RNLI Bicentenary

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Tuesday 26th March 2024 Westminster Hall

[Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mrs Harris. I congratulate my hon. Friend and constituency neighbour the Member for Totnes (Anthony Mangnall) on securing this debate, and I thank my colleagues on the Backbench Business Committee for agreeing to it.

It is very apt to be celebrating the 200th anniversary of the RNLI, given the role that it plays for communities in south Devon. The Torbay RNLI has been operating since 1866, serving commercial merchantman traffic and keeping holidaymakers and those visiting the south coast safe. The organisation has been at the heart of the community since then; it is based on volunteering and on funding and support from the community.

It is easy to see why the RNLI is such a loved institution when we hear the stories of its members’ heroism. In Torbay we have Keith Bower, who I think is one of only three living holders of the RNLI gold medal for conspicuous gallantry. Other Members have already referred to those crew members who sadly lost their lives, but there have been many occasions on which volunteers will have absolutely pushed to the limits what they could do to save someone in distress. It is right that we pay tribute and remember them. It was great to see Keith at the heart of the recent service of thanksgiving at Westminster Abbey, in recognition of the role that so many play, in extreme conditions, to try to save the lives of people they will probably never have met. They go out of their way to bring them home safe, for them and their families.

My hon. Friend the Member for Totnes and I have an interesting debate about the Torbay RNLI, because the station on land is in Brixham, which is part of his constituency, but the boat is moored in the waters of Brixham harbour, which—due to the anomalies in how Torbay runs its harbour authority—is part of mine. But the RNLI is loved across the bay. At the event on 4 March, the fleet was out and being saluted by so many people on land, as well as those on the waters who rely on and are reassured by its constant presence.

It is worth noting that the RNLI Torbay lifeboat fundraising team are the ones helping to sustain the crew at the front. We have a song written by Roger Smith to commemorate and celebrate the 200th anniversary; there is also a whole network that exists throughout the year and raises vital funds to support the team we see out on the water.

It is also worth noting how the RNLI supports the wider work of the community. We think immediately of emergency call-outs when someone is in distress and a lifeboat is called out to identify them and bring them back to safety, but a range of other things can happen. There is always a moment for reflection when I am about to do the Boxing day walk into the sea at Paignton sands and I see the lifeboat pull up beforehand; the RNLI effectively provides a safety boat. It is a slightly thought-provoking moment: I sit there thinking, “Is this the best decision I’ve ever made?” as I am about to walk into freezing cold water, with the lifeboat pulling up to keep us safe. It shows what the RNLI does for the wider community: it is not just about emergencies, but about providing the safety and support that such events need. That allows thousands of pounds to be raised for other charities and for fundraising in the community, as well as being an opportunity to get rather cold on Boxing day, if that helps to shake off anything from the day before.

In its 200-year history, the RNLI has been supported by other institutions that contribute towards its efforts and share its goals. It is well worth mentioning the National Coastwatch Institution Torbay and its station up at Daddyhole plain, which works closely with RNLI Torbay. They are both committed to exactly the same purpose of keeping those who use the waters around our bay safe.

The RNLI is an institution that has been well loved and well supported for 200 years. It shows the best of our communities and ensures that they are safe even in the most perilous of conditions. It has had a successful 200 years in which it has gone from strength to strength. I see no reason why it will not go on to further success over the next 200 years, with many thousands more lives saved.

Railway Ticket Offices

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Wednesday 13th September 2023 Westminster Hall

[Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Davies. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for West Dorset (Chris Loder) on securing the debate. In a longer session, it would be worth looking at how things such as contactless travel could be extended, particularly incorporating railcards into that offer.

In the time I have, I will focus on the situation at the ticket offices at Torquay and Paignton stations. Although the national average is about 15%, the consultation document confirms that at Paignton 41.3% of tickets were sold at the ticket office. The high percentage of passengers purchasing a ticket at this ticket office shows that demand and need for this service are still strong. It may partly reflect the fact that Paignton and the neighbouring areas are communities with a higher than average percentage of people aged over 70, who may be unfamiliar with online booking methods. Similarly, many tourists use the ticket office not just to buy a ticket but to clarify which tickets are available and the validity of their tickets, and use some of the GroupSave options that may be harder to get from a machine.

At Torquay station, 29.4% of tickets are still sold at the office, but I recognise that the situation is far from ideal for passengers. The ticket office is on the down platform, from which the only destination is Paignton station. Most people therefore depart from the up platform, which has the self-service ticket machine—though often with a large waste bin right behind it—no indoor waiting area and no staff facilities whatever.

I hope that, as part of this process, the Minister will look at feedback about facilities as well as the ticket office issue. I would be particularly interested to hear from him whether the response will be a blanket one, or one that considers the situation at each station. Will thresholds be considered to give more clarity to the level of usage that would see a ticket office retained, and will there be action where the consultation highlights issues such as a lack of other suitable facilities at a station?

Restoring Your Railway Fund

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Tuesday 24th January 2023 Westminster Hall

[Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered the Restoring Your Railway Fund.

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mrs Cummins. First, I thank my colleagues on the Backbench Business Committee for agreeing to schedule this timely debate.

The name Dr Beeching evokes strong passions even 60 years after the publication of his first report, and the very fact that I do not have to mention the subject or the title of the report, simply his name, speaks to the special place our railways hold in the nation’s heart and the impact of the proposals that followed. No other mode of transport can evoke such passion or interest, and while more people use buses than trains, it is rare that anyone becomes as engaged in a discussion about a new No. 3 or No. 12 as they do in talking—at length—about the prospects of restoring a piece of track that last saw a train long before many of us were born.

We refer to the Beeching era, but Britain’s railways were contracting before Beeching arrived. For example, in Devon alone, the line to Princetown closed in 1958 and the line to Yealmpton closed to passengers as far back as 1947, but Beeching’s first report on reshaping Britain’s railways is, for many, the key moment. The report has seared his name into our national memory, and it defined an era for our railways. Of 18,000 miles of railway, Beeching recommended that 6,000 miles be closed and 2,363 station closures, both on lines set to close and on lines he proposed remain open.

There are lots of debates about whether different approaches could have been tried, not least reducing costs on lines rather than closing them, but those debates are for the rail historians. We know that today, across Britain, there are viable schemes ready to reconnect communities to our rail network. When people talk about what had been the signs of decline in a once-prosperous town, many local residents include in the list the words, “Then the station closed.” A rail service is often seen as a sign of literally being on track to better prospects. Hence the excitement when a long-lost service returns.

[Paul Howell (Sedgefield) (Con)]

Ferryhill station in my constituency was removed in 1964 when I lived there, although there is still a freight line. The station is symptomatic of the area’s need to regenerate and redevelop. Does my hon. Friend agree that any consideration of whether a bid should succeed must be cognisant of the impact on the people of the area, not just the mathematics that go with it?

[Kevin Foster]

I could not agree more with my hon. Friend, who is a strong champion for his constituents on the matter. Where once there was a station and now there is a space or an empty building, or just freight trains trundling past, people sense that they might have been left behind, so reopening stations, particularly in locations such as the one he mentioned, is one of the best signs that levelling up could offer to show that the agenda across Government is about giving communities back what they had in the past. We are not going to reintroduce steam trains, but we do want to give people a modern, functional service that points towards an aspiration for a better future.

With respect to such opportunities, the pledge in our 2019 manifesto, which forms the basis of the Government’s mandate, was explicit:

“To help communities across the country, we will restore many of the Beeching lines, reconnecting smaller towns such as Fleetwood and Willenhall that have suffered permanent disadvantage since they were removed from the rail network in the 1960s.”

In January 2020, colleagues across the House will have welcomed the Government translating that pledge into £500 million for the restoring your railway programme to deliver the manifesto commitment, which I know was firm when my right hon. Friend the Member for Uxbridge and South Ruislip (Boris Johnson) was Prime Minister. I know the Minister will be keen to repeat it today.

I want to ensure that the commitment remains firm not because I am sentimental about the days when steam trains raced from London Waterloo to Tavistock, but because of what we see when lines reopen and communities reconnect. For example, the revitalisation of the line to Okehampton has brought full passenger services to the town for the first time in five decades. It was the first former line to reopen under the restoring your railway programme. In the same week that it celebrated its one-year anniversary in November, the Dartmoor line also saw its 250,00th journey—more than double the demand originally forecast.

Then there is the Scottish Borders railway, for which an original target was set of 650,000 passengers in the first year, but demand for the service exceeded expectations with almost 700,000 trips made in just the first six months of the line reopening. In short, new lines bring new trade to the railways and provide an attractive alternative to travel by car or coach. The Minister saw for himself the achievements at Okehampton and the excitement of the local community at having its train service back. We would simply not get that with a new road junction or a bus service.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

I thank my hon. Friend for giving way and congratulate him on leading this important debate. In Cumbria we have been pushing for the reopening of the Penrith to Keswick line and of Gilsland station. My hon. Friend mentioned the Borders railway, which we want extended through Longtown in my constituency and down into Carlisle. Does he agree that opening up those projects not only connects people to physical places, but increases economic opportunities and access to education and empowers rural communities?

[Kevin Foster]

I could not put it better. Transport systems are not just about an academic exercise of connecting point A to point B, but about linking communities, providing opportunities and levelling up communities. Instead of looking back to a service that existed until the late 1960s, we should look forward to the opportunities. My hon. Friend is a very strong advocate for his constituents and I know he will push the Government on that scheme.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Kevin Foster]

It would be rude not to give way to probably the most regular attender at 9.30 am on a Tuesday.

[Jim Shannon]

I commend the hon. Gentleman for securing this debate. It is a real pleasure to intervene on him, whom I see as a very dear friend. My constituency used to have a railway line, but now has no railway whatever. Does the hon. Member not agree that it makes no sense for any constituency to have less public transport at a time when we are encouraging people to ditch their cars and make changes to help the environment? It takes investment. If the Government are serious, the funding must also be serious.

[Kevin Foster]

The hon. Gentleman puts it well and reminds us that in the Beeching era many communities went from having train services to numerous destinations to literally having none. We have mentioned the example of the Scottish Borders railway. After the closure of the Waverley route, certain communities became some of the furthest away from the mainline network. Train services provide people with different choices and opportunities. It is safe to say that the people of Strangford can be reassured that if there is any prospect of getting a train service back to Strangford, the hon. Gentleman will regularly pursue it in this place until it happens.

I am conscious that there are many requests for new lines and stations across the country. In June, the Government published a restoring your railway fund programme update with details of all successful and unsuccessful bids. In total, the programme update listed 44 successful schemes, which are at different stages, and 23 schemes are being funded to develop a strategic outline business case—one of the earlier stages in considering a transport intervention. Thirteen schemes that had already developed a SOBC are being supported to develop further, and eight schemes are being delivered. Of those, the Dartmoor line between Okehampton and Exeter has already reopened.

The schemes stretch across the country, ranging from the Northumberland line reopening to the new Thanet Parkway station in Kent, plus St Clears station in Wales and the White Rose station in Yorkshire. As evidenced today, many other communities want to join them. Many communities who were not successful at first now hope to join them in future rounds.

In some areas the dreams of restoring a railway service will come up against the harsh realities of previous track beds having been lost or development having taken over where a line once cut through. What might in the early 1970s have been a relatively easy job of re-laying track will now mean cutting a new track bed through previously untouched countryside. I know from my brief time in the Department for Transport about the issues with restoring the key section of the Varsity line between Cambridge and Bedford, given the short-sighted decisions of past generations to build over the old track bed. The modern realities of development since the line closed mean a different realignment is needed. It is interesting to note that this is one railway that Dr Beeching proposed to keep open in his infamous report, with the mistake of closure being clear almost from the time it was implemented.

In many locations where enthusiasts or a local council have sought to preserve the dream that trains would one day come back down the track to them, reopening former lines can offer excellent value for money. We can also benefit from the quality of railway engineering in the Victorian era. The report on the former line from Bere Alston to Tavistock, more than 40 years after its closure, found that many of the key structures were in fairly good condition, despite not having been maintained for decades. Think of how each pound spent on the restoring your railway programme delivers popularity and inspiration for the local community. Then think how HS2 developers must dream of getting anywhere near that with the tens of billions being spent on that.

The Minister will not be surprised to hear me talk of the opportunity to do just that in my own constituency. The former Goodrington Sands station lies only a few hundred metres from the railhead that marks the end of the Network Rail track, and has done since the line from nearby Paignton station to Kingswear closed. It is not the derelict building that some hon. Members might now be picturing in their minds. Since 1972, it has operated successfully as part of the Dartmouth Steam Railway, with its platforms still in very good condition.

Goodrington station provides a great example, not just of preserving the past, but of an opportunity for the future. Given the Network Rail track nearby, it is possible to create a track route, entirely separate from the operations of the steam railway, to Goodrington from Paignton. That would allow a new platform to be created alongside the heritage station, with accessibility provided by stairs and a lift to the road bridge that passes over the site. Whereas parking is limited at Paignton, there are large car parks near Goodrington station, which are often only used in the summer peak season.

Those ingredients, alongside the presence of a large beach and leisure facilities around the former station, provide a tempting chance directly to reconnect communities nearby and facilitate a parkway-style access to the rail network. Despite the obvious attractions of that plan, plus support from the local community, the spirit of the Beeching era lived on in the coalition of Lib Dem and independent councillors currently running Torbay Council, who objected to the bid for restoring your railway funds. It was disappointing to note their opposition, and the way they assumed they could get an officer to write to MPs, simply demanding we withdraw a bid, as they had said no. As some will know, such ill-judged actions merely provoked not compliance but scorn from me, my hon. Friend the Member for Totnes (Anthony Mangnall) and many local residents.

The restoring your railway programme is not just about reopening lines closed during the Beeching era. It is also providing entirely new stations, such as the one being built at Marsh Barton, which I passed on the train when I travelled up yesterday, and the very welcome Edginswell station in Torquay, where preparatory works are under way ahead of the main construction work starting later this year. Having asked many questions about that project of previous Rail Ministers, I welcome the new stations fund and the Torquay town deal supporting it: the first new station in Torbay since the war, delivered by a Conservative team.

I could be here a long time, listing individual schemes and opportunities for reopening, and I suspect we will hear quite a few more as the debate progresses. Yet the purpose of this debate is not just to put in a pitch for a local scheme, although this is a good opportunity for colleagues to ensure that the Minister has heard the exact benefits a scheme will bring for their local area. There are a few points it would be good for the Minister to respond to.

The first is the easiest: to confirm that the Government remain committed to the vision of reversing Beeching-era cuts, giving communities new train services, as set out in our 2019 manifesto, and the £500 million previously agreed. Secondly, what work will the Government do to support groups and MPs looking to bid where a local council retains the spirit of the Beeching era and decides to object, but the community is positive? Thirdly, what assessment of the value delivered with these projects will be used to capture the full impact for the community of being reconnected to the rail network?

As I said at the start, the fact that we can mention one man’s name 60 years after his report was published shows how the railway closures affected so many communities. For the first time in decades, many communities can now talk about railways as part of their future, not just something they reminisce about from the past. That is what the restoring your railway scheme is about. It is the ultimate prize from levelling up, and it is vital that the commitment shown to it by the Government’s 2019 manifesto continues.

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Foster]

This has been a welcome debate, although I do not think I should take the 22 minutes that are still available for what is supposed to be a short winding-up speech. I am particularly grateful for the Minister’s replies about the Government’s continuing commitment to the scheme overall and to the budget, particularly given some recent press speculation.

The railways seem to be in a different position today, compared with what we saw in the past. Given some of the comments made during the debate, I am sure the Minister has, like me, been reflecting on the fact that it is only 17 years ago that a Transport Secretary was saying that the railways

“can’t be in the business of carting fresh air around the country”.

