Mr Peter Bedford (Mid Leicestershire) (Con)
The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Pat McFadden)
We inherited from the Conservative party a welfare system that forced too many people out of work and on to long-term benefits, while leaving millions of children in poverty. We have begun to address that through reforms to universal credit, increased employment support, more help for children in poverty and, now, a youth guarantee to offer work and training to young people who are unemployed.
Sarah Bool
The oldest law in economics is that if we tax something more, we get less of it. The inverse is also true: if we subsidise something more, we get more of it. Why do this Government believe that subsidising unemployment through huge increases to the welfare bill will not lead to more unemployment? Will the Secretary of State accept that those changes disincentivise work, and will he tell the House how much the Budget is expected to increase unemployment?
Pat McFadden
The Conservative party watched the number of those who are not in education, employment or training grow year by year and did nothing about it. The hon. Lady will find that, at the Budget a couple of weeks ago, the Office for Budget Responsibility projected that the levels of people in employment will rise in every year of the forecast.
Mr Bedford
In their first Budget, the Government hiked taxes on employers, leading to a sustained increase in unemployment. Earlier this year, we saw a botched attempt to reform welfare, which is now going to cost us more in welfare spending, and in the Chancellor’s “Nightmare before Christmas” Budget, she hammered hard-working families with yet more tax rises. Why do the Government loathe aspiration and hard work in favour of an economy based on welfare and state dependency?
Pat McFadden
The hon. Gentleman will find that the welfare budget had risen three times as fast as a proportion of GDP as it is projected to rise under this Government. We have begun to make changes through the reform to universal credit—that is more change in the system than his party introduced in many years—and, critically, to employment support for both the long-term sick and disabled and the young unemployed.
Lauren Edwards (Rochester and Strood) (Lab)
Around 600 young people in Rochester and Strood are claiming unemployment benefits; many more are NEETs—not in education, employment or training—and are not known to the Department for Work and Pensions. Does the Minister agree that the best way to improve their futures and reduce the welfare bill in the long term is through targeted support programmes, such as the youth guarantee, which will get them into good, stable jobs and off benefits?
Pat McFadden
We have a very different approach to the issue of NEETs from the Conservative party. We are not going to sit and look at the graph rise year by year without offering young people hope and aspiration for the future. That is why we brought forward a package, with £800 million of backing, to offer training or work to the young unemployed, and ensure that they have options in life rather than a life on benefits.
Neil Duncan-Jordan (Poole) (Lab)
I welcome the child poverty strategy published on Friday. Will the Secretary of State outline what more needs to be done to end child poverty for good?
Pat McFadden
It is estimated that the child poverty strategy we published on Friday will lift more than 500,000 children out of poverty by the end of this Parliament. Critically, most of the children in poverty are living in households where someone works, so setting up the working against the non-working is completely contrary to the facts on child poverty.
Helen Whately (Faversham and Mid Kent) (Con)
In the Budget last month, the Chancellor put up taxes in order to spend £16 billion more on welfare. The Government chose to make working people worse off in order to spend more on benefits. The sickness benefit bill is now set to skyrocket to more than £100 billion by the end of this decade. The Secretary of State likes to blame us, but his predecessor, the right hon. Member for Leicester West (Liz Kendall), cancelled our reforms, and Labour Back Benchers stymied the Government’s. Working people are saying to me, “Why bother? I’d be better off on benefits.” The country cannot afford that. The Secretary of State must know this—he is no fool—so when is he going to come up with some welfare savings?
Pat McFadden
The Conservatives’ zeal for change is very touching; it is just a pity that they only discovered it the day they stopped having any responsibility for running the welfare system. Let me remind the hon. Lady that this is the system that they created, and these are the gateways to benefits that they created. The reform that they put forward was struck down by the courts, and the incentives in the system that she attacks are the ones that they legislated for. Now we have begun to change the system, with the first change in universal credit incentives for years, more support for the long-term sick and disabled, and a youth guarantee that offers hope where previously there was only neglect.
Harriet Cross (Gordon and Buchan) (Con)
The Minister of State, Department for Work and Pensions (Dame Diana Johnson)
I am sure that the hon. Lady will be pleased to know that more than 329,000 more people are in work this year. The economically active working-age population has reached a record high of 34.3 million. However, the unemployment level has increased by 282,000 over the year. These figures show why we must continue supporting people into work with our Get Britain Working plan, which includes creating a new jobs and careers service, tackling economic inactivity due to ill health and delivering our youth guarantee.
Harriet Cross
As I am sure the Minister and the rest of the Front-Bench team know, we are seeing huge redundancies and mass unemployment within the oil and gas sector increasing every week. When did any of the Front-Bench DWP team last meet the oil and gas sector to discuss that?
Dame Diana Johnson
The hon. Lady might not know this, but I joined the team in September, so I will have to find out. I am happy to write to her about when the last meeting in that area took place.
Peter Fortune
I recently heard from Bill Perera, who runs a franchise of McDonald’s in my constituency of Bromley and Biggin Hill. He runs nine restaurants and employs nearly 800 people, 70% of whom are aged 16 to 24. He wants to increase this pathway and opportunity into employment for young people, but he is finding it increasingly difficult, because of the increased national insurance contributions. Does the Minister agree that one way to reduce unemployment would be to reverse this disastrous policy?
Dame Diana Johnson
The hon. Gentleman will know that, for under-21s, there are no national insurance contributions that are payable by an employer. I fully recognise that McDonald’s provides good-quality work for young people and is often their entry into the workplace. I am keen to work alongside employers. That is why we are looking at the jobs and careers service and how best we can engage with employers to ensure that they have a pipeline of young people who are ready to work and can get into those jobs, which is what the gentleman at McDonald’s to whom the hon. Gentleman has just referred is looking for.
Sonia Kumar (Dudley) (Lab)
I welcome the Government’s £820 million investment to help young people into work. In Dudley, one in five school leavers—the highest proportion in the country—are not in education, employment or training. Will the Minister guarantee that this funding prioritises areas with the greatest need, including Dudley? Will she commit to visiting my constituency?
