Electronic Monitoring of Offenders
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(1 week, 6 days ago)
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Nick Timothy (West Suffolk) (Con)
(Urgent Question): To ask the Secretary of State for Justice if he will make a statement on the electronic monitoring of offenders.
The Minister for Prisons, Probation and Reducing Reoffending (Catherine McKinnell)
The Government inherited a justice system pushed to breaking point by the previous Government. When Labour came to power, we had fewer than 100 places left in our prisons, with incredibly serious problems with electronic monitoring. We have taken swift action to improve performance, and are now delivering the biggest expansion of tagging in British history, backed by £100 million of investment.
As part of our reforms, there is a presumption—[Interruption.]
Mr Speaker
Order. At least let the Minister get to the end of what she has to say without interruption.
Catherine McKinnell
Thank you, Mr Speaker. As part of our reforms, there is a presumption that eligible offenders released under the progression model will be tagged, giving the Probation Service an additional tool to monitor offenders and protect the public. We are now tagging a record number of offenders, helping to cut crime and make our streets safer.
Electronic monitoring is not used in isolation. Those released from prison remain subject to licence conditions and probation supervision, which can include curfews and restrictions on their movements. We have also introduced tougher powers for probation officers, including world-first restriction zones for the most serious sexual and violent offenders where appropriate, as well as the ability to prohibit offenders from driving, attending public events or entering pubs, clubs and bars. Where an offender breaches their conditions or can no longer be safely managed in the community, they can immediately be recalled to prison.
We have also ensured that the electronic monitoring service is ready to support the expansion. The service was ready for first-tranche releases on 1 October, with the equipment and staff in place to deliver the presumption to tag offenders on release. Serco has consistently met its contractual requirements since March 2026.
The Ministry of Justice routinely publishes extensive data on probation and tagging. It is published quarterly, and the last set of data was published just last week. It is vital that the Government and the public have confidence that the information published by the Department is accurate. Our quarterly economic monitoring statistics, including figures for the number of prison leavers fitted with tags and the figures covering the October period, will be publicly available in January.
This Government inherited a prison system on the brink of collapse, with just 500 places being built in the last 14 years. It is this Government who are now building the prison places we need and putting in the strictest measures possible to protect the public.
Nick Timothy
You would not believe, Mr Speaker, listening to the Minister that the numbers of prison places and prison officers are actually down. It all sounds like it is going very well according to her version of events.
Labour told us that to keep the public safe from the dangerous criminals it is releasing early, the Justice Secretary would implement the toughest tagging regime in British history, and that there would be a new presumption that offenders will be electronically tagged and monitored when they leave prison. But the Metropolitan police told Sky this weekend that it will not act on all breaches of tag conditions by bailed offenders, blaming the pressure created by Labour’s early release scheme.
Just in London, there have been 100 tag breaches a day by released prisoners since the first early release scheme started, with two to three released prisoners now being rearrested every week. The Met commissioner said that
“95%-plus of the tagging breaches that we arrest are simply being bailed back into the community on the same condition”.
He says, “there is zero sanction”. One sergeant said:
“There are not enough cops”
to handle Labour’s early release of thousands of prisoners.
The Justice Secretary, when he stops hiding in his Department and sending junior Ministers to answer for him, needs to be straight with the House and the public. Four days after his early release scheme started, he told the BBC that he did not know—that it was impossible to know—how many prisoners had been tagged. He wrote to me yesterday admitting that he still does not know, and that is 26 days later. The Times reports that most prisoners will not be tagged as they are released from prison, and we know that more than 5,000 offenders went unmonitored in the first half of this year because they were not fitted with tags.
This is a mess. So chaotic is Labour’s early release scheme that prisoners are being given tents instead of housing upon release. As a matter of policy, these prisoners will be in probable breach of their licence and tagging conditions, which require them to have an approved address, all because the Probation Service is overwhelmed. We know that two thirds of prisoners who are sleeping rough go on to reoffend within the first year.
Ministers keep telling us that the full data on tagging and reoffending cannot be published until the regulation publication dates. I ask again: will Ministers publish full data on how many released prisoners have been tagged? Will they publish comprehensive data on reoffending by prisoners let out through Labour’s early release scheme, and will the Justice Secretary apologise to the House for telling the public that they would be kept safe?
Catherine McKinnell
While the hon. Member raises some important points, I stress again that we are working night and day to fix the broken system that we inherited. We are working across agencies. We are working incredibly hard with the police, the Probation Service and all those who work in the criminal justice system who want to keep the public safe and ensure that victims get the service they need, too.
I caution the hon. Gentleman, because he appears to be conflating a number of issues. He will be aware that it is usual practice, which has been in place under successive Governments, including his own, that prisoners are tagged at their place of accommodation on release, and that was always the plan for 1 October. That said, we know that this creates a gap between leaving prison and having the tag fitted, which is why to address it we have conducted a successful pilot to fit tags at prison receptions. That is currently live in six prisons, and we are working at pace to roll this out to further prisoners who will have a tag upon leaving. [Interruption.] The hon. Member for Bexhill and Battle (Dr Mullan) chunters from a sedentary position to ask about the police. He is talking about local Metropolitan police policy in relation to breaches of court bail where it is the responsible agency. It is important not to conflate the release of prisoners and the tagging policy, which we are working at pace to improve from the situation we inherited, with the other demands on the police, which we are working closely with them to resolve. We inherited a failing tagging system with record backlogs. We are investing £100 million in electronic monitoring, tagging offenders before release and, importantly, strengthening victim protections with a new alert system.
To the MPs who share this Government’s and the Prime Minister’s ambition that no one should be street homeless, I urge them to support us in these endeavours and to ensure that their local authorities are working with us to support prisoners on release, to ensure they are tagged and to ensure that victims and the public are protected. That is our key priority, and we can work together across this House to achieve that.
I visit prisons and meet prison officers and governors every week who are working incredibly hard to keep the public safe and to transform the lives of individuals in our prison system to ensure that when they leave prison, they leave in a better state than when they arrived. We are working to reduce reoffending and to support the Probation Service in reintegrating people into society, and to ensure in the meantime that people are tagged and victims and the public are kept safe. We are working incredibly hard getting on with the job of fixing the mess we inherited and rebuilding our justice system that was left so broken, and I urge hon. Members across the House to support us in their local area in that work.
Catherine Atkinson (Derby North) (Lab)
Victims should not have to make their lives smaller, looking over their shoulder because offenders are free to roam; it is the offender whose freedoms should be limited. Will the Minister be more ambitious in using restriction zones, which keep an offender within a defined area, rather than simply banning them from particular areas, as with exclusion zones? If victims are to feel safe, tags must be fitted as they walk out of the prison gate, not weeks later. Will that be in place in January, as intended?
Catherine McKinnell
My hon. Friend is absolutely right, and I thank her for her assiduous work on all these subjects. As she says, we are rightly rolling out world-leading restriction zones, ensuring that it is offenders who are restricted, where that is appropriate. Indeed, we have the exclusion zones as well, where they are appropriate, and obviously these decisions are made by probation practitioners. She rightly highlights the work we are doing to accelerate the roll-out of tagging at prisons to ensure the safety and security of the system and so that tags are installed at the prison gate as soon as possible.