That was widely interpreted as potentially heralding another round of Beeching-style cuts, whereby we would build a big new railway in the form of HS2 but shut down rural branch lines. It is great to hear from my hon. Friend the Minister the positivity and vision about the future of the railways, and that they really connect communities and are not just a transport scheme that sits in aspic.

[Dr Hudson]

I congratulate my hon. Friend again on securing the debate. Does he agree that programmes such as reopening the Penrith to Keswick line, reopening Gilsland station and extending the Borders railway through Longtown to Carlisle would feed into the west coast main line? Should not the Government take the two-pronged approach of restoring those links and holding Avanti West Coast to account for the unacceptable service on the west coast main line?

[Kevin Foster]

I am conscious that I could probably start a whole new debate by getting on to the subject of Avanti trains and their performance. However, I agree that the line brings a sense of Union connectivity; communities in the borders areas do not operate on the basis of the political dividing line between England and Scotland, but very much work together. Reopening the railway line my hon. Friend mentioned would be a great sign of that, and I know that he will continue to be a major champion of it.

We should reflect on the fact that there is the potential for a renaissance in our railways. It would have been easy today to focus on current disputes and not to look at the great future we have. We are seeing major investment and large-scale electrification on our rail network for the first time in decades. People can again look forward to a railway being part of their future, and not just something that their grandad or grandmother tells them about using in the past.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That this House has considered the Restoring Your Railway Fund.

Lifeboat Services: Search and Rescue

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Tuesday 10th January 2023 Westminster Hall

[Philip Davies (in the Chair)]

I am from Yorkshire, so I consider it oppressively hot in here; if people wish to remove their jackets, they are free to do so. I call Kevin Foster to move the motion.

[Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered the contribution of lifeboat services to search and rescue.

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Davies. I am grateful to my colleagues on the Backbench Business Committee for granting me this debate, and of course to my hon. Friend the Member for Totnes (Anthony Mangnall), who did the legwork on the application to secure it.

It is worth giving some context at the debate’s start. Search and rescue provision in the UK is delivered through an amalgam of Government Departments, emergency services and various SAR charities and voluntary organisations. UK SAR is arranged through the UK SAR Strategic Committee, an interdepartmental body chaired by the Department for Transport, hence our being joined by a DFT Minister and his shadow. His Majesty’s Coastguard provides a response and co-ordination service for air and sea-based SAR in the UK. HM Coastguard has existed since 1822, and of course celebrated its bicentenary last year. The coastguard co-ordinates air and sea-based SAR through its nine operation centres around the UK. They are in Shetland, Aberdeen, Humber, Dover, Fareham, Falmouth, Milford Haven, Holyhead, Belfast and Stornoway. In addition, the London coastguard, which is co-located with the Port of London authority, looks after SAR on the River Thames. HM Coastguard has its national maritime operations centre in Fareham in Hampshire.

Lifeboats are not the only part of SAR at sea; many organisations, including the Royal Navy, Royal Air Force, commercial vessels in the vicinity of an incident and HM Coastguard’s helicopters, play their part, but in this debate, I will focus on the lifeboat service. The classic image of the lifeboat service is one of heroism, and of its crews fighting through rough seas to save lives. The courage of those involved, and their commitment to saving those in peril on the sea, are the anchor that holds the crew together during a rescue mission while, in the words of the famous hymn,

“the breakers roar and the reef is near”.

No debate such as this should pass without mention of how that legendary bravery was demonstrated on 19 December 1981, when the Penlee lifeboat headed out into atrocious conditions to try to save the lives of eight people in peril. Tragically, all eight lifeboat crew were lost that night. It was the last time the Royal National Lifeboat Institution lost a whole crew in one incident—a record that I am sure we hope will stand for many years to come.

It is of course the RNLI that most people will think of when they hear a reference to lifeboats. It was founded as the Royal National Institution for the Preservation of Lives and Property from Shipwreck in 1824. In 1854, it changed its name to what we know it as today. Its main base is in Poole, Dorset. It has 238 lifeboat stations, and an active fleet of 431 lifeboats, which range from large, all-weather lifeboats to smaller inshore vessels.

The impact of the RNLI’s work cannot be overestimated. Its operations have saved over 143,900 lives since 1824, and it is not just men who have been the heroes: Grace Darling became one of the Victorian era’s most celebrated heroines when, on 7 September 1838, she risked her life to rescue the stranded survivors of the wrecked steamship Forfarshire. Today, around 95% of the RNLI team are volunteers; they are around 5,600 crew members, 3,700 shore crew, including station management, 82 lifeguards, and 23,000 fundraisers. The scale of the RNLI’s contribution to search and rescue is immense. In 2021 alone, there were 8,868 lifeboat launches, 84 of which were in at least force 8 conditions, and 1,022 crew assemblies—a total of 9,890 taskings. That resulted in 12,903 people being aided, and 296 lives being saved.

The RNLI’s work is about not just reacting when things go wrong, but reducing the need for search and rescue by educating and advising on dangers. RNLI water safety teams reached more than 27 million people in 2021 with essential messaging, undoubtedly saving more lives and keeping families together.

We should bear in mind that lifeboat services are not just about the RNLI—a subject that is close to the heart of my hon. Friend the Member for Totnes. In addition to the RNLI, a number of voluntary organisations provide independent lifeboats for the purpose of saving lives on the water. There are more than 50 independent lifeboat organisations around the UK, and independent lifeboats operate in coastal areas—for example, the Hope Cove lifeboat in south Devon—and on inland waters, rivers and lakes, while some organisations operate independent lifeboats alongside other search and rescue services, such as mud rescue. The majority of those independent lifeboats are equipped, maintained and operated in accordance with the rescue boat code.

Independent lifeboat organisations vary greatly in size, crew numbers, rescue numbers and types of rescue boat used. Crews range from the 12 crew members at Port William Inshore Rescue Service in Dumfries and Galloway to the around 260 crew members at Community Rescue Service, which operates across Northern Ireland; and call-outs range from the five call-outs in 2021 for the Sea Palling independent lifeboat in Norfolk to more than 120 for the Hamble lifeboat in Hampshire. The rescue boats involved range from small RIBs—rigid inflatable boats—to large all-weather lifeboats, which are comparable to the boats that many people associate with the RNLI.

[Bob Seely (Isle of Wight) (Con)]

My hon. Friend is making an excellent speech and I thank him for doing so. He is making important points about independent lifeboats, but also about the support services. We have independent lifeboats at Freshwater, Sandown and Shanklin in the Isle of Wight, which do wonderful work, on top of the RNLI stations at Bembridge, Cowes and Yarmouth. Not only that, but our inshore lifeboat centre in East Cowes keeps half the nation’s fleet of RNLI boats in good condition. Will my hon. Friend join me in paying tribute to those services?

[Kevin Foster]

I am delighted to hear my hon. Friend list the amazing support that the Isle of Wight provides. It does not just save lives and help those in peril on the sea around the Island—as he knows, some of those waters famously present obstacles and risks to passing shipping, and it is worth paying tribute to the many Islanders over the years who have put their life at risk trying to save those in peril near the Island—but makes a wider contribution to the service. As he says, lifeboat services are not just about the team who go out on the boat; they are about the support network that enables the lifeboat teams to go out. It is great to be able to pay it the tribute that he just did.

Independent lifeboats are not a new invention, and the first independent lifeboat station was formed in Formby, Lancashire, in 1776. Although many independent lifeboat stations were RNLI stations when they were established, others have been set up in response to specific incidents. For example—I see colleagues from Northern Ireland in the Chamber—Foyle Search and Rescue was set up by local people in 1993 in response to the alarmingly high number of drownings in the River Foyle, 30 in 18 months. It has since adopted a role in suicide prevention and supporting families in the city more widely. That shows the diversity in the types of work that such organisations can take on, and the contribution that such services can make.

It is right that we remember the contribution that those organisations make, and how their work is supported by the National Independent Lifeboat Association, a new charity founded last year by my hon. Friend the Member for Totnes. All independent lifeboats in Great Britain and Northern Ireland were invited to join the association, and it has 30 members from England, Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland and Jersey.

During my preparations for the debate, it was made clear to me that the RNLI is proud of its independence and the fact that it can operate free from requirements of the type that Government funding would bring. I was advised of that in the knowledge that such debates can sometimes involve the subject of whether the service offered by the RNLI should be publicly funded, rather than our having the current funding arrangements, which are based on voluntary giving.

It might seem strange to some, but this service is not lobbying for Government funding. That position recalls the fact that, a decade ago, a former Prime Minister described his vision of creating a big society—a concept in which individuals come together to tackle an issue or make a difference, rather than the state setting up structures to intervene that might often be less effective or efficient. There are often debates about how that concept can be defined in real life, but in many ways lifeboat services reflect that idea, from the crews who volunteer their time to train, and who are ready to answer the call of duty, to fundraising teams in communities who raise the resources needed to support operations, to the many community members who do their bit by simply dropping a few coins into a collection box when they buy a pint, visit the local shop or walk past one of the many collection boxes across coastal communities. Also included are people who, when thinking about the legacy they want to leave, tell their solicitor to include the lifeboat service in their will. This shows how society comes together to help others in need, and to provide a unique service that we can all benefit from, but hope never to need.

Those who regularly hear me speak know that I will not miss an opportunity to highlight the work being done in south Devon, and I will start with the Torbay RNLI lifeboat station. It was established in Brixham in 1866 and has occupied the same premises since 1872. It was established after a fleet of merchant ships were caught in hurricane-strength winds in Torbay in January 1866, causing the loss of about 40 ships and nearly 100 lives. Today, the lifeboat station has 35 crew members, including those who are shore-based. The station operates two lifeboats that reflect the diversity of the rescues that the station may be called on to perform: a Severn class all-weather lifeboat and a D-class inshore lifeboat. The crew members are volunteers who mostly have day jobs.

In 2022, Torbay RNLI lifeboat station responded to 111 shouts. The station is supported by the Torbay Lifeboat Fundraisers, who work throughout the year to raise the funds needed to support the lifeboat. The group has over 200 volunteer members, and it organises a range of events and activities to raise money. I thank everyone in Torbay who supports them; the crew would not be ready to save lives without their contribution.

I pay tribute to the team at the National Coastwatch Institution in Torbay, who also play a part in search and rescue operations in south Devon. NCI watchkeepers, who are volunteers, provide eyes and ears along the coast, monitoring radio channels and providing a listening watch in poor visibility. When people get into trouble, NCI watchkeepers can alert His Majesty’s Coastguard and direct the appropriate rescue teams, including lifeboats, to the casualty. The NCI station at Torbay is one of over 50 such stations located around England and Wales. Located at Daddyhole plain, it is the first purpose-built NCI watch station. In January 2012, the station was given declared facility status, meaning that the station was not only fully operational, but fully recognised in search and rescue operations as having the same status as RNLI lifeboat stations. That shows the benefit of partnerships between organisations that save lives.

Lifeboats are as vital to search and rescue operations today as they were in the era when horses drew the boat to the launching point and the crew pulled on the oars against the high sea to reach a vessel in distress. Direct funding is not sought, but I am interested to learn from the Minister how he sees the future for our lifeboats, and on a couple of other points.

First, some independent lifeboats are not fully declared HM Coastguard rescue facilities, often because of the complex process that must be undertaken to become such a facility. Does the Minister see an opportunity to simplify the process, without compromising standards? Secondly, independent lifeboats are not represented on the UK SAR operators group, but hope to join the group later this year. Will he provide an update on that? Finally, how does he see the work of lifeboats and their contribution to search and rescue fitting into wider efforts to improve safety at sea?

The debate is a good opportunity to highlight the contribution of lifeboat services to UK search and rescue. As we speak, crews across the UK stand ready to answer the call to save those in peril; they are ready to face whatever dangers that may bring. They are some of the best of our nation, and I end with a simple message to them: thank you.

[Philip Davies (in the Chair)]

I remind hon. Members that they should bob if they wish to be called to speak in the debate.

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Foster]

It has been a very welcome debate, and it has been great to hear so many contributions, and so many tributes paid to volunteers, who are the backbone of lifeboat services. I particularly thank the hon. Member for Wythenshawe and Sale East (Mike Kane) and the Minister for their contributions, and it is a rare occasion when we see the hon. Member for Paisley and Renfrewshire North (Gavin Newlands) and my hon. Friend the Member for Moray (Douglas Ross) completely agreeing with each other.

This has been a good chance to pay tribute to those working in lifeboat services and remember their heroism. As I said in my speech, in the words of that great hymn,

“when the breakers roar and the reef is near”,

the lifeboat services go in and do their duty.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That this House has considered the contribution of lifeboat services to search and rescue.

Avanti West Coast Contract Renewal

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Tuesday 25th October 2022 Commons Chamber

[Cat Smith (Lancaster and Fleetwood) (Lab)]

(Urgent Question): To ask the Secretary of State for Transport if she will make a statement on her decision to renew the contract for Avanti West Coast to provide passenger services on the west coast main line.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Kevin Foster)]

On 7 October, a short-term contract was entered into with the incumbent operator for the West Coast Partnership. The contract extends the delivery of the West Coast Partnership and Avanti West Coast business for six months until 1 April 2023. This gives Avanti a clear opportunity to improve its services to the standard we and the public expect. The Government will then consider Avanti’s performance while finalising a national rail contract for consideration in relation to the route, alongside preparations by the operator of last resort should it become necessary for it to step in at the end of the extension period.

The primary cause of Avanti’s recent problems is a shortage of fully trained drivers. Avanti was heavily reliant on drivers volunteering to work additional days because of delays in training during covid. When volunteering suddenly all but ceased, Avanti was no longer able to operate its timetable. Nearly 100 additional drivers will enter formal service between April and December this year, and Avanti has begun to restore services, initially focusing on the Manchester and Birmingham routes.

From December, Avanti plans to operate 264 daily train services on weekdays, a significant step up from the circa 180 daily services at present. We need train services that are reliable and resilient to modern life. Although the company has taken positive steps to get more trains moving, it must do more to deliver certainty of service to its passengers. We will hold Avanti fully to account for things in its control, but this plan is not without risk and, importantly, requires trade union co-operation. The priority remains to support the restoration of services before making any long-term decisions.

In assessing options for a longer-term contract, the Secretary of State will consider factors including outcomes for passengers, value for money and the delivery of major projects and investment—in this case High Speed 2, given the links to its future delivery model. To put it simply, things must improve during this probation period for the contract to be further extended.

[Cat Smith]

I declare an interest, as I suspect many Members will, as a long-suffering traveller on the so-called rail service on the west coast main line.

By giving Avanti this six-month contract extension, after months of failure and rail chaos, this Government are frankly rewarding that failure. Avanti promised to improve services back in September, and instead it has gone and cut services, introduced this emergency timetable and almost entirely stopped selling tickets online.

The provision of reliable train services is essential for the economic growth and prosperity of more than half the UK’s population. I seek clarification on the metrics the Minister will use to assess improvement or, indeed, further failure, given that the bar is currently set so low. It is clear that the west coast franchise has been fundamentally mismanaged by Avanti. These significant failings mean that staff morale is at an all-time low, which is reflected in the industrial action taken by trade unions. Staff report being overworked and understaffed due to the company’s failure to recruit sufficient staff and fill vacancies. I understand that many station ticket offices are understaffed and, in many instances, the company is failing to meet its regulated ticket office opening hours. As the Government are so tightly managing this contract, what are they doing to resolve these industrial disputes and the issues affecting staff at Avanti?

It seems that the Government are intent on rewarding failure. Rather than bringing the franchise in-house, they have given Avanti an extension. The Government have given Avanti precisely the same management fee despite it running dozens fewer services. This means Avanti stands to receive fees, or profits, worth £6 million for this period. This profiteering is supported by the Government and paid for by taxpayers and passengers. Avanti is part-owned by the Italian Government, so why not the UK Government instead? We could then reinvest any surplus revenue in improving the network for passengers rather than seeing it seep out in profits. When will the Government stop rewarding Avanti’s failure and instead strip it of its franchise and bring the west coast main line back into public ownership?

