success, we must equip the alliance for the future. I have long argued that this is the moment for Europe to make a fundamental shift in posture. That is what the UK has done, delivering the biggest sustained increase in defence spending since the Cold War, and setting out a landmark shift in our defence and deterrence in the Strategic Defence Review. Yesterday NATO allies stepped up as well to meet this moment.

Creating an alliance that is stronger, fairer and more lethal than ever. Together we signed a new defence pledge, 5% of GDP by 2035, including for the first time wider issues of homeland security and national resilience. Like protecting our cybersecurity and energy networks. This is in lockstep with our national security strategy, and we are already investing in these areas. So under NATO's new definitions we estimate we will reach at least 4.1% of GDP in 2027, on the way to 5% by 2035.

Allies also agreed to review both the balance and the trajectory of these requirements in 2029, two coincide with the scheduled review of NATO's capability requirements ensuring we keep pace with threats and technologies as they evolve. With this historic amendment we are continuing our proud condition on leading in NATO, picking up the torch. Now following their lead we will seize the opportunity created by this moment to align our national security objectives and plans for economic growth, in a way not seen since the 1940s, renewing industrial communities across our country, communities across our country, boosting innovation.

Our investment in our nuclear deterrent alone will support 30,000 jobs. I want to speak directly about our deterrent capability. It has kept this country safe for decades. But we recognise the grim reality today, that the nuclear threat is growing. So we are renewing our existing at sea capability, and we are going still further. I can tell the House today we will procure at least 12 F-35 a fast jets, and we will make them available to ban nuclear weapons if necessary.

This marks the return of the Royal Air Force to nuclear deterrence for the first time in three decades. The biggest strengthening of our deterrence posture in a generation. Keeping our country safe while also supporting 20,000 jobs. The NATO summit sent a message of intent that will be heard around the world. But this must be joined by renewed support for Ukraine, because if we let Putin succeed there the deterrent effect on NATO's new plans would be fatally compromised. So I told President Zelenskyy at Downing Street on Monday that we will harden our resolve, we struck an agreement together to share battlefield technology, accelerating our support for Ukraine's defence.

While boosting British security and British jobs. We committed to providing hundreds more air defence missiles, paid for not by the British taxpayer but with money from Russia's frozen assets. And together with Europe, Canada and our Indo- Pacific partners, we announced we will deliver 40 billion of military aid to Ukraine this year, matching last year's pledge in full. There is a pass to a lasting peace, but it will only come through flipping the pressure onto Putin.

His position is weaker than he claims, so I urged all our partners, including the US, to step up the pressure now with more sanctions and more military support to bring Russia to the table to agree an unconditional ceasefire leading to serious negotiations. Let me turn to be G7 summit. Where again my priority was to deliver in the national interest. And again I can report some significant progress. Leaders agreed to take decisive action on illegal migration, following the UK's lead in using hardheaded measures like sanctions.

We marked an export contract with Canada, worth over half £1 billion, creating jobs here at home. We secured Canada's agreement to ratify Britain's entry to the CPTPP, a trading block worth $12 trillion. And we secured President traps signature to fully implement our trade deal. Which will/tariffs on British goods. His executive order will remove aerospace tariffs completely, cut tariffs for British carmakers facing now to 10% in a matter of days. Saving thousands of jobs in the West Midlands and around the country.

I have been to Jaguar Land Rover many times now, I have looked goes workers in the icon and I know what this means that there communities. This is what summits like this mean for the working people of Britain. This requires cool heads, it defies simple stick answers and knee-jerk judgements. We don't pretend to fix every global problem, but we can carve a unique path through these dangerous times to secure and renew Britain in an year of global instability.

That's what our plan for change is all about, putting Britain's national interest first. After years of economic chaos we have delivered economic stability for the British people. After years of our Armed Forces being hollowed out we are building up our military, firing a power industries, leading in NATO, supporting Ukraine, keeping Britain safe. After years of trade alliances we are rebuilding them and shaping them to serve the British people. Focusing our global influence to deliver for working people and in the national interest.

I commend this statement to the house.
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Kemi Badenoch Portrait Rt Hon Kemi Badenoch MP (North West Essex, Conservative)
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Leader The Opposition, Kemi Badenoch. Minister for advanced sight of his statement. He has evaded Prime Minister's Questions for two weeks, only to come back here to tell us what we already heard on the news. This is a weak statement from a weak Prime Minister, which can be characterised in two words, noises off. In his statement, the Prime Minister said we urge Iran and Israel to honour the ceasefire. He said we are using every diplomatic lever to support this effort.

What diplomatic levers? Are they the same levers he's using with his backbench rebels? Is he asking them to please play nice? Let's be honest, nobody cares what this Prime Minister things, and why should they when he doesn't even know what he thinks and clearly no one cares what he thinks, because he was not involved. We used to be a strategic player on the world stage, in advancing...

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Order. You may not wish to hear the leader of the opposition, I do. Can I just say, it doesn't do anybody good in this chamber to try and shout somebody down who is speaking.

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speaking. Thank you. They can shout as much as they like but we all know the as they like but we all know the truth. Used to be a strategically on the global stage, advancing Britain's interest with confidence, now we are on the sidelines. Over now we are on the sidelines. Over the last few weeks historic events unfolded in the Middle East, and at every stage Britain has been out of step with the US and out of the loop with Israel. Last week the Prime with Israel.

Last week the Prime Minister Kallas from the G7 insisting there was nothing President Trump said that would indicate he was about to get indicate he was about to get indicate he was about to get involved in the conflict. Days later they launched an attack on Iran's nuclear facilities, he had no idea what was going on. At the -- a week what was going on. At the -- a week before Israel launched an attack on Iran, it became apparent the UK wasn't even informed in advance, wasn't even informed in advance, despite us having been involved in previous preventative action.

How is this standing up on the world stage? Tuesday the Foreign Secretary, a lawyer, repeatedly could not say whether the US strikes against Iran whether the US strikes against Iran nuclear facilities were legal. This government does not know what is the steering. Let me make the conservative position clear, Iran has been a direct threat to the UK for years dotting terrorism on British soil, it must not get nuclear weapons. This is a time for Europe to step up, the UK should be leading.

Instead we have an Attorney General using international law to constrain and restrict the UK while the Prime Minister hovers in decisively on the sidelines. What we need is a leader, instead we have three lawyers. Last week I wrote to the Prime Minister about how this conflict has underscored the folly of the government's £30 billion Chagos surrender deal. The Diego Garcia base is of obvious strategic importance for conflicts in the Middle East, they are shaking their heads, they don't understand. It's obvious.

It was used at -- extensively, during the war in Afghanistan including by the US. A prime minister Mike at Prime Minister's Questions the prime Minister said this surrender had been opposed by our adversaries, Russia China and Iran. Since then it's been widely reported China have offered massive congratulations on the deal and conveyed it fully supports Mauritius. Can the prime Minister admit he was incorrect to state on the floor of this House that China opposes the deal, can he confirm if he still views China's confirm if he still views China's Under the terms of the US deal, if he, when we introduce legislation setting out the detail of the Chagos surrender so Parliament can consider We welcome the announcement that the UK will be buying F-35 fighter jets.

I'm pleased the Labour Party has moved on from its previous position rate did not support NATO and advocated against nuclear deterrent. They pretend it never happened, we have the receipts. Conservatives are proud of exceeding the NATO baseline of 2% on defence, and we led NATO in getting there. The government's aspiration to get spending on national security to 5% is just hope. The reality is that Labour does not have a plan to get to 3%, it is all smoke and mirrors. We do not know what the governors will spend this extra 1.5% component.

In the Prime Minister the confirm that this is money that we are already spending or whether it will be new money? As long as the plan remains underfunded, these are just words. Instead of using smoke and mirrors to inflate defence spending, Labour should heed our call to hit 3% by the end of this Parliament with a fully funded plan to get there. Look at the money they claim they will say with their welfare bill, £5 billion is nowhere near the tens if not hundreds of billions that we are going to need to find to meet this defence spending target.

This is the problem. It is one thing to talk about spending money on infrastructure, making announcements about reviews, but it is another to be clear where the money comes from. And how it will be spent efficiently to secure the defence of our nation. They can mutter all they like, we all know that they are terrified of doing anything that even remotely difficult. It is crucial that there is a clear United Front in full support of Ukraine which secures piece on their terms. The stakes could not be higher.

We need the government to be leveraging British interests in every way they can. Can he safely pushed for clearer language in that NATO communique about Russia being the aggressor in this conflict? Can you update us on the U.K.'s current position on Ukraine's accession to NATO, given the absence of detail in this years communique? We must ensure our leading role continues but this requires strong leadership and ability to influence. In conclusion, the Prime Minister may have finally reached out to this House after a fortnight away but in truth he is all at sea.

Irrelevant on the world stage, impotent in the face of rising illegal immigration, and now, with 126 of his own MPs all openly with 126 of his own MPs all openly undermining his authority, his government is incapable of making even the smallest changes to bring down the cost of our ever expanding welfare bill. There is no way we are going to go to pay for a defence. The government paralysed by its own legal advice, paralysed by rebellious backbenchers and paralysed by the fear of being found out having no real vision for the country.
11:49
Keir Starmer Portrait Rt Hon Sir Keir Starmer MP, The Prime Minister (Holborn and St Pancras, Labour)
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Prime minister.

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Can I say to those who are late please don't stand. Mr Speaker, we live in more volatile times and many of us can volatile times and many of us can remember, and with conflicts in many remember, and with conflicts in many parts of the world, that are evolving in a fast and dangerous way. There has never been a more way. There has never been a more important time to work with our allies. And to be absolutely serious allies. And to be absolutely serious in our response.

That response was in our response. That response was unserious. Unserious. To suggest at unserious. Unserious. To suggest at a time like this that the Prime Minister attending the G7 summit and Minister attending the G7 summit and Minister attending the G7 summit and the NATO summit is avoiding PMQs. It the NATO summit is avoiding PMQs. It is unserious. What happened at NATO yesterday was historic. It was very important at a time like this that NATO showed unity and strength, their commitment to the future not their commitment to the future not just to the past.

That took a huge amount of work with our allies over the last few days and weeks, we have the last few days and weeks, we have been centrally involved in that, crafting the final outcome. We were recognised as having done so. I am proud that we helped put summit in the right way and the world emerged safer as a result, and that was that unanimous view of 32 allies leaving NATO yesterday. For the Leader of the Opposition to belittle it just shows how irrelevant she and the party opposite have become.

They used to once be serious about these issues. They used to be capable of cross-party consensus, and all of that is slipping away. We have lead on Ukraine, three trade deals, and she talks about the prospect of US attacks. She must have overlooked the fact that on Tuesday when I return from the G7, the first thing I did was go straight into a Cobra meeting to plan for all contingencies including a possible US attack on Iran.

I will tell her why I did that although we did offer Privy Council briefing so she knows, we have military personnel located in nearly all the bases across the Middle East. And therefore I was extremely concerned to ensure that immediately on my return, I took every step to ensure I had the highest levels of assuredness that we had the preparations in place to keep our people and assets safe, should the need arise full stop so far from being blindsided, we were planning through last week, we were talking to the Americans.

We were put on notice about everything that they did. She simply does not understand the nature of the relationship at that level. In relation to Diego Garcia, we did not have to give Mauritius advanced notice under the treaty was that it absolutely clear. And she talks about defence spend, we are the party that has increased defence spend to the highest level since the Cold War. 2.5%. They talked about it, we did it. She says we don't know where the money is coming from.

She was pressed on this is an interview not so long ago and this was a quote. She said this, " We talked about getting to 3% by 2030, and we could not make the numbers work. " And then she goes on, " We need to find a way to make that numbers work. This sort of thing requires real thinking. Let's start looking at what we can do. It is about setting up task forces. " Mr Speaker, that is how unserious they are.

She asked about the communique. She would know if she had actually studied this, the way that NATO works as an iterative process. And therefore the position on Ukraine has not changed through NATO are not changed under this government. On the contrary we are recognised as leading on Ukraine, the closest ally of Ukraine working the whole time. That is something I am proud of. I think it's something the House is proud of, we have been doing this on a cross-party basis across the House

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and the sooner we get back to that rather than the unserious response of the Leader of the Opposition, the better. Chair of the Foreign Affairs
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Ed Davey Portrait Rt Hon Ed Davey MP (Kingston and Surbiton, Liberal Democrat)
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Leader of the Liberal Democrat's Ed Davey.

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Thank you Mr Speaker was up and I thank the Prime Minister for early sight of his statement. We agree it would have been wrong to leave an would have been wrong to leave an empty chair in front of the Union Jack at the table for the G7, and it Jack at the table for the G7, and it is astonishing and I share his surprise Conservative policy not to surprise Conservative policy not to attend the G7. Mr Speaker, I am glad attend the G7.

Mr Speaker, I am glad the Prime Minister that signalled retreat on his welfare plans and retreat on his welfare plans and hope you will now listen to everyone and not just his backbenchers. On the G7, despite the progress that he the G7, despite the progress that he outlined, it remains very damaging to the world economy, the United to the world economy, the United States, and Donald Trump continues their policy of protectionism. I their policy of protectionism. I wonder if you could update the house if he had discussions with other G7 or NATO colleagues about how we can or NATO colleagues about how we can persuade President Trump to resile from protectionism? Or NATO, the from protectionism? Or NATO, the Prime Minister is right, Putin's imperial ambitions resent a once in imperial ambitions resent a once in a generation threat to our security.

Last week I travelled to Estonia to meet British troops and Estonian meet British troops and Estonian leaders including the prime minister. The Estonians have not forgotten the repression enforced by Russian tanks, nor the murder of four further prime ministers at the hands of the Kremlin. They are under no illusions about the threat posed by Putin, and we must not be either. So I welcome his commitment to NATO's new spending targets. In the face of Russia's war machine, the British Army remains an essential guarantor of our country's security, and that of our allies.

Meeting without credible troops stationed in Estonia, I was inspired by their skill and professionalism. We need to get more Brit people like them into the military, so will the Prime Minister to consider the liberal Democrat proposals to move more quickly to reverse the Conservative cuts to the army, and back our new £10,000 bonus? It is vital we take such measures as Putin continues his barbarism in Ukraine. Our commitment to Ukraine's Defence Ministry increased not reduced. In addition to the actions he outlined, can the Prime Minister to confirm whether he has held more discussions with partners not just using the interest from the Russian assets, seizing the frozen Russian assets.

So we can bolster our support for Ukraine and pay for a faster increase in defence spending. Dystonias believe they have a plan to deal with all the convocations he mentioned when I asking questions about this was the is he prepared to meet me to discuss Estonian ideas to break the backlog so we can see these assets? The Prime Minister also spoke about conflicts and crises in the Middle East. He is right to push even harder for a ceasefire in Gaza. People...

Military action or diplomacy will make us safer in the future. We must redouble our efforts for a just peace in the region and that must include self-determination for the Palestinian people. Will the government finally commit to recognising a state for the Palestinians?

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Can I thank him for his question.
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Keir Starmer Portrait Rt Hon Sir Keir Starmer MP, The Prime Minister (Holborn and St Pancras, Labour)
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Can I thank him for his question. He started by asking whether I have discussed with other G7 partners the discussed with other G7 partners the question of the tariffs, and the answer is yes we did and we do frequently discuss trade and the frequently discuss trade and the economy. The challenge is that those tariffs are put in place for all economies. That is the sort of coordination and discussion that goes on all the time. On troops in Estonia, I have visited those troops a number of times myself.

They are incredibly brave. They have a real sense of purpose. I tell him that it was the frontline states on the border with Russia that were leading the charge in relation to the work we had to do yesterday to review and take forward the pledges that we make. He asks about reversing the cuts to the army, we will begin reversing those cuts. When the party opposite came into office there were 100,000 in the army and many left there were 70,000.

I think that is what was meant when it was that they had hollowed out the armed forces. On the question of the assets whether they themselves can be seized rather than just the interest, I have been discussing that with colleagues as he would expect. It is complicated as he knows. There is not one view frankly on this issue amongst colleagues and allies. I'm happy to see the proposals that he has received from Estonia or any others. It remains complicated and I have to say allies are in different places on this.

We will continue to discuss. On a ceasefire in Gaza and recognition, I think it is important we press the case and quite urgently enclose club oration with our colleagues from the E3. Working closely at the moment to say this is the moment to press on to a ceasefire in Gaza. And that should happen in days not weeks or months. I do think there is a window of opportunity here. I hope that it happens I can't predict that it will but I do think all of us should do all we can to ensure that along with a ceasefire in Iran we push for the ceasefire in Gaza.

On the question of recognition, it has long been our policy to recognise Palestine and the right time in the process to bring about this. Because without two-state solution, there is little prospect of lasting peace in the region. That remains policy. Thank
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Luke Pollard Portrait Luke Pollard MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Plymouth Sutton and Devonport, Labour )
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week our nation comes together to give profound thanks to the men and women of our Armed Forces, their families and veterans, the heroes who give so much and sacrificed so much for their country. At a time when the world is becoming increasingly dangerous, unpredictable, and insecure. Right now, our Armed Forces are helping Ukraine to defend itself against the might of Russia by supplying kits and equipment. Nearly 3 1/2 years into a war which Putin thought would be over in three days.

Our Armed Forces are in Singapore with the UK carrier strike group led by HMS Prince of Wales, strengthening Britain's ties with the Indo- Pacific. They are operating as part of every NATO mission alongside our allies, keeping the peace in zones of potential conflict, and our people are working in the Middle East to de-escalate tensions and stabilise the region. Our Armed Forces are contributing to UN peacekeeping forces around the world, helping to bring hope to war-torn communities, and they are protecting our shores, and at home, ready at a moments notice to respond to any emerging threats.

Julie, they are the best of Britain. Recognised globally for their professionalism and determination. We have a chance in Armed Forces Week to say thank you for to thank them for their service, to thank their families for their understanding at the times when they are away. To thank those people who support our men and women in uniform in defence industries, in the supply chain, in technology companies that help keep them having the fighting edge that keeps our country safe.

Apart from those affected by Covid restrictions, 2024 was the first year since the inception of Armed Forces Day that there was no national event. This government is proud to have restored it this year, backing three days of celebrations. As the member for Great Grimsby and Cleethorpes knows, it is a community which carries a long tradition of not honouring our Armed Forces but shaping and supporting them too. From the local RAF station at North Coates, which was home to the coastal command during World War II, disrupting enemy supply chains with great success, to active veteran groups today, like one which does outstanding work in North East Lincolnshire, topping veterans to return to civilian life.

