Oral Answers to Questions
Ian Murray Excerpts(3 weeks, 3 days ago)
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Richard Foord (Honiton and Sidmouth) (LD)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
First, Mr Speaker, I apologise to you and the House for Scottish questions overshadowing other events today.
I was pleased to join the Commonwealth Games Federation last week to confirm that Glasgow will host the Commonwealth games in 2026. It will be yet another wonderful opportunity for Scotland to show how we put on world-class sporting events. I also visited the Sir Chris Hoy velodrome and spoke to the next generation of cyclists, who have been inspired by Sir Chris. I am sure that the whole House will wish to pass on their best wishes to him and his family. I also congratulate Scotland women’s football team, who qualified for the play-offs yesterday after a 4-0 win over Hungary.
I was delighted to join the Prime Minister as he hosted the inaugural meeting of the Council of Nations and Regions at Queen Elizabeth House in Edinburgh earlier this month. We discussed opportunities for attracting long-term inward investment, stabilising the UK economy and creating good jobs. The council demonstrates our commitment to working together to deliver those priorities.
Richard Foord
It is essential that all the UK’s nations and regions have a seat at the council of nations and regions, alongside Scotland, yet areas such as the great south-west, which is home to over 3 million people and has an economy of £80 billion, are being left out because we do not have metro mayors. Will the Secretary of State speak to colleagues in the Cabinet Office to ensure that, on the council, Scotland can work with all the non-mayoral regions of England?
Ian Murray
On 16 July, the Deputy Prime Minister wrote to all areas that do not have a devolution deal to invite them to come forward with a proposal. New mayors established through that process would be eligible to sit on the Council of Nations and Regions. I will make sure that the Deputy Prime Minister forwards that letter to the hon. Gentleman.
Chris Murray (Edinburgh East and Musselburgh) (Lab)
It was brilliant to welcome the Prime Minister to my constituency for the first meeting of the Council of Nations and Regions. Following that meeting, are the Government committed to ending the decade and a half of austerity imposed on my constituents by the Conservative and SNP Governments?
Ian Murray
I was delighted to attend the Council of Nations and Regions, held in a Labour constituency in Edinburgh. I can assure my hon. Friend that our manifesto said “no return to austerity”, and that is what we are determined to deliver.
John Lamont (Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk) (Con)
The trade union Unite has issued a joint letter from political leaders across the United Kingdom’s nations and regions opposing Labour’s cut to the winter fuel payment. That letter has been signed by every party at Stormont and by parties in Wales, and the Scottish Conservative leader Russell Findlay also signed it. Was the winter fuel payment even discussed at the Council of Nations and Regions?
Ian Murray
I thought that, with a full House, the shadow Secretary of State would have taken the opportunity to apologise for his Government not only crashing the economy, but leaving a £22 billion black hole. That is something this Government are determined to clean up. [Interruption.]
Mr Speaker
Order. We have not even got to the Budget yet, Mr Bowie, and you are already excited. Come on, Secretary of State.
Ian Murray
I hope that, in a later question, the shadow Secretary of State will apologise at the Dispatch Box to the country for crashing the economy, and to pensioners for what has happened to them as a result.
Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
I was delighted to speak at the Space-Comm expo last month in Glasgow, where I met a wide range of industry members, both national and international, and recently I was fortunate enough to visit the SaxaVord spaceport in Shetland, where I saw wonderful progress. I have also met representatives of Orbex in the hon. Gentleman’s constituency, and will continue to champion Scotland’s spaceports, including in Sutherland in his constituency.
Jamie Stone
The Secretary of State mentions Orbex. At present, it employs 125 people; by 2030, it could employ as many as 500. Is the Secretary of State willing to visit Orbex in Elgin and, indeed, the Sutherland space launch site?
Ian Murray
Elgin is certainly not the final frontier, so I would be very happy to visit. The Minister for Science recently visited the UK Space Agency’s new office in Edinburgh, and during that visit, he echoed my sentiments about the importance of Scotland’s space sector. The Minister for Data Protection and Telecoms has recently met Orbex as well, and I will remain in close contact with my ministerial colleagues to ensure that we back the sector. I am very happy to visit when ministerial time allows.
Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)
As the Secretary of State knows, I recently had the opportunity to visit California with the Scottish Affairs Committee to look at how that state has created an environment that encourages new space projects. In Scotland, we have a unique opportunity, not least because of developments in Glasgow, but also because the University of Edinburgh is already well respected and part of the programmes at Stanford, New York University, Columbia and NASA. What will the Government do to encourage the creation of that sort of environment in Scotland, and will the University of Edinburgh, given its reputation, be central to that?
Ian Murray
Scotland will be central to the space sector, and I very much welcome the question. We will fully back the space sector, as I said to the Member for Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross (Jamie Stone). The Minister for Science has been to the UK Space Agency’s new office in Edinburgh, and the Minister for Data Protection and Telecoms has met Orbex. I have met Orbex and been to Unst in Shetland to visit the spaceport up there. We will fully back this; of course, its potential reaches to infinity and beyond.
Kenneth Stevenson (Airdrie and Shotts) (Lab)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
I welcome my hon. Friend to his place; it was a wonderful election result in his constituency of Airdrie and Shotts. Investment in the UK to drive growth is the Government’s No. 1 priority, and we have already started delivery on it. Just this month, we hosted an international investment summit, at which we announced £63 billion of shovel-ready investment across the UK. That includes the likes of Greenvolt’s £2.5 billion investment in Scotland and Iberdrola’s £24 billion investment in green energy. We also announced this week that Glasgow will host the Commonwealth games, which will bring £100 million to the city.
Kenneth Stevenson
I thank the Secretary of State for his answer. It is refreshing to see a Government working across Departments to ensure a pro-worker, pro-business and pro-growth approach that attracts inward investment. After years of Scotland being let down by two poor Governments, how does he see this new Labour Government approach benefiting my constituents in Airdrie and Shotts?
Ian Murray
The No. 1 benefit to my hon. Friend’s constituents in Airdrie and Shotts will be that they have him for their Member, championing them. I am pleased by his welcome for our approach. Airdrie and Shotts has a rich industrial heritage, and a modern industrial strategy will reignite the industrial and technological potential in all our communities. The national wealth fund and Great British Energy will help rebuild Scotland’s industrial base. We want Scotland to be the most attractive part of the UK to invest in, and we will continue to work closely with the Scottish Government to make that a reality. I could not put it better than my hon. Friend did: pro-worker, pro-business and pro-growth—that is this Government.
Chris Law (Dundee Central) (SNP)
Earlier this year, the UK Conservative Government promised a £20 million levelling-up partnership for my city of Dundee, for projects such as the university’s life sciences innovation district, a new campus for Dundee and Angus college, and the Dundee Museum of Transport. Despite having written two letters in the last four months seeking assurances about the funding, I have so far not received a commitment to it, which raises concerns that Labour is about to renege on this commitment. Can the Secretary of State assure me today that these projects and the £20 million for Dundee will be committed to in full?
Ian Murray
The hon. Gentleman will not have to wait long. The Budget is in about an hour’s time, and the Chancellor will lay out all the spending plans in that Budget. The biggest impact on his constituency of Dundee will of course be made by GB Energy, given what that will do to our green energy system; it makes me very surprised that nobody from the SNP voted to back the Bill last night.
Graeme Downie (Dunfermline and Dollar) (Lab)
Kirsteen Sullivan (Bathgate and Linlithgow) (Lab/Co-op)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
The crisis that we inherited from the previous Government is not just fiscal but industrial, because neither the previous Government nor the SNP had any proper industrial strategy for Scotland. Our industrial strategy will deliver certainty and stability, which businesses need in order to invest in the high-growth sectors that will drive long-term sustainable economic growth. Well-paid jobs are at the heart of our modern industrial strategy, which is complemented by our plan to make work pay. Our strategy is clear: as a Government, we are pro-business and pro-worker.
