Ethiopia: Northern Tigray Region

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Wednesday 2nd December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Alton of Liverpool (CB)]

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper. In doing so, I declare my interest as the vice-chairman of the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Eritrea.

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, an initial Tigray humanitarian preparedness plan has been prepared by the United Nations. A comprehensive assessment of the humanitarian needs across Tigray has not yet been possible. We are encouraged that an assessment mission co-ordinated by the UN is scheduled to commence later this week, and this follows efforts by the UK and others to press for implementation of the assessment. We have also contributed to the UN guiding principles presented to the Government of Ethiopia on humanitarian access, with a view to the delivery of assistance for civilians.

[Lord Alton of Liverpool (CB)]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for that reply. Can I press him further on the issue of the humanitarian corridor? Will this conform to United Nations principles of neutrality, and will access be granted to our diplomats to visit Tigray? Secondly, how do we intend to hold to account those who have been responsible for the torture of refugees, the forced reform of refugees and some pretty barbaric acts which have been carried out against some of those who have escaped from Tigray?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on the noble Lord’s second point, of course the situation at the moment does not allow for a full assessment. But let me assure him of this: we will certainly continue to press that any perpetrators of such acts are brought to justice. On his point about humanitarian corridors, we are liaising closely with the UN humanitarian organisations to establish what, if any, additional support is needed to press for diplomatic channels in particular—which we have been doing—to allow for the principles that he has articulated. It is integral to the principles laid down by OCHA, which the UK supported the development of.

[Lord Hain (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that there is a real prospect of the Ethiopian conflict getting right out of control, especially given the Horn of Africa’s strategic importance, with Gulf countries, China, the US and others jockeying for influence, or even becoming a Libyan nightmare of war crimes, war lords and ethnic cleansing? Can the Government redouble efforts to broker negotiations through the United Nations, the African Union and the EU?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, first let me assure the noble Lord that I share his concern, when we see the challenges faced in neighbouring countries, about the importance of containing this and seeking a peaceful settlement. On the channels he has mentioned, my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary discussed co-ordination with our EU partners on 23 November, and we are in discussions with key African partners, including Uganda, Somalia, Kenya and, importantly, South Africa. At the UN, we also participated in the Security Council debate on 24 November.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, given the risk to stability in the region, does the Minister agree with former US ambassador Carson when he said yesterday that the battle cannot be won militarily, and that it is vital that neighbours do not become embroiled through the use of their bases or airspace? Could he spell out which EU countries the United Kingdom is working with to secure these aims via the UN?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

On the noble Baroness’s two questions, I can say yes and yes. We are working specifically with the likes of Germany and France in this respect, which also have important equities in that area.

[Lord Lancaster of Kimbolton (Con)]

My Lords, all too often, women and children are the greatest victims of conflict. The UK is leading the way in the implementation of UN Resolution 1325, which recognises the importance of women’s involvement in peacekeeping. I visited and saw first-hand the UK contribution to the Peace Support Training Centre in Addis but, in light of recent events, is now the time to increase our commitment to that centre?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My noble friend speaks with some insight and, of course, great expertise. I share his view that one of the real successes has been the women, peace and security programme run by the Ministry of Defence and the FCDO. On his specific question on whether we increase capacity, obviously the situation at the moment is very fluid on the ground, but he makes a very important suggestion, which I will certainly take back and update him on accordingly.

[Baroness Cox (CB) [V]]

My Lords, what assessment have Her Majesty’s Government made of the Ethiopian premier’s assertion in Parliament on 30 November that his forces “have not killed a single civilian” during the conflict in the Tigray region? That followed a statement by the International Committee of the Red Cross on 29 November that Ayder Referral Hospital in the Tigrayan capital was “running dangerously low” on stocks and body bags due to an influx of wounded people, and that 80% of them had suffered unspecified trauma injuries. What can be done to help the supply of medical equipment much needed for that hospital?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I assure the noble Baroness that I have been speaking directly to UN agencies, as have other colleagues within the FCDO. I share the important point she raised right at the end of her question, and we are pressing for unfettered humanitarian access. The number of fatalities is unclear, but there is clearly also a high level of internally displaced people. I assure her that we are using all good offices and lobbying directly with the country, as my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary has done, to ensure unfettered humanitarian access to the region.

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

Picking up the last point the Minister mentioned, on the number of internally displaced people, has there been an assessment of how many there are? Have conversations taken place with the Governments of Sudan and Eritrea over the support that could be given to refugees at the border as well?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on the noble Lord’s second point, the short answer is yes. We have raised it on a bilateral basis, as have international agencies. One figure I can share with him is that we now estimate that more than 45,449 people have fled Ethiopia for neighbouring Sudan—that is the latest figure I have. That is an example of the figures we have been able to make an assessment on.

[Baroness Barker (LD)]

My Lords, given that this is, in essence, a political and economic conflict, and given also that the Chinese Government are the biggest economic investor in Ethiopia, are Her Majesty’s Government working with the Chinese Government to see what influence they can bring to bear to calm matters and to bring about a potential negotiation between Ethiopia and Eritrea?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

The noble Baroness makes an important point. We too are one of the leading international donors to the country, and I assure her that we are using, in particular, our discussions at the UN in pursuit of that aim.

[The Lord Bishop of St Albans [V]]

Prior to the conflict, Tigray was a safe haven for Eritrean refugees afraid to return home because of fear of persecution. With Eritrea’s rumoured involvement in the conflict against the TPLF, what assessment have Her Majesty’s Government made of the validity of claims that the Eritrean military are forcing refugees into trucks and abducting them back to Eritrea?

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[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

The right reverend Prelate is right to raise those concerns. This too is part of the conversations that my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary has had with the Eritrean Government. They, of course, refute any such programmes or policy, but we continue to raise our concerns directly with them.

[Lord Robathan (Con)]

My Lords, I first visited Ethiopia with the Commons International Development Committee. We had a long meeting with Meles Zenawi, who was very impressive, and was often described as Tony Blair’s favourite African dictator. He, of course, has been gone for many years. However, when I visited last year, although there was greater prosperity there was still grinding poverty. Can my noble friend assure me that henceforth, when we pour in billions and billions of pounds in aid, as we have done in Ethiopia, for humanitarian reasons and for education and health, we will also look at what is happening to the defence budgets of such countries? I am afraid that what has been happening is fungibility. We have been giving aid for education and health—they have been spending money on arms.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My noble friend raises an important point about transparency in development spending. That is why the new structure at the FCDO will pursue that very point, ensuring that development support is intended for those who are suffering, and gets directly to them.

[Lord Harries of Pentregarth (CB) [V]]

In answer to the question asked by the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, the Minister said that the Government were in touch with France and Germany. Are the Government in touch with any power in the region itself that might be an influence for good, and what response have they had from the African Union about the role that it might play?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

Let me assure the noble and right reverend Lord that yes, we are in touch with some of the countries I have already listed, such as Kenya, Uganda, Somalia and South Africa. We are dealing with those countries in the region at the most senior levels of government.

[Baroness Goudie (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, may I ask the Minister about local women being asked to be at the peace table, on both sides, from now on? It is only with local women at the peace table that we will get real peace.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I totally agree with the noble Baroness. The United Kingdom has been at the forefront of involving women peace mediators. Indeed, we have launched several initiatives, and I agree that when women are involved in bringing about peace and sustaining it, peace agreements last much longer. The evidence is there for all to see.

[The Lord Speaker (Lord Fowler)]

My Lords, all supplementary questions have been asked, and that brings Question Time to an end.

Official Development Assistance

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Wednesday 2nd December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Sheehan (LD) [V]]

My Lords, I thank the Minister for bringing this Statement to your Lordships’ House. In her resignation letter to the Prime Minister, the former FCDO Minister, the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg, called the cut to the aid budget “fundamentally wrong”. She could not in all integrity defend the betrayal of a manifesto commitment made less than a year ago. Her view is endorsed by many others in the Minister’s own party in both Houses. No fewer than five former Prime Ministers—three from the Minister’s own party—and the most reverend Primate the Archbishop of Canterbury have said that this cut to international aid is morally wrong and harmful to Britain’s standing on the international stage. Not so long ago—in July and again in September—the Secretary of State, Dominic Raab, agreed.

To tie the cuts in the aid budget to the £4 billion increase in the defence budget is to rub salt into the wound. The Secretary of State would do well to heed the words of the noble Lord, Lord Dannatt, in your Lordships’ House last week. He said that the UK’s influence comes,

“largely through the integration of our hard power ... with our soft power”,

and that reducing the international development budget will significantly

“reduce the impact of so-called global Britain”.—[Official Report, 25/11/20; col. 250.]

In his Statement, the Secretary of State says that the cut to the aid budget nevertheless means that Britain’s aid spend remains at No. 2 among the G20. This misses the point. The outcry is because the Government are reneging on an unequivocal manifesto commitment and cutting aid over and above the fall in GNI at a moment unprecedented in global history. Future generations will rightly be appalled. It is akin to kicking someone when they are down. The British people have a strong sense of fair play. It is wrong to suggest, as I have seen in the press, that public opinion is on the side of these cuts. There is no evidence to support this assertion.

The 0.7% of GNI aid target, enshrined in law, is a proud Liberal Democrat achievement. It was spearheaded in the other place by the Private Member’s Bill from my right honourable friend Michael Moore. In your Lordships’ House, it was ably led by my noble friend Lord Purvis of Tweed, supported by my noble friend Lady Northover—then a DfID Minister in the coalition Government. Do the Government intend to change that law to reduce the aid target to 0.5%? If so, do they intend to use a Finance Bill as the vehicle for it?

Can the Minister state categorically that the 0.7% will be met this year? I regret that I need to ask this, but doubt remains. Will any shortfall caused by the overenthusiastic £2.9 billion cut announced in July be managed in a way that alleviates poverty and offers taxpayers value for money?

The Secretary of State does not mention scrutiny either in this Statement or in his letter to the noble Baroness, Lady Anelay, chair of the International Relations and Defence Committee. Can the Minister assure your Lordships’ House that monitoring and assessment of the effectiveness and value for money of ODA spend will not be the preserve of internal FCDO processes, but rather subject to independent, open and transparent scrutiny, including by parliamentarians?

What assessment have the Government made of how many UK international NGOs will go under next year as a consequence of the economic situation and of this cut? How many jobs will be lost in the UK? Does the Minister agree that these NGOs, particularly the small ones, have the trust of local community leaders and so have been able to go that vital last mile to deliver essential healthcare, nutrition and—crucially today—vaccines? Surely he accepts that the COVAX initiative will fail unless we can get supplies to where they are needed. We must have robust health systems on the ground to vaccinate people. I fear that this Statement shows that joined-up thinking is not currently a strength of the new FCDO.

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, first, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness, Lady Sheehan, for their comments. I also thank them for making time last week, in calls that I and colleagues made, to discuss their obvious concerns about this cut, some of which they have articulated today.

I say at the outset in responding to both the noble Lord and the noble Baroness that, as my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary mentioned specifically in his Statement, the decision was taken given the effects of the global pandemic on the economy and, as a result, the public finances, but it was taken with deep regret. It was felt that at the moment we cannot meet our target of spending 0.7% of GNI on ODA next year. The Statement was very up front, setting out the Government’s intent. As my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary made clear in the Statement, it is our intention to return to that target as soon as the fiscal situation and the challenges permit. As I am sure the noble Lord and the noble Baroness acknowledge, those challenges are immense.

They both mentioned the manifesto commitment. Like many in your Lordships’ House and in the other place, and like many people across the country, we are proud that the Conservative Government enshrined the 0.7% target in law. Equally, the commitment in the manifesto at the time of the election did not for a moment predict—I do not think that anyone could have done so—the challenge not just to the UK but to the world of a health pandemic, coupled with the challenges to the economy that we face.

I shall pick up, first, on some of the specific points made by the noble Lord, Lord Collins. Rightly, he talked about the impact on aid. I do not deny that if you have a reduced pot of money, you will spend less on many of the important causes that we are currently engaged in around the world. I have seen for myself the importance and strength of those contributions. Our development spend brings about stability in countries, ensures that peace agreements are sustained and, importantly, empowers communities around the world.