Although the biggest celebrations will be taking place in Cleethorpes, where the Defence Secretary will be this weekend, there are more than 180 other events taking place across the nation. Earlier this week my ministerial colleague Lord Coaker is amongst the large crowds which turned out in Northern Ireland to

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celebrate Armed Forces Day. Mr Deputy Speaker, I was very

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Mr Deputy Speaker, I was very fortunate to be there and had an opportunity to meet Lord Coaker. It opportunity to meet Lord Coaker. It was clear to him and I, 60,000 people turned out to commemorate and celebrate such a wonderful occasion celebrate such a wonderful occasion was the I ask the Minister maybe later on, will he outline clearly later on, will he outline clearly what can be done to recruit more TA soldiers, whether it be flexibility from employers, whether it be jobs they can do, or would it be to

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enlarge the numbers? Can I thank him for his years of

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Can I thank him for his years of service? It was in Westminster Hall yesterday that he ended up all the yesterday that he ended up all the years that he served in uniform. I think it was 14 1/2 years in total in various roles. Can I thank you in various roles. Can I thank you for his service to our country. It is vital that we address the retention and recruitment crisis we inherited from the previous government. We are making good progress in that regard, a key part progress in that regard, a key part of that is not only recruiting new people to a Regular Forces, but also making it easier to join the making it easier to join the reserves as well.

Whether people are serving full-time, part-time, in their spare time, there is an opportunity for people right around the country to contribute to our Armed Forces. The Minister for Veterans and People will be setting out further steps as to how we can improve our reserves as we approach the Armed Forces Bill in the next Session of Parliament. Making the case that improving our reserves makes us safer but also provides more opportunity for the nation to have a closer connection with those people who serve as well.



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I am very grateful to the Minister. One of the 180 events he Minister. One of the 180 events he mentioned would be Armed Forces Day in Andover which I will be attending in Andover which I will be attending on Saturday. I wondered if he can reflect on the importance of of the work of celebrating Armed Forces in those divinities which physically those divinities which physically embrace their headquarters and camps and residencies to sustain that and residencies to sustain that connection between the nonuniform connection between the nonuniform civilian population and those who protect them on a daily basis?

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Can I thank him for his attendance at an Armed Forces Day event this weekend. As someone who event this weekend. As someone who represents Devonport, I am acutely aware of the relationship and the aware of the relationship and the important history, and the connections today between our connections today between our military, those civilians that in Devonport's case support fleet, and our wider community including our wider community including veterans. I think he is right, we tell the story of that connection, not just by looking back the battles not just by looking back the battles of previous years, those people who never returned from wars, but making the case that investing in our defence today creates good well-paid jobs.

Provides opportunities for our young people, and it is one of the sources of great pride that our army, our Navy, and our Air Force, all feature in the top five employers of apprentices in the country. It is a huge opportunity to celebrate the skills that we have. And also the connections between people. I think all our communities

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are proud of our Armed Forces. This weekend is a great opportunity to say that. I thank my honourable friend for

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I thank my honourable friend for giving way. He knows reason I had the great privilege of visiting our the great privilege of visiting our base in the Kurdistan region of Iraq. I saw for myself the dedicated Iraq. I saw for myself the dedicated service of the troops and the officers who are doing huge work to officers who are doing huge work to help that regional government, and thereby enhance regional security, thereby enhance regional security, and British security will stop they are a tribute to this country and we over them a debt of gratitude.

We over them a debt of gratitude. We should remember that there are so many service men and women overseas doing a very difficult work. doing a very difficult work.

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doing a very difficult work. Sometimes in harms way. And on Armed Forces Day we must remember those serving officers and soldiers. Can I thank him for his remarks.

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Can I thank him for his remarks. It is a good reminder that on Armed Forces Day, and in Armed Forces Week, will be parliamentarians on all sides of the house visiting local communities, making the case for Armed Forces and their for Armed Forces and their communities. They will meet people from communities right around our from communities right around our country, and they won't get celebrations because they will be serving on the front lines overseas, helping to project UK power and influence, helping to stabilise regions and helping to make sure that we de-escalate tensions.

The work that our forces in the Middle East may have been in the news quite a lot recently, but their work that is often not covered in the news is nonetheless as vital for a national security, and worthy of our praise and thanks. I'm sure on a cross- party basis there is support for the work they do across the Middle East. Mike right honourable friends the Minister for Defence Procurement industry will be in Liverpool this weekend celebrating alongside her community of Liverpool at Armed Forces Day events was in the Minister for Veterans and People will be in Coventry having completed a tour of many of our communities nationwide, making the case for further investment in services to support our veterans.

A vital part of this governments work to support those people who have served. Many celebrations will be taking place across Scotland and Wales including Edinburgh where the Minister for Scotland will be attending full stop I will be back home in Plymouth, home to not only Devonport but the spiritual home of the Royal Marines were I will be out in force on Saturday. For those people not familiar with Plymouth geography, it is a wonderful clifftop view of Plymouth Sound and nothing more sinister.

As a son of a Royal Navy submariner I'm proud to represent my hometown which is not a seat in military history but plays a pivotal role in protecting Britain today. Having grown up as a Navy grad, I know many remarkable people in defence tend to dismiss their achievements as just part of the job. A humbleness that defines service in a country. I know what they do and how they go well beyond the expectations of a normal day job for top had a shoulder immense responsibilities with great modesty, and supported by their families, perform the ultimate public service.

Through the government's Strategic Defence Review and defence reform, putting much more emphasis on our people and on renewing the nation's contract with those who served. The most troubling thing I have seen recently in relation to our people was the continuous attitude survey which revealed that only one quarter of our service personnel believe they are valued by society. For members who have not read the latest continued attitude survey, can I encourage them to do so. It tells a story about what our people think and although we are now seeing stabilising after a decade of falling across three of our services, the fact that they don't feel valued by society should be a wake-up call for all of us about how we talk about Armed Forces, how we we talk about Armed Forces, how we

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I apologise for not being in the chamber when he referred to my chamber when he referred to my constituency. This weekend we will be hosting National Armed Forces Day, which will be fantastic. The comments he is making about remembering our veterans, remembering our people, Saturday will be a true celebration of older

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work so many people put into making sure we are safe and secure every day. Can I thank her for all the work

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Can I thank her for all the work she put into making the case as to she put into making the case as to why Cleethorpes should be the first of the renewed national day events. I know the Defence Secretary is I know the Defence Secretary is looking forward to attending events in Cleethorpes this weekend, and hearing not just from people who serve today but young people, the serve today but young people, the cadets in her community, that may cadets in her community, that may well serve in the future.

And veteran so served our nation as well. Looking forward to events in well. Looking forward to events in Plymouth but I know events in Cleethorpes will be the centre of our national attention this weekend, rightly so.

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rightly so. I appreciate the Minister giving

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I appreciate the Minister giving way. Will he recognise that the UK's Armed Forces are a visible manifestation of the philosophy and values that underpin the country? And if society does not value the Armed Forces, might he concede that it's because consistently I think we have failed to defend though principles and values that underpin our society. We should confront the accusations that this is, for example, an inherently racist country, which it absolutely is not.

And confront the accusations that our history is not something we should be proud of, because perhaps then a wider society will appreciate the men and women who defend not just the physical country but our values, our history and our

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philosophy. I thank the honourable gentleman

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I thank the honourable gentleman for that intervention and I share his passion for telling our nation's story. To tell our full story we have to explain the good bits and have to explain the good bits and sometimes the bad bits as well, but at all times we can look at the bravery, courage and service of our bravery, courage and service of our Armed Forces as a source of national pride. I also look at our Armed Forces today as the embodiment of some of our British values.

I believe in equality, something very important to me personally. When I important to me personally. When I think about our soldiers operating in Estonia at the moment, being ready to deter a Russian move across the border, it does not matter what the border, it does not matter what the colour of the skin of a soldier is, what religion they have, where they come from, what their accent they come from, what their accent is. All that matters is that in that unit everyone has each other's backs, proud of our country, proud backs, proud of our country, proud of our service, proud of the reasons they are there.

I think Armed Forces Week is an opportunity to remind Week is an opportunity to remind people about the difficult jobs we ask people to do, and to thank them ask people to do, and to thank them for it. The right honourable gentleman is right, talking about the values that stand behind uniform and why the flag they have on their and why the flag they have on their arms matters so much. It's not just a piece of cloth, it is British values we should all be proud of.

And for that reason I think it's important we recognise that our service personnel need to feel more valued. The figure has plummeted over the past 12 years, we know that words won't address the problem, only action will. That's wise important to award our service personnel the biggest pay rise for over two decades, and follow it up with another above inflation pay rise this year. For the first time, as a source of great pride for me as a Minister for the Armed Forces, we can say that every single person in uniform is now pay the living wage.

That should always have been the case but sadly was not, but it is now. They deserve a lot more than just a decent salary, the cold, damp and mouldy homes that many have been living in our frankly a betrayal of their service. So after buying back 36,000 homes from the private sector, sold off under previous Conservative government, that saves taxpayers more than £600,000 a day in rent payments. We are delivering a generational renewal of military accommodation, with at least £7 billion of funding in this Parliament to help tackle the poor

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state of forces housing. Can I thank the Minister for his statement and take the opportunity statement and take the opportunity to also mark an important week for our Armed Forces. And I welcome everything he is saying about the support to our Armed Forces, but support to our Armed Forces, but also to their families and the way of investment in their homes and more money in their pockets. Does he more money in their pockets. Does he agree that supporting our Armed Forces goes way beyond just the equipment they need on the equipment they need on the frontline.

It's about making sure that their families are supported that their families are supported and valued, through the support we can give as a government and also the communities they live in.

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the communities they live in. I couldn't agree with the honourable Lady more. It is so honourable Lady more. It is so important. I think in this debate, and I am guilty of this occasionally, many of our defence debates have been about kits, debates have been about kits, platforms, it's often been about platforms, it's often been about frigates, and we talk about the equipment. We need to talk about our people more. That's at the heart of people more. That's at the heart of the defence review, but also the policy is talking about the families more.

That's why the Armed Forces Commissioner Bill that we are Commissioner Bill that we are placing through the House, that I hope will be law soon, will help families access the commission. To make the case that it is the whole defence family, those who serve in uniform and the family members that backed them in service, that need to be valued by this nation. I believe on a cross-party basis that view is shared, what we now need to do is to make sure it is featured in legislation and day-to-day operations of the military.

There is more to do on that.

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Would the Minister on his previous point about the selling off of military homes and the buying of military homes and the buying back of them from the Labour government, would he acknowledge the negotiations for that deal actually

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negotiations for that deal actually started in May 2024 under the Conservative government, completed by the Labour government. Indeed, when this announcement

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Indeed, when this announcement was initially made I remember thanking him for his work on this. thanking him for his work on this. It was a terrible prioritisation. It was truly awful. It represented the worst value for taxpayers, and it worst value for taxpayers, and it has doomed many of our Armed Forces families to appalling accommodation families to appalling accommodation for far too long. Now that prioritisation has ended, we have brought back those homes into public brought back those homes into public control again.

We can invest in them and we need to do that at pace. There are people living in There are people living in accommodation today with damp and mould, that's not written. We need mould, that's not written. We need to proceed at pace, the Minister for veterans who lease this work in the MoD is certainly as keen as I am to

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see the improvements. Purely for the record, the reason the Shadow Defence Secretary is not here is because he has a very important personal family commitment today. I am honoured to stand in for him. Has he seen our proposals for an Armed Forces housing association which is ring fenced, to provide better accommodation for Armed Forces personnel and their families?

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I thank him for that. He is by no means a poor substitute for the means a poor substitute for the Shadow Defence Secretary -- Armed Forces secretary. We are planning to publish our housing strategy later publish our housing strategy later this year, no doubt not at all in the minds of the Shadow frontbench when they published their proposals when they published their proposals ahead of time. I will have to encourage him to wait for the full encourage him to wait for the full work to be published in due course.

Improving defence housing has to be Improving defence housing has to be a priority, because for many years our nation has not been delivering what our Armed Forces deserve. That will change now. This year we have extended the ability to reclaim the costs of wraparound childcare to costs of wraparound childcare to many of those deployed overseas, next year we will go further to cover all overseas areas to make cover all overseas areas to make family life a little easier. We are legislating for an Armed Forces legislating for an Armed Forces Commissioner, an independent voice to help improve service life.

And we have made a manifesto commitment to have made a manifesto commitment to bring the Armed Forces Covenant fully into law, a promise made by the nation that those who defend it will be treated fairly and not disadvantaged because of Bayer service. This includes making sure service. This includes making sure their service children have the same access to education as other children, also transforming recruitment. We hope many young people will be inspired to join our after attending Armed Forces Day events this weekend.

We are also overhauling access to support and overhauling access to support and care for veterans. I would like to say although Armed Forces Day is an opportunity to thank those people in uniform, we should also use it as an

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opportunity to thank those who have served as well. On the point about the covenant, which I very much welcome the work which I very much welcome the work being done to bring it into wider being done to bring it into wider effect and legislative effect with consequences when it's not applied, I think that is going to be I think that is going to be important in terms of delivering Armed Forces services right across Armed Forces services right across the sector.

But there is a financial consequence for that, a financial consequence for that, a financial consequence I think Parliament needs to seriously consider and government needs to consider about how that is needs to consider about how that is born and contributed -- distributed. Make sure public services are empowered and financed to support empowered and financed to support Armed Forces personnel in the best way they can, and the wider families

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just as importantly. Can I thank the honourable gentleman for his intervention, I agree it's important that it's a agree it's important that it's a pledge made in action and deed, not just words. If you look at the Armed just words. If you look at the Armed Forces Covenant implementation across the country at the moment there are some areas that are there are some areas that are exceptional at doing so, that really have embraced not just the words of the covenant but the spirit behind the covenant but the spirit behind it.

There are other areas that are perhaps a little further behind on the journey. When we look at central government compared to local government there is a distinction between the services and the offer. That's why we are putting it fully into law. One of the things we hope to be able to do in having a debate around putting the Armed Forces Covenant into law is to share best practice that we see in local councils up and down the country. In this place here there is sometimes the temptation to believe all good ideas must come from the Dispatch Box, I certainly do not believe that when I can see brilliant councillors of all parties making the case for improving the lives for veterans, and for those people who serve.

And perhaps most importantly for the families, because I think where the Armed Forces grips -- covenant grips most importantly is improving life for children who may disadvantage because their parents move around so frequently, and sometimes they don't get the same level of access around educational support, SEND support and other aspects. I hope when that debate comes, as I think it will later this year or the beginning of next year, I hope honourable members will be able to participate and also take something from that debate to amplify the work of their local councils, who I believe probably each and every member in this place has something good to tell about the work done in their area that they can share.

If I can just make some progress on veterans. We owe a substantial debt of gratitude to all those who have served their country. The government has an enduring duty to recognise their contribution and support after service, the majority of veterans go on to have successful careers and lives. As we are helping them make the best use of the diverse skills they have gained, three partnerships, minority of those people who have served do not find that transition easy and may need extra support. We are creating need extra support.

We are creating a new £50 million fund to give veterans easier access to care. We launched the pilot in the North West region at the Imperial War Museum North, we also launched £75 million to recognise the historic roles experienced by LGBT veterans in the Armed Forces, significantly above the level recommended in the Atherton review. We are also committed additional funding to maintain veterans homelessness support programs ensuring those at risk of homelessness have continued access to specialist help. I think

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the whole house... I thank the Minister for giving

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I thank the Minister for giving way. Just a quick point on the issue of veterans, I appreciate the government is working on this issue government is working on this issue specifically but would he be able to give a quick update on the work the government is doing to waiver the we government is doing to waiver the we Visa fees for families of

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Visa fees for families of He will know the Minister of

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He will know the Minister of Defence published written material and how we can improve recruitment from the Commonwealth. It is not from the Commonwealth. It is not just about how expand the pipeline coming into our Armed Forces, we need to recognise and support those people. With our manifesto commitment to deliver that, it is something that the Defence Secretary has spoken to the Home Secretary has spoken to the Home Secretary about now officials are in dialogue about it. I hope my colleague look to this area will announce progress in due course.

I think there is in due course. I think there is between he and I a strong sense that there is a wrong to be righted here. Those people who serve our country Those people who serve our country for a good period of time should be able to settle here in that respect.

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I recognise his interest in doing so. The magnificent VE Day commemorations, as was the equally historic 80th anniversary of VJ Day, that will take place in August this year, has acknowledged is perhaps the last major opportunity to thank those who fought in the Second World War. We are also slowly losing the generation who did National service after the war, and with them, that living bridge that they provided to our Armed Forces. We need to reconnect society without Armed Forces, and wider participation in National Resilience Review this week's festivities are a great way to kickstart the process.

As our STRO made clear, we have to be much more proactive as a country about rebuilding those connections particularly with young people. Half of the army's current crop of regimental sergeant majors were once cadets. We will boost the cadet force by 30% by 2030. Creating the opportunities for 42,000 more young people to be cadets. We will also introduce voluntary gap year schemes for school and college leavers and will a new UK strategic reserve by 2030, an objective considering yesterday was reserve stay, when we were able to thank the many thousands of reservists who serve the country.

They greatly bolster our capability at a time of crisis serving across defence, from the back office to the frontline. They give us the skills, scale, and ability to meet the threats as we face at home and overseas in a cost-effective way. As my honourable colleague can attest, after serving alongside them on various tours, I have seen enormous benefits that experience without Armed Forces can offer people particularly young people. Purpose, adventure, social mobility, unique sense of camaraderie and self achievement, and for many people, it is a route to a much better life.

We want to make many more young people aware of the opportunities on offer, and a chance to see where service life will take them. As noted earlier, we are also taking decisive actions to address the recruitment crisis that we inherited. The torturously slow process that caused so much frustration is being transformed. Example, we have eliminated more than 100 outdated medical recruitment policies. We are slashing the time it takes to get medical records from weeks and hours. Our objective is to reduce the time it takes to start, and it means applicants will get a decision on a provisional application decision in 10 days and a start date in 30 is a good step towards improving those processes.

We know there is much more to do. Army recruitment has been totally restructured and we have acted to keep hold of valued staff who are most at risk of leaving, by introducing retention payments for army privates, Lance Corporal's, and aircraft engineers. The result speak for themselves. Year-on-year inflow of recruits is now up 19%. Outflow is down 7%. The Royal Navy has exceeded its yearly recruitment targets, and the Royal Air Force applications are up by one third compared to early 2024. Applications to join the army are at their highest level for seven years.