Kirsteen Sullivan
The new industrial strategy identifies creative industries as a key sector for UK growth. My constituency is a popular setting for film and TV productions, including the Lockerbie film and “Outlander”, as well as hosting the Pyramids studios. As film and TV make an increasingly important contribution to my constituency’s economy, what steps are the Government taking to support investment in the creative industries in my constituency?
Ian Murray
My hon. Friend mentions “Outlander”, which was filmed in Bathgate and Linlithgow, as well as the Lockerbie bombing film starring Colin Firth. The film “Damaged” is in production there. It stars Samuel L. Jackson—I hope he did a few leaflets for her while he was in her constituency. The creative industries are a jewel in Scotland and the UK’s crown, and there is the independent film tax credit announced earlier this week by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport. Films with distinct homegrown content and talent meet the criteria for that new relief. Productions eligible for the tax break must have a UK writer or director, or be certified as an official UK co-production. That shows that this Government are determined to back our creative industries, and to continue to grow our film and TV industries.
David Mundell (Dumfriesshire, Clydesdale and Tweeddale) (Con)
Does the Secretary of State share my anger and disappointment that the SNP Scottish Government dogmatically continue to block new nuclear developments in Scotland, depriving my constituency of important jobs and economic prospects? What can he do through the industrial strategy to ensure that we at least take advantage of decommissioning and supply chain opportunities?
Ian Murray
I have never known the right hon. Gentleman to be angry or disappointed, but I share his anger and disappointment. This Government back our industry. Nuclear will be a major part of the energy mix going forward, and we need to ensure that we have the right balance. GB Energy has been set up, and the related Bill passed Third Reading yesterday. I am disappointed that neither he nor the SNP voted for it, but that is the vehicle through which we will take these issues forward.
Adam Jogee (Newcastle-under-Lyme) (Lab)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
I welcome my hon. Friend to his place. The Budget, which will be announced by my right hon. Friend the Chancellor shortly, will herald a new era of investment and growth in Scotland. In our first 100 days, we announced the headquarters of GB Energy in Aberdeen, launched the national wealth fund and announced the biggest upgrade of workers’ rights in a generation.
Adam Jogee
Newcastle-under-Lyme is home to many people who left Scotland to build a life, such as my constituent Lee-Bernadette Walford. Can the Secretary of State outline how resetting the relationship between the UK and Scottish Governments is important for economic growth up and down our United Kingdom?
Ian Murray
We do not agree with the Scottish Government on everything—or, indeed, very much at all—but Scots expect us to work together to produce results, and that is what we have tried to do. Yesterday I had my regular meeting with the Deputy First Minister, and this morning I spoke to the Finance Secretary ahead of the Budget. Economic growth is a key area, and I am delighted to highlight shared work on energy, our bringing the Commonwealth games to Glasgow, and the jointly funded £100-million package for the Falkirk and Grangemouth growth deal. Our long- term economic strategy requires the Governments to work together. The Prime Minister and the First Minister have been clear that that is what we are determined to do.
Pete Wishart (Perth and Kinross-shire) (SNP)
The Secretary of State boasted of a £150-million investment fund, only to contradict himself, bizarrely, and say that no such figure existed. Is this Scottish Schrödinger’s funding? Is it perhaps the levelling-up fund referred to by my hon. Friend the Member for Dundee Central (Chris Law)?
Ian Murray
I am surprised that the hon. Gentleman was keen to ask a question, given that he did not apply for one in the shuffle—nor did any other SNP Member. It is also surprising that he, with all his experience in the House, wants to spend his time in this new Parliament defending the previous Tory Government’s reckless gambles with the economy.
Mr Speaker
Order. I do not know whether the Chair of the Select Committee is standing or not. Do you want to come in on this question?
Patricia Ferguson (Glasgow West) (Lab)
Yes, thank you, Mr Speaker. Does my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State agree that the Drumchapel levelling-up fund bid and the project that would follow from that would be a good way to promote the economic and social growth of the area?
Ian Murray
My hon. Friend has been a doughty campaigner for the Drumchapel project. She will not have long to wait, as the Chancellor will come to the Dispatch Box shortly and announce the Budget. I am hopeful that all these projects, including some of the anti-poverty projects that my hon. Friend has championed for years in her constituency, come to pass.
Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)
When it comes to promoting economic growth in Scotland, it is clear that the best way to do that is from within this great United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. What is the Minister doing to make that happen, and to convince my SNP colleagues sat in front of me of the best way forward?
Ian Murray
The best way to keep the United Kingdom together is to make sure that this is a successful UK Labour Government, and that is what we are determined to do. May I point the hon. Gentleman to the row in front of him? There are nine SNP MPs left, and we have 37 Scottish Labour MPs. That is how we protect the Union.
John Lamont (Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk) (Con)
The Secretary of State said at the weekend that the Labour Budget
“will herald an era of growth for Scotland”,
but what is going to grow? Is it the tax burden on hard-working Scots, the number of pensioners choosing between heating and eating because they have not got their winter fuel payments, or the number of Labour broken promises? Or will we get all three this afternoon?
Ian Murray
The hon. Gentleman had a second opportunity to apologise for the Conservative party crashing the economy, and the dreadful £22-billion black hole that we inherited, which was hidden from the Office for Budget Responsibility. I ask the shadow Secretary of State to reflect on that before he asks his questions. Of course, he will not have long to wait to find out, as the Chancellor will be here shortly.
John Lamont
There were no answers in that response. Not so long ago, the Secretary of State said that a national insurance rise would have “an enormous impact” on businesses. He also said that
“under Labour, National Insurance wouldn’t go up”.
Tax rises, economic damage and broken promises—are this Labour Government not just the same as the SNP?
Ian Murray
I thought the shadow Secretary of State was just describing his previous Government.
Blair McDougall (East Renfrewshire) (Lab)
Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
Scotland is rightly proud of its six world heritage sites. As the hon. Gentleman will appreciate, responsibility for planning decisions for large-scale energy projects in Scotland rests with Scottish Government Ministers. The UK Government work closely with the Scottish Government to deliver for Scotland, while respecting devolution. I meet regularly with my Scottish Government counterparts on these issues.
Mr Campbell
I thank—[Interruption.] I thank the Secretary of State for his reply. In any discussions he has, will he take account of the fact that I have written to UNESCO about the potential for a huge offshore wind farm very close to the Giant’s Causeway and the UNESCO world heritage site there? The Communities Minister in Northern Ireland has also met UNESCO. Will the Secretary of State make representations to ensure that all considerations are taken account of, so that people know the problems that may compromise that world heritage site?
Ian Murray
I am glad that the hon. Member has not lost any of his popularity in the House. It would be inappropriate for me to comment on planning decisions for large-scale energy projects in Scotland, as it is a devolved responsibility. I recognise the importance of considering the protection of local assets when developing renewable projects, particularly at cherished world heritage sites.
Points of Order
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Stephen Flynn (Aberdeen South) (SNP)
On a point of order, Mr Speaker.
In the wee hours of 9 June 2017, I watched on as the most talented, formidable and consequential politician of his generation—a man who had represented the people of Banff and Buchan, Aberdeenshire East and Gordon, a man who had served for two terms as the First Minister of Scotland—lost his parliamentary seat for the first time in 30 years. It is a moment I will never forget, not because of the nature of his defeat but for what happened next, because within just a few moments, Alex Salmond took to the podium and gave a speech that, despite all the despair that those of us in the SNP felt in the room that night, made us feel 10 ft tall. He gave us back the hope that things would get better, and would get better quickly.
Rabbie Burns once wrote:
“The heart ay’s the part ay
That makes us right or wrang.”
Alex gave all of us in the SNP the belief that what we felt in our hearts was worth fighting for—the belief that we could one day become an independent nation. Alex Salmond took us so very close to making that belief a reality.
At this time of profound shock and sorrow, I send my heartfelt personal condolences to Alex’s wife Moira, his wider family, his friends and his legion of fans across the nationalist movement and within the Alba party itself. It is of great personal sorrow to me that Alex Salmond will not live to see Scotland become an independent nation. The challenge for all of us now in the nationalist movement is to make sure that we put good his legacy and deliver the future he so badly fought for throughout his distinguished parliamentary career.
