Romanian and Bulgarian Accession
Baroness May of Maidenhead Excerpts(11 years ago)
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Yvette Cooper (Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford) (Lab)
(Urgent Question): To ask the Home Secretary if she will make a statement on Romanian and Bulgarian accession.
The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
In June 2005, the previous Government signed accession treaties with Romania and Bulgaria, and in doing so they granted all Romanians and Bulgarians the right to come to Britain. The treaties came into effect in 2007, and as a result the seven-year transitional controls relating to free movement will end on 1 January 2014. From that date, Romanians and Bulgarians will have the right to largely unrestricted free movement across Europe.
Unlike the previous Government, who chose not to apply the transitional controls for countries such as Poland and Hungary in 2004, this Government are doing everything we can to ensure that we are prepared for this latest extension in EU free movement rights. First, we are making use of the full seven years available to us to impose transitional controls, something the Labour party failed to do in 2004, which meant that Britain was the only major economy in Europe to grant full access to its labour market to millions of Poles, Hungarians and others.
Secondly, we are tightening the European immigration regulations to ensure that we do not gold-plate EU free movement rules. We are therefore amending the regulations to create a statutory presumption that a European’s right to reside here ends after six months unless they can prove that they are actively seeking work and stand a real chance of finding it.
Thirdly, we are taking action to limit the pull factors that attract people to come to Britain. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions is introducing a three-month delay before a European jobseeker can claim benefits and a new minimum earnings threshold to ensure that EU nationals are genuinely working in the UK before they can access benefits. He is also developing a tougher six-month test to assess whether benefit claimants have a genuine chance of finding work. That will apply to all EU nationals who come here to look for work and those who have already worked here. Those changes will come into effect as soon as possible in the new year. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Health is ensuring that, wherever possible, the NHS claims back the cost of treating Europeans from their home country. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government will issue new statutory guidance to ensure that local authorities set a residency requirement, or a minimum period of residence in a community, before a person qualifies for social housing.
Fourthly, we are ensuring that there is a full and proper operational response to the challenges brought by that extension in free movement. We are working with the police, local authorities and other agencies to identify Europeans who are rough-sleeping and not exercising their treaty right to be in the UK. Where appropriate, those people will be removed. We are also changing the European immigration regulations to introduce a 12-month bar on their return to Britain, unless they can prove that they have a proper reason to be here.
Fifthly, I have lobbied other member states in the Council of Ministers about the abuse of free movement, and there is a growing coalition of support for change. In April this year, Germany, Austria and the Netherlands, along with Britain, wrote to the European presidency and the Commission to make the case for change. Although I am pleased that the European Commission has at long last admitted that there is a problem, it is still refusing to do anything meaningful about it.
Those are the measures we are taking to prepare us for the extension of free movement in January, but in the long term there is much more we need to do. The Prime Minister made it clear at the beginning of the year that any future Government he leads will seek to renegotiate Britain’s relationship with the EU before we hold a referendum, and that referendum will ask the people whether we should be in or out. As I have made clear in the past and reiterate today, that renegotiation must address the problems caused by free movement. Now, in her reply, the shadow Home Secretary needs to tell the House whether she agrees with that renegotiation and referendum and whether she agrees that the renegotiation must address the problems caused by free movement.
Yvette Cooper
For generations, people have come to this country and worked hard to contribute to Britain, building some of our biggest businesses and even becoming Olympic medal winners, but the principle of contribution is an important one, and the controls on immigration must be fair to those who live here. That is why we called for stronger restrictions on benefits for new arrivals from the EU, including proposals eight months ago to strengthen the habitual residence test to make it clear that people should not be able to claim benefits when they first arrive. We also said that the framework for the free movement of labour should be looked at again.
At the time, the Government dismissed those proposals, but eight months later they have changed their minds. That is welcome, but will the Home Secretary say why she did not bring those proposals forward at the time? It is now the end of November, and accession for Romania and Bulgaria will occur in a month’s time, so will she tell the House which of these measures will be in place by the beginning of January, when the transitional controls for Romania and Bulgaria end? Will the restrictions on jobseeker’s allowance be in by January? Will the housing benefit restrictions be in by January? Will the minimum wage fines be in place by January? If not, why not? We called for these proposals eight months ago, so why the delay?
We all agree that transitional arrangements should have been in place for the A8 countries. At the time, the Conservative party voted for A8 accession even without transitional arrangements. The Home Secretary’s party also supported the Romanian and Bulgarian accession agreement. The Prime Minister has today claimed that the rules on transitional controls should have been changed at that time, but he did not argue for changing transitional controls then and failed to do anything about changing transitional controls when this Government endorsed Croatian accession in 2011 with exactly the same transitional control rules in place. Will she explain why the Prime Minister failed to act in 2011, given what he has said today?
Neither are the Government doing anything about the impact of accession on the workplace. Most people from Europe come to Britain to work, not to claim benefits, and 1 million British citizens live and work elsewhere in Europe too, yet there is a serious problem of low-skilled migrant workers being exploited, undercutting local workers and responsible businesses too. That is bad for everyone, yet she is doing nothing about it. We have urged her to take action, against recruitment agencies that target only foreign workers; against factories that segregate shifts by nationality; against the loophole in the minimum wage that means migrant workers are put into overcrowded tied accommodation to get round the rules; and against employers in the care sector, for example, who have recruited heavily from abroad but failed to train or to pay the minimum wage. Each time she has refused, so what is the Home Secretary or the Prime Minister doing to address those problems for wages and jobs? Nothing.
All parties should take a responsible approach to immigration. We will not enter an arms race of rhetoric. Instead, we need practical measures to address people’s concerns. We are glad that the Prime Minister has adopted our proposals on benefit restrictions, but the Government should not have delayed them for eight months so that they will not be in place for January. It is not enough, either. They need to take action over jobs and wages now.
Mr Speaker
Order. The temperature is rising. I keep a close eye on these things, and I understood the reference to be a collective reference, not an accusation of individual impropriety. [Interruption.] Order. I do not require any assistance, although the sage nodding of the head by the hon. Member for Wellingborough (Mr Bone) is always a matter of great parliamentary interest. That is why I took the view I did. I urge Members to be moderate in their use of language, but the Home Secretary is in order.
Mrs May
Despite all the evidence and warnings, the Labour party in government refused to impose transitional controls in 2004, but now it seeks to lecture us about immigration. I do not know whether the shadow Home Secretary has seen a copy of today’s Daily Mail, but it contains a fascinating article written by Britain’s ambassador in Warsaw in 2004, who describes the “incredulity” of the Poles when he told them that Britain would not be imposing transitional controls. He writes that the Polish Government
“instinctively knew what Tony Blair’s Labour government consistently denied: the immediate abolition of all border restrictions would lead to a surge of”
their people coming to these shores.
The Labour Government told us that only 13,000 people would come; the truth was that more than 1 million came. It was the biggest single influx this country has ever experienced, and who suffered as a result? The right hon. Lady talks about doing something about wages and jobs. In the five years following Labour’s failure to impose transitional controls, more than 90% of the increase in employment in Britain was accounted for by foreign nationals. Under this Government, thanks to our measures to control immigration and reform welfare, two thirds of the increase in employment has been accounted for by British people.
But if the right hon. Lady does not want to listen to me or the former British ambassador to Poland, perhaps she should listen to the succession of former Labour Home Secretaries who have admitted what the British people already knew. The right hon. Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw) describes the failure to impose transitional controls as a “spectacular mistake”. And let us remember: it was not just European immigration that Labour let get out of control, but all forms of immigration. Under Labour, net immigration reached 2.2 million, which is twice the population of the city of Birmingham.
I come again to the right hon. Lady’s point about what is being done on wages and jobs. The Labour Government knew just what they were doing. The hon. Member for Dagenham and Rainham (Jon Cruddas), the Leader of the Opposition’s policy guru, has said that Labour were
“using migration to introduce a covert 21st century incomes policy.”
Labour, which claims to be the party of the working man and woman, admits that it used immigration deliberately to keep down wages.
In answer to the right hon. Lady’s question, I have gone through what the Government are doing to prepare for January: we have been making full use of transitional controls; we are tightening the immigration rules so that we do not gold-plate EU free-movement rules; we are limiting the pull factors that attract people to Britain; we are ensuring a strong operational response to the challenges brought by free movement; and we are working with other member states to cut out the abuse of free movement. She claims we have done nothing about the habitual residence test, but my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions has tightened it, and that is already in operation. We want to renegotiate our relationship with the EU and ensure we address the problems caused by free movement as part of that renegotiation.
In its 13 years in government Labour did nothing about those issues. The shadow Home Secretary’s comments today show that she has not learned any lessons from 2004, has failed to come up with any solutions of her own and has failed to support our plan to fix the problems caused by free movement in the renegotiation. On this issue, as on others, she has no credibility whatsoever.
Mr James Clappison (Hertsmere) (Con)
My right hon. Friend rightly adverted to the fact that the previous Government, virtually alone among the major economies, allowed unfettered access to this country to the large populations of the accession countries in 2004. Will she assure me that this Government will not do what the previous Government further did, which was, at the same time, to grant a large number of work permits to workers from outside the EU, in a policy that has never been properly explained and remains mysterious to this day, even though it sounds very much as though the right hon. Member for Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford (Yvette Cooper) would like to repeat it.
Mrs May
Indeed, and a leading Labour party Front Bencher has already indicated that a Labour Government might consider increasing levels of immigration, were Labour to come back into power. Certainly this Government have been tightening up not just on the work permit route from outside the EU into the UK, but on every route of access into the UK. As the Conservative party committed to doing before the election and as was agreed in the coalition agreement, the Government have introduced a cap on non-EU economic migration into the UK. We have a limit on the number of people who can come here as tier 2 workers and we have reformed the other routes, and I am pleased to say that as a result we have seen immigration from outside the EU fall.
Keith Vaz (Leicester East) (Lab)
Of course it is right for all Governments to target the abuse of benefits. Will the Home Secretary reassure us, however, that this measure is not designed specifically to deal with Romanians and Bulgarians as the transition ends in just 30 days’ time? Does she agree that the real issue is the push and pull factors? That is why it is necessary to work with the Romanian and Bulgarian Governments to find out the reasons and causes of this migration. Romania has not as yet accessed 87% of the funds it was given on accession. We need to work with the Romanians so that they can build on their infrastructure and their citizens are able to remain there—this applies to Bulgaria, too—which is what they want to do. We cannot have freedom of movement without movement, which makes this a fundamental issue for the European Union rather than one that can be dealt with by a change in the benefit rules.
Mrs May
I thank the right hon. Gentleman for his measured response and his question. Of course he is right to say that making the changes to tighten the benefit rules, seeking to remove people not exercising their treaty rights and then providing a year-long ban applies not only to Romanians and Bulgarians but to all those exercising their free movement rights and coming here from the European Union. What I took from the last part of the right hon. Gentleman’s question was, I think, support for the concept that this Government have set out—that we want to renegotiate the treaty. My party has certainly set that out, and the Prime Minister has set it out. We want the treaty to be renegotiated and, within that, we want to address the issue of free movement. Crucially, other member states across the EU are now working with us, because they also see potential problems arising from the abuse of the free movement right.
Sir Gerald Howarth (Aldershot) (Con)
May I congratulate my right hon. Friend on her incredibly robust statement today, which will be warmly welcomed by the British people, and may I join her in condemning the nauseating hypocrisy of Labour Members, who allowed 2.2 million to come into this country as a deliberate act of policy? We saw on the television young doctors in Bulgaria wishing to come to this country because they could earn in two days here what they earn in a month in Bulgaria. Is not their membership of the EU completely contradicted if all the talent leaves Bulgaria and comes to the UK and other advanced European countries? Even at this late stage, I invite my right hon. Friend to contemplate extending the transitional arrangements so that we have another two or three years to prepare for this.
Mrs May
My hon. Friend makes an important and serious point about people moving to the UK who would be of benefit to their own countries if they remained in them. It is important to look at the issue he raises about the disparity of wages and salaries that can be earned, particularly when looking at renegotiation, free movement and transitional controls. My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister has made it clear that one aspect that we are currently considering is whether a more flexible approach on transitional controls, reflecting potential disparities and extending transitional controls while certain disparities remained, would be more beneficial than the blunt instrument we have now.
Ms Gisela Stuart (Birmingham, Edgbaston) (Lab)
As a foreign national who came to this country, I find some of the tone of the right hon. Lady’s response to be slightly distasteful. Some of what she wants to put in place is right and proper, but she did not answer the shadow Home Secretary’s question about why those things were not put in place when we called for them eight months ago. Does she anticipate that all the provisions she mentions will be in place by 1 January?