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I thank my honourable friend for giving way for sub does he agree giving way for sub does he agree that it was helpful when discussing recruitment problems for the armed services that this government was services that this government was able to deliver an above inflation pay rise of 4.5% for service pay rise of 4.5% for service personnel, recognising the extraordinary professionalism, in addition to the big pay award last addition to the big pay award last year, this can only help the issues being discussed.



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being discussed. It does. Just as the Strategic

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It does. Just as the Strategic Defence Review talks about a whole society approach, I view that from inside and outside perspective. We as a society need to value our Armed as a society need to value our Armed Forces more. Mechanise your have a role within resilience and improving role within resilience and improving the way our nation is defended. We also need to recognise that those people within our Armed Forces needs to feel more valued by the whole of to feel more valued by the whole of society as well.

Ensuring that our people are paid well and live in a people are paid well and live in a decent home are the foundations of that. I hope one day that this House that. I hope one day that this House will not need to raise the quality of our military accommodation because the quality will be achieved at such a level that it will just be a given that we ask people to live in accommodation, whether it is single living accommodation or a service family, nation, it will just be decent.

That is our objective but we have a lot of work still to do. I hope members across the House will be able to join our Armed Forces, and communities this weekend to celebrate the work of our service personnel, as we set about reconnecting the nation to its military. We must remember that service and sacrifice are not values confined to the history books. They are just as important today as they have ever been. And they are just as visible today if we tell stories.

They are embodied in Britain's Armed Forces. There has never been a more important time to thank them for the fantastic work they do, or a better time to promote the benefits of an Armed Forces career to young people. So to all those who serve, all those who have served, and all the families, we give our deep thanks. To those who might serve in the future, we say, long to an event this weekend and find out what a brilliant Armed Forces can do for

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you. Thank you. The question is that the House is

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The question is that the House is considered Armed Forces Day. Before we proceed, I am conscious of the fact that some members have arrived fact that some members have arrived after the start of the debate. Ordinarily that would preclude them from speaking in the debate but I from speaking in the debate but I also understand the Prime Minister a statement earlier today has thrown statement earlier today has thrown timings out slightly. So my intention is to accommodate all those who are in the chamber and those who are in the chamber and wish to speak.

Inevitably those who arrived late will have to take their

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arrived late will have to take their turn. Opposition frontbench, Shadow Minister of state. Thank you Madame Deputy Speaker.

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Thank you Madame Deputy Speaker. Given the topic, I am genuinely honoured today to be able to open honoured today to be able to open this debate today on behalf of his Majesty's loyal opposition on the subject of Armed Forces Day. I had subject of Armed Forces Day. I had the honour to be present in new Palace the arm on Monday to watch
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Mark Francois Portrait Rt Hon Mark Francois MP (Rayleigh and Wickford, Conservative)
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Palace the arm on Monday to watch the flag being raised, and the ceremony presided over by Mr Speaker and the chaplain Reverend Canon, it was a joyous occasion that was well attended by many MPs. My opposite number the Armed Forces Minister is the proud son of a sub mariner. I was been followed by the equally proud son of Reginald Franois who was in a squad on D-Day. We are both naval brats. As we put it, at least after a fashion.

It has now become established that Armed Forces Day is held on the last Saturday each June. This Saturday there will be many ceremonies taking place in parallel across the length and breadth of the United Kingdom. Including in my own county of Essex, I'm hoping to attend the celebration in Basildon, the town in which I grew up. This is a time when people across our four nations come together to celebrate the role of the whole Armed Forces family, regulars, reserves, veterans, cadets, and of course the loved ones.

Defending our country and our democratic way of life. I hope to say something about these four categories, regulars, reserves, cadets, veterans in my remarks as afternoon. Beginning with reserves, Armed Forces Day and indeed Armed Forces Week is a matter which normally enjoys bipartisan or perhaps I should say tri-partisan support in Parliament. Touching on this also allows me to say a bit about the value of reserves in our Armed Forces was not I declare an interest as someone who served as an infantry officer in the fifth Battalion of the Royal and Regiment in the territorial Army in the 1990s during the Cold War when the Berlin Wall was still up.

As such, I vaguely appreciate extremely important role that our reserves, the Royal Navy reserves, the Army reserves, the Royal Artillery Air Force, the RAF volunteer reserves, and others plan supporting our regulars in the defence of the realm. In that context I recently saw an analysis which pointed out that following the 2024 general election, there were now 17 Conservative MPs in the House of Commons who have served or are serving in either the regular or reserve Armed Forces. But on these benches we have no monopoly of military service.

The same survey also pointed out quite rightfully that Labour have 30 MPs in the same position, and the Liberal Democrats now have eight. For completeness I must of course point out that the honourable member for Strangford also served in the TA. He is with us on that point, indeed I sometimes feel he is always with us, he is virtually omnipresent in the chamber. It is therefore true to say that Armed Forces have supported across the little spectrum. At least from those of us who are here.

I merely note in passing that yet again when defence has been discussed in this chamber, there is no Reform MP present to grace our proceedings. Ironically, for a party that likes to try and wrap itself in the flag, which it does not own, it is telling that they can't be bothered to turn up to debate the service of those who loyally served under it. Bluntly, Reform don't do defence. Nevertheless, I hope that most of what I say in the next few minutes will be broadly consensual, with perhaps one exception that I will come to near the end.

The role of our Armed Forces who have defended our way of life down the centuries is just as pertinent today as ever. The war in Ukraine, as the brave Ukrainians continue to resist Putin's barbaric illegal invasion of the country taking place alongside continued turmoil in the Middle East. On regulars, those who serve our Armed Forces reserve our unstinting and ongoing support. Numerous stats show the vast majority of people who serve in the Armed Forces and if it greatly from the experience.

As well as serving the country, they often learn valuable skills and trades to make them highly marketable in the civilian job market. Indeed this is a problem for attention, as the Minister was intimating. When I served as an MoD minister, albeit a decade ago, I read one powerful statistic which was that 80% of people who left the Armed Forces normally found a job within six months. I believe the figures are equally as good or even better today. People who are smart, disciplined, trained to turn up on time, and to be resourceful, are always likely to prove attractive to

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employers. I thank the member for giving

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I thank the member for giving way. Veterans play an important part in my constituency of Glastonbury in my constituency of Glastonbury and Somerton, with 11% of households home to at least one. However, home to at least one. However, female veterans are over 10% less likely to be employed compared to likely to be employed compared to men. Does the right honourable Member agree with me that we must put more support in helping female

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put more support in helping female veterans find employment after service? I agree. I think we should do

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I agree. I think we should do everything we can to enable all veterans of whatever gender to find veterans of whatever gender to find good employment after their service. good employment after their service. Female veterans too. I cannot resist Mr Speaker, but as customary as is in her constituency, why on earth in her constituency, why on earth are Kneecap Being allowed to appear there? Why on earth are the organisers allow that to take place?

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Moving on, we need to remind that... Point of order.

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Point of order. If I could just correct the right honourable Member, the Glastonbury Festival site is not in my
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constituency.

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She mentioned Glastonbury... Is not a point of order for the chair. Thank yous that is bigger. We

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Thank yous that is bigger. We need to bear this ploy ability very need to bear this ploy ability very much in mind. Without skilled regular personnel to retain and operate even the most expensive and operate even the most expensive and sophisticated kit, the Typhoon and F-35 fighters, and battle tanks, we F-35 fighters, and battle tanks, we cannot achieve operational success. In short, without well-trained people, equipment counts for people, equipment counts for nothing. Therefore does not achieve the deterrent effect we seek.

When the deterrent effect we seek. When asked earlier this week what was the single biggest challenge the Royal Navy is now facing, the fleet commander, Vice Admiral Andrew Burns commander, Vice Admiral Andrew Burns replied, " It is people right now. It is the quantity of people and not just recruitment, it is retention. " For context this is not a uniquely British problem. All of our five British problem. All of our five eyes partners face similar challenges even the US. And I shall challenges even the US.

And I shall Moving to cadets, we are fortunate in this country to have active and enthusiastic cadet groups who welcome the proposals of the white paper to expand further. We would like to see more detail of how exactly this is going to be achieved. The debts play a vital role in fostering discipline, teamwork and sense of service among young people, providing opportunities for personal development and serving as a pathway, should they desire it, for future careers in the Armed Forces.

-- The cadets. We are all, ultimately, whether ministers, shadow ministers or otherwise, constituency MPs. In that context I would like to pay particular tribute to the army cadet detachments in Rayleigh and Wickford who are part of the sea company in the cadet force and I have visited in the past. I am hoping to see that really detachment again shortly, they will need to find a new home in the next several years. I would also like to highlight the Wickford Squadron. I should declare an interest, I have the honour to have recently been appointed as the honorary president.

Their motto is Japanese for heavenly river. I can confirm that they are in full flow. I heard a number of members in the chamber over the years they tribute to their cadet units so I will chant my own. We will rightfully hear praise for more cadet units before the debate is out. They are a fundamentally important part of the Armed Forces family and as well as the young people who sign up, I would like to take this opportunity to thank those adults who give their time voluntarily in order to provide instruction and leadership for these outstanding young people.

Turning to veterans, one example of work that can be done to protect them, I would like to commend to the House and like to commend to the House and initiative known as the force of the protocol, named after Alan who served in the British army. Years in several theatres, and sadly took his own life after a struggle with complex PTSD. His widow, Claire, came to see me at my constituency surgery a number of years ago now and told me she was determined to channel her grief in a positive way by establishing a system to help find and protect victims who go missing.

I was struck by her determination to succeed and I am pleased to tell the House that is exactly what she did. Insured, the protocol is now a standard operating procedure among many police sources, similar to the protocol for those with dementia. -- Police forces. It works like this, people have a veteran in their family who they believe may be vulnerable can register details confidentially, including known associates, with an organisation known as safe and found online. In the event that the veteran go missing, the family can make that information immediately available to the police to assist them in their search for the potentially vulnerable veteran.

It was initially trialled by Greater Manchester police over six months, it was an outstanding success. It was reported that the trial allowed Timely and positive interventions which undoubtedly saved the lives of thousands of veterans in the Greater Manchester area. The protocol is now being rolled out across police forces nationwide. We had an event to allow progress in the Commons in 2024, the new veterans Minister tended to give his personal support, which I would like to thank him today.

In an equally bipartisan spirit, I would like to pay tribute to the actor and TV celebrity, Ross Kemp, Grant Mitchell, for his unwavering support for this initiative and the work he has done for veterans more widely and for his amazing documentary with the Royal Anglians Fire regiment in Afghanistan. Thank you for everything you do for our Armed Forces, past and present. We know your heart is absolutely in it. And we are grateful. I am delighted to report to the House that my own Constabulary in Essex are formally adopting the protocol today.

At a ceremony at Colchester, deliberately in Armed Forces Week. This will mark 38 forces using this procedure. It is estimated that since the initial trial and roll-out across other forces in this country, hundreds of lives of veterans have been saved by this process. I wish to commend Claire Lee for everything she and her supporters have done to make this possible. We have another invent in the Commons this November, by which time I hope the 43 police forces in England and will will be signed up.

Well done, Claire. Alan would be proud of you. As I mentioned earlier, despite the tri- partisan nature of this debate, there is one issue which I feel the governments on these benches will not agree. -- Government and these benches will not agree. That is the proposed treatment of Northern Ireland veterans. Over 300,000 regular British soldiers served in the Troubles. Operation Banner was one of the longest running continuous exercises in the nation of the British Army. During this long, and at times highly dangerous deployment, over 700 British soldiers were killed.

Assisting the Ulster defence Regiment and the -- Constabulary. To uphold order in Northern Ireland. Many more soldiers were maimed for life while trying to hold the line in an incredibly complex and dangerous situation. I have seen many memorials in my time, perhaps one of the most poignant was the Royal also Constabulary Memorial, commemorated the lives of hundreds of officers who also gave their lives working alongside the army to attempt to uphold the rule of law in Northern Ireland.

Imagine that utter dismay of those veterans who served in the British army in the highly complex theatre at the news that the present Labour government intends to drive through a remedial order under the auspices of the human rights act 1998. Effectively to remove key provisions within the Conservative Northern Ireland Troubles and reconciliation act 2023. The net of this will have two important effects, it will reopen the endless cycle of investigation and reinvestigation, investigation and reinvestigation, often via coronial inquests, to which many British Army soldiers have already been subject.

Secondly, I wonder if many members opposite are even aware of this, the same order which there whips will be urging them to vote for later this autumn, will also make it easier for Gerry Adams and his associates to sue the British Government and ultimately the British taxpayer. This is two-tiered justice at its absolute worst. The veterans themselves initiated a parliamentary e-petition entitled 'protect Northern Ireland veterans from prosecution, which amassed over 100,000 signatures in well under a month.

As of noon today, the petition has achieved over 145,000 signatures and it is still going strong. As a result of the public support, we will be debating this totally counter-productive policy which is a looming disaster for Armed Forces recruitment and retention in Parliament. Next month. On these Conservative benches we will resist this misguided Remedial Order designed to aim Gerry Adams while throwing our veterans to the walls. We welcome the daily mail's campaign to protect our veterans, as the editorial put it, 'it is profoundly unfair that frail ex- servicemen continue to live in dread of a knock on the door by the authorities while IRA murderers sleep easily with letters of immunity handed to them by Tony Blair.

I think that puts it rather well. It is worth recording in this context that many of the soldiers serving in Northern Ireland were recruited from what we call now 'red wall' towns, Blackpool to Bury, and were ordered across the Irish Sea to uphold the rule of law. Many are now in their 70s or even the 80s. I suspect Labour MPs opposite would find it difficult to explain to those veterans and their loved ones wife they are taking this action just because their government is literally obsessed with the human rights act 1998.

So, we on these benches will be bitterly opposing the Remedial Order. Members opposite will need to look into their consciences and then hopefully, when consciences and then hopefully, when the bells ring, to decide. With that very important exception, I hope we can all agree across this House, those that are here, that we value immensely the work of the whole Armed Forces family and everything they do to help keep our country safe. Without those people who have the courage to take the Kings shilling, and to put on the uniform and, if ultimately necessary, to risk their lives in order to keep this country free, we would have no guarantee of our precious democracy.

Perhaps the most fitting way to end this contribution would be to quote the words of Roy George Kipling and is famous poem, written for Queen Victoria's Diamond Jubilee. There is no hint of jingoism, it warns of the power of divine judgement and humility of kings. As Kipling put it, little malt and the shouting dies, the captains and the kings depart, still stands indigent sacrifice, her humble and contrite harm. Lord God of hosts, be with us harm.

Lord God of hosts, be with us

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yet. Lest we forget, lest we forget.' Can I thank you for sharing the

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Can I thank you for sharing the

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Can I thank you for sharing the Of Kipling, something that has sunk into the national consciousness. I appreciate the cordial nature of this debate between the Minister and the shadow Minister. We three were the shadow Minister. We three were together earlier this week, having a debate about recruitment in the debate about recruitment in the north-east, which was cordial and it is a great opportunity to continue that here. In Stockton we celebrated Armed Forces Day early on Saturday, Armed Forces Day early on Saturday, we had a ceremony, many celebrations we had a ceremony, many celebrations on the High Street and a service.

on the High Street and a service. The Yorkshire Regiment were there, we also had representatives of our we also had representatives of our cadet forces, the Marine and RAF cadets based in Norton in my cadets based in Norton in my constituency. We also had representatives of the Royal military police. Also based in
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Chris McDonald Portrait Chris McDonald MP (Stockton North, Labour)
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military police. Also based in Norton. In Stockton, we have a very strong representation of the Armed Forces in our local community. One in 20 of the people in my constituency are serving in the Armed Forces or veterans. Very strong area for the Armed Forces. I mentioned the Royal military police. I did wonder if maybe the Royal military police are mentioned too often in the House. I thought this might be an opportunity to commend the work they do. They have, I think possibly claim to be the longest established regiment, stretching back to the 14th century.

To the first sergeant of the piece. They are a vital part of our Armed Forces with around 2,200 soldiers and civilian staff. The support operations in conflict zones, peacekeeping missions and humanitarian. This is a suitable moment to pay tribute to the Member for Epsom and Ewell for her service as a captain in the military police as a captain in the military police The role of the police is much like other units in the Armed Forces, but they have three main roles, the policing of the army, special investigations, and close protection.

And in the policing of the army, they will be attached to unit in the field to ensure that captured personnel are treated appropriately, legally, and humanely. They were deployed in Ukraine recently under close protection of the foreign office. protection of the foreign office. And of course, there are airborne in Colchester who were part of operation Martha garden, so members of the Royal military police.

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Would he accept that the actions attached to fighting units are a attached to fighting units are a direct reflection of the army, of our national character, upholding our national character, upholding the rule of law even in warfare?

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the rule of law even in warfare? I would, and that creates a point I might go on to develop a bit more. It creates a unique duty, very serious responsibility that puts serious responsibility that puts them in a different position to comrades which can't be easy and comrades which can't be easy and must be quite difficult. I also want must be quite difficult. I also want to highlight that the RMP can find themselves in incredibly dangerous themselves in incredibly dangerous situations as well.

I was talking to a friend of mine who was a member a friend of mine who was a member and he highlighted to me the role of Royal military police officers during the Second World War and in other conflicts as well. Managing traffic points. These are fixed grade reference points. It is vital that the traffic flow is managed appropriately for logistics, but it appropriately for logistics, but it also means that personnel are very easy to target from artillery and aircraft, and they carried out that war with great bravery as well, so I really want to commend them for that.

Policing puts the individuals involved in a difficult and somewhat unique position. That is also true for the civilian police force, but I think there is a particular additional burden on those members of the Royal military and how they discharge their duty, and I was struck by Kate Green who, 20 years from the lifting of the LGBT military ban was serving in the Royal military police, anything that she feared the most was being asked to investigate those who are suspected of hiding their sexuality.

If you admitted it, you were out and it was the end of your career. Kate decided she couldn't continue with this anymore. She didn't want to continue to live a lie has, so she handed in her one-year notice to the Royal military police, the LGBT ban on the army was lifted a short time after her career ended. She works with the army and this is an opportunity to welcome the lifting

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of the LGBT ban, and. Nearly 30 years ago when I was at

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Nearly 30 years ago when I was at the University of Leicestershire, I the University of Leicestershire, I argued vociferously to make sure that our Armed Forces were allowed to recruit from our campus to make to recruit from our campus to make sure that they got people like us into the military so that we can into the military so that we can create a military that was reset and reflective of our society, so people reflective of our society, so people from LGBT Q plus communities could serve alongside us without any impediments.