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
Further to that point of order, Mr Speaker. I know that colleagues from across the House will join me today in expressing our shock and sadness at the sudden passing of the right honourable Alex Salmond. He was a Member of this House for 25 years and of the Scottish Parliament for 11 years, and he was of course First Minister of Scotland for seven years. His impact wherever he served was profound.
My thoughts and sympathies are first and foremost with his family and friends and especially his wife Moira, who has already been mentioned. Members might not be aware that the Scotland Office brought Moira and Alex together; they met first as colleagues in that Department before marrying in 1981. My thoughts are also with those whose relationships with him had broken down in recent years and those who are finding this time difficult as they deal with a range of emotions.
It is no secret that some of his happiest periods as a politician were spent in this place, where he made alliances that may to some have seemed surprising. My thoughts today are particularly with the right hon. Member for Goole and Pocklington (Sir David Davis), who I know has lost a close friend, and with Alex’s SNP colleagues.
In the short period during which our careers in this place overlapped, I was always impressed with Alex’s formidable oratory and debating style. No Member from any part of this House was given an easy ride. He sat on the third Bench—where the leader of the SNP, the right hon. Member for Aberdeen South (Stephen Flynn) is today—during the passage of the Scotland Act 2016, chuntering and bantering in my ear every time I stood at the Opposition Dispatch Box. His love of lively discussion extended beyond this Chamber, and I was always keen to keep the topic on our shared passion for Heart of Midlothian football club, rather than constitutional matters.
It is impossible to overstate the impact that Alex had on Scotland and our politics. After half a century of involvement, from student activist to First Minister, whether you agreed or disagreed with his political objectives, there is no denying the rigour and commitment with which he pursued his goals. That commitment saw Alex lead the Scottish National party for a total of 20 years, taking it from a small political movement to the party of government in Scotland. In doing so, he secured a referendum on Scottish independence in 2014, an achievement that would surely have been scarcely believable for a student activist who joined the SNP in the early 1970s and perhaps even for the Alex Salmond who first led the party in the early 1990s.
As someone firmly on the opposite side of that debate, I know that the result of the referendum was a source of huge disappointment to Alex. It was testament to his conviction in the cause that he continued to campaign for Scottish independence with the same passion in Parliament, in the SNP, in the Alba party and in communities across Scotland throughout the past decade. He has left an indelible mark on Scottish politics and public life. I know that many in the independence movement and beyond will miss him. I once again send the deepest sympathies on behalf of the UK Government to all his family and friends at this difficult time.
John Lamont (Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk) (Con)
Further to those points of order, Mr Speaker. On behalf of the Opposition, I would also like to pay my tribute to the right honourable Alex Salmond. As others have said, despite political differences, we were all shocked and saddened to hear the news on Saturday of Alex Salmond’s sudden passing. He and I were both elected to the Scottish Parliament in 2007, and although we disagreed on many of the big issues of the day, not least the question of independence for Scotland, we all respect his dedication to public service as a Member of the Scottish Parliament, a Member of Parliament and as First Minister of Scotland. He was passionate, formidable, impressive and hugely charismatic. Alex Salmond was undoubtedly a giant in Scottish and United Kingdom politics. My sincere sympathies go to his wife Moira and to his wider family, in particular his sister Gail, who lives in Hawick in my constituency in the Scottish Borders. My thoughts and prayers are with them all.
Draft Social Security (Scotland) Act 2018 (Disability Assistance) (Consequential Modifications) Order 2024
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The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
I beg to move,
That the Committee has considered the draft Social Security (Scotland) Act 2018 (Disability Assistance) (Consequential Modifications) Order 2024.
It is a great pleasure to move our first Scotland Office motion and draft order as a Labour Government, and it is an even greater pleasure to have you in the Chair for this historic moment, Mr Efford. It is also great to have so many new Members in the room with us. I do not know what they have done to upset the Whips in order to have to be here at 9.25 on a Wednesday morning, but they are all here and obviously keen to get involved with this wonderful order, which I am sure they have all read.
Laid before the House on 26 July, the draft order is the result of collaborative working between the two Governments of Scotland, and supports the Scottish Government’s decision to introduce pension age disability payments in Scotland later this month. As I said, this is the first Scotland Act order that this new Labour Government have brought before a Committee to approve since our election, and given that it was started under the shadow Secretary of State for Scotland, I suppose it could be argued that it is another example of clearing up his mess.
The order comes in the year of the 25th anniversary of the Scottish Parliament, delivered by the last Labour Government. Devolution happened because of political giants such as the late John Smith and Donald Dewar who believed in a strong Scottish Parliament within the United Kingdom. Those men also believed in the values of co-operation over conflict, and understood that we achieve more by working together than we ever do by standing apart. It is in that spirit that this Government have set out to reset the relationship with the Scottish Government to deliver for the Scottish people. That is what the majority of Scots want, deserve and voted for on 4 July.
The Scotland Act 2016 devolved significant powers to the Scottish Parliament, including responsibility for social security benefits and employment support. The Scottish Government’s introduction of the pension age disability payment under section 31 of the Social Security (Scotland) Act 2018 exercises that responsibility. The Scottish Government, through their Executive agency, Social Security Scotland—that is a bit easier to say at this time of the morning than after three glasses of wine—will administer that benefit in Scotland.
As, at introduction, the pension age disability payment is broadly analogous to attendance allowance in England and Wales, it is the intention of the UK Government that those individuals in receipt of the pension age disability payment should also receive the same treatments in the reserved social security and tax systems as those on attendance allowance. Scottish recipients will transfer from the Department for Work and Pensions to Social Security Scotland.
The order before us today is made under section 104 of the Scotland Act 1998, which allows for necessary amendments to legislation
“in consequence of any provision made by or under any Act of the Scottish Parliament”.
It is therefore the appropriate vehicle to make these technical but important changes to recognise pension age disability payment in reserved systems. Scotland Act orders are a demonstration of devolution in action, and I am pleased to say that the Scotland Office has taken through more than 250 orders since devolution began in 1997.
I will explain the effect that this order will have and the provision that it will make. The order makes amendments to ensure that the pension age disability payment is recognised as a qualifying benefit in the same way as attendance allowance within the reserved social security system, with regard to entitlements to additional reserved UK Government benefits and premiums. This includes the Christmas bonus and carer’s allowance. It means that recipients of pension age disability payment will be entitled to receive the annual £10 Christmas bonus payment if it has not already been paid with another benefit. Should all other eligibility criteria be met, it will also ensure that reserved carer’s allowance can be paid to someone caring for someone in receipt of pension age disability payment in Scotland. It also amends the taxation of trusts with disabled beneficiaries to treat those with beneficiaries in receipt of pension age disability payments in the same way as those with beneficiaries who receive attendance allowance.
Once the order is in force, it will also prevent dual entitlement to benefits paid because of the same needs: individuals entitled to pension age disability payments cannot be entitled to receive personal independence payment, attendance allowance and disability living allowance at the same time. This is in the same way as disability living allowance and personal independence payment are not payable to people in receipt of attendance allowance before the transfer. The order will also prevent overlapping entitlement for pension age disability payments and armed forces independence payments.
Equivalent provision is being made in Northern Ireland in respect of pension age disability payments and to prevent dual entitlement to child disability payment and adult disability payment with equivalent Northern Ireland social security benefits. Child disability payment and adult disability payment are forms of disability assistance paid in Scotland, and introduced by Scottish Ministers under section 31 of the 2018 Act.
In summary, the order makes amendments to UK legislation to support the introduction of pension age disability payments in Scotland. It ensures that the new Scottish benefit can operate effectively and that its recipients are treated equitably. Twenty-five years into the Scottish Parliament, this is devolution in action. The vast majority of Scots want to see their Governments work together to produce better results for them, and that is what we are going to do.
Ian Murray
I thank the shadow Secretary of State for his contribution. He is right to praise the officials for bringing the order forward—they are always the heroes in these processes, as he well knows. I hope that he is not passing the blame on to the officials as well.