[Kevin Foster]

What metrics will we use? As with all rail contract awards, the Government will act in accordance with the franchising policy statement made under section 26(1) of the Railways Act 1993, which is already publicly available, in assessing whether to award a new contract. As I have said a number of times from this Dispatch Box, we are clear that the current service is unacceptable and will look for significant improvements before April if we are to extend this contract any further.

I always say that bringing something in-house is not necessarily a magic bullet, as the hon. Member for Coventry South (Zarah Sultana) demonstrated with her recent tweet when travelling on London North Eastern Railway, which is operated by the operator of last resort. For example, there might be issues related to infrastructure, which is of course publicly owned.

Avanti has a plan for improvement and the significant restoration of services in December, and we are seeing new train drivers being trained. Of course, we are seeing the wider impact of industrial action on the network, on which we and the Opposition have very clear views. They support it one day and not the next.

We believe there is a credible plan. There is daily interaction between Avanti and the Department for Transport, with weekly interaction at the most senior level. Ministers are regularly updated, too. We are making sure that a firm eye is kept on this, and we receive regular representations from Members of this House on what needs to happen to ensure this line provides the type of service we all want to see.

[David Mundell (Dumfriesshire, Clydesdale and Tweeddale) (Con)]

I have previously raised my concern about the capacity of FirstGroup, which is a partner of Avanti that also operates the TransPennine service that has been absolutely appalling over recent months, particularly for my constituents who use Lockerbie station. Is the Minister clear that FirstGroup has the capacity both to operate TransPennine and be part of the Avanti partnership and, in both, achieve improvements on the currently unacceptable levels of service?

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Foster]

I have met FirstGroup to discuss the overall position of its franchise. It should be remembered that FirstGroup is also involved in running the Great Western Railway franchise, which runs fairly successfully in the south-west and Wales. Other parts of its operation are going relatively well, are well managed, are delivering good outcomes for customers and are supporting our agenda of growing the rail network. For example, GWR operates the Dartmoor line that was opened last year.

On TransPennine Express, we recognise that a number of factors have affected performance. Again, quite a lot of training is needed following the backlogs caused by covid and related to the line upgrades. It is clear that TransPennine Express services need to improve quite substantially. Again, we look to work with FirstGroup to get the type of improvement plan we want to see.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Minister, Tanmanjeet Singh Dhesi.

[Mr Tanmanjeet Singh Dhesi (Slough) (Lab)]

I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Lancaster and Fleetwood (Cat Smith) for securing this urgent question because Avanti West Coast’s continued abject failures are simply unacceptable. Over the course of its contract, Avanti has had the fewest trains on time, more complaints than any other operator and a wholesale failure to train new drivers, which has led to the mess we have to endure today. Despite this, Avanti has been rewarded with a contract extension. The Tories, as usual, are rewarding failure, yet there are gaping holes in the improvement plan announced alongside the contract extension, which will prolong passenger misery.

On the busiest main line in the country, at the busiest time of year, there is not a single bookable weekend service between November and Christmas—not one. The service reductions that the Government signed off were supposed to increase reliability, but they have done the exact opposite. Can the Minister explain today when services will be available to book and why the Transport Secretary failed to demand that as a condition of handing over millions in taxpayers’ cash? Avanti is being paid precisely the same management fee as under the previous contract, even though hundreds of services are not running—why? Travelling across the north is also becoming next to impossible. Today, more than 40 services on TransPennine Express have been cancelled. As my good friend the Mayor of West Yorkshire, Tracy Brabin, lamented to me:

“It’s chaos and the Government must intervene.”

So why are they planning to hand TPE an eight-year contract for this service in May? Perhaps the Minister can enlighten the House as to whether they are preventing a deal between TPE and the workforce which could improve services in the short term?

Today, what the public need to hear from the incoming Government—yet another Government—is a serious plan to get travel across the north back on track; they need to hear a plan to restore services. If the Government cannot get that, they must withdraw the contract, because passengers are sick and tired of excuses.

[Kevin Foster]

We have been clear that the current position with services is unacceptable and we expect significant improvements. Long-term contract award decisions will be affected if, as we approach them, the service day to day is not where it should be. The management fees that are paid are specified in the contracts for operating. That said, the performance fee, to which the hon. Gentleman was perhaps also referring, for Avanti for the period beyond the withdrawal of rest-day working and the current timetable reductions is due to be independently evaluated. That is not just done by the Government and it has not yet been done. I suspect that the independent evaluator will want to take on board quite a number of these points, but the hon. Gentleman will appreciate why I would not want to give too many comments from the Dispatch Box on what the independent evaluator should do.

As for the plans for improvement, the first point to make, which has already been touched on, is that we are seeing more drivers being trained by Avanti West Coast and there are plans to reinstate the vast majority of the timetable in December. Clearly, when deciding what comes next we will want to make sure that that has worked and it is delivering an acceptable level of service for ourselves and for passengers more widely. On TPE, although we are of course welcoming the fact that we are starting very large-scale investment into that route, the level of which that route has not seen for decades, we need to see significant improvement.

As for moving immediately to cancel the contract, I remind the hon. Gentleman of the quotes in the Manchester Evening News on 6 October that were attributed to Mayor Burnham about how that could bring more disruption in the short term. The idea that putting this situation into the hands of the operator of last resort would immediately resolve a driver shortage and other issues is not one that stands up to any scrutiny.

[Aaron Bell (Newcastle-under-Lyme) (Con)]

My constituents have been enduring a pretty terrible service from Avanti for many months, with only one train an hour from Stoke-on-Trent recently. But it is not just about the reliability and the cramped trains; it is also about the availability of tickets, as people are not able to book ahead, which is costing them more because they are having to buy on the day. When the Minister speaks to Avanti, will he make sure that he stresses not only reliability, but availability, so that my constituents can get up and down the west coast cheaply?

[Kevin Foster]

Yes, I will. In fact, I have already spoken to some of Avanti’s most senior management and made that point, particularly following representations from hon. Members. I also reinforced it in a meeting I had with FirstGroup more recently, and it has an overall interest in the Avanti operation.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the SNP spokesman, Gavin Newlands.

[Gavin Newlands (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (SNP)]

There are 14 trains scheduled this Saturday from Glasgow to Euston, but last Saturday only three actually ran, and yesterday saw more than 15% of Avanti’s Glasgow services cancelled. People in Scotland and the north of England are being treated as third-class citizens. I doubt that the laissez-faire attitude of the Department for Transport when it comes to industrial relations at Avanti would last five minutes if home counties commuter services were being slashed in the same way. When are Ministers going to roll up their sleeves and get involved? Was Mick Lynch not right when he said in evidence to the Transport Committee that Scottish Government politicians:

“have an attitude where they want to resolve the issue, whereas sometimes when we meet politicians down here they want to exacerbate the issue and make us their enemy.”

And that was before the Government tabled their utterly regressive Transport Strikes (Minimum Service Levels) Bill; Tory party ideology is impacting taxpayers and passengers yet again.

The six-month extension is seen by everyone as kicking the can down the road. What work is ongoing right now to ensure that the DFT and Directly Operated Railways Ltd are ready to “take back control” of a key piece of cross-border infrastructure, and we follow the lead of Scotland in ending the disastrous experiment of privatisation?

[Kevin Foster]

Work is ongoing to ensure that the operator of last resort would be ready in April to pick up the service. I will touch on some of the issues raised, but not all are within Avanti’s control; merely changing the franchise and who operates it would not resolve issues and problems that have been caused by infrastructure or engineering works, for obvious reasons—those sit in Network Rail’s purview. However, we are certainly not adopting a laissez-faire attitude. Every day, the DFT is engaging with Avanti and TPE about the services. Every week, there are senior-level contacts as well, and Ministers are actively involved with this process. I am a traveller on Avanti trains myself of a Sunday, and the idea that we are not interested in this or that we have some sort of laissez-faire attitude is completely for the birds. As for relationships with the trade unions, the Transport Secretary has met the general secretaries, but we make the point that we are not the employer in this circumstance, and it is for the unions and the operating companies to come to an agreement.

[Simon Fell (Barrow and Furness) (Con)]

On Saturday, I endured an almost 10-hour odyssey across the UK to go from Barrow to London, for an engagement that I then missed. No one is going to peel an onion for me, but many of us have to endure this twice a week and for our constituents it is many more times than that. They are missing trips to the airport and to see their families, and they are missing their commutes. This is simply unacceptable, and they cannot book ahead and their tickets are ridiculously expensive as a result. Will my hon. Friend confirm that if Avanti does not improve services quickly, it will be stripped of its franchise?

[Kevin Foster]

I hear the points my hon. Friend makes. Obviously, he will appreciate that I need to follow the due legal process in terms of any removal of franchise, but we have made clear the criteria that are set out and the need for improvement before April, which is when we would need to take the final decision on a longer-term principle. If the current situation continues, that will clearly be a very strong part of our consideration.

[Christian Wakeford (Bury South) (Lab)]

Two weeks ago, I told Avanti in the Select Committee that every train I had booked in the past month had been cancelled. Avanti told me that there had been improvements. Improvements appear to be moving about as fast as the 8.55 from Manchester Piccadilly to London Euston—that train was cancelled. We have seen a reduced service, half of all trains late and 60,000 complaints, yet the Government have handed Avanti more than £19 million, including more than £4 million in performance bonuses. What message does the Minister think it sends to the public to reward Avanti in this way for nothing but failure and letting down its customers?

[Kevin Foster]

The hon. Gentleman would be aware, had he heard some of what I said earlier, that the performance payments in relation to the period since the timetable reduction have yet to be evaluated independently. Clearly, the evaluation will take into account the actual situation of the delivery of the contract. As this is an independent evaluation, he will appreciate why it is not one I will personally do as a Minister and it is right that it is under that process. As we have touched on, the Government have made it clear to Avanti that significant improvements need to be made in its service. It has a plan to implement for December, which it is confident will deliver a major improvement in the service it is operating. We look forward to seeing it implement that.

[Dr James Davies (Vale of Clwyd) (Con)]

I am grateful to the Minister for meeting me a week ago today to discuss Avanti West Coast services to north Wales. He knows that those remain abysmal. Whereas there are normally six direct services a day, there is now just one, if it is not cancelled. What assurances has he received from the company that it will able to return to near normality by December, as promised?

[Kevin Foster]

The assurances that Avanti is giving are that its plans for December will restore the majority of direct services into north Wales. DFT officials are engaging daily with Avanti, as I have touched on, because we do not just want to accept an assurance that the service will be better. Clearly, we want to have verified plans for it to be better. We are seeing additional train drivers coming in and we are reassuring ourselves that Avanti’s plans for December do not include the use of driver rest-day working, because the withdrawal of that prompted the major issues in its timetable. Clearly, we would not want Avanti’s improvement plan to be based on that factor. That is where we are at the moment. We are assured that it has the plan to restore the majority of services in December, but clearly we are engaging with Avanti daily and will see what happens in December, and that will then prompt what we do on the long-term franchise.

[Tim Farron (Westmorland and Lonsdale) (LD)]

Avanti is currently able to run approximately 40% of the services out of Euston that its predecessor used to run, with a massive impact on my communities and all those people from London, the biggest destination in the country, who visit the lakes, the second biggest. Staff shortages are clearly the problem, along with a lack of good will in the staff body. There are wonderful people working for Avanti, but there are not enough of them and they are poorly managed. Will the Minister reflect on the fact that one reason why there is such low morale and low commitment to good will and working overtime is the Government-sanctioned programme of ticket office closures, not just on the mainline at Penrith and Oxenholme but in places such as Appleby, Windermere and Grange. Will he push Avanti to make sure that we keep those ticket offices open, and therefore perhaps do something about staff morale and train reliability?

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Foster]

We could have quite a session on the changes in ticket buying patterns in recent years. The number of people buying tickets at a ticket office has declined dramatically, and we are keen that staff should be deployed as much in helping passengers outside on the concourse as in sitting behind a glass screen waiting to sell a ticket.

As for the overall services, the hon. Gentleman corresponds with me regularly, I am afraid, about the issues that affect his constituents. We have made it clear that the current performance is not acceptable. We recognise that individual staff members work hard and deliver a good service, but overall the standard is not what we expect, and we expect significant improvement, particularly in the December improvement plan, which we will monitor closely.

[Virginia Crosbie (Ynys Môn) (Con)]

In the past year, daily flights from Ynys Môn to Cardiff have been scrapped by the Welsh Government, and on Friday came the appalling shock that they will close one of the two bridges—the Menai bridge—for up to four months. On top of that, we have a rail service that limps along with just one direct service to and from London. What assurance has the Minister been given by Avanti that at least one of Ynys Môn’s transport links will be fully functional by the end of the year?

[Kevin Foster]

I know that my hon. Friend is strongly committed to restoring the connections which her constituents have a right to expect. Certainly, the December plan includes the restoration of the majority of the services to Holyhead. As I have touched on in a number of my answers, there is daily engagement between the Department and Avanti, including at a more senior level, not just to study what is happening currently but to reassure ourselves about the plans going forward. We expect those to be in place by the end of the year. We have made it clear that we will then look at what happens after the plan has been implemented, and that will form the basis of the decisions that we make long term.

[Taiwo Owatemi (Coventry North West) (Lab)]

Across the west midlands and in Coventry, commuters face continued travel disruption due to the failures of Avanti West Coast. That has had a huge economic impact on my constituents in Coventry North West. There have been absolutely no consequences for the appalling service that Avanti has delivered to my constituents, so while the current Government may well continue to operate without accountability, will the Minister tell me when he will stop rewarding failure and stop wasting taxpayers’ money, and do the right thing by putting power back into the hands of passengers?

[Kevin Foster]

I have pointed out a couple of times that performance payments for the period since the cessation of rest-day working and the reduction in the timetable will be evaluated independently. To my knowledge, no such payments have been made so far, but we will wait for the result for the independent evaluation, which is specified under the franchise contracts. As has been touched on, simply changing the branding of the train or the name of the operator will not resolve many of the issues, but we are relatively confident that the plan that will be set out by Avanti in December will deliver. Of course, we will hold Avanti to account on that plan.

[Mike Wood (Dudley South) (Con)]

Many of my constituents in Dudley South have been let down badly by the inability of Avanti West Coast to operate an acceptable level of service. How many more chances will Avanti have before its faces the consequences of its failings?

[Kevin Foster]

As I have touched on, we have made it clear that we will follow due process. We have been clear in our comments to Avanti that the six-month extension is not an indication of what our long-term view is. It is effectively a probationary period, and we expect to see significant improvements in the services on the line before April. As I have touched on, the OLR is making preparations that would be necessary if it had to step in at that point.

[Liam Byrne (Birmingham, Hodge Hill) (Lab)]

Does the Minister understand the depths of the rage of commuters in Birmingham and the west midlands that a company that is incapable of running a train service has just been rewarded with a six-month extension? Surely he can see that Avanti, having treated the public like fools, is now treating him like a fool, because all that it is seeking to do is maximise its profit for the next six months before the inevitable happens and the contract folds. He should get a grip and end this chaos now.

[Kevin Foster]

First, I am always pleased to note that the vast majority of commuters in Birmingham, Coventry and the west midlands have the benefit of Mayor Andy Street pushing their transport services forward, and we are delighted to work with him to ensure quality. As for Avanti, we have engaged directly with Mayor Street, because we want to see improvements and we want the service to change. We will have a plan to do so in December.

[Jack Brereton (Stoke-on-Trent South) (Con)]

In addition to the severe disruption and overcrowding of services through Stoke-on-Trent, commitments to improve stations have not been fulfilled. Will my hon. Friend look at what more can be done to ensure that those contractual obligations to improve stations such as Stoke-on-Trent are fulfilled by Avanti?