The noble Baroness, Lady Sheehan, mentioned the importance of transparency. I do not agree with her on that. As someone who started his life in the Foreign Office as a Minister of State, was then a double-hatted Minister across both departments and is now a Minister at the FCDO, I have seen in my portfolio, and have direct experience of, the benefits of bringing together the important tools of diplomacy and development. In ensuring that decisions are expedited, we can make more efficient decisions, and the focus of those decisions can more readily be seen in the different parts of the world with most need.

In particular, I emphasise to the noble Baroness and the noble Lord that we remain absolutely committed to helping the world’s poorest. The measures that the Government have announced will ensure that every penny that we spend goes as far as possible towards sustaining our position as a world-leading development power, notwithstanding the cut that has been announced. The noble Baroness acknowledged where we stand.

I have always felt that the importance of any spend lies in its effective delivery on the ground. We stand with pride in comparison with many of our G20 and G7 partners, and it is important to recognise that we have seen some real benefits from our spend over many years. In particular, we will continue to spend over £10 billion on many of the key priorities which I know are close to the hearts of the noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness, Lady Sheehan.

The strategic framework on ODA spend that my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary is setting up—the double lock, which he announced with my right honourable friend the Chancellor—will ensure that the money spent is targeted on achieving many of the key goals highlighted by the noble Lord and the noble Baroness, including being at the forefront of meeting the challenge of the Covid pandemic. In that regard, I am proud that when my right honourable friend the Prime Minister returned to work following his own challenge from Covid, one of the first events in which he participated and led on was the Gavi summit. That raised over $8 billion—far in excess of the estimate.

Equally, the Gavi summit ensured that the vaccines and the support that they will give to many vulnerable communities, including those that I often see on my own patch—I give the specific example of polio eradication in places such as Afghanistan and Pakistan—are sustained at a time of great challenge for people across the world. Specifically on the Covid-19 pandemic, we have also been at the forefront of the COVAX Facility. I believe we all welcomed the news this morning about the further progress that has been made on developing vaccines.

I also assure the noble Baroness and the noble Lord that, as these vaccines come on line, including the important Oxford-AstraZeneca one, we are committed to ensuring a scaling up of vaccine production. Indeed, the FCDO has been instrumental in facilitating the agreement reached between AstraZeneca and the Serum Institute of India for that very purpose—to scale up production of a vaccine that, through the COVAX Facility, as well as through direct distribution, will allow vulnerable communities to be reached as quickly as possible.

In addition, the noble Lord, rightly raised our chairmanship of the G7 and the important leadership that we are showing as president-elect of COP 26 in Glasgow next year. I have a personal interest in this, in that I was the one who stood up at the UN and declared the £11.6 billion of climate financing. We will stand by that over the five-year period. It is important that we show leadership on these issues.

We remain very committed to the SDGs as the basis of our aid. There are many challenges, but arguably the biggest two international challenges in the area of development are the Covid-19 pandemic and facing the climate emergency. The United Kingdom continues not just to lead the narrative but to provide support through direct financing for both initiatives, to ensure that the most vulnerable communities and developing states benefit from our continuing support.

The noble Baroness mentioned the 0.7% target. As I have mentioned to her previously, and as I believe I said in responding to a Question last week, our spend this year will meet the target of 0.7% of GNI. She also raised the issue of scrutiny of ODA spend. The fact that I appear before your Lordships’ House today, as do colleagues in the other place, and the fact that we continue to have discussions and debates about this, shows that scrutiny takes place. I fully acknowledge and respect that. During my discussions last week, I talked directly to the commissioner of ICAI, not only to reassure her about our commitment to our development programmes but to gain a sense from her of what this means for the independent assessments that ICAI is able to make. As noble Lords will be aware, the Government have committed to ensuring that ICAI retains its role in making sure that our development spend is appropriately scrutinised.

Finally, I come to the important point that the noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness, Lady Sheehan, raised about the importance of legislation. Again, I fully understand why that was mentioned, and it was raised also by noble Lords in other discussions. At this juncture, I acknowledge not only what the noble Lord and the noble Baroness said but the important work done by my noble friend—not just my noble friend but my very good friend—and colleague Lady Sugg in the development sphere. She will be missed at the FCDO. It is often said in the context of your Lordships’ House that it is much more welcome to have two hands on the pump rather than just one. I will personally miss her insights, experience and friendship, but I respect the decision that she took. Equally, I acknowledge the work of the noble Lord, Lord Purvis, in enshrining in law the 0.7% target.

It is right that noble Lords ask questions about the Government’s recognition of their statutory obligations. As I said only last week, we are cognisant of our duties to Parliament. Under the 2015 Act, the Secretary of State is under an ongoing legal duty to ensure that that 0.7% target is met. However, as has been acknowledged by noble Lords, the framework of the Act envisages that 0.7% may not be met in certain circumstances, including by reference to economic and fiscal circumstances.

On that basis, it is permissible to depart from the duty where the fiscal and economic circumstances justify doing so, reporting to Parliament under the Act. The noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness, Lady Sheehan, asked me specifically about this issue. I assure noble Lords that we are considering legislation in the context of the projected long-term fiscal circumstances and the need to plan over successive years. That kind of long-term planning is not easy to square with Parliament’s intention as set out in the framework of the Act, and therefore I believe it is right in the context of that planning to ensure that we engage further with Parliament by bringing forward legislation.

The noble Lord and noble Baroness asked me specifically about timing. All I can say is that we intend to bring forward legislation in due course because, at the current time, it is difficult to predict the end date and this 0.5% figure moving back to 0.7% in light of the fiscal circumstances. It is right that we look carefully at that. As I said, we are considering the issue and will bring forward legislation in due course. As the noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness, Lady Sheehan, know—and I look forward to hearing from other noble Lords on this issue—I understand the strength not just of the sentiment but of the principle behind 0.7% and its value in establishing the UK as both a respected partner and a development power in the world.

Regarding the merger and the bringing together of the Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office, the noble Baroness talked about defence spend. Earlier today we had a Question on the importance of women, peace and security. That is why the integrated review, on which further announcements will be made earlier in the new year, brings together all the key strands of our diplomacy and defence to ensure that the UK has been, is and will continue to strengthen its position as global Britain on the world stage.

[The Deputy Speaker (Lord Lexden) (Con)]

My Lords, we now come to the 20 minutes allocated for Back-Bench questions. I ask that questions and answers be brief so that I can call the maximum number of speakers.

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[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, my noble friend raises two points. Respecting his insights and his own experience as a Minister, I say to him that I have seen myself the direct benefit that our development spend has brought in the field and the opportunities that it has brought to communities in different parts of the world. I am proud of the fact that our development spending has lent itself to strengthening the opportunities for different communities, but that also has a knock-on positive impact on what we as the UK are trying to achieve in the international arena. Our development spend and our commitment to it, our commitment to the SDGs and our commitments to alleviating poverty, providing support for famine relief and ensuring that girls are educated wherever they might be in the world are things that we can proudly stand up and say the UK has supported and will continue to support.

I agree with my noble friend in as much as I accept that the British people are among the most generous in the world—we see that in the pandemic that we are currently facing—but equally we as the Government are trustees of public spending to ensure that, as we look at our priorities domestically, we also look to invest wisely internationally, including in supporting the most vulnerable communities and people around the world.

[Baroness Hayman (CB) [V]]

My Lords, I declare my interests as set out in the register, and I echo the comments made about the much-respected noble Baroness, Lady Sugg.

The scale of these cuts will be brutal for those affected but also, I believe, damaging in the long term to this country and its interests. The Statement gives priorities in general and I welcome the commitments on climate change, girls’ education and health, but it is very short on detail. So I have a specific question: will the Government be honouring their other commitment made in their manifesto—namely, to lead the fight against malaria? Will they do so by maintaining investment in malaria at its present level?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I commend the work of the noble Baroness’s campaign to eradicate malaria. We have worked together on this, particularly in relation to the last CHOGM. She asks for quite specific details on the programmes and prioritisation. My right honourable friend has laid out the framework for how we will look at those priorities. I cannot give her a specific commitment on a particular programme on a particular issue, but I can say, where we have given commitments in the past, we will ensure that we look at how we can sustain our support, whether technical or financial. In due course, as decisions are made on how we prioritise our aid spend specifically, I am sure that we will return to these questions. I regret that I cannot give her a specific commitment on the issue of malaria at this time.

[The Lord Bishop of St Albans [V]]

My Lords, I ask the Minister to answer the question from the noble Lord, Lord Collins: will Her Majesty’s Government include a sunset clause in any legislation amending the International Development Act? Secondly, do the Government intend to produce and publish any impact assessment of the reduction in spending on official development assistance?

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[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I cannot go into the details of the legislative proposals that will be coming forward; as I said, I am not party to them yet, but they are being looked at. He asked some specific questions about sunset clauses, as did the noble Lord, Lord Collins, which I have noted, but beyond what I have said about the status of the legislation there is little more that I can add at this juncture.

[Baroness Jay of Paddington (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I too am concerned about the lack of clarity about where the axe will fall on the UK’s very effective aid programme. Is the Minister able to give specific examples of where the severe cuts may occur? For instance, will women’s education funding be at the same sort of level or a much lower one? In health, will maintaining help with Covid mean reducing HIV/AIDS projects when their importance was very much emphasised yesterday on World AIDS Day? The Government really owe those receiving assistance and those delivering it much more proper transparency.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I assure the noble Baroness that as we look at our priorities for spend in 2020 those will become much clearer. My right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary is looking quite specifically at the issue of ODA spend for next year. The noble Baroness is right to raise the important gains that we have seen on key priorities that the UK has supported. I assure her that we will look at each programme to ensure that we can sustain not only the leadership that we have shown but the gains that we have made. Again, I have to say to her that I cannot give her details about specific programmes and projects at this time.

[Lord Purvis of Tweed (LD)]

My Lords, when asked about the domestic economic situation, the Minister for Africa, James Duddridge, told the House of Commons:

“We are bound by law to spend 0.7%, so it is not a choice; it is in the law, and we will obey the law.”—[Official Report, Commons, 30/6/20; col.147.]


We now know that the Government believe it is a choice and they will break the law. As the Minister said, they will in fact bring forward legislation to repeal that law, which does not sit with what the Government said about it being a temporary measure. So will the Minister give me this commitment: will the Government publish the fiscal criteria that will have to be met in order for the 0.7% commitment to be re-met before any legislative proposals to repeal the 2015 Act? If they do not, how can we believe the Government in the same way that we believed James Duddridge in June?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Lord, again, asked quite specific questions and understandably, I cannot share with him information on the nature and detail of the legislation at this point. I assure him that, as I have said before, the Government fully recognise their obligations to Parliament. As I said earlier in my response to the noble Lord, Lord Collins, and the noble Baroness, Lady Sheehan, this is important and we are looking at legislation to ensure that we fulfil those obligations to Parliament.

[Baroness Buscombe (Con)]

My Lords, I entirely support the 0.2% reduction in our development spend in the light of the economic emergency that we all face. It is also right to strengthen our defence and security capabilities, working hand-in-hand with our soft power. In line with this strong, integrated approach, does the Minister agree that if those in the party opposite are serious about protecting the world’s poor, it is incumbent upon them—unlike their colleagues in another place—to support the overseas operations Bill when it comes to your Lordships’ House? That Bill will support our Armed Forces, some of whom are risking their lives in some of the most dangerous places in the world, such as Mali, South Sudan and Afghanistan—places where, every day, they seek to work hard with our soft power to save and change millions of lives.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, my noble friend raises an important point with which I totally agree—and I am sure that many other noble Lords would also agree—regarding the important role that our Armed Forces play in bringing about and sustaining peace and in ensuring humanitarian corridors. The increase in spending that we have seen in other areas—including in the MoD budget—testifies to the important role of the military when it comes to peacekeeping operations and sustaining humanitarian corridors. We can all be proud of the role that our military plays in delivering support to the most vulnerable communities around the world.