Mrs May
I have made it clear on many occasions that I think immigration has been good for the United Kingdom overall. The problem we faced was uncontrolled immigration under the previous Labour Government, whom the hon. Lady supported. We therefore needed to ensure that we brought some control into our immigration system. Most members of the public think that it is only fair when they are hard working and contributing to the NHS, for example, that other people coming here should be required to contribute as well, while those who come here legitimately think it only fair that those who are here illegitimately and illegally should be removed from this country. Some of the measures—the tightening of the habitual residence test, for example—have been renegotiated in recent months. These policies are being looked at and they will be in place by 1 January; others will be put in place as soon after 1 January as is possible.
Mr Charles Walker (Broxbourne) (Con)
I thank the Home Secretary for her statement, but I ask her to find her inner lion or tiger and extend transitional controls until 2019. She should take the hit and not pay the EU fine.
Mrs May
My hon. Friend raises the same point as my hon. Friend the Member for Aldershot (Sir Gerald Howarth) raised, and I suspect that other hon. Friends would like to raise the same point. I think it right for this Government to look at everything we can do to ensure that we can maintain the control of migration to which we have been committed to introducing in the UK. The current legal position is clear, and I have set it out, but it is right to look at every possibility to ensure that we deal with the situation. I have set out in my response to the urgent question the moves that we are making.
Mr Nigel Dodds (Belfast North) (DUP)
Given the abject failure, as the right hon. Lady describes it, of the European Commission adequately to respond to a joint initiative that included the German Government and others, would it not be a good idea to press the matter further, to extend the transitional provisions of the 2005 treaty until such time as we can have a referendum and see what decision the British people have made, and to maintain the status quo in the meantime?
Mrs May
As I noted, a number of hon. Members have raised this issue, so I congratulate the right hon. Gentleman on being the third to do so. I have just responded to my hon. Friend the Member for Broxbourne (Mr Walker) on that very matter. On the point about the European Commission, I agree that it has so far failed to respond. It has, however, moved in that it has accepted that the concept of free movement can be abused and that some abuse of it does take place. This is why my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions and I are working to build within the EU, a coalition of member states—beyond those I have already mentioned—that remain concerned about this issue, wish to see something done about it and can bring greater pressure on the Commission.
Dr Julian Huppert (Cambridge) (LD)
It is clearly right to clamp down on abuse, but will the Home Secretary confirm that the vast majority of EU migrants here do not claim benefits and instead contribute substantially to our country and our economy—to the tune of £25 billion, according to one study from University college London?
Mrs May
The problem is that the last Labour Government made no attempt to collect any information, so nobody knows the number of people claiming benefits when coming into this country in 2004. This Government are now starting to collect that information so that we can build up a better picture at the same time as we are tightening up access to those benefits. We are not able to say what the picture was previously because the last Government failed to collect the figures.
Mr Clive Betts (Sheffield South East) (Lab)
I am sure that the Home Secretary will realise that my constituents are concerned not just about benefits. My right hon. Friend the Member for Sheffield, Brightside and Hillsborough (Mr Blunkett) has drawn attention to the challenges posed by the large influx of Roma-Slovak migrants into our constituencies. Does she accept that that poses major challenges to community cohesion and puts significant pressures on housing overcrowding and health and school services in our constituencies? Does she agree that the Government need to develop a strategy to work with councils such as Sheffield to meet those challenges to the benefit of all concerned?
Mrs May
The hon. Gentleman raises an issue that I know concerns a number of communities around the country; local authorities are seeking to address it. There are a number of ways in which the Government have worked on these issues—in respect of certain groups in London, for example—including by working with the Romanian police, who have been over here to support us on this particular question. We need to ensure that we can maintain community cohesion so that we do not see a rise in the concerns to which the hon. Gentleman refers. The Government will strengthen their ability to ensure that those who are removed for not exercising their treaty rights are not able to return for a year.
Michael Ellis (Northampton North) (Con)
Will my right hon. Friend note Lord Mandelson’s comment that the last Labour Government sent out “search parties” to encourage mass immigration? Moreover, the right hon. Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw) has said not only that the Labour Government’s policy was a “spectacular mistake”, but that it left them—and should have left them—with “red faces”. In the light of those admissions from certain leading Labour figures, will my right hon. Friend ensure that she continues to repair the damage done to this country by the negligence of the last Government?
Mrs May
My hon. Friend is right, and I assure him that, working with colleagues such as my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions, I will do all that I can to repair the damage left by the last Government. Given that the right hon. Member for Sheffield, Brightside and Hillsborough (Mr Blunkett), Lord Mandelson—as my hon. Friend pointed out—and the right hon. Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw) have all been reflecting on the mistakes made by the Labour Government in relation to immigration, I think that it would have been far preferable for the shadow Secretary of State to come to the House and apologise today.
Mr Mike Weir (Angus) (SNP)
The Home Secretary has announced what appear to be substantial proposed changes to freedom of movement, but freedom of movement is a two-way street. It is estimated that 2.2 million United Kingdom citizens are living or working in other parts of the European Union. What assessment has the Home Secretary made of the impact on those citizens of reciprocal changes that may be made by EU nations?
Mrs May
It is true that a number of people from the United Kingdom have chosen to exercise free movement rights and move to other parts of Europe. The figure that I have seen is slightly lower than the one given by the hon. Gentleman, but that does not affect the principle, or the fact that people have exercised those rights. What I think this country should do, in conjunction with other EU member states—and we are working with other member states—is decide what makes sense, and what is fair to our citizens. We must have a system that ensures that those who exercise free movement rights exercise them properly, and that we are able to reduce the pull factors that encourage people to come here and, potentially, not exercise those rights properly.
Geoffrey Clifton-Brown (The Cotswolds) (Con)
Will my right hon. Friend say to our colleagues in the European Union that, given that the last Labour Government let in 2.2 million migrants, Britain has taken more than its fair share of migrants throughout Europe, and it is high time that this Parliament regained sovereignty over our immigration policy?
Mrs May
In many respects, we have rather more control over our borders than a number of other European Union member states. We are not in Schengen, for example, and we intend to remain outside it and retain our ability to exercise border controls. I think that the measures I have announced today demonstrate that we are increasingly sending the European Commission the message that we think it important for us to be able to make decisions about such matters as the habitual residence test on the basis of what is right for people living here in the United Kingdom.
Derek Twigg (Halton) (Lab)
Let me say first that I think we should consider what changes could be made in relation to how free the movement of labour should be in the European Union. My constituents raise that issue with me regularly. May I also ask the Home Secretary what estimate her Department has made of the impact that the changes will have on the number of EU citizens coming to, and staying in, this country, and on what date the benefit changes will take effect?
Mrs May
The Government have produced no estimate, and independent commentators have expressed the view that that is a sensible approach. Because of the number of variables, it would be very difficult to make such an estimate other than within a very large range.
Some of the measures that I have announced—including the ability to ensure that people who are removed because they are not exercising their treaty rights do not return for a year—will take effect on 1 January, while others will be introduced as early as possible in the new year.
Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con)
I welcome the Home Secretary’s statement, but I do not think that either the coalition Government or the Opposition are listening carefully enough to what people are saying. My constituents take the view that this country is full, and that we should not open our borders to Romania and Bulgaria. Yes, if we do not open our borders to them the country will be taken to court, but we will have sent a signal of firm intent about our renegotiation of the EU treaties—and hopefully, by the time the case comes to court the referendum will have taken place, and we will have left this wretched organisation altogether.
Mrs May
I note my hon. Friend’s robust remarks, which are no less than I would have expected from him on this issue. I understand people’s concern about it—and, indeed, about immigration generally—but I think that their concern is largely a response to what they saw happening under the last Government. We are taking a number of steps to deal with that, not just in terms of what will happen after the end of the transitional controls but in the Immigration Bill, which is currently going through Parliament. It is this Government who are introducing changes that I believe are absolutely fair to hard-working people in this country.
Mr Ian Davidson (Glasgow South West) (Lab/Co-op)
Surely the fact that new Labour got it spectacularly wrong on European immigration—as some of us argued at the time—does not entitle the Government to make the same mistake. Am I not right in thinking that by the end of the first week in January, every citizen of Romania, every citizen of Bulgaria, and everyone else who has managed to get Romanian and Bulgarian passports will be able to enter the United Kingdom without hindrance?
Mrs May
The hon. Gentleman said that mistakes had been made by the last Government. He also referred to new Labour; I am not sure whether that is something different from the Labour party that he now represents. He claimed that this Government were not learning from those mistakes, but we have indeed learnt from them. That is why we have been clear about transitional controls, and why we want to renegotiate the treaty and ensure that free movement is part of that renegotiation.
Simon Hughes (Bermondsey and Old Southwark) (LD)
As one who strongly supports our continued membership of the European Union but was very critical of Labour’s action in doing away with the transitional arrangements for the eastern European countries, and as one who also strongly supports our not joining the Schengen agreement, I welcome the Home Secretary’s statement because it deals with some of the deep concerns expressed by our constituents. However, will she ensure that over the next few weeks the coalition Government disseminate very clearly, for the benefit of the public and local councils, information about exactly what the rules are in relation to people from other countries? There are people outside the House—and, sometimes, people in the House—who misrepresent the picture in a way that generates fear of immigrants and fear of immigration, and does no good to our community cohesion.
Mrs May
My right hon. Friend has made an extremely important point. We will do all that we can to ensure that people are aware of the rules that will operate—including, obviously, those who will put the rules into practice—so that everyone recognises the actions that the coalition Government are taking. The right hon. Gentleman referred specifically to councils. In my response to the urgent question, I mentioned the new guidance that will be issued by the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government concerning the residency in the community test for access to social housing. We will ensure that those who need to know what action we are taking are given a full picture of what the Government are doing to address an issue that is of concern to them.
Susan Elan Jones (Clwyd South) (Lab)
Can the Home Secretary tell us whether there will be larger fines for breaches of the national minimum wage legislation, and can she confirm that those arrangements will be in place by 1 January next year?
Robert Halfon (Harlow) (Con)
My Harlow residents will welcome the measures announced by my right hon. Friend because they are entirely fair, but will not many hard-working immigrants who do not claim handouts from the British taxpayer welcome them as well, because they create a level playing field?
Mrs May
My hon. Friend has put his finger on an important point. What we are doing is fair to the hard-working people who have come to the UK legally, played by the rules and done the right thing. It is every bit as frustrating for them to see people coming here and abusing and playing the system. That is another reason why it is absolutely right for us to take this action.
Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab)
None of us believes everything we read in the newspapers, but there have been reports of British recruitment agencies working in Romania and Bulgaria actively to recruit people to come here in January. What steps are the Home Secretary and other members of her Government taking to deal with that?
Mrs May
I recognise the issue that the hon. Lady has raised. If recruitment agencies were attempting to recruit only from certain countries, such as Romania and Bulgaria, that would be discriminatory and against the law. The Minister for Immigration is taking that matter up with the Equality and Human Rights Commission, which is the relevant enforcement body.
Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con)
The only way for the Home Secretary to deal with the problem of thousands of people coming to this country from Romania and Bulgaria is to extend the transitional arrangements, and it would be perfectly legal for her to do so. My private Member’s Bill, which has its Second Reading this Friday, would do exactly that, and by the end of a five-year extension, the referendum would have taken place. I urge my right hon. Friend to be here on Friday if she can, and to support my Bill.
Mrs May
I should make it clear to my hon. Friend that when he sees me here on Friday, it might have something to do with another private Members’ Bill that is being debated on that day. It is an important Bill that will put in place the legislation on the EU referendum, which we are clear that we should have.
Nick Smith (Blaenau Gwent) (Lab)
Which of the benefit changes that have been identified today will not be ready on 1 January?
Mrs May
I have indicated that the habitual residence test will be available from 1 January, and that the measures for those people who will be removed—[Interruption.] The hon. Gentleman asked which measures would not be ready. He can work it out for himself, because I have told him which one will be in place on 1 January.
Jacob Rees-Mogg (North East Somerset) (Con)
I am sorry to have to ask the same question for about the sixth time. It is open to the Government to abrogate their treaty obligations, and it is open to the House to legislate. The free movement of people is no longer working in the interests of this nation, so why do Her Majesty’s Government lack the political will to change the law?
Mrs May
I am tempted to say that I suspect my hon. Friend was not sorry to have to ask that question for a sixth time. I have answered it in relation to an earlier question. The Government are taking steps to ensure that we can do what we believe to be necessary to address the issue of the removal of transitional controls on people coming from Romania and Bulgaria. I hope that my hon. Friend understands the intentions and good faith behind what the Government have done across the immigration system over the past three and a half years. We have explored every possible avenue to do everything we can to repair the damage, mentioned by my hon. Friend the Member for Northampton North (Michael Ellis), that was done by the last Labour Government’s policies.
Ian Austin (Dudley North) (Lab)
I welcome the restrictions, because I have long felt that rules designed for an EU made up of a small number of advanced economies cannot really work for a much bigger organisation. Given the Home Secretary’s admission that the new rules on the national minimum wage will not be in force on 1 January, however, why will she not introduce legislation now to make the necessary changes more quickly?