Jess Brown-Fuller (Chichester) (LD)
Over 5,000 offenders went unmonitored in the first half of this year due to serious delays in the tagging system, and in the year to March, an average of 300 people per week were released from prison with no fixed address, making it incredibly difficult to ensure that offenders are tagged and then managed in the community. That adds to the strain on both the Probation Service and the police, who are using scarce resources to manage an increasingly large caseload and keep victims safe. The Government have repeatedly promised that they will not jeopardise public safety, but many victims following the stories over the weekend, especially after Mark Rowley’s comments, will struggle to believe them. Will the Government listen to the calls of the Victims’ Commissioner to tag individuals at the gate and roll that out to every prison by January?
We also welcomed the Government’s announcement to introduce restriction zones for offenders, which limits the movement for perpetrators rather than victims, but the effectiveness of those zones will require offenders to be properly monitored and any breaches to be addressed without delay. Is the Minister confident that there are enough resources to operate restriction zones effectively, and when will we see a national roll-out of this important measure?
Catherine McKinnell
The hon. Lady makes a number of thoughtful and helpful contributions. It is very important that housing and homelessness are tackled among the prison leaver population, to ensure that they have the opportunity to build a life and not reoffend, and we will work with local authorities as effectively as possible to ensure that prisoners are not at risk of becoming homeless. It is a priority of this Prime Minister and this Government to tackle homelessness across the board, which was reinforced by the announcement yesterday of £874 million of priority funding to tackle homelessness. We are already extending the period by which collaboration must happen between the prison and probation unit and local authorities, so that they have the maximum period possible to put in place arrangements that ensure victims’ safety and the public’s safety.
The hon. Member rightly raised tagging at source, which we have had a very successful pilot of. This has not been done previously by any Government. We recognise it as an opportunity to really improve the work that is happening, and we are working at pace to ramp up tagging at source. She also raised the restriction zones. I can only reiterate that these are world-leading measures we are putting in place. We are not just fixing the mess that we inherited but working at pace to make this system work in the interests of victims and the public, and creating a society that everyone can contribute to.
Janet Daby (Lewisham East) (Lab)
I thank the Minister for her responses. Does she agree that more needs to be done to prevent reoffending while offenders are actually in prison, so that they do not commit further crimes when they are released and on tags? What is she doing to ensure that there is appropriate education and training across the prison estate?
Catherine McKinnell
My hon. Friend is absolutely right that ensuring that there is purposeful activity in prisons, and that prisoners can gain life skills and work skills while they are in prison, will help to reduce reoffending and help to tackle the prison capacity challenge that we have. She will recognise that the capacity challenge we inherited makes all of this harder—it makes everything we are doing in the prison system harder. That is why we are both building more prison spaces and ensuring that we invest in and support rehabilitation while people are in prison, to reduce the need to recall people when they reoffend. We are tackling this on all fronts, and I appreciate my hon. Friend’s support for our efforts.
Sir Ashley Fox (Bridgwater) (Con)
The Minister says that the Government are building new prison places, yet she will be aware that there are fewer prison places today than on the day Labour took office. She will also be aware that this vast flood of prisoners being released early has overwhelmed the ability of the Probation Service to find them accommodation and that some prisoners are now being issued with tents, setting them up to fail. Can the Minister tell us how many prisoners have been issued with tents on their release? Has the rate been higher or lower than she expected?
Catherine McKinnell
It is not Government policy to provide tents to people being released from prison who are at risk of being homeless. We are clear that tents should never be an acceptable housing solution. The hon. Member will know that overall housing responsibility rests with local authorities in England and Wales. I assure him that we are working very closely with the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government to tackle the scourge of homelessness across the board, including among the prison leaver cohort that he is concerned about. He can support this work by encouraging his local authority to engage in pre-release panels, so that this work can be done collaboratively right across the UK to ensure that nobody leaves prison homeless.
Mr Jonathan Brash (Hartlepool) (Lab)
Between May and August this year, Kevin Brown committed eight burglaries in Hartlepool, targeting businesses and charities like Alice House hospice and Cornerstone homelessness charity. The court handed him a suspended sentence. That is not good enough for me, and it is not good enough for my constituents. Does the Minister agree that we must build more prison places so that individuals like this are locked up?
Catherine McKinnell
I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend that we must build more prison places, and we are working at pace to do that. Obviously, I will not comment on independent judicial decisions that are made in particular cases, but he should be reassured to know that when it comes to tackling acquisitive crime, tagging is appropriate and individualised to the offender, to ensure that it tackles their particular challenges in terms of reoffending. An acquisitive crime GPS tag pilot found that offenders were 20% less likely to reoffend within 12 months. We are working across the board to tackle all these issues in the round.
Richard Tice (Boston and Skegness) (Reform)
It is bad enough that dangerous criminals are being released early, but my constituents are frankly terrified that these prisoners are being released without tags—the world has gone mad, Minister. Will this Government commit not to release prisoners without tags?
Catherine McKinnell
The hon. Gentleman will have heard the answers I have given on the business as usual that we inherited: it was always the plan that from 1 October, offenders would normally be tagged at their accommodation. We are presuming that more offenders and individuals released from prison will be eligible for tags than at any point in history, and we are investing significantly in that. We have undertaken a pilot of tagging prisoners at the prison, which has been shown to be successful, and we will work at pace to roll that out further as quickly as possible.
Kim Johnson (Liverpool Riverside) (Lab)
Serco continues to be awarded lucrative Government contracts despite repeated failures, while probation officers have been pushed to breaking point. Will the Minister commit to bringing back in-house electronic tagging and probation services, as I proposed in my amendment to the Bill that became the Sentencing Act 2026, so that we are not rewarding private profit over public safety?
Catherine McKinnell
The contract with Serco was signed by the Conservative party, and its performance did not originally meet expectations, but we have focused on driving rapid improvement and ensuring that we turn that failing performance around, so that it is meeting contractual expectations and working with us at pace to make the improvements that we want to see in our system. We will continue to keep all these matters under review, as we would with any contract that the Government have entered into.
Sir Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con)
I welcome the fact that the Government are experimenting with a scheme of tagging prisoners at the point of release, but a question then arises. Those of them who do not have an address to go to and who choose to remove the tag are going to be very difficult to find. Is there a solution to that?
Catherine McKinnell
The right hon. Gentleman asks a typically thoughtful question. Obviously, all these matters are kept under review. We work very closely with the Probation Service, which uses a range of measures to manage offenders once they are released into the community, to both support them to reintegrate and to ensure that the public are safe, and we also work very closely with the police on that. When an offender does find settled accommodation, a tag can then be put on as part of their licence conditions, but where there are concerns, the recall option remains available.
Emily Thornberry (Islington South and Finsbury) (Lab)
When Pentonville Prison was built in 1842, I do not imagine anybody expected that today it would have twice the number of prisoners the Victorians thought ought to be kept there. Furthermore, Pentonville Prison is a London remand prison—people used to be there for six to eight months on remand in pretty terrible conditions, but now they are there for years because of the crisis in the criminal justice system. The question is this: when they are released, what should be done with them? I was speaking to the governor of the prison on Friday, and he said that if the Government wished them to, prison officers would be quite happy to be trained to put the tags on people themselves before releasing them.
Catherine McKinnell
I thank my right hon. Friend for her thoughtful question. Like me, she has the greatest regard for our prison governors. They work on the frontline, keeping the public safe and keeping their prisons running, and they do come up with a lot of good ideas, many of which I have heard myself. I meet governors regularly about what we can do to improve matters; I am very much “ear to the ground.” Indeed, many of the proposals that we are taking forward to improve significantly on the situation we inherited come from the very practical reality that prison governors encounter, so I thank her for the suggestion.