Dame Diana Johnson
I welcome my hon. Friend’s question. The growth in the number of NEETs over time is absolutely a matter of inequality. The previous Government failed to tackle this issue and the numbers went up and up. This Government are going to do something, because it is about opportunity for young people and our economic future. We cannot have nearly a million young people not in education, employment or training.
Mr Jonathan Brash (Hartlepool) (Lab)
Since the general election, the number of people claiming universal credit in my constituency has fallen by 7.3%. Does the Minister agree that central to this Government’s mission of getting people back into work is that it must reach every part of the country, including those areas that have been let down for far too long?
Dame Diana Johnson
My hon. Friend is exactly right. At the mayors council on Thursday, we were discussing this very point about ensuring that all parts of the country benefit from employment opportunities for their local people.
Helen Whately (Faversham and Mid Kent) (Con)
I was sorry that the Secretary of State could not answer the question from my hon. Friend the Member for South Northamptonshire (Sarah Bool) earlier. Fortunately, there are people who can help. For instance, UKHospitality has told us that 100,000 people will lose their jobs because of the Budget. That is on top of the 150,000 jobs already lost since Labour came to power. At this rate, there will be queues forming outside jobcentres. Can she tell me what preparations the Government are making to cope with the influx of benefit claimants from all these job losses?
Dame Diana Johnson
May I just say gently to the shadow Secretary of State that she seems to be suffering from amnesia? We know that in the last four years of the previous Government, the number of NEETs increased by 50%. This is the Government who are going to do something about NEETs. We have our youth guarantee and our commitment to a subsidised job opportunity for those who have been out of work for 18 months or more. This is the Government who will tackle the NEETs problem.
Helen Whately
Businesses are cutting jobs at the fastest rate since the pandemic and unemployment has gone up every month under this Government, but clearly they are not ready to deal with the consequences. The number of jobcentre work coaches has actually fallen since they took over. No doubt the Minister will proudly tell us that they have just announced millions of pounds of spending on Government-created jobs for young people, but may I ask her to reflect for a moment? After hiking taxes on businesses so that they cannot afford to employ young people, the Government are spending a load of that tax on state-subsidised jobs for the same young people. Some are calling this the economics of the madhouse, but I simply call it Labour economics. Does the Minister not agree that the Government should get out of the way and reduce the burden on businesses so that they can create jobs, opportunities and economic growth?
Dame Diana Johnson
Of course we want employers and businesses to create jobs, but let me reiterate—as I am not sure that the shadow Secretary of State heard my earlier answer—that for the under-21s, no national insurance contributions are payable by an employer. Let me also refer her to my first answer and repeat that more than 329,000 more people are in work this year.
Blake Stephenson (Mid Bedfordshire) (Con)
The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Pat McFadden)
When this Government came to power, we inherited a situation in which almost 1 million young people were not in education, employment or training. As we have said, the number rose by 50% in the last few years of the Conservatives’ time in government, and they did nothing about it. That is why we are acting. In the Budget we announced a youth guarantee, with £820 million of investment, to offer hope where previously there was only Tory neglect.
Blake Stephenson
About 1,200 people in my constituency are not in education, employment or training. With two job-destroying Budgets and the Employment Rights Bill on the horizon, does the Minister really understand the concerns of my constituents, who feel that this Government are simply making it so much harder for young people to find work and get on the career ladder?
Pat McFadden
If the hon. Gentleman cared about young people and opportunity, he might regret the fact that there was a 40% decline in young people’s apprenticeships over the last decade, when his party were in power. As well as the introducing the youth guarantee, we have brough forward £725 million more in investment for apprenticeships—again, to provide hope where there was previously Tory neglect.
Ms Polly Billington (East Thanet) (Lab)
I welcome the commitment to free apprenticeships for small and medium-sized enterprises if they take on under-25s, which was announced in the Budget, and I also welcome the commitment to apprenticeships in the hospitality sector. Can my right hon. Friend confirm that there will be a focus on coastal communities such as East Thanet in these programmes, given the disproportionate number of young people written off by the Tories over the past 14 years and the significant number of small and medium-sized hospitality businesses, in particular, that are desperate to hire local talent?
Pat McFadden
My hon. Friend is right to point out that the issue of youth opportunity is also an issue of inequality, and that the rate of NEETs is often highest where deprivation and inequality are highest. That is why it is essential that we have an active policy, through the youth guarantee, to offer training, work experience, subsidised employment and more apprenticeships for young people.
Rebecca Smith (South West Devon) (Con)
Since the Chancellor delivered her Budget, it has come to light that benefits have been extended for the parents of teenagers with disabilities or illnesses. Although on the face of it that may seem kind and compassionate, it is also contradictory. Parents and carers are no longer required to ensure that their teenagers are attending an educational setting at all to receive additional child benefit, which means that young people living with neurodivergent conditions such as ADHD are being enabled to stay at home and out of education, training or even work. This flies directly in the face of the Prime Minister’s words after the Budget:
“if you’re not given the support you need…or if you are simply written off because you’re neurodivergent or disabled, then it can trap you in a cycle of worklessness and dependency for decades.”
May I ask the Secretary of State how extending access to benefits for conditions such as ADHD in teenagers before coming up with a plan to ensure that young people remain in full-time education and training delivers on the Prime Minister’s point?
Pat McFadden
I hate to sound repetitive, but the rates of absence from school rocketed when the Conservatives were in power. Again, this is something that we have begun to address, because children cannot achieve unless they are attending school. That is why absence from school really matters, and why my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Education has rightly made attendance such a high priority for herself and her Department.
Shaun Davies (Telford) (Lab)
The Minister for Social Security and Disability (Sir Stephen Timms)
Changes announced at the Budget will improve value for money for taxpayers while ensuring that the Motability scheme continues to provide outstanding support for disabled people.