[Lord Kerr of Kinlochard (CB) [V]]

My Lords, a detected lie is the clock striking 13: it is wrong and it casts doubt on all past and future chimes. In June, the Prime Minister formally renewed the 0.7% commitment on the record in the other place. I was reassured, but it turns out that I was deceived. The aid community around the world was reassured, but it turns out that they were deceived. I suspect that the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg, was deceived: she was an excellent Minister and will be much missed. The cut to our aid projects now is 30%; the cut to our credibility is much greater. I ask the Minister: why do we lie?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, as I said earlier, we are proud of our commitment to 0.7%; it was a Conservative-led Government who brought that into legislation. I can assure him that we made this decision after very careful consideration. We needed a temporary reduction in order to meet the unprecedented challenges that we face in terms of both health and the economy. I reassure him, however, that our intention is to return to 0.7%.

[Lord Grocott (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, does the Minister agree with me that there are few parts of the world where our continued development assistance is needed more desperately than in Afghanistan? Does he further agree that any reduction in our support for that country—given the decades of conflict, the huge numbers of displaced people and our deep involvement there, both militarily and economically—could have devastating effects? Can he assure us that, whatever changes are envisioned in our aid budget, the funding for Afghanistan will remain a top priority?

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[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, just recently, I participated in the pledging conference where we announced a further £155 million in development support for Afghanistan for the next year, contingent, of course, on the situation with the peace talks. Equally, we have committed a further £70 million to the important strides that we are making in ensuring the security situation in Afghanistan. As the Minister for Afghanistan, I recently discussed this with President Ghani directly. We remain committed to ensuring that the gains that have been sustained in Afghanistan continue through our security support as well as our development support.

[Lord Bruce of Bennachie (LD) [V]]

My Lords, I draw attention to my entry in the register of interests. Does the Minister agree that severe cuts on top of the departmental merger and the fundamental restructure of delivery are likely to prove deeply disruptive for development programmes? Strengthening management and capacity within the department, referred to in the Foreign Secretary’s Statement, may well be essential, but does the Minister accept that the success of UK aid delivery has been built on a model of partnership with the UK’s world-leading NGOs and development specialists? These cuts will test their resilience. How soon will the department be able to provide clarity on bidding and programme-planning to enable the Government’s development partners to manage their own capacity to ensure that crucial aid and development work can be sustained and that resources on which the Government depend for delivery will still be there when called upon?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I agree with the noble Lord that we have great development expertise. Where I differ from him is that, in bringing the departments together and creating the FCDO, I believe that we have further leveraged the expertise of our development officials in contributing to our diplomatic priorities as well. Let me further assure him that I have spoken directly to a range of international partners, both within the UN context and key NGOs. We will continue to liaise with them on specific allocations; those decisions are in progress, and we will update NGOs and other key partners on them as they are taken.

[Lord Sarfraz (Con)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that, while we build back better at home, we now have an opportunity to give back better overseas by addressing significant cost inefficiencies in our aid programmes? Will he confirm that humanitarian commitments, such as ensuring distribution of a Covid vaccine to Rohingya refugees, will remain a priority?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I formally welcome my noble friend: this is the first time I have answered a question that he has posed. I agree with him on both fronts. The creation of the FCDO allows for things to be done more efficiently. As the Minister for Bangladesh, I am directly engaged on the Rohingya issue, which I know is close to my noble friend’s heart. We gave a further commitment to Bangladesh of £47 million—£37 million for Rohingya support and £10 million for support for Bangladesh itself—at the recent pledging conference that we hosted.

[Lord Wigley (PC) [V]]

My Lords, we are still among the world’s richest countries. If the problem is finding the money, let us adjust the top level of income tax to share the fiscal burden fairly. The Government were elected on a manifesto pledge to maintain overseas support. If this manifesto pledge can be jettisoned, can this House, too, pick and choose which manifesto commitments we should respect?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on the proposals on tax, I am sure that the Chancellor will listen very carefully to the noble Lord. On the issue of the manifesto pledge, I have already answered that question.

[Lord Hannay of Chiswick [CB] (V)]

My Lords, will the Minister be so kind as to respond to the very forceful letter that was sent to the Foreign Secretary by your Lordships’ International Relations and Defence Committee last Wednesday, arguing that the decision taken was wrong economically and wrong politically? Does he not think that it is shameful that in none of the statements made by the Government, including his own answers to questions, has it been admitted that we have already cut £2.9 billion from our aid by applying the 0.7% calculator, and that all that is proposed now comes on top of, and in addition to, that?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I agree with the noble Lord on his final point. The reduction in GNI has meant a circa £2.9 billion reduction in the current aid spend, but we will fulfil our commitment to the GNI for this year. I also accept the principle that the proposal of 0.7% going down to 0.5% for 2021 presents an additional reduction. I know that the letter from my noble friend Lady Anelay to the Foreign Secretary is in the course of being responded to.

[Lord Sikka (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, I draw attention to my entry in the register of interests. There is another aspect of the ODA which the Government continue to neglect: the amount of taxes which are avoided in emerging economies and low-income countries. Last year, they lost $144 billion due to tax avoidance by corporations and the rich. The tax avoidance industries in the UK and the Crown dependencies and overseas territories are particularly responsible for that. What steps will the Minister take to ensure that the emerging economies get the taxes which are due to them? That would give them plenty of resources for development.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, it needs political leadership within country, but we should be lending technical support to ensure that a greater level of tax is collected within developing parts of the world. I note what the noble Lord has said.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, what the noble Lord calls the “fiscal situation” that we are currently in was already apparent when reassurances were given, until a very few days ago, on our commitment to development by a department—DfID—renowned for its efficiency and transparency, including working on governance and tax collection. We could be in this so-called fiscal situation for the next decade or generation, because of Covid and Brexit. Can the Minister honestly say that he anticipates that we will ever return to 0.7% of GNI for development?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

Having hope and optimism is part and parcel of what defines the Government’s thinking. While we have been challenged this year, and our decision on this issue reflects that, as I have already said, it is our intention to return to 0.7%. We have recently seen news on the Covid vaccine, and the steps that are being taken. I again underline the United Kingdom’s leadership on the important issues of facing up to the Covid challenge and ensuring that, through the COVAX facility and other support, we access vaccines and provide them to the most vulnerable. This underlines this Government’s commitment to ensuring that the most vulnerable and those who need assistance continue to get the support that they need, notwithstanding the challenges and this decision.

Conflict Minerals (Compliance) (Northern Ireland) (EU Exit) Regulations 2020

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Wednesday 2nd December 2020 Grand Committee

Moved by

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

That the Grand Committee do consider the Conflict Minerals (Compliance) (Northern Ireland) (EU Exit) Regulations 2020.

Relevant document: 31st Report from the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments (special attention drawn to the instrument)

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, these regulations, laid on 15 October, are necessary for the application

“to and in the UK in respect of Northern Ireland”

of the EU Conflict Minerals Regulation, which is listed in Annexe 2 of the Northern Ireland protocol. The regulation establishes the due diligence obligations of the largest importers of tin, tantalum, tungsten, and gold, or “3TG”. Supply chain due diligence here is absolutely crucial. A large proportion of these so-called conflict minerals originate from conflict-affected and high-risk areas. The EU regulation makes voluntary guidance set by the OECD mandatory. It aims to break the link between armed conflict and the exploitation of 3TG and to put an end to abuses of local communities, including mine workers, which are often linked to violations of human rights.

Parts of the EU Conflict Minerals Regulation have applied in the UK since 2017. However, its key operative provisions do not apply until 1 January, after the end of the transition period. These include the relevant obligations on business and member state competent authorities to ensure its effective implementation throughout the EU. Those key provisions will not take effect in Great Britain and will not form part of retained EU law. The regulations we laid before Parliament make that provision for Northern Ireland, as required under the protocol, and establish an enforcement framework for non-compliance.

This means that from the 1 January 2021, the largest importers into Northern Ireland of tin, tungsten, tantalum and gold will need to demonstrate due diligence to ensure that their imports have been mined and processed responsibly. They will have to demonstrate that they are managing any risks that their supply chains are linked to human rights violations or to the fuelling of conflict.

To enforce this in Northern Ireland, we are proposing powers for the Secretary of State to require businesses to report on their due diligence systems. The regulations also make provision for inspectors to enter business premises to inspect documents, data and records. These powers are necessary to ensure that the largest importers of “conflict minerals” into Northern Ireland do so in a way that is fair to everyone in the supply chain.

The regime follows a civil sanctions route and provides for a power to issue civil compliance notices and financial penalties where businesses do not comply. The decision to impose a financial penalty may be appealed to the First-tier Tribunal. The regime does not impose penalties for substantive breaches of due diligence obligations, as this is considered outside the scope of the EU Conflict Minerals Regulation. As required by the regulations, we will publish guidance at the earliest opportunity on how the civil sanctions will be used.

We accept the comments by the Joint Committee on Statutory Instruments that Regulation 8, which enables the Secretary of State to serve a notice requiring “a person” to produce information, is only enforceable against “Union importers”—importers into Northern Ireland—and that the regulations do not make provision for enforcing a requirement under Regulation 8 that is imposed on a person who is not a “Union importer”. We also accept as a point of principle that the imposition of obligations in statutory instruments should be accompanied by enforcement measures with equivalent scope.

It is necessary for these regulations to be made before the end of the transition period to meet the UK’s obligations under the Northern Ireland protocol. We are proceeding with the regulations as currently drafted but will bring forward as soon as possible amending legislation to amend Regulation 8, as I said.

This amendment will make explicit that the power to require the production of information can be exercised only in relation to a “Union importer”—an importer into Northern Ireland. In the meantime, the Secretary of State undertakes not to exercise the power to require production of information under Regulation 8 against persons other than “Union importers”. When the amending regulations are laid, they will also implement some minor administrative and clarifying corrections.

Our intention through these regulations is to allow businesses to operate responsibly in conflict-affected and high-risk areas. 3TG minerals are key components for much of our technology and our view is that, under the right conditions, their mining can build prosperity and security for local communities. Conducting due diligence, in accordance with OECD guidance, is key to managing the risks and to ensuring that businesses along the supply chains behave responsibly.

Our proposed regime for Northern Ireland is in line with the spirit of OECD guidance, incentivising businesses to continually improve their due diligence processes. The approach taken in the regulations, including the financial penalties for failure to co-operate with procedural requirements, corresponds with the European Commission’s stance on the scope of the EU regulation. We consider that this approach to the implementation of the EU conflict minerals regulations in Northern Ireland will meet our obligations under the protocol. I beg to move.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, first, I am grateful to all three noble Lords for their participation; I hope that the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, can hear me clearly. As all noble Lords have acknowledged and as I mentioned in my opening remarks, the EU Conflict Minerals Regulation comes into full force on 1 January 2021 and imposes a legal obligation on EU importers over the 3TG. We will also, in accordance with OECD guidance, issue further guidance in this respect in the early part of 2021 to ensure adherence.

Various questions were raised and I will seek to answer them as specifically as I can. First, on the report and the regulations mentioned, in particular the additional amendments we will seek to make in line with the committee’s report on Regulation 8, I do not have a specific date but I will of course endeavour to ensure that noble Lords are updated at the earliest opportunity to ensure that we are fully compliant in this respect. However, to answer the specific questions from the noble Lord, Lord Collins, these regulations will ensure we comply fully with our obligations under the Northern Ireland protocol.

The noble Lord, Lord Bradshaw, raised the competent authority that will operate for the Northern Ireland inspectors, who will be appointed on behalf of my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary to exercise his powers with respect to entry and inspection. For the purposes of the regulations, the Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Secretary will take the role of the competent authority. This is also part and parcel of our fulfilling our obligations in this respect.