Mrs May
We will bring forward the various legislative requirements as and when the time to do so is appropriate. We are looking across the board in dealing with these issues. Some measures will be in place, and some regulatory changes will take place before the end of this term and before the Christmas recess. The Government are taking action.
Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con)
My constituents are getting thoroughly fed up with being told what to do by EU officials on the radio this morning and elsewhere. Can the Home Secretary decide what will happen in the UK in future without interference from the EU?
Mrs May
My hon. Friend’s constituents might be interested to hear that we will find ourselves in considerable disagreement with the European Union over a number of the measures that we are taking. We are prepared to take those measures, however, because we believe that they are right for this country.
Mr John Denham (Southampton, Itchen) (Lab)
As I think the Home Secretary has acknowledged, the majority of people who come here will not get on a coach or a plane on spec. They will be recruited by agencies that have offered them jobs with British employers, probably with an additional offer of accommodation. With just a month or so to go, will she tell us what she has done to identify the agencies that are recruiting in that way and the employers that are offering those jobs? Will she also make it perfectly clear that the slightest breach of regulations on the minimum wage, health and safety, accommodation, benefits or anything else will be met with the full force of the law by the Government from the very first stage? Simply referring such cases to the Equality and Human Rights Commission will not be good enough.
Mrs May
First, I did not acknowledge that the majority of people would be recruited in that way. I accepted that there had been stories about recruitment agencies undertaking that sort of operation, and I indicated clearly that the relevant enforcement body was the EHRC. The Government are taking this issue up with the EHRC.
Nigel Mills (Amber Valley) (Con)
If the accession treaty had allowed the restrictions to continue beyond the end of this year, would it have been the Government’s policy to seek such an extension? If so, would the Home Secretary consider accepting the new clause that I have tabled to the Immigration Bill, which would achieve precisely that?
Mrs May
We believe that it is right to look at the way in which transitional controls operate because there should be more flexibility for member states in the exercise of those controls. At the moment, we have only the rather blunt instrument of an extension of a particular number of years. That is why it is important that free movement should form part of the renegotiation process. The Government should look at all options in seeking to deal with this issue.
Charlie Elphicke (Dover) (Con)
My constituents in Dover will welcome the robust action that the Home Secretary is taking to crack down on welfare tourism, but will she note that some people have been going round my constituency and elsewhere in east Kent saying that 29 million people will turn up when the restrictions are lifted? What does she make of those claims?
Mrs May
It behoves all of us to speak on this important issue in a measured and sensible way. This is a matter of grave concern, and the people who are going round making exaggerated claims of that nature do a disservice to all of us, especially those of us in the Government who are taking measures that will have an impact on the people coming here and measures to reduce the pull factors. We are also taking wider measures in the Immigration Bill to ensure that people who come here cannot use our public services without contributing to them.
Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con)
I welcome the statement. I happily voted for the Immigration Bill, and the Opposition would have more credibility on this issue had they done so as well. Has the Home Secretary sought and received any guidance from her Department on extending the transitional arrangements, on how long the infraction procedure would take and on the likelihood and amount of any fines?
Mrs May
I thank my hon. Friend for reminding us of the Opposition’s failure to support the provisions in the Immigration Bill. Had they given that support, the shadow Secretary of State’s contribution today might have had a little more credibility. Given my hon. Friend’s background, he will know the legal position on the accession treaty. As I have said, the Government are taking every step they can and looking at all the issues in dealing with this matter.
Nick de Bois (Enfield North) (Con)
I welcome the tone and content of the Home Secretary’s statement, which are in stark contrast to this morning’s reference by EU Commissioner Andor to “hysteria” in Britain’s reaction to the lifting of the transitional controls. Does that reference not underline how remote the EU institutions are from the British public and the British Government’s needs? Does it not also explain why so many of us in this House want the Government to seize back the transitional controls?
Mrs May
I fully appreciate the point that my hon. Friend is making and I fully appreciate that when statements such as the one he mentions are made, people feel strongly about the Commission’s attitude on this matter. As I indicated earlier, I think the point for the Commission is very simple: if it thinks this is simply an issue about the position being taken by the United Kingdom, it is wrong. Other member states, such as Germany, the Netherlands and Austria, are also concerned about this issue of free movement and the problems that now arise with free movement. The European Commission is beginning to find that it is on the wrong side of the argument. It makes statements such as that one, but we will continue to impress on it that this issue is important for member states across the European Union—although of course this Government’s main concern is for people here in the UK.
Domestic Violence
Baroness May of Maidenhead Excerpts(11 years, 1 month ago)
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The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
I am announcing today my intention to roll out nationally both domestic violence protection orders (DVPOs) and the domestic violence disclosure scheme (DVDS) across England and Wales from March 2014. This follows the successful conclusion of two pilots to test these provisions. Tackling domestic violence and abuse is one of my key priorities. I am determined to see reductions in domestic violence and abuse and the Government’s updated violence against women and girls (VAWG) action plan sets out our approach for achieving that. The Government are committed to ensuring that the police and other agencies have the tools necessary to tackle domestic violence, to bring offenders to justice, and to ensure victims have the support they need to rebuild their lives.
Domestic violence protection orders are a new power introduced by the Crime and Security Act 2010, and enable the police to put in place protection for the victim in the immediate aftermath of a domestic violence incident. Under DVPOs, the perpetrator can be prevented from returning to a residence and from having contact with the victim for up to 28 days, allowing the victim a level of breathing space to consider their options, with the help of a support agency. This provides the victim with immediate protection. If appropriate, the process can be run in tandem with criminal proceedings.
The domestic violence disclosure scheme introduces a framework with recognised and consistent processes to enable the police to disclose to the public information about previous violent offending by a new or existing partner where this may help protect them from further violent offending. The DVDS introduces two types of process for disclosing this information. The first is triggered by a request by a member of the public (“right to ask”). The second is triggered by the police where they make a proactive decision to disclose the information in order to protect a potential victim (“right to know”). Both processes can be implemented within existing legal powers.
Deportation with Assurances Policy
Baroness May of Maidenhead Excerpts(11 years, 1 month ago)
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The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
Deportation with assurances (DWA) enables us to deport foreign nationals suspected of terrorism in compliance with our obligations under the European Convention on Human Rights, the UN Convention on Torture and the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights.
The independent reviewer of terrorism legislation, Mr David Anderson QC, has accepted my invitation to undertake a review of our DWA policy. He will review the framework of the UK’s DWA policy and make recommendations on how the policy might be strengthened or improved, with particular emphasis on its legal aspects. The principle of DWA has been upheld by the European Court of Human Rights. To avoid duplicating or prejudicing the work of the courts, the review will not consider the merits of individual cases. Copies of the terms of reference for the review are available in the Vote Office.
When completed Mr David Anderson’s report will be laid before the House and copies will be available in the Vote Office. Following consultation with other relevant Departments and agencies, I will publish the Government’s response as a Command Paper in due course and this will be made available in the Vote Office.
Daniel Morgan (Independent Panel)
Baroness May of Maidenhead Excerpts(11 years, 1 month ago)
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The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
I announced in a written ministerial statement on 10 May 2013, Official Report, column 17WS, the creation of the Daniel Morgan independent panel, to be chaired by Sir Stanley Burnton.
Sir Stanley Burnton informed me on 13 November of his decision to resign as chairman of the panel for personal reasons.
The work of the panel will continue and announcements about any further appointments will follow in due course.
The Morgan family has been informed of Sir Stanley’s decision and remains fully supportive of the panel process.
Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed
Baroness May of Maidenhead Excerpts(11 years, 1 month ago)
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Mrs May
On the last points, Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed is indeed a British citizen. I do not have his passport, but the police do. I know the right hon. Gentleman raised the same issue over the Magag case. On tags, as I said earlier, the police believe that, in this case, the tag functioned exactly as it should have done. He referred to the court case. The issue there was not about the effectiveness of the tags, but about reaching the evidence threshold for taking a criminal prosecution in relation to the operation of the tag.
[Official Report, 4 November 2013, Vol. 570, c. 27.]
Letter of correction from Theresa May:
An error has been identified in the answer given to the right hon. Member for Leicester East (Keith Vaz) on 4 November 2013.
The correct answer should have been:
Mrs May
On the last points, Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed is indeed a British citizen. I do not have his passport, Mohamed was not in possession of his British passport when he returned to the UK so there was no passport for the police to seize. I know the right hon. Gentleman raised the same issue over the Magag case. On tags, as I said earlier, the police believe that, in this case, the tag functioned exactly as it should have done. He referred to the court case. The issue there was not about the effectiveness of the tags, but about reaching the evidence threshold for taking a criminal prosecution in relation to the operation of the tag.
Terrorism Legislation (Independent Reviewer Report)
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The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
The Government’s response to the report of Mr David Anderson QC on the operation in 2012 of the Terrorism Act 2000 and part 1 of the Terrorism Act 2006 is being published today.
I thank David Anderson QC for his report and have carefully considered the detailed commentary and observations made.
The Government’s response is available in the Vote Office and online.
Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed
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The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
With permission, Mr Speaker, I would like to make a statement on the abscond of an individual subject to a terrorism prevention and investigation measure, or TPIM. The Metropolitan police believe that on Friday 1 November, TPIM subject Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed absconded from his controls. He was last seen at 3.15 pm inside a mosque in Acton. The police counter-terrorism command immediately launched an intensive covert operation to trace Mohamed, and inquiries continue. Ports and borders were notified with his photograph, and details were circulated nationally and internationally.
Acting on police advice, on Saturday I applied to the High Court for an order protecting Mohamed’s anonymity to be lifted, in order to assist the police with their investigation. Last night, the police appealed for the public’s help in tracing him. The police have urged anyone who sees Mohamed or knows of his whereabouts not to approach him but to call 999 or contact the anti-terrorist hotline.
The police and Security Service have confirmed that they do not believe Mohamed poses a direct threat to the public in the UK. The reason he was put on a TPIM in the first place was to prevent his travelling to support terrorism overseas.
I have spoken several times over the weekend to the director general of the Security Service, Andrew Parker, and to the Metropolitan police assistant commissioner for specialist operations, Cressida Dick. I received another briefing earlier today. They have told me that they believe they have all the resources and support they need to carry out the manhunt. However, I will not hesitate to provide them with any additional assistance they require.
The whole House will join me in thanking the police and the Security Service for their continued efforts to keep our country safe. Their focus is to locate and arrest Mr Mohamed. They are doing everything in their power to apprehend him as quickly as possible. The Government will provide them with all the support they need. I commend this statement to the House.
Yvette Cooper (Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford) (Lab)
Parliament will be deeply concerned about the Home Secretary’s statement. Obviously, all hon. Members want the police and the Security Service to have all possible help to apprehend Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed as soon as possible. The Home Secretary says that Mr Mohamed poses no direct threat, even though he is widely reported in the media to have attended terror training camps, procured weapons and planned attacks. He has walked away from a terror suspect order in a very simple disguise, and the Home Secretary has no idea where he is. He is the second man in 10 months who has absconded while subject to a TPIM. There were only 10 such men to begin with, and two have now gone: one in a black cab and one in a disguise. The Opposition called for controls to be tightened, for the legislation to be revisited and for lessons to be learned. None of that has happened. The Home Secretary has done nothing.
Since control orders were strengthened some years ago, no one absconded—since 2007. Lord Carlile, the former counter-terror reviewer, has said:
“nobody absconded while subject to a relocation order”.—[Official Report, House of Lords, 8 January 2013; Vol. 742, c. 20.]
However, since the Home Secretary got rid of relocation orders and control orders and introduced the weaker TPIMs, two terror suspects have vanished. Ibrahim Magag was previously relocated to the west country. The Home Secretary’s decision brought him back, and he disappeared. Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed was previously relocated outside London. The Home Secretary’s decision brought him back and he, too, has disappeared. Her policies brought those two terror suspects back into contact with their old networks and with people who could help them to disappear, and made it easier for them to run off.
Last time the Home Secretary said there was plenty of money for the added surveillance needed, so was Mr Mohamed under active surveillance when he entered the mosque, or was it just ordinary CCTV? His case was in court on Friday—he was accused of tampering with his tag—but why did the Government drop the case? Were the tags faulty? Were there other charges?
The Home Secretary said that Mr Mohamed was under a TPIM to stop him travelling overseas. What did she plan to do next year when his and all the other TPIMs ran out?
TPIMs apply to a very small number of difficult cases. Everyone recognises that there is no perfect answer and that there will always be challenges, but this Home Secretary has made it easier for serious terror suspects to disappear. That is irresponsible. She was warned about changing the law and weakening controls. She was warned that more people would abscond and they have done so—twice—but still she will not act. The question on everyone’s lips is: how many more warnings does the Home Secretary need?
Mrs May
This is a serious issue, but the right hon. Lady’s response was beneath somebody who is supposed to understand these matters.