The shadow Secretary of State poses an important question about divergence. It will be a matter for the Government to decide what would happen in that case. It is obvious that, at the moment, the pension age disability payment is broadly on the same terms as the attendance allowance, which is why the order has come forward. Should there be a significant divergence in future, it will be up to the UK Government to consider a way to identify those clients in Scotland and to decide what would need to happen on that basis. We will keep the arrangement under review, as we keep all social security arrangements under such orders under review.
I welcome the hon. Member for Edinburgh West back to her place in the House of Commons. All the transfers happened under the Scotland Act 2016, which was eight years ago, so it is a hugely complicated process. We want to ensure that this transfer happens as smoothly as possible; we have seen mistakes and errors in the past, which is why we will keep the order under constant review. My plea to the Scottish Government and to Social Security Scotland is to work with the DWP and the UK Government in partnership to ensure that the transition is as smooth as possible and that nobody loses out or cannot access the system. A major part of the Joseph Rowntree Foundation’s “Poverty in Scotland 2024” review this week was about it being as easy as possible for people to access the system.
I thank hon. Members for their contributions and for being here to debate the order. It demonstrates the continued commitment of the UK Government to work with the Scottish Government to deliver for the people of Scotland.
Question put and agreed to.
Oral Answers to Questions
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Gregor Poynton (Livingston) (Lab)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
This is, of course, my first Scottish questions on this side of the House, and I am delighted to be joined by so many colleagues from Scotland behind me. I welcome back returning Members from all parties and thank those who have not returned for all their hard work on behalf of their constituents. I thank the former Secretary of State for Scotland, Sir Alister Jack, for his work representing Scotland in Whitehall and the UK Government in Scotland. I also thank all the staff in the Scotland Office for making us so welcome. Their professionalism is unsurpassed.
I am very pleased that we were recently able to welcome 19 female Afghan medical students to Scotland so that they can continue their studies. The work to bring them here was initiated by Sir Alister Jack, and their safe arrival in the UK is a credit to our commitment to helping them.
I congratulate the hon. Member for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk (John Lamont) on his new position. I am sure he will be diligent in holding me to account, and I hope that I was diligent in holding him to account.
I am sure the whole House will join me in congratulating Scotland’s Olympians and Paralympians, who have achieved so much sporting success this summer.
This Government will introduce a new industrial strategy to drive long-term, sustainable growth by securing investment in crucial sectors and industries in all parts of Scotland and the UK, which involves working in close partnership with the Scottish Government. That will support our national mission to have the highest sustained growth in the G7.
Martin Rhodes
An industrial strategy that embraces the jobs of the future must involve our higher education institutions, including the three world-class universities in Glasgow. What are the Government doing to ensure that that is the case?
Ian Murray
I thank my hon. Friend and congratulate him on his wonderful victory in Glasgow North. Scotland’s 19 world-class higher education institutions are an essential part of our economy, culture and global reputation, and they are paramount to the successful delivery of our missions. We punch well above our weight in Scotland, which is something that we need to protect and nurture. By the end of next week, I will have met the principals of all of Scotland’s universities. I want to deepen and strengthen those relationships, and I believe that the knowledge and expertise of those institutions will be crucial to delivering a new industrial strategy and the goals of this new Government.
Frank McNally
Coatbridge and Bellshill has a rich history of heavy industry, but following years of empty rhetoric and empty soundbites from the previous UK Government and the current Scottish Government, there has been a failure to honour the legacy of industry across Scotland and deliver a long-term, sustainable and coherent strategy. What steps will the Secretary of State take to ensure that industrial jobs in Scotland are as much a part of its future as they are of its history?
Ian Murray
I thank my hon. Friend and congratulate him on winning Coatbridge and Bellshill. Scotland and its world-class industrial workforce will play a driving role in our ambition to become a green energy powerhouse in this country. For example, my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero, the Scottish Government and I met representatives of Petroineos earlier this week to discuss what support can be provided to ensure a sustainable future for the industrial clusters in the wider Falkirk and Grangemouth region, which is crucial to the entirety of Scotland and the UK. That includes our commitment to fund Project Willow with the Scottish Government.
Gregor Poynton
I thank my right hon. Friend for his response. A UK-wide industrial strategy that supports jobs in Scotland is incredibly vital. However, this week we have heard the concerning news that the Mitsubishi Electric plant in my constituency is looking to reduce its workforce by 440 from its current complement of 1,600. This is a highly skilled workforce creating world-leading products such as air source heat pumps and air conditioning units, which are vital as we look to decarbonise our economy. Through no fault of its own, however, Mitsubishi Electric has seen its order book fall away due to short-term economic pressures. May I ask the Secretary of State to meet the management, workers and me to see what the UK Government can do to support—
Ian Murray
I thank my hon. Friend for his question. I am really sorry to hear of the difficulties facing Mitsubishi Electric’s workforce, and of the uncertainty those workers face during this difficult time. I pay tribute to my hon. Friend for his efforts to support the workers in his constituency, and we have talked about this issue already. I will commit as a matter of priority to a meeting with the company and its workforce in the coming weeks.
Mr Alistair Carmichael (Orkney and Shetland) (LD)
I, too, welcome the Secretary of State to his new position and congratulate him on his appointment to what I can tell him is a splendid job to hold in government. On an industrial strategy, will he focus his ministerial colleagues’ minds on the potential development of tidal stream generation? That provides an enormous opportunity for our manufacturing sector to create a supply chain that is based here in the United Kingdom, rather than having to bring capacity from overseas.
Ian Murray
I agree with the right hon. Gentleman and congratulate him on his role when he was in the Scotland Office. We hope to emulate much of the work that he did. I have met the European Marine Energy Centre and those involved with tidal resources in his constituency. This is critically important to our net zero ambitions and in getting to clean power by 2030. I am due to meet them when I visit his constituency in the coming weeks, and I will make sure that this is top of the agenda.
Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)
I congratulate the Secretary of State and welcome him to his place. I associate myself with his earlier remarks, particularly about Scotland’s Olympians and Paralympians. I was delighted to hear the recognition in his first answer of the role that our universities will play in a new industrial strategy, which is going to be vital in Scotland, particularly in the light of the recent admissions about the mess that the Scottish National party has made of our economy in Scotland. That is why I was baffled to see the UK Government cutting £800 million from a supercomputer project at the University of Edinburgh that has the potential to support research on drug discovery, climate change and advanced engineering. What discussions did the Secretary of State have with the Chancellor of the Exchequer about the impact of that?
Ian Murray
As the hon. Lady will know, the Chancellor of the Exchequer did a full audit of Government spending in the first weekend that she was in office, and found a £22 billion black hole. The exascale computer that she talks about was announced by two previous Prime Ministers and two previous Chancellors, and indeed was in the Budget in the early part of this year, but no money was allocated and therefore the project has been paused, pending both the Budget on 30 October and the spending review next year.
John Grady (Glasgow East) (Lab)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
I congratulate my hon. Friend on winning Glasgow East. The people of Scotland want their two Governments to spend more time fighting for them than fighting each other, which is why resetting the relationship has been a priority for this Government and, indeed, the Prime Minister. I have had numerous productive meetings with Scottish Government Ministers, including the Deputy First Minister. We have had 17 days of visits across Scotland, and seven members of the Cabinet have already visited. There have been dozens of calls between Secretaries of State and Cabinet Secretaries. I look forward to working with the Scottish Government to deliver our shared priorities for the people of Scotland.
John Grady
Scotland’s official economic forecaster, the Scottish Fiscal Commission, has said of the Scottish Budget that
“much of the pressure comes from the Scottish Government’s own decisions.”
Does the Secretary of State agree that the Scottish Government must accept responsibility for the catastrophic state of Scotland’s public finances?
Ian Murray
My hon. Friend is right; the Scottish Fiscal Commission did say that. While this new Government are cleaning up the mess of the previous Conservative Government, the SNP seems to be cleaning up its own mess. In 2023, Audit Scotland said:
“The Scottish Government’s projections suggest that it cannot afford to pay for public services in their current form.”