Shaun Davies
The Motability scheme stems from the vital principle that people with disabilities should be able to live a dignified and independent life. I have heard from several constituents about how accessible cars can help them into work and healthcare, which I welcome, but I have also heard from a number of others about those with questionable conditions being provided with cars that, quite simply, the average working family could not afford. In many cases the cars are not even made in Britain. Does the Minister agree that, in order to keep faith and confidence in the scheme, it is really important that the scheme addresses real need across the country and in my constituency? Will he meet me to discuss some of the extreme cases that I am hearing about in Telford?
Sir Stephen Timms
I do agree with my hon. Friend, and I would be happy to meet him. Motability is an important scheme that does an important job. Some tax reliefs will be removed in July. Existing leases will not be affected, and neither will wheelchair-adapted vehicles. There will still be vehicles, with no up-front payment, that are affordable solely through the mobility component of personal independence payment, so the scheme will continue to do a great job but will give better value for money for taxpayers.
John Milne (Horsham) (LD)
The shadow Secretary of State for Work and Pensions recently stated that
“millions are getting benefits for anxiety or ADHD along with a free Motability car.”
That is clearly nonsense, because only 200,000 claimants—at most—would be eligible to apply in the first place, and many of them also have a physical disability, which is the real reason for the car. Does the Minister agree that this must rank as one of the least accurate claims ever made by a politician, despite the strong competition?
Sir Stephen Timms
Well, choosing the most misleading claim is a tough contest, but the hon. Gentleman is right. The shadow Secretary of State’s colleagues introduced PIP, with the current criteria, in 2013. They then had 11 years to change it if they thought doing so was necessary, but they did absolutely nothing. My review will look at the eligibility criteria for the mobility component of PIP.
Steve Race (Exeter) (Lab)
Emma Foody (Cramlington and Killingworth) (Lab/Co-op)
The Minister of State, Department for Work and Pensions (Dame Diana Johnson)
At the autumn Budget we built on the substantial action that we have already taken to tackle child poverty and announced the removal of the two-child limit, which will lift 450,000 children out of poverty by 2029-30. That rises to 550,000 alongside other measures, such as the expansion of free school meals set out in our child poverty strategy, which was published on Friday. The Secretary of State for Education will be making an oral statement on the child poverty strategy this afternoon.
Steve Race
I recently held roundtables with Exeter residents to discuss child poverty, which in some of our neighbourhoods runs as high as 30%. All the evidence suggests that ingrained poverty cuts across a wide range of policy areas, so I was delighted by the publication of the child poverty strategy and the introduction of the new measure of deep material poverty. Could the Minister set out what this will mean for integrated policy development across Government, so that we can end child poverty for good?
Dame Diana Johnson
May I commend my hon. Friend for his interest in this area? Deep material poverty is where families lack basic essentials, such as a warm home and healthy food. Families who cannot afford four or more of the 13 essential items are judged to be in deep material poverty, and 2 million children are in deep material poverty today. Over the course of the 10-year strategy, the items and thresholds that have been identified will not change, but they will enable us to use a broader set of measures when assessing our success in tackling child poverty.
Emma Foody
Child poverty in the north-east reached shameful levels under the previous Conservative Government, damaging the life chances of children and young people. As the Minister has set out, this Government are turning the tide with not only the removal of the two-child cap, but the expansion of free school meals and the introduction of breakfast clubs, lifting 550,000 children out of poverty. Can she set out how the child poverty taskforce will work with the north-east’s child poverty reduction unit to ensure that we can go even further in the north-east?
Dame Diana Johnson
Again, I thank my hon. Friend for her interest in this area. On Thursday I spoke to the North East Mayor, Kim McGuiness, at the North East combined authority about the excellent work that she is already undertaking through the child poverty reduction unit that she has created. Now that the strategy has been published, we will continue to work with mayors and local authorities, the public and private sectors, and civil society through a dedicated team in Government, with strong ministerial oversight, to deliver on tackling child poverty across the whole United Kingdom.
Tom Gordon (Harrogate and Knaresborough) (LD)
One thing that really concerns me is that I have met a number of parents who have had to leave work because of the unmet need of their children with special educational needs and disabilities. Children who are already really vulnerable are ending up being forced into poverty because there is not the support from schools and local authorities. What conversations has the Minister had about assessing the impact of SEND and how that leads to the unemployment of parents?
Dame Diana Johnson
That is obviously a very important question, and the Government are looking at the whole issue of SEND. I have been in the House long enough to know that the regime currently operating, which is not working for parents and children, was introduced by the previous Government—if I recall correctly, it was the Conservative Government rather than the coalition one—and we clearly need to look at how we can have a system that works, that supports families and children, and that helps parents get back into work.
Mr Joshua Reynolds (Maidenhead) (LD)
It took the Government a year and a half to confirm that they were going to scrap the two-child benefit cap. What estimate has the Minister made of the number of children who, during that time, were unnecessarily kept in poverty because of it?
Dame Diana Johnson
I think it is absolutely right and proper that this Government have the child poverty taskforce to look at not just the issue of the two-child limit, which is obviously very important, but all the other measures we need to have in place to support families. As the Employment Minister, I am particularly pleased that we have measures in the strategy to help parents into work—[Interruption.]
Mr Speaker
Order. Sorry about this. I do not want a complete conversation to be going on across the Chair. Mr Jopp, you are better than that. Being a Whip, you know that you are meant to set an example, not the opposite.
Dame Diana Johnson
I was saying that it is important that there are measures in the child poverty strategy to help with childcare in particular. It is not just that; we have free school meals and the breakfast clubs. There are also the issues of temporary accommodation. The statistic the hon. Gentleman perhaps wants me to give is that I understand 100 children a week were pushed into child poverty through the two-child limit that the previous Government introduced in 2017.
Gill Furniss (Sheffield Brightside and Hillsborough) (Lab)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Torsten Bell)
To tackle pensioner poverty, we are both increasing the state pension and running the biggest ever pension credit take-up campaign. Raising the new state pension in line with the triple lock over this Parliament is set to increase it by over £2,000 a year, while 60,000 extra pension credit awards were made in the year to July compared with the previous 12 months.