The right hon. Lady referred to the money available for surveillance. I understand that she briefed Sky News this morning that she would tell the House of Commons that there have been cuts to the funding for monitoring and surveillance. I notice that she has dropped that from her argument, because the truth, as she well knows, is that as part of the TPIM package the Government introduced in 2011 we did not cut the surveillance budget for the police and Security Service but increased it—by tens of millions of pounds per year. We did not cut the budgets for counter-terrorism, policing and the security service; we protected them.
The right hon. Lady asked about the lessons learned from the Magag case. I can confirm that there was a review of that case, which was shared with David Anderson, the independent reviewer of terrorism legislation, who mentioned it in his annual review. All the recommendations of that review have been acted on. I can also confirm that a similar review will be conducted of this case.
The right hon. Lady referred to the changes in TPIMs. They are, of course, time-limited, but time limits have nothing to do with this case, as the subject was still bound by the terms of his TPIM. What she never tells the House when she makes this point is that 43 people who were subject to control orders have now exited those control orders. The truth is that even before time-limited TPIMs were introduced, the courts would not allow people to be left permanently on control orders. When the Metropolitan Police Commissioner was asked whether he had concerns about time limits, he said:
“I do not think so.”
Mrs May
I will come on to the relocations.
The right hon. Lady talked about tagging. GPS tags are used to provide information on the location of TPIM subjects and the tags that are used for TPIMs are significantly better than the ones they replaced, which had no ability to track subjects outside their homes. In this case, the police believe that the tag functioned exactly as it should have done, but it will be one of the aspects considered as part of the review of the case, and I should tell the House that I have been advised that this abscond does not raise any new operational issues with the tags.
The right hon. Lady also talked about relocation, but she knows that if someone is determined to break the terms of their TPIM or control order, there is little to stop them doing so in one place or another. David Anderson, the independent reviewer of terrorism legislation, says:
“The only sure way to prevent absconding is to lock people up in a high security prison.”
Unless the right hon. Lady is proposing the introduction of such draconian laws—and I thought she had conceded long ago that 90 days was too long—she should accept what David Anderson says. There will always be the risk of an abscond.
The shadow Home Secretary talked about the control order regime as though it never allowed any absconding by its subjects, but during the six years that control orders existed, there were seven absconds and only one of those seven people was ever found again. The idea that somehow control orders prevented absconds is not true. Even if we wanted to go back to the days of control orders, we would not be able to do so. The powers available under control orders were being steadily eroded by the courts, and the system was becoming unviable. Unlike control orders, TPIMs have been upheld consistently by the courts, so we now have a strong and sustainable legal framework to handle terror suspects.
The police and security service have always said that there has been no substantial increase in overall risk since the introduction of TPIMs, and despite the implication of what the right hon. Lady said, we have increased by tens of millions of pounds the annual budget for surveillance by the police and security service—and we have also given them new powers. In April this year, in a written statement, I explained how we would use the royal prerogative to remove passports from British nationals whom we want to prevent from travelling abroad to take part in extremist activity, terrorism training or other fighting. That power has already been used on several occasions since it was introduced. As for foreign nationals, the Immigration Bill will make it easier for us to get them out of the country, By the way, the Opposition failed to vote for that Bill on Second Reading.
The idea that under this Government the police and Security Service have fewer powers to keep us safe is just wrong. The idea that they have less money to keep us safe is wrong. The right hon. Lady should take her responsibilities seriously and support the police and Security Service in the important work that they do.
Angie Bray (Ealing Central and Acton) (Con)
Acton is a diverse community. It is also, overwhelmingly, a peaceful and law-abiding community. At its centre sits a mosque well known for being moderate, mainstream and popular. However, I am aware of concerns about potential radicalisation of younger members of the community. Will my right hon. Friend tell me whether her Department had previous concerns about the An-Noor Masjid and Community centre, from which this young man was able to escape?
Mrs May
This is an issue to which my hon. Friend has paid much attention in her constituency. I understand that the mosque authorities have been co-operating with the police and we welcome that co-operation. She refers to radicalisation. Within our counter-terrorism strategy we have the Prevent strand, which is precisely to ensure that young people and others do not find themselves being radicalised, and that we can exercise interventions, particularly through the Channel programme, to help to stop that radicalisation taking place. As I said in relation to the mosque where this individual was last sighted, I am pleased that the mosque authorities have been co-operating with the police.
Mr Jack Straw (Blackburn) (Lab)
In the light of no abscondings under control orders in the five years from 2007 after they were strengthened, but two abscondings in the past 10 months since TPIMs, which the Home Secretary introduced, greatly weakened the controls on these individuals, does she not think that a little contrition rather than bombast would be appropriate in these circumstances? Does she not recognise that the fundamental responsibility of any Home Secretary is to take proper measures to protect the safety and security of the British people? She has failed to do so by acting irresponsibly in weakening the powers available to control terrorists.
Mrs May
May I first say to the right hon. Gentleman that this is my first opportunity in the Chamber to note that he has announced his retirement from politics? He has given many years of service to this House, to his constituents and to the Government in various roles. I am sure there are many people who will be sorry to see him go from this Chamber.
National security is always the Government’s first priority. The right hon. Gentleman quoted some figures. I have to say to him that, yes, there have been two absconds in the two years that TPIMs have been in place, but there were seven absconds in six years under control orders. As I made clear in my response to the shadow Home Secretary, the control order regime was gradually being eroded by the courts. What we now have under TPIMs is a legally supported regime that puts measures in place to control and provide for those individuals whom we cannot prosecute, but who present a risk. The best place for any individual who is a terrorist is behind bars.
Sir Gerald Howarth (Aldershot) (Con)
May I commend my right hon. Friend’s approach and urge her to go further in her robustness and scrap the Labour-introduced Human Rights Act 1998? While she is at it, will she follow the advice of our right hon. and learned Friend the Member for Rushcliffe (Mr Clarke) and have the burqa banned in this country? It is alien to our culture and has enabled this man to abscond.
Mrs May
I thank my hon. Friend. He and I, as Conservative Members, both stood on a manifesto at the general election to scrap the Human Rights Act. I expect to stand on that manifesto at the next general election; it will be a Conservative commitment. He asks about the burqa. I will repeat my position, which is one that I have made clear on previous occasions. First, I believe it is the right of a woman to choose how she dresses. We should allow women to be free to make that choice for themselves. There will be circumstances when it is right to ask for a veil to be removed—for example, at border security or perhaps in courts—and individual institutions, like schools, will make their own policies on dress. However, I fundamentally believe it is the right of a woman to be free to decide how to dress.
Keith Vaz (Leicester East) (Lab)
I welcome what the Home Secretary has said about the burqa. This is not a case where the burqa is responsible. I urge her to look at the role of G4S and the tags that have been provided. As she knows, last week a number of cases were dropped after the police found out that there was a suggestion that tags had been tampered with; in fact, it was a question of wear and tear. Will she please investigate this again, rather than just accept that assurance? Was Mr Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed a British citizen? If he was, when did he acquire citizenship, bearing in mind the fact that he was a supporter of al-Shabaab, and does she have his passport?
Mrs May
On the last points, Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed is indeed a British citizen. I do not have his passport, but the police do. I know the right hon. Gentleman raised the same issue over the Magag case. On tags, as I said earlier, the police believe that, in this case, the tag functioned exactly as it should have done. He referred to the court case. The issue there was not about the effectiveness of the tags, but about reaching the evidence threshold for taking a criminal prosecution in relation to the operation of the tag.[Official Report, 6 November 2013, Vol. 570, c. 1MC.]
Dr Julian Huppert (Cambridge) (LD)
I agree completely with the Home Secretary that people who have committed terrorism offences should be convicted and in jail. Does she agree, however, that to have forcible relocation for people not convicted of any offence is not only a bad idea, but deeply un-British?
Mrs May
As my hon. Friend knows, the TPIM legislation did not contain relocation provisions. As I indicated in a couple of earlier responses, gradually, over time, the courts were reducing the ability to use various measures within the control orders, and they made it clear that they were not orders on which people should be left indefinitely.
Mr David Winnick (Walsall North) (Lab)
Can we work on the reasonable assumption that the Home Secretary’s spin doctors will not shortly be telling us that this happened because of that wicked man Edward Snowden or that somehow The Guardian was responsible for what occurred?
Mr David Ruffley (Bury St Edmunds) (Con)
My right hon. Friend has protected surveillance budgets since she came into office and was the first Home Secretary to deport Abu Qatada. In short, she is a commendably tough Home Secretary. Will she allow me to say that as a result of those things, Government Members can trust her to find out what went on in this case and that we have 100% confidence in how she is running the show?
Hazel Blears (Salford and Eccles) (Lab)
This year, 12 people previously convicted under terrorism legislation will be released and on our streets. Early next year, the orders of many of those still on TPIMs will come to an end. The independent reviewer of terrorism legislation, David Anderson, has said it is
“tempting, in the most serious cases, to wish for longer”
than the two years under TPIMs, and has described those whose orders will expire as at
“the highest end of seriousness”.
What steps is the Home Secretary taking to manage the undoubted increase in risk that will result from those on TPIMs who have completed their sentences under terrorism legislation being released and walking our streets?
Mrs May
The right hon. Lady started by referring to people being released, but these were people who had come to the end of their sentence. That is what happens—it happens in the normal course of events—but for individuals who pose a terrorist risk, or who are suspected of posing a terrorist risk, the law enforcement agencies take appropriate measures to ensure the security and safety of the public. As I said, national security is the Government’s first concern.
Mark Pritchard (The Wrekin) (Con)
I offer the Home Secretary my full support. As she will know, under existing legislation, she has the power to revoke the British citizenship of somebody who holds dual citizenship. May I encourage her to undertake a review of all those in custody and under TPIMs who hold dual citizenship and to consider revoking their British citizenship so that we can deport them more freely back to their home countries?
Mrs May
I note the point that my hon. Friend makes. I think I am right in saying that the majority of individuals who are under TPIMs are British nationals. He is right to say that it is possible to revoke the British citizenship of someone who is a dual national, but we would have to ensure that we did not render anyone stateless in so doing. There are a number of people who are subject to TPIMs who are British nationals.
Paul Goggins (Wythenshawe and Sale East) (Lab)
With two suspects on the run, no powers of relocation and a number of the current orders due to end early next year, is it now the Home Secretary’s policy to phase out the use of TPIMs?
Mrs May
TPIMs remain on the statute book as a tool that can be used when it is most appropriate to do so. I am sure the right hon. Gentleman and I agree that we would prefer to see anyone who is in any way involved in terrorism being prosecuted, convicted and sent to jail. As David Anderson has said, the only really secure place for someone who is a terrorist is behind bars. TPIMs remain on the statute book as a tool to be used when it is operationally appropriate to do so.
Mr James Clappison (Hertsmere) (Con)
I also offer my full support to my right hon. Friend. Does she agree that we would do well to remember the long saga of detentions, control orders and absconding under the previous Government, following hard on the heels of the introduction of the Human Rights Act 1998, which has made it so difficult to deal with dangerous people in our society? Can we now expect some humility, common sense and realism from those on the Opposition Benches regarding their responsibility for that?
Mr Pat McFadden (Wolverhampton South East) (Lab)
The Home Secretary has sought to blame the courts for chipping away at the previous regime, but she cannot escape the fact that it was a deliberate decision by her and her Government to increase the freedoms of these terror suspects by granting them access to technology and removing the relocation power. The former independent reviewer of terrorism legislation, Lord Carlile, said today that the lack of a relocation power was
“always going to be a vulnerability in the way TPIMs operate”.
In the wake of this latest absconsion, will she now reconsider the sunset clause in relation to the remaining TPIMs? If not, will she acknowledge that, as a result of a deliberate political decision by her Government, the rest of the suspects will be released on to the streets without supervision in a few months’ time?
Mrs May
I will make two comments in response to the right hon. Gentleman’s question. First, he knows full well that when TPIMs were introduced, this Government increased the funding available to the police and the Security Service for surveillance to the tune of tens of millions of pounds a year. I pointed this out in an earlier response to the shadow Home Secretary. Secondly, he referred to time limits but, as I have said, 43 people were on control orders and all of them have now exited those controls.
Michael Ellis (Northampton North) (Con)
Will my right hon. Friend confirm that, under her leadership of the Home Office, despite the difficult times of austerity that we inherited from the previous Government, the funding in this area has increased, not decreased, as was suggested in duff information given to the media earlier? Will she also confirm that in May 2007, the then Labour Home Secretary had to come to the Chamber to explain why three men had escaped while under the control orders regime of the previous failed Government?
Mrs May
My hon. Friend has got his facts absolutely correct about those who absconded while under control orders. We have protected the funding for counter-terrorism policing and increased the funding for surveillance and other measures as part of the package relating to the introduction of TPIMs. As I said, that involves tens of millions of pounds a year.
Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab)
I should like to take the Secretary of State back to the answer she gave to the hon. Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert). What convictions have been obtained against Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed? What prosecutions are planned? Does she not think that there is something deeply dangerous about using the royal prerogative to bypass Parliament in order to take away someone’s nationality or access to a passport? Should not an element of accountability be essential in any democratic liberal society such as ours?
Mrs May
For those who are under TPIMs, and others, we make every effort to ensure that prosecutions take place whenever possible. I commend the Security Service in this regard. A number of individuals were prosecuted earlier this year for terrorism-related offences relating to significant plots. This shows the very good work that the police and the Security Service do on a daily basis to keep the public safe. I believe that it is appropriate to have slightly changed the ruling in relation to the interpretation of the exercise of the royal prerogative. It is important to have that measure available; and, as the hon. Gentleman will see from the fact that I am here at the Dispatch Box answering his question, I am also accountable to this House.
Mr Ben Wallace (Wyre and Preston North) (Con)
Unlike the shadow Home Secretary, I have actually taken part in surveillance operations, and it is incredibly hard to watch someone 100% of the time. To come here and try to blame the Home Secretary for what is probably an operational front-line challenge is to play politics with our forces of law and order. Does the Home Secretary agree that one way to improve the capability of our Security Service and police force—to improve surveillance or to get more convictions—would be to introduce the communications data Bill which Labour opposes and our coalition partners block?
Mrs May
I commend my hon. Friend for bringing his personal experience to the debate; he has more experience of participating in surveillance operations than I do. He is absolutely right that we ask our Security Service and law enforcement agencies to undertake difficult tasks and that they do an excellent job for us on a day-by-day basis; they are not, I think, often enough praised for the work they do. My hon. Friend is also right about the importance of communications data. I have been clear on many occasions, including in this Chamber, that I believe we need to increase the ability of our law enforcement and security and intelligence agencies to access the data that will enable them to investigate—but, crucially, in many cases, also to prosecute —those involved in terrorism and organised crime.
Steve McCabe (Birmingham, Selly Oak) (Lab)
The Home Secretary told us at the time of Ibrahim Magag’s escape that the security and surveillance elements of the TPIMs were specific to each individual package and subject to regular review. Is she in a position to tell us when the arrangements covering this individual were last reviewed?
Mrs May
The money made available both to the police and the Security Service was made available around the TPIMs package, and obviously there are a number of ways in which that funding will have been used to enhance their capabilities. As to the individuals under TPIMs, there are regular reviews of the nature of the measures attached to them. As I said, those reviews take place regularly and for every subject of a TPIM.
Mr David Nuttall (Bury North) (Con)
I thank the Home Secretary for her statement. Will she explain what action will be taken against Mr Mohamed to protect the public if he is caught?
Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)
Would not the difficult job of keeping up surveillance on these nine individuals who are subject to TPIMs be made easier if relocation orders were made available? Does the Home Secretary not understand that the British people would expect her at least to review these procedures in the light of the fact that all it seems necessary to do to evade them is either to hail a black cab or to dress up in a burqa?
Mrs May
I have made it absolutely clear that all the measures relating to individuals under TPIMs are regularly reviewed to ensure that they continue to be appropriate. We have made more funding available to the police and to the Security Service when the TPIMs were introduced—and that funding continues to the tune of extra tens of millions of pounds a year—to enhance their capabilities for dealing with these subjects. I remind the hon. Gentleman, furthermore, that the police and security services have to deal with a number of individuals, not simply those involved in TPIMs, and we saw some good prosecutions earlier this year of those who were involved in plots to cause significant harm to British citizens.
Christopher Pincher (Tamworth) (Con)
My right hon. Friend is quite right to point out that Labour’s control orders were failing. Their powers were being eroded by the courts and there were seven absconsions in six years. Further to the question from my hon. Friend the Member for Bury North (Mr Nuttall), will she say what might happen to those who may be assisting Mr Mohamed at the moment?
Mrs May
When it is possible to take criminal action against people who have been involved in criminal offences, we will expect appropriate action to be taken through prosecutions. As I have said this afternoon and on a number of other occasions, I believe that the best place for those who are involved in terrorism is behind bars.
Angela Smith (Penistone and Stocksbridge) (Lab)
Can the Home Secretary confirm that Mr Mohamed was previously relocated outside London?
Graham Evans (Weaver Vale) (Con)
Labour is the party of ID cards, dodgy dossiers and 90 days of detention without trial. Why would anyone heed Labour Members’ advice on security and the rule of law?
Mrs May
I thank my hon. Friend for reminding us of those facts. I believe that the very first Bill introduced by the present Government was the Bill to abolish the ID card scheme that the previous Government had introduced, and I am pleased to say that it was this Government who reduced the period of pre-charge detention from 28 days to 14—although, as my hon. Friend has reminded us, the last Labour Government discussed increasing it to as much as 90 days.
Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)
How many people under TPIMs does the Home Secretary need to lose before she reviews the policy of relocation?
Mrs May
The hon. Gentleman should bear in mind what I said earlier, which was a statement of fact: that over the years, the courts were beginning to erode the control orders that his party had introduced. We responded to that with a package of TPIMs legislation, and, crucially, by giving extra funding to our law enforcement and security services to help them do their job of keeping the public safe.
Bob Stewart (Beckenham) (Con)
The Human Rights Act seems to give succour to some terrorists. Is it not about time that we replaced it with a British Bill of Rights, which would probably protect our citizens much better?
Mrs May
As I have already made clear, I think that we should indeed consider replacing the Human Rights Act with a British Bill of Rights, and the Conservatives will take that policy to the next election. Meanwhile, I am taking the action that I can take to make it easier for us to deport foreign criminals in particular, and to ensure that certain aspects of the interpretation of the European convention on human rights reflect the will of this Parliament. As we know, this Parliament is on the people’s side, and that is where the law, and its interpretation, should be as well.
Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland) (Lab)
When did the Home Secretary know that Mohammed Ahmed Mohamed had become a British citizen, and when did she become aware of his terrorist activities?
Mrs May
I looked at the issue of the individual’s terrorist activities when the TPIM was placed on him. I do not have the information about when he became a British citizen in my mind at this moment, but I shall be happy to write to the hon. Gentleman and the Chairman of the Select Committee.
Stephen Phillips (Sleaford and North Hykeham) (Con)
My right hon. Friend said that the case would be submitted to the independent reviewer. Can she give us some idea of how long she expects him to take to make recommendations? Consistent with the robust position that she always takes in protecting the people of this country, can she confirm that, if necessary, she will announce further measures to the House to ensure that terrorists who cannot be prosecuted are dealt with properly and the public are protected?
Mrs May
As I said earlier, national security and the protection of the public are always at the forefront of the Government’s mind when we are considering these issues.
I am grateful to my hon. and learned Friend for enabling me to clarify something that I said earlier, which his question suggests may have led to some misunderstanding. The review in the case of Ibrahim Magag was undertaken by the Home Office, but it was overseen by the independent reviewer of terrorism legislation. It is not in his remit actually to review, but he looked at the Home Office review and said that it was thorough, and I expect him to look at the review that will be undertaken in this case as well.
Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab)
To be honest, it is not that easy to balance the conflicting interests of security and individual liberty and freedom, but what really worries me about the attitude the Home Secretary has presented today is that she seems to think that these two men came up with some phenomenally cunning plan. One of them jumped in a black cab and the other slipped on a burqa. Surely she understands that the others will probably be laughing in her face.
Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con)
In August 2011 the Home Secretary told Parliament in an oral statement that she was going to change the law relating to face coverings. If that had happened—or, indeed, if the Bill of my hon. Friend the Member for Kettering (Mr Hollobone) banning face coverings in public had been introduced—she would not have had to come to the House today. Has she changed her mind on that policy?
Mrs May
We did indeed consult on the issue of face coverings, but that was about not the wearing of the burqa but the powers available to the police in circumstances such as mass demonstrations and riots where people are covering their faces, and whether the police needed any further powers. The police were clear that the powers available to them were sufficient for them to be able to deal with such circumstances in future, which is why we did not bring forward any legislation on that matter.
Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab)
I commend the Home Secretary in at least one respect today: her generous words for my right hon. Friend the Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw) may cause him to pause and think that perhaps he will not depart this place, but will instead stand again. However, in the light of there having been two absconders within 10 months, should the Home Secretary not consider whether the measures she has put in place might be improved?
Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con)
Given that the burqa is mediaeval, sexist and oppressive and given that, as we now know, it represents the easiest and most complete disguise for a Muslim terrorist suspect, will the Secretary of State reconsider her opposition to my Face Coverings (Prohibition) Bill? May I also say to her that this is not about telling women what to wear: first, because we now know that men wear burqas as well as women; and secondly, because this issue is about somebody concealing their identity, and such a law must cover both balaclavas and burqas?
Mrs May
Despite my hon. Friend’s best efforts, my position on this issue has not changed in the last half-hour. I continue to believe in relation to the burqa and niqab that it is for an individual woman to decide how she chooses to dress. Women should be free to make that choice for themselves. There will be circumstances in which it is appropriate to require somebody to remove a face covering: that could be in court, as we have seen in a number of instances; it could be at the border, for security purposes; and individual institutions such as schools should make their own policy in relation to dress that they consider appropriate in their institution. I continue to hold the view that it is not for the Government to tell women how to dress.
Mr Speaker
Order. None of us wishes unduly to embarrass the right hon. Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw), but following the Home Secretary’s most gracious tribute to him, may I say—on behalf, I think, of Members throughout the House—that the way in which, after 30 years of uninterrupted service on the Front Bench, the right hon. Gentleman has shown his continuing respect for Parliament and enjoyed something of a Back-Bench renaissance over the last three years is hugely respected in all parts of the Chamber?
Scotland Analysis: Security
Baroness May of Maidenhead Excerpts(11 years, 1 month ago)
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The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
The UK Government have today published the seventh paper in their Scotland analysis programme, “Scotland analysis: security”. This series of publications is designed to inform the debate on Scotland’s future within the United Kingdom ahead of next year’s referendum.
The “Scotland analysis: security” paper analyses the UK’s approach to security and the potential consequences of Scottish independence. Scotland and its people are an integral part of the UK’s national security, and the UK Government believe both that Scotland is better off as part of the UK, and that the UK is stronger, safer and more secure with Scotland as part of it.
The first duty of any state is the defence of its territory and institutions, and the protection of its citizens and property from both internal and external sources of threat or harm. As a part of the Union, Scotland benefits from the full spectrum of capabilities available to the UK’s security, intelligence and law enforcement agencies.
There is greater security through integrated UK-wide security and intelligence agencies with global reach. The UK’s security and intelligence agencies protect against terrorism and espionage, enable the collection of secret foreign intelligence, and make possible intelligence gathering through the monitoring of communications. An independent Scottish state would lose automatic access to UK intelligence, impacting on its ability to counter espionage and hostile foreign intelligence activity as well as terrorism.
We are better protected through enhanced justice and policing capabilities and international partnerships to tackle serious and organised crime. Long-established UK-wide laws facilitate the cross-border pursuit of justice despite different legal systems and police jurisdictions. This works with the minimum of bureaucracy and more quickly and efficiently than is possible between EU states. Independence would see the existing powers lapse, impacting negatively on an independent Scotland’s ability to pursue justice across borders.
There is greater resilience through UK-wide cyber security, chemical, biological, radiological and nuclear (CBRN) response and border protection arrangements. The UK’s £860 million cyber security programme delivers enhanced cyber security for the benefit of the whole of the UK, which leads other G20 countries in its ability to withstand cyber attacks.
The UK Government also maintain a number of capabilities to deal with CBRN devices as well as explosive materials.
Scotland also benefits from a nationally run scheme to prevent both specified foreign national passengers travelling to the UK and British nationals boarding flights when assessed to pose a threat to that aircraft. An independent Scottish state would be responsible for its own border security.
More broadly, and in support of many of the security capabilities I have outlined here and which are detailed in the paper itself, Scottish security and resilience companies currently stand to benefit from HMG’s efforts to increase global UK security exports. The security and resilience industry in Scotland is estimated to generate over £200 million per annum and employ over 2,000 people. UK Government efforts to promote Scottish security firms overseas would cease in the event of independence; a significant potential loss to this important element of the Scottish economy.
In the event of a vote in favour of leaving the UK, Scotland would become an entirely new state and would have to establish its own security arrangements. The start-up costs and complexity of establishing separate intelligence, border and CBRN capabilities would be very significant. It would cease to enjoy the influence that derives from the UK’s established status as a key player within the international system and the opportunities this offers to advance the security and prosperity objectives of the UK including Scotland.
Future papers from the Scotland analysis programme will be published over the course of 2013 and 2014 to ensure that people in Scotland have access to the facts and information ahead of the referendum.