[Kevin Foster]

Certainly we are keen that Avanti should honour all its contractual obligations. The one on which we are most focused is ensuring that it improves the operation of the railway but, similarly, we would want to consider the other commitments that it made—the progress that has been made on them and how it is honouring them—as part of the longer-term decision.

[David Linden (Glasgow East) (SNP)]

I probably spend more time on the Avanti west coast main line than anyone in the Chamber. Its performance is simply appalling, and the Minister saying that it must improve is like me turning to my son and daughter and saying, “Don’t eat anything from the biscuit tin again”, then walking away and leaving the biscuit tin in front of them. The reality is that under the Avanti franchise, staff morale has been driven into the ground. The company has engaged in horrendous industrial relations with the trade unions, and it is running the service into the ground in the full expectation that it will lose it in six months’ time. Why does the Minister not just do the right thing, take the contract from Avanti, and follow the example of the Scottish Government and bring it back into public ownership?

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Foster]

My discussions with FirstGroup and Avanti, and particularly with FirstGroup, do not indicate that it is inevitable that they will lose the service in six months’ time, or that that is an outcome for which they hope and wish. Every day, the Department engages with Avanti on the December improvement plan and bringing in more train drivers. Again, that brings home the fact that we need to reform our railways to move away from the idea that services depend on rest-day working, which belongs to the services of the past.

[Scott Benton (Blackpool South) (Con)]

The situation with Avanti has been intolerable for many months. Not only has that caused significant problems for commuters but it has damaged the tourism industry in my constituency, as holidaymakers are reluctant to book ahead. What reassurances can the Minister give the House that he is holding Avanti to account on its recovery plan?

[Kevin Foster]

As I have said, departmental officials engage with Avanti on its recovery plan, as I touched on in an answer to a previous question: it is about not just accepting its assurance but going into the details of what the plan is. Every week, there is engagement at senior management level. Ministers are engaged through departmental teams with the progress that has been made on reassurance. As I have said, at the moment we are confident that Avanti can deliver its plan in December —there is a requirement for trade union co-operation as well, which we accept is slightly out of its control—and that is our key focus in ensuring that we manage this every day, as we are conscious that significant improvement is needed.

[Graham Stringer (Blackley and Broughton) (Lab)]

It is no accident that Avanti has reached the pinnacle of incompetence within the rail industry. It has done that by cutting costs and putting profit before service and people. It has damaged the economy all the way along the west coast main line. People who use that line do not want it to continue. I do not want it to continue. Why is the Minister giving this dreadful company a second chance?

[Kevin Foster]

As I have already said, we are clear that the six-month extension is to give Avanti the final opportunity to implement the improvement plans that it has put in place, which we are starting to see the benefits of—we are starting to see drivers coming through—and that will then allow us to take a final decision in the early part of next year about what happens. Alongside all that, we are already doing the relevant preparations in the OLR.

[Mary Robinson (Cheadle) (Con)]

The Avanti service between Stockport and London Euston is unacceptable and has been for some time. I am grateful to the Minister for his words on this, but cancellations and the inability to book a return ticket mean that people are not travelling on the train; they are choosing to get in the car instead. Will the Minister take to Avanti the clear message that it must improve and improve quickly or its contract will be in jeopardy?

[Kevin Foster]

My hon. Friend puts her points very well. We have been clear that improvements need to be made for this contract to continue beyond April.

[Dan Jarvis (Barnsley Central) (Lab)]

Yorkshire continues to be blighted by unreliable services, but it was very good to see Mayor Tracy Brabin in West Yorkshire telling TransPennine Express to come up with an immediate solution to the chaos that has left so many passengers deeply exasperated. One thing the Department could do is to make sure that negotiations on rest-day working are meaningful and deliver an agreement with the trade unions. Rest-day working, as the Minister will know, is separate from terms and conditions, and an agreement would make an almost overnight difference. The Secretary of State has indicated that she is open to an agreement. Can the Minister update us on what progress is being made?

[Kevin Foster]

Again, it is worth noting that, in the case of Avanti—I shall talk specifically about Avanti as it is the subject of today’s urgent question—agreement on rest-day working with the trade unions had been in place for some period of time, and that it suddenly ceased in those volunteering to undertake it. This is not a case of there not being an agreement. For example, if people started volunteering for rest-day working tomorrow, they could pick it up and do it again. That said, is it sensible to be having large parts of a key train line relying on rest-day working? The obvious answer is no, which is why we want to look at wider modernisation—we may have some difference of opinion on that, but it is a key point—and on how additional drivers are being trained so that the December recovery plan for Avanti does not rely on driver rest-day working.

[Rob Roberts (Delyn) (Ind)]

One of the biggest problems on the north Wales coast line is that when Avanti stopped its services, my constituents had to put up with Welsh Labour’s Transport for Wales service instead, which is just as unreliable. It is so overcrowded that it looks a bit like the tube at rush hour. With a little bit of sympathy for Avanti’s situation, I have been trying to schedule my own train travel recently, and it is just as difficult to get a train because of strike action going on as because of the problems with getting tickets. Does the Minister agree that the hardest part for the public is uncertainty and cancellations? Would it not be better for Avanti to run fewer services well, especially down the north Wales coast line, rather than making promises that it just cannot keep?

[Kevin Foster]

The hon. Member is right to suggest that this idea of a publicly owned transport service being some sort of panacea of great customer service is rather false. It is interesting to hear the examples that he highlights of the service offered by the Welsh Government, which his own constituents get to experience. On the balance between reliability and the number of services being run, the reduced timetable was put in place partly to ensure that services would run. That said, the service is clearly not at the level that we would wish. That is why more than 100 drivers will have been trained between April and November, which is when we look to bring back the main timetable. Ultimately, it is for Avanti to deliver the services that it is contracted to provide.

[Kate Hollern (Blackburn) (Lab)]

The west coast Avanti line has been dysfunctional for many months. The Minister is saying that we need to give Avanti the opportunity. Let me give him some recent examples. Today, 44 services have been cancelled on the TransPennine route. On Thursday, if people tried to purchase a ticket online, they could not. No tickets were available until 9.10 in the evening. If someone is travelling back to Lancashire, that is a long time to hang about in London and it gets them home very late. The Minister says that we have seen improvements, but we have not. He says that he will give Avanti another six months. Are we really saying that people in Lancashire have to wait six months for an improvement that is unlikely to come, while the Minister decides to continue to reward bad service?

[Kevin Foster]

I make the point that the TransPennnine Express is a separate franchise from Avanti, although FirstGroup is the overall operator. We are starting to see the reinstatement of some services as new drivers are being trained, but we are clear that the overall service is unacceptable and needs to improve. The idea that just sticking it into the OLR tomorrow morning will suddenly resolve all the problems is not practical, but we are very clear that if we do not see the significant improvements that we need to see post the December improvement plan being implemented, we will need to take a careful view of the long-term future of the franchise.

[Robin Millar (Aberconwy) (Con)]

Residents of Aberconwy know only too well the importance of the services that run on the north Wales main line. Indeed, the UK connectivity review reflected the strategic importance of that infrastructure, but, unfortunately, the Avanti emergency timetable does not seem to recognise that; it barely delivers a main line service. Effectively giving north Wales branch line status is causing real problems. Recently, I caught a Crewe to Chester connection. It was a single carriage that only left the station when six people had crammed into the toilet and it still left people behind on the platform. Will the Minister confirm that, in any future considerations of the franchise, it will bear the name the north Wales and west coast main line to reflect the strategic importance of north Wales to the rail service?

[Kevin Foster]

From my own time in the Wales Office, I am conscious of the vital economic role that the railway plays in north Wales in terms of economic performance. As my hon. Friend says, the current service is not acceptable. We look forward in December to seeing the restoration of the majority of direct services. I hope that he will appreciate why I am not going to commit to a rebranding exercise on the Floor of the House this afternoon, but I am sure many colleagues will have a view as to whether the current name that the line operates under is the best compared with some of the other names that could have been chosen, particularly the old LMS one.

[Andrew Gwynne (Denton and Reddish) (Lab)]

Why does this Minister insist on defending the indefensible? Avanti failing is nothing new. It has failed virtually since day one when it took over the contract from Virgin. The Minister says that it has daily meetings and his officials have meetings frequently with Avanti. Has he pushed Avanti on the fact that, for too many weekends and days of the week, my constituents cannot book advance tickets online? Has he pushed it on the fact that, for some inexplicable reason, a journey on the west coast main line between Stockport and Euston is far more expensive than the same journey on the east coast main line between Wakefield and King’s Cross? He talks about performance-related payments to Avanti. If he cannot get a grip on Avanti, do we need performance-related payments on the Minister?

[Kevin Foster]

It is always good to get constructive suggestions as to how we improve train services. On the service, I think I have said “unacceptable” more times at the Dispatch Box on this subject than on pretty much anything else. No one is arguing that the current service is acceptable as we go forward. However, simply chucking it into the OLR and giving it a new brand to resolve every problem is not a solution on its own. That is why we have engaged and worked with Avanti on the December improvement plan. We expect it to deliver and if it does not, clearly, there will be consequences when we come to the April contract extension decision.

[Andrew Bridgen (North West Leicestershire) (Con)]

The Minister says that he has given Avanti a six-month contract extension to allow it to deliver its improvement plan. What assurance can he give the House and commuters that services will not deteriorate again to their current, unacceptable levels if the Avanti contract is extended beyond then?

[Kevin Foster]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right to raise that. As part of taking a longer-term decision, we would want to see how the improvement was sustainable—for example, as I have touched on already, by moving away from a reliance on rest-day working for train drivers as the core of delivering the service. We want to look—in the same way, by the way, that the OLR would have to look if it took over operations—at ensuring that any improvement is sustainable and provides a long-term basis of confidence for the service and particularly the communities that rely on it.

[Bill Esterson (Sefton Central) (Lab)]

Does the Minister not understand that the public believe the Government, by extending the Avanti franchise, are taking them for fools? Does he not realise that the only way out of this for him and his ministerial colleagues, and the only way to end the public’s anger towards their Government, is to remove the Avanti franchise and do it now?

[Kevin Foster]

I have to say, that was not the universal reaction to the decision we took, when we were clear that this was a six-month probationary period. We look forward to seeing the implementation of the December timetable changes and the improvement plan, and to closely monitoring the progress being made towards it, including, for example, the training of new drivers to fulfil it. As I have said a number of times, simply repainting the engine and giving the franchise a different name will not solve many of these issues.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

It currently costs £369.40 for a standard open return between Manchester and London. That would be excessive at the best of times. When the company is completely incapable of running a reliable service, it is downright unacceptable. The Minister has said repeatedly that there are already signs of improvement. That is not the experience of Avanti passengers. Can he describe exactly what signs of improvements he is talking about?

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Foster]

We have already begun to see the restoration of some peak-time services. It is also worth saying that very few people use the open return-price ticket—I certainly did not use it when I travelled down from Manchester on Sunday, and nor would many other travellers. We are starting to see improvements. We are seeing the profile of new drivers joining the service. Drivers already in training will be able to start driving trains before the December improvement plan is in place. However, we are clear that this is a probationary period and we look forward to seeing the outcomes.

[Kim Johnson (Liverpool, Riverside) (Lab)]

I and my constituents know only too well that the Avanti West Coast line is the worst performing on the rail network, although the workers do a great job and should be commended. My great city of Liverpool will be hosting the Eurovision song contest in my Liverpool, Riverside constituency next year. We need an efficient and effective service to get people to the city and support the local economy. Does the Minister agree that, instead of rewarding failure, it is time to terminate the contract and bring the service back in house?

[Kevin Foster]

We are all looking forward to the delivery of a successful Eurovision in Liverpool, or Lviv-erpool, as some people are deciding to call it—[Interruption]—although I understand that there is some disappointment from colleagues who were hoping that Glasgow would be the venue. Certainly, the rail network will need to play a key part in making sure that we can support that event fully.

As I have touched on a couple of times, just stripping Avanti of the contract today would not be a magic bullet to solve the problems we are seeing. Avanti has its improvement plan for December, we are working closely to monitor progress on it, and we are clear that we expect to see significant and sustainable improvements following that plan, ahead of taking a final decision in April.

[Mrs Paulette Hamilton (Birmingham, Erdington) (Lab)]

People in Birmingham are absolutely sick to the back teeth of Avanti West Coast—its cancelled trains and overcrowded carriages, the cuts to services and the lack of ticket availability. It is absolutely ridiculous that its contract was extended. If we are serious about levelling up and improving services, we need to have plans in place to end this chaos. So Minister, do you think that—

[Mrs Paulette Hamilton]

Madam Deputy Speaker, does the Minister think that rewarding Avanti with a contract extension was a mistake?

[Kevin Foster]

I do not believe it is a mistake to focus on an improvement plan that will come in in December and to carefully monitor progress. As I have said, DFT officials engage daily with Avanti on the progress it is making. We are not just accepting assurances; we want to see clear, concrete evidence—for example, drivers in training and drivers completing training are the core part of resolving some of these issues. That is where we believe our focus should be now. We will clearly look to see how the improvements are made in December. If they are not, and if the service is still as it is, clearly we will take a decision ahead of the main contract renewal in April. I also understand that Avanti accepts that the current service is not appropriate.

While we are talking about Birmingham, we should remember that this does not reflect on the whole rail network, as the hon. Lady knows. Chiltern runs a very effective service to Birmingham Moor Street, which provides a good option for many people looking to travel to London from Birmingham, and it has operated it successfully for many years.

[Jeff Smith (Manchester, Withington) (Lab)]

My constituents in south Manchester are contacting me, frustrated and angry about Avanti’s lack of service. They cannot book seats, and even if they can, the trains are ridiculously overcrowded or cancelled completely. The Minister is setting great store by this so-called December improvement plan, but how can we have any confidence in that plan, given the current terrible service, which by the way is actually getting worse? Avanti should have lost the contract already, but if we do not see massive and fast improvements in December, will he please commit to stepping in quickly, and long before April, to sort out this shambles?

[Kevin Foster]

As the hon. Gentleman will appreciate, we are constantly monitoring the performance. As for removing the franchise, we clearly have to go through a due process, as I am sure he would accept it. We believe that there is a credible plan for improvements in December. We are starting to see evidence of new train drivers actually qualifying, and we are seeing more in training. The December improvement plan has been launched without, for example, relying on driver rest-day working, the withdrawal of which has been the absolute core of the problems affecting Avanti trains. Certainly, we will continue to engage closely with Avanti beyond the implementation in December, and the company knows full well what is at stake ahead of the main contract renewal in April if the services do not significantly improve. In the meantime, we are being clear with Avanti that issues such as the availability of online ticketing also need to improve. Weekday availability has improved significantly, but I accept that we now need to see the same for weekends.

[Mr Khalid Mahmood (Birmingham, Perry Barr) (Lab)]

Avanti is having a huge effect on the economy of Birmingham and the region, because of the huge inward investments that Birmingham is drawing in from HSBC and other financial institutions, and because of the region making other investments—without the support of Andy Street, the Mayor. They are doing a fantastic job. We need to support the workers and the travelling public, who are having to suffer. For example, I could not change my ticket down to London and had to wait until the train came; I was told to do it on the train, because they could not guarantee the service arriving. That is not an effective way to manage the service. We should not be looking to extend the contract to April. The Minister should now put the contract into abeyance, and by December we should be training more people to get a new contract in place and have the service running properly for Birmingham and the west midlands.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Mahmood]

Will the Minister put in place a programme now so that we can take charge of Avanti trains by December?

[Kevin Foster]

As I have touched on already, we do not believe that simply popping this into the OLR and changing the paintwork on the trains, as if that is a magic solution, will be an effective way forward. We believe that tackling the underlying issues, such as ensuring that there are an adequate number of train drivers to operate the service without using rest day working for drivers, is at the core of a successful operation, either under the current franchise or potentially under the OLR in future. We are clear that we will expect to see significant improvements following implementation of the plan put forward by Avanti in taking a long-term contract decision.