Gill Furniss
More than a quarter of a million pensioners received compensation from the Pension Protection Fund and the financial assistance scheme, but those who accrued their income before 1997 have suffered a real-terms cut of 24% in the past five years alone. I welcome the Chancellor’s commitment to provide indexation on these accruals, but many of those who will benefit are elderly and in ill health. Can the Minister confirm that he will implement this much-welcomed change as quickly as possible?
Torsten Bell
I thank my hon. Friend for that important question. I, like her, have met and listened to lots of those affected by the lack of indexation on pre-1997 accruals within the PPF and the FAS. I can assure her that, assuming the Pension Schemes Bill receives Royal Assent, the uprating will take place at the next PPF uprating, which means January 2027 on current estimates.
Sir Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con)
I am very grateful to the Minister to be in receipt of the triple lock, but it is not an effective way of tackling pensioner poverty and it is bankrupting the country. I am sorry not to be party political, but can we not have a consensus between the parties that we should phase out the triple lock, concentrate resources on pensioners in real poverty and have an agreement on dealing with benefits generally to get people back into work? We should work together.
Torsten Bell
I am always keen to work together with the Father of the House. He mentions the triple lock, but we are doing far more things to tackle pensioner poverty. There were 900,000 pensioners eligible for pension credit under the Conservatives who were not claiming, and that is why we have brought forward the biggest take-up campaign ever seen. The marketing campaign this year will run from September to the end of the financial year, we are carrying out research on what works to encourage take-up of pension credit and we are stepping up data sharing across Departments, including between His Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the Department for Work and Pensions.
Anna Dixon (Shipley) (Lab)
The Minister for Social Security and Disability (Sir Stephen Timms)
Liz Sayce did an outstanding forensic job in getting to the bottom of the carer’s allowance overpayment problems. We have accepted or partially accepted 38 of her 40 recommendations. The Department will reassess overpayments incurred between 2015 and last summer where fluctuating earnings were an issue, and we will set out detailed plans in the new year.
Anna Dixon
I thank the Minister for his response. As he well knows, over the last decade, around 185,000 unpaid family carers have been pursued by the Department for Work and Pensions to return overpayments in their carer’s allowance. Through no fault of their own, many working carers have faced bills that have often run into thousands of pounds. It is incredibly positive that, after years of inaction from the Tories, this Government have acted. Does the Minister share my hope that trust might now be rebuilt between the state and the near 6 million unpaid family carers in this country?
Sir Stephen Timms
My hon. Friend is a great campaigner for carers on this issue and others. She is absolutely right: this is a very serious problem that was ignored for 10 years, despite there being quite a lot of publicity about it. I hope, as she says, that trust will now be rebuilt as we fix these problems in the coming months.
Tim Farron (Westmorland and Lonsdale) (LD)
Cumbria has a much higher than average number of unpaid carers, largely due to the much higher than average number of people who are older, and the situation is exacerbated by rural isolation. It is a community with a significant amount of seasonal and variable work. What is the Minister doing to ensure that carers can take flexible seasonal work without fear of losing all support?
Sir Stephen Timms
The hon. Gentleman will know that the carer’s allowance has an earnings threshold, which we have increased very significantly—the biggest increase in the earnings threshold that there has ever been. We are also looking, in the longer term, at introducing a taper to carer’s allowance, instead of the cliff-edge earnings threshold that is still there at the moment. That will not be a quick fix, but once it is in place, I think it will help with the concern he raises.
Steve Darling (Torbay) (LD)
The Liberal Democrats welcome the fact that the Government have accepted the findings of the Sayce review into carer’s allowance overpayments, but what assurances can the Minister give that the Government will stop hounding carers about overpayments? Will the Government also apologise?
Sir Stephen Timms
I am very sorry about what happened to many carers. For example, only about half of the alerts that came into the Department from HMRC were checked, so overpayments that the Department had been notified of carried on for months and months. Of course, genuine overpayments do still need recovery and that work will continue. If people run into difficulties, it is always worth talking to the DWP debt management service.
Rosie Duffield (Canterbury) (Ind)
The Minister of State, Department for Work and Pensions (Dame Diana Johnson)
I thank the hon. Lady for her question; it is one that, like her, I take a deep interest in. Work coaches in jobcentres are trained to recognise a wide range of risks. If they identify safeguarding concerns, including a risk of commercial sexual exploitation, action is taken to escalate them to the appropriate agencies. The DWP does not accept jobs relating to sexual services, or those seeking employees for jobs of a sexual nature.
Rosie Duffield
Commercial sexual exploitation is the exchange of money, goods or services in return for sex acts. It is a form of violence against women. Inquiries by the all-party parliamentary group on commercial sexual exploitation have revealed that it is now taking place on an industrial scale. With the growth and mainstreaming of sites such as OnlyFans and online brothels such as Vivastreet, does the Minister agree that we should urgently outlaw pimping websites and force all pornography websites to verify the age and ongoing consent of everyone featured on their platform, as is proposed in amendments tabled to the Crime and Policing Bill?
Dame Diana Johnson
I thank the hon. Lady for her supplementary question. She will appreciate that she is raising a number of issues that are outside my role as Employment Minister, but I will certainly raise them with my ministerial colleagues in the relevant Departments. She may, however, be interested in today’s written ministerial statement on safeguarding in the DWP for vulnerable claimants, which sets out the work that is already under way to deliver in this important area.
Damian Hinds (East Hampshire) (Con)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Andrew Western)
Skills England is playing a central role in delivering the Government’s plan for change and industrial strategy. It is the authoritative voice on skills needs and is informing the post-16 education and skills White Paper; supporting the delivery of sector skills packages in digital, AI, engineering, construction and defence; and informing decision making through the labour market evidence group’s work on migration.
Damian Hinds
It really is not ideal to have the body responsible for upholding standards in qualifications inside a Department that will be judged on how many people it gets through to passing those qualifications. It was not ideal when it was at the Department for Education; it is even less ideal now that it is at the Department for Work and Pensions. Will the Minister give a commitment that once Skills England is up and running, he will make it independent from Government, with a guaranteed voice for industry, and will he set that out in statute?