Oral Answers to Questions
Baroness May of Maidenhead Excerpts(11 years, 1 month ago)
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Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab)
1. What support her Department provides for sanctuary schemes for victims of violence.
The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
The Government have put stable funding in place, ring-fencing nearly £40 million for specialist local domestic and sexual violence support services, rape crisis centres, and national helplines. Decisions on whether to fund the provision of sanctuary schemes for victims of violence are for local authorities, based on their assessment of local need.
Kerry McCarthy
I thank the Home Secretary for that response, but I understand that funding for sanctuary schemes has fallen by over a third under this Government. Freedom of information requests have shown that about 21% of victims of domestic violence who make use of such schemes are now falling foul of the bedroom tax. Does the Home Secretary think that such people, who are in a place where they are safe from their abuser, should be evicted because of the bedroom tax?
Mrs May
The sanctuary schemes obviously have value for a number of people. They are not right for everybody, but for those for whom they work, such schemes are important when put in place. Latest statistics show that last year, 2012-13, 7,100 households had homelessness prevented or relieved thanks to the installation of a sanctuary scheme—a 17% rise on the previous year. On the spare room subsidy, the Government are providing baseline funding of £20 million annually to the discretionary housing payment scheme, which is available to local authorities to help people in such circumstances. The Government have also provided an additional £25 million per annum on top of the baseline funding until the end of the spending review period.
Mr James Gray (North Wiltshire) (Con)
In addition to sanctuaries, which are terribly important, does the Home Secretary agree that it is time to re-examine sentencing guidelines on domestic abuse? In one case in my constituency, the ex-husband, who has been convicted twice of domestic abuse, is now living in the same estate as his terrified ex-wife, and no custodial sentence was handed down. Surely such a person should be in prison.
Mrs May
My hon. Friend makes an interesting point, and the Minister for Policing, Criminal Justice and Victims is sitting on the Front Bench and will have heard that question in relation to responsibilities of the Ministry of Justice. Importantly, I have asked Her Majesty’s inspectorate of constabulary to look at the policing of domestic violence, and we must examine how the police respond to such incidents. I am pleased that the Government have introduced a number of pilot schemes and are considering various ways that victims of domestic violence can be further protected. Domestic violence protection orders, for example, enable the victim to remain in their home, rather than the perpetrator remaining and the victim being forced out.
Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)
Last week I wore pink, in common with 100 others in Lichfield—pink trousers, pink shirt, pink feather boa—to walk for the Pathway project in my constituency. It looks after those—not only women, but men too—who suffer from domestic violence. Will the Home Secretary or one of her team please come to Lichfield to see the good work the Pathway project is doing?
Mr Speaker
The hon. Gentleman must have looked even more exotic than usual.
Mrs May
I know that my hon. Friend has a fondness for taking photographs, and I wonder whether he has taken a photograph of himself that could perhaps be circulated to Members of the House for their edification. He makes an important point, however, and I commend the Pathway project in Lichfield. I have noted the hon. Gentleman’s invitation, as has the Minister for Crime Prevention, for one of us to come and visit. May I say what excellent work people in the Pathway project and similar schemes are doing on this important issue?
Dr Phillip Lee (Bracknell) (Con)
2. What assessment she has made of the latest crime figures.
The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
Our police reforms are working and crime is falling. Recorded crime has fallen by more than 10% under this Government, and the independent crime survey shows that crime has more than halved since its peak in 1995.
Mrs May
I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend. Both our constituencies are served by Thames Valley police, and I am pleased that since 2010, crime has fallen by 25% in the Thames Valley police area, including a fall of 30% in my constituency. My hon. Friend is right. Those who said that when police budgets were cut the only thing that would happen would be for crime to go up have been proved wrong. I commend the work of all the police officers and staff who have contributed to those good crime figures.
Fiona Mactaggart (Slough) (Lab)
There has been a 30% increase in reports of rape, and yet a dramatic fall in the number of rape cases referred for prosecution. What is the Home Secretary doing about that?
Mrs May
The hon. Lady is right to draw attention to that—we need to look at the matter very seriously. I am happy to say that the Minister for Crime Prevention is doing so. In addition, the Home Office has sat round the table with national policing leads and the Crown Prosecution Service to consider why we are seeing that most recent trend, and to develop a plan for ensuring that cases are referred to the CPS when it is right to do so.
Duncan Hames (Chippenham) (LD)
The 12% fall in crime excluding fraud will be welcomed in Wiltshire by my constituents, but businesses repeatedly find themselves victims of seemingly invisible but none the less criminal behaviour online. What support is being given to businesses to tackle those online thefts?
Mrs May
First, the Office for National Statistics now includes figures on fraud reported to Action Fraud in the police recorded crime count. That is an important step forward—we now get a more accurate picture. Crucially, following the launch of the new National Crime Agency, we have established within it an economic crime command, which will enhance our ability in this country to deal with a variety of economic and financial crimes, including the fraud my hon. Friend describes.
Emily Thornberry (Islington South and Finsbury) (Lab)
The Home Secretary will be aware not only that rape statistics have gone up, but that the figures for child abuse have gone up hugely as well. Five years ago, 50% of rape offences were referred to the CPS, but now only 30% of rape and abuse of children offences are referred. What will the Home Secretary do about that? Does she believe that 20% cuts to the police might have something to do with it?
Mrs May
No, I do not accept the premise on which the hon. Lady’s question is based. We are looking very seriously at the question of child abuse. That is why my right hon. Friend the Minister for Policing, Criminal Justice and Victims was involved in setting up a group across Departments on the question of child abuse and child sexual exploitation to ensure we can deal as effectively as possible with that most horrific crime.
Mr David Ruffley (Bury St Edmunds) (Con)
Crime will fall even further if we can make bigger reductions in police bureaucracy. Front-line officers using body-worn cameras have the potential to reduce the amount of paperwork they have to do back at the station. Will my right hon. Friend indicate how many police hours she believes could be saved by that new technology, which has been endorsed recently by the Minister for Policing, Criminal Justice and Victims?
Mrs May
My hon. Friend makes an extremely important point. I had informal discussions about the use of body-worn cameras at the college of policing last week. I am pleased to say that a number of forces have piloted the use of such cameras. The college will look at best practice so it can ensure they are used as effectively as possible. They will not only reduce the bureaucracy that the police are involved with, but provide greater and enhanced ability to deal with crimes and provide the evidence in criminal circumstances. They will also benefit officers when accusations are made about their behaviour—often, the body-worn camera will show when such accusations are not correct.
Jack Dromey (Birmingham, Erdington) (Lab)
Crime has fallen overall thanks to the development of neighbourhood policing under a Labour Government. With the thin blue line stretched ever thinner, there are disturbing signs of a generation of progress in some areas being reversed. Since the general election, shoplifting is up in 23 police areas and mugging is up in 15 police areas. There has been a staggering 44% increase in mugging in London. Does the Home Secretary therefore share the concerns of Her Majesty’s inspectorate of constabulary that that which has proved to be so successful and is so valued by communities throughout our country—neighbourhood policing—“risks being eroded”?
Mrs May
May I first welcome the hon. Gentleman to his new role on the Opposition Front Bench? I am not sure that his question was the best approach for him to take. I am very sorry that he has failed to recognise the work being done by police officers and staff around the country to ensure that overall levels of crime have fallen since 2010. I would hope he welcomes the work they are doing. HMIC has made it clear that forces, in taking the budget cuts, have focused on ensuring front-line resilience. That is a very good example of how it is possible to do more for less.
Mr Jonathan Djanogly (Huntingdon) (Con)
5. What steps she is taking to restrict immigration routes into the UK without limiting the ability of UK universities to attract international students.
Justin Tomlinson (North Swindon) (Con)
10. What steps she is taking to address domestic violence.
The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
Domestic violence is a dreadful form of abuse and is totally unacceptable. Our approach to tackling it is set out in the Government’s updated violence against women and girls action plan. Key initiatives include piloting domestic violence protection orders, which I referred to in a previous answer, and a domestic violence disclosure scheme. We have also extended the definition of domestic violence to include 16 and 17-year-olds and to include the use of coercive control.
Justin Tomlinson
I have visited the women’s refuge in Swindon and was extremely impressed by the help and facilities that it provides. What steps is the Home Secretary taking to support the work of those vital safe havens for victims of domestic violence across the country?
Mrs May
Like my hon. Friend, I pay tribute to all those who work in refuges and provide refuge for the victims of domestic violence. They are predominantly for women, as the majority of such victims are women, but we must never forget that men can also be the victims of domestic violence, as my hon. Friend the Member for Lichfield (Michael Fabricant) said earlier. The Government are providing stable funding of £40 million to support specialist domestic and sexual violence services, such as the independent domestic violence advisers who offer further valuable support to victims.
Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab)
The last Girl Guides survey showed that 5% of girls thought it was okay to be threatened with violence for spending too much time with friends, and that 25% thought it was okay for a person’s partner to check up on them and read their texts. What are the Government doing to combat domestic violence by educating young people, particularly young women, about what is acceptable in relationships, and—
Mrs May
Although cut off in her prime, the hon. Lady makes an important point. It is shocking to see the number of girls and young women—and, indeed, the number of boys and young men—who think that violence in a relationship is okay and part of a relationship. She is absolutely right that we must do what we can to educate young people about what a proper relationship should be and what should not be part of it. That is why the Home Office has supported a very successful national teenage rape prevention campaign, which we were able to extend into a teenage relationship abuse campaign. The figures and responses show that those campaigns have had a real impact on young people’s understanding of the nature of relationships.
Andrew Stephenson (Pendle) (Con)
19. Victims of domestic violence in my constituency sometimes find the first step of talking to someone about it to be the hardest one to take. Residents are well served by the Pendle domestic violence initiative helpline, as well as the national domestic violence helpline. Will my right hon. Friend tell us what she is doing to ensure that the victims of domestic violence are aware of these helplines, which provide them with valuable support at the time they need it most?
Mrs May
My hon. Friend is absolutely right to commend the work of those who provide helplines, and I would like to congratulate him on the success of the Pendle domestic violence initiative. Helplines indeed play an important role in supporting the victims of domestic and sexual violence. That is why the Home Office provides £900,000 to five national helplines each year. We take every opportunity to publicise these helplines, and we have done so through the two campaigns to which I referred in my previous answer—the teenage rape prevention campaign and the relationship abuse campaign. It is important to keep telling people about the availability of these helplines.
Helen Jones (Warrington North) (Lab)
The Home Secretary is astonishingly complacent given that reported domestic violence has risen by 31% on her watch, while at the same time as funding for refuges and specialist advice has fallen by 31%, the number of independent domestic violence advisers is falling and specialist domestic violence courts are being axed. Is this a deliberate attempt to target the victims of this violence or does it simply show that she has no influence over her colleagues in other Departments?
Mrs May
First, I welcome the hon. Lady to her new role on the shadow Home Office Front Bench, but I have to say that I thought that the nature of that question was beneath her. [Interruption.] The hon. Lady says “facts” from a sedentary position, and she quoted a figure of 31%. I understand, however, that that came from a survey based on the average from 63 local authorities, and that survey did not take into account responses from 201 authorities that said cuts had not been made in their provision. If the hon. Lady wants to cite facts, I suggest she looks at them more carefully in future. This Government take domestic violence very seriously. That is why it is this Government who have put in place stable funding of £40 million and why under this Government rape crisis centres are opening, when under the last Labour Government they closed.
Mr Michael McCann (East Kilbride, Strathaven and Lesmahagow) (Lab)
13. What recent assessment she has made of the level of referrals from the police to the Crown Prosecution Service for domestic violence offences.
Lorely Burt (Solihull) (LD)
T1. If she will make a statement on her departmental responsibilities.
The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
May I first thank and congratulate the police, and, indeed, all the other emergency services, on the excellent work they have been doing overnight and continue to do today for the victims of the terrible storm?
Earlier this month the new National Crime Agency was launched to lead the UK’s fight against serious and organised crime. For the first time we have a single national agency harnessing intelligence in order relentlessly to disrupt organised criminals at home and abroad. I have also announced that we will introduce in this Parliament a modern slavery Bill, which will include measures to send the strongest possible message to criminals: “If you’re involved in the disgusting trade in human beings, you will be arrested, prosecuted and locked up.” Modern slavery is an appalling evil in our midst and no man, woman or child should be left to suffer through this terrible crime. Finally, I have recently introduced an Immigration Bill which will stop immigrants using certain services where they are not entitled to do so, reduce the pull factors which encourage people to come to the UK, and make it easier to remove people who should not be here.
Lorely Burt
On the last point, what is the Secretary of State doing to ensure that her plans to introduce charges for foreign nationals using the NHS will not deter bright young talent from coming here to work or study?