My honourable friend impediments. My honourable friend agree with me that what is true is agree with me that what is true is that inclusion comes from being part of an institution and helping to change it from within, and that it change it from within, and that it is necessary that we do not put

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impediments on campuses today. I thank him for his service and

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I thank him for his service and his continued advocacy in this place. He spoke very powerfully in place. He spoke very powerfully in this intervention, and I would agree with him that it is no small task to change an organisation that starts change an organisation that starts and ends with leadership. We must thank the leaders to do exactly as we said. I also want to share the story of Rachel Webster, she has an example of how it is possible to break down barriers and overcome some entrenched stereotypes.

Rachel chose engineering, but she was told she wouldn't be able to weld because she was a girl. I don't know if any of you had a go at welding but I am terrible at it. She was unable to pursue that at school, but Rachel left school and was better at teaching welding than me because she took a four-year apprenticeship programme and learned how to weld. Her ambition was to enter the Armed Forces and she wish to apply to join the Royal Engineers where many of her compatriots went, but when she applied, she was told that women couldn't be Royal Engineers.

So, undeterred, she joined the Royal military police. She trained with the Royal Army Corps and was deployed to Germany. Her career took her to the Troubles, one of the proudest moments came in Iran. She was helping build a girls school to impress the local men who didn't realise that it was possible for women to weld, so she was able to use her welding skills on behalf of the army. Both Rachel and Kate have really powerful stories. They show us that courage doesn't know any gender or any sexuality, and I do hope that they will be inspiring stories from my constituents people across the country.

And I would like to take this moment to thank all of our Armed Forces, particularly those police in the north-east and across the country for their valuable service to our nation. Thank you.

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Thank you. It is a privilege today to speak in today's debate on today to speak in today's debate on Armed Forces day. A day that we Armed Forces day. A day that we recognise and celebrate the bravery, dedication and sacrifice for those who serve and have served in our Armed Forces. We honour and we thank Armed Forces. We honour and we thank them. Earlier this week, I was proud to attend the flag raising ceremony to attend the flag raising ceremony in Epsom.

Events like this are held in communities across the country and their meaning runs deep. They and their meaning runs deep. They are visible reminder for something that should never be taken for granted. The courage of the men and
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Helen Maguire Portrait Helen Maguire MP (Epsom and Ewell, Liberal Democrat)
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who highlighted the important and vital operational work of the vital operational work of the police. My journey began with the desire to lead, travel and make a desire to lead, travel and make a difference. I joined Sandhurst, crawling and encouraging in equal measure. I trained in boots not made for me came up with friendships forged in resilience. I was deployed forged in resilience. I was deployed to Bosnia as part of the peacekeeping mission and I served in peacekeeping mission and I served in Iraq with the Royal read.

Helping to retrain the Iraqi police force in a retrain the Iraqi police force in a volatile area. We operate under constant threat and before my constant threat and before my arrival, six of my colleagues were arrival, six of my colleagues were killed, and I still remember the fear of that first night, travelling in a blacked out bus, unsure what in a blacked out bus, unsure what lay ahead. The fear of the unknown, of not making it home, it is one of not making it home, it is one that many serving personnel is still faced today.

And yet we carried out our mission with professionalism and comrade. British troops working shoulder to shoulder, brave interpreters, local allies and international partners. I saw how overstretched and underequipped our troops often were compelled to our allies. We got on with the job but we shouldn't have to make do. Armed Forces Day is not just about parades. It marks a time for action. Our service personnel deserve more than warm words. They deserve a fair deal, and that is why am calling for a fair deal commissioned to overhaul the conditions facing veterans and their families.

From housing to pay, diversity transition support, our service personnel deserve more. Unfortunately, too many military families still live in substandard accommodation. Too many veterans struggle with poor mental-health and inadequate support. And too many LGBT veterans are still waiting for proper justice and compensation. We were pleased to see the government accept the report's recommendations but speed is of the essence. As many of those affected are elderly or seriously ill. Women in the Armed Forces face unacceptable levels of harassment and misogyny.

We must do better. And we will push for full implementation of those recommendations, and when it comes to troop numbers, the reality is stark. Our Armed Forces overstretched and under resourced, and that is why we are calling for a new bonus scheme to help new recruits into the British Army, an expansion to track soldiers to re- enlist. I left the army earlier than I planned, forced to choose between motherhood and military service. There was no support, no nursery, no flexible career path.

These are the real barriers that drive people out, losing many experienced people. We must change that. We need to support families. The Lib Dems create a one-stop shop for military families to access housing, education, healthcare and support. Finally, I am proud of my constituency's military history. Langley Vale was once a training camp for 8000 soldiers. It is now place of reflection, and our local engineers recently celebrated 75 years of proud service. In a volatile and uncertain time, let us follow our legacy, not just in ceremony but in policy.

Let us make Armed Forces Day place for serious change.

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Thank you. It is a great

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Thank you. It is a great privilege to speak today to mark Armed Forces Day 2025. It is a
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Steve Yemm Portrait Steve Yemm MP (Mansfield, Labour)
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Armed Forces Day 2025. It is a moment for our country to show its deep and enduring gratitude to all of the men and women who serve and have served in our Armed Forces. Their service underpins our national security, our values, and indeed, our way of life, and whether on the frontline or behind-the-scenes, at home or abroad, these individuals commit themselves fully to something that is far greater than themselves. And they do so not for recognition but out of duty.

And since becoming a member for Mansfield, I have had the opportunity to meet with veterans, serving personnel and their families. I have seen first hand the strength of character, discipline, and resilience that military life builds. It is clear that those who serve bring with them skills that enrich every part of our society once they return to civilian life. We must also be honest about life. We must also be honest about the reality that many face. Military life is unique.

It often needs longs operations, whole families, and sudden transitions. And while the vast majority of veterans make successful moves in civilian life, there are still far too many who encountered disadvantage, whether it is in housing, employment, access to healthcare mental health services and so forth.

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I thank my friend for giving way. I served for 25 years and at times, I served for 25 years and at times, almost 10 years were stretched. It was a month on, month after was a month on, month after deployment with me being away from my family. During this Armed Forces my family. During this Armed Forces week, we must remember and give raisin celebration to our Armed Forces families who, as he describes, suffer obscene pressure

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and burden. I thank the honourable member for

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I thank the honourable member for his intervention, and when I speak, families of serving personnel in families of serving personnel in Mansfield, it is always a subject that is very close to the that is very close to the It is important to recognise that. Because of those issues I think that Because of those issues I think that is why it is so important that we recognise the Armed Forces government. It is our collective promise across government and promise across government and society and public services that those who serve should not be disadvantaged by those who offer service, not just principal but something important to be recognised in law, but this can only be effective if those in positions of responsibility understand and implement it properly.

That is the reason why earlier this month, on 4 June, I was proud to host the first ever all party Parliamentary reception for the Armed Forces government here in Parliament. The event was held in partnership with the Royal British Legion and the Ministry of Defence government team who do absolutely outstanding work in supporting veterans and promoting awareness. I want, in this House, to formally put on record my thanks to the Royal British Legion and the Minister for Veterans and People for his attendance at the event.

The aim was simple, it was to help members of this House and staff members better understand how the government operates, the support it provides and how we can use it to serve our constituents more effectively. It is very encouraging for me to see members from across the House and across the political spectrum united in their belief that no one who serves this country should face those types of barriers when their service comes to an end. Armed Forces Day and week is not just about parades and flag waving.

It is about us recognising and reaffirming our commitment to the people who defend our freedom day after day. As we rightly thanked our Armed Forces today, let's reconnect ourselves in this House to ensuring that their support is matched by our support, support is matched by our support, that their sacrifice never means that silence, that their families are never left behind. Let's move forward on this day, not just with gratitude, but with purpose.

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It is an honour to speak ahead of Armed Forces Day. A day of Armed Forces Day. A day of pageantry, and also precision. I congratulate the government in
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David Davis Portrait Rt Hon David Davis MP (Goole and Pocklington, Conservative)
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congratulate the government in reinstating the pageantry. The data recognise those who have served and serve in our Armed Forces. Often without thanks. We owe them a debt of gratitude that we cannot ever really repaid. But gratitude alone is not enough. As the Minister said, only 1/4 of veterans really feel their service is properly recognised. There is a reason for that. I will speak plainly and I hope the Minister will take what I have to say in a difficult five minutes of listening for him as a call for action, a call for help.

There is a shadow that hangs over our Armed Forces, political and legal vendetta, targeting veterans of Northern Ireland, Operation Banner. These men answered their countries call on one of the country's darkest hours. They stood between the innocent and the terrorists, often literally, often in the way of a bullet. And now they are treated not as heroes, but as suspects. The inadequately informed inquest was one incident where elderly veterans are being persecuted and there will be many more. The terrorists killed 722 British soldiers during the Troubles.

The people who carried out Troubles. The people who carried out the murders have been effectively exonerated by the British state. I do not blame the state for that, it was necessary at the time. But today we witness legal crusade against the men who risked everything for peace. It is prosecution driven by politics, not facts. While killers walk free, authorities found soldiers who stop them from killing and treat their soldiers like criminals. The legacy act is designed to put an end to the strategy.

The government has decided to repeal the act. If it does not properly replace it with effective legislation, it will hand the initiative back to those who spent decades glorifying violence. I hope the Minister will pay attention to that paragraph. The government must decide side they are on in the exercise. Our veterans deserve peace, not a knock on the door and questions about battles that they fought to defend the public half a lifetime ago. Battles that were fought under orders, battles that were fought under supervision.

Battles that were fought under yellow card rules and battles that immediately afterwards had close judicial examination of everyone's behaviour to ensure they obeyed the law in every respect. Often the law in every respect. Often the military police were involved in looking back, they were not always popular in doing it but it was necessary part of the process. Not one of those conditions applied to the psychopathic murderers they were up against. Not one. I asked the government repeatedly to end the shameful campaign of retrospective injustice and I continue to ask until I get the meaningful answer and resolution to this running injustice.

That is why I support the petition that my right honourable friend referred to, an astonishing number of signatures for such a short time. That is just the start. It is not just massively important to our veterans, if this rewriting of history succeeds, this weapon of law fair can be used against soldiers in any future conflict, destroying the effectiveness of troops in future operations. This morning the daily mail had headlines to the campaign to highlight this program. We should remember that this is not just about our special forces, it is about all of the Armed Forces.

There are at least 20 inquest into actions by government agencies Armed Forces that could potentially be restarted by the government after the end of the legacy legislation. Only a minority of special forces. If we continue down the path we will not only betray our past, but we will jeopardise our future. The campaign of persecution sends a chilling message to the next generation, serve your country, risk your life and face prosecution in your old age. Why would any young man or woman sign up for that? Many are not.

Many refer to better recruitment and retention figures but they will not last if this battle is lost by the British state. This was most high profile when it struck at certain areas, but it applies to every soldier and area of the military who carries a weapon and wields in defence. These soldiers who operate in extreme danger and uncertainty are made to make impossible decisions and under fire. They expect not recognition or reward, but they expect the recognition of their government.

We expect our soldiers to put their lives on the line for our country, and they expect recognition for that. Soldiers must weigh every trigger pull against a future court case, we cripple their ability to act. What is the point of Armed Forces if we render them useless through legal ambiguity? IN the last person to tolerate unnecessary killing or misbehaviour by our troops. Those who will know of my campaigns on torture and rendition in the past. I will not stand for that.

But we must balance properly the rule of law, as it applies to each environment. We already have well thought through rules of law fair established in the Geneva Convention and that is where we must look first. From 2005 to 2007, our military achieved spectacular results in saving lives. In saving lives. In Baghdad, vehicle borne suicide bombings fell from 100 a- month to just one after we engaged. Sectarian assassinations, once rife, all but ceased. But this was not the work of indiscriminate bombing or decision level assaults, it was achieved through precise, controlled and surgical raids backed by careful planning into some of the most hostile environments.

The impact was staggering. Even the hostile panorama programme showed 95 percent of terrorist neutralisation's work captures, not kills. 95 percent. Under unbelievable circumstances. And thousands of innocent lives were saved. Not just a matter for operation of skill, but also moral operation of skill, but also moral discipline. In the midst of most -- close quarters combat against some of the most dangerous on earth, our soldiers showed restraint. Mistakes I have no doubt that -- time to time made, we must look at that.

But instead of blunt instruments, we are left with the missile, the drone. We kill everyone on a bus or everyone at a wedding party, our military has been brilliant at doing the opposite, being targeted, lawful and effective. Dismantling that would not only be militarily reckless, it would betray the principles the Minister himself said we stand for, that should distinguish us from those we fight. Let today do rather more than clap politely at a parade. Let's act, let's end the relentless pounding of our veterans.

Let's give our serving forces the legal protection and political support that they deserve. Let others recognise that if we find it difficult to recruit, it is a consequence of a state that too often turns its back on its defenders. Let's make one promise, that no British soldier will ever again be abandoned by the very

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Arise to pay tribute to our Armed Forces personnel. Can I associate myself with the remarks of the Minister. I would like to start by Minister. I would like to start by recognising veterans for their past service, their contributions made to service, their contributions made to society continue to serve society with the skills and leadership shaped by their unique military
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Kirith Entwistle Portrait Kirith Entwistle MP (Bolton North East, Labour)
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experiences. I would like to thank reservers for what they have done in supporting Armed Forces, I have a husband who is a reservist in the army. I would like to thank our cadets and Armed Forces families who also make psyche -- sacrifices in their own way.

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I recently attended the 95th birthday celebration. I want to pay birthday celebration. I want to pay tribute to all. The cadets in my tribute to all. The cadets in my area, what they are learning is phenomenal. Does she agree we have to back them with support and back many volunteers who make the cadet

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many volunteers who make the cadet groups run effectively? I thank for that intervention.

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I thank for that intervention. Our cadets have an opportunity for our army and young people. They should be supported and backed as should be supported and backed as I am proud to have attended the flag I am proud to have attended the flag raising ceremony in Bolton North East, and I was proud to see the East, and I was proud to see the strong showing of support at that ceremony. The Armed Forces flag is raised above the town hall in Bolton raised above the town hall in Bolton and it will fly there proudly until and it will fly there proudly until the end of Armed Forces Day.

The ceremony was an opportunity to reflect on those who have served in reflect on those who have served in a currently serving, especially those deployed overseas and in active service. I was glad to join in celebrations with the president in celebrations with the president of the Royal Artillery Association Bolton branch, and also members of Bolton branch, and also members of the Royal Artillery. There are nearly 3000 veterans in Bolton North East, and Bolton is also home to the battery of the 103 Regiment of the Royal Artillery which is the most northern subunits of the regimen, northern subunits of the regimen, dating back to 1889.

I am deeply proud of our local military history, but on Monday, I also heard concerns from members of the 216 battery about a lack of funding, particularly around general training, mean there is not enough training to progress levels, so I hope the government will look at ways to provide support on this. I am also a former employee of the Royal British Legion and someone with experience coming into improve the lives of Armed Forces, I strongly welcome this commitment to renewing the nations contact with those who serve and have served.

Having raised concerns, I am really pleased that this Labour government recognises the importance of raising the communities and that we have committed to enacting them into law. However, I would like to ask the Minister what plans are in place to make sure there are sufficient budgets to have the covenant duty and how the government intends to work with local layers as a parent, I welcome plans to support families deployed overseas and here that we will have families and I strongly commend the Minister for also ordering support to our families because I experienced first-hand the

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challenges that they face as well. I thank my friend for giving way.

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I thank my friend for giving way. There are many brave men and women serving in my constituency and I am serving in my constituency and I am very proud and thank them for their contribution. She mentioned Royal contribution. She mentioned Royal British Legion. I want to pay thank you to Tilehurst Royal British you to Tilehurst Royal British Legion he do a fantastic job to support our veterans, particularly support our veterans, particularly the president. the president.

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the president. I will join her and join her in thanking the teams that they provide thanking the teams that they provide as well. I am please see this as well. I am please see this government is boosting communities government is boosting communities by 2030, and I know how much of a difference that will make people in difference that will make people in my constituency. I also welcome the Armed Forces commissioner, which is long overdue in my opinion. I would long overdue in my opinion.

I would like to end by reiterating the concerns highlighted for members of the 216 battery around funding for training, and I hope the government will find ways to provide more support on this so we can continue to backup our words with action, upscale our defence sectors and the Armed Forces community, and I look forward to joining in celebrations

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I want to speak in the debate

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I want to speak in the debate today to recognise the contribution of all those who serve in the Armed Forces, and those who stand beside
14:20
Ben Obese-Jecty Portrait Ben Obese-Jecty MP (Huntingdon, Conservative)
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Forces, and those who stand beside me for support. I will be attending on Sunday, and I pass on my thanks to Anna Dutton from organising the day and Andy Phipps on the cadet force for his efforts. For a region with strong links, it is wonderful that our armed personnel will have the opportunity to participate locally, and I say that as someone who is very proud to have military bases in the constituency, but also to places that represent British defence.

We have an extraordinary number of US personnel in and around our constituency which always takes people by surprise when you hear those accents. Armed Forces Day is about the recognition and celebration of those young men and women who are giving up the best years of their life to serve the nation. It is also about those who stand behind them, who sacrifice their time, their careers, their ability to make homes or their partners, mothers, fathers to recognise their career ambitions. I spent the best part of the decade in the army though I rarely mention it.

It was one of the greatest experiences of my life. But particularly through the passage of time, I have heard about how bad it was, but I do miss it. The commander in, the experiences and opportunities, these are all unique elements that make it part of their unique experiences. The unspoken love. I served since the Korean War. Place a strain on our Armed Forces, and we often like to recall the first time we look to this was in the last Labour government.

We even mentioned in the previous statement. What they don't often mention is that that operation just about break the army, and I would echo the words of the member here in terms of my experience of serving during the same period, and we went through equipment very quickly, and with the pace of change that we see in operations of warfare currently, we would do well to remember that we cycle through different types of body armour. If we had three different types of body armour, three different types of helmets, different patterns, we had to bring in requests to have vehicles, roadside bombs, air raids, to patrolling helmets with metal detectors in Afghanistan, so the pace of change is something that we must bring into that.