Andrew Western
I appreciate the point that the right hon. Gentleman makes. Clearly we want to ensure that Skills England is set up to be successful and to have a real impact in delivering the skills that we need in the workforce now and into the future. I am very happy to commit today to setting up a meeting for the right hon. Gentleman, should he so wish, with the chair of the board of Skills England, Phil Smith, to discuss his concerns directly.
Gareth Snell (Stoke-on-Trent Central) (Lab/Co-op)
Skills England has the potential to really make an impact in places like north Staffordshire, where there are skills that we need for the jobs of tomorrow. However, those programmes are too often piloted through mayoral combined authorities, and we are a long way from that in Staffordshire. How will the Minister ensure that areas that do not have mayors on the horizon can access the same exciting opportunities as everywhere else?
Andrew Western
I recognise that my hon. Friend takes a keen interest in the delivery of these courses and in various skills training sectors in his constituency. Indeed, I am writing to him today in response to his last question. He is absolutely right that we need to ensure that areas that are further away from the establishment of MCAs are not left behind. That is a valid concern, and I will be certain to share it with my noble Friend the Skills Minister on his behalf.
Michelle Scrogham (Barrow and Furness) (Lab)
Perran Moon (Camborne and Redruth) (Lab)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Andrew Western)
We have already taken action: we published the skills White Paper in October and we are investing £1 billion in skills packages in sectors that will create hundreds of thousands of jobs over the next five years. The Budget set out more than £1.5 billion over the spending review period for investment in employment and skills support, including for the youth guarantee and apprenticeships for young people.
Michelle Scrogham
After 14 years of neglect, young people in Barrow and Furness are going to benefit from this Government’s commitment to supporting the apprenticeships that will drive our local economy. Does the Minister agree that Labour’s unprecedented investment in skills shows just how serious this Government’s commitment is to driving opportunity in communities like mine, and will he further agree that Barrow-in-Furness should be one of the locations for the Government’s new defence technical excellence colleges?
Andrew Western
I will take my hon. Friend’s two questions separately. I strongly agree with her on the first question, because this package of investment will fund new measures to support apprenticeships for young people, including by fully funding apprenticeships at small and medium-sized enterprises for eligible people aged 16 to 24 to boost small business starts and prioritise funding to young people, starting from the next academic year. We are working with colleagues in the Ministry of Defence and the Department for Education to deliver the £182 million defence skills package aimed at harnessing the skills needed for the future and meeting the needs of people at various stages in their training and career pathways. My hon. Friend is an exceptional champion for her community in Barrow and Furness. I will not be drawn directly on her question about the location of defence technical excellence colleges, but I would say that there is considerable and rich expertise in Barrow, and I am sure that a college there would be hugely successful.
Perran Moon
Cornwall has been identified as a strategically important region for renewable energy and critical minerals, but we currently have a worrying shortage of places at our outstanding further education colleges. Can the Minister reassure me that the necessary skills funding will be made available to support these growth industries in an area of high social deprivation that was neglected by the Conservatives for 14 years?
Andrew Western
My hon. Friend will be pleased to know that we published our clean energy jobs plan in October, which set out how we will deliver the pipeline of skilled workers that the sector needs. The plan includes five technical excellence colleges that will specialise in training skilled clean energy workforces as part of a £182 million investment to support engineering skills in clean energy occupations and other priority sectors. Local skills improvement plans will help to identify the key skills priorities for each area of the country, and clean energy and other green skills must be considered in the development of those plans.
Liz Jarvis (Eastleigh) (LD)
Stuart, the managing director of GW Martin—a precision engineering manufacturing firm based in my constituency—welcomes the additional support for apprentice training in small and medium-sized enterprises, but asks that the Government ensure that training providers will receive adequate funding to strengthen the training available. Can the Minister assure Stuart that fantastic SMEs such as GW Martin will be supported so that they can employ more young people from Eastleigh and give them meaningful opportunities to start their careers?
Andrew Western
I can give the hon. Lady that clear assurance, using two specific examples of the work the Government are doing. First, we have provided £725 million of additional support for the delivery of the growth and skills levy in the Budget. Secondly—specifically to the hon. Lady’s question—the delivery of apprenticeships for small and medium-sized enterprises will be fully funded for young people moving forward. That crucial intervention will ensure that the funding that this Government are allocating to apprenticeships tackles the problem of young people not in education, employment or training.
Sarah Dyke (Glastonbury and Somerton) (LD)
As was identified in the national food strategy, there is a shortage of skills in food and farming. The Liberal Democrats are proposing a “Farm First” scheme to give young people training and the incentive they need to choose a career in farming. Will the Minister outline the steps the Government are taking to create pathways to increase the number of post-16 learners who undertake training in food and farming?
Andrew Western
The hon. Lady will recognise the significant investment that this Government have put into agriculture more broadly since coming into office. I am not aware of the “Farm First” scheme, but if she would like to write to me about it, I would be happy to meet to discuss it further.
Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
The Minister of State, Department for Work and Pensions (Dame Diana Johnson)
I thank the hon. Lady for her very important question. The Government are committed to supporting those with mental health conditions, alongside those with other long-term health conditions and disabilities, into work. More disabled people and people with health conditions will be supported to enter and stay in work through our Pathways to Work guarantee and our Connect to Work supported employment programme.
Monica Harding
As is the case throughout the country, young constituents in Esher and Walton are out of work due to mental health conditions. I welcome departmental initiatives such as the disability employment advisers and cross-Government work through the joint work and health directorate and WorkWell. However, fragile mental health can be picked up on and supported earlier in school and may be a result of poorly identified special education needs—an area that we know is at breaking point—and the current state of mental health waiting lists; in Esher and Walton, for instance, the average wait for under-18s is 184 days. What current learnings from the Department for Work and Pensions are being fed back into the Department for Education and the Department of Health and Social Care to ensure that the next cohort is ready for work?
Dame Diana Johnson
The hon. Lady knows that there are already resources going into schools to provide mental health support to children and young people early on. There is also additional money going in through the Government’s investment into the NHS, which will include mental health services.