The noble Lords, Lord Collins and Lord Bradshaw, and the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, also rightly raised the issue of other parts of the UK, since we are taking these regulations forward only in Northern Ireland, in line with the Northern Ireland protocol. They asked specific questions on this. Outside of the EU, the UK is not obliged to enforce the substantive provisions of the EU conflict minerals regulation. However, the UK will continue to be an active member of the OECD and to promote the OECD’s due diligence guidance. In this respect, the UK Government fully expect all UK businesses to adhere to the OECD guidance. Since the EU minerals regulation is listed in Annexe 2 of the Northern Ireland protocol to the withdrawal agreement, the UK Government, in introducing the SI, are taking the necessary steps to ensure that the regulation is implemented and enforced in Northern Ireland. We will in due course consider what, if any, further regulatory framework might be appropriate for Great Britain.

In this regard, the noble Lord, Lord Collins, also asked about our work elsewhere in the world. We have of course been very effective in bringing regimes across the world to the fore regarding this issue. In particular, the UK is committed to addressing risks around conflict minerals through promoting and encouraging compliance with the OECD’s due diligence guidance, which has been issued for responsible mineral supply chains for conflict-affected and high-risk areas. We will of course continue to be a member of the OECD outside of the EU and we expect all businesses to take appropriate steps.

The UK is also a founding member of the European Partnership for Responsible Minerals. This initiative aims to increase the proportion of responsibly sourced minerals by working across the whole of the supply chain. In this regard, the UK Government funded projects, including in the African Great Lakes region, and supported the development of a due diligence hub to provide information for businesses to progress their supply chain due diligence.

The noble Baroness, Lady Northover, specifically flagged the importance of the Kimberley process. I have worked directly on this so I can reassure her. The Kimberley process, as noble Lords know, groups 55 like-minded participants, covering 82 states, with framework regulations designed to prevent the flow of conflict diamonds, which is also pertinent to our debate. We have been part of the Kimberley process since 2002. The UK remain committed to the policies and principles of the Kimberley process. We will become an independent participant at the end of the transition period.

I trust that I have answered most if not all of the questions raised. As I said, I will come back to noble Lords on the specific timetabling of the related amendments under Regulation 8. We seek to do that as soon as practicable and possible. I am sure that we will update noble Lords through the usual channels. With that, I once again thank all noble Lords for their participation. This is another important step forward in the passing of these regulations to ensure our compliance with the obligations under the withdrawal agreement as we prepare for the end of the transition period.

Motion agreed.

Official Development Assistance

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Thursday 26th November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Bruce of Bennachie (LD) [V]]

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper, and draw attention to my entry in the register of interests.

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, the Covid-19 pandemic has had a severe impact on our economy, which has fallen by 11% this year. This has forced Her Majesty’s Government to take a tough decision to spend 0.5% of our national income next year on official development assistance to help the poorest countries, rather than the usual 0.7%. My right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary will shortly set out in the other place the future plan on how the aid budget will be managed to deliver better results for every penny spent, and to ensure that it is focused on strategic global priorities, which are vital as we recover from the pandemic and prepare for our presidencies of both the G7 and COP 26 next year.

[Lord Bruce of Bennachie (LD) [V]]

My Lords, I pay tribute to the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg, for her honourable decision to resign from the Government yesterday in protest at the decision to cut aid, which she clearly stated she could not defend. She achieved a great deal in her role, and she was a pleasure to work with. I wrote yesterday that the decision was “unconscionable and mean-spirited”. It is all the more shameful because the Government fought two elections in quick succession committed to 0.7%, and this guarantee was repeated by the Foreign Secretary, and by the Prime Minister in a letter to me, when DfID was absorbed into the Foreign Office a few short months ago. The 0.7% is enshrined in law. Do the Government intend to disregard the law again, or will they seek to amend it? Will legislation come before this House? Is the Minister aware that the law allows for a legitimate retrospective shortfall, but not for a planned cut in the 0.7%?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I join the noble Lord in his tribute to my noble friend Lady Sugg. She was not only a noble friend but a friend within the FCDO, and will be sorely missed both by the department and, I am sure, by your Lordships’ House in this role. As I have said, my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary will lay out some details on the issue of legislation. The noble Lord has raised two important points, and I can assure him that we are very cognisant of our obligations both in terms of the Act and to the House. As for the cut that has been announced, as my right honourable friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer laid out only yesterday, it was a difficult decision, but it was necessary on the basis of the challenges we face. None the less, in real terms we will still spend £10 billion to fight poverty and climate change, among other key priorities in overseas development.

[Baroness Blackstone (Ind Lab)]

My Lords, the Minister has paid tribute to the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg. I too want to pay tribute to her for her honourable decision to resign when the Government broke their manifesto commitment on development assistance. She said that was fundamentally wrong. Does the Minister agree with this, and with her letter to the Prime Minister, which said:

“Cutting UK aid risks undermining your efforts to promote a global Britain and will diminish our power to influence other nations to do what is right”?


In answering that question, perhaps he would also indicate when the Government intend to restore development assistance to 0.7% of GNI.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on the noble Baroness’s first point, I have already mentioned my long support of and friendship with the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg. Of course, she discussed her decision with both the Prime Minister and my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary. I pay tribute to her efforts and her work in both DfID and the FCDO. As the Chancellor said only yesterday, the cut is temporary and we will return to the 0.7% when the fiscal situation so allows.

[Baroness Sheehan (LD)]

I too pay tribute to the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg, who was an outstanding Minister, and who acted with integrity yesterday. The £2.9 billion cut in the aid budget already announced for this year represents a cut of more than 19%—far more than the projected 11.3% drop in GNI. Will the Minister support the Government if they choose to break the law and knowingly undershoot the 0.7% target?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, in the current year we will meet the 0.7% target. On our obligation to your Lordships’ House to uphold the laws on the statute book, I have already alluded to the fact that my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary will lay out further detail shortly in the other place.

[Baroness Meyer (Con)]

My Lords, the gang of five Prime Ministers, in objecting to a temporary reduction in our aid budget, surely protest too much. Is it not the case that, despite our enduring the worst economic crisis in 300 years, the UK provision of international aid, at 0.5% of GNI, will still be one of the highest in the world, and the second highest in the G7 group of industrialised countries?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, my noble friend is right: we will remain one of the most generous G7 donors, spending more of our national income, in percentage terms, than the United States, Japan, Canada or Italy. I further assure my noble friend that we stand very firmly in ensuring that, when we look at poverty alleviation, fighting famine, our commitment through the various vaccine summits we have held and the importance of our COP 26 presidency —with the commitment we have made on climate finance —we stand ready to continue to meet our obligations both domestically and internationally.

[Lord Crisp (CB) [V]]

My Lords, this cut is short-sighted and mean-spirited; it will damage our national interests and scar the lives of millions. Disturbingly, there is no end point. We are all aware of the financial situation, but what other options were considered? The UK will spend billions on vaccines from its aid budget and elsewhere for people in low and middle incomes as well as its own citizens. Could it not have made a virtue of this by using the aid budget to commit to vaccinations for all, not just making a cut but demonstrating UK leadership on the protection of the world’s health and providing a welcome boost for UK science and technology? Was this considered, and why was it not done? If the Minister does not know the answer, I would be grateful for a letter.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I do not agree with the noble Lord. On the specific issue of the vaccine, he will recall that, when my right honourable friend the Prime Minister returned from his own challenge with Covid-19, the first summit he chaired was the Gavi summit, which committed £330 million per year to other vaccines. As the Minister responsible for south Asia, I know that issues of polio still impact vulnerable communities in places such as Afghanistan and Pakistan. Equally, we have led from the front on the importance of the Covid-19 vaccine, with a commitment of £571 million to the COVAX Facility. The Covid-19 challenge, along with climate finance, are arguably the two biggest challenges facing the world today and through 2021, and we have shown leadership on both and will continue to do so.

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

My Lords, I, too, praise the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg, and hope that we can work on a cross-party basis to oppose this move by the Government. The Minister said that there would be £10 billion of ODA in 2021-22, but this represents a cut of £5.1 billion compared to 2019. Yesterday, the noble Lord, Lord Parkinson, said that the Foreign Secretary’s savings for this financial year to maintain the budget within 0.7%—and we should not forget that that has meant real cuts—

“prioritised the UK’s global response to the Covid-19 pandemic, including on poverty reduction for the bottom billion, climate change and reversing biodiversity loss, championing girls’ education and protecting our operational capacity.”—[Official Report, 25/11/20; col. 249.]

Will the Minister tell us which of these priorities will now be cut to meet the Chancellor’s breach of the law and the Conservative manifesto?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the short answer to the noble Lord is that they remain, and will continue to be, priorities, and I note the additional support that we have announced within the defence budget, for example. As Minister for the UN, I am sure that all noble Lords acknowledge the vital role our Armed Forces play in the delivery of aid, bringing peace and resolving conflict. We will ensure that the priorities my noble friend listed only yesterday will continue to be sustained and strengthened through 2021.

[Lord Roberts of Llandudno (LD) [V]]

Have the Government been in touch with the new incoming regime in the USA? It seems that President-elect Biden will be far more ready to co-operate with us on these massive problems in relation to overseas aid.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, my right honourable friends the Prime Minister and the Foreign Secretary have both been in touch with incoming Biden Administration on these important priorities.

[Baroness Tonge (Non-Afl) [V]]

My Lords, I, too, add my dismay about the resignation of the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg. Does the Minister agree with the World Bank that the provision of sexual and reproductive health and family planning services alongside girls’ education is the most effective intervention we can make in developing countries? Will he, therefore, ensure that, despite the reduction in overseas aid, the money currently donated for those services will remain unchanged and will not be reduced proportionately?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on that very issue, as the noble Baroness will know, I articulated very strongly for us to sustain our support for this important priority. As the noble Baroness may be aware, between April 2015 and March 2020, we reached an average of 25.3 million women and girls accessing modern methods of family planning per year. This remains an important priority, and, as the lead on PSVI in particular, I say that this remains very much in my policy and planning.

[The Deputy Speaker (Baroness Garden of Frognal) (LD)]

My Lords, the time allowed for this Question has now elapsed. I apologise to the noble Baronesses, Lady Nicholson and Lady Armstrong, and the noble Lord, Lord Bilimoria, who were unable to put their questions.

Hong Kong: Legislative Council

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Thursday 12th November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Northover]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what assessment they have made of reports that four pro-democracy legislators have been dismissed from the Hong Kong Legislative Council with immediate effect.

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, yesterday was another sad day for the people of Hong Kong. China’s Standing Committee of the National People’s Congress imposed new restrictions, meaning that any Hong Kong legislator deemed to be supporting independence, refusing to recognise China’s sovereignty, seeking to support foreign forces’ interference or endangering Hong Kong’s national security would be disqualified. This decision led to the immediate removal of four elected members of the Legislative Council. Beijing’s actions breach both China’s commitment that Hong Kong will enjoy a high degree of autonomy and the right to freedom of speech, which is guaranteed under the Sino-British joint declaration.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, this is immensely serious for Hong Kong. What have the Government said directly to the Chinese Government about this major breach, as the Minister described it, of the Sino-British joint declaration? Will they consider taking China to the International Court of Justice for breaching its obligations under the Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties, or has the United Kingdom undermined its ability to do that by threatening to break international law when it suits us?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

On the noble Baroness’s second question, we remain strong supporters of the ICJ but, as she will know, going to the ICJ requires the agreement of both parties. I very much doubt that China would do so. On the specific measures that we have taken since China’s action, only an hour or so ago, the Chinese ambassador was summoned to the FCDO to meet the Permanent Under-Secretary. I have not seen the read-out of that but we have taken immediate steps there.

[Lord McKenzie of Luton (Lab) [V]]

My Lords—[Inaudible.]

[Lord McKenzie of Luton (Lab) [V]]

I will; I am sorry. China’s dismissal of four members of the Legislative Council underlined the worst fears about the national security law and its impact on freedoms of expression and judicial independence in Hong Kong. The new law, which apparently applies to everyone everywhere in the world, is generating alarm among universities with students who will return to Hong Kong at some stage and could face the risk of arrest. It makes a nonsense of “one country, two systems”. What representations are being made to the Chinese ambassador about the disqualification of the four pro-democracy lawmakers? What progress is being made in identifying senior Chinese Government officials who have committed serious human rights abuses?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Lord is correct. We have summoned the Chinese ambassador to register our deep concern on this issue. The noble Lord talked about all members of the Legislative Council; four members were suspended and removed while they were in the Chamber. Others have left the council in solidarity.