As we have heard, the IFS said this morning that SNP decisions have reduced the tax take rather than increase it. This is about treating taxpayers’ money with respect and being honest about the tough choices we face. An honest assessment of the SNP Government’s Budget is that these problems have been stored up for years. Tough decisions have been kicked into the long grass, and money has been spent recklessly. It is a problem of the SNP’s own making, and the Scottish people will suffer as the SNP tries to clear it up.
John Lamont (Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk) (Con)
I, too, start by congratulating both Ministers on their appointment to the Scotland Office. I loved my time at the Scotland Office, and I know they will be very well supported by the Department’s excellent team of officials, some of whom are in the Box today.
Labour plans to end the winter fuel payment, taking money away from elderly people who have worked all their days. Age Scotland has said:
“At minimum, a quarter of a million pensioners in Scotland on the lowest incomes or living in fuel poverty will no longer receive this vital financial support over the winter months, while hundreds of thousands more on modest incomes are going to struggle”.
Labour has cut the winter fuel payment across the UK, and the SNP is doing Labour’s dirty work in Scotland. What does the Minister have to say to the 250,000 elderly Scots who are in poverty and struggling with the decisions of Labour and the SNP?
Ian Murray
I welcome the shadow Secretary of State to his new post.
During the inheritance statement a few weeks ago, the Chancellor set out how the current Government are fixing the foundations and trying to clear up the dreadful legacy left by the Government of which the hon. Gentleman was a member. The Chancellor did not want or expect to make these decisions, but they had to be made to try to get the finances in balance and to make sure that we can fix the foundations to deliver on our manifesto. That is the legacy of the previous Government and, as I said in my previous answer, the SNP has made a mess of the public finances over the last 17 years. As we saw in the Scottish Parliament yesterday, the SNP has one hell of a mess to clear up, and it is Scottish pensioners and the Scottish people who will pay the price.
John Lamont
Labour is taking a leaf from the SNP playbook by refusing to take responsibility for its own actions. This is happening because of choices made by this Labour Government that have been passed on by the SNP in Edinburgh. Labour’s election slogan was all about change and, under this Labour Government, pensioners do not seem to have any change to spare. A woman called Lesley told Age Scotland that the winter fuel payment
“is literally a life saver for us.”
Another person, Brian, told Age Scotland:
“I would freeze without it, or go hungry.”
Is this the change that Labour meant—taking money away from struggling pensioners?
Ian Murray
There seems to be no recognition or apology from the shadow Secretary of State for the legacy his party has left this Government to try to clear up. We knew about the massive overspend in public services by the previous Government, and the audit the Chancellor did in her first weekend in office revealed the £22 billion black hole. These things have to be fixed. We did not expect or want to make such tough decisions, but we have had to make them to fix the foundations of our economy.
Stephen Gethins (Arbroath and Broughty Ferry) (SNP)
May I add my congratulations to the Secretary of State? I know it has not always been easy and sometimes it has been a lonely path, so I offer my personal congratulations to him on his appointment and to the hon. Member for Midlothian (Kirsty McNeill) on taking her place.
I will take the Secretary of State at face value on improving the relationship between the Scottish and UK Governments, but he will be aware of the devastating consequences of the cuts in the winter fuel payment for pensioners in both our constituencies and across Scotland. In order to work better with the Scottish Government, will he do better than giving them just 90 minutes’ notice next time?
Ian Murray
I welcome the hon. Gentleman back to his place, having won the election for the new constituency of Arbroath and Broughty Ferry. He should look at what the Finance Secretary said in the Scottish Parliament yesterday: she announced half a billion pounds of cuts, including £120 million in health services and £20 million in mental health services, and she has sold the family inheritance by using the ScotWind money to plug the additional funding gaps in the budget. Audit Scotland and the Institute for Fiscal Studies have been clear that this is a problem of the Scottish Government’s own making, so if they want to reset the relationship, they can start by taking responsibility for their own actions.
Stephen Gethins (Arbroath and Broughty Ferry) (SNP)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
I am committed to working with the Scottish Government and have already met the Deputy First Minister four times in eight weeks. Resetting the relationship between Scotland’s two Governments is crucial to driving economic growth. Just last week, my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer was in Glasgow and met the First Minister. The Prime Minister has made resetting the relationship a key part of his new way of working in government. He has met with the First Minister to have those discussions and with members of the business community to discuss growing the Scottish economy. It is the choice of all of us to grow the Scottish economy and something we all need to do together.
Stephen Gethins
The Secretary of State will be aware that macroeconomic policy sits here in Westminster and that decisions taken here have a huge impact. We have worked on this issue before, so does he agree with the SNP that being outside the customs union and the single market is bad for growth in the Scottish economy, or does he agree with the Conservatives and their Reform party colleagues that it has been good for the Scottish economy?
Ian Murray
The hon. Gentleman is taking no responsibility for the decisions that his party makes in the Scottish Government. We saw that yesterday with them plugging the hole in their own public finances. The IFS has been clear that the decisions the Scottish Government have made have taken the tax take down in Scotland, despite being it being the highest taxed part of the country. If we are to reset this relationship, they have to start off by taking accountability and responsibility for their own decisions.
Rachel Taylor (North Warwickshire and Bedworth) (Lab)
Sport has played an essential role in economic growth in Scotland. What steps will the Secretary of State take to ensure that the legacy of Sir Andy Murray is recognised in Scotland?
Ian Murray
I would like to announce to the House that Andy Murray and I are not related, despite the fact that we share the same physique [Laughter.] I assure the House that the Scotland Office and this Government will do all we can to ensure that the wonderful legacy of one of Britain’s best sportspeople of all time is maintained.
Torcuil Crichton (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (Lab)
Richard Baker (Glenrothes and Mid Fife) (Lab)
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
Scotland is at the forefront of this Government’s mission to make Britain a clean energy superpower by 2030. We will headquarter Great British Energy, a new publicly owned clean energy company, capitalised with £8.3 billion, in Scotland. That will help create thousands of jobs, and deliver energy security and lower prices permanently for consumers. Just this week, the sixth allocation for the contracts for difference scheme was announced, with over 130 renewable projects awarded contracts and 20% of those projects based in Scotland.
Torcuil Crichton
I welcome the Secretary of State to his position. We watched him for many lonely years as he held the fort on his own. He was always outnumbered, but never outgunned. Will he now use the full firepower of the Scotland Office to convince Cabinet colleagues and industry players of the vital role and potential of the Arnish fabrication yard in Stornoway and its sister yard in Methil, both of which are coming up for sale as part of the going to market of Harland & Wolff? Will he assure workers at the Arnish yard and at Stornoway port that they will play a big role in the renewables future and in GB Energy?
Ian Murray
I thank my hon. Friend for that question, and congratulate him on winning the Western Isles. He is Mr Western Isles, and he will be a champion for those islands.
The Government will continue to engage with Harland & Wolff, local MPs and the Scottish Government to monitor the situation and support a resolution that provides long-term certainty for the yards and workforces across the whole UK, with all four yards across the UK being treated as one. The Under-Secretary of State for Scotland, my hon. Friend the Member for Midlothian (Kirsty McNeill), recently visited the Arnish yard. I have visited the Methil yard twice—once before the election and once during the election—and I have regular meetings with the Deputy First Minister on this issue and hope to meet her again in the coming weeks. We will do all we can to protect these yards.
Gordon McKee
Having spent many years working for my right hon. Friend when he was on the Opposition Benches, may I welcome him to his position as Secretary of State for Scotland? The creation of GB Energy will support 50,000 new jobs across Scotland. It will deliver lower household bills and help us meet our net zero obligations. Given that Glasgow already has a fantastic renewables industry, may I ask what work he has done with his Cabinet colleagues to ensure that GB Energy supports jobs in Glasgow?
Ian Murray
I congratulate my hon. Friend on winning his seat in Glasgow South. His question is much better than any that he ever wrote for me.
My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero is due to make an announcement on the location of GB Energy very soon. I regret that, in the interim, I can say no more than that, although I am sure that my hon. Friend’s words of encouragement in respect of Glasgow will not have escaped the attention of my Cabinet colleagues. I can announce exclusively to the House today, Mr Speaker, that GB Energy will be headquartered in Scotland.