I am pleased that the hon. Lady highlighted the range of options available to people with mental health conditions, because we know that those people are very diverse and that there is no one thing that will support them into work and keep them in work. As she said, we have work coaches, Pathways to Work advisers, Connect to Work, and employment advisers in NHS talking therapies. There is a whole range of options to ensure that we get people with mental health conditions into work and keep them there.
Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)
What conversations has the Department had with the Department of Health and Social Care to ensure that the 10-year plan tackles the root causes of mental ill health? My constituents in Harlow tell me that they get mental health support only when they are really facing crisis, and by the time they have got to that crisis point, they have already given up work and training.
Dame Diana Johnson
My hon. Friend raises an important point. We know that 6,700 workers in the NHS are already providing that additional mental health support and, as I have said, work is going on in schools as well, recognising that early intervention is so important. I have also had meetings with the DHSC, particularly to look at how the two Departments can work together to ensure that we are providing wraparound care to people in work. This is happening alongside the Charlie Mayfield review “Keep Britain Working”, because we know that people may develop mental health conditions during the course of their life in employment, and we want to ensure that they stay in employment with the right support wrapped around them.
Paulette Hamilton (Birmingham Erdington) (Lab)
The Minister for Social Security and Disability (Sir Stephen Timms)
The Minister of State, Department for Work and Pensions, my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon Hull North and Cottingham (Dame Diana Johnson), just mentioned our Pathways to Work guarantee, which will offer everybody with health impairments on out-of-work benefits a support conversation to work out best next steps, one-to-one caseworker support for those ready to move towards work, specialist longer-term support for those who can benefit from that, and periodic engagement for those not yet ready to move towards work.
Paulette Hamilton
A constituent of mine with severe health needs recently told me that she gained employment only after she was able to learn to drive and then secure a car through the Motability scheme. Can the Minister set out what further steps the Department is taking to ensure that disabled people with health needs receive the support they need to gain access to work and to take part fully in the things they enjoy?
Sir Stephen Timms
There is a great deal of work to be done: the disability employment gap has been stuck at around 30 percentage points ever since 2010. We have talked already today about Motability, which is key for enabling many disabled people to get to work. After the changes next July, there will still be a wide range of vehicles available in exchange solely for mobility benefit. Access to Work is also extremely important. We consulted earlier in the year through our Green Paper on reform to Access to Work, so that we can help and support more people, and we will be bringing forward proposals along those lines in the new year.
Vikki Slade (Mid Dorset and North Poole) (LD)
I have been assisting several constituents who are deaf and need the support of British Sign Language interpreters and face-to-face appointments. There are only five BSL interpreters available to cover the whole of Dorset, and as a result people are waiting extremely long periods not only to get appointments but to get access to help them get to work. Can the Minister explain what is being done to provide more such services?
Sir Stephen Timms
I am sure that the hon. Lady will be interested in the recent report published by the BSL Advisory Board, which works with the Government specifically on BSL. I met members of the board last week. They produced a report recently on access to health and care support, specifically highlighting some of these issues. For example, how do BSL users make GP appointments? The other steps that I have outlined today will also be important for deaf and disabled people, and we will continue to work closely with BSL Advisory Board on these issues.
John Slinger (Rugby) (Lab)
The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Pat McFadden)
Since the last set of Work and Pensions oral questions, we have announced £820 million of funding to offer training and work to young unemployed people through the youth guarantee and £725 million more in apprenticeship investment, with 50,000 more apprenticeship starts for young people. We have responded positively to the Sayce review on carer’s allowance and we have published our child poverty strategy, which will lift more than half a million children out of poverty by the end of this Parliament.
John Slinger
I have been campaigning for a youth hub and working with officials in the DWP and local councils to try to secure a much-needed youth hub in Rugby. Does my right hon. Friend agree that this service, offering employment advice, wellbeing support and more, would help tackle the problem of youth dependency on benefits, which is at 16% in Rugby—roughly the national average? Does he further agree that, as young people would say: no cap, it is only this party that will do what is necessary to back young people?
Pat McFadden
My hon. Friend is right to say that youth hubs can deliver vital help to get young people back on track. This is about getting the jobcentre out of the jobcentre, if you will, and making sure that we meet young people where they are in the community. We are expanding youth hubs; there will be a total of 360 around the country. Locations will be announced in due course, and I am sure that my hon. Friend will keep campaigning for one in his area.
Mark Garnier (Wyre Forest) (Con)
The Chancellor’s Budget put a cap on salary sacrifice for pension savers at just £2,000. That was to raise an extra £4.8 billion in 2029, and it will affect 3.3 million savers and 290,000 employers. What research has the Pensions Minister done to understand and quantify the negative effects that this will have on pension savings?
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Torsten Bell)
I thank the hon. Gentleman for his question because it gives me a chance to bring the House’s attention to research published after the general election in 2024 but commissioned under the last Conservative Government—I have the document here. What was the research into? It was into capping salary sacrifice pension contributions at £2,000. The hon. Gentleman can read the research published and commissioned by his own party about putting back under control this tax relief, which had got out of hand.
Mark Garnier
Well, it was not us who put it in place; it was Labour.
This policy hits the private sector disproportionately: 14 times as many people save through salary sacrifice in the private sector as they do in the public sector. Whether it is kite-flying about lump sum withdrawal or taxing inherited pension pots, in a week when Labour Together is canvassing Labour members about a new Labour leader, is it not the case that the Chancellor is more interested in throwing red meat to her sad and unfortunate Back Benchers in a vain attempt to save her job than she is in the interests of the savings of our hard-working constituents?
Torsten Bell
There is nothing sad about Labour Members watching wages rise faster under this Government than they did under the Conservatives. There is nothing sad about our Back Benchers seeing the end of austerity and seeing public services being improved right across this country.
Mohammad Yasin (Bedford) (Lab)
The Minister for Social Security and Disability (Sir Stephen Timms)
As my hon. Friend says, it is against the law to impose age restrictions on jobs unless they can be objectively justified. The Equality Act 2010 provides legal redress. There is also practical help available through the Equality Advisory and Support Service, which his constituent should certainly give a call, and we have 50PLUS champions working across the whole of our jobcentre network.