Vikki Slade (Mid Dorset and North Poole) (LD)
The issue of electronic monitoring does not concern only those on early release. Michele, a victim of domestic abuse, has a restraining order against her ex-partner until 2036 that the police say he is regularly breaching. Ten days after his release, she contacted me for the fourth time to say that he still did not have a tag. As we went into half term, she said:
“I’ve not left my house all week. The children can’t go out in half term. We don’t feel safe.”
The liaison officers know that a breach is going to happen again, and family members are now staying with her, one at a time, to make sure she is not alone. I totally understand the January deadline—there are a lot of people to deal with—but will the Minister make a commitment that serial victims of domestic abuse will be prioritised so that children do not have to look over their shoulder?
Catherine McKinnell
The hon. Lady raises an important case. I am very sorry to hear about the situation that her constituent is dealing with this half term. Obviously, that needs to be escalated to the appropriate people. A whole variety of measures are used to ensure victim engagement, including the victim contact helpline, and specific orders can be put on domestic abuse offenders. I appreciate the ongoing concerns, and I would be happy to engage with the hon. Lady about this case.
Rachel Taylor (North Warwickshire and Bedworth) (Lab)
I thank the Minister for the groundbreaking work of her Department in tagging prisoners before release, but will she update the House on the work that this Government are doing to start fixing the failure of the Conservatives to build more prison places or invest in our crumbling prison estate?
Catherine McKinnell
My hon. Friend brings us back to the crux of the issue that this Government inherited. We are dealing with the consequences of a failure to invest in our prison capacity over many years—there was a net gain of just 500 prison places when the Conservatives left Government. We are working at pace to deliver 14,000 prison places, and we aim to do so by 2031. We have already delivered 3,300 places, and I look forward to being at the groundbreaking and opening of many more.
Liz Saville Roberts (Dwyfor Meirionnydd) (PC)
The Lord Chancellor recently addressed Napo’s conference—I was listening in, as I was speaking afterwards—and he told probation officers, “Without you, our criminal justice system does not work.” However, Napo is presently balloting its members on strike action following failed negotiations with the Government for a pay rise after decades of pay stagnation. Does the Minister agree that technology cannot replace dedicated probation officers and that they need the proper pay, proper conditions and proper workloads to be able to do their jobs properly?
Catherine McKinnell
The right hon. Lady is absolutely right. Justice Transcribe, which she refers to, has supported probation officers to reduce their workload when it comes to the transcribing of notes; obviously, they must keep careful records, and this system is inevitably helping to manage workloads. She is right that probation officers do a vital job, and I thank them for the work that they are doing today and every day to keep the public safe and manage offenders in the community. In April, we secured the biggest probation pay increase in over a decade, and the current offer increases that by a minimum of 5%. We want to increase our recruitment of probation officers, so hon. Members should encourage people to join the service. We also want to retain our brilliant probation officers, and we are continuing in discussions with them to that end.
Esther McVey (Tatton) (Con)
Can the Minister confirm that criminals will not get tagged if they are classed as homeless? At the weekend, it was revealed that prisoners released early by this Government were given tents because there was no accommodation for them. So yes or no—will prisoners who are released and given a tent be tagged? Or will they be roaming the streets without any way of locating them, free to commit more crime?
Catherine McKinnell
I agree with the right hon. Lady that it is completely unacceptable for a prisoner to be released with a tent. That is not Government policy, and it is not something that we want to see. That is why we are working at pace to improve the current homelessness situation that we inherited from the previous Government, to make sure that nobody, including prison leavers, leaves prison homeless or has to live homeless.
Jayne Kirkham (Truro and Falmouth) (Lab/Co-op)
A Lords Committee criticised the Ministry of Justice under the previous Government for reappointing the contractors after repeated failures. Serco had an issue with finding a tag small enough for the elderly mother of my constituent, which delayed her release over Christmas. What steps are the Government taking to ensure that contractors manage to tag all prisoners before they leave prison?
Catherine McKinnell
I am sorry to hear about that particular case. There are circumstances where there are physical challenges to fitting a tag—for example, because of a medical reason such as limb loss or swelling. It is important that the vast majority of people who should have tags do have tags, and we need to make sure that happens. The business-as-usual position is to tag an individual who is due to be tagged once they are in their accommodation, but we are trialling, have piloted and will be looking to roll out tagging at the prison as quickly as possible.
Adam Dance (Yeovil) (LD)
I have heard from far too many worried victims and parents of young victims in Yeovil about how much anxiety the potential early release of their offenders, including members of child grooming gangs, has caused. Probation services in rural areas are on their knees, so will the Minister tell victims in Yeovil what work has been done with probation services in the south-west to ensure they have all the personnel, resources and systems in place to safely manage the release of offenders to our communities?
Catherine McKinnell
I am sorry to hear about the experience of those young people in Yeovil. We need to be careful about some of the rhetoric around the subject and to always have victims in mind when we have these conversations. Yes, there must be robust challenge to ensure that we get this right and that we push the measures we are taking to the furthest point possible to make sure we keep people safe, but we must also respect the work of our probation teams who are monitoring offenders in the community and working to keep people safe. There are a range of offences that are excluded from the progression model, so those offenders are not eligible for progression. We have increased the tagging of offenders, even where they are excluded from progression but whose crimes are of a nature that we would want them to be tagged and monitored post-release in any event. I want to provide reassurance to young people: we are working at pace and our very hardest to ensure that we keep the public safe, and we manage offenders as they reintegrate back into the community.
Markus Campbell-Savours (Penrith and Solway) (Lab)
One former Conservative Minister wrote a book that discussed the prison system’s failure to reform. Will the Minister confirm that she has looked at Rory Stewart’s book and his concerns that the Department lacked project management capabilities and support from the Treasury, and required a longer tenure for Prison Ministers? Would she recommend the book to the shadow Minister?
Catherine McKinnell
Indeed, Conservative Members have made a plethora of public commentary on such issues. As well as the book my hon. Friend mentioned, the former Prime Minister herself and her policy chief admitted that not enough prison places were built. I would be interested not only in whether Conservative Members might want to read the aforementioned book, but in whether they will apologise for the failures of the previous Government—this would be a good opportunity to do that.
Sir Gavin Williamson (Stone, Great Wyrley and Penkridge) (Con)
The Government have not yet set out the number of domestic abusers who have been released under the early release scheme. Will the Minister set out to the House what that number is, and the total number of domestic abusers who will be released under the scheme?
Catherine McKinnell
The right hon. Gentleman knows as well as I do that that figure is not available, but we could not take this issue more seriously. That is why we have tagging under the domestic abuse perpetrators on licence approach, and probation services have a wider set of powers, many of which I have mentioned, including restrictions on licence conditions to prohibit offenders from driving or attending public events. It is right that we bring in our world-leading restriction zones to ensure that it is the perpetrators, not the victims of domestic violence, who have to alter their lives. We will continue to prioritise and work on this issue, and he is right to raise it.
Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)
I speak regularly to victims of crime and their families in Harlow, and I find some of their stories absolutely heartbreaking. I feel really angry that there are men in our society who think it is okay to treat women in the way they do, and I am sure that people across the House feel the same way. One thing that victims and their families raise with me is their concern about how easy it is for perpetrators—these vile individuals—to take their tags off. What can the Minister say about the punishment that will be handed down to those individuals who tamper with their tags or try to take them off?