I am always pleased to hear of the investment being secured for Birmingham, particularly by Mayor Andy Street. Of course, one of the biggest drivers of investment in Birmingham now—this is one thing that there probably will be some agreement on—is Birmingham Curzon Street. That is being built and will be the main terminus for HS2, which has enjoyed cross-party support, and it is starting to drive investment in Birmingham, and we very much welcome it.

[Justin Madders (Ellesmere Port and Neston) (Lab)]

I am pleased to be able to speak to the Minister about this. We were due to meet yesterday, but unfortunately he cancelled at short notice, leaving me with a feeling not dissimilar to that of Avanti West Coast passengers. I have no criticism of him for that, because he had important business in the House. I hope we are able to meet soon, because I have been trying to meet him and his many, many predecessors for the last six months to discuss this issue. The state of direct services between Chester and London is appalling. We were promised improvements by Avanti, but the services have actually gone backwards. Having seen how Avanti has failed to deliver on its promises so far, I have no confidence that it will be able to pull this off in time for the renewal of the franchise. Does the Minister have confidence in Avanti?

[Kevin Foster]

It is worth pointing out what I was doing yesterday afternoon: I was in the Chamber answering an urgent question. Urgent questions seem to be a bit like buses; you wait a while for one, and then two come along fairly close together.

We have scrutinised carefully what Avanti is doing with its improvement plan for December. As I have said a number of times, we are not just going to accept assurances that it will work. DFT officials are engaging daily—weekly at more senior levels—to ensure that the company is hitting the milestones it needs to for this improvement plan. We all want to see the line operate and move forward successfully. However, we have been clear that if it does not, and if by April the improvements have not happened and been sustained, we will follow the due process, but that may well have a strong impact on the long-term decision.

[Dan Carden (Liverpool, Walton) (Lab)]

Extending Avanti’s contract by six months was the wrong thing to do. The travelling public have had enough of this company running their train service into the ground. Liverpool is a visitor economy. I represent both the city’s football clubs, and it is time for us to have a decent working service. That will also rely on Avanti staff. Avanti’s tactics of smearing its own workforce and making them a scapegoat for its mismanagement mean that it will not recover this service while doing that. What is the Minister doing to improve industrial relations between the workforce and the company, and will he consider acting today, not waiting months more?

[Kevin Foster]

We are already acting; there is daily engagement with Avanti on how it is progressing towards its improvement plan. As I have made clear, we are not just accepting assurances that it will make improvements in December, but looking for clear evidence that it is meeting the milestones to do just that. We are keen that there should be good relationships between employers and their employees in the sector. For all the problems that are well known about, rail sector management and employees worked closely together for the state funeral and the events following the death of Her late Majesty, with many going the extra mile and working into the early hours of the morning to ensure that people could attend the events and get home afterwards. Despite the idea that there are problems in particular parts, there was a real team effort for that event across the rail sector. We are engaging actively, and we look forward to seeing the improvements that the December plan will bring; if not, consequences will follow.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

And finally, from the east coast, Chi Onwurah.

--- Later in debate ---

[Chi Onwurah (Newcastle upon Tyne Central) (Lab)]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Why does the Minister insist on rewarding private sector failure—Avanti or TransPennine Express—with more public money, while refusing to invest in transformative public transport services such as Northern Powerhouse Rail? Does he think that my constituents, deprived of an affordable or reliable means of getting to work, are pleased to know that their hard-worked-for taxes are being used by this Government literally to pay the private sector to profit from their misery?

[Kevin Foster]

I have covered a number of times the position on performance payments in the Avanti contract. The hon. Lady’s constituents will have seen the clear commitment we have made to investment in Northern Powerhouse Rail over the last few months. They will have seen the start of work on the trans-Pennine upgrade. They will have seen the integrated rail plan, and they will see the first new main line to be built in this country along the spine of it since the Victorian era, already moving from London to Birmingham and then on to Manchester after that. I think they will be slightly more impressed by that than whatever they can see from 13 years of investment under Labour.

Bill Presented

Ministerial and Other Pensions and Salaries (Amendment) Bill

Presentation and First Reading (Standing Order No. 57)

David Linden, supported by Drew Hendry, Gavin Newlands, Brendan O’Hara and Alan Brown, presented a Bill to provide that a person who ceases to hold a ministerial office is entitled to a grant only after holding the relevant office for two years or more; and for connected purposes.

Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time on Friday 18 November, and to be printed (Bill 172).

Great British Railways

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Monday 24th October 2022 Commons Chamber

[Rachael Maskell (York Central) (Lab/Co-op)]

(Urgent Question): To ask the Secretary of State for Transport to make a statement on the future of Great British Railways.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Kevin Foster)]

The case for rail modernisation is now stronger than when Keith Williams set out the plan for rail in 2021. Covid-19, recent macroeconomic events, industrial relations and financial challenges have increased the need for it. The railways are not meeting customers’ needs, with delays, unreliability and uncertainty exacerbated by the rail strikes. When people look at the rail sector, we need them to see a system that stands for reliability and sustainability, so it is clear that we have to change.

This Government will therefore deliver the most ambitious changes to our railways in a generation, and will deliver for the people who matter: our passengers, customers and taxpayers. Although we will not be introducing rail reform legislation during the current Session, due to limits on parliamentary time, we are committed to introducing the legislation necessary to create a guiding mind, Great British Railways, as soon as possible.

As many Members are aware, a competition was run to identify the location for the Great British Railways headquarters. I welcome the support of colleagues for the six shortlisted towns and cities, and I note that the hon. Member for York Central (Rachael Maskell) has been vocal in her support for York to be the winner. I hope to be able to announce the successful location shortly—subject to other events outside the Chamber. Ahead of the legislation, we will continue to work with the Great British Railways transition team and the wider sector to push ahead with our ambitious modernisation programme to deliver real benefits for customers.

Reforming our railways means more reliable trains, faster journey times—in all, a modern, future-facing rail industry; a sector with an unswerving focus on meeting the needs of its customers, creating a simpler, better railway for communities across Britain. There will be a GBR at the heart of our rail network, with its headquarters located in one of our great railway communities. The details will be confirmed shortly, but our commitment to deliver is unchanged.

[Rachael Maskell]

I am grateful to you, Mr Speaker, for granting this urgent question.

Following the publication for the House of the Williams-Shapps review, the Government announced in the Queen’s Speech on 10 May 2022:

“Legislation will be introduced to modernise rail services and improve reliability for passengers”.

As part of this process, the then Transport Secretary launched a high-profile competition for the location of the headquarters outside London. Forty-two locations bid and six were shortlisted, including York, as part of the levelling-up agenda. Each location shortlisted hosted a ministerial visit over the summer of 2022, involving public sector, rail industry and community stakeholders. In parallel, the public participated in a public vote over their preferred destination. All this was at significant cost to local authorities. Last Wednesday, the Secretary of State shelved her plans for this Session. No written or oral statement has been made to the House until today.

Let me therefore ask the following questions. Why did the Secretary of State not have the courtesy to announce her U-turn on Great British Railways to the House? If the relocation of the new headquarters is to proceed, what will the process be, and if not, given that hundreds of thousands of pounds have been spent by local authorities, how will the Secretary of State compensate shortlisted authorities? What was the result of the public vote? What are the reasons for shelving the plans for the future of Great British Railways in the current Session? How, in the interim, will the Secretary of State address the failure issues across the rail network that Great British Railways was to resolve, including contract failure on the west coast main line and elsewhere? What discussions has she had with the trade unions on abandoning her plans, and on the implications for the workforce across the rail sector? Is she now abandoning Williams-Shapps, levelling up, and any semblance of government? The Great British public deserve better.

[Kevin Foster]

I think it is worth pointing out that the comments referred to were made to a Select Committee of this House, the Transport Committee, and that the Secretary of State was therefore giving information in her role as Transport Secretary and keeping Members up to date. As I touched on in my initial answer, there will be a Great British Railways HQ located in one of our great railway communities. I am sorry to disappoint people, but I will not be announcing from the Dispatch Box today where that will be, but it is something that we are committed to doing. It has been inspiring to see the excitement about the competition; it shows what rail can bring to local communities. Certainly there will be a successful bidder, so to speak, and they will be announced in the not-too-distant future.

Yes, the Secretary of State has met the general secretaries of the leading trade unions involved in the rail sector, but that was not to discuss abandoning the plan, because we have not abandoned the plan. We are still taking forward a range of work to reform and modernise our railways, and there is plenty we can do, even in the absence of a Bill in the third Session. I am confident that Great British Railways will make a difference to our rail network. It would be tempting, in these interesting circumstances in which I come to the Dispatch Box, to make a raft of pledges on things I would quite like to do with the railways, but we are certainly conscious that we need to reform and move forward, and that is something that most people across the sector realise. There might be slightly different views about exactly how to go about that, but I am keen to see it taken forward to make the difference for our customers and communities, who deserve a rail network that delivers for them.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Chair of the Select Committee, Huw Merriman.

[Huw Merriman (Bexhill and Battle) (Con)]

It was in the Transport Committee that the Secretary of State gave us this news about Great British Railways. I understand the concern about her not coming to the Dispatch Box to do so, but surely everybody supports the concept of a Select Committee getting fresh information from those who come before it. The Secretary of State also told us that the guiding mind of Great British Railways can still be advanced without legislation, because there is a lot that can be brought forward and very few parts of it need legislation. Can the Minister set out some of the ideas that would see the guiding mind being brought forward, notwithstanding the fact that the legislation would be slightly lagging behind?

[Kevin Foster]

The Chair of the Transport Committee is absolutely right to highlight the role that his Committee can play as a group of experienced, and in some cases expert, Members who can analyse issues and question Ministers on their performance. It is appropriate to use a Select Committee as a place to engage and discuss where Government’s thinking is going. What can be achieved without legislation includes workforce reform, delivering local partnerships, bringing forward a more long-term strategy for rail and reforming how we use ticketing. I think we all recognise that post-pandemic far fewer people are buying season tickets compared with on-the-day tickets, and we are looking at the changes that may flow from that changing pattern. There is still plenty that we can be cracking on with and delivering at the initial stage of reform without having primary legislation as part of it.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Minister, Tanmanjeet Singh Dhesi.

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Foster]

Luckily, I have already answered the hon. Gentleman’s first question. We have certainly not brought Great British Railways to a halt. Again, we said the location of its headquarters will be announced shortly. This has not been stopped, abandoned or any of the other things we are hearing from the Labour party. We are very clear that we want to look forward to a rail network that is seeing massive, almost unprecedented investment, and in which customers can look forward to better facilities and better services that deliver for their communities. I leave it to the hon. Gentleman to look back wistfully at British Rail.

[Andrew Jones (Harrogate and Knaresborough) (Con)]

It is clear we have a very busy legislative programme, but that does not necessarily mean we have to stop things like fares reform, network efficiency, flexible ticketing or encouraging more people back on to our railways. Those things do not need legislation; they just need progression. This time will allow my hon. Friend to ensure a significant role for the private sector in rail reform and, of course, to further consider the merits of York as the location of the headquarters of Great British Railways.

[Kevin Foster]

I could not have put it better myself. My hon. Friend is absolutely right that there is a range of things we can take forward, not least fares reform and innovative practices such as last year’s rail sale. There is plenty of work that can still be done, and we will certainly be getting on with it.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the SNP spokesperson, Gavin Newlands.

[Gavin Newlands (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (SNP)]

The rail industry and GBR are in stasis, and there is little evidence of progress coming from the Department for Transport. Six months ago, the previous Secretary of State promised we “would not be disappointed” with the legislation to create GBR, but I am feeling distinctly underwhelmed. The Williams review promised that GBR will

“take a whole-system view, allowing it to make choices and decisions more effectively. It will enable the railways to be run as a public service”.

That vision lies in tatters for now. We know that long-term thinking and planning are key, but instead we have a piecemeal, stop-start process that will take years, if not decades, to achieve real change in a key part of our national infrastructure.

When can we expect anybody, GBR or otherwise, to take a whole-system view of rail in this country? With ScotRail back in public ownership, there is one part of the UK where the railways are run as a public service. Will the Minister use the transport mini-Bill to devolve Network Rail to Scotland, to ensure that a fully integrated and fully publicly owned railway can be run somewhere in the UK?

[Kevin Foster]

I can understand why not having an integrated rail network across Great Britain is a particular priority for the Scottish National party. It clearly is a priority for this UK Government. We will not be looking to devolve responsibility for rail infrastructure, not least because the SNP’s main idea at the moment seems to be stopping the trains for passport control at the border.

On the wider pitch, we are determined to make a difference with our railways. We are seeing real innovation, and I am sure the hon. Gentleman will have looked at, for example, the experience of Lumo trains from Edinburgh to London. Lumo is an open-access operator that is pulling traffic away from air and on to rail, which is exactly what we want to see. We will get on with the many reforms we can make without primary legislation, but one of them will not be creating a disjointed rail network.

[John Redwood (Wokingham) (Con)]

When will the Government and railway companies come forward with proposals for an improved pattern of services that attracts many more fare-paying passengers? We need to get the deficit down very quickly and the best way of doing so is by getting more people paying fares willingly.

[Kevin Foster]

My right hon. Friend is absolutely right. Clearly, demand patterns have changed dramatically during the pandemic. For example, a lot fewer people are commuting into London at 7 am to 9 am and then leaving between 5 pm and 7 pm, or they are doing that three or four days a week rather than five, so there is a need to look at how we can adapt. We are giving slightly more flexibility to some operating companies, and looking at how we use our ticketing and, in particular, our ticket pricing. The rail sale was a great way of getting a lot of people on to trains that might otherwise have been relatively quiet, producing new revenue to the railways. In addition, as I said in response to the SNP spokesperson, Lumo is targeting traffic that goes by air to get it on tracks.

[Cat Smith (Lancaster and Fleetwood) (Lab)]

My constituents would really struggle to describe British railways as “great”, because their lives are made a misery by Avanti and TransPennine, which continually cancel trains, leading to their missing job interviews, school and education. Today, a commute that should have taken me two and a half hours took me almost five—I only just made it in time for Education questions. May I ask the Minister why on earth his Government extended the contract with Avanti? Frankly, my constituents do not understand why.

[Kevin Foster]

We made it clear when we extended the contract for only six months that it was a probationary period, to allow Avanti to implement the recovery plan that it has and is intending to bring forward in December. We will judge whether to extend its contract any further based on how that goes.

[John Penrose (Weston-super-Mare) (Con)]

The rail Minister is right to talk about the need for rail reform, but may I urge him to use the couple of months of extra time that he has won by postponing legislation to revisit some core conclusions of the Williams-Shapps review, which are out of date because they are based on work done before the pandemic? He has mentioned the changes in customer demand and we need to rethink some crucial things, particularly the role of Great British Railways as the fat controller and a central planner rather than a genuine slimline system operator.

[Kevin Foster]

I am keen that GBR adapts to the changes we have seen since the pandemic, but we are seeing this across the whole industry and in the discussions the train operating companies want to have with Government. We will certainly use any time we have to ensure that our proposals make a difference and have the most positive impact for customers and communities.

[Ellie Reeves (Lewisham West and Penge) (Lab)]

My constituents were recently informed by Southeastern of huge timetable changes, with the result that they will have to make significant amendments to their commutes. Southeastern did that with no public consultation, despite being a publicly owned franchise. Will the Minister ensure that Southeastern goes back to consult, so that rail users have their voices heard before such significant changes are made?