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I hesitate to interrupt this speech which is a great testament to speech which is a great testament to his service, but I would like to say that he mentions the request for that he mentions the request for vehicles that could withstand this, and I thought this might be appropriate moment to mention, in appropriate moment to mention, in response to that, a new type of response to that, a new type of steel was invented, developed in the institutes and produced in south Wales to provide exactly that, a great national response and a great national response and a demonstration of the steel industry and the industry in general to

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provide a rapid response to the requirements of those in the future. I would concur, I don't know anything about the detail provided, but I think it is worth bearing in mind just how quickly the pace of change and our ability to react to that, and we have seen a lot in that, and we have seen a lot in recent weeks about the capability, and no plan ever survives first and no plan ever survives first contact with the enemy. It is true now than it has been all year.

We do now than it has been all year. We do take our Armed Forces for granted. The jingoistic applause, discounts and thank you for your service isn't and thank you for your service isn't for us. We are British. The flipside of that is that there is some move around to occupy. Greater societal recognition of the value of serving, and inculcation that service to nation summing to be proud of, something to aspire to, the benefits not just the country but the individual.

We too often look at Armed Forces as the first port of Armed Forces as the first port of call, flooding, snowing, manning the fire trucks, even the bin strikes through the Armed Forces. While we appreciate there is a process the Armed Forces is enlisted, I wince when I see it activated. We shouldn't rely on the service personnel to cover everything they showed. There should not be a default bailout our Armed Forces deserve better. To be paid properly so they don't have to take a pay cut as explained by some people I spoke to on operations recently.

To be housed properly to the defence contractors don't paint over mould on the walls because treaty is on the checklist as has happened in houses in my constituency. To be posted sympathetically to the families don't end up split apart where both parents are serving personnel, as I have seen happen, and to be supportive and grant stability so that service personnel to children can see a stable home and education. I could go on, but the point I'm making is that the treatment of the personnel wasn't good enough when I served, wasn't good enough under the last government, and I don't think it is good enough now.

While I don't doubt the sentiment, we will look at this despite the promises. In this house, we often stand in this chamber waxing lyrical about Armed Forces. We recount stories of bravery, commitment and sacrifice. They mortgage the backdrop, and I encourage people to remember that. On one last final point, as we can return to Constituencies this weekend to participate dutifully and attend those debates, spare a thought for those young men and women because I appreciate the recognition. The irony is that the best way we can show how much we devalue this is by not making them work on a sunny Saturday afternoon.



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It is with immense pride that I rise today in Armed Forces week, particularly as the national celebrations are returning to celebrations are returning to Cleethorpes this weekend. That is a moment of real honour for our moment of real honour for our community in Great Grimsby. 10 years after the last time that we hosted
14:26
Melanie Onn Portrait Melanie Onn MP (Great Grimsby and Cleethorpes, Labour)
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after the last time that we hosted in 2016, and hasn't a lot happened in those years? But to have it return under a Labour government is an incredibly proud moment. And we may not be in towns with colleagues here representing that, but our ties to the military run deep and they ran proud. From American GIs camped ran proud. From American GIs camped in Grimsby's people park doing the Second World War, the brave men and women who gave everything to their country to support the war effort, including our town's fishermen, and my great grandma may, and my great aunt Kathleen who both took roles as wartime wardens back in the Second World War in their village of healing.

Our towns have stood shoulder to shoulder with our Armed Forces. Those connections still continue today with the third Royal Bank army battalion operating out of Westwood hope in Grimsby training and serving with distinction across our area and further afield. Their commitment does reflect the values that define our area, resilience, solidarity and service, and every Remembrance Sunday it opened our doors to the local community to provide refreshments to those young cadets that the gentleman was just mentioning.



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We must be very proud. I had amazing squadrons who are based in amazing squadrons who are based in Waltham Forest and Leyton, and two for one who are nationally the best academic squadron in the country. But behind them is a core of But behind them is a core of volunteers who really don't get the recognition that they deserve. It is really important that we look at this in the community, and with my friends join with me in getting the

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friends join with me in getting the recognition of their services. He does make an important point

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He does make an important point and it has been mentioned in and it has been mentioned in comments today because we do not have a future pipeline of young people who want to participate in people who want to participate in the Armed Forces who already have some element of training, the discipline, the understanding of the lifestyle if you do not have the adults who are prepared to support adults who are prepared to support that. It is incredibly time- consuming.

It takes them away from consuming. It takes them away from their families and the Armed Forces their families and the Armed Forces more widely as well. I am happy to

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give way. I thank the member for giving way. I also participated in my way. I also participated in my schools combined Cadet service while I was there, enjoying many evenings I was there, enjoying many evenings and nights over Salisbury plain in the bitter cold. It was one of the coldest nights I have experienced. But the sea cadets give people an But the sea cadets give people an experience that helps them grow into the person that they want in a safe the person that they want in a safe and friendly environment.

It gives them confidence and friendship and leadership to help them launch well leadership to help them launch well into life, so will she join me in celebrating groups like Glastonbury celebrating groups like Glastonbury and cadets in thanking them for all

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and cadets in thanking them for all I'm happy to do just that. All of

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I'm happy to do just that. All of the organisations working with young the organisations working with young people do an amazing job. The young people who are involved themselves, the fact they show up, turn up, they commit, it is a testament to their commit, it is a testament to their resilience and the self belief that they can achieve and they are going to put time and effort into themselves so they can prepare themselves for their future lives. The barracks does open its doors to our community every year, providing hot food, hot drink, place for families to come, but everyone to families to come, but everyone to But to provide a bit of community spirit, connection and conversation on what is a very important day in our constituency and we regularly see hundreds of people lining the streets as the procession goes from streets as the procession goes from the church to the memorial near the Grimsby Institute.

This year, as Cleethorpes hosts the national Armed Forces Day event, we are hosting the national event this year and I'm pleased to do so, we will be celebrating not only our service men and women, but the economic boost it will bring to the area. I want to pay tribute to the local Armed Forces defence team who -- events team. They will now be working hard out of the wire, and they will not have the opportunity on Saturday to enjoy it because they will be so busy making sure everything is running smoothly.

For those who are coming from out of the area making this is a grand celebration on Saturday, making sure they have everything they need. It will be for our businesses, tourism sector and people from around the country who will come to this national event, he will line the streets to give thanks to our servicemen and women. Only recently I had the pleasure of welcoming students from the uniformed services course at Grimsby Institute. They came into Parliament and into the education centre.

These young people are preparing for careers across police and fire service, Armed Forces and emergency response. Their enthusiasm and discipline were a reminder that the future of our uniformed services is in good hands. They are the next chapter in our proud tradition of service. I was pleased to have them here. We also have some excellent community groups. In addition to the Armed Forces events team, that group have turned what was an old Local Authority building into a centre for science for veterans.

Any kind of mental health support, housing support, welfare and benefits advice, there is space within a nice relaxed environment where you can go and have a coffee and there are professionals there to signpost veterans and provide additional support. We also have another brilliant grassroots group run voluntarily by ex-servicemen and women, bringing people together through food and drink and other activities and really helping people who have left their services, sometimes recently, sometimes many years ago, but are finding life a little bit difficult, to find themselves in a challenging situation and with that pride that comes with service, sometimes the pride means they do not always wish to access the help that is available to them.

And the group is a brilliant group that manages to build relationships and ties and provide that support and encourage people not to feel embarrassed that they might require some additional support for a period of time and help them to access that. I congratulate them on that work. Our towns military history runs deep and has lasting connections to European allies. After the Second World War, a Polish regiment unable to return home due to Soviet occupation made home due to Soviet occupation made the woods their home.

A mascot now stands in the park as a tribute, and to many who settled in Grimsby in 1947. When I was growing up, my great aunt and her mother, my great-grandmother, welcomed into their -- houses, I grew up with one of those Polish servicemen who live without family for this dash back 50 years before he passed away. I want to remember him because he was a big part of our families life.

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I thank my honourable friend. In her very powerful and moving speech, she has alluded to the efforts of the entire community and I wonder if the entire community and I wonder if she would agree with me that in line with the words of the right with the words of the right honourable member about the importance of this being a national endeavour of remembering those who endeavour of remembering those who have served and those who continue have served and those who continue to serve, in -- irrespective of to serve, in -- irrespective of party, I would like to put on record in that spirit that the Conservative councillor, Catherine Lawrence, is doing wonderful work with her team doing wonderful work with her team with the British Legion.

I have worked with her many times and will continue to do so and will be taking part in the ceremony on Saturday. It part in the ceremony on Saturday. It is with that spirit we should support our Armed services.

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support our Armed services. I thank you for that intervention. It was particularly timely. People who have paid big timely. People who have paid big part in our lives have come from different periods and I know my different periods and I know my family will not be alone. It would also be remiss of me, I'm going to also be remiss of me, I'm going to move on from that, it would be remiss of me not to pause and remember. Also the Grimsby chums, ordinary men from our community who volunteer together, traded together, and in July 1916, faced the horrors of the song together.

They stood shoulder to shoulder with the people from Edinburgh as they launched the first wave of the British assault. They launch into what would become a day of unimaginable loss. Some managed to reach the German trenches, including the second Lou tenant, Harold, with five men reached the trench and held out Only two officers returned uninjured and barely 100 men left standing. Their bravery and sacrifice are an enduring legacy of our community's contribution to peace and freedom.

I would like to say that this is not just losses from that time, over the last two decades we had a number of other losses from our community, other losses from our community, others who should be recognised. It is in that vein that I welcome some of the commitments that have come from the government and show, I think, the determination of this government to improve the lives and welfare of ministry serving person their families. Particularly when it comes to forces in accommodation improvements and having previously lived in service accommodation, I can confirm the difference that it makes to have a good quality home compared to some of my friends whose properties were not in such a good state.

Bringing children who were really having to keep on top of some pretty terrible structural issues while raising their families, while their partners and husbands were serving away. And also recognise the additional funds for homeless veterans also. That is going to be invaluable in making sure ex- servicemen and women who do find themselves struggling perhaps to adjust, or finding changes later on in their lives, perhaps feeling their community is not as strong as it was when they were in the forces to find themselves to be homeless, so making sure they have that precision of funding to support them is incredibly important.

This weekend is the -- as the red arrows fly over Cleethorpes beach, hopefully I can give the Secretary of State an ice cream, or perhaps a pint. There will be lots of points drink this weekend. And our community celebrates with the parades, displays and remembers. We do so with a pride in our past, present and our unwavering support for our armed services. I know I speak for everybody in Great Grimsby and Cleethorpes when I say thank you, thank you to those who have served, those who serve now and those preparing to serve, the bravery and sacrifice, they are written into the soul of our nation and into the streets, homes and families of our communities.

Let us not just honour them on Saturday, but honour them in the values that we champion, the support we offer and the remembrance we preserved for

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generations to come. There are many gallant members in

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There are many gallant members in this chamber, back came in Scotland in the Scottish Parliament chamber, and other legislators of these islands, national and local members islands, national and local members who have served Armed Forces with distinction and bravery. I pay tribute to those members and family tribute to those members and family and many friends you have and sometimes continue to serve, I hold sometimes continue to serve, I hold sometimes continue to serve, I hold them in the highest regard for their commitment.

That commitment is demonstrated by every rank and location where the armed forces operate. Scotland has a proud and operate. Scotland has a proud and distinguished military history and Armed Forces Day has become a point
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Graham Leadbitter Portrait Graham Leadbitter MP (Moray West, Nairn and Strathspey, Scottish National Party)
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of community support for armed forces, serving and veterans. There are around 4,500 serving personnel are around 4,500 serving personnel in my area, around 1,500 army personnel, between the third Battalion, the Regiment of Scotland and others. They are supported by hundreds of contractors, who joined with serving personnel with offensive and defensive capabilities for the military system. In addition, veterans in the constituency, we have the highest percentage in any constituency in the UK. And shows the long and distinguished connection with the military in that part of the north of Scotland.

Around one in five people living in the constituency have a direct military connection. Quite a figure. It is unsurprising that the Armed Forces in the area are not viewed as a separate or distinct community. A rather insignificant an integrated part of the wider community. It is, is often the case in the north of Scotland, done without fanfare, but with everyday respect and appreciation of everyday respect and appreciation of the rules embedded within community life and is. It is no us and them, it is a whole community.

That does not equate to the Armed Forces being ignored. That can be seen in the numbers that turn up year and year across the constituency in act of remembrance. Numbers that have grown over the last 25 years in a significant way and show no sign of dropping off. There are military children in both schools in the constituency and some schools have a very significant percentage of military children. The Help for Heroes, ARIA fund and more, who Heroes, ARIA fund and more, who opened a well attended facility.

-- The RAF fund. The military, including contractors, offer opportunities to young people in the region, many take up those opportunities. In my life I spent four years of leader of the council, during that period we strengthen the role in delivering the Armed Forces government and worked across party, across the chamber, to do that. That has continued with cross-party support for the council achieving gold standard in the employer's recognition scheme. During my time as council leader and is pleased to support the developing points between the council and the Royal Navy patrol vessel currently operating in the Indo-Pacific.

Giving the constituency and the wider region strong links with all three services. I will trust on some politics and I trust it will be taken in the positive spirit are presented. It is not a day for hard politics but there are some things I wish to point to that could be better for our Armed Forces. In terms of the government, I mentioned this in my intervention earlier onto the Minister, I welcome the proposals to embed the government in legislation. Along with the challenges associated with that, and financial implications, but it is the right thing to do and I look forward to future opportunities to debate and consider the embedding of the government as a legislated One thing that frustrated me was rapid changes in numbers which happened with no financial support to the council.

Like many councils with military bases, particularly Air Force bases, many of them are in quite rural areas. They are council for small populations and consequently smaller budgets to operate with. That makes them less agile because they simply don't have the money available on short notice to make the changes that are required to deliver services at a bigger scale. Others in the chamber have experience with military numbers. If the MoD were private developer, they would be providing pans and supporting a range of other public services.

They would also be required to look at infrastructure in the area, but the current design of the Armed Forces and the government departments that support them doesn't lend itself to doing that. This needs serious work. I am by no means a fan of everything that we do, but in this regard, significant changes to the population, it is a government department that steps up for periods to support the local authorities, making smooth changes with investment and service provision and the local economy.

These have big problems and demand that we have to absorb, and that is easier said than done. There is a welcome opportunity done. There is a welcome opportunity to fix that. The Department in the US used to be known as the Department for economic adjustment which I thought sounded a bit Orwellian. I was looking for opportunities to look at that issue, and the Department for defence team that was involved in that helps communities limit the impact of actions and program changes, and that is exactly what we need to achieve in the UK, and I think it is important as we go through an area of significantly increased spend in Armed Forces and growth on these numbers.

There will be demands for more dentists, doctors, healthcare, and it puts a lot of services and check which we need to look at. I would like to make three specific dimensions. I am taking part in the Armed Forces Parliamentary scheme, and it has afforded me many excellent learning opportunities as a parliamentarian, allowing me to better understand the Armed Forces for constituents. I would like to pay tribute to the Armed Forces trust here behind the scheme and the military operators in parliament, and those who have given so much and those who have given so much time and effort.

I would commend it to other members from the house who may be interested in taking it up. It was a real delight at the beginning of this week to the constituents for a tour of Parliament, and I congratulate her for a well-deserved win in the competition setup by the excellent place. Due to be really proud of her RP submitted on the theme of memories and I hope she and her family enjoyed the time. And finally, this morning, I was pleased to welcome to Parliament several members of the battlefield coordination detachment.

The group were led by Lou Tennant G Jenna who is developing an understanding of Parliament and the interaction between Parliament and military services, something which as important as the ministry as well as the Parliament. It is vitally important that dedication and commitment of Armed Forces and Armed Forces Day are great opportunity to do just that.

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Thank you very much. I would like to associate myself with the opening to associate myself with the opening words of the Minister. It is a privilege to speak in this debate. As a member of the Armed Forces As a member of the Armed Forces Parliamentary scheme, but also as a proud Member of Parliament. The home of the Royal Navy and a community
14:50
Amanda Martin Portrait Amanda Martin MP (Portsmouth North, Labour)
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with ties to Armed Forces. But for me, this debate is not just about duty. It is personal. I have a son currently serving on several cousins, and grandad to wear and ward their uniforms with pride, and I know both the pride and sacrifice that service life brings. I am emotional and waving off the ships as they sail out of my city and as they sail back in and I want to thank the Minister for joining me earlier this month when we waived love ones of Prince of Wales.

I will be returning again next month. The Armed Forces week, we honour not just those in uniform, regulars, reserves and veterans, but also the families who stand behind them. The Armed Forces of the backbone of our national security and the best of us, and I would like to make a special mention of the battalions. More fondly known in my city as the Powell's. Over 1400 of those who lost their lives, many of those going over the battle of the sum on 3 September 1960, a tribute to these Armed Forces veterans who didn't survive can be found on my football club and also their names were adorned on our football shirts as well.

After years of regret and underfunding, I am proud that the Labour government is turning the page. They deliver the largest pay rise over 20 years for armed forces and we have heard from the Minister how an increasing recruitment and how we have committed 1.5 and how we have committed £1.5 billion more for military accommodation. Tackling years of decay and poor conditions that too many forces families had to endure, and I'm proud to report the Minister to meet with residents and Armed Forces families to see what can be done with accommodation and I look forward to this government changing homes for the better.

We also must look to the future and we must look at boosting the cadet forces and I'm pleased that we are looking to do that 2030, opening doors to 42,000 more young people from every background to develop their skills and discipline and confidence that service life can bring, and I would like to make a mention of the Royal Navy cadets, the sea cadets, the army cadets and the combined Cadet forces and teachers at Portsmouth College teach the uniformed protective services level II and three and who do a great job in ensuring our young people that they can be a life in the military.

I would also like to make sure that those who served not forgotten and launching valour, £50,000 programme with support centres, something I urge the council to sign up to and I wholeheartedly embrace as we have veterans who deserve and need our support. I also look forward to putting the covenant into law and promoting the service to our Armed Forces and their families, many of whom don't know it exists so that we can follow best practice across the country and deliver for our people.

In Portsmouth, we commemorated VE day and it was fantastic to join the residents and I look forward to joining many other street parties on VJ Day in August.

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Weir will cause a huge debt of thanks to the whole of the World War thanks to the whole of the World War II generation but I would like to pay tribute if I made a remarkable local hero from my constituency, local hero from my constituency, Jack dark, the last surviving member Jack dark, the last surviving member of the Pathfinder Squadron. The Pathfinders played a crucial role in World War II, flying ahead of World War II, flying ahead of formations to mark targets for attack.