Catherine McKinnell
I share my hon. Friend’s anger. Since taking on this role, I have felt very angry not just with some of the perpetrators and the cases that we see come across our desks, but with the 14 years of failure that left us in the situation we are in. We are working at pace to improve the technology and the application of the tagging system. [Interruption.] The Conservatives chunter from the Opposition Benches, but they wasted £100 million on tags that did not work. We are working to ensure that this scheme is effective, and we are working at pace to pick up the pieces that were left behind.
Lee Anderson (Ashfield) (Reform)
Will the Minister please tell the House how many people who should be wearing an electronic tag are wandering around our communities with no electronic device fitted at all? That should be a simple question.
Catherine McKinnell
That question has a simple answer: the hon. Gentleman will be able to see the data when it is published in January. We have just had data published for the previous three months. The data obviously needs to be verified and accurate. We are not in the business of publishing data that is not robust, and we will publish it in due course in the normal way.
Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)
I thank the Minister for her very comprehensive answers. Electronic monitoring of offenders can be a useful tool to manage prison capacity for individuals who have carried out non-violent crimes, but there are some serious concerns about regional co-ordination. Can she assure the House that robust safeguards are in place to ensure that private monitoring contractors are sharing real-time flawless data with police forces in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland? What specific metric is her Department using to confirm that tagging systems are genuinely reducing offending, rather than being a sticking plaster for a broken system?
Catherine McKinnell
The hon. Gentleman asks a very thoughtful question, and one that probably requires a lengthier answer than I have time to give, but I absolutely acknowledge the point he makes. I am determined that we have the data, the monitoring and the reporting to ensure that this scheme does work and is not a sticking plaster, so that victims can have faith in it, and probation officers and the police can be supported to do what they need to do to keep our communities safe. We are investing significantly in this technology, and we need to ensure that it works. He raises a genuine and good point.
Oral Answers to Questions
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(1 month, 3 weeks ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Watch Debate Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
The Minister for Prisons, Probation and Reducing Reoffending (Catherine McKinnell)
Thank you, Mr Speaker. The right hon. Gentleman, himself a former Prisons Minister and a highly regarded former shadow Secretary of State, has raised this issue assiduously on behalf of his constituents. The project to replace a water main serving the Onley Park estate is progressing through design and development, with a projected programme expected in November.
Stuart Andrew
The Minister will know that Onley Park is still owned by the Ministry of Justice. Although I welcome the funding, these residents have been waiting years, and frankly they are really worried—we have still not got a start date or clarity around backdated bills, and the situation is affecting house sales now. Will the Minister meet me and representatives of the parish council, so that we can provide some clarity and a resolution for the residents of Onley Park?
Catherine McKinnell
I absolutely recognise the right hon. Gentleman’s concerns. As I have said, the projected programme should be with him by November. He will appreciate that there are important value for money considerations, and we also need to ensure we get the project right. It is expected to be a year long once it commences—by January 2027—but if he still requires a meeting, I would of course be happy to facilitate one.
Dr Andrew Murrison (South West Wiltshire) (Con)
Perran Moon (Camborne and Redruth) (Lab)
The Minister for Prisons, Probation and Reducing Reoffending (Catherine McKinnell)
The recruitment and retention of probation staff is a high priority for me and for the Government. We are absolutely committed to recruiting and retaining our brilliant and dedicated probation workforce so that they can supervise and manage offenders in the community and keep the public safe.
Perran Moon
The Probation Service is suffering from thousands of vacancies and a pretty appalling retention rate. The extra £700 million announced for the Probation Service from this Government is welcome, but does the Minister accept that some of that needs to support Probation Service salaries, which have been massively eroded after a decade and a half of pay freezes and real-term cuts?
Catherine McKinnell
My hon. Friend should be reassured to know that the retention rate of the Probation Service has improved significantly since this Government came to office. The south-west Probation Service has reported some of the best retention rates in the country, but we are investing £700 million into probation and the community. We are committed to supporting them, and discussions around pay are ongoing.
Mr Will Forster (Woking) (LD)
After releasing a man with a history of domestic violence from prison, the Probation Service told his former partner that he had made threats against both her and her child as he was being released. Unsurprisingly, she now lives in fear. The Probation Service even told my local authority, Woking borough council, that it needs to rehouse her for her own safety. Will the Minister urgently look at this case and agree to increase the probation workforce to ensure that this incident never happens again?
Catherine McKinnell
I am concerned to hear what the hon. Gentleman says, and I will look further into that case. We are committed to ensuring that we have the probation workforce so that people are safe and can feel confident that they are safe.
Catherine McKinnell
We are giving probation the widest and toughest range of tools ever to restrict offenders and their movements and to help protect victims. We are continuing to invest in strengthening the Probation Service via recruitment and digital improvements. We are building capacity, after years of the service being run down under the previous Government.
Sadik Al-Hassan (North Somerset) (Lab)
The Minister for Prisons, Probation and Reducing Reoffending (Catherine McKinnell)
We are committed to delivering 14,000 additional prison places by 2031, the largest expansion of prison capacity since the Victorian era. To date we have delivered 1,000 additional rapid deployment cells across 20 sites, with plans to deliver a further 400 by the end of 2027.
Mike Reader
I thank the Minister for her answer. However, I understand that following the collapse of the contractor ISG, there are a number of stalled projects in the programme that cannot be brought forward, and that contractors are lacking a long-term pipeline. Given the wider societal benefits of the programme—it is delivered through modern methods, in factory conditions—and the reduced operational impact, as the cells are made offsite, will the Minister ask her officials to review affordability criteria, so that we can bring more projects forward?
Catherine McKinnell
My hon. Friend is rightly interested in ensuring the plans are delivered. We are working flat out to deliver them on time—or, where we can, ahead of time. I will certainly look into the issues he raises. These are complex projects, but we are determined to get this right. I am happy that he has raised the issue, and we will look into it further.
Gideon Amos (Taunton and Wellington) (LD)
The Ministry of Justice will be able to deliver its rapid deployment cells building programme more quickly if it completes other programmes. Taunton Crown court has been closed since 2023, and the closure has just been extended. In March, I received a letter saying that the long-promised opening date in July was now cancelled, and that in due course I would receive an update. I have not received any update. Victims and jurors are having to travel extra tens of miles—30 or 40 miles—without public transport, which is a real burden on them. An exacerbating issue is the fact that jury recompense has not been updated since 2010. Will the Minister look into this issue, and also address jury recompense?
Sarah Bool (South Northamptonshire) (Con)
Rapid deployment cells are one option, but the question remains of why the Government are not making use of fully certified cells. HMP Millsike has an operational capacity of up to 1,500, but it has only 1,100 prisoners, due to staffing issues. Can the Minister guarantee that she will replace the 1,600 prison officers lost under Labour by next year?
Catherine McKinnell
About 80% of Millsike’s capacity is in use. Occupancy will continue to increase as and when that is appropriate and safe, and as and when we have the correct culture and processes established on the site. Clearly, this issue is pressing. We are working as hard as we can. We brought forward £110 million in investment to bring onsite any available space that is not currently in use. We will continue to do so, while making up for the staffing shortages that were left by the previous Government.
Anneliese Dodds (Oxford East) (Lab/Co-op)
Chris Murray (Edinburgh East and Musselburgh) (Lab)
The Minister for Prisons, Probation and Reducing Reoffending (Catherine McKinnell)
The Prison Service absolutely needs to be modernised, which is why we are building new digital prison services that will support the transformation of core prison operations and offender management; developing tactical AI-enabled tools for frontline staff to improve accuracy and efficiency; and exploring the use of biometric technology to improve public safety.