Richard Baker
My right hon. Friend will be aware that I have been working closely with Unite, GMB and local management at the Methil yard in my constituency during the restructuring process at Harland & Wolff. Does he agree that 200 skilled workers at Methil and those at Arnish have a vital contribution to make to our ambitions to grow our renewable sector, and also that all stakeholders have a vital role in securing the long-term future of these yards?
Ian Murray
I congratulate my hon. Friend on winning Glenrothes and Mid Fife. I acknowledge his efforts, and those of many hon. Friends in the House and of people in the local area, advocating for the Methil fabrication yard. The yard, along with many others like it, will have a key role in fulfilling our ambition for Scotland and the UK to become a green energy powerhouse. In addition to GB Energy, there is the national wealth fund, which will help unlock further investment opportunities for ports and heavy industry, and manufacturing companies will have a crucial role to play in creating jobs in our transition to net zero. I have been to the Methil plant twice. It has a world-class workforce, and I can assure them that we will do everything we possibly can to make sure that they have a bright future.
John Cooper (Dumfries and Galloway) (Con)
I welcome the Secretary of State to his place and thank him for his generous words about the work of Sir Alister Jack, who was previously in that role. Does the right hon. Gentleman share my consternation this morning that two sanctioned Russian oligarchs now have a share in Harbour Energy, our largest producer of North sea oil and gas? That seems incredible at this time, not least because the company that they are using to have this stake—LetterOne—was forced to divest itself of a broadband company because it was a threat to national security. Can we look again at this decision?
Ian Murray
May I welcome the hon. Gentleman to his place and congratulate him on winning his seat? The Foreign Secretary is sitting two seats along from me, and I am sure that he will have heard what the hon. Gentleman said. I am sure that the issue is a concern to everyone in the House, and we will make sure that a written response is given to the hon. Gentleman as soon as possible.
John Lamont (Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk) (Con)
The Rosebank oilfield will provide more than £6 billion of investment in UK-based businesses. The Jackdaw oilfield will cater for the energy needs of 1.4 million UK households. This Labour Government are jeopardising all that investment, energy and jobs by dropping the UK Government’s opposition to the judicial review, which aims to block these vital energy projects. Can the Secretary of State seriously tell the 90,000 people whose jobs rely on oil and gas in Scotland that the future of this crucial industry is secure under Labour, when it is his Government’s policy to oppose all new developments?
Ian Murray
I thank the shadow Secretary of State for his question, but he should stop scaremongering, given the 90,000-strong workforce in the North sea. Oil and gas will be with us for decades to come. The Finch decision, to which he refers, was something that this Government had to consider very carefully. The Secretary of State has started a consultation on consenting, which will affect Jackdaw and, indeed, Rosebank, and that should conclude within the next six months.
Brendan O'Hara (Argyll, Bute and South Lochaber) (SNP)
Government’s Legislative Programme: Scotland
Ian Murray Excerpts(4 months, 1 week ago)
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The Secretary of State for Scotland (Ian Murray)
The UK Government’s legislative programme for the first session was outlined at the state opening of Parliament on Wednesday 17 July. This statement provides a summary of the programme and its application to Scotland. It does not include draft Bills, Law Commission Bills, or Finance Bills.
The UK Government are committed to delivering change for Scotland. This legislative programme delivers on our missions to enable the best outcomes for the people of our four nations. This includes kick-starting economic growth, making Britain a clean energy superpower, breaking down barriers to opportunity, and keeping people safe.
Meaningful collaboration built on mutual respect will be key to delivering this change. We will reset the relationship with the Scottish Government. Through effective joint working, we can deliver better results for people across the UK. Central to this is our commitment to strengthen the Sewel convention by setting out a new memorandum of understanding outlining how the nations will work together for the common good. Now is also the time to conduct a reset in our public life; a clean-up that ensures the highest standards of integrity and honesty. We will legislate to remove hereditary peers from the House of Lords.
Scotland will be at the heart of our mission to make Britain a clean energy superpower. Great British Energy, a new publicly owned energy company, will make Britain a world leader in energy technologies, create jobs, and build supply chains in every corner of the UK. Scotland will be the powerhouse of our mission, with Great British Energy headquartered there.
We are committed to supporting economic growth across Scotland and will continue to work in collaboration with the Scottish Government, local authorities and other partners to deliver this. Our new national wealth fund will have a remit to support our growth and clean energy missions, making transformative investments across every part of the country. We will also bring forward legislation to improve workers’ rights, to protect public funds and end the requirement to franchise rail services. This change will come ahead of a broader Bill to reform the railways and establish Great British Railways.
In this legislative Session, we will embed economic stability to create the conditions for long-term growth that will improve the lives and opportunities of people in Scotland and across the United Kingdom. We will invest in our infrastructure, deliver the public services that people need, secure our borders and restore order to the asylum system so that it operates swiftly, firmly and fairly. We are boosting our energy security to cut bills and ensuring that work pays with our new deal for working people. In addition, we will protect the health of people across the UK by introducing a generational ban on smoking, and imposing limits on the sale and marketing of vapes, taking a landmark step in creating a smoke-free UK.
The following Bills will extend and apply to Scotland (either in full or in part):
Armed Forces Commissioner Bill
Bank Resolution (Recapitalisation) Bill
Border Security, Asylum and Immigration Bill
Budget Responsibility Bill
Commonwealth Parliamentary Association and International Committee of the Red Cross (Status) Bill
Digital Information and Smart Data Bill
Cyber Security and Resilience Bill
Employment Rights Bill
Great British Energy Bill
Hillsborough Law
House of Lords (Hereditary Peers) Bill
Lords Spiritual (Women) Act 2015 (Extension) Bill
National Wealth Fund Bill
Passenger Railway Services (Public Ownership) Bill
Pension Schemes Bill
Planning and Infrastructure Bill
Product Safety and Metrology Bill
Railways Bill
Renters Rights Bill
Sustainable Aviation Fuel (Revenue Support Mechanism) Bill
Terrorism (Protection of Premises) Bill
Tobacco and Vapes Bill
The UK Government will work collaboratively with the Scottish Government to secure the legislative consent of the Scottish Parliament where appropriate.
[HCWS9]
Constitutional Law
Ian Murray Excerpts(6 months ago)
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Ian Murray (Edinburgh South) (Lab)
The fact that we are considering this statutory instrument on the Floor of the House, when such instruments are normally done in Committee, demonstrates that the Government have absolutely nothing left to bring to the Chamber. In fact, this debate was scheduled for a Committee Room upstairs but was subsequently cancelled and brought to the Floor of the House. It shows that the Government are desperate to try to fill time in this Chamber rather than send us all away early again. I know I speak for the Opposition and millions of people up and down the country when I say that this nonsense has to end: a general election must be called soon on this zombie Government. They may be able to run for now, but they certainly cannot hide. The people are fed up of 14 years of complete failure.
We are here to consider increased borrowing limits for the Scottish Government. I wonder whether the Minister could answer a few questions. As per the August 2023 fiscal framework agreement, which came two years late, can the Minister tell the House how the increase amounts have been calculated?
Secondly, the fiscal framework allows for £3 billion, and slightly more given this order of debt for capital purposes at £450 million a year. How much of that just over £3 billion has been drawn down to this stage?
Thirdly, the resource-borrowing powers can be drawn down by up to £600 million per annum up to a maximum of just over £1.75 billion. How much of that has been drawn down? The reason I ask that latter question is that at the Finance and Public Administration Committee of the Scottish Parliament this morning, the permanent secretary warned the First Minister that there is a looming £1.9 billion fiscal deficit in the Scottish Government, because of spending promises that have been made by the current Scottish Government, and that the First Minister will have to come to Parliament regarding the redrawing of those priorities to try to reduce that £1.9 billion fiscal deficit.
Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)
Does the hon. Member agree that, notwithstanding the fact that the fiscal framework has brought the two Governments to the table, the problems we are seeing with spending and the constant arguments are not in the best interests of the people of Scotland? What they really need is two Governments who work more closely together and in concert for Scotland.