[Kevin Foster]

I am aware that Southeastern is taking feedback on its proposals. It is important that it engages with communities and, in particular, with their representatives in this House. Given the number of changes that have had to be made in the past couple of years, there is more flexibility for operators, including those that are publicly owned, to react to emerging patterns of demand. However, I understand that Southeastern will be listening and looking at the feedback it gets on its proposed changes.

[Michael Gove (Surrey Heath) (Con)]

The Minister has been brilliantly clear that the creation of GBR will play a significant part in levelling up transport connectivity in the north and midlands, but he also knows that it is vital to ensure that London and the home counties are better connected. Travel times from my constituency, and particularly from Camberley, Frimley and Bagshot, to London have not improved since the age of Queen Victoria. Will he put a Stephenson’s Rocket up the fundament of those bureaucrats who have been standing in the way of the progress my constituents require?

[Kevin Foster]

Presumably it would be more like putting an electrified Michael on the case as well. Demands have changed, particularly in London and the south-east. We are seeing the results of investment, particularly that which my right hon. Friend was instrumental in helping to secure during his time in the Cabinet, for example, with the opening of Bond Street station to passengers this morning. People are starting to see major improvements in London and the south-east, but I accept that they will also look to what is happening on their local line and I will be happy to discuss with him what could be done on the one he cites.

[Sarah Olney (Richmond Park) (LD)]

The setting up of Great British Railways was meant to include ticketing and pricing, and the cost of commuting continues to weigh heavily on my constituents, particularly during the cost of living crisis. Furthermore, if we want to encourage people on to the trains and out of their cars, it is key that we make trains affordable. The Department for Transport has said that it will not put up regulated rail fares by 12.3%, in line with July’s retail prices index, but will the Minister commit to freezing rail fares next January, to help with the cost of living crisis and the fight against climate change?

[Kevin Foster]

It is worth saying that there are a range of fares available on our railways, particularly in London and the south-east, where people use pay as you go and contactless bank cards. We have said that we will not take the normal approach—which also existed during the coalition—of using the RPI figure to set fares next year, and a fair rise has been delayed. We look forward to introducing plans that strike a balance between a railway that is affordable for not only the taxpayer but customers and communities.

[Jack Brereton (Stoke-on-Trent South) (Con)]

The pandemic and the reckless strike actions we have seen have caused significant disruption to our rail services. Does my hon. Friend agree that the focus should now be on restoring services and maximising investment in improving stations—for example, by reopening the stations at Meir and Trentham in my constituency?

[Kevin Foster]

I am always pleased at the Dispatch Box to hear colleagues argue passionately for the reinstatement and further expansion of parts of our rail network. It has also been good to engage with Members on both sides of the House on the Restoring Your Railways project, and our goal is to get services restored. A lot of passengers are coming back on to the railways, and we are keen to see that, but people must have the confidence to come back, and that is where industrial action is so damaging. We are looking to restore many services, but we also have to take account of the fact that patterns of demand have changed, particularly in relation to commuting between 7 am and 9 am and between 5 pm and 7 pm, given the changes in the wider economy.

[Chi Onwurah (Newcastle upon Tyne Central) (Lab)]

As the birthplace of British railways, Newcastle has bid to be the home of GBR, so will the Minister tell us what we would win if we were to win? The last Prime Minister, or perhaps she is still the Prime Minister—I am not sure, because I cannot keep up with Tory chaos; anyway, it was a recent Prime Minister—committed to the implementation in full of Northern Powerhouse Rail, so will the Minister also tell us whether that commitment will outlast the transport Bill?

[Kevin Foster]

The NPR statement from the Prime Minister was very welcome, and it was welcomed on both sides of the House. The winning community will be very much the headquarters of the UK’s railways, and I very much look forward to announcing—subject to some of the things that have been alluded to—the successful town or city in the near future.

[Nick Fletcher (Don Valley) (Con)]

In the spring and early summer this year I spent many days campaigning and collecting signatures for a petition for Doncaster—the greatest railway town in the country—to become the home of the Great British Railways headquarters. Will the Minister confirm that my boot leather was not wasted and that Doncaster is still very much in the running?

[Kevin Foster]

I am glad to hear of the effort my hon. Friend put in. I can see a couple of colleagues in the Chamber who will agree with his views about Doncaster, and others who might suggest other communities instead. As I have said, there will be a winner and there will be a headquarters for Great British Railways, and I genuinely hope to be the person to announce that fairly soon.

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

I am sure we would all agree that failure should not be rewarded with promotion or long contract extensions. I hope we would also agree that Great British Railways will never be truly great without the considerable investment needed in infrastructure across our rail network. Will the Minister take this opportunity to clarify the Government’s progress on the Network Rail enhancements pipeline, given that a report published today noted that there had been no progress on one third of all the projects since the plan was published for 2019-24?

[Kevin Foster]

The updated rail network enhancements pipeline will be published in due course—shortly might be another way of putting it. But I look at the investment that we are putting into our railways and see £96 billion in the integrated rail plan. I look at the fact that the first major mainline in this country since the Victorian era is under construction now and is on its way to Birmingham, then Crewe and then Manchester. That level of investment in our railways is unprecedented in most of our lifetimes, and it is very welcome.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

I declare a very personal interest in this matter, Mr Speaker. In the past three days, I have tried to make four journeys between Manchester, Edinburgh and London. Two were more than half an hour late, three were cancelled and one was then uncancelled when the driver of the preceding cancelled train turned up after all and was able to drive my train. However, I say to the Minister, because he has talked about ticketing and pricing, that there is a particular issue where different companies serve the same destinations and charge different and non-interchangeable prices. Can that be addressed ahead of legislation?

[Kevin Foster]

The hon. Lady makes a fair point about making sure that ticket prices are able to be clearly understood by customers and consumers and that they are fair overall. However, open access operators, for example Lumo from Edinburgh, provide a different pricing plan which is of benefit to customers. It is something that we are keen to see simplified and an area on which we look to work.

[Mohammad Yasin (Bedford) (Lab)]

Bedford residents are sick and tired of waiting for a detailed decision on East West Rail. Some are finding it difficult to sell blighted homes. Others are living under the spectre of their homes being demolished if plans in their current form go ahead through Bedford. Shockingly, we are still waiting for a response to the consultation that ended a year and a half ago, in which time there have been three rail Ministers. Will the Minister put an end to this chaos and confirm when the plans will be published?

[Kevin Foster]

I thank the hon. Member for raising East West Rail, a major investment we are making in improving connectivity across our country, driving economic growth and revitalising rail lines, some of which have some of the least used stations in the whole country, which will soon become much more vibrant hubs for their local community. We look forward to confirming further details on stages 2 and 3, in particular between Bedford and Cambridge, in the near future.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

It seems to my constituents that improving efficiency involves cutting trains altogether; they cannot be late if they do not run. I have lost three peak-time train services on the Sidcup line that serves New Eltham and Mottingham and two peak-time train services in the morning at Eltham and Falconwood on the Bexleyheath line and at Kidbrooke. The Minister says that Southeastern is listening, but the reason it is not, as Southeastern told the scrutiny panel at Greenwich Council last week, is that it sought and got permission from the Department for Transport to make these cuts without consultation. Will the Minister go away and ensure that there is proper consultation and that we run train services that people actually want?

[Kevin Foster]

I thank the hon. Member for his points. As he will be aware, the process for changing timetables has been altered over the past couple of years, again, because of the radically changing demand during the pandemic. As traffic returns, we can see that it is not returning in a uniform way across the whole network. A quick look at some of the rail usage statistics would show that. But we do expect Southeastern to be responsive to the feedback that it is getting, although I take on board the fact that, particularly at peak times in London, there have been shifts in public demand.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough) (Lab)]

The former Transport Secretary was very keen to try to steal Labour’s clothes with the announcement of Great British Railways, no doubt mindful that the overwhelming majority of voters support nationalisation. Sadly, his version of Great British Railways was not the real deal. I am sure that my hon. Friend on the Front Bench will be more than happy to take the Minister or his successor through Labour’s White Paper, “GB Rail: Labour’s plan for a nationally integrated publicly owned railway”. Would the Minister like to take up the offer?

[Kevin Foster]

It is extremely kind of the hon. Gentleman to offer to take me through a Labour party policy document. However, I would rather stick with the plan for rail that is the Government’s policy—the one that we will continue to take forward. My focus will always be, not on dogma, but on whether customers and communities are being served. Considering the way Labour Members try to portray British Rail as a panacea of customer services, I suggest they look back on some of the old news reports about how it used to operate.

[Mr Ben Bradshaw (Exeter) (Lab)]

The long-awaited transport Bill, which has now been abandoned despite having been in the Queen’s Speech just months ago, was not just going to deliver Great British Railways, but address a whole range of pressing and long-overdue transport problems in this country: the menace of pavement parking, regulating e-scooters and so on. Is not the reason for this chaos that we do not have, and have not had for some months, a functioning Government? Would it not be more democratic and better if there was a general election and we had a Government with a mandate that was united to address the pressing problems the country faces?

[Kevin Foster]

It is interesting to hear the right hon. Gentleman say he wants to see the legislative timetable accelerated and, in the same breath, that he wants to dissolve Parliament. We will get on with the job and leave the politicking to others.

[Dame Diana Johnson (Kingston upon Hull North) (Lab)]

The Minister says he is getting on with the job, so can he please get on with the job for passengers facing daily misery in Hull? TransPennine Express cancels dozens of services every day, causing real problems for commuters. It is also responsible for the toilets at Hull station, but cannot even manage to keep those clean and maintained. Can he ensure that TransPennine honours its contractual obligations and, if it cannot, that he terminates its contract?

[Kevin Foster]

Certainly we will be keen to ensure TransPennine is not just offering a bog-standard service to the right hon. Lady’s constituents. If the company is not honouring its contract, we will certainly be happy to pick that up with it and ensure that it does.

[Dan Jarvis (Barnsley Central) (Lab)]

I declare an interest, as a big supporter of the Doncaster bid, but I share the frustration of many across local government who have committed time and money in good faith to a process that so far has not delivered an outcome. Given that uncertainty, and the need to confirm the Government’s intentions for Northern Powerhouse Rail, which the Minister mentioned a moment ago, does he agree that there is an urgent requirement for the Secretary of State or a senior member of the Government to come to the House and provide clarity about the Government’s intentions in this particular area?

[Kevin Foster]

I have already made clear that we will—hopefully I will—look to make an announcement around the result of the headquarters competition for Great British Railways. I take on board the points made by a number of hon. Members about wishing to have a decision on which of our great railway communities will host that HQ. On the second point about Northern Powerhouse Rail, the hon. Gentleman will have heard the commitment. We are keen to engage with the region and key stakeholders, including Members of Parliament representing the communities, about how we turn the vision into a hard plan for delivery.

Oral Answers to Questions

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Thursday 13th October 2022 Commons Chamber

[James Wild (North West Norfolk) (Con)]

1. Whether her Department has made an assessment of the accuracy of the benefit-cost ratio in the outline business case submitted by Network Rail for the Ely area capacity enhancement under the rail network enhancement pipeline.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Kevin Foster)]

As a fellow Blue Fox, I always had a lot of time with David, and a great friendship. I join you, Mr Speaker, in your tributes to him and James. I also reflect that last Friday marked 70 years since the collision involving three trains at Harrow and Wealdstone station where 112 people lost their lives in our worst peacetime rail incident. We remember those who were lost.

The benefit-cost ratio for the Ely area capacity enhancement was calculated and assured by Network Rail as part of the development of the outline business case for the scheme. We have no reason to doubt the robustness of the benefit-cost ratio.

[James Wild]

I welcome the Minister to his place, and indeed the new Front-Bench team. The project is backed by MPs across the east of England because it would increase capacity by 30%, enabling more passenger and freight services and delivering a major boost to growth. Given the overwhelming economic benefits that it offers, will the Government ensure that this much-delayed project, for which my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister has been campaigning for more than a decade, is now fast-tracked and moves to the next phase?

[Kevin Foster]

My hon. Friend is a strong champion for the Ely scheme, and I recognise the potential for the benefits that he highlighted. It is, though, worth noting that the scheme would require significant public funding with a total cost of up to £500 million, so we need to consider that as part of reviewing patterns of rail travel post the pandemic. We will therefore seek to provide as much clarity as possible when we publish an update to the rail network enhancements pipeline.

[Dan Jarvis (Barnsley Central) (Lab)]

2. What recent steps her Department has taken to deliver major transport infrastructure projects in the north of England.

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[George Freeman (Mid Norfolk) (Con)]

4. Whether her Department is taking steps to increase investment in the regeneration of stations outside cities to (a) improve access for (i) local residents, (ii) commuters and (iii) tourists and (b) support growth hubs.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Kevin Foster)]

The Government recognise that stations are the heart of many communities across our country, providing vital transport links. We are investing in stations through the new stations fund and the restoring your railway programme, as well as through wider enhancement and renewal schemes. We are also providing accessibility improvements through the £383 million Access for All programme.

[George Freeman]

I am grateful for that answer. No region is more poised to deliver growth for this country than the east, with agritech, cleantech, biotech and every other tech, but we are being held back by terrible infrastructure. The residents of East Anglia want a commitment to regional rail—what Network Rail dismisses as small regional routes—right at the heart of a growth vision. Will my right hon. and hon. Friends agree to support the role of stations in rural areas? There are 52 in East Anglia. They could all be innovation hubs and be redeveloped. They are going nowhere at the moment. In particular, there is Wymondham station in my patch, where disabled passengers have to go to Norwich to change platforms. We have waited 10 years. My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister has made big commitments. Will the Minister meet me to drive rural stations for growth?

[Kevin Foster]

I am always delighted to meet colleagues who share my passion for investing in our rail network and who recognise that our stations are not just a handy place to board a train, but are sometimes the heart of a local community. We are investing in our stations: for example, we recently delivered a new mobility hub at Norwich station in the east of England. I am very happy to meet my hon. Friend.

[Tim Farron (Westmorland and Lonsdale) (LD)]

Staveley station in my constituency, on the Lakes line from Oxenholme to Windermere, has 41 steps to get up to it. It is 100% inaccessible to anybody with a mobility problem. That is an outrage. We have bid into several pots over the years, but because it is not a main line station, it never qualifies for any funding. Will the Minister meet me and local rail campaigners to make sure that Staveley station is accessible for everyone?

[Kevin Foster]

As the hon. Member will know, we are making great progress on accessibility through our Access for All programme across our stations. We are also completing an accessibility audit of all the stations on our network. I am happy to meet him to talk about his station and I look forward to announcing, in the next year, the latest round of stations that will benefit from Access for All improvements.

[Priti Patel (Witham) (Con)]

I welcome the Minister to his new role and thank him for all his work in the Home Office.

Will the Minister commit to the upgrade of Witham train station, which has been under debate and discussion for many years? Importantly, will he help with the accessibility issue at Marks Tey station? I also invite him to come to Marks Tey station to look at the work that is needed to make it fully accessible.

[Kevin Foster]

I have a feeling that I will hear quite a lot about Chorley station over the next few months, Mr Speaker.

Turning to matters in Essex, I am delighted to see my right hon. Friend in her place, campaigning hard for her constituents. I would be delighted to visit—I expect that that is an invitation I really cannot refuse.

[Rachel Hopkins (Luton South) (Lab)]

Luton town station is our gateway to our town centre. People use it to go to work and football fans use it to go to the match, but as local people know and consistently tell me, it is not fit for purpose. It is decrepit and run down. Will the Minister outline the details of when the Access for All work will begin to install lifts to the four out of five platforms that are inaccessible? More importantly, to grow our local economy, will he commit to funding a comprehensive renovation to the station to make it fit for the 21st century?

[Kevin Foster]

I am happy to respond in more detail, perhaps in writing, about when work is planned to take place. I recognise the important role that the station plays at the heart of her constituency and community.

[Catherine West (Hornsey and Wood Green) (Lab)]

5. Whether her Department has made an assessment of the level of funding that will be required to meet its cycling targets for (a) 2025 and (b) 2030.