Chris Murray
My city of Edinburgh is a world centre for innovation in digital technology, including in areas with applications in prisons. For example, the company VisionRF produces tech that monitors signs of self-harm in prisons, preventing suicides and deaths on the estate. What role does the Minister expect technology to play in improving long-term performance of prisons, and will officials engage with Edinburgh researchers? Although justice policy is devolved, tech and innovation learnings can be applied to all parts of the UK.
Catherine McKinnell
My hon. Friend raises an interesting case. There is so much work going on with technological development that can support a more efficient Prison Service. We are investing £82 million, following the Dame Lynne Owens review, because there was chronic under-investment by the previous Government in technology, and we want the Prison Service taken into this century and beyond.
Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)
I welcome the Minister to her place, and wish her well in her role; I know that she will do exceptionally well. She referred to technological advances on the UK mainland. The hon. Member for Edinburgh East and Musselburgh (Chris Murray) mentioned that the justice system is devolved in Scotland; it is devolved in Northern Ireland as well, but it is important that that technology is shared. Can the Minister assure me that the Justice Minister in Northern Ireland will have access to that technology?
Catherine McKinnell
I appreciate the spirit in which the hon. Gentleman asks his question, and he has my assurance.
Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
Richard Foord (Honiton and Sidmouth) (LD)
The Minister for Prisons, Probation and Reducing Reoffending (Catherine McKinnell)
This Government are determined to give offenders the tools to move away from crime. To do that, we need to address issues such as housing, employment, and substance misuse, and to help offenders develop personal skills and behaviours. We are continuing to work on strengthening practice in that area.
Monica Harding
My local police force is working hard to get youth crime down, as I witnessed when I went out on an op, but reoffending is a real problem. Probation officers and youth justice workers play an essential role in the rehabilitation of young offenders, but in my area, the service was operating with under two thirds of its roles staffed last year. That is mostly due to the high cost of areas like Esher and Walton. A constituent who came to my surgery had been offered a position as a youth justice worker but had waited over six months for employment checks to be made. The Department’s data shows that almost 15,000 candidates are stuck in the vetting pipeline. What is the Minister doing about that?
Catherine McKinnell
The hon. Lady raises an important point, which I am very much working on. I am working with officials in the Department to understand exactly why vetting is taking so long, because we need those people employed, on the frontline and working to reduce reoffending. I reassure her that I am on the case.
Richard Foord
The problems with early release that we saw over the summer are partly an issue with reoffending, as a quarter of prisoners released go on to reoffend. I have a constituent whose sibling has moved into her small house after spending time in prison, to prevent him becoming homeless. I understand that community accommodation service tier 3 is a good scheme for supporting prisoners when they are first released, but what housing schemes support rehabilitation later, to stop that revolving door for some offenders?
Catherine McKinnell
The hon. Gentleman raises an important point, and an issue that I have identified as being a priority if we are to support people in not reoffending and going back into our prison system. Alongside the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government, we have committed to halving the proportion of those released homeless from prison. We need to support people into settled accommodation, so that they can get into employment and stay out of crime.
Seema Malhotra (Feltham and Heston) (Lab/Co-op)
I am pleased that the Government are extending intensive supervision courts, which combine rehabilitation with close judicial oversight, as I saw once on a visit to Texas. Tackling the causes of crime and interrupting the cycle of reoffending not only reduces crime, but helps people back into sustainable relationships and employment. Will the Minister share whether consideration is being given to extending the scheme to London in a future roll-out?
Catherine McKinnell
Such courts are to be seen not only in Texas, but in Stockton, Teesside; I visited an intensive supervision court there and saw for myself the value of this approach in ensuring that we really tackle the challenge of prolific offending among the relatively small group of people who commit a significant number of crimes. We are operating this approach in four locations in England, and will do so in a further seven by 2029, including in London.
Rachael Maskell (York Central) (Lab/Co-op)
I refer Members to my entry in the Register of Members’ Financial Interests. Last week, I visited a prison with the University and College Union to look at the prison education service. I saw the power of dynamic prison education, but also heard about the cuts to these privatised contracts. Will the Minister will bring those contracts back in-house, and work with the Department for Work and Pensions and the Department for Education to ensure that education has real purpose in people’s lives and reduces reoffending?
Catherine McKinnell
My hon. Friend will hopefully not doubt my commitment, as a former Minister for Schools, to education as a life-changing force. Indeed, I want to see it employed to reduce reoffending and protect the public while changing lives.
Mr Paul Kohler (Wimbledon) (LD)
Restorative justice has a vital role to play in cutting reoffending and supporting victims. I would not be here today, after a violent attack in my home, were it not for a subsequent RJ session. I am consequently very concerned that the Prison and Probation Service has recently issued a protocol that would have denied access to RJ to my family, as well as the family of James Hodgkinson, on whom the play “Punch” is based. As I understand it, no Minister has yet been formally assigned the RJ role in the Ministry of Justice, but when they are, will they meet me and Jacob Dunne, the RJ campaigner and the perpetrator in “Punch”, to help reverse this retrograde step?
Catherine McKinnell
I thank the hon. Gentleman for raising that point. Restorative justice is clearly a vital part of our system, and we need to ensure that it works to the fullest effect. I would be more than happy to have the meeting that he suggests.
Deirdre Costigan (Ealing Southall) (Lab)
From 26 October, Labour’s new respect orders will mean that those persistently involved in antisocial behaviour in Ealing Southall can be required to attend drug and alcohol rehab to reduce reoffending. What work is the Minister doing with the Home Office to ensure that our courts have the guidance they need in advance of 26 October, so that both the police and the courts can act immediately to make Ealing Southall safer?
Catherine McKinnell
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. She has raised some of the practical issues surrounding this matter with me, and she can be assured that I have taken them forward; indeed, I will take forward the request she makes today. We work with other Departments to ensure that these support services are available to reduce reoffending and keep the public safe. I will take on board the suggestions she has made today.
Alison Hume (Scarborough and Whitby) (Lab)
Mr Andrew Snowden (Fylde) (Con)
The Minister for Prisons, Probation and Reducing Reoffending (Catherine McKinnell)
The distribution of property used by the Probation Service’s accommodation service is regularly reviewed to meet local need, operational requirements and community considerations, as we need to ensure that the properties are allocated appropriately and that there is sufficient capacity.
Mr Snowden
Properties such as rundown B&Bs have long been used as houses in multiple occupation for services such as probation, and councils in large metropolitan areas use them for adult and children’s social services, effectively as a dumping ground. This is a cross-Government problem that has been going on over some time. Will the Minister assure me that through the early release scheme they will not add to problems such as those in Blackpool, where the concentration of HMOs used by multiple services creates transient populations?
Catherine McKinnell
The hon. Gentleman raises an important point, and that has to be a consideration. Clearly, the accommodation is demand-led. Ideally, offenders should be resettled back into their communities, where they have community ties and are able to build their life and find stable accommodation so they do not reoffend. That needs to be done on a local and case-by-case basis to make sure that it is appropriate within the setting.
Callum Anderson (Buckingham and Bletchley) (Lab)
Dr Andrew Murrison (South West Wiltshire) (Con)
The Minister for Prisons, Probation and Reducing Reoffending (Catherine McKinnell)
I absolutely agree with the right hon. Gentleman, and I am working with Cabinet colleagues to make sure that prison officers who have worked hard all their lives in, as he says, incredibly challenging circumstances get the retirement they deserve.