On identification, the noble Lord was, I think, alluding to global human rights sanctions. As I have said before, we cannot speculate on future sanctions that we may apply through that regime. Nevertheless, since the national security laws initiated the continuing suppression of freedoms in Hong Kong, we have aired—and continue to air—our deep concerns.

[The Deputy Speaker (Lord McNicol of West Kilbride) (Lab)]

I gently remind noble Lords to keep their questions and answers concise.

[Lord Mackay of Clashfern (Con) [V]]

What course can Her Majesty’s Government follow that is likely to improve the situation for freedom in Hong Kong?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My noble and learned friend raises an important issue. On 6 October, 39 countries issued a joint statement at the UN General Assembly expressing deep concern at the situation in Hong Kong, building on the Human Rights Council statement in June. We believe that this joint approach with other international partners is the best approach in pressing China to live up to its obligations.

[Lord Alton of Liverpool (CB)]

My Lords, I declare my interests as a patron of Hong Kong Watch and vice-chair of the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Hong Kong. What steps are the Government taking to co-ordinate an international response to the purge of democrats and the dismantling of democratic freedoms in Hong Kong? Does this include an international contact group, mobilising the G7, developing an alliance of democracies to co-ordinate targeted sanctions and a lifeboat rescue package, and working for the creation of a mechanism at the United Nations for a special rapporteur?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

As I have already said, we are leading the international response on Hong Kong. An increasing number of countries are joining statements through UN human rights bodies, which underscores the success of this approach. We have no plans to establish an international contact group. The Foreign Secretary is leading the way on this issue as a priority.

[The Lord Bishop of St Albans [V]]

My Lords, the Government have provided a way for citizens holding a BNO passport to take steps to come here. A high proportion of people will miss out on this scheme, particularly those born after 1997. What other immigration measures have the Government considered in the interests of safety for the people of Hong Kong?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the right reverend Prelate is right to raise BNO status. It will open for applications at the end of January 2021. On the specifics of people born after a given date, certainly where they are connected to those who qualify for BNO status, our policy is not to separate families—they will also be included in the scheme.

[Lord Campbell of Pittenweem (LD)]

My Lords, given the clear breach of the joint declaration and international law, how can we enlist support from European Union countries when the Government persist with Part 5 of the Internal Market Bill? Is this not a clear illustration of the Government’s chickens coming home to roost?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I assure the noble Lord that there are no chickens in my response, per se. On this specific issue, the fact that Germany delivered the statement at the UN Third Committee underlines the strong support in the European Union for our position on Hong Kong.

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

My Lords, I welcome what the Minister said about his and the United Kingdom’s efforts at the United Nations and building support, but we obviously need to do more. The Minister failed to answer the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Alton, about how we may build a better consensus through the use of the scheduled G7 meeting. Can he give a more specific answer?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

Of course. We will continue to press this case, whether through the G7 or other multilateral fora. We are achieving success; I am sure that all noble Lords will acknowledge that the fact that we have seen an incremental increase in the number of countries supporting the UK’s position on Hong Kong illustrates the success of this policy.

[Lord McColl of Dulwich (Con) [V]]

My Lords, in view of this scandalous behaviour by the Chinese Government and their rejection of the criticism of western Governments, is it not time to encourage people not to support Chinese exports, as their economy is all-important to the Chinese?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, we have a strategic relationship with China. We continue to wish to strengthen that, but in a very clear-eyed way, and where there are abuses of human rights, whether in Hong Kong or indeed in mainland China, we will call them out.

[Lord Thomas of Gresford (LD) [V]]

The offence of the four lawmakers who were expelled without legal process from LegCo—two barristers, an accountant and a medical consultant—was that they had allegedly supported requests to the US to impose sanctions on China for its interference in Hong Kong. What about this country? The United Kingdom signed the bilateral joint declaration, which by Article 3 guarantees the rights and freedoms of Hong Kong citizens. Does the Minister agree that we have a moral and imperative duty to take action now, not just to wring our hands—to impose sanctions or to take China to the International Court of Justice, as my noble friend suggested earlier?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Lord raises Article 3, and that is exactly what we are pressing: that China must uphold its international obligations. I have already covered the point on the ICJ; we will continue to work on a multilateral basis and bilaterally in raising this issue with Chinese authorities and the Hong Kong special administrative region as well.

[Baroness Warwick of Undercliffe (Lab)]

My Lords, what assessment has the Minister made of the likely impact that Beijing’s purging of pro-democracy voices in the legislature will have on the rule of law in Hong Kong? Does he share my concern about the threat to the continued independence of the judiciary, and do the Government have anything specific in mind to seek to avoid that?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I totally concur with the noble Baroness. There has been an increasing decline, and this is the second major shift this year with the introduction of the national security law and the suspension of democratically elected legislators. She raises an important point about the independence of the judiciary. Again, the national security law raises real concerns, as under it the Chief Executive now has the right to appoint judges as well. We will continue to raise that issue and our concern with China directly.

[Lord Randall of Uxbridge (Con) [V]]

My Lords, this is an extremely serious development and I am sure that Her Majesty’s Government are working hard with international partners to ensure that democracy and human rights—and indeed freedom of speech—are maintained in Hong Kong. I have previously raised the fact that two crucial events are coming up where China has a leading role to play. As well as the COP next year there is the equally important meeting on the Convention on Biological Diversity, which China is hosting. Does my noble friend think that the prospects of these two global events are in any way endangered by these events in Hong Kong?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, China is an important partner and my noble friend is quite right to raise the two events coming up next year. We continue to work strategically and importantly on the priorities of the environment as a key issue in the lead-up to COP 26. However, events like this indeed hinder the relationship that we are seeking to build bilaterally with China.

[Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle (GP) [V]]

My Lords, I declare my position as co-chair of the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Hong Kong. The noble Lord, Lord McColl of Dulwich, referred to people buying Chinese products. That is a large part of our retail sector but of course our financial sector, the City of London, is tightly enmeshed with banks that have expressed support for the Chinese government position and are heavily involved in the Hong Kong economy. What are the Government’s plans to tackle that issue?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, as I have already said, trade with China is important, but we must do so in a manner which reflects the importance that the Government attach to human rights. The noble Baroness raises the issue of financial services. It is for companies to make key decisions, but we remain very much committed that where there is a usurping of human rights we will raise those issues, whether that is happening in Hong Kong or mainland China.

[Lord Hain (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, given the serious and continuing deterioration of human rights in Hong Kong and China, which government policy has been most effective: David Cameron’s toadying or Boris Johnson’s bombast?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

That is an interesting question for the noble Lord to put to a Minister who has served under both Prime Ministers. We live in the present, and that is where we need to focus. We have seen a systematic abuse in recent years in mainland China, whether we are talking about the Uighurs or indeed other human rights abuses, which we have often debated in your Lordships’ House. Currently, the steps that have been taken this year alone in Hong Kong illustrate a hardening of the stance and a real test of the Sino-British joint agreement. We will continue to press for that and press China to stand up for its international obligations. However, at the same time, we will continue to raise the bar against the usurping of human rights, be it in Hong Kong or indeed in China.

[The Deputy Speaker (Lord McNicol of West Kilbride) (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank all noble Lords for the brevity of their questions and answers. All supplementary answers have been asked.

Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Wednesday 4th November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

My Lords, I welcome this Statement and the Foreign Secretary’s representations about Nazanin’s case generally, including his rightly voiced opposition to her potential return to prison during a second trial. Yesterday, James Cleverly welcomed the fact that she had not been sent back to prison. However, can the Minister confirm whether the Government have made specific representations to Iran on this possibility? Can he also detail any further multilateral action at the UN to secure her release and that of other British dual nationals incarcerated in Iran?

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for his support. I know that this issue has cross-party support and we are working together on this aim. On his final point, yes, we are working with partners to apply maximum pressure for all dual nationals arbitrarily detained in Iran to be released. On this specific case, we have made specific representations, both through the interactions of my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary and at ambassadorial level.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, the cases of the dual nationals being held in Iran are clearly appalling. Following the question asked by the noble Lord, Lord Collins, I would like to probe the Minister on whether the Government carried out a risk assessment of the safety of Nazanin and others due to the postponement of the IMS debt. We have not had an answer to that either in the Commons or here. Exactly when did the Government ask to attend her trial and what answer did the Iranian authorities give?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, on the noble Baroness’s second point, as she will be aware, the Iranians do not recognise Nazanin’s dual national status. We made that representation; it was declined. On the IMS dispute, I assure the noble Baroness that discussions are ongoing to explore further options to resolve this 40 year-old case, but it would be inappropriate for me to comment further on the case at this time because of those ongoing discussions.

[Lord Alton of Liverpool (CB)]

My Lords, the shocking treatment of Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe throws into sharp relief the appalling human rights track record of Iran, does it not? Will the Minister therefore talk specifically about the recent executions of some of the 2019 protesters and the despicable intimidation of members of staff at the BBC Persian service and their families?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I join the noble Lord in recognising that the UK has a long-standing opposition to the death penalty, whatever the reason and in whichever country. We continue to make that case to Iran and other nations. Iran’s criminalisation of co-operation with the British Council and the attacks against BBC Persian employees are also deeply concerning. The Government continue to provide support to defend them repeatedly at the highest levels in Iran.

[Lord Polak (Con)]

In the Statement, the Minister in the other place said that

“we are committed to the nuclear deal with Iran—the joint comprehensive plan of action, or JCPOA—as the best means available to monitor and constrain Iran’s nuclear programme.”—[Official Report, Commons, 3/11/20; col. 185.]

The Foreign Secretary suggested on television this morning that there are flaws but until something else is out there, it is the only option. What work has the FCDO undertaken to create an alternative? It has also been suggested that the Iranian Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps has shamelessly harassed Mrs Zaghari-Ratcliffe. To save my noble friend the Minister from telling us that he cannot discuss future proscriptions, I ask this: given that the Minister in the other place was clear on the concerns about Iran’s destabilising activities throughout the region, can my noble friend tell the House what possible further destabilising activities the regime and the IRGC can get up to before we act in a tough and appropriate manner?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lord, on my noble friend’s second point, we are acting in conjunction with our E3 allies to ensure that the JCPOA remains alive and on the table. It prevents Iran becoming a nuclear state, which must be a priority.

My noble friend raises concerns about the IRGC. We share them, particularly regarding Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe’s case and the challenge that she has been presented with the IRGC. On the efforts that we are making, we continue to work with our US allies and E3 partners to ensure that the current ban that was lifted on arm sales to Iran can also reach a conclusion that satisfies our allies across Europe and in the US.

[Lord Browne of Ladyton (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, in April 2019, the Government granted diplomatic protection status to Mrs Zaghari-Ratcliffe—a very welcome signal that the UK treats the case no longer as a consular matter but as a formal legal dispute between Britain and Iran. Has that change of status been reflected in any change in the Government’s approach to this matter? What difference has it made, if any?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, exercising diplomatic protection to Mrs Zaghari-Ratcliffe’s case formally raised it to the level of a state issue. We continue to take further action where we judge that it will help to secure her full and permanent release. For the time being, we welcome the fact that she has been allowed to return home and has not been taken to prison.

[Baroness Goudie (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, following on from my noble colleagues’ questions, can the Minister assure us that Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe will be able to have medical check-ups through the embassy every week and that a permanent person will visit her every other day from the embassy? At the moment, I feel she is in a very fragile state, with no continuity of people to be with her besides her family.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, we as Her Majesty’s Government cannot guarantee this, but I assure the noble Baroness that we continue to implore the Iranian authorities that she should receive whatever medical attention she needs.