Ian Murray
I could not agree more. If the Prime Minister wishes to go and see His Majesty the King at some point soon, we might get at least one half of those two Governments working together after the general election.
Angus Brendan MacNeil
What do he and the hon. Member for Edinburgh West (Christine Jardine) have against the Republic of Ireland? It has one Government, which is doing very well and has a budget surplus, unlike the UK that has the mishmash and a mess, with a Scotland underperforming in the UK and looking at an Ireland that is overperforming having left the UK. There are lessons to be learned for himself and other colleagues.
Ian Murray
There are certainly lessons to be learned for the UK: not to have a Tory Government. If we had a Labour Government, things would be in a much better position. I am sure the hon. Gentleman will be encouraging all his constituents to vote Labour at the general election in order to make that change.
My fourth question to the Minister is that the fiscal framework of August 2023 suggests that these figures will be increased by inflation from 2024-25 onwards. Will the Minister confirm that is correct? What inflationary measure will be used to do that? Every household in Scotland, and up and down the UK, knows the impact the current Government have had on borrowing overall. Crashing the economy and trebling the national debt has had consequences for everyone. The interest payments on Government debt alone as a share of the economy are now the highest since in early 1950s.
Thanks to the former Prime Minister’s disastrous premiership, interest rates that homeowners are now paying have gone through the roof, taking away home ownership for many in this country. We are in the midst of a cost of living crisis that was made in Downing Street but is being paid for by working people all over the country. If it is possible to sum up this dreadful Government in one individual’s actions and behaviours, it is the crashing of the economy, accompanied by the highest tax burden on working people in 70 years, and the largest fall in living standards since records began in the 1950s. They are reckless, incompetent and unapologetic for the chaos they have wrought across the country.
But the Government seem to want to go further. They have looked at the former Prime Minister’s chaos inflicted on the country by the £45 billion unfunded tax cuts for the richest, and decided to trump that with a £46 billion unfunded tax cut to scrap national insurance, but will not tell us how they will pay for it. [Interruption.] There is chuntering from the Treasury Bench. Instead of chuntering, perhaps they will tell us how they will pay for that £46 billion unfunded commitment. When the Minister responds, will he take the opportunity of this rare occasion of a Scottish statutory instrument being discussed on the Floor of the House to answer my fifth question, about where the money for the £46 billion unfunded commitment will come from?
We have had three failed Prime Ministers in the UK over as many years, an embarrassing statistic the SNP could not help but match, with three First Ministers in Scotland in as many years. They have brought back former leaders to take charge, although the party in government in this Parliament have not done that for the top job, or certainly not for now anyway. Scotland is governed by a man who is responsible for many of the problems we face in the first place—he will have to take charge of these borrowing requirements—the Education Secretary who wrecked our education system, the Finance Secretary who decimated local government finance and the leader who led them to their worst ever election result.
Edward Timpson (Eddisbury) (Con)
I am very much enjoying the hon. Gentleman’s jousting, although I suspect he will have to wait quite a while before he gets to do it again for real in the general election, but will he be supporting that statutory instrument today?
Ian Murray
Yes, we will be supporting the statutory instrument, but it is worth putting it into the context of where these borrowing powers will have to be spent and the requirements of that. I know the hon. Gentleman would hardly wish to defend the Scottish Government’s record on spending; Members on the Opposition Benches certainly will not do that. What is happening in Scotland because of having two bad Governments needs to be completely exposed—[Interruption.] Oh, SNP Members are awake.
Ronnie Cowan (Inverclyde) (SNP)
As we look towards a general election and the almost certain prospect of a Labour Government, with Labour Members switching places with those now on the Government Benches, would the hon. Member for Edinburgh South (Ian Murray) be prepared to commit a Labour Government to restoring the Scottish block grant?
Ian Murray
I would commit the Labour Government to the fiscal framework agreement that has already been put in place. It was negotiated and agreed in August 2023, and lays out the fiscal framework for the years ahead. When Labour Members move from the Opposition to the Government Benches come the general election, I am not sure if the hon. Member for Inverclyde (Ronnie Cowan) will be still be in his place. We have had 14 years of Conservative failure in this place and 17 years of SNP failure in Scotland too. That is the context in which these orders come forward. There is an enormous black hole in Scotland’s public finances, while one in six Scots are on NHS waiting lists. Real earnings in Scotland today are lower than they were in 2007. The only response to this crisis from either Government has been to increase taxes.
Patrick Grady (Glasgow North) (SNP)
I wonder whether the hon. Member agrees with his shadow Health Secretary who said at the weekend that, right across the UK, every part of the NHS is in crisis. All roads lead back to Westminster, because, even though this is a devolved matter, decisions taken in Westminster have an impact on the NHS across the whole country.
Ian Murray
The conclusion is that all roads must lead to a Labour Government to resolve the issue. That is where we end up.
The only response to this crisis from either Government has been to increase taxes. [Interruption.] Those on the Treasury Bench are still chuntering. I wonder whether they can still chunter about where the £46 billion unfunded spending commitments are going to come from. Those on the Treasury Bench have presided over the highest tax burden on working people in 70 years, and the SNP went even further, with any Scot earning over £28,500 a year paying more tax than anywhere else in the UK—that is nurses, teachers, police officers, firefighters and council workers all paying for their Government’s incompetence.
Angus Brendan MacNeil
The hon. Gentleman earlier mentioned the previous Prime Minister and the high interest rates in the sterling zone. Will he apologise for buddying up with the Tories in 2014, wearing his Union Jack jacket, saying that Scotland should stick with the Tory Government, stick with the risk of a Prime Minister doing what she did, and stick with the risk of a currency zone that has hammered people’s mortgages and hammered people’s standards of living. He can apologise from the Dispatch Box if he wants.
Ian Murray
Mr Deputy Speaker, I am so looking forward to the hon. Gentleman bringing forward yet another financial perspective to what independence would look like, but it would absolutely trash our economy and make what is currently going on look like a picnic in the park. He cannot answer any of the basic questions about how that would work.
At the same time as hammering working people in Scotland with tax increases, the SNP has U-turned on its U-turn and, again, will not take any more money from the oil and gas giants’ excess profits, but will, instead, take more money from our nurses in income tax. Working people are paying the price and getting less. The truth is that this motion today is not what the people of Scotland and the UK are calling out for; they are speaking with clarity that they want change—change from a cruel and failing Conservative Government and change from a tired and failing SNP Administration. They want change. Let us get this general election and deliver that change.
Oral Answers to Questions
Ian Murray Excerpts(6 months, 3 weeks ago)
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Ian Murray (Edinburgh South) (Lab)
On this International Workers’ Day, May Day, Scottish Television journalists are striking for fair pay. I am sure the Secretary of State will join me in insisting that STV gets back around the table with its journalists to thrash out an acceptable deal. Given all the news that is happening this week, we need them back on the television.
I too pay tribute to the outgoing First Minister, Humza Yousaf. We may not have agreed on everything, but his historic appointment marked a pivotal moment in our multicultural public life in Scotland, and I wish him and his family well for the future.
The spring Budget was just another moment that exposed the damage done by the chaos of the former Prime Minister’s kamikaze Budget. The Secretary of State has been spinning that it brings taxes down, but is it not the case that the tax burden in Scotland and across the rest of the UK continues to rise? The Prime Minister now wants to mirror his irresponsible predecessor with an unfunded £46 billion policy to get rid of national insurance altogether. The Secretary of State sits around the Cabinet table, so which one of these have they discussed to pay for this: pensioners, the NHS or income tax rises?
Mr Jack
I agree with the hon. Gentleman that the tax burden in Scotland is too high and rising, and people are paying more and getting less. Fortunately, the UK Government have taken the decision to partially offset that, not through income tax cuts but through national insurance cuts, with 4p coming off NI. To pick up on his last point, he was referring to an aspiration that this Government have. We have already reduced NI by 4p, a third, and we aspire to remove it altogether, because it is a tax on jobs.