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[Sara Britcliffe (Hyndburn) (Con)]

7. What recent assessment she has made of the potential merits of modernising the railways.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Kevin Foster)]

The need to reform our railways is now even stronger than when the “Plan for Rail” White Paper was published in 2021. The lasting consequences of covid-19 on passenger numbers and revenue, and the impact of strikes on railway customers, have increased the need for reform. The Government will ensure we have a modern railway, fit for the 21st century, that meets customers’ needs, supports growth and decarbonisation, harnesses the best of the private sector and connects our communities.

[Sara Britcliffe]

Earlier this week I had the pleasure of opening the new disabled access ramp at Accrington station, as part of our wider plans to make this station and others across Hyndburn and Haslingden accessible for all. As we have two further stations in the pipeline—Church and Oswaldtwistle, and Rushden—can my right hon. Friend confirm that these bids will be looked on favourably? To modernise our railway stations, we need to make sure that everybody can use them.

[Kevin Foster]

I absolutely agree, and I am delighted to hear that my hon. Friend was in attendance to open the improvements at Accrington station, where the existing non-compliant ramp was modified. The Department recently received 309 nominations for the next round of Access for All, including Rushden and Oswaldtwistle, and I will look to announce the successful stations next year.

[Rachael Maskell (York Central) (Lab/Co-op)]

York’s powerful rail cluster is driving innovation and modernisation across the rail network—a real asset to Great British Railways. Obviously, we are waiting to hear what is happening to the headquarters of GB Railways and the relocation outside of London, because the timetable has slipped. Will the Minister say when he is planning to announce where that new headquarters will be?

[Kevin Foster]

I have had many powerful representations made on behalf of York, including from the local council at last week’s Conservative party conference. We will confirm our intentions around announcing the location of the headquarters shortly.

[Mr Louie French (Old Bexley and Sidcup) (Con)]

Modernising our railways and maintaining services are vitally important. Thousands of residents in Old Bexley and Sidcup have already completed my survey outlining their concerns over Southeastern’s December timetable changes on the Bexleyheath and Sidcup lines. Will the rail Minister please meet me again to discuss these concerns and Southeastern’s lack of consultation?

[Kevin Foster]

As always, my hon. Friend is a doughty campaigner for his constituents. He has already been in contact with me a number of times and I think we may have a meeting scheduled, at which I look forward to exploring these issues further with him.

[Wendy Chamberlain (North East Fife) (LD)]

Leuchars train station in my constituency is the only station serving St Andrews. It is a hub for local communities and the large number of tourists and students who go to the town, but the access bridge installed in 1995 is no longer fit for purpose and those who require step-free access cannot use it. I have been in contact with the Scottish Government and I am pleased with what the Minister has said about funding announcements next year for Access for All, but can he provide clarity on who is the final decision maker?

[Kevin Foster]

My understanding is that accessibility is a reserved matter, hence we will announce the successful stations as the UK Government. Obviously, in looking at access, we will liaise with the Scottish Government on potential priorities. We want to make sure that there is a fair spread of spending across the UK, looking at a number of factors, including usage, how inaccessible a station is, and the type of facilities it provides.

[Amanda Milling (Cannock Chase) (Con)]

Accessibility is a real issue at some stations in Cannock Chase; at Rugeley Trent Valley, for example, there is a footbridge to two of the platforms. Will my hon. Friend meet me to discuss how we can modernise stations across Cannock Chase to ensure that they are accessible for everyone?

[Kevin Foster]

I recognise the representations that my right hon. Friend makes, and I will be happy to meet her. We have already agreed improvements that should deliver over 100 more accessible step-free routes. The vast majority of passengers are now able to make their journey through a step-free station, but we recognise that, due to the historical nature of much of our infrastructure, far too many stations still are not able to be used by all. That is why we asked for nominations; we have received 309, and we look forward to announcing next year the next list of stations to receive improvements.

[Patrick Grady (Glasgow North) (Ind)]

The Scottish Government recently took ScotRail into public ownership, which has revitalised the industry, created new stations and effectively decarbonised train travel. They have also chosen to end the Caledonian Sleeper contract, because it does not give value for money to the taxpayer. When will the UK Government fully devolve Network Rail so that Scotland’s railway is fully under the control of Scotland’s Government?

[Kevin Foster]

I understand why the SNP, given its plans for a border at Berwick, may not see having an integrated rail network across the entirety of Great Britain as a priority. We believe it is right that we have an integrated rail network and infrastructure across Great Britain, and that is why it remains a reserved matter.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Minister.

[Mr Tanmanjeet Singh Dhesi (Slough) (Lab)]

I welcome the new ministerial team to their place.

To address the failure of privatisation and fragmentation, just last year the Secretary of State’s predecessor, the right hon. Member for Welwyn Hatfield (Grant Shapps), announced the launch of Great British Railways. There were promotional videos with Michael Portillo and a nationwide campaign to host the new headquarters, with towns and cities investing enormous time, effort and money in their bids. There is a huge transition team, and millions of pounds of public money has already been spent. But now we hear that the whole thing is being scrapped and will not be included in the transport Bill. I appreciate that this Government are infamous for their U-turns and creating confusion, but can the Minister confirm: has Great British Railways been stopped in its tracks?

[Kevin Foster]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for welcoming me to my place and I look forward to perhaps more constructive exchanges. We are taking forward an ambitious programme to reform our railways. We look forward to confirming the position on the Great British Railways headquarters in the very near future. I have to say to the hon. Gentleman that, for those of us who remember his clarion call to bring back British Rail, that hardly brings back memories of amazing customer service and quality provision compared with what we have today.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the SNP spokesperson.

[Gavin Newlands (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (SNP)]

I, too, welcome the new Minister to his place. I often talk favourably about Scotland’s record on rail modernisation, as we actually get on and modernise infrastructure while down here the Tories focus on pushing the sector to “modernise”—to cut the workforce’s terms and conditions. Following similar comments from the Scottish Trades Union Congress general secretary at the weekend, Mick Lynch of the National Union of Rail, Maritime and Transport Workers said yesterday that in Scotland we have an attitude of wanting to resolve workforce disputes, whereas down here the Government want to exacerbate them for political reasons. Has this new team at the helm asked Network Rail and the train operating companies to get round the table and properly negotiate with freedom? If not, why not?

[Kevin Foster]

Again, as the hon. Gentleman will be well aware, my right hon. Friend the Transport Secretary has met leading members of the unions, but we are not the employer in this dispute. It is important that the unions sit down, stop striking and get on with coming to a deal that is fair not just for workers but for taxpayers, who have put £16 billion into supporting our railways over the last couple of years.

[Imran Hussain (Bradford East) (Lab)]

9. Whether her Department is taking steps to help reduce rail journey times between Bradford and Manchester.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Kevin Foster)]

The Prime Minister has been clear that the Government will deliver Northern Powerhouse Rail in full and it will stop at Bradford. That is a pledge I am sure the hon. Gentleman will welcome.

[Imran Hussain]

I, too, welcome the Minister to his team, and I also welcome his comments. As he will know, Northern Powerhouse Rail will slash journey times from Bradford to Manchester dramatically, bringing much-needed and immense investment to Bradford. He is right to say that the Chancellor and Prime Minister have previously made this commitment, so will he add some further clarity to this excellent news for Bradford by setting out today a timetable of funding and construction, and when the Government will finally start work on this programme in full?

[Kevin Foster]

I am glad to hear that the hon. Gentleman shares my enthusiasm for that project, which, as he says, will make a massive difference for communities in Bradford. As he will appreciate, I am not going to lay out the detailed construction timetable here in the House, but we certainly intend to engage with leaders in the region and look forward to setting out further details in due course.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State, Louise Haigh.

[Louise Haigh (Sheffield, Heeley) (Lab)]

Northern Powerhouse Rail, and the billions of pounds in growth and tens of thousands of jobs, depend on HS2 being delivered in full. So will the Minister guarantee that the HS2 leg beyond Birmingham to Manchester will not be the victim of his Chancellor’s kamikaze Budget?

[Kevin Foster]

We have already got the Bill for the line through to Crewe through this Parliament. The next Bill, for phase 2b and the line up to Manchester, will soon be before its Select Committee. People can see our commitment to HS2: we are building it.

[Owen Thompson (Midlothian) (SNP)]

10. Whether she has had recent discussions with the Secretary of State for the Home Department on the (a) level of vacancies and (b) potential merits of expanding the shortage occupation list in the transport sector.

--- Later in debate ---

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

T2. Previous Ministers for rail have been up to the National Memorial Arboretum to see the existing freight line between Lichfield and Burton. It would be remarkably cheap to convert it into a passenger rail line. It would relieve traffic on the A38 and provide direct contact for veterans to go to the National Memorial Arboretum. So, having had a load of Ministers coming up, may I invite my right hon. Friend—a very good friend—the Secretary of State to come up and visit me at the National Memorial Arboretum, which she will enjoy, and see the benefits of making that line available for passenger traffic?

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Kevin Foster)]

I thank my hon. Friend. His invitation sounded so wonderful that I, as the Rail Minister, insisted on coming to the Dispatch Box to accept it. I do note that the proposed scheme was previously unsuccessful under the restoring your railway programme, but I am happy to continue working with him to explore opportunities to improve the rail transport offer in this area.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Minister.

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[John Lamont (Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk) (Con)]

T9. The Borderlands growth deal is a fantastic example of the UK Government delivering for local people, but transport officials are delaying and dragging their feet over the next steps to extend the Borders railway to Hawick, Newcastleton and on to Carlisle. The lack of progress is frustrating for me, local campaigners and my local council. Will the Minister agree today to urgently speed up this process so that we can deliver better transport links across the Scottish Borders?

[Kevin Foster]

My hon. Friend will know that I am only too keen to enhance the links across the border rather than put border infrastructure in place as others would wish to do. We are currently considering advice regarding next steps for the proposal. In particular, I am keen to see a feasibility study in place for the restoration of the whole rail route. I would be happy to put in writing more details for him in the very near future.

[Helen Morgan (North Shropshire) (LD)]

T3. Bus services in the market towns of my constituency are some of the worst in the country. People who cannot drive in those towns are unable to access not only their high street, but hospital appointments. Studies have shown that for every £1 invested in bus infrastructure we generate about £8 in economic benefits. Will the Secretary of State support me in helping to level up rural market towns and pass my Bus Services Bill to improve this critical piece of local infrastructure?

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[David Rutley (Macclesfield) (Con)]

Sadly, too many local residents and passengers have experienced cancelled and disrupted Avanti West Coast train services over recent months, despite the excellent service of the team at Macclesfield railway station. Can my right hon. Friend confirm that Avanti’s day-to-day operational performance over the period of the new short-term contract will also be a material factor in determining who will be awarded the long-term National Rail contract to operate west coast services after April 2023? Local passengers deserve better.

[Kevin Foster]

I could not agree more with my hon. Friend. The current service is not acceptable, as I have made clear directly to Avanti’s most senior management, and significant improvements are needed. We will be monitoring Avanti’s performance over the next six months, particularly the implementation of its recovery plan, before making a decision in April 2023.

--- Later in debate ---

[Fleur Anderson (Putney) (Lab)]

T8. It is not just the Prime Minister’s economic mess that is keeping my Putney constituents up at night, but the deafening return of Heathrow early morning flights. Some are coming in at 4 or 4.30 in the morning, when they should not be before 6 o’clock. Flights should start at 6, but Heathrow keeps pushing the boundaries. Will the Secretary of State publish the data on exactly how many late-running flights are being granted special dispensation to break the night-time curfew, the reasons why and what action she will take if it transpires that Heathrow is breaking the restrictions on it?

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Kevin Foster)]

I am interested to hear that, although I would note that now the economy is reviving Heathrow has gone back to being the busiest airport in Europe. But it must operate within the law and we will investigate any evidence that that is not the case.

[Maria Caulfield (Lewes) (Con)]

Parishes in my constituency such as Ditchling and Ringmer want to introduce road safety measures including reducing the speed limit and cutting the number of HGVs coming through the villages, but they have been told by the local highways authority that not enough fatalities have occurred. Will the Minister outline how we can change the policy so that we can make villages in my constituency safer?

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Foster]

I am delighted to note the support from the Opposition for the statement that the Prime Minister made last week, as I am sure she will be. We will certainly make sure that we set out in detail soon, having engaged with those in the region who have a clear interest in the detail of the plan and how we ensure that we deliver the many benefits that project will bring at the same time as minimising the impact of construction.

[Scott Benton (Blackpool South) (Con)]

Creating a passing loop on the South Fylde line would double the number of trains coming into south Blackpool every hour, assisting businesses such as Blackpool Pleasure Beach to create new jobs and investment. Will the new Minister meet me and my hon. Friend the Member for Fylde (Mark Menzies) to discuss the opportunities that could deliver?

[Mr Speaker]

A quick yes will do.

[Kevin Foster]

Yes.

[Chi Onwurah (Newcastle upon Tyne Central) (Lab)]

Over the summer my constituents experienced atrocious service from local bus companies, with elderly and frail constituents forced to wait for hours at bus stops without knowing whether a bus was coming or not. Will the Minister with responsibility for buses, and my neighbour the Secretary of State, meet me so we can sort out at least an acceptable bus service for my constituents?

--- Later in debate ---

[Mike Amesbury (Weaver Vale) (Lab)]

I welcome the new Ministers to their places. What recent discussions has the Secretary of State had with the Secretary of State for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities about the excellent Winnington bridge and transport corridor round 2 bid?

[Kevin Foster]

We are always keen to hear positive proposals to help to level up our communities, and we meet regularly with ministerial colleagues. I am particularly passionate about the role rail will play in levelling up, but roads and other aspects are important as we make sure that communities get the investment they deserve.

[Helen Whately (Faversham and Mid Kent) (Con)]

Whenever there is a major delay at the channel crossings in Kent, motorways in my constituency are turned into lorry parks and Kent comes to a standstill. The fact is that Kent is carrying the can for a gap in our national infrastructure. May I urge my right hon. Friend to work with Kent MPs on this problem and be the Transport Secretary who solves it?

Hedge End Train Station: Accessibility

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Wednesday 12th October 2022 Commons Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Kevin Foster)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Eastleigh (Paul Holmes) on securing this debate on rail accessibility at Hedge End station in his constituency. This might be my first trip to the Dispatch Box as Rail Minister, but I know that it is far from the first time that the issue has been raised on the Floor of the House. Thanks to his determined campaigning efforts, this is, I think, the second such debate since his election in 2019. The debate is a good opportunity not only to reply to his points about Hedge End but to set out the Government’s continued work to make our rail network more accessible for all passengers.

Transport is at the heart of how we go about our daily lives. It gets us to work and places of education, allows us to run our businesses efficiently and enables us to build connections with people all over the country. More than 14 million people in Great Britain identify as having a disability, and even more people will find that they have struggled to access a railway station due to a mobility issue. The Government recognise how inaccessible transport is a barrier to unlocking their potential, as my hon. Friend and my hon. Friend the Member for Wimbledon (Stephen Hammond) outlined. However, while our railway’s heritage is magnificent, it means that many stations date from a time when the needs of disabled customers were simply not considered, and the infrastructure available reflects that.

While we estimate that 75% of rail journeys are made through step-free stations, we recognise that only about a fifth of all stations have full step-free accessible routes into the station and, crucially, between each platform. My hon. Friend the Member for Eastleigh highlighted this with Hedge End, and I can think of a station in my constituency where access to one platform can be achieved only via two flights of steps. For some, that situation at their local station is the barrier preventing them from using rail at all, and that is fundamentally unfair.