[Viscount Waverley (CB) [V]]

My Lords, what is holding back a resolution? The issue must be more complex than we understand it to be. Is practical horse-trading really going on behind the scenes? For example, have the Supreme Leader’s personal representatives, who are based in London and directly responsible to him, been sat with? If so, with what outcome? What price freedom? Is Iran holding out on its internal judicial process by saying no to the return of the £400 million-plus owed by the Government rather than having the UK turn this into an advantageous negotiation position that could also be put to the benefit of the desperate lot of Iran’s long-suffering people, having been instructed to do so by a UK court? Where is the best practice in the UK’s rule of law in all this?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I agree with the noble Viscount that our argument and challenge are not with the Iranian people; they have suffered for far too long. We are engaging on this issue at the highest level. From the Prime Minister downwards, we are engaged in getting Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe, and other dual nationals who are arbitrarily detained, released on a permanent basis.

[Baroness Stuart of Edgbaston (Non-Afl)]

My Lords, it seems clear that the Iranian regime is using the court process as a negotiating tactic. This does not affect dual nationals just from the United Kingdom but also from France, Germany, Australia and the United States. We can probably anticipate that some of these practices will be accelerating ahead of the presidential elections in Iran in June. Have we had discussions with our partners to protect dual nationals across the board and to take joint action?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I welcome the noble Baroness to the House and assure her that we work very closely in conjunction with our partners, including those who have detainees who are arbitrarily detained. On the future elections, it should be in our mind that Ayatollah Khamenei, as spiritual leader, also has ultimate adjudication powers on any decision taken by the Iranian Government.

[Lord Dubs (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, is there any truth in the allegation that some other countries—Australia, France, Germany, Canada and the USA—have had greater success in getting their people back? Is this only because their people were not dual nationals? Secondly, have the Iranians ever mentioned the money in the course of our negotiations with them about Nazanin’s release?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I have already commented on the ongoing discussions that we are having on the issue of the debt. On the noble Lord’s first point, I believe that he answered his own question. He is quite right that those detainees have been successfully released because they hold a particular nationality. Regrettably, Iran does not recognise dual nationals and that has been its persistent response to our lobbying on this case and others.

[The Deputy Speaker (Baroness Garden of Frognal) (LD)]

My Lords, all supplementary questions have now been asked.

Integrated Review of Security, Defence, Development and Foreign Policy

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Tuesday 3rd November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Howell of Guildford]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government when the Integrated Review of Security, Defence, Development and Foreign Policy will be (1) completed, and (2) published.

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, the integrated review continues but, in light of the decision to move to a one-year spending review, we are considering the implications for its completion. We will of course provide an update in due course.

[Lord Howell of Guildford (Con) [V]]

My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that reply. With the comprehensive spending review now delayed, can we be clear about which comes first: the much-needed review of defence spending or the fundamental review of our position in the world and how to defend it, which the integrated review is meant to address? Has my noble friend noted that the new call for evidence questions from the review, put out in August with an absurdly short window, make no mention at all of our trade and business prosperity in the new world conditions on which everything else will depend? Will he pass the word to the reviewers to correct that?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I always take my noble friend’s advice and listen to it carefully. I will of course follow up on that point. On his wider question, the integrated review takes into account not just defence but our development programmes, as well as diplomacy. The intention is very much to ensure that we will, as I said, in due course be able to announce a date on the further progress of the integrated review.

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

My Lords, the current crisis highlights that international co-operation is the greatest tool for confronting global threats and advancing our values and interests. Sadly, under this Government the UK has lost much of its influence at the United Nations, along with losing its historical place at the ICJ, and has failed in a series of high-profile votes at the Security Council and the General Assembly. Will the review fully consider the UK’s policy towards the UN and can the Minister explain how the Government will seek to strengthen and regain the UK’s influence at this important institution?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, it will not surprise the noble Lord that I disagree with him. We continue to have a very big influence at the United Nations, including at the UN Human Rights Council. He is all too aware of the recent incremental success we have had on the challenging subject of Xinjiang. On elections, the noble Lord refers back to that of 2017 on the ICJ; subsequently, there have been several UN positions, as well as an election to the important institution of the ITU, where the British candidate was successful. This was down to the influence we carry. I assure him that I agree with him on this point: it is important that we sustain and retain but also strengthen the role of the United Kingdom in global affairs, including through our work at the UN.

[Baroness Smith of Newnham (LD) [V]]

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Howell, referred to money and asked whether we would be looking at chicken or egg. Does the Minister agree that although it is vital that we spend at least 2% of GDP on our Armed Forces, in the context of a declining economy with Covid 2% may not be enough? What conversations are being had with the Treasury about this?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I am sure the noble Baroness appreciates that the whole idea behind a one-year spending review is to ensure that we prioritise the issue of the economy, as she rightly said, but also other challenges that we face in the Covid crisis. That said, when we look at the context of the thresholds set, particularly at NATO, I am proud that the United Kingdom continues to stand by our commitment to spend 2% of GDP on defence but also 0.7% on development.

[Lord Lancaster of Kimbolton (Con)]

My Lords, the UK has some of the most advanced military capabilities in the world—the F35 fighter, the Type 45 Destroyer and cyber, to name but three—but our real military advantage comes when we can network these capabilities. With the addition of space and cyber to the traditional domains of land, air and maritime, can my noble friend reassure me that multi-domain integration will be at the heart of this review?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I welcome my noble friend. I assure him, and agree with him, that the United Kingdom will always prioritise how we respond to the threats that we face. As I am sure he will acknowledge and agree, our armed and security forces work tirelessly to protect the UK and our interests at home and abroad. However, I agree with him that we need to be dynamic in our response to the ever-changing and evolving world, including some of the new threats and opportunities, be they in cyber or space.

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, a number of pending defence capital investment programmes will be crucial to both our future military capability and the UK’s prosperity agenda, but a one-year financial settlement risks crippling them. Can the Minister assure the House that such important strategic issues will be decided by informed debate and not pre-empted by short-term Treasury fiat?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I assure the noble and gallant Lord that we continue to stand by our Armed Forces. He will note that the Government are investing an additional £2.2 billion in defence over this year and next, which will put our total spending at £41.5 billion. I give him the added assurance that the Government will continue always to prioritise how we respond to the threats that the UK faces. Our Armed Forces and security services work tirelessly in this respect and are fully funded.

[Lord West of Spithead (Lab)]

My Lords, the Treasury’s decision that the comprehensive spending review will now be on a one-year settlement will be very damaging to defence. The military, particularly equipment procurement, is a relatively long-term business, as alluded to by the noble and gallant Lord, Lord Stirrup. The UK needs a clear statement of how Ministers see the UK’s position in the world, not least to inform defence structure and spending in the future. If the integrated review is delayed, will the Government at least publish a foreign policy review—ideally, early in 2021—which will be able to take account of which way the United States is heading as well as future relationships with the EU?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I shall follow up on the noble Lord’s suggestion and write to him. I assure him that the Foreign, Commonwealth & Development Office is now pursuing international priorities in an integrated manner, including working to ensure greater leverage in the Indo-Pacific area.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, next autumn we are hosting COP 26, which must be a success both for the United Kingdom and globally. Given the delay to the CSR, how will we ensure that climate change is comprehensively addressed, what proportion of funding will come from our ODA commitments, and how will that affect our development programmes?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I have already alluded to our commitment to 0.7%, which is enshrined in law. The noble Baroness is of course right to raise COP 26; I assure her that Ministers across government are working to ensure that we deliver on its priorities and ambitions.

[Lord Truscott (Ind Lab)]

My Lords, there has been much talk of global Britain post Brexit. Can the Minister define what that means? Secondly, can he tell your Lordships’ House what values and principles underpin the integrated review?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, in a few seconds, global Britain means our place in the world, whether through multilateral institutions such as the UN, through the Commonwealth or, indeed, through our bilateral relationships. The UK has strong influence and strong partnerships, and we will strengthen those partnerships and friendships going forward. On our overall positioning, I am very optimistic about the outlook for the UK in the global world. The results of the FCDO merger demonstrate why.

[Baroness Helic (Con) [V]]

My Lords, I regret that the publication of the integrated review has been postponed. We live in an era of extraordinary unpredictability that cannot be addressed by ad hoc reviews. Will the Government therefore consider introducing a legislatively mandated quadrennial defence, foreign policy and security review to ensure that we have an automatic and regular review of MoD and FCDO strategy and the threats facing our country, as is the case in the United States?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

Noble Lords have ample opportunity, as do Members in the other place, to question and challenge the Government, whether in defence, development or diplomacy, and that will continue.

[Lord Craig of Radley (CB) [V]]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that a nuclear deterrent lacks credibility unless it is underpinned by capable, modern, conventional capabilities? If so, does he agree that the current resilience and fighting strength of the three services is less than adequate and must be improved rapidly as part of this review?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I agree with the noble Lord’s first point. However, I have already alluded to our increased budget in defence spending, which underlines the importance and priority that Her Majesty’s Government attach to our defence capabilities.

[The Deputy Speaker (The Earl of Kinnoull) (Non-Afl)]

My Lords, the time allotted for this Question has now elapsed and we therefore move to the second Question.

Jammu and Kashmir: Human Rights

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Monday 2nd November 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hussain (LD)]

In begging leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper, I declare an interest as someone who was born in Kashmir and who has family and friends living on both sides of the line of control.

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, the Government recognise that there are human rights concerns in Indian-administered Kashmir. We encourage all states to ensure that domestic laws are in line with international standards. Any allegation must be investigated thoroughly, promptly and transparently. We also welcome reports that some restrictions are being relaxed and detainees released. We call on the Government of India to lift all other restrictions as soon as possible. We continue to raise our concerns with the Indian Government directly.

[Lord Hussain (LD)]

I thank the Minister for that Answer. Have the British Government taken note of the four letters written recently to the Indian Government by UN rapporteurs on torture, arbitrary detentions, extradition and custodial killings in Indian-administered Jammu and Kashmir? Furthermore, do we know what the Indian Government’s response was? If there was no response, what course of action do our Government, as a P5 member of the UN Security Council and a defender of human rights, suggest that the Security Council takes?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, we are aware of these letters and reports that the Government of India have not yet responded. As I said, we recognise human rights concerns and encourage all states to ensure that their domestic laws are in line with international standards. Any allegation of human rights violations or abuse is deeply concerning and must be investigated thoroughly. Where we have such concerns, as I said, we raise them directly with the Government of India.

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

My Lords, Amnesty International raised particular concerns over the crackdown on civil society and journalists in Kashmir and Jammu. Can the Minister detail what steps the Government have taken to protect press freedom? Have they engaged with the International Federation of Journalists, which has consistently fought for reporting rights in Jammu and Kashmir, as well as globally?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I will write to the noble Lord on his final point about formal engagement. As he knows, media freedom and the protection of journalists is a priority for Her Majesty’s Government; we are leading on a coalition with Canada. On the specific issue of Amnesty International and its situation in India, I assure the noble Lord that I have raised that directly with the Government of India.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, the former Chief Minister of Indian-administered Kashmir, Mrs Mufti, was detained in August last year when the Indian Government stripped the region of its partial autonomy. She was put under house arrest under a law that allows detention without charge for up to two years. She has only just been freed. Have the Government raised this and other arbitrary detentions in the region with the Government of India?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I assure the noble Baroness that we have; we raised that specific case.

[Baroness Warsi (Con) [V]]

My Lords, in Indian-administered Kashmir, Kashmiris enter their 16th month of lockdown, with curfews, a ban on communication access, closing of media outlets and widespread arrest of politicians and human rights activists. Will the Government press for a free and independent plebiscite for Kashmiris, as mandated by the United Nations? Does the Minister recognise the urgency of Kashmiris having their voice heard at a time when the BJP Indian Government are deliberately changing the population reality on the ground, in contravention of UN resolutions?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, as I have said, we welcome the lifting in recent weeks and months of some restrictions in Indian-administered Kashmir, including the restrictions on the internet; 2G and, in certain parts of Indian-administered Kashmir, 4G have been restored. However, we remain concerned, as my noble friend has said, at the ongoing detentions. While we welcome the recent release of the former Chief Minister, other detentions continue, and we continue to raise them. It is the long-standing position of Her Majesty’s Government on any dispute between India and Pakistan that it is for both countries to sit down and resolve their disputes and differences.