To say was a tough mission is an underestimate. Crew survived for an average of just six weeks. for an average of just six weeks. Against all the odds, Jack will celebrate his 102nd birthday on 11 August, an extraordinary milestone August, an extraordinary milestone that speaks to his incredible spirit and his determination. So, I'm very much looking forward to meeting Jack much looking forward to meeting Jack in person tomorrow and I hope that the honourable member will agree the honourable member will agree that his story is a powerful reminder of the bravery and resilience of all our Armed Forces.



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resilience of all our Armed Forces. I thank him for that wonderfully intervention. I send my best wishes to Jack for his birthday, and also in remembering that, I would like to in remembering that, I would like to remember John Jenkins who is one of our own veterans from Portsmouth. We also proudly celebrated Armed Forces Day last Saturday, honouring the sacrifice with events across the city. It is an event that I have attended since I was a kid and it shows our city as its best.

We raise the flag in support of those who serve and have served, but in my kitty, the Armed Forces are amended every day, not just on one day. I also want to pay tribute to the local charities, veterans organisations and community groups who work year-round to support our Armed Forces communities. Dedication and compassion make a real difference and it has been the pleasure to work with them on behalf of my constituents, veterans and their families, and I have been proud to host many of them in this place.

Let us use this week not just to show gratitude but to rebuild the bond between society and those who serve, and to assure that our community is properly respected, supported and championed, and let us use it to say thank you. Be that to Ollie, Kate, Kirsty, Craig, Mark, Jonty who is currently away on the Prince of Wales, and to all who serve and have served because whether they are serving now or have served or are supporting from home,

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they all deserve nothing less than our full commitment in their attack. Thank you. I welcome the

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Thank you. I welcome the Minister's statement today, and being a member of the defence select, I look forward to scrutinising the detail in what we scrutinising the detail in what we need to administer. I would like to say a brief word of thanks to the Royal Marines Association, the Royal British Legion, and the veterans British Legion, and the veterans charities and many others for all the good work in my constituency of North Devon which is home to more
14:57
Ian Roome Portrait Ian Roome MP (North Devon, Liberal Democrat)
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North Devon which is home to more than 4800 veterans. And North Devon is also home to the Royal Marines for the logistic regimen. Back in January, I spent a day with a wonderful organisation called the root cause projects, a community of serving personnel who meet regularly around the campfire in the great outdoors to look out for each other and talk. Their message is simple. Being able to talk to people with a shared life experience is vital to those who served and is good for those who served and is good for your mental-health.

I know from my time working with the Armed Forces charity just how important that support structure is. When I left the Royal Air Force in the 1990s, many veterans still found the experience of being out of uniform not just strange but very isolating. So I hope that Armed Forces will continue to look at community and show that we all appreciate the service of those who keep us safe. Recently, I visited the British Normandy material with some fellow parliamentarians, some in the chamber today.

To lay reefs in memory of those who gave the ultimate sacrifice. It was a truly moving experience. Officially opened on 6 June 2021 by his match to the king, as Royal patron of the Normandy Memorial trust, the memorial stands as a powerful tribute to the 22,442 servicemen and women under British command who lost their lives on D-Day and throughout the Battle of Normandy in the summer of 1944. I was extremely honoured to meet veteran from the D-Day landing her a just turned 100 years old who landed on the beach that day seven times and it was because he was a pilot.

And I thanked him for his service and recited some memories from that momentous day. Walking among the stone inscriptions, I was struck by how the memorial brings together the names of individuals from over 30 different countries, all united in sacrifice. Sat on a hillside overlooking the beach, the site offers a poignant reminder of the scale and diversity of those who fought and fell. That day certainly put a large lump in my throat just like every remembrance service does.

We recognise that dedication to duty is Armed Forces week, but most importantly, I hope veterans and serving personnel no that support structure is there for them and that

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Can I thank the Minister for his opening remarks and can I thank the opening remarks and can I thank the colleagues from across the chamber in coming together to commemorate, in coming together to commemorate, to celebrate those brave men and women who keep us safe. Before I begin, I would like to note that a Westminster Hall debates was due to Westminster Hall debates was due to take place at around the same time take place at around the same time today.

This was to be on the RAF photo reconnaissance unit. The unit photo reconnaissance unit. The unit whose intelligence gathering work of staggering 26 million photographs
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Jas Athwal Portrait Jas Athwal MP (Ilford South, Labour)
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staggering 26 million photographs was vital to the war effort. These men, often on armed, operated under extreme risk with a tragic 48 percent fatality rate. There bravery and sacrifice was instrumental to our victory. I hope to contribute our victory. I hope to contribute more fully to that debate when it takes place so that we can rightly honour their role in protecting our freedom. On Armed Forces Day, I want to focus today on women and men are currently protecting country.

Many today have spoken about the uncertain global times we face. These challenges only serve to sharpen our focus and strengthen our resolve to honour our Armed Forces. I previously shared with this House how growing up whilst I knew my grandfather and great-grandfather had served in the war, I really saw had served in the war, I really saw their contributions recognised. -- I rarely saw their contributions recognised. Armed Forces Day is about changing that, about raising the flag for all of those on active duty.

Thinking of their service for us and honouring their decision to put themselves in harms way for the rest of us. I take this opportunity to thank the Ben and women of Ilford whose names are etched in Memorial Hall, which used to be the entrance to the maternity unit of Kings hospital in Newbury Park. A wonderful idea that they gave their lives so that babies, children, could be born in freedom. It is about recognising our Armed Forces who come from every walk of life, from diverse faiths and backgrounds.

Sikhs, Hindus, Muslims, students, black, white, Asian. Personnel, each individual making incredible contribution to our collective security. If we are serious about supporting our Armed Forces, we must supporting our Armed Forces, we must do more than hold debates to observe commemorative days. We must improve the experience of those serving now and I'm proud of the Prime Minister's announcement on the increased funding today. Improved experience means supporting efforts to make the military more inclusive, more accessible and more responsive to the needs of its personnel.

I would like to mention groups like the defence seeking network you are doing just that by raising the voices of Sikhs in service and working to ensure they can serve with dignity and authenticity. In 2022, the defence seeking network spearheaded the introduction of a waterproof, tear proof, camouflage copy of a sacred seatback -- Sikh prayerbook for use in tactical environments. Reviving a tradition in World War I where Sikh soldiers served under the British into army carried their scriptures with them carried their scriptures with them into battle.

For many Sikhs their tradition of protecting those more vulnerable than them, the introduction of the text helped the Sikh to retain the connection between their service and their faith. It was not always like that, an Oxford budget in 1918 who was denied entry in the British cause, was going to join the French until his tutor intervened and got him in. He grew with distinction, survived for 40 miles at low altitude with bullets in his leg and is plain being shot.

In his own words, he said my pursuers did not have the bullet with my name on it. These are small but meaningful initiatives about this text, demonstrating respect for those who serve. On Armed Forces Day we commemorate the men and women we may not see daily. The once behind-the-scenes who work tirelessly to keep us safe, like the one in the factory in Ilford in World War II. We honour those whose names are not always remembered, whose records are lost like the men of the RAF reconnaissance unit, and we reaffirm our commitment to implementing real change.

From larger scale policy initiatives, to smaller cultural initiatives, make our forces stronger and more

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inclusive. Thank you. This debate rather fittingly comes in the shadow of the NATO comes in the shadow of the NATO summit in The Hague yesterday. With the headline pledge to reach five percent of GDP on defence by the
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Rachel Gilmour Portrait Rachel Gilmour MP (Tiverton and Minehead, Liberal Democrat)
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percent of GDP on defence by the midpoint of next decade. And I are two remarks from across the House that we do live in an increasingly volatile world. Perhaps more volatile and more unpredictable than at any other point in the post 1945 era. We see the bloodiest conflict on European soil since the Second World War. Death and devastation in the Middle East and across Africa, the Middle East and across Africa, Asia and beyond. We on civvy Street, in our comfort, perhaps guilty of forgetting how fragile our freedoms and democracy are and the threats posed to them.

These values are not guaranteed. They have to be for four. We must be reminded of that. Because we live in an age which gives the historical exception, not gives the historical exception, not the norm. Our way of life at home depends on our strength to defend it and how we project ourselves abroad. We recently celebrated the 80th anniversary of Victory in Europe. Just a few generations back, still within the memories of many, this country was engaged in a fight for its life and survival.

We would do well to remember this always. Thankfully, brave men and women who serve to protect today need no such reminder. I come from a military reminder. I come from a military family. My late father served in the reserves. Two of my brothers have had long careers in the Armed Forces. One is in the Black Watch. He was in charge of making sure everything went smoothly when the Queen died. I cannot tell you how proud I was of my baby other then when it did.

And Johnny, now retired, was only tenant in the brigadier guards. They have dedicated their life to service of the country, I can see that they reinforced my knowledge that the military remains in the best of hands. Britain's Armed Forces are still the finest in the world. I speak with pride about my own constituency of Tiverton and Minehead, home to 5077 veterans, a proud part of the country with a strong tradition. I would like to salute the fantastic presence of the Royal British Legion and other veteran organisations in my patch.

Particularly the Dunkirk Memorial House, the Armed Forces breakfast Provide a sense of community. Having done lots of pro bono work with the Royal British Legion in a previous life, particularly around PTSD and hearing loss, it is a topic close to my heart. I would say now I am delighted to hear the Minister announced the Armed Forces government will be included in legislation. It is a national obligation to look after those who have served as. Before I was elected, I had to try to help a young RAF veteran, Owen, and his family, including his young daughter, who had just been diagnosed with autism, they had just become homeless.

If only the legislation had been in place there. I know my colleague, the counsellor responsible for the government at the district council, will ensure she endeavours to make sure the very best is done. The Armed Forces government is not a charity. It is justice. We must be alive to the recruitment crisis currently in our Armed Forces. We must close that gap. I do feel, however, we are not particularly helping ourselves in this regard. Allow me to draw attention to the plight of a young constituent of mine, which I suspect is a frustratingly similar story to a number of young people up and down the country.

In February 2024 she the country. In February 2024 she gave up the chance to study A-levels to attend the assessment centre, when October 2024 she passed the assessment when her scores were exemplary. By June this year, -- and exemplary. By June this year, -- and she was accepted in the Intelligence Corps. During this year she was still not given a start date. Meanwhile, she is getting by with a series of menial part-time jobs but has seemingly been left in the lurch.

I'm not using her name because she has asked me not to but I will give the Minister her details later in the hope we can process this matter sooner rather than later. Young people like my constituent you are prepared to serve their country and represent the best of generation deserve better and I would ask the Minister to comment on this privately. I will ask the Minister to commit today to publishing detailed targets of processing applications, allocating sufficient personnel to recruitment pipeline and providing more successful candidates with concrete start date within a reasonable time start date within a reasonable time period.

I would like to put on that record that the veterans Minister was known as a legend when he served in the Royal Marines. To me, he remains a legend today. I sent him an email and receive a response within 48 hours, which is enormously helpful to my constituents, the people I serve. In finishing, I'm going to quote from Alexander, he said I am a Patriot but not a nationalist. And so, as I finish my speech today, I reiterate his words.

I speak as a proud Patriot, but
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David Reed Portrait David Reed MP (Exmouth and Exeter East, Conservative)
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It is a pleasure and a privilege to close today's excellent debate on Armed Forces Day. I pay tribute to colleagues across the House for the thoughtful and passionate thoughtful and passionate contributions. I rise on the half of his Majesty's loyal opposition to express our thanks to all those who serve and have served in our Armed Forces. Regulars, reservers, veterans, cadets and families who support them every step of the way. Armed Forces Week, which began on Monday, and culminates this Saturday, 20 June with Armed Forces Day, is a national moment to say one thing clearly and collectively thank you.

Thank you to those defending the UK and our interests around the world. Our Armed Forces represent the best of our country, committed, courageous and professional. They worked tirelessly, often in the most challenging conditions, to keep us safe and uphold the values we share. Today's debate has been powerful because of the personal reflection shared by so many members. The shared by so many members. The honourable member. Turn north, -- the honourable member for Stockton North, having watched the member in defence debates, it is clear he is a passionate advocate for his constituency with strong military links.

You raised about the Royal military police in his constituency, a regiment that plays a vital role and we need to hear more about. I enjoyed hearing about the airborne police officer unit, an interesting skill set we could potentially see in the Met. The Member for Stockton North talk powerfully about his constituents, Kate and Rachel, both veterans who faced internal adversity because of their gender and sexuality. As said quite rightly, commissioners not know any gender or sexuality. -- Coverage does not know any gender or sexuality.

-- Coverage. Many veterans in my constituency have made transitions to military life, I know the skills they bring. The highlighted the need for the Armed Forces government to be strengthened. I'm glad to hear about the reception he held in the House of Commons. It would be good to support and going forward in endeavours. We must ensure the sacrifice of service personnel is not met with silence., But with I moved to my gallant friend. I agree with my gallant friend that the member, that the service is not enough alone.

Only 1/4 of veterans believe that service is valued, and I agree with him that that needs to change. He spoke powerfully about Northern Ireland veterans and the S service, a regimen that he serves with. He spoke about the injustice this group of soldiers and others in the military are facing by the opening of domestic legal frameworks. These veterans bring battles that were fought under orders, and the yellow card legal system. They were under the view of the Royal military police with strong legal framework surrounding those operations.

My friend made the point that they join up, they serve the country, and now the view is that they will get prosecuted in later life. This is not right, and I look forward to the issue debated later on this month, and hopefully overturned in the coming months, and with the veterans petition that is live at the moment to see the uptick in the numbers of people who have signed that petition in the last few hours is significant. The member for Bolton North East made remarks about her personal connection to the Armed Forces and her husbands service in the reserves.

Has an interesting to hear about the 216 Royal Artillery Regiment in her constituency and her link to the Royal British Legion. I think she made a powerful case of support for training and I look forward to hearing the ministers response to that. I also want to echo the support for expanding the cadet programme. I spent many happy years in the air cadets and I see what value that brings society, and as a pathway for people to join the military, so I align with her comments.

My honourable and friend, the member for Huntington. As ever, a strong advocate and champion for the military unit. We are regularly calling out for more support. He served the UK operations during the global war on terror in Afghanistan and Iraq, and he knows first-hand the challenges that come from the revolution of war and the need for kids to keep pace with the evolution of threats. As my friend said, no plan survives first contact with the enemy, and those words remain as true as they ever have.

So, it is crucial that we not only learn the lessons of modern conflict but ensure that our Armed Forces retain capabilities to make the demands of the evolving environments that we are potentially going to be involved with incoming years. He also made a fair and timely observation that the best way to honour Armed Forces is not to make them work on a hot day in the middle of June. The honourable member for Great Grimsby in Cleethorpes rightly highlights the volunteers who work tirelessly behind-the-scenes to ensure our Armed Forces are commemorated poorly.

They miss out on enjoying the events themselves, so I hope they enjoy some sunshine with their families. We thank them all in their groups for their vital support on these commemorations. The member also shared a moving story about her great aunt and mother. The story touched many of us in the chamber today. We welcome Polish servicemen into their home and became part of the family 50 years ago, demonstrating how deeply service personnel become woven into our communities and lives.

As always, I'm sure the red arrows will deliver a magnificent display over Cleethorpes this weekend. I hope it does manage to enjoy some ice cream when he is up in your constituency and a few beers as well. The honourable member for Portsmouth North, a proud mother serving the Royal Navy sailor who she spoke about many times. He represents the city with a really high number of service personnel and veterans, one of the highest in the country, I think, and as you expect, and been to 1 of the homes in the Royal Navy who represents Devonport.

She also raised a really interesting point around the protective services BTEC course. I see the value of that first hand and it is really interesting to see young people really flourish in that environment, and just like the cadets, it provides a really strong pathway to those who want to go into the military or other protective services. The honourable member for North Devon, a really strong military constituency. 4800 with 11% of households. He has been a proud advocate for the Royal Marines in his constituency for the regiment.

And I was impressed to hear about the work that he has done with the Armed Forces charity. It was also really enjoyable and interesting to go away with him recently on the trip that he spoke about to Normandy to see the D-Day commemoration. And it was particularly poignant to meet with the D-Day veteran who is now 100 years old who was a Royal Marines, unlike the honourable member said, he made countless trips up and down the beaches that day, and I loved hearing his stories.

The honourable member for Ilford North opened the photographic units, tales of daring do an unit that I really enjoyed learning about as the campaign has been growing, and I look forward that debate being rescheduled and being brought back to the House of Commons. He raised some really important points around the contribution of people from all over the world to the Armed Forces and the Commonwealth, and the need to celebrate them this Armed Forces day, and it was interesting to hear about the first Indian fighter pilot in World War I with the fighting against the red Baron.

And then lastly, the member for Tiverton and Minehead, my near name in the south-west. She has a strong military family and I have spoken to how many times about her brother service. I think she raises a very interesting and important point around the pathway for people that want to join the military and she talks about her constituents trying to join the Intelligence Corps and the weight uptime to join being far too long. And I think that will be an interesting point to discuss whether there can be something around that.

I speak from personal experience. I am proud to have served in the Royal Marines and after leaving service a decade ago and it was to say the least one of the more unconventional side gigs in public service, giving me a Birds Eye view of Armed Forces Day celebrations, and over many years, I looked at Armed Forces Day events. From thousands of feet above, I saw crowds gather which was humbling, though my primary concern wasn't so much national pride as much as avoiding crash landing in someone's picnic.

These kind of events are not just pageantry which has been raised by members from across the house. They are tools for engagement. As a child, I have memories of attending larger airshows and other military larger airshows and other military displays, and as people remember, the Navy's high octane competition with the motorcycle display team made a lasting impression on me and shaped my decision to join the military. As difficult choices are made to support that increase, it will be important more now than ever to showcase our Armed Forces and their capabilities.

That visibility assures public understanding and accountability for where taxpayers money is being spent. There is also a broader point, and as the national security sale outlined this week, the threats faced are serious. The possibility of a hostile attack on the UK which, for many decades were seen as unimaginable is now within the realm of possibility. The time must, we have to defend the things that we hold dear. We must therefore to a new relationship with defence not seeing it as a line in the budget but recognising it as a fundamental pillar of our national security and resilience.

As Armed Forces Day is more than capability. It is about morale, about recognising the Neri services public support matters. It lifts spirits, it strengthens bonds and reminds those in uniform that their country stands firmly behind them. And that support must go further than symbolic gestures at a point that we had repeatedly across the chamber in today's debates. The Armed Forces covenant is a solemn pledge from government, from businesses and communities to treat those who serve in their families with fairness and respect in everyday life.