Making rail fully accessible for all—whether for a person with a disability or, for that matter, for a person struggling with a heavy pushchair or a suitcase—is of great importance to the Government. The inclusive transport strategy published in 2018 set out our ambition for all disabled people to have equal access to transport by 2030. Where physical infrastructure remains a barrier, assistance may also play a role in making access equal. Good progress is being made on the commitments set out in the strategy. In 2021, we published the plan for rail, which set out how the railway specifically must evolve to meet the needs of its customers. As part of the plan, the Government announced the development of a national rail accessibility strategy: a step change in rail network accessibility for disabled passengers and those with accessibility needs.

The plan also committed to a comprehensive accessibility audit of rail network facilities to provide us with a complete understanding of what stations in Great Britain look like today and to set us in the direction of change. The benefits of that are twofold. The data generated will be made publicly available, enabling passengers to plan their journeys better. It will also equip the Government and the rail industry to better target future investments to bring stations into the 21st century. The audit is progressing well, with more than 85% of Great British mainline stations already audited and the remainder to be completed by spring 2023. That will give us a really complete picture of what accessibility looks like at each station beyond whether it is step-free.

The Government will continue to push the rail industry to comply with its legal obligations to meet current accessibility standards. The Department also requires train operating companies to set out in their accessible travel policy how passengers can book assistance or alternative accessible transport in advance where accessible infrastructure is not yet available. The passenger assistance programme is in place to make accessible journeys easier, providing support to disabled passengers in planning their journeys with confidence and in safety.

I am very aware that accepting and adapting to current accessibility infrastructure is not enough. We must invest in transforming our rail infrastructure to ensure that it meets accessibility needs for years to come. The Access for All programme does just that. Since launching in 2006, the programme has provided step-free accessible routes at more than 200 stations, including at Southampton Parkway in 2010. It has also provided about 1,500 smaller-scale improvements such as accessible toilets and improved customer information systems—all things that make it easier for someone to make their journey.

The inclusive transport strategy extended the programme to 2024, providing nearly £400 million of additional funding. That will deliver accessible routes at more than 100 additional stations, with 24 already completed since 2019. To accelerate delivery of further step-free accessible routes, we recently closed nominations for stations during the next railway funding period, which begins in 2024. Any station in Great Britain without full step-free access was a potential candidate. I am pleased to say that more than 300 stations were nominated and to confirm that Hedge End was one of those stations. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Eastleigh for endorsing the nomination. I suspect that another nomination might also have come in from the constituency of my hon. Friend the Member for Wimbledon. The Department will now assess the nominations with Network Rail, using the same criteria as for previous tranches.

All inaccessible stations deserve funding—we want a network that is accessible for all—but it is essential that the Government allocate Access for All funding fairly, with consideration of a wide range of criteria. The selection process takes into account annual footfall, the incidence of disability in the area and, sometimes, proximity to particular facilities that those with mobility issues might need to access, such as a local hospital. It also considers the availability of third-party funding and the operational views of the rail industry. We will look to continue to ensure a fair geographical spread of projects across the country. I expect to be able to make an announcement on shortlisted stations next year.

Once again, I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Eastleigh for securing this debate on rail accessibility at Hedge End station. In responding, I wanted to demonstrate the work that the Government are doing to improve rail accessibility, despite the limitations historic buildings and infrastructure place on us. We are improving our knowledge of the accessibility picture on our rail network through the stations accessibility audit. We are setting out our plans for improvements in the upcoming national rail accessibility strategy along with delivering infrastructure improvements through successful programmes such as Access for All.

I am committed to improving rail accessibility for all passengers, so I am grateful for the representations made today by my hon. Friends. They strengthen the case for the work we are doing. I know that my hon. Friends are both constant and active advocates for the needs of their constituents and I know that if there is not a commitment forthcoming in the future this will almost certainly not be the last time we discuss step-free access at Hedge End station on the Floor of the House. I know my hon. Friend the Member for Eastleigh will realise why it would not be right for me to give him a firm commitment today ahead of the wider announcements on the Access for All scheme, not least given the wider interest among many Members from both sides of the House who have supported and promoted schemes, but I know he will be on my case until he gets what he wants for his constituents.

Question put and agreed to.

Oral Answers to Questions

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Thursday 21st March 2019 Commons Chamber

[Andrew Jones]

I should point out that 98p in every £1 paid in fares goes back into investment in the industry. The argument about nationalising the railways is one that we have had here before, and I think it is the wrong approach. The approach that we have taken for the past 25 years has led to a record growth in passenger numbers, a record number of services on our network and a record level of safety across our network. The hon. Gentleman’s suggestion would simply move us back to the 1970s and to a model that failed.

[Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)]

13. What plans he has to improve the resilience of the rail network in (a) Devon, (b) Cornwall and (c) Somerset.

[The Secretary of State for Transport (Chris Grayling)]

I was very pleased to be in Dawlish last month to kick off the next stage of our programme to make the railway line there resilient against storms and floods. The £80 million investment in the new sea wall south of the station should mean that the line does not get blocked by high tides as it has done in the past, and I look forward to that work being completed later this year. Further work at Dawlish will follow, and we have also completed work around Exeter to provide greater resilience in that area. It is a real priority for this Government to ensure that the rail network in the south-west does not get disconnected by storms and bad weather in the future.

[Kevin Foster]

I thank my right hon. Friend for giving me such a positive answer. The news of the £80 million funding for the new sea wall was very welcome for the whole region. As he knows, when the Dawlish line is cut off, the whole of Devon and Cornwall is cut off from the network. Can he confirm that, if the local council gives planning permission for the work, it will be started very quickly, to deliver this much-needed scheme?

[Chris Grayling]

I very much hope that the work will commence within a matter of weeks. We will then need to go on and deal with the cliffs, which are a significant issue and will require longer development and consent processes because of the extremely sensitive environment around them. It is my view that we need to sort out the cliffs as well as the sea wall.

EU Exit Preparations: Ferry Contracts

Kevin Foster Excerpts

Tuesday 5th March 2019 Commons Chamber

[Charlie Elphicke]

I have given way quite a lot, so I will make some progress.

The Secretary of State has worked hard in the national interest to make sure that contingency plans, once authorised, have been taken forward. I pressed him on the point, because I wanted to see a new route from Dover to Zeebrugge in Belgium, but it would have required a level of intervention that is difficult under the procurement rules. As it was, he undertook procedures that were known within the Department to be legally risky, but were seen as being in the national interest because of the time available. I have to agree that that decision was in the national interest. It would have been very easy for the port of Dover to go for an opportunistic legal action on the basis that it was being shut out of the process, but it would not have been the right thing to do.

Everyone across the country could see what the Secretary of State was trying to achieve: to take pressure off the port of Dover and the channel tunnel in case there were difficulties with France. That was a concern at the time because of the kind of rhetoric that was coming from the French President, Monsieur Macron. Now that things have moved on and we know that the European Union will extend transit on a no-deal basis, the risk of such difficulties is much less, but that was not known at the time. It is right that the Secretary of State and the Department take measures based on the information before them.

[Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)]

I am listening to my hon. Friend’s speech with quite some interest. If he had to choose between the risk of potential legal action and the risk of no medicines for our NHS, would he make the same choice as the Secretary of State?

[Charlie Elphicke]

Therein lies the heart of this debate. The Opposition are saying that the Secretary of State should not have taken this action at all. They are attacking him for taking contingency planning measures.The kernel of their argument is that he was wrong to take them. I think that that is incredibly opportunistic. As I said, he may or may not have been allowed out of the traps as early as many of us in this House would have liked, but once he was away, he took the measures that were necessary.

Beyond the whole issue of contingency planning, some important improvements are needed in our country. The reason we need contingency planning is that we have not invested in our border systems and infrastructure as perhaps we might have done in the past. To set out the case for my constituents and the people of Kent, we need to ensure that our infrastructure is better prepared, because—irrespective of Brexit—we have big queues in Kent and problems on the ferries and in the tunnel.

Contingency planning or no contingency planning, there needs to be investment in more lorry parking in Kent, and the Department for Transport needs to be more effective in taking it forward. The roads to the port need upgrades. In particular, the A2 dualling, which was taken out of the programme by John Prescott in 1997 as one of the cuts in the early days of the then Labour Government, is long overdue and needs to be brought back as quickly as possible. It is also incredibly important that contingency plans work on a balanced basis between the tunnel and the port of Dover.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Speaker]

Order. The hon. Member for Torbay (Kevin Foster) did not actually put in to speak.

[Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)]

I have bobbed.

[Mr Speaker]

The hon. Gentleman may have bobbed, but I have just told him—

[Kevin Foster]

rose—

--- Later in debate ---

[Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)]

Thank you for your guidance, Mr Speaker. I will of course observe that courtesy. I would not wish to prevent other Members from having the opportunity to contribute to this debate.

It is interesting to follow the hon. Member for Glasgow North West (Carol Monaghan), particularly given her interest in Coventry airport. As a former deputy leader of Coventry City Council, I know that one of the issues for that airport is that it is quite an underutilised resource since passenger flights from it were ended a couple of years back, when, sadly, the then Labour Government decided not to allow the airport permission for a terminal that would have allowed that service to become financially sustainable. Helpfully, there is quite a large resource there and an ability to develop it further. I hope that gives her some reassurances. Certainly, it is an airport that could contribute a lot more to our economy more generally. I will now focus my remarks more on Torbay.

There is a bit of a groundhog day feeling to this debate. Those who come here to tell us how dreadful no deal would be and to raise legitimate concerns about what that may mean for business and the economy, normally the next day pop back to complain about measures to mitigate no deal. There was always going to be a need to try to move with some urgency, particularly in relation to what the contract is actually about. We keep on talking about the ferries, but what we were actually talking about yesterday is the fact that this is about securing the supply of vital medicines into the UK if there is disruption at the border.

It is worth noting that there was not a contract just with Seaborne Freight; that is how it is regularly portrayed, for pretty obvious reasons. There are also contracts with DFDS and Brittany Ferries, which represent the majority of the capacity. Those contracts are still in place, even though the one with Seaborne Freight is not. As I said in my intervention on my hon. Friend the Member for Dover (Charlie Elphicke), whose speech I found quite informative and useful, this is about the balance of the debate. Let us be candid: if the Secretary of State had refused to take a decision to create additional capacity, we would probably be here debating the potential lack of capacity for medicines to be transported into this country in a no-deal scenario. Instead, we are debating whether the legal risk was the right one to take. That is ultimately the nub of this debate.

In any scenario, we cannot say 100% exactly what the legal risk will be. No one presenting a legal case to court, particularly with any move towards reaching an out-of-court settlement, is going to start with the gambit, “We think we’re done—now we’re going to come here and negotiate.” That would clearly be an absolutely ludicrous position to adopt at the start of any discussions. I have taken part in such discussions myself. Both sides are always going to start with the fact that they feel their case is strong. We would be surprised if Eurotunnel walked in the door having decided that its case was not.

[Joanna Cherry]

Has the hon. Gentleman, like myself and the official Opposition spokesman, ever come across a commercial case where the settler stipulates how the settlee must spend the money? That is simply unheard of. Will he contradict that?

[Kevin Foster]

I thank the hon. and learned Lady for her intervention, which gives me an opportunity to confirm that this is not about £33 million going straight into Eurotunnel shareholders’ pockets—it is about spending it on specified outcomes. I am perfectly content to see what the settlement is being used for.

[Alan Brown]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Kevin Foster]

I will continue with my speech for a few moments.

This is not about just handing over £33 million. It is about the fact that investment will follow with a company that—let us be blunt—the Government work very closely with on a range of issues. If there were disruption at the border, the Opposition would immediately be having a go and complaining about it, yet now they are complaining about measures to try to mitigate disruption in case of a no-deal outcome.

For me, this is about that balance. The Secretary of State would have had to look at the legal risk versus the risk of no medicines coming into the NHS. That is the nub of the decision. If every decision went perfectly, there would never be a debate in this Chamber about it. That is what this fundamentally boils down to. [Interruption.] If the shadow Secretary of State, who is chuntering from a sedentary position, is saying that he would not have awarded the contracts and that he would have taken the risk on the supply of medicines in a no-deal scenario, that is a position that he could defend. I do not think that would have been the right decision. My personal view is that it would be better to take a legal risk than a risk with vital life-saving medicines, but he can try to defend his view if he wishes to.

[Alan Brown]

The Secretary of State has argued that the £33 million will not be going directly to the Eurotunnel shareholders because of the improved services, border systems and security. Can the hon. Gentleman clarify for the House what these additional services are, because we would all appreciate that?

[Kevin Foster]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. When we are investing in border security, we do not usually put the exact details of what we are doing out there, do we? However, that issue has certainly been covered.

[Alan Brown]

rose—

[Kevin Foster]

The hon. Gentleman has had his answers to his points. He may not like the answers he gets, but he has had them and I will not take a further intervention.

Some people have come here today talking about the fact that we should take no deal off the table and that would make all this absolutely pointless. I am afraid that we cannot simply take no deal off the table. We have to do one of two things. To be fair, the Scottish National party and the Liberal Democrats take the consistent position that they would look to ignore the referendum result by revoking article 50. In effect, they would take no deal off the table by staying in the European Union. The only other option to take no deal off the table is to agree a deal with the European Union. That is where we see the inconsistency of many of Labour’s positions. It is all very well Labour Members saying, “I don’t like this deal; I don’t want that deal,” but, unless they are prepared to say that they would revoke article 50—there are two parties that are still on that platform; I do not agree with that but it is at least a coherent position—then it is absolute nonsense to come here and say, “We don’t like any of the deals but we demand that no deal be taken off the table.” That is absolute tosh and rubbish.

[Peter Grant]

Has the hon. Gentleman read the alternative deal that was put forward by the Scottish Government in December 2016?

[Kevin Foster]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. I did read the White Paper put out by the Scottish National party a few years ago that was a bit of a work of fiction. My understanding, unless he wants to correct me, is that his position is that he wishes to remain in the European Union.

[Peter Grant]

rose—

[Kevin Foster]

If the hon. Gentleman is going to get up and say that it is not, that will be quite a surprise for quite a number of Scottish National party supporters.

[Peter Grant]

I take it from his non-answer that the hon. Gentleman has not bothered to read that document. What the Scottish Government put forward over two years ago showed a willingness to make a significant compromise. They would have been willing to consider a deal that kept us in a single market and customs union if it allowed Scotland—and, indeed, Northern Ireland—to have the wishes of our people respected. It is a pity that he clearly has not bothered to read that document. Although his Government have completely ignored it, I would still recommend it to him because it might yet show us a way out of the shambles that they are creating.

[Kevin Foster]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. As I say, I naively thought that his position was to stay in the European Union, because that is what I keep hearing in virtually every debate on Brexit that the Scottish National party contributes to. I recall the SNP Government’s proposals on staying and it makes the point: why on earth would anyone want to be outside the European Union while following all its laws, all its rules and all its customs obligations, and probably ending up still within its common fisheries policy, which, as we know, has had such an impact on the north-east of Scotland? It would continue to do so if we stayed in the European Union. We would be obliged to be part of it, despite the claims by the Scottish National party.

This debate is about having a go at no-deal preparations, while at the same time complaining that the impact of no deal would be too great. There is a real opportunity next week to put an end to all these discussions by voting for a deal. It is an opportunity for some Opposition Members to come off the fence and be clear about their options: the deal that has been negotiated, which is realistic and can be passed, or joining the SNP in voting to stay in the European Union. It is easy to make party political points. It is easy to have a go and criticise decisions that you know you probably would have taken. [Interruption.] Sorry, Mr Speaker—decisions that they know they would have taken; the only decisions you take are on who is called to speak and procedural matters in this House.

That is the nub of this debate. Ultimately, it was a legal risk versus a risk to medicine supply. Many Members sitting in the Chamber know what they would have done in those circumstances. The contracts with DFDS and Brittany Ferries are still in place, providing the majority of this capacity. Next week, people will have to start choosing between the alternatives that are actually on the table, not ones that they pretend might be.