[Lord Loomba (CB) [V]]

My Lords, the population of the Kashmir Valley is 95% Muslim. To allege that Muslims suffer human rights abuses cannot be true. It appears to be propaganda against India by troublemakers and terrorists. Even after the revocation of Article 370, cases of terrorism are sadly still being reported in the union territory of Jammu and Kashmir today. The terrorists are the worst violators of human rights. Does the Minister agree that we cannot accept continued religious hatred against a particular community in Jammu and Kashmir, or acts of terrorism, regardless of their motivation and where they take place?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, as I have already said, we raise concerns about human rights in Indian-administered Kashmir regularly and constructively with the Indian Government. I agree with the noble Lord—I am sure I speak for all noble Lords on this—that we condemn, without any hesitation, all forms of terrorism. Any targeting of a community because of its religious rights or beliefs is totally against the norms of any functioning democracy.

[Lord Thomas of Gresford (LD) [V]]

Is the Minister aware that hundreds of applications for habeas corpus have been lodged in the High Court of Jammu and Kashmir over a 15-month period, arising out of the arbitrary detention without trial of thousands of people —including, as we have heard, political and community leaders—under the public safety Act? The court rules specify a 14-day time limit from lodging an application to the hearing. They have not even been listed, let alone dealt with. This is especially urgent since the shocking wave of arrests on 28 October. Will Her Majesty’s Government join the Jammu and Kashmir High Court Bar Association in its strenuous protests to the Indian authorities against these breaches of the United Nations human rights convention?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the United Kingdom Government are clear. We have a constructive and strong relationship with India which allows us to raise candidly and privately issues of human rights abuses, wherever they may occur, or human rights concerns we may have. As I have said, any allegation of human rights abuses must be investigated thoroughly, promptly and transparently. We make that point to the Indian authorities.

[Baroness Tonge (Non-Afl) [V]]

My Lords, will the Minister explain why we immediately supported sanctions against Russia when it annexed the Crimea, even though 97% of the people of Crimea regarded themselves as Russian and had supported Russia in its annexation, yet no action has been taken since India’s revocation of Jammu and Kashmir’s special status? It has imposed total lockdown on the majority Muslim population and thousands, as we have heard, have been taken prisoner and many tortured. Can the Minister please explain why we behaved differently?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

The issue was raised by the noble Baroness herself; one is a revocation of a constitutional item and the other is an annexation of a territory. They are two very different legal positions. We continue to raise the situation in Indian-administered Kashmir with the Indian authorities.

[Lord Ranger (Con)]

The Minister will agree that India is the largest working democracy in the world. The rights of her 1.3 billion citizens are protected in the constitution regardless of race, religion or gender—I repeat, gender. India also has the world’s most diverse population, living side by side in perfect harmony for centuries. The rights of all are protected through the constitution, including those of over 200 million Muslims. The same is reflected in Jammu and Kashmir; the province benefits from all rights under the Indian constitution.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, we of course support Indian democracy. My noble friend is right to raise the constitution of India, which protects the rights and freedoms of all communities.

[Lord Singh of Wimbledon (CB) [V]]

My Lords, Britain’s partitioning of India on the fallacy of irreconcilable religious differences promoted active hostility between Pakistan and India, particularly in Jammu and Kashmir. Independent reports confirm a significant increase in human rights abuse since the Indian army takeover of the disputed region. Does the Minister agree that Britain has a moral responsibility to work for a greater measure of secular autonomy for the Hindu, Muslim and Sikh populations of one of the most beautiful places in the world?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I agree that Kashmir is one of the most beautiful places in the world. We continue to raise issues of concern with the Indian authorities, and indeed the Pakistani authorities, on ensuring rights and freedom for all.

[Baroness Thornhill (LD) [V]]

It is quite clear from the Minister’s words that both sides are not sitting down and resolving their issues, and nor is our Government’s raising of issues with the Indian Government working. There has been a demonstrable escalation in atrocities since the lockdown and split last year. It is clear that UN resolutions are being ignored with impunity. What do the Government believe has to happen before the international community responds, or is the UN to be ignored and regarded as a crocodile with rubber teeth?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the Government are seeing progress. As I have already indicated, we are seeing some positive movements on easing the lockdown and the release of detainees in Indian-administered Kashmir, and continue to do so. We have a continuing, strong, progressive and constructive dialogue with the Indian Government which allows us to have very candid and frank exchanges on issues of concern. We raise these regularly and will continue to do so.

[The Lord Speaker (Lord Fowler)]

My Lords, the time allowed for this Question has elapsed.

Sanctions (EU Exit) (Consequential Provisions) (Amendment) Regulations 2020

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Thursday 29th October 2020 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon]

That the draft Regulations laid before the House on 16 September be approved.

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, before I introduce this SI debate, I want to express on behalf of my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary his response to the horrific events in France today. He issued the following statement:

“The United Kingdom stands with France today in sorrow, shock and solidarity at the horrifying events in Nice. Our thoughts are with the victims and their families, and we offer every support to the French people in pursuing those responsible for this appalling attack.”


I am sure those sentiments resonate with everyone in your Lordships’ House.

I turn to the instrument before us. It was laid on 16 September under the powers provided by the Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Act 2018. It will aid the investigation and prevention of terrorist financing; prevent designated persons acting as charity trustees and managing or operating sensitive financial enterprises; and enable the effective implementation of legal, operational and regulatory measures for combating terrorist financing.

We have also laid alongside this draft instrument a Section 46 report. The report is required when new regulations are made under Section 45 of the sanctions Act to amend sanctions regulations made for a discretionary purpose under Section 1 of the sanctions Act. The report details why I consider that the relevant conditions, set out in Section 45 for the use of this power to make amending regulations, are met.

The purpose of the instrument is to add new provisions to three existing 2019 regulations relating to counterterrorism sanctions. These new provisions in the 2019 regulations will in turn make amendments to several other pieces of primary and secondary legislation to replace and update references to counterterrorism sanctions legislation. That needs to be done to ensure that the new counterterrorism sanctions framework established by the 2019 sanctions regulations delivers substantially the same policy effects as the existing sanctions regimes after the end of the transition period.

The three regulations amended by this instrument, collectively known as the 2019 regulations, are the ISIL (Da’esh) and Al-Qaida (United Nations Sanctions) (EU Exit) Regulations 2019, made on 5 March 2019; the Counter-Terrorism (International Sanctions) (EU Exit) Regulations 2019, made on 14 March 2019; and the Counter-Terrorism (Sanctions) (EU Exit) Regulations 2019, also made on 14 March 2019. The provisions of primary legislation that will ultimately be amended by the 2019 regulations as a result of the amendments made by this instrument are Section 49(3) of the sanctions Act and Section 178 of the Charities Act 2011.

I shall provide further details: Section 49 of the sanctions Act confers a power on the appropriate Minister to make regulations for the purpose of enabling or facilitating the detection, investigation, or prevention of terrorist financing. This will, for example, enable the Government to amend or update the existing Money Laundering, Terrorist Financing and Transfer of Funds (Information on the Payer) Regulations 2017, which currently include measures to tackle terrorist financing.

Section 49(3) defines “terrorist financing” by references to other pieces of legislation. The amendments made by this instrument will remove references to offences under regulations being revoked by the 2019 regulations and add references to new offences under the 2019 regulations. That will ensure that the definition of “terrorist financing” is up to date and can be used in reference to current legislation. It also means that Her Majesty’s Government can use the power in Section 49 of the sanctions Act to facilitate the prevention, detection or investigation of terrorist financing, following the revocation of a number of the current offences by the 2019 regulations.

Appallingly, there are occasions when charities are abused for the purpose of financing terror. To reduce the risk of such abuse occurring, Section 178 of the Charities Act 2011 disqualifies individuals who present a known risk from serving as a charity trustee or a charity senior manager—that is, the chief executive, finance director or their equivalent. The amendments made by this instrument will remove references to persons designated under regulations being revoked and add references to persons designated under any of the 2019 regulations.

I am sure many noble Lords will agree that this is a technical update to ensure that legislation on charities and financial services can continue to deliver the same policy effects after the end of the transition period. It will prevent those designated under these sanctions regulations being able to act as charity trustees or charity senior managers.

The amendments to the Electronic Money Regulations 2011 and Payment Services Regulations 2017 prevent the registration of a small electronic money institution or a small payment institution where any of the individuals responsible for the management or operation of the business have been convicted of an offence under the Counter-Terrorism (Sanctions) (EU Exit) Regulations 2019. This prevents persons convicted of terrorist financing offences managing or operating these sensitive enterprises.

The consequential amendment to the Money Laundering, Terrorist Financing and Transfer of Funds (Information on the Payer) Regulations 2017 provides that the definition of “terrorist financing” used in those regulations refers to the new offences in the Counter-Terrorism (Sanctions) (EU Exit) Regulations 2019. This amendment will ensure that the Government are able to continue to promote the effective implementation of legal, operational and regulatory measures for combating terrorist financing once the 2019 regulations are in force. The instrument represents the first use of the powers under Section 54(3) and (4) of the sanctions Act to amend the definition of “terrorist financing” in Section 49(3) of the sanctions Act. It will not come into force until a later date or dates to be appointed separately.

This instrument thus forms a necessary part of the programme of work being undertaken by the Foreign, Commonwealth & Development Office in conjunction with other Whitehall departments to construct an effective and robust UK sanctions framework under the Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Act 2018. The counterterrorism sanctions framework includes financial, trade and immigration sanctions. It is a key element of the UK’s counterterrorist financing strategy and remains a major disruptive and preventive tool in the global fight against terrorism. We will continue to work closely with our Five Eyes and other international partners to help combat threats to the international financial system and the charity sector.

The United Kingdom, let me assure noble Lords, is working closely with the Financial Action Task Force, the G20, G7 and EU partners to disrupt terrorist financing. There is a particular focus on: reducing domestic terrorist fundraising; the movement of terrorist finance across borders; and the fundraising and movement of terrorist finance overseas. International counterterrorism sanctions regimes are an essential, practical weapon in disrupting terrorism. They also demonstrate international resolve.

The UK has a strong reputation for tackling terrorism, supported by our robust legislative framework. We will of course continue to strengthen our approach to countering terrorism by ensuring we have the correct range of disruptive tools and capabilities at our disposal, including our sanctions and counterterrorist financing frameworks. This instrument will ensure that these remain functional and effective. I beg to move.

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[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, I thank all noble Lords for their contributions and for their support for these regulations. I join with other noble Lords in warmly welcoming the noble Baroness, Lady Hoey, and in congratulating her on her excellent speech. We learned from my noble friend Lord Balfe of her connections with Tottenham Hotspur. I am sure we shall have animated debates, as I am a Liverpool fan—the accent is a bit of a giveaway. She will be an incredibly powerful contributor to our debates. Her speech today showed important insights into the detail of the subject matter being discussed. I often describe your Lordships’ House as a place of wit and wisdom. Knowing the noble Baroness, I am sure she will make high-quality contributions on both these fronts.

I also welcome the contributions and support of other noble Lords in this important debate. I totally concur with the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, and the noble Lord, Lord Collins; it will be no surprise if I repeat something that I have said to them both within and outside the Chamber. I agree that sanctions and their application—whether in the context of counterterrorism or any other area—work effectively only when they are taken in lock-step with other key partners.

I want to pick up specifically on some of the key points raised by the noble Lord, Lord Bradshaw, my noble friend Lady McIntosh of Pickering and the noble Baroness, Lady Ritchie. Existing regulations will continue to operate and apply to the UK during the remaining part of the transition period. We continue to work with the EU and member states to ensure that all EU sanctions are implemented and enforced. The noble Lord, Lord Collins, also raised these issues. We are working closely with our European partners, not just on sanctions but in other areas as well. Specifically, on sanctions, I am in constant touch with my opposite numbers within the European Commission. We also have discussions with leaders and representatives of other Governments within the EU. As recent alignment has shown, we work closely on matters of international co-operation, particularly through the E3 mechanism.