The message from today's debate is clear. Gratitude must be backed up by action on housing, employments, and a dignified transition to civilian life. These are responsibilities we all share. The government strategic review exposes the whole national defence. It is welcome and necessary. Defence is not just the task of Armed Forces butter shared civic responsibility for true resilience lies not only on capability but also on strong institutions, cohesive community, and national unity. At the heart of that resilience is trust.

A social contract between the nation and those who serve it. We must do all we can to honour that trust. That is why we cannot ignore the serious concerns raised by veterans, especially those who serve in Northern Ireland. The strength of feeling in that his real and justified, and the member raised that today in his speech. I want to place on record my thanks to the Minister for his principal support for a judicial report and I hope his judgement has been actively sought by colleagues in the Northern Ireland Office, especially as they reflect on plans to repeal the Troubles legacy and reconciliation act 2023.

Our veterans deserve clarity. They deserve compassion and they deserve fairness. The strength of the Royal Navy, the British Army and the Royal Air Force lies not just in firepower or training but in the character of those who serve. Their dedication, discipline and selflessness are a credit to our country, so let's use this not only to reflect but to renew our commitments. To serve those who serve us, to honour those who have worn the uniform and to ensure future generations understand the debt we are.

We are grateful. We are proud. We will remember them, we will support them, and we will thank them. Thank you.

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Thank you. With leave of the house, I would like to respond to house, I would like to respond to this debate. As members had to sit through my opening remarks, they through my opening remarks, they will be pleased to know that I won't be repeating many of those today, but what I am keen to do is to pick up on a number of the points raised by honourable members in the by honourable members in the discussions to be summarised by the gentleman opposite, but can I first thanked everyone for their contributions today? It is at a time contributions today? It is at a time where it is easy to make political hot shots across the chamber on some serious issues.

Today's debate has serious issues. Today's debate has shown that, on a cross-party basis, we can come together to support our we can come together to support our people, to talk about the contributions that our Armed Forces make, but also, to raise genuine make, but also, to raise genuine areas of concern but to do so with respect and with thoughtfulness, and respect and with thoughtfulness, and I think sadly, not as many people will be watching this debate as will be watching this debate as watch other affairs in this chamber, but if they had, they would see a parliament working effectively and parliament working effectively and properly and I will be seeking to come back to a number of points raised as we go through in these

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In a bipartisan spirit has the Minister would allow me an apology.
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Luke Pollard Portrait Luke Pollard MP, The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Plymouth Sutton and Devonport, Labour )
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I promised the Defence Select Committee in my remarks I will explain the reason why he and some of the committee are not here. It is because they are on an overseas trip directly related to defence

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business. So if you can help keep me honest about both on the record. That he does not want to offend

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That he does not want to offend the chair of the Defence Committee. I'm glad he has had the chance to do so. What I heard in this debate I so. What I heard in this debate I hope our forces will avert if they were listening, was not only support for the men and women who serve, for the men and women who serve, advocacy for the Armed Forces being a brilliant career choice. But support for improvements to transition from military life to transition from military life to civilian roles afterwards.

And also the support of those people who have served in the past and stories of served in the past and stories of heroism and courage that we have heard. But I think makes for a good heard. But I think makes for a good debate today. I'm pleased that the number of people able to pick out elements from the Strategic Defence elements from the Strategic Defence Review. The government has adopted all 62 recommendations from the report, and we will be influencing report, and we will be influencing them in full.

Further announcements them in full. Further announcements will take place as to what to implement and how we are taking forward the spirit of the F ER as forward the spirit of the F ER as well as the recommendations. I shall set up after increasing defence set up after increasing defence spending to 2.5% of GDP by 2027, 3% in the next Parliament, and 3.5% by 2035, and 1.5% on resilience and homeland defence by the same period. There will be plenty of opportunities for members to make the case that increasing defence spending can be spent not just on kit and equipment but also on people.

When we hear conversations around military accommodation, I know there is an increased budget to pay for that work. We talk about valuing our people and we know they received above inflation pay rises for people for the first time in a long time that I think is really important. There was one thing that I will expect to see and hear more of in future debates. We had lots of mentions of Army Navy and Air Force and traditional roles that they do but I expect in future Armed Forces debate we will have more mentions of those people who work in cyber, and digital defence and nation.

The direct entry cyber pathway, has been a success. And we look forward to announcing the passing out of the first cohort later this year. But the ability for us as Armed Forces and people who care about defence to talk about cyber and ability to protect digital infrastructure, this is just as important as more military threats, and there will be discussion on how we keep the space debate are safe as well. I expect in future years.

I'm glad a number of honourable Member's were able to talk about their roles and participation in the Armed Forces Parliamentary scheme. It is an area as a minister that I'm responsible for. Very proud of the way that has been expanded in the past year. I would like to thank the Armed Forces publicly trust for their support in doing so. It is a superb opportunity not just for parliamentarians who have not served but also for those who have, to experience a different perspective on military life.

To understand what we ask about people and how we can listen to their experiences and bring back into the house to learn from our people and their deployment, and their experiences to improve our work here. I would like to turn to a number of comments made in the debate just to respond if I can. I'm glad that the Shadow Minister was able to talk about the protocol, indeed I would expect all members of the house to be asking their Chief Constable whether their police force is going with that.

I will undertake to do the same as I imagine many of the other Devon MPs will be doing here for Devon and Cornwall police. I think Ms Romero from doing that I'm grateful to him for bringing it to the attention of the House. As someone who is proudly the first- ever out MP, I say, think the way that LGBT personnel and veterans are now spoken about in this House fills me with pride. Growing up there was not always the role models the public debate that enables people to feel like there was a place in the Armed Forces for folks like me.

And to hear honourable members in this House is very powerful. I think his quotes when he says courage does not know any different in sexuality or gender is absolutely right. It is something we need to build into our Armed Forces as we seek to change the culture, so everyone is welcome that there is no place for abuse, and we need the contributions of everyone from every background in our Armed Forces to keep our nation safe. I'm grateful to him. I'm also grateful for the member from Epsom when he spoke about the importance of payments to LGBT veterans.

The priority order that the Minister for Veterans has established for that is that initial payments have gone to those people who are over 80, all those people who are savvy towards the end of their life. To make sure that those payments can be made to them before they leave. And we have now established procedures for paying the larger cohort of people and the Minister for Veterans will be making further announcements about how we will be rolling that out. We are pleased that the first payments have been made in full, and we will be rolling that out further.

I agree with her when she says Armed Forces Day is a starting point for serious change. I believe that started on 4 July last year. I think the spirit in what it was sent there, it is not enough just to talk about change to put into action. Hopefully she members across the House will be able to see Strategic Defence Review being implement it, the increasing defence spending, increase pay for forces and housing commitments or cultivating to improving things as we go through.

I'm grateful to the member for Mansfield, who spoke about the Armed Forces Covenant being out collective aspect. This is right. As we look to put that fully internal needs to be a conversation. One thing, if I may be thinking, to request honourable members from both sides that the questions on Armed Forces Covenant we not directed just at the Ministry of defence. It is to be effective we need every single government department to be able to understand what their role is in delivering an Armed Forces Covenant fully into law.

Work at the Minister for Veterans has been undertaking on a cross government basis was not I imagine there will be further such work as we build towards that

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legislation in due course. In the hope that other government departments are listening, the departments are listening, the Minister might recall that I said in my remarks that at noon today, Northern Ireland veterans petition had just over 145,000 signatures. had just over 145,000 signatures. Having looked at a few seconds ago it is now just shy of 148,000. Perhaps inspired by the right Perhaps inspired by the right honourable Member for Goole and Pocklington excellent speech. Perhaps you can convey to his colleagues that we do not want to throw out Northern Ireland veterans throw out Northern Ireland veterans to the walls.

And clearly from this petition neither to the public. I am grateful for his intervention. I grateful for his intervention. I will be returning to the speech, but let me deal with some of the other let me deal with some of the other points before I get to that if you will allow. I am grateful for the speech from my honourable friend for Cleethorpes and Grimsby about the National Day event. I'm pleased to see the passion that she has for this event, and the seriousness that she has as a Member of Parliament for her community.

The pride that for her community. The pride that she has and also the connection with folks that she mentioned in her remarks. It is very powerful. I am certain there will be other things from the Secretary of State, so I expect that. Can I thank the audible member for Murray West, when he spoke about the RAF and the importance of how we base our people and value the wider community. In and value the wider community. In dreadful him mentioning HMS Spain.

Although fantastic job has been done, their contributions to holding the international border space order supporting allies in that region is very important. It is a little ship with a big impact. So I'm grateful for his suggestion. Can I encourage him not to forget the opportunity to talk about how we can debate further about the resilience spending. I think for him in particular, his remarks about how the spending of other government departments and councils that effectively enable homeland defence, is precisely why, in the NATO spending pledge that was agreed at the NATO summit, there is now 1.5% of GDP commitment by 2035.

To be spent on homeland defence and other types of activities. That bolster our resilience as a nation. I think he has a strong case for arguing on that. NATO will shortly publish the full criteria but I believe the examples he uses are good ones to argue for in support of that. So may I encourage you to do that. My honourable friend from Portsmouth North waved off HMS Prince of Wales when she left for her deployment into the Indo- Pacific. It was a good opportunity not only to meet members of her community but also to realise that the carrier and the carrier strike includes people from all parts of our country.

All sailing together. And indeed sailing alongside many of our allies during our Norwegian friends who have a frigate sailing on the entire deployment. So when we celebrate contrary to our Armed Forces let's also render the contribution of allies to keeping us safe today and in the past as well. I'm very grateful for the intervention from the honourable gentleman from Horsham who spoke about some 102nd birthday. As I'm the member who spoke about Norman Ashford, a D-Day veteran, in his remarks, it is important that we value and take extra care of those final few folks from the Second World War.

Make sure we are capturing their stories and telling them they are not forgotten. I'm grateful for the contributions of all of those. The member for Ilford South correctly raised the issue of the RAF aircraft. I can report the Minister has met the campaign, as I suspect nearly anything a person the House has. If there is a public affairs for best campaign they deserve it. I understand that there is progress being made, and the campaign has met Westminster City Council to look at this.

It is a campaign where the cost needs to be met by public subscription. I have no doubt that they would be. I expect positive progress in that regard. I know there is strong support for the recognition for bravery of those people who undertook those roles in the second world war. I'm grateful to him for raising it in this debate. And raising the examples of service personnel don't always get the attention they need in recollections of wartime stories especially from the Sikh community.

I'm grateful to him falling so and speaking about it. It is good to have three Frontbench speakers from Devon. It is not always the case in this place but I'm grateful the member from Tiverton and Minehead who spoke about God's wish and her family have made. In relation to the type of flight issue as it is referred to, that is time from signing up to a training establishment, we inherited a situation where, for some of our services, that was over a year.

That is not acceptable. We were losing in July last year, 84% of people in the process, not because we had remove them because of a medical problem, or because of an eligibility issue Grand National took records, but simply because the process took too long. It is not acceptable. I feel very strongly against the critique that is sometimes applied to act younger generation, who do not want to serve our nation. That is not true full stop last year 106 to 5000 people tried to join the British Army.

We hired 9500 at the end of it. We lost vast majority of the process is too long. That is why we are reducing the time of flight, and the particular matter she raises, I'm happy looking into that for her. But certainly the policy I mentioned should, when fully rolled out across all three services make a difference in that respect. There is the process of rolling that out. I will certainly try and discourage people reading the transcript of this debate being regarded as veterans, it will no doubt 80s humbleness.

I'm grateful to the honourable gentleman opposite for his concluding remarks and history of crash landing, nearly crash landing in someone's picnic. He did not quite at the end of that story but as he is in one piece, let's assume it all went well in respect of that. But grateful for the way in which he summarised the debate. The member for Bolton North East raised the very valid questions around training levels. We certainly have had a situation where to manage in year spent over a number of years, training both regular and reserve forces was often the first casualty of trying to manage budget pressures.

We are very aware of that. We are conscious that the increase in defence spending could impart make a difference for that. But as we have a number of challenges that deal with this, we need to look at how the best way of delivering the increased training available, increase adventure training in particular to city what many of our forces want. I would be happy to have the connotation with her so she can raise the particulars I'm grateful to the member for Huntingdon, who has changed his fashion.

His remarks in particular talking about the contribution of U.S. Air Force bases in his constituency, a good reminder of the close friendship we have. I was at the US embassy earlier today as part of a conference organised by the Council on geo-strategy looking at our alliance. Our military cooperation is one of the things that really underscores the value of the relationship we have with our US friends. I know that America really does value the bases they are able to operate from in the UK, so that is certainly true.

I agree entirely when he says our Armed Forces personnel should be paid properly, housed properly, indeed that is the intent of many of the changes we are making. I think in particular about the stability point around where we are with the British Army deployments, because largely the Air Force and Navy have greater stability than their compatriots in the army. It is something we are aware of and looking at, I am certain he will be sending me a lot of PQs on that matter before I sit down even.

Before I conclude can I turn to the serious issue raised by the right honourable member when he spoke about Northern Ireland veterans. He will know because we've spoken about it a number of times, as indeed he has with the Secretary of State and also the Minister for veterans, but on these benches we feel very strongly we need to support our veterans navigating through that process is what we are seeking to do at the moment. We also recognise that the debates on the petition, mentioned by a number of members, will be taking place on 14 July.

I welcome that debate, it's an opportunity to make the case in support of those people who served our nation, and served in support of peace in Northern Ireland. There is more work to be done there. After the honourable gentleman's remarks I read the article in the Daily Mail that he referenced in relation to the launch of the campaign. It is certainly true that the government seeks to repeal the current Northern Ireland legacies act. What you had to get to the end of the article to read is that we will replace it as well.

The wording he chose carefully in his remarks about how that replacement must work, because we know the current act is unlawful and has been found to be unlawful in a number of courts, it's also not prevented some of the bits we are seeing at the moment. We have to find a way forward on this. I know The Northern Ireland Office is looking at this area at the moment, and we continue to have conversations with our NIO colleagues. That was the point the shadow Minister was making in his intervention earlier.



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Coming as I do from a constituency in the north-east, of course over many years members of course over many years members of our community served in Northern Ireland. This is you are veterans in Ireland. This is you are veterans in Northern Ireland is just as important to those on these benches as it is to those across the whole House. I was in the House on 21 May House. I was in the House on 21 May when the Minister for Northern when the Minister for Northern Ireland said they committed to fixing the failure of the legacy act.

Would he agree with the comments of the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland?

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for Northern Ireland? I entirely agree, there's something not right here and it needs to be resolved. I don't doubt the passion that the honourable the passion that the honourable gentleman is opposite and those on gentleman is opposite and those on our side have, we need to find a solution to those that can provide peace of mind and the ability to peace of mind and the ability to address community concerns. There is address community concerns. There is a path through this, we need to go through it carefully to make sure we are cognizant of all the strong views in that, I am certain that views in that, I am certain that will happen.

I'm also certain we will continue our conversations outside the chamber as we work with our Northern Ireland office colleagues who have the lead on this area. I'm grateful for him raising it in this debate. This has been a good debate in terms of looking at Armed Forces Day, and when it comes to the support we are seeing it's not just from those members who are able to speak in this debate, unconscious there's a number of members present to due to the vagrancy's of Parliament procedure have been unable to speak in this debate.

The member who sits behind me who is also attending Armed Forces Day events at the Motherwell United services club on Saturday, and the member for Wellingborough who has the whip, there are whips on both sides of the house who may not be able to contribute verbally but I'm certain will be also supporting Armed Forces Day events in their constituencies right across the country. What we need to ensure now is that the warm words and very well crafted speeches we have heard today are put into action all year round.

It's not enough just to have a day where we celebrate our Armed Forces, we need to recognise their service each and every day. And as the nation increasingly sees a more uncertain and dangerous world on their TV screens or their phones, it is the men and women of our Armed Forces who are at the pointy end of our defence of our nation. We can all do something to increase the resilience of our own defence. If everyone in the House just updated their operating systems on their computers and phones Britain would be more cyber secure than it was beforehand.

We can all do something, but in this place in particular Members of Parliament on both sides can continue to make the case for our people, make the case for defence families, for better investment and better pay for our Armed Forces. The sentiment psychiatry both sides of the House today it is something we can all see on a cross-party basis. I thank all honourable members for contributing

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today and wish them all a very successful Armed Forces Day on Saturday. Thank you. The question is that this house

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The question is that this house

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The question is that this house is considered Armed Forces Day. As many as are of that opinion, say, many as are of that opinion, say, "Aye". Of the contrary, "No". The ayes have it. The question is that

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this house do now adjourn. I am delighted to see the house
15:53
None Portrait Adjournment: Potential merits of floating solar panels
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I am delighted to see the house so full for the adjournment debate, because I do want honourable members
15:53
Lincoln Jopp Portrait Lincoln Jopp MP (Spelthorne, Conservative)
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because I do want honourable members who are staying to remember who was here. And indeed, members in the public gallery may wish to take a note in their diary as well, because I hope I'm going to in some way below their House's mind with what I'm about to say. To sow a seed that will grow into something fantastic. Because what we are here to discuss is floating solar. Members will know that I'm the member of Parliament for Spelthorne, I feel obliged to remind the house on regular occasions that Spelthorne is not in Lancashire, it is not in Lincolnshire, it is everything south of Heathrow and -- until members get to the River Thames.

Members around the House know my constituency well, because it is what they see when they take off from Heathrow airport or when they land there. I was selected as the member of Parliament, the candidate to be the member of Parliament from Spelthorne four days into the general election. Having spent 25 years in the army, obviously I love a map. There's a good saying that if you don't understand what's going on, get a bigger map. So I looked at the map of Spelthorne, and was very struck by these four massive blocks of blue.

So I looked into them, these are for raised reservoirs. Which have held half of London striking water. Being a practical person, I thought to myself there's not many votes there. I secondly thought to myself, I can't really build any houses there because Spelthorne is 67% greenbelt and water and a large chunk of the rest of it is floodplain. So it is very difficult to know what we might do in terms of meeting our housing targets.

People get crammed onto the small island of where develop and can happen. I was determined to find something to utilise the 2,000 acres from the reservoir in my Spelthorne constituency. I looked into it a little further and came upon the concept of floating solar. This is a terribly simple concept. You simply take solar panels, you attach them to plastic floats, you anchor those floats to the bottom of the reservoir, and you strings and wires to take an AC current officer floating solar panels.