Steve Darling (Torbay) (LD)
Disability News Service has stated that both the Treasury and the DWP have refused to clarify the £1.9 billion of cuts to disability benefits set to take place over the next five years that were quietly sneaked into the Budget the other week. Will the Minister now set the record straight and advise us on how those cuts, which amount to almost £2 billion, will occur and on what impacts they will have on people with disabilities?
Sir Stephen Timms
I do not know what the hon. Gentleman is referring to. I will happily look into the report he has spoken of. There will be no changes at all to eligibility for personal independence payments until the conclusion of my review, which will be in the autumn of next year.
Mike Kane (Wythenshawe and Sale East) (Lab)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Andrew Western)
I thank my hon. Friend and constituency neighbour for his question and for highlighting the record of the Conservatives on this issue. He knows that I know his constituency well. I also know the work of Nacro well, and I take this opportunity to commend that organisation. Youth hubs such as this one—along with our youth guarantee and other interventions—are a really important part of this Government’s work to bear down on young people not in education, employment and training.
Peter Fortune (Bromley and Biggin Hill) (Con)
The Minister of State, Department for Work and Pensions (Dame Diana Johnson)
The hon. Gentleman raises an important point. The transformation of our jobs and career service will provide wraparound support to individuals who are looking for work or career development. We want to change the feel of jobcentres so that they are about supporting people, rather than having people go in just to comply with benefit conditions.
Yuan Yang (Earley and Woodley) (Lab)
Dame Diana Johnson
I absolutely agree. We all know that child poverty stifles opportunity, making it harder for children to succeed and get on in life. Nearly 1 million young people aged 16 to 24 are not in education, employment or training. We need to break that cycle, and we will do so through the child poverty strategy.
Matt Vickers (Stockton West) (Con)
Pat McFadden
The hon. Gentleman attacks the system, gateways and conditions that his Government created. When it comes to working people and non-working people, he will be aware that most children in poverty live in a household in which someone works, as are most of the children helped by the lifting of the two-child limit. Those who are not are often children under the age of three with a lone parent.
Sally Jameson (Doncaster Central) (Lab/Co-op)
Andrew Western
My hon. Friend is correct. The Milburn review will consider all the interventions required to bear down on NEETs and to support institutions such as the Doncaster UTC. It will consider what is working, what is not, and what needs to change, given our shameful inheritance from the Conservative party of nearly 1 million young people not in education, employment or training.
Caroline Voaden (South Devon) (LD)
One of my constituents recently spent nearly two weeks calling the DWP every day to find out why his employment and support allowance had been stopped without warning. Each time he called, he waited for over an hour, only for the line to be cut off with no reply. Will the Minister explain to my constituent—and to the thousands of others who are out there hanging on a line somewhere—what action the Department is taking to ensure that vulnerable claimants can actually speak to a human when they need to?
Andrew Western
I thank the hon. Lady for raising that important case. If she writes to me about it, I will be certain to look into the circumstances she has set out. On telephony more generally, there has been a significant decrease—of more than a minute—in the average waiting time, but clearly the case that she describes is unacceptable, and I will look into it on her behalf.
Emma Foody (Cramlington and Killingworth) (Lab/Co-op)
Pat McFadden
My hon. Friend is right to raise that issue. The numbers of people not in education, employment or training have been going in that direction for several years. That is why we brought forward the youth guarantee, which will offer work experience, training and, ultimately, subsidised work, offering hope where previously there was only neglect.
Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)
We all know that disabled people often face higher energy bills. In my constituency, that is exacerbated by higher standing charges. The Government have now abolished the energy company obligation. Can the Minister tell me what support with bills will be available for disabled people this winter?
Sir Stephen Timms
In April, there will be a permanent real-terms increase in the headline rate of out-of-work benefits for the first time, I think, since the 1970s. We are taking £150 on average off household energy bills, expanding the £150 warm home discount to 6 million lower-income households, and freezing NHS prescription charges for a year.
Sonia Kumar (Dudley) (Lab)
Pat McFadden
It is always a pleasure to meet my parliamentary neighbour from Dudley. She is absolutely right to draw attention to the role of allied health professionals, because there is a strong link between good health and employment, and this problem has to be seen across departmental boundaries.
Lincoln Jopp (Spelthorne) (Con)
Following the Budget, a furious Labour voter, 30 years old, texted me to say, “I am furious about the salary sacrifice thing. I give up a lot of things to put 20% of my salary into my pension. That’s going to cost me almost two grand a year for being responsible.” Why are the Government so keen on punishing savers?
Torsten Bell
We are taking a pragmatic approach to reforming pension contributions made via salary sacrifice, the costs of which are set nearly to triple to £8 billion between 2017 and the end of this decade. The case for change was made powerfully by a previous Chancellor:
“The majority of employees pay tax on a cash salary, but some are able to sacrifice salary…and pay much lower tax… That is unfair”.—[Official Report, 23 November 2016; Vol. 617, c. 907.]
So said Baron Hammond of Runnymede.
Danny Beales (Uxbridge and South Ruislip) (Lab)
Pat McFadden
I applaud my hon. Friend’s campaigning for young people in his constituency. We are expanding the number of youth hubs, which will offer support across the country. The precise locations will be announced in due course.
Seamus Logan (Aberdeenshire North and Moray East) (SNP)
I recognise, as do so many Members across the House, the injustice and maladministration suffered by the so-called WASPI women born in the 1950s. I welcome the recent development announced by the Secretary of State, but will he give an undertaking that if compensation is agreed, it will take into account the poverty suffered by so many of these women and include recompense for their significant legal costs?
Torsten Bell
As the Secretary of State set out to the House a few months ago, the decision to which the hon. Member refers is being retaken by the Department, and we have committed to updating the House on that decision in due course.