Mrs Sharon Hodgson (Washington and Gateshead South) (Lab)
Greg Smith (Mid Buckinghamshire) (Con)
Ministry of Justice contractors are acting in a deeply inconsiderate manner, affecting my constituents in Edgcott, Grendon Underwood and the Springhill Road estate in the construction of a new mega-prison adjacent to HMP Grendon. I asked the Minister in writing over the summer if she would come and see with her own eyes those problems. She wrote back to me yesterday to say no. Why will she not, and will she reconsider?
Catherine McKinnell
The hon. Gentleman will know the importance of ensuring that we build the prison capacity that was so lacking under the previous Government. Officials continue to regularly meet the local council, elected councillors and parish councils to agree all traffic management and address challenges around the site. I am visiting as many prisons as I can get to, and I will certainly endeavour to visit HMP Grendon in due course.
Alistair Strathern (Hitchin) (Lab)
Kim Johnson (Liverpool Riverside) (Lab)
Last week Appeal launched a campaign calling for Trew’s law, which would review the cases of all imprisoned police officers, following the actions of a corrupt and racist British Transport police officer, Derek Ridgewell. Will the Minister agree to meet me and the campaigners to discuss this law?
Dr Danny Chambers (Winchester) (LD)
There has long been a proven link between people deliberately harming animals and then committing domestic abuse. The Links Group has researched and highlighted that link for 25 years and is having a special conference later this year to mark this. Will the Minister agree to meet me and the Links Group so that we can draw on its 25 years of expertise to help prevent avoidable harm to women, children and even animals?
Mr Andrew Snowden (Fylde) (Con)
I previously put it to the Prisons Minister in one of these sessions that anyone who fails a drug test on arrival in an open prison like Kirkham does not belong there and should be sent back to a more secure prison. The Minister said they were concerned but could not agree to that. Has the Department had any more thoughts on at least consequences for failing a drug test on arrival at an open prison?
Catherine McKinnell
I absolutely recognise the hon. Gentleman’s concerns. We have a review ongoing into these issues within prisons, led by Amber Rudd, and we will continue to ensure that we have the deterrence, to stop drugs getting in, and that the right actions are taken when they do.
Nick Timothy
On a point of order, Mr Speaker. In oral questions just now, the Justice Secretary stood there and said again that he wanted to work collaboratively, and he invited the House to scrutinise the Government’s proposals on juries, but those are just words. This summer, as the Government constantly changed policy on early release, I wrote to him and the Prime Minister three times in July and twice in August, and received no reply until I got a short, dismissive reply last Thursday, by which point—[Interruption.] What are your guidelines? By that point, the policy had changed several times. Just now, the Secretary of State dismissed my question sarcastically, saying that he was not the correspondence secretary. That is not only disrespectful to the House; it is disrespectful to his correspondence secretary and may explain the delays—
Home Office and Ministry of Justice
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(4 months, 1 week ago)
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Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) (Lab)
It is an honour to follow my hon. Friend the Member for Congleton (Sarah Russell), and indeed, to follow all the Members who have contributed to what has been a very thoughtful debate. There seems to be a huge amount of cross-party consensus, indicated by the Chair of the Justice Committee, my hon. Friend the Member for Hammersmith and Chiswick (Andy Slaughter) and my colleague on the Public Accounts Committee, the hon. Member for North Cotswolds (Sir Geoffrey Clifton-Brown). I commend the hon. Gentleman for the work that he does in championing sound public finances. I also agreed with a great deal of what he said about this being an issue across Government, and about the Public Accounts Committee therefore being well placed to contribute to the discussion and, indeed, the solutions. Failures to address these issues have significant effects, both on the public finances and on the most vulnerable people in society, and, indeed, they are issues that are often reflected in our constituency mailboxes.
I was contacted recently by a young woman who had reported child sexual abuse to the police last year. Owing to repeated delays and cancellations, she has still not had her “achieving best evidence” interview with the police. That is extremely distressing for her, as all can imagine, but I am afraid it is symptomatic of the delays that persist within the criminal justice system, and we know that young victims are significantly more likely to withdraw from the justice process when a case is dragging on. In 2023, more than one in four rape investigations ended because the victims could no longer continue. These long waiting times are a significant factor when it comes to achieving justice, not to mention the cost to the public purse. With that in mind, I am pleased that the Government have already lifted the cap on the number of days on which courts can sit, because it will promote efficiency within the system. We must use our court estate to its full capacity, and we know that that is not happening at present.
Warinder Juss (Wolverhampton West) (Lab)
Not long ago, I had a meeting with a group of barristers at Wolverhampton Crown court. They were grateful to the Government for uncapping the number of hearing days and trial dates, which they said had made a significant difference to the court backlogs, but they also raised the problem of prisoners not arriving in court on time. They felt that dealing with it would make a significant impact on ensuring that cases did proceed. Does my hon. Friend agree that the Government could perhaps take another look at that?
Catherine McKinnell
I entirely agree, and my hon. Friend has anticipated a point that I was going to make. The increased court days are clearly vital to maintaining productivity and the efficiency of the use of court time, although that only works if the court system itself is working. We have seen very good examples of the way in which the additional days are already being used to clear backlogs and reduce the number of outstanding cases. In the English courts, we have seen evidence of the prioritisation of domestic abuse cases involving vulnerable witnesses. This can reduce waiting times, particularly for people involved in those sensitive cases—and yes, that makes a big difference to them individually, but it also makes an impact on our system as a whole.
As my hon. Friend has said, we need a court estate that is fit for purpose in order to maximise the use of these additional days. I too have visited my local court, in this instance Newcastle Crown court. What was obvious, even on the day I was there, was the consequence of some of the malfunctions in the system that make it difficult for court cases to proceed, such as faulty infrastructure, the flooding of parts of the court building, dock alarms or door locks failing to operate. As a result of such problems, staff do not feel safe enough to do their work and maintain the security of the courtroom, and therefore cannot go ahead. Often it is vulnerable victims who bear the brunt of delays and cancelled court hearings.
On the day I was at Newcastle Crown court, I heard about a complainant in a rape case. Her husband was the victim of an assault by the defendant, who had raped his wife. They were forced to wait four hours for the trial to begin. They were eventually told that the defendant would arrive and that the delay to his delivery was causing the delay, but it had a knock-on effect on additional days in court. Such delays ensue right across the system.
Court staff report that, from a structural perspective, many of the issues affecting the court system in Newcastle have been caused by the departure of a full-time maintenance engineer, who was dismissed due to the need to make savings. In the light of the many delays of trials and hearings, that appears to be a false economy, which is why I am pleased that the Government have recognised the challenges to the court estate itself and are making investments. I am also really pleased that the Minister is acting on the huge problem of private contractors delivering defendants to an incorrect court, several hours late or just not at all.
Midway through a trial in Newcastle in April, a defendant left court in custody on a Friday, only to fail to reappear the following Monday, with a jury ready and waiting. It is completely unacceptable, a total waste of taxpayers’ money and hugely offensive to those taking part in trials. I know the Minister is aware of these issues and is keen to establish an oversight body to review the prisoner transfer process from end to end. I will keep a very close eye on that, and I am sure that other Members contributing to this debate will do the same.