Mrs May
My hon. Friend is right to draw attention to the fact that in the Immigration Bill, we will ensure not only that a better process will be put in place to deal with situations where people come here for a very short time, use the NHS and should be charged but the charges are not being retrieved, but that those who come for a temporary period and may use the NHS will actually contribute to the NHS. That is only fair to hard-working people up and down the country. We will be looking, in particular, at the issue of students, and we have been very clear that we will set the surcharge for the use of the NHS at a rate that is competitive, because a number of other countries across the world do exactly this and at a higher charge.
Yvette Cooper (Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford) (Lab)
I join the Home Secretary in thanking the police and all the emergency services for their excellent work in response to today’s storm. I know that the House will also want to send sympathies to the families of those who are reported to have tragically lost their lives as a result of the storm.
It is because the police do such a valued and vital job that it is also important to have effective investigations when things go wrong, so that they do not cast a shadow over the excellent work that so many police officers do each day. So does the Home Secretary agree that in order to do that, it is time to replace the police watchdog, the Independent Police Complaints Commission, with a new organisation with stronger powers?
Mrs May
I join the shadow Home Secretary in sending condolences to the families and friends of those who, it is reported, have lost their lives as a result of the storm, and she is right in saying that the whole House will wish to pass our sympathies on to those who have lost loved ones. On her question, I think it is right that we beef up the IPCC—that we give it a greater ability to deal with serious and sensitive cases and complaints that have been made against the police, rather than seeing so many of those complaints referred back to the police for their investigation. I think the public are concerned at the number of cases where they see the police investigating themselves, and the Government are committed to increasing resources at the IPCC. We have given it new powers and, if necessary, we will continue to do that.
Yvette Cooper
The Home Secretary’s response is welcome, but it does not go far enough. Let us consider some of the problems we have seen for the IPCC. So far, the IPCC has proved that it is powerless to direct action in the case of West Mercia police; it is powerless to get seven former police officers to come to interview over Hillsborough; and it is unable to keep the confidence of families over the Mark Duggan case, over undercover policing and Stephen Lawrence, or over the death of Ian Tomlinson. Surely the Home Secretary agrees that the public need to have confidence not only in the police, but in the watchdog, in order for an effective job to be done? The resources are not sufficient, and the watchdog needs the powers to be able to launch its own investigations and ensure that lessons are learnt. That is the best way to ensure that a shadow is not cast over the excellent work the police do. We have been urging her to do this for more than a year now, so why will she not introduce these reforms to give the watchdog the much stronger powers that it needs?
Mrs May
The right hon. Lady knows full well that not only the issue of the investigation of complaints against the police, but the whole question of the integrity of the police goes further than simply the IPCC. We have taken a number of steps: for example, the register of struck-off police officers, which will be introduced as a result of action taken by this Government. It is exactly the sort of thing that would have helped in respect of the police officer involved in the issue relating to the Ian Tomlinson death, to which she referred. This Government are taking action on the IPCC. We are going to increase the resources, we are increasing the powers for the IPCC and we will ensure that it will be investigating the serious and sensitive cases which currently are passed back to the police. I think it is right that these investigations are done by a body that is not the police themselves.
Mr Speaker
We need short questions and short answers. Let us be led by Mr Marcus Jones.
Ann McKechin (Glasgow North) (Lab)
T4. Will the Home Secretary confirm whether she has held any discussions with her fellow European Union Ministers on developing a common approach to how we will handle the increasing flood of Syrian refugees, particularly so that we can try to avoid disasters such as those we have witnessed in recent days?
Mrs May
A number of discussions have been held at EU level in relation to Syrian refugees both at the Justice and Home Affairs Council and at the European Council that took place at the end of last week, on which the Prime Minister will be making a statement after questions have finished. We have been considering, and the UK is supporting, a regional programme close to Syria to enable us to work with those countries that have borne the brunt of accepting refugees from Syria, to ensure that the right and appropriate support is given. The United Kingdom has given more humanitarian aid for Syrian refugees than all the other members of the European Union put together.
James Morris (Halesowen and Rowley Regis) (Con)
I recently took part in a knife crime summit in Birmingham following a series of incidents that have taken away more young lives. Does the Minister agree that stop-and-search powers for the police can be an effective way of clamping down on the carrying of knives in certain of our inner-city communities?
Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab)
T9. According to Refuge, three women a week commit suicide because of domestic violence and their abusers usually escape scot-free. Some campaigners are calling for a specific offence of liability for suicide to be introduced. What does the Home Secretary think is the answer?
Mrs May
Of course, it is horrific to see the number of women who die at the hands of their abusers or who commit suicide as a result of the abuse they are suffering. This is an issue we have looked at in the past, and for a variety of reasons we decided that we would not go ahead with the proposal the hon. Lady puts forward, but I am happy to look at the issue again.
Mr Ian Liddell-Grainger (Bridgwater and West Somerset) (Con)
One of the stubborn points that I hear from my constituents is that although crime is dropping, which is obviously welcome, rural crime is still not coming under control. Will the Minister please take a very close look at the police community support officers? Most of the stolen property turns up in Exeter or Bristol. If we had the resources for PCSOs, we would be able to detail a lot more of the thefts that are going on across places such as Exmoor, get some of the stuff back and deter these criminals if they thought they were going to get caught when they get back with the stuff that they had stolen.
Mr Nigel Dodds (Belfast North) (DUP)
A moment ago the Home Secretary welcomed the setting up of the National Crime Agency, as do I, but unfortunately, as she will know, in Northern Ireland it has been blocked by two parties. What steps is she taking in conjunction with the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and the Minister of Justice in Northern Ireland to address this very big failing in relation to tackling crime and criminal gangs in Northern Ireland?
Mrs May
The right hon. Gentleman raises an important point. We have had a number of discussions with both my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and the Minister of Justice in Northern Ireland on this matter. The National Crime Agency will be working with the Police Service of Northern Ireland on matters relating to serious and organised crime and all matters under the National Crime Agency’s responsibilities, and we continue to talk both to my right hon. Friend and to the Minister of Justice and look for a further way forward on this issue.
Julian Smith (Skipton and Ripon) (Con)
Following the disturbing reports in The Sun this morning about the impact of the Snowden files on our intelligence services, may I urge the Home Secretary to continue to balance national security with press freedom as she deals with this issue?
Mrs May
My hon. Friend has raised an important point, which he has rightly raised on a number of occasions in the House. It is important, of course, that we protect press freedom, but we also need to ensure that we are able to protect our national security and that we do not see information being published which could give any succour to those who wish to do us harm through terrorism.
Immigration Bill
Baroness May of Maidenhead Excerpts(11 years, 2 months ago)
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The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mrs Theresa May)
I beg to move, That the Bill be now read a Second time.
We have introduced a limit on economic migration from outside the EU, cut out abuse of student visas and reformed family visas. As a result, net migration is down by a third. Our objective—
Simon Danczuk
The Home Secretary says that net migration is down by a third; the reality is that it has fallen by only a quarter. The House of Commons Library has confirmed that, and the Government are at risk of misleading Parliament. Would the Home Secretary like to correct the record?
Mrs May
It is a bit cheeky for a Labour Member to stand up and complain about the figures for falling migration. Immigration is down since 2010 and net migration is down by a third from its peak in 2010.
Our objective remains to reduce annual net migration to the tens of thousands by the end of the Parliament, and we must also reform the immigration system that manages the flow of migrants in and out of the UK. When I addressed the House in March this year, I explained that the immigration system that we had inherited from the last Government was chaotic and dysfunctional. Having created a separate entity in the UK Border Force to get a grip on border checks, we were left with a UK Border Agency that still lacked transparency and accountability, and to tackle that I split the UK Border Agency into two distinct operational commands inside the Home Office—UK visas and immigration and immigration enforcement. I made it clear that while organisational reform was necessary to transform the way in which we dealt with immigration, it would not on its own be enough to achieve that goal. We also needed to update the IT infrastructure and to change the complicated legal and policy framework that so often worked against us. The Bill changes some of that legal and policy framework so that it will be possible for the immigration system to operate fairly and effectively.
Simon Hughes (Bermondsey and Old Southwark) (LD)
The Home Secretary was clearly right to intervene in the way she did to sort out UKBA, which was clearly dysfunctional, and that was the right move in the right direction. But those of us who are willing to give the Bill a Second Reading—I am one of them—have concerns that there was no draft Bill, no Green Paper and no White Paper; there was consultation on only part of the Bill, and there are sensitive areas that need to be looked at across the board, including in connection with the legal aid changes. Why do we have to deal so quickly with such sensitive and difficult issues?
Mrs May
It has been clear for some time, as I have laid out, that the Government want to bring forward legal and policy framework proposals to make sure that we can deliver for people in this country a fair approach on immigration, which ensures that those who come here and stay here and use our public services contribute, and that those who are here illegally can be removed more quickly. My right hon. Friend is a long-standing Member of the House and knows full well that there will be significant opportunities for discussion of this matter in Committee. I can assure him that there have already been a considerable number of discussions on the elements that have gone into the Bill. These are issues that have been addressed by Select Committees in the past.
Keith Vaz (Leicester East) (Lab)
We look forward to considering this again in the future. The BBC is reporting that the immigration vans that were introduced by the Government to go around certain cities to ask people to leave the country will no longer be rolled out. When she appeared before the Select Committee last Tuesday, she said that the vans were not her personal idea, but part of a package. Has she now seen the pilot and is she now telling the House that they will not be rolled out throughout the country?
Mrs May
What I said to the right hon. Gentleman was that I did not have a flash of blinding light one day and walk into the Home Office and say, “I know, why don’t we do this?” I have looked at the interim evaluation of the vans. Some returns were achieved, but politicians should be willing to step up to the plate and say when they think that something has not been such a good idea, and I think that they were too blunt an instrument. But we should also be absolutely clear about what used to happen under the last Government. If somebody came to the end of their visa, no one got in touch with them to say that they should no longer be staying here in the UK. That is now happening as a result of the changes to immigration enforcement. As a result of that work, during the last year some 4,000 people have left the UK. It is absolutely right that we do that, but we will not be rolling out the vans; they were too much of a blunt instrument.
Mr Lee Scott (Ilford North) (Con)
Does my right hon. Friend agree that if we are able, in a sensitive area, to stop some of the abuses, it will allow us to help the very people whom we all in this House want to help, instead of having our system abused?
Mr James Clappison (Hertsmere) (Con)
Is it not also the case that the previous Government not only did nothing to encourage people to leave the country when they had overstayed, but instituted a series of amnesties that undermined the credibility of the whole system for overstaying people?
Mrs May
I have taken a number of interventions and will now make some progress.
I will set out the elements of the Bill in context. First, the Bill will cut abuse of the appeal process. It will streamline the labyrinthine legal process, which at present allows appeals against 17 different Home Office decisions—17 different opportunities for immigration lawyers to cash in and for immigrants who should not be here to delay their deportation or removal. By limiting the grounds for appeal to four—only those that engage fundamental rights—we will cut that abuse.
Secondly, we will extend the number of non-suspensive appeals so that, where there is no risk of serious and irreversible harm, we can deport first and hear appeals later. We will also end the abuse of article 8. There are some who seem to think that the right to family life should always take precedence over public interest in immigration control and when deporting foreign criminals. The Bill will make the view of Parliament on the issue very clear. Finally, the Bill will clamp down on those who live and work in the UK illegally and take advantage of our public services. That is not fair to the British public and to the legitimate migrants who contribute to our society and economy.
Sarah Teather (Brent Central) (LD)
Did the Home Secretary take advice from colleagues in the Department for Education on the extent to which her definition of article 8 is compliant with our obligations under the UN convention on the rights of the child?
Mrs May
I can assure my hon. Friend that we have had a number of discussions with colleagues in the Department for Education on the operation of the proposals in the Bill. There is an agreement across the Government that we need to do precisely what I have just set out in response to my hon. Friend the Member for Ilford North (Mr Scott): we must ensure that we are fair to those people who come here legitimately and do everything the right way, but we must also make it easier to remove those people who do not have a right to be here.
Mrs May
I will make some progress before giving way again.
Part 1 of the Bill is about removals. The current process for enforcing the removal of people who are in the UK unlawfully is complex, with too many stages before an individual can be removed. With multiple decision points, the current system provides individuals with multiple opportunities to bring challenges throughout the process. That increases the risk of further delays before removal takes place. We want to adopt a system in which only one decision is made. That will inform the individual that they cannot stay in the UK, and enable immigration enforcement to remove them if they do not leave voluntarily.
The existing system, designed by the previous Government through eight different Acts of Parliament, does not work. It was inevitable that such a complex system would be exploited. The Bill remedies that. As well as delaying the removal process, some illegal migrants held in immigration detention may apply to an immigration judge for bail and then use it as an opportunity to disappear. Bail might be appropriate in some circumstances, but can it be appropriate to grant bail when a detainee is booked on a flight in the next few days and there are no exceptional circumstances? Should immigration detainees who have already been refused bail be permitted to make repeat applications day after day? The Bill will bring sense to the law in this area and stop that abuse.