Debbie Abrahams (Oldham East and Saddleworth) (Lab)
I warmly welcome the child poverty strategy published last week, and I congratulate past and present ministerial teams on all they have done on that strategy. Can my right hon. Friend give details on when he expects to publish the targets, the detailed metrics and the monitoring and review framework? Those are essential if we are to reduce child poverty.
Pat McFadden
I thank the Chair of the Select Committee for her question. We estimate that the measure will lift 450,000 children out of relative poverty, and 550,000 for the strategy as a whole. She is absolutely right to say that, having published the strategy, we will bring forward the legislation and monitor its impact right across Government and well beyond the boundaries of the DWP.
Helen Morgan (North Shropshire) (LD)
A lady came to my surgery the other week to tell me that she had been assessed at only the basic level of PIP and as fit to work. I was staggered, because she could barely walk and could barely breathe. Will the Minister meet me to see how we can rectify this crazy situation in which somebody who can barely walk to a surgery has been told that they are fit to work as a cleaner?
Sir Stephen Timms
Whether people get PIP is not about whether they can work—they may be working or not. The limited capability for work-related activity part of universal credit is about whether or not a person can work, but I will be very happy to have a conversation with the hon. Lady about what has happened.
Euan Stainbank (Falkirk) (Lab)
Some 1,750 kids in Falkirk, most of whom have a parent in work, will be lifted from poverty and its lifelong economic consequences by the fully funded lifting of the two-child cap. Does the Minister agree that the cost of this poverty-alleviation policy is far less than the long-term cost of leaving those parents in poverty?
Dame Diana Johnson
I agree with my hon. Friend. It is shocking that during the previous Government some 900,000 children were allowed to get into poverty. The cost of that will be borne by us all, which is why the investment now will pay dividends in the future.
Chris Law (Dundee Central) (SNP)
Since Maximus began the contract to provide work capability assessments in September last year, nearly 1,000 people have had their assessment appointments cancelled. However, a whistleblower has been in touch with me to state that cancellations are a regular occurrence largely because of IT services provided by the DWP. Shockingly, one of my constituents had their assessment cancelled five times in my city of Dundee. What action is the Minister taking to monitor and improve the service provided by Maximus so that no one has to suffer the distress of such cancellations?
Sir Stephen Timms
I would be happy to look into the details. I was not aware of that whistleblowing report, but I would be happy to look at it.
Lillian Jones (Kilmarnock and Loudoun) (Lab)
The youth guarantee scheme represents a clear statement of intent from this Labour Government. Unlike the Conservatives, we will not abandon our young people to a lifetime on benefits, or allow the mental health toll of long-term unemployment to define their futures. Will my right hon. Friend outline how this policy will deliver for those young people by providing skills, confidence and meaningful work, and deliver for the wider economy by turning potential into productivity and reducing the cost of economic inactivity?
Pat McFadden
My hon. Friend is right to say that purposeful activity, be it training or work, can be an answer to some of the mental health problems that we are seeing in society, so I welcome her endorsement of the youth guarantee and the intentions behind it.
Ian Sollom (St Neots and Mid Cambridgeshire) (LD)
Employers across the construction, care and manufacturing sectors have warned that Skills England’s dumbed down reforms mean that apprenticeships will not be recognised by professional bodies. Today’s announcement of 50,000 apprenticeships is meaningless if employers will not recognise those standards, so will the Secretary of State guarantee that reformed apprenticeships will still meet those standards? That is a particular concern in the construction industry—
Mr Speaker
Order. These are topical questions. I am trying to get everybody in but the hon. Member is not helping me. Hopefully, he asked at least three of his questions.
Pat McFadden
The hon. Member is right to say that apprenticeship standards are highly valued. Our constituents value what an apprenticeship means. As we take the scheme forward, it is important that the public and employers have trust in the high standards that an apprenticeship offers.
Tom Hayes (Bournemouth East) (Lab)
Nan Roberts is 92. She was widowed this year and is facing her first Christmas without her husband of 64 years, and she is feeling utterly fobbed off by a creaking DWP system. She is waiting for her “choices letter”, despite having ingoing state pension payments dating back to 1994. The threat of asking this question has already led to some action by the DWP, but will the Secretary of State outline how I can do more to support my constituent?
Torsten Bell
The hon. Gentleman is a powerful champion for his constituents and I am sure that all hon. Members will be unhappy to hear about this case. I know that staff from the Department for Work and Pensions have already been in touch with his office, and I am happy to follow up myself.
Torsten Bell
I thank the hon. Gentleman for his brief question. Pensioner poverty halved under the last Labour Government. It went up under the previous Conservative Government, but it is going to come down again under this Government.
Rachael Maskell (York Central) (Lab/Co-op)
On Friday, I learned of an 81-year-old constituent who had had to return to work because of the cost of living in York. Will the Government take a deep dive and carry out an inquiry into poverty in later life, so that we can ensure that we deal with pensioner poverty once and for all?
Torsten Bell
I thank my hon. Friend for her important question. We have seen poverty rates fall less fast among people approaching the state pension age, rather than those over it. We need to look across the range of policy levers to address that, which includes growing the economy so that wages are rising and building houses so that people’s housing costs come down.
Jayne Kirkham (Truro and Falmouth) (Lab/Co-op)
Cornwall Marine Network in my constituency is a small and medium-sized enterprise members association that provides training and apprenticeship support. It recently celebrated providing 5,000 new jobs and apprenticeships. It will welcome the Government’s youth guarantee and the news that SMEs will not have to pay for apprenticeship training for under-25s. Will the Minister confirm how this Government will increase the capacity of such training providers?
Pat McFadden
I warmly commend my hon. Friend and the company she mentions. One of the apprenticeship reforms that we have announced is fully funding apprenticeships for SMEs for under-25s. That will help companies such as the one she mentions, and many more besides.
Brian Leishman (Alloa and Grangemouth) (Lab)
The Injury Time campaign wants to classify brain injuries in football, such as dementia, as an industrial injury. The campaign wants former players to receive Government support and benefits and wants an increase in funding for research. Will the relevant Minister meet me and PFA Scotland to discuss this important topic?
Sir Stephen Timms
I would be very happy to meet my hon. Friend.