Finally, I know that the Government recognise the importance of providing free legal advice, as set out very well by my hon. Friend the Member for Congleton. The Public Accounts Committee has recognised the importance of investing up to £34 million more a year in criminal aid, which is welcome.
I conclude by asking the Minister to join me in recognising both the human and the financial benefit of timely justice, the absolute importance of maintaining our court estate, and the improvements. Where we see good practice happening across our system, it must be shared. I often hear good ideas and wonder why they are not being done elsewhere, and we need to have a system in which good practice is shared and best practice is rolled out for the benefit of justice right across the system.
Oral Answers to Questions
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(5 years, 5 months ago)
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Robert Buckland
Volumes of possession actions remain significantly low as a result of measures that we took in response to the pandemic. Indeed, although the ban in England on bailiff-enforced evictions will end on 31 May, the requirement for landlords to give extended notice periods to seek possession orders in all but the most egregious cases has really struck the right balance. We intend to taper down these notice periods to pre-covid levels by October, which will help to manage demand in the courts. I pay tribute to senior judiciary for working at pace to develop a case management approach to possession cases.
Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) (Lab)
Robert Buckland
With respect to the hon. Lady, I think that her concerns are wholly misplaced; I would be kind enough to say that. Some of the objection to this is, frankly, synthetic. The last Labour Government introduced it in Northern Ireland in 2003 without any concomitant reduction in turnout. Countries such as France and Canada and other mature democracies have long had this system in place. We will provide free identification for the tiny minority of people who do not have it. Frankly, the people of this country are wondering why on earth this has not been done before and are bewildered by the Opposition’s confected objections.
Oral Answers to Questions
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(6 years, 3 months ago)
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Robert Buckland
My hon. Friend always speaks with passion on behalf of victims of crime in North Cornwall. He knows that the county of the Duchy sits within the Devon and Cornwall police and crime commissioner area, which has received over £2 million of funding to support victims of crime this financial year. The Ministry of Justice provides £510,000 of funding directly to five sexual violence support providers in the PCC area through the rape support fund. We have allocated another £439,000, which has been distributed to local providers via the PCC, to support victims of domestic and sexual violence. An additional £195,000 of covid-19 extraordinary funding has been distributed to rape support centres in the Devon and Cornwall PCC area through the rape support fund.
Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) (Lab)
Robert Buckland
I am grateful to the hon. Lady for raising that specific point. It deserves closer scrutiny, and I would be happy to engage directly with her on the issue.
Oral Answers to Questions
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(7 years, 10 months ago)
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Lucy Frazer
Cornwall is a sparsely populated area and there are difficulties there, but there is always access to the telephone service. It is right that we should look not only at face-to-face advice but at where technology can help to deliver legal advice to people.
Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) (Lab)
Lucy Frazer
The hon. Lady makes an important point about ensuring that we have support for those who are most vulnerable, but I would like to make two points on welfare benefits, which she has highlighted. First, the most important outcome for benefit claimants is that the decisions on their claims should be right first time. This avoids the need to go to court at all, and my Department is working closely with the Department for Work and Pensions to ensure efficient decision making. I have met the Minister twice to ensure that we get those decisions right first time. Secondly, while decisions on welfare claims significantly impact the lives of often vulnerable people, the claims are often not complicated. We are making changes to the tribunal system to ensure that those cases are handled simply, effectively and more quickly.
Oral Answers to Questions
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(10 years, 4 months ago)
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Mr Speaker
Bad Boys bakers no doubt felt very privileged to be visited by the hon. Gentleman.
Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) (Lab)
10. What progress he has made on proposals for reform of the Human Rights Act 1998.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mr Dominic Raab)
We will bring forward our proposals for a British Bill of Rights to replace the Human Rights Act. We have made good progress on the development of our plans, with input from practitioners, non-governmental organisations, academics and many others right across the UK. Our proposals will be announced in due course and we shall consult fully on them.
Catherine McKinnell
The Minister says that plans will be published in due course, but plans to repeal the Human Rights Act were announced in the Conservative manifestos in both 2010 and 2015 and in the Queen’s Speech in 2015 and 2016. Can he please explain why his Department has so far failed to publish any proposals or begin a consultation on those plans?
Mr Raab
I appreciate that the hon. Lady is eager to engage in a detailed, substantive debate on human rights. Distinguished people in the Opposition, from Lord Irvine through to the current shadow Justice Secretary, have talked about the defects in the Human Rights Act. They have made compelling points and we intend to act on them. I look forward to debating the matter with the hon. Lady in due course.
Transitional State Pension Arrangements for Women
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(10 years, 8 months ago)
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Owen Smith
That is an extremely common experience for MPs, because the letters sent out in 1995 by the then Tory Government were neither use nor ornament. I have got one here that was sent to a woman on 13 June 1995. This letter has five pages, and not one of them mentions that the pension age is going to rise to 65. In fact, every single page refers to the fact that the state pension age for women is 60. The final page offers the extraordinary suggestion that
“a form inviting you to claim your State Retirement Pension will be sent to you”
a few
“months before you reach 60.”
This happened in the very month that the Bill that became the 1995 Act was going through this House under that Government. That is a measure of what a desperately poor job they did of informing people.
Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) (Lab)
I have lost count of the number of constituents who have contacted me to say that they had absolutely no idea about these pension changes and heard about them on the radio or the TV. Fortunately, we are raising the profile of this issue on the Government’s behalf. Is it not insulting of Government Members to suggest that these women are wrong, or lying, or that there is something wrong with them, when ultimately it is the Government’s responsibility to communicate these changes?
Owen Smith
It is wrong, it is insulting, and it compounds the more fundamental insult that women who, by and large, have smaller pensions because they had lower earnings throughout their entire lifetime while bearing a burden for the rest of us, have been told that they cannot access their pension. That is the real insult that we should be worried about.
My hon. Friend is right that it is completely insulting to suggest that proper notice was given, because the truth is that it was a botched job from start to finish. We know that because the current Conservative Pensions Minister in the House of Lords says so. She says quite clearly that
“until recently, many of these women were expecting to receive their state pension at age 60, since they were unaware of the changes made in 1995”.
The Government are damned out of their own mouths.
Mr Vara
I will not give way, as I wish to make progress.
Following the 2011 Act, we wrote to all those directly affected to inform them of the change to their state pension age. About 5 million letters were sent by the DWP and the sending of the letters to those affected was completed between January 2012 and November 2013. Letters to those whose state pension age was set by the 1995 Act only were sent between April 2009, when Labour was still in government, and March 2011, when that process was finished by the coalition Government. As a result of those efforts, in 2012 a survey by the DWP found that only 6% of women who were within 10 years of receiving their pension thought that their state pension age was still 60.
The shadow Work and Pensions Secretary mentioned several surveys and was somewhat selective in those to which he referred. The one done by the DWP, which runs and is in charge of the pension scheme, has a fair amount of validity and, as I say, only 6% of women who were within 10 years of receiving their pension thought that their state pension age was still 60. As for the original 1995 changes to the state pension age, in 2004 nearly three quarters of those between 45 and 54 were aware of changes to women’s state pensions. Our communications campaign has focused on raising general awareness of the changes and encouraging those closest to the state pension age to get a personalised state pension statement.
Mr Vara
I am grateful to my hon. Friend for putting those facts on the record. I am, however, sorry that as he was making those points of substance, all he got was the yah-boo politics that we can expect from the Opposition. I am afraid that the truth, as anyone watching this debate at home can see for themselves, is that the Opposition do not want to know the substance or the facts. All they are interested in is the politics, but this is far too important an issue to be treated with the political naivety with which some Opposition Members are treating it. This is an important subject and the Government are dealing with it and treating it with the seriousness it deserves.