Mr David Heath (Somerton and Frome) (LD)
The Home Secretary mentioned the eight previous Acts. During my time in the House it has seemed that we get a new immigration Bill at least every two years, and very few of them seem to have any long-lasting beneficial effect. Can she convince me that the Bill is not another example of the Home Office reaching for the statute book, rather than dealing with the management of the immigration service properly, and can she estimate how long we will have to wait for the next immigration Bill?
Mrs May
This is about putting in place a number of legal changes that will help ensure that the system can be better managed. Alongside that policy change, as I have evidenced in the fact that I have abolished the UK Border Agency and set up the two new commands within the Home Office, we are of course making changes in how we manage and administer the system to make it operate more smoothly and rather better.
Rehman Chishti (Gillingham and Rainham) (Con)
Will the Home Secretary confirm that limiting the number of bail applications that can be made is nothing new? Under the Bail Act 1976, the number of applications one can make in criminal cases is limited before exceptional circumstances have to be shown, so this is nothing new and we are simply improving the process.
Nicola Blackwood (Oxford West and Abingdon) (Con)
The Home Secretary is being generous in giving way. Does she agree that a process with so many in-built delays takes a toll not only on the taxpayer but on those going through the process, who have to live through so much uncertainty during that time? Does she also agree that if we are to require the decision makers to make a greater number of decisions earlier in the process, they will need to have greater expertise in order to do so?
Mrs May
We obviously want to ensure that those making the decisions do so properly. My hon. Friend is absolutely right that it is only fair to those who are making applications that they get a decision that has been properly considered within a reasonable space of time. Sadly, that was not happening in the system we inherited, so we are having to make a lot of changes. I have been clear that that change cannot take place within six months; it will take some time before we can see the system that everybody wants.
Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab)
With reference to the point the hon. Member for Somerton and Frome (Mr Heath) made about discussing numerous immigration Bills during his time in the House, along with the introduction of the UK Border Agency and the Australian-style points-based system and the huge reduction in the number of asylum seekers coming to this country, does that not make it absolutely clear that claims that the previous Labour Government were totally uninterested in immigration are total nonsense? We can argue about how effective the Acts were, but the fact that the previous Government came back so many times to discuss immigration makes it clear that they were very sensitive to the issue.
Mrs May
Unfortunately, the previous Labour Government were interested in immigration in the wrong way. One of the things this Government have had to do, for example, is root out abuse of student visa applications, which started under the previous Government’s points-based system. I will take no lectures about the previous Labour Government’s interest in immigration.
Mr David Ruffley (Bury St Edmunds) (Con)
In June 2003 the then Immigration Minister, Beverly Hughes, said that the impact on migration into Britain of 10 accession countries joining the European Union would be “minimal”, with 13,000 migrants expected a year. That was laughably inaccurate. Can the Home Secretary assure us that the Bill will ensure that there is no repeat of that shocking open-door immigration policy?
Mrs May
I can be absolutely clear with my hon. Friend that, as far as this Government are concerned, full transitional controls should be put on any country joining the European Union. We are also looking at a number of proposals to deal with what we have described on various occasions as the potential pull factors for individuals coming here. The Bill will deal with some of the issues that require a legislative response. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions is also looking at concerns about access to benefits and, I am pleased to say, is working well with other EU member states that have similar concerns about the way some of these systems currently operate.
Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab)
I am very grateful to the Home Secretary. I want to raise the issue of EU identity cards. She is suggesting that landlords will be required to understand all the EU ID cards that guarantee somebody’s right to be in this country. One of the difficulties is that in Italy, for instance, it is not the national state that provides the ID card but the local authority, which can be tiny. How on earth can a commercial landlord be expected to understand all 444 different EU ID cards?
Mrs May
The problem with the argument that the hon. Gentleman and other Labour Members have been advancing in relation to landlords is that we already have an example of a system where people check the status of individuals: employers do that, and they are provided with support by the Home Office. Exactly the same will happen with landlords. The idea that this is something entirely new is completely wrong. Many landlords already ask exactly these sorts of questions of the people to whom they are renting properties.
Establishing the identity of illegal migrants is a further difficulty in the removal process. Visa applicants are required to give their fingerprints to an entry clearance officer before they enter the UK. Following my border reforms last year, the fingerprints of arriving passengers are checked to ensure that the person who has travelled to the UK is the rightful holder of the visa, but there are gaps in our powers to take fingerprints, and the Bill closes them. When the police encounter a suspect, they have the power to check fingerprints, but when an immigration officer encounters a suspected illegal migrant, they may check fingerprints only where consent is given unless they arrest them. Not surprisingly, not everyone consents. Officers need powers equivalent to those of the police so that when they find an illegal migrant they can check their fingerprints to confirm their suspicion and start enforcement action.
Mrs May
I have already been very generous in taking interventions.
Part 2 is about appeals. The appeals system is complex and costly. Seventeen different immigration decisions attract rights of appeal, and when a case finally comes to a close some applicants put in fresh applications and start all over again. That is not fair to the public, who expect swift enforcement of immigration decisions. The Bill sorts out the mess. In future, the 17 rights of appeal will be reduced to four. Foreign criminals will not be able to prevent deportation simply by dragging out the appeals process, as many such appeals will be heard only once the criminal is back in their home country. It cannot be right that criminals who should be deported can remain here and build up a further claim to a settled life in the United Kingdom.
As well as reducing the number of appeals, we propose to simplify the process. An appeal to an immigration judge is a very costly and time-consuming way of correcting simple casework errors that could be resolved by a request to the Home Office to review the decision. This is what we already do overseas for millions of visa applicants. Applicants will be able to contact the Home Office and ask for a simple administrative review to remedy such errors. That can resolve errors in decisions cheaply and quickly, within 28 days, and it is substantially quicker than the average 12 weeks that it currently takes to appeal via the tribunal with all the costs that that incurs. The Bill creates an effective and efficient appeals system that will ensure that the process cannot be abused or manipulated to delay the removal of those who have no basis for remaining in the UK, but it still provides an opportunity to challenge a decision where fundamental rights are concerned. The public are fed up with cases where foreign criminals are allowed to stay because of an overly generous interpretation by the courts of article 8—the right to respect for family and private life. Under the current system, the winners are foreign criminals and immigration lawyers and the losers are the victims of these crimes and the law-abiding public.
The Government first sought to address this issue in July 2012 by changing the immigration rules with the intention of shifting the weight the courts give to the public interest. This House debated and approved the new rules, which set out the factors in favour of deportation and the factors against it. The courts accept that the new rules provide a complete code for considering article 8 where we are deporting foreign criminals. However, some judges have still chosen to ignore the will of Parliament and go on putting the law on the side of foreign criminals instead of the public. I am sending a very clear message to those judges: Parliament wants a law on the people’s side, the public want a law on the people’s side, and this Government will put the law on the people’s side once and for all. This Bill will require the courts to put the public interest at the heart of their decisions.
Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)
Given that the figures show that first-instance decision making is very poor in this regard, with 42% of family visit visas and 51% of entry clearance applications successfully appealed last year, does the right hon. Lady agree that it would be better to focus on getting the system right than on eroding appeal rights against immigration decisions?
Mrs May
No, I have been very generous in giving way. Let me say to Labour Members and to the hon. Member for Brighton, Pavilion (Caroline Lucas) that one of the problems we have seen in some family visit appeals in the past—this is why we removed the family visit appeal process—is that people have introduced new information into the appeals mechanism in the time since the original decision. That means that the decision in an appeal that is won is not necessarily based on the original case but may be based on the case put forward on appeal, which may be different. The hon. Lady needs to be careful when she quotes figures.
Mr Straw
May I correct the right hon. Lady on one thing? Long experience tells me that the tribunals do not accept information that has come in after the original application was made; it would sometimes be better if they did. We are all interested in streamlining the system. However, given the very high number of decisions on appeal that overturn the original decisions by the Home Office or the immigration officials abroad, what guarantee can she offer that the quality of the reviews that will now be undertaken by Home Office officials as an alternative to appeals will be subject to proper supervision? In my experience, when we had those reviews before we often got poor-quality decision making and people within the Department saying, “Oh well, if so and so has already said no, I’m going to say no too.” If that happens we end up with more judicial reviews.
Mrs May
First, tribunals do accept, and have been accepting—we have seen examples of this—information that has come forward after the original application was made prior to the appeal. The figures that the hon. Member for Brighton, Pavilion quoted related to family visit appeals. We have already removed the ability to appeal on a family visit visa. It takes less time and is slightly cheaper for people to reapply and, if they have further information, to put it into the appeals mechanism. Of course, we need to ensure that the system is operating properly, and we will be looking to ensure that, through the operation of the ability to challenge administrative error, we ensure that people are making decisions fairly on the basis of the decision that is put in front of them.
Mr David Burrowes (Enfield, Southgate) (Con)
I welcome the fact that this Bill will enable the system to become effective, as well as humane. How will it impact on human trafficking, not least in relation to those who are human trafficked and are dealt with more as criminals than as they should be—victims?
Mrs May
My hon. Friend will know that we are looking at the whole question of how we deal with human trafficking, or—let us call it what it is—modern slavery. Next year we will introduce a Bill to deal with modern slavery, with a particular focus on dealing with the criminal gangs who undertake this activity. The launch of the new National Crime Agency gives us an even greater ability to deal with those gangs. I want to ensure that we not only start to reduce but end this horrible crime of human trafficking—modern slavery.
Mrs May
I am going to make some further progress.
Part 3 is about migrants’ access to services. We want to ensure that only legal migrants have access to the labour market, free health services, housing, bank accounts and driving licences. This is not just about making the UK a more hostile place for illegal migrants; it is also about fairness. Those who play by the rules and work hard do not want to see businesses gaining an unfair advantage through the exploitation of illegal labour, or to see our valuable public services, paid for by the taxpayer, used and abused by illegal migrants.
Hon. Members will know that the right of non-European economic area nationals to work in the UK is restricted, and where the right to work is granted, it may be restricted to a particular employer or limited hours. Employers are required to ensure that their employees have the right to work in the UK and if they do not, they will face penalties, but the process for enforcing those fines is complicated. The Bill will streamline that process, making employers think again before hiring illegal labour.
Let me turn to the national health service. Many temporary migrants are currently allowed free access to the NHS as if they were permanent residents. Such an approach is extremely generous, particularly compared with wider international practice. Our intention is to bring the rules regulating migrant access to the NHS into line with wider Government policy on migrant access to benefits and social housing. That means restricting access to free NHS care to those non-EEA nationals with indefinite leave to remain and those granted refugee status or humanitarian protection in the UK. Under this Bill, other migrants will have to contribute.
Temporary migrants seeking to stay in the UK for more than six months will have to pay an immigration health surcharge on top of their visa fee. I assure the House that this surcharge will make the system fairer and will not undermine our aim to attract the brightest and the best. We have carefully examined what other countries do and will ensure that the UK offer is a competitive one in a tough global market.
Mrs May
I want to make more progress.
Dealing with migrants is not new for the NHS. There is already a framework for charging other countries. The NHS must enforce it and recover the cost of treating foreign nationals from foreign Governments, and all of us in government will work with it to make the system work.
The Government also want to ensure that illegal immigrants cannot hide in private rented housing. We are already working with councils to tackle rogue landlords who provide beds in sheds and illegal, overcrowded accommodation. Under the Bill, we will go further and have the necessary powers to deal with rogue landlords who rent homes to illegal migrants.
Ms Diane Abbott (Hackney North and Stoke Newington) (Lab)
Is the Secretary of State able to quantify the number of foreign nationals treated by the NHS who are not entitled to free care and who came here solely and deliberately to get free health care?
Mrs May
I suggest that the hon. Lady look at the audit conducted by the national health service that was released today. It makes it absolutely clear that we are talking potentially about several hundred millions of pounds across the NHS when we consider the number of people who come here and are able to use the service without contributing, who come here as health tourists and who come here and use the service when they should not be able to do so. That is why the Bill is absolutely right.
I say to Opposition Members who say that somehow it is wrong to ask people who come to this country to contribute, that it is only fair to the millions of hard-working people who pay into the NHS through their taxes that somebody who comes here to live for a period of time should be asked to contribute. It is only fair also to ensure that when people come here to use the NHS, or use it when they are here and their Government should be paying, that we actually recoup that money.
Barry Gardiner
The most recent migration statistics quarterly report by the Office for National Statistics was published in August 2013 and it noted that the net flow of long-term migrants was 176,000, compared with 235,000 in June 2010, when the right hon. Lady’s Government came to power. That suggests that the figure of 25% cited by my hon. Friend the Member for Rochdale (Simon Danczuk) when he intervened earlier is right and that the right hon. Lady’s figure of 33% is wrong. Will she confirm that those are the latest statistics and that the reduction was by 25%?
Mrs May
If the hon. Gentleman looks at Hansard, he will