The noble Lord, Lord Collins, asked about the United Nations and our priorities there. He will know that there is a particular Under-Secretary-General responsible for counterterrorism. I am in discussions with our representatives in New York to see how we can further strengthen the UK’s broad interests. I will take into account the noble Lord’s suggestions on how we move forward in this area. The sad events in France once again indicate the vulnerability of dealing with such acts. My noble friend Lady McIntosh made the point about people who operate using new channels of communication. I agree with her—we need to be one step ahead. The terrorist mindset is always looking at new and innovative ways to challenge and defeat those who unite against extremism and terrorism. As events have shown, this remains a live issue. We send our condolences to the families of those attacked in France today. We have learned that the attack happened in a church—a place of worship. Any terrorist attack is appalling, but this compounds the impact.

I am grateful to my noble friend Lord Balfe and welcome his support and that of the noble Baroness, Lady Ritchie, for these regulations. I can assure them again that we shall work closely with EU counterparts. On UN sanctions, we work internationally. I pre-empted a question from the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, when I mentioned international partners, by alluding specifically to the European Union. Now that we have left the European Union, it will be important for us to continue to align ourselves with liberal democracies across Europe. That sends a powerful message on sanctions and other areas of work.

I was not surprised by a couple of the references from the noble Lord, Lord Hain—I somewhat expected them. The noble Lord, Lord Collins also asked about corruption, particularly in the context of the Magnitsky sanctions. I can assure both noble Lords and the House that we are considering how a corruption regime can be added to our current armoury of legal weapons. The Magnitsky global human rights sanctions are an obvious one. I can also assure the noble Lord, Lord Collins, that we are looking specifically at the framework of the UN Convention against Corruption and I have had meetings to this effect. We are also looking at other jurisdictions such as the United States and Canada which already apply these sanctions. As details emerge, I will share them with your Lordships’ House.

The noble Baroness, Lady Jones of Moulescoomb, in her customary way, raised a number of questions about illegitimate regimes which may seek not to take on board the sanctions being applied. It depends on the situation as to whether sanctions are likely to be effective in achieving our foreign policy aims. The global human rights sanctions are a good example in that they specifically target movement and financing. These are powerful tools, even if an individual or an existing regime somewhere in the world does not accept them. Acting first and foremost as the UK but also in partnership with other countries adds to the strength and application of such tools.

The noble Baroness also referred to the US elections. The United States is a strong friend and ally—it is also a robust democracy. We await the outcome of their elections. The systems in the United States are robust enough to provide an outcome which is both acceptable and legitimate. The strength of a democracy lies in its own operation. It is not for me to comment on the outcome of those elections, but I believe the US is and will remain a vibrant and strong democracy, underpinned by the rule of law.

I thank my noble friend Lady Gardner for her support. She referred to Section 49 as an important part of the Government’s approach in laying these regulations.

The noble Baroness, Lady Hoey, asked about Libya. We are working to have the Libya regime and accompanying guidance ready for the end of the transition period and will provide details of it. I also take on board her important references to the communities in Northern Ireland who have had to endure challenges of their own. We stand in solidarity with all those who have been victims of any kinds of atrocities.

I wish to thank all noble Lords again for their important and supportive contributions. It is not often that I can stand at the Dispatch Box and universally thank every single contributor for their strong support of the Government’s approach. On this occasion it is most welcome. This instrument underlines our common objective to support and protect the United Kingdom and the international financial system, as well as the charity sector to which the noble Baroness, Lady Northover, referred. I can assure her that we work closely with the Charity Commission. Charity law disqualifies certain individuals from being a charity trustee, as set out in the Charities Act 2011. These regulations tie these important pieces of legislation together. I assure her that we look very closely at the work of the Charity Commission, particularly with regard to those NGOs operating in the international sphere.

These regulations will also ensure that the range of disruptive tools and capabilities at our disposal, including our sanctions and counterterrorism financing framework, remain effective. It will aid our global fight against terrorism and contribute to the UK being an even stronger force for good in the world.

Finally, in her maiden speech, the noble Baroness, Lady Hoey, talked of the celebrations in Northern Ireland in 2021. I am sure I speak for all noble Lords here, and beyond, when I say that we look forward to joining with her and other noble Lords in those celebrations. The noble Baroness described it as a “wee country”; I am sure we all regard it as an important country which defines the modern United Kingdom. I beg to move.

Motion agreed.

Afghanistan

Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon Excerpts

Thursday 15th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness D'Souza]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what plans they have to provide assistance for (1) humanitarian, (2) development, and (3) girls’ education, work in Afghanistan after the withdrawal of peacekeeping forces.

[The Minister of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon) (Con)]

My Lords, the United Kingdom warmly welcomes the start of the Afghan peace negotiations, which are the best chance of securing enduring peace. While the spending review is ongoing, I cannot comment on future assistance levels. However, the Government remain absolutely committed to supporting the people of Afghanistan, and we expect to announce funding for 2021 at the pledging conferences this autumn. Our ongoing programmes support humanitarian development and girls’ education, which will continue to be a priority.

[Baroness D’Souza (CB)]

I thank the noble Lord for his answer. It is firmly established that educating girls is one of the surest ways to achieve development: social, economic and political. In view of this, will Her Majesty’s Government commit to not only continuing but expanding their education programme, including female teacher training, secure school construction and vocational courses in Afghanistan?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I assure the noble Baroness that the issue of girls’ education remains a government priority. Indeed, our Prime Minister, the right honourable Boris Johnson, leads directly on the campaign for 12 years of quality education for every girl around the world. As the noble Baroness knows, the situation in Afghanistan is fluid, but we remain very committed to the central objective and indeed the priorities that she has outlined.

[Baroness Blackstone (Ind Lab)]

My Lords, it is essential to maintain development aid in this desperately poor country, as were it to collapse the illicit economy would also almost certainly take over. However, can the Minister tell the House what position the UK Government will take at the pledging conference he mentioned just now in Geneva in November on conditions with respect to corruption and human rights?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

The noble Baroness raises two important points. We of course lead on anti-corruption in the context of humanitarian support around the world, and Afghanistan is no exception. Particular mechanisms in the programmes ensure that corruption is tackled, and those who seek to cause disruption to those processes are fully held to account. The UK National Crime Agency, for example, works very closely to build Afghani capacity. On the pledging conference, which takes place in November, we recognise the need to continue to support programmes in Afghanistan, but to do so for every agency and every person in a secure manner which also ensures that every pound that is pledged and delivered goes to the purpose for which it is intended.

[Baroness Tonge (Non-Afl) [V]]

My Lords, the Minister will know that in Afghanistan there is a high prevalence of child marriage. A third of girls marry before the age of 18, some as young as 12, which brings physical and mental consequences and loss of education. What support can the Government realistically give the Government of Afghanistan to help eliminate that problem?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

The noble Baroness is quite right to raise these issues. As Minister for Afghanistan, this is a central concern for me, particularly with the Afghan peace talks under way—although they have stalled. I assure her that these issues remain the key priority in the support and the training we give through the schools and education programme, and the Girls’ Education Challenge fund. We continue to prioritise this as we move through the current talks and for future programmes. Child marriage is of course not unique to Afghanistan, but is found in other parts of the world. Education and education for girls remain essential to tackling it.

[Baroness Helic (Con) [V]]

My Lords, the official figures for women reported to have tested positive for or to have died from Covid-19 in Afghanistan are significantly below the equivalent figures for men. That does not match with the experience of other countries, suggesting that Afghan women are not receiving adequate attention or treatment, and many may be suffering and dying in their own homes. Can my noble friend tell the House what steps the Government are taking to contribute to reducing barriers to healthcare for women in Afghanistan, and how they expect women’s access to healthcare to be impacted by the withdrawal of international forces?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

On my noble friend’s second point, this poses a massive challenge for countries continuing to have a presence there, and indeed for donor countries such as ourselves that are engaged in humanitarian programmes. She is right to highlight the challenge. To be candid with her, I recognise and understand it. The challenge will be how the security situation prevails with any new governance arrangements in Afghanistan, to ensure that the achievements we have made, including in providing health support to women, are sustained and strengthened in the months and years ahead.

[Baroness Northover (LD)]

My Lords, one of the key advances that has come out of the engagement in Afghanistan has been the improvement in women’s rights. What discussions have the Government had with our former EU colleagues to make sure that our departure from the EU does not lead to them reducing their commitment?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

The noble Baroness is quite right to raise this. Engagements are going on regarding the US withdrawal between other NATO partners who continue to have a presence on the ground, because security has to be the primary objective in securing the gains that have been made. I assure the noble Baroness that I am looking at all the programmes in Afghanistan with the very purpose of seeing how we can strengthen partnership working to ensure that we continue to deliver them.

[Baroness Fall (Con) [V]]

My Lords, we do not yet know the outcome of the peace talks between the Taliban and Afghanistan, but we know for certain that US withdrawal of troops is imminent and that the Taliban’s reach is wide and deep across the community. I seek assurances from the Minister that he will not just continue to support education for girls, but look more creatively at ways in which we can teach in communities, including within homes, which are unlikely to fall foul of the Taliban.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I can certainly give that assurance to my noble friend. Indeed, the challenges of Covid and the pandemic have shown how we can enable learning through technology. I certainly want to look at that area further, not just in Afghanistan, but in other areas across the world.

[The Earl of Sandwich (CB) [V]]

My Lords, as the Minister has already said, the UK has been prominent in anti-corruption and police reform, alongside the EU and the UN—President Ghani himself attended a meeting on that on 4 October. However, does the Minister have any evidence that in the present political situation, these initiatives are effective and will lead to real change?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Earl is right to raise this issue. The UK has supported the Afghan National Police, which helps to support the Afghani defence and security forces. We continue to fund up to £70 million through trust funds for this purpose, and we continue to engage and support through technical support and training. I cannot speculate what the outcome of the negotiations will be. They remain challenging; as I said earlier, they have stalled. However, we are ensuring that all the support we give, including to the Afghan police, stays in place.

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

My Lords, President Ashraf Ghani referred to climate change as one of the five drivers of turmoil in his country and highlighted recent droughts and floods. Can the Minister say what support we are giving to Afghanistan in response to these humanitarian crises, not just with funding, because I hear what he says about the pledging conference, but regarding expertise to help mitigate some of these natural disasters that are occurring?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

The noble Lord raises an important point; whether it is climate change, girls’ education or police training, the engagement of experts is required. I assure him that we work on our programmes in Afghanistan specifically with that objective in mind, including with key NGO partners. However, I cannot stress enough that the situation on the ground is fluid. The issue of the security and the continued presence of NGOs is a challenge not just to the country, but directly to them.

[Baroness Sheehan (LD)]

My Lords, what support is the FCDO giving Afghani women during the peace process? A strong platform for them will be crucial to protect girls’ education from Taliban ideology.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

The noble Baroness knows as well as I do that Taliban ideology is not just discriminatory; it isolates women. I assure her that I am very much invested in this issue on a personal level. We are supporting Afghani women through the UN— we lead the Afghan engagement group. The current ambassador from Afghanistan to the UN is a woman, and we continue to support women’s direct and pivotal engagement in the peace process in Afghanistan. However, I will be very honest with the noble Baroness: from the Taliban side, that remains an immense challenge.

[Lord Alton of Liverpool (CB)]

My Lords, returning to the point the Minister just made about ideology, given the probable return of the Taliban to positions of power in Afghanistan and its ideological commitment to early child marriage, denying girls the chance of an education, is there any sign that the Taliban has modified its implacable hatred of girls’ education, exemplified by its attempts in Pakistan to murder Malala Yousafzai?

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

I would not hazard to think what the Taliban ideology is. It is not just against girls; it is fundamentally against empowerment through education. The check and balance must be that we as a Government, with international partners, remain firm and resolute that education empowers and, yes, it empowers girls. For anyone involved in the peace process, if you empower a girl, you empower the individual, her family, her city and her country, and it is about time that all those involved with the intra-Afghan peace talks woke up and realised the objective and how beneficial it will be for the future of Afghanistan.

[The Deputy Speaker (Lord Faulkner of Worcester) (Lab)]

My Lords, the time allowed for this Question has elapsed.