Catherine McKinnell
I thank the Minister for giving way, and he is clearly in a difficult corner, but I wondered whether he could clarify whether the Government now accept that women—well, anybody—need at least 10 years’ notification of a pension change in order to plan and prepare. If the Government now accept that, will he explain why that does not apply to this group of women?
Mr Vara
The hon. Lady will be aware that Governments have to take difficult decisions at times. Considering the state of the economy and the financial position that this Government came into—she will be aware that one of her own colleagues said that there was no money left—and considering the longevity of both men and women, the Government had to take difficult decisions, as all Governments of both shades have to. This Government had to take difficult decisions and we took them because they needed to be taken.
Ian Blackford
I will give way later, but I want to make some progress because I am aware of the time constraints.
Parliament voted unanimously on 7 January for a motion that the Government should put into place mitigation for the women affected. The Prime Minister speaks about the sovereignty of this House. Why have the Government ignored that vote? Why have they ignored the will of the House? Whose sovereignty now? They cannot ignore the will of the House at random on the legitimate demands of the WASPI people. The Government are treating this House and the people of this country with contempt. Where is parliamentary democracy?
Catherine McKinnell
Does the hon. Gentleman share my concern that the Minister has, basically, confirmed from the Dispatch Box that this disgraceful discrimination is a price worth paying for deficit reduction?
Ian Blackford
The hon. Lady makes a very good point. The women in the WASPI campaign are paying for the failures of the economic policy of this Government.
Let me remind the House that what we have is a Conservative Government—
Police Grant Report (England and Wales)
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(10 years, 8 months ago)
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Mike Penning
My hon. Friend is absolutely right about that. We fund counter-terrorism from a separate budget, and that is enormously important. We have a Minister of State who specifically deals with that task. It is really interesting that even though I have heard Opposition Members say today, “This is terrible! This is going to happen; this has happened,” actually the 43 authorities welcomed the Chancellor’s Budget, and I have had really interesting discussions with them, in some of the areas represented by Members who have complained today about the settlement. That is what this debate is supposed to be about: it is about a very generous settlement, which we would not have had if we had not won the arguments with the Chancellor.
Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) (Lab)
I am slightly baffled by the Minister’s comments. Northumbria police force expects to have lost about £150 million between 2010 and 2020, and its workforce has already been cut by a quarter, split equally between police officers and police staff. Will he clarify in what way that is a generous settlement?
Mike Penning
Let me go over the arguments. We inherited a fiscal mess left by the previous Administration. We had to make really difficult financial decisions, including on policing. The police forces did brilliantly well. They were genuinely very worried that we would extend that approach into 2015-16, but we did not do that, which is why they are saying thank you to us for not making 10% cuts to policing, which is what Labour’s Front-Bench team would have done.
Transitional State Pension Arrangements for Women
Catherine McKinnell Excerpts(10 years, 9 months ago)
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Richard Graham
I will come to questions in a moment.
I hope the Minister will confirm all my points, because they have important consequences for everyone, not least the 10 years’ notice of any change.
Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) (Lab)
On a point of order, Mr Stringer. You asked us at the start of this debate to do the maths on the time needed to allow all 20 speakers to speak. I did the maths, and it was five to six minutes. The hon. Member for Gloucester (Richard Graham) might be having some difficulty.
Graham Stringer (in the Chair)
That is not a point of order, but the point is well made.
Graham Stringer (in the Chair)
Again, that is not a point of order, but the point is made.
Catherine McKinnell
Further to that point of order, Mr Stringer. Can you guide me on whether you have any control over this issue? My concern is that it is deeply disrespectful to the many women here who are concerned about this subject.
Graham Stringer (in the Chair)
Mr Graham has the floor. He has heard the points, and I intend to impose a time limit when he sits down.
Catherine McKinnell (Newcastle upon Tyne North) (Lab)
I, too, strongly commend my hon. Friend the Member for Warrington North (Helen Jones) for leading this debate so powerfully. Although the injustice imposed on women born in the 1950s has been repeatedly debated, discussed and raised with the Prime Minister in recent weeks and months, this is my first opportunity since returning to the Back Benches to express my constituents’ concerns, and I am grateful for it.
The Minister and the Government regularly state that the changes to the state pension age imposed by the Pensions Act 2011 are vital to ensuring that our pensions system is fair, affordable and sustainable, and I am sure the Minister will repeat those words today; but not a single Member of this House would suggest that our pensions system should be anything other than fair, affordable or sustainable, and nor would any of the women who are part of the brilliant WASPI campaign. I agree that it is right to equalise the state pension age for women and men, but I thoroughly object to the Government’s implication that the women, and indeed men, who are campaigning on this issue are standing in the way of progress, or acting as a barrier to the achievement of gender equality and fairness. That is deeply insulting, patronising and wrong.
We are, thankfully, living longer, and few people would doubt that the state pension age must rise to reflect that, but the crux of the matter is that these pension changes have not been properly communicated to those affected, and women born in the 1950s have been disproportionately hit because their pension age has been increased not once but twice, with very little time for them to do anything about it. That relatively small group of women is being asked to bear the cost of making our pension system fair, sustainable and affordable for everyone else. That is patently unfair and blatantly discriminatory. Women across the country have been left in real fear, simply because they did not have the foresight to be born a few years—in some cases, a few months—earlier.
How dare the Government lecture those women about the importance of gender equality? They have worked hard, done the right thing and paid into the system. They have faced discrimination, unfairness and inequality throughout their working and often their family lives. They thought they had entered into a pensions contract with the Government, only to discover as they neared retirement that the Government were not going to keep their side of the bargain. That is the very definition of unfairness, and the notion that inequality can be fought by imposing more of it is absurd.
Mrs Sharon Hodgson (Washington and Sunderland West) (Lab)
Will my hon. Friend give way?
Catherine McKinnell
I am sorry, but I will not.
Women across Newcastle North face real financial hardship as a result of these changes, just when they thought they had done their bit As well as repeatedly lobbying the Minister for Pensions about the wider injustice, I have written to her about every single case in my consistency that I have been contacted about. I want her to appreciate the real impact that the changes are having on individuals’ lives. I want to share some examples today, if I have enough time.
One of my constituents, a brilliant WASPI campaigner, at the age of 54 and on the advice of her union contacted the DWP in 2008 to request a state pension forecast. She was informed that she had attained 38 qualifying years. She has received no other information from the Government about the 1995 changes. However, she was born in November 1954, so under the 2011 pension changes, at the age of 61 with 45 qualifying years, she is unable to receive her state pension for another five years. She has worked since she was 15, and is now unable to do so because she is pre-diabetic and pre-glaucomic. She claims jobseeker’s allowance, but cannot complete the job searches because her condition makes it difficult to use a computer. She is attempting to find work in a region that has the highest level of unemployment anywhere in the country by some margin.
What particularly worries me about that case is not only that my constituent has received no information from the Government about the 2011 changes—she found out about them by chance—but that she has been informed that she will not be entitled to receive a full state pension under the new system unless she makes further contributions between 2016 and 2020, despite having 45 qualifying years. Given her health conditions, it is impossible for her to do so. I gently ask the Minister, who campaigned vociferously on this issue, what is the point of becoming a Minister if you are unprepared to use the levers of power when you have the opportunity to do so?