Ian Murray
This is a £46 billion, unfunded aspiration, and the Secretary of State and the Government will not tell us where they will get the money from. Scotland is trapped between two chaotic and failing Governments; we have had three Prime Ministers, and we will have had three First Ministers, in as many years. All the while, the right hon. Member for Aberdeen South (Stephen Flynn) thinks he is already the First Minister and calling the shots, although he has been shooting himself firmly in the foot. What is abundantly clear to the people of Scotland is that neither the Scottish Government nor the UK Government are even interested in delivering the change that Scotland needs. With neither Government wanting to let the people decide, will the Secretary of State tell the House who he thinks is most scared of a general election, the Tories or the Scottish National party?
Mr Jack
We absolutely do not fear an election, whether for Holyrood or a general election. As I watch the nationalists implode again, I say, “Bring it on.” I hear them say the same from a sedentary position. [Interruption.] Bring it on! Chaps and chapesses over there, start polishing up your CVs.
Oral Answers to Questions
Ian Murray Excerpts(8 months, 3 weeks ago)
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Ian Murray (Edinburgh South) (Lab)
Regardless of what the Chancellor announces today, we are in the highest tax-raising Parliament in history, which is a consequence of the Minister’s Government’s failure over 14 years. Ordinary hard-working Scots did not cause this economic crisis—the Government did—but they are being made to pay for it. There have been 25 Tory tax rises since the last election, and the average family is much worse off as a result. Does the Minister agree with the Institute for Fiscal Studies that even after today’s Budget the overall tax burden on working people will still reach record levels?
John Lamont
Clearly, I will not speculate on what the Chancellor will announce shortly. I remind the hon. Gentleman that 2.4 million workers in Scotland have benefited from £340 going back into their pockets thanks to the changes to national insurance that have already been announced.
In relation to the hon. Member’s wider points about the tax burden, we should not forget the huge interventions that the Government made to support workers, families, communities and businesses during the pandemic. As a consequence, we are having to repay that, but that saved jobs and many businesses from going under during the covid pandemic.
Ian Murray
Regardless of what the Chancellor says today, working people will still be paying a much higher tax burden at the end of this Parliament, and it will reach record levels. Shockingly, the tax burden in Scotland is even higher. Anyone in Scotland earning more than £29,000 a year will pay more income tax after the SNP voted for yet another tax rise on working people. That means we are in the absurd position in Scotland of the SNP raising taxes on nurses and teachers while opposing Labour’s plan for an extended windfall tax on the oil and gas giants. We even hear that the leader of the Scottish Conservatives threatened to resign last night on potentially another U-turn from the Chancellor on the windfall tax. Does the Minister accept that the best thing to happen now would be for this circus to be brought for an end and for the Prime Minister to call the election?
John Lamont
As I said, I will not speculate on the contents of the Budget. But when the election comes, Scotland’s voters will have a clear choice: a party who will stand up for Scotland’s place in a strong United Kingdom, or the Scottish National party, who wants another referendum. I am unclear what the Labour party has to offer.
Oral Answers to Questions
Ian Murray Excerpts(12 months ago)
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Ian Murray (Edinburgh South) (Lab)
Let me take this opportunity to congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Rutherglen and Hamilton West (Michael Shanks) not only on his vast—and fast—promotion to the shadow Front Bench but on the 20.4% swing from the SNP that brought him the by-election victory.
The announcement of the closure of the refinery at Grangemouth is a hammer blow. Too many communities are still living with the devastation of being left behind after coalmine closures in the 1980s. That must not be allowed to happen again. Grangemouth’s owner is buying football clubs and investing in plants elsewhere, while the workers lose out. The Prime Minister has decided that a culture war on the environment trumps getting the UK into the global green energy race by backing Labour’s green energy superpower plans. The devolution settlement demands that both Governments work together, but they certainly do not. What discussions is the Secretary of State having with the Scottish Government to protect jobs at Grangemouth? What impact will the closure have on the Acorn carbon capture and storage project?
Mr Jack
First of all, it is a very worrying time for those whose jobs are at risk at the Grangemouth refinery. This morning, the Under-Secretary of State for Scotland, my hon. Friend the Member for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk (John Lamont), and a Minister from the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero met Neil Gray from the Scottish Government, and yesterday my hon. Friend had a meeting with the local authority. Work is going on. It is ironic that the Scottish Government want to shut down oil and gas, because when that happens, people suddenly realise the need to manage a transition and take us gradually to net zero while protecting people’s livelihoods.
On Acorn and the Scottish cluster, I have spoken to the chief executive of Storegga, which is pulling the project together. He told me that the refinery closing has little impact on its project, because Grangemouth was supplying the blue hydrogen to the refinery and others, and the emissions from that were being put into the North sea.
Ian Murray
It is the 25th anniversary of the Scottish Parliament next year—one of the Labour party’s proudest achievements. However, recently it has been riven by failure and scandal, from one in seven on NHS waiting lists to ferries, iPads and camper vans. Much has been made about the dual role of the Government-appointed Lord Advocate, who sits in the Scottish Cabinet while presiding over prosecutions in Scotland. What discussions has the Secretary of State had with the Scottish Government about Anas Sarwar’s idea to split the dual role of Scotland’s top law officer, to maintain the separation of powers between the Government and the judiciary?
Mr Jack
As the hon. Gentleman will know, the Director of Public Prosecutions in England is appointed by a panel, which removes the risk of perceived interference by Government. Many learned friends have expressed their concerns to me about the structure in Scotland and the closeness between the judiciary and the Government, and I find their concerns understandable. It is vital that the public perception is that the prosecution service is very independent from Government.
Oral Answers to Questions
Ian Murray Excerpts(1 year, 2 months ago)
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Ian Murray (Edinburgh South) (Lab)
I join the Secretary of State in saying how gutted we are about the football result last night—but mark my words, we will be seeking revenge in Germany at the European championships next year.
I take this opportunity to thank my hon. Friend the Member for Blaydon (Liz Twist), who was in the shadow Scotland team but has moved on to do new things after the reshuffle, and to welcome to the Scotland team my hon. Friend the Member for Keir Hardie’s old seat, Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney (Gerald Jones). He is very welcome.
Last week, it was revealed that the former Prime Minister, the right hon. Member for South West Norfolk (Elizabeth Truss), had secured a book deal. Her book is titled “Ten Years to Save the West”, but it might have been better focusing on the 44 days it took her and her Government, with the support of the Scottish Secretary, to crush the economy. Does the Minister accept that Scots will be paying the price for years to come for the Tories’ kamikaze handling of the economy?
John Lamont
As the hon. Gentleman well knows, the economic challenges we face here in the United Kingdom are no different from those faced by other economies around the world. They have been entirely caused by the illegal war in Ukraine and the covid pandemic. Thankfully, due to the decisive action of this Conservative Government and Prime Minister, the evidence suggests that the UK is recovering from the economic shock far better than France, Italy and Germany.
Ian Murray
Ukraine and covid did not crash the economy; this Government did. The truth is that, after 13 years, we have a low-wage, low-growth economy. Let me take the example of residents in a random Scottish constituency, Rutherglen and Hamilton West. Behind every door we knock on, the story is the same: the cost of living. Those voters are paying the price for two bad Governments: the UK Government, who crashed the economy and are asking working people to pay for it, and the Scottish Government, who mismanaged the economy and are also asking working people to pay for it. There is a Tory premium on everyone’s mortgages and rents, alongside the highest tax burden on working people in 80 years, and the SNP wants to increase income taxes further and is proposing eye-watering council tax rates for those residents. Do the people of Rutherglen and Hamilton West not deserve a fresh start with Scottish Labour’s Michael Shanks?
John Lamont
It was not so long ago that Scottish Labour was calling for even higher taxes on the people of Scotland. When Scottish Labour leader Anas Sarwar stood for the leadership, he said:
“I actually think our tax policies will be even more progressive and radical than even John McDonnell’s or Jeremy Corbyn’s tax policies or manifesto”.
Mr Sarwar has now U-turned, of course, but maybe the hon. Gentleman can explain how much Scottish Labour secretly wants to put up taxes in Scotland.