The clever bits in terms of the intellectual property are the anchors, because, as I'm sure honourable members across the House now, reservoirs generally tend to have about a metre that they vary in depth from time to time, and equally reservoirs are drained and assessed on about a 20 year rolling cycle. An delighted to

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give way. I thank my honourable and gallant friend for allowing me to intervene. friend for allowing me to intervene. We are told there is nothing new under the sun, but actually I think he is describing something that he is describing something that takes both of those boxes. Remarkable. I remember playing by Remarkable. I remember playing by the scenic reservoir in my hometown, I also read about it in geography I also read about it in geography class. It strikes me that one of the reasons reservoir levels rise and fall because of evaporation, fall because of evaporation, obviously water is a precious resource.

Does covering the resource. Does covering the reservoirs help with the evaporation?

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evaporation? My honourable friend pre-empts one of the benefits I'm going to highlight to the house in terms of highlight to the house in terms of floating solar, because he does remember his lessons well. The placing of floating solar reduces evaporation from that body that is evaporation from that body that is covered by 70%, 70%. Given that the covered by 70%, 70%. Given that the vast amount of water which is lost vast amount of water which is lost to evaporation on our reservoirs each year, if the government decides to pursue this at a grand scale we will save a great deal more water.

Part of my coming here today is to speak to two large constituencies within this House. There are 543 constituencies which have reservoirs or man-made water in them. Similarly, we have countless members from across the House who have very difficult decisions to make about putting solar farms on good agricultural land. Essentially what has happened is that the whole discussion in this area has become a zero-sum game, a battle between the battle for food security and energy security.

And there seems to be no way of unpicking that, until now. Globally, floating solar has been put to practical application at large-scale, in China and in India and in Vietnam. And the UK was actually a leader in this, because on the Queen Elizabeth II reservoir in 2016 a grand technology demonstrator was put on and plugged in. It has been banging out 6.3 MW into Thames water's own Thames water treatment facility ever since, enough to power 2,000 homes.

Given that it only covers less than 10% of that reservoir I'm sure honourable members can see the vast potential. I want to talk about some of the benefits of floating solar. Because they are legion. Firstly, and honourable members will have work this out already, there is the removal of the opportunity cost of putting floating solar panels on grade a agricultural land. If you don't have to put it all over Lincolnshire and you can put it on the reservoirs then that land can be used for growing food.

I would be

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delighted to give way. I'm very grateful. He is talking about the use of private about the use of private agricultural land, and food security agricultural land, and food security is part of national security, as is energy security and indeed water security. But there is this huge security. But there is this huge trend of prime agricultural land being devoted over to solar plants, including in my constituency of including in my constituency of Epping Forest. A new plan about to go in for a 237 acre plot between go in for a 237 acre plot between sawn wood and Epping Upland.

Would he agree with me, he's articulating he agree with me, he's articulating today about alternatives to where they can be placed. There are plenty of places up and down the land. Brownfield sites, reservoirs, railway sidings, rooftops of agricultural buildings. We must protect prime farmland and the greenbelt and make sure that solar panels are going in the right panels are going in the right

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panels are going in the right I agree. It is going to give hope across the House and therefore across the House and therefore across the country that this alternative solution to putting solar panels on to grade a solar panels on to grade a agricultural land can be to a certain extent in answer to a maiden's prayer. Not only will it remove the opportunity costs of putting it on agricultural land, one of the beauties of floating solar is that it is twice as efficient as the land-based system.

Land-based systems warmup because they are on the land. If they warmup they become less efficient. Whereas floating solar because of the evaporating effect on the underside automatically cool and remain 100% efficient throughout the sunny day.

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I'm grateful. As the honourable Member full-strength is not here, Member full-strength is not here, perhaps I can fill in. We have heard from one of my Essex colleagues about the land in Essex by a number of developments. Before the 2010 boundary changes I had a large boundary changes I had a large reservoir in my constituency which would be ideal for the technology would be ideal for the technology that my right honourable friend is suggesting. Does he believe there suggesting.

Does he believe there are many many hundreds of other areas across the country that are suited as well?

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suited as well? I do indeed. I wasn't 100% sure which minister would come to respond which minister would come to respond to this debate, so I have only had the briefest of moments to look at the lake in Burgess Park in the Minister's own packing constituency, to see whether that also might be to see whether that also might be suitable for floating solar. We talked about the opportunity costs. talked about the opportunity costs. We talked about the doubling of efficiency.

Also, and I'm sure honourable member's will have worked honourable member's will have worked this out, in my constituency, my this out, in my constituency, my 2000 acres of reservoir is raised which means no one can see the top of them unless they are taking off to Torremolinos or landing from Dubai. So none of that visual vandalism that people object to so much about carpeting our beautiful

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country in solar panels, that goes away. I thank my honourable and gallant

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I thank my honourable and gallant friend for giving way. I must also friend for giving way. I must also declare I do share an office with him and so I know an awful lot more about floating solar because he is about floating solar because he is so passionate about it. As a result, so passionate about it. As a result, I would like to point out that in my own Huntington constituency, we have the eighth largest reservoir in the the eighth largest reservoir in the country by volume and the third biggest by area.

It is also a raised reservoir. It is surrounded reservoir. It is surrounded ironically by solar panels that you can see from the ground. He obviously agrees with me would be a obviously agrees with me would be a fantastic idea to use that enormous stretch of water to inputs and

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floating solar. I am very grateful to my honourable and gallant Friend from Huntington for joining this merry band of evangelists for floating solar. And seeking to get in on the solar. And seeking to get in on the ground floor with the inclusion of his own reservoir in his own his own reservoir in his own constituency. Because, within minutes, he has immediately seen the

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minutes, he has immediately seen the opportunity. I congratulate him on that. Thank you to my honourable Friend. I'm happy to join this debate. It is not only amusing but very educational. For me, I think it also is a matter of great concern for this country to conserve the water supply we have. And therefore would you agree with me and it also stops the evaporation of water because of the direct sunlight, and it also conserves the water.

The honourable Member who I share the Defence Select Committee with X a very important point. In terms of future proofing the United Kingdom's water supply for increased temperatures, I understand that in Australia for example, reservoirs are being very expensively covered with shale in order to reduce evaporation. The honourable Member might know that, where floating solar panel exists, it reduces evaporation by 70%. In the case of the one on the Queen Elizabeth reservoir, it is 100 tons of water a day.

It is extraordinary. So, I know you are thinking it could not get any better. But I have to tell house any better. But I have to tell house there are still further benefits. So where these reservoirs are owned by water companies, and the water companies want to use the electricity themselves, there is no requirement for planning permission. If you consider the turmoil that land-based systems have to go through over many many years, whereas floating solar being deployed within a few weeks.

Compared to the absolute problems the nation put itself through for it

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puts a land-based system. I thank the member for giving way. This is another issue where way. This is another issue where this side of the house can give them this side of the house can give them more information to the government side. We have real issues in many parts of rural Britain around some of the energy infrastructure has to of the energy infrastructure has to go alongside solar farms, particularly where we are looking at massive new mega pylons was you can use the energy on site or the already existing energy of the structure that there often is around structure that there often is around reservoirs, of hydro and other reasons, isn't this a great example as to why actually floating solar

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as to why actually floating solar would be a real solution which everybody can get on board with? I think my honourable friend

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I think my honourable friend makes a fantastic point. The Queen Mary reservoir in my own Mary reservoir in my own constituency actually had a plug in points to the National Grid at one points to the National Grid at one end. And so minimising disruption that placing solar farms away from that placing solar farms away from where the power is needed is certainly something that can play into this as well. Honourable into this as well. Honourable members will think, that must be his list complete.

That must be all the benefits to floating solar because there can't be any more. But I say to the House, one of the most astonishing things about floating solar is that it improves the water quality underneath. Things which grow in the water, which the water companies subsequently have to filter out to make it Ready for you and your constituents, you Madam Deputy Speaker and indeed all members of the House in your constituents. The water companies have to use fewer filtering where the surface has been covered by floating solar.

We have covered the evaporating effect. And so, really I

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floating. He has made a very strong point about being able to use floating solar in order to obviate solar in order to obviate development on Green Belt land around other parts of the country. Is he aware that there is a Is he aware that there is a development proposed in my constituency for up to 1300 houses constituency for up to 1300 houses which is a major issue in a by- election ongoing in Wickford Park as we speak. Would he agree that in we speak.

Would he agree that in

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order to prevent the housing, people should vote for the excellent Conservative candidate before the polls close? My honourable and gallant Friend,

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My honourable and gallant Friend, we have gone from Cooper to Cooper. I'm delighted to follow his I'm delighted to follow his endorsement and wish everyone there the opportunity to get to the polls the opportunity to get to the polls today to exercise their democratic vote.

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vote. I thank him for giving way. I wonder if I may have stumbled across another advantage of floating solar another advantage of floating solar which may not have occurred to him and that is if the water quality is improving, with a not help the fish? I have reservoir in my constituency which has got some of the best pike fishing and I wonder if the fish

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fishing and I wonder if the fish might benefit from having a roof over their head? I visited the Queen Elizabeth II reservoir on Tuesday this week. I am not aware, it is a closed site owned by Thames Water, I'm not aware that there were any fish there. There is certainly birdlife. I think that is an important point to make that the general planning law and modelling has been done on only covering 15 % of the reservoirs.

In order to leave sufficient space for leisure use including fishing no doubt. And also for bird life. The ones I saw on the Queen Elizabeth II on Tuesday were warming themselves very happily on the floating solar panels. Because of course by being on them, they are predator free. Because nothing can attack them. How big could this be, I hear the House rule. I thank the honourable lady. If I say the installed base of every single solar panel in the United Kingdom is producing 17 GW, then if I were to say that we covered 15% of man-made reservoirs in this country, we would double the national capacity.

Adding a further 16 GW without touching an inch of agricultural land. Absolutely extraordinary. In so doing, it would create 80,000 jobs in the construction phase, and 8000 jobs in the maintenance phase. And so my plea to the Minister, who I know is putting the finishing touches to the government solar roadmap, that floating solar plays a much greater part than it did in the first draft. I am very grateful to my honourable friend, I hope this has been educational, informative, and they are fully signed up to the floating solar brother in an system which will go forward from this place and evangelise for the good cause.



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Minister. Thank you Madam Deputy Speaker. I would like to thank the honourable would like to thank the honourable and gallant Friend and for securing a debate on this important issue. a debate on this important issue. And for prosecuting his argument in this case for floating solar with this case for floating solar with such flourish. I would also like to such flourish. I would also like to put on record that the Minister for was desperate to be here and he is very sorry that he can't be here.

very sorry that he can't be here. I'm glad that I'm able to stand in his place. I am also glad that the honourable gentleman was able to honourable gentleman was able to make his speech because I know he was not able to intervene in the solar debate we last had. Let me start by saying, I absolutely agree, the government is very clear that, like the honourable and gallant Friend, we believe there is an Friend, we believe there is an exciting role for floating solar.

We think it is a new technology, but a technology that has a huge amount of technology that has a huge amount of potential. Developers around the potential. Developers around the world have started to come forward with utility scale proposals in the last decade. And several large projects have been conducted in projects have been conducted in recent years was the this includes installations the capacity to generate hundreds of megawatts of electricity, and these have been mainly in China. The honourable and gallant Friend woman has very effectively set out the upsides of floating solar so I won't reiterate them.

But put on record that we agree and recognise many of those upsides. Let me say a bit about the state of floating solar today and the UK. There has been some deployment of floating solar in the UK, like a project on the Queen Elizabeth II reservoir which is just near an outside his constituency. This uses 24,000 solar panels to generate around 20% of the site's electricity needs. At the time of construction, it was Europe's largest floating solar installation.

There are other smaller projects around the country. But the scale is still very nascent and limited.

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I thank the Minister for giving way. We have heard about a large reservoir in my own constituency was the just to the north of my contingency in North East Cambridgeshire we are about to start Cambridgeshire we are about to start building the fence reservoir. I'm building the fence reservoir. I'm sure this will be away to the joint project between Cambridge Water and Anglia Water. It will be 50,000,000 Anglia Water. It will be 50,000,000 m in size. And the consent order is expected to go in 2026 with construction starting in 2029.

Would she agree that it is a fantastic opportunity to be able to try out this nascent technology on such a large project which could generate large project which could generate

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large project which could generate Thank you to the honourable gentleman. There are many schemes, there are huge opportunities and the there are huge opportunities and the government is working with industry to think of what the potential is to think of what the potential is across the country. And new proposals are coming forward at the moment, we are trying to engage with moment, we are trying to engage with those proposals. Look, what I would say is whereas we see there is huge potential it's also important to put that in the context of some of the that in the context of some of the challenges we have as we try to grow solar.

We are trying to do our part to work with industry, trying to make sure we deal with some of the obstacles and barriers to schemes coming forward, for example planning or investment uncertainty. Which is why floating solar projects can apply to the government's flagship Contracts for Difference team, and they do. I know that one of the arguments being put forward on arguments being put forward on floating solar which the honourable gentleman raised, reiterated by other honourable members, is that it reduces the amount of land that we need to use.

And the arguments have been made about agricultural land and constraining the amount of solar that is on them. The thing I would gently say is that if we look at the statistics only 0.1% of land in the UK is covered by ground mounted solar at the moment. A minuscule amount. I will give way in a moment. Even with the expansion that we are actively trying to encourage, we are talking about a fraction of UK land that will only ever be used for ground mounted solar.

So it's

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important to put it in context. She is right to point to the figures, but this is only growing. figures, but this is only growing. One of the difficulties with the One of the difficulties with the land that goes under solar panels is that it tends to be south facing land, prime agricultural land. This is a growing problem I think.

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is a growing problem I think. I recognise the point the honourable member has made, but even honourable member has made, but even with the expansion we are still talking about a fraction of land. Inevitably, local authority across
16:17
Miatta Fahnbulleh Portrait Miatta Fahnbulleh MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State (Department for Energy Security and Net Zero) (Peckham, Labour )
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Inevitably, local authority across local authority, regional government and local government will make a judgement about the land they protect. Everyone recognises we must have prime agricultural land because we need it, so we are making decisions and local government will

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make decisions in that context. I would just point out to the

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I would just point out to the Minister that she could save herself a vast amount of political pain, because apart from some swans that I saw and a couple of Seagulls and one saw and a couple of Seagulls and one man from the Royal Society for the protection of birds, there ain't many people who are going to complain about putting floating solar on reservoirs.

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solar on reservoirs. I'm always in the market for less pain! Let me say a little bit about pain! Let me say a little bit about some of the constraints, because we have had eligible bids submitted to our Contracts for Difference scheme. Unfortunately none of these have Unfortunately none of these have been successful, that's because the cost of floating solar are about 10 cost of floating solar are about 10 to 15% higher than ground mounted projects. The reason for this is the cost of floating structures on which cost of floating structures on which the panels sit, we hear from the sector these can account for more sector these can account for more than half of the project.

Also expensive underwater cables that cost more than land based systems. Although we are very keen to Although we are very keen to encourage this technology and encourage the sector to grow, there is more that needs to be done in order to make it cost effective. From a government perspective it's absolutely critical that every scheme we have and every project we support is cost-effective, so that bill payers are not footing the bill for technology that is too

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expensive. She's making a powerful argument

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She's making a powerful argument for a look again at the CFD scheme, the contract for difference scheme which is notorious for being difficult. A two-pronged approach difficult. A two-pronged approach here, some changes to CFD and obviously the technology associated with solar is moving on all the

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with solar is moving on all the time, perhaps the two could come together. Thank you for that intervention. We will always keep this under We will always keep this under review, the key for me is that we must continue to work. We recognise must continue to work. We recognise the potential of the technology and we want to continue to work with we want to continue to work with industry to make sure we bring costs down. Because as you say, there are reservoirs and waterways where this is a potential, and can also be a painless potential.

We can help unlock the technology there is absolutely appetite on the part of absolutely appetite on the part of the government to do this. One of the things we are trying to do is invest in the R&D and research around this, we are putting government support and investment to government support and investment to unlock that. The final thing I would say is on the solar task force, which the honourable and gentlemen mentioned. We are working at pace in order to deliver the recommendations order to deliver the recommendations of the task force.

This is really effectively brought together industry and government to discuss action needed to expand solar deployment in line with our 2030 clean power mission. The task force identified the need for the roadmap to address the specific barriers to floating solar and other innovative technologies. A particular subgroup has been convened to focus on this very specific topic.

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I don't know if the task force has engaged with the company that has engaged with the company that runs the Queen Elizabeth one from Bluefield, a very clever one. They Bluefield, a very clever one. They did write to the Secretary of State earlier in the year, some four months ago, and have yet to receive months ago, and have yet to receive a reply. I would be grateful to know whether the government is engaging with Bluefield and whether I can

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with Bluefield and whether I can nudge the Secretary of State to reply to the letter. Thank you to the honourable

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Thank you to the honourable gentleman. The nudge has been taken, I will pass this on to the Minister I will pass this on to the Minister of energy. As a department we are trying to engage extensively with trying to engage extensively with industry as we think about how to take forward complex and very difficult challenges as we try to difficult challenges as we try to deliver our clean power mission. If there are companies and organisations that can lend their insights and knowledge to help us insights and knowledge to help us develop better policy, we are always in the market for that so I will in the market for that so I will pass on that nudge.

Just to say that pass on that nudge. Just to say that we are finishing the final touches to the solo roadmap, is due to be published very soon. Whilst I won't published very soon. Whilst I won't obviously disclose the detail of it, I just want to assure honourable members that the question of, this question will be addressed within the solo roadmap. Let me finish by saying we recognise floating solar is an exciting area. We think it has huge potential for deployment here in the UK.

We are seeing the technology being deployed more broadly in other countries, we want to be part of that. The honourable gentleman has talked about the benefits, whether that is to the grid, water quality, consumers in terms of electricity, and ultimately for climate change. There is very much to like, the challenge for us is to work with industry to make sure we can unlock the potential. That's about reducing the cost, ensuring its cost-effective and ensuring we can deploy this technology.

My one commitment I will make on behalf of the government is that we will always engage with industry as we do this. We want the innovation, we want the insights and the experience of the right and the best as we try to build up our clean power sector to unlock the potential

**** Possible New Speaker ****

we believe is there. The question is that this house do now adjourn. As many as are of do now adjourn. As many as are of that opinion, say, "Aye". The ayes
16:29
None Portrait Oral questions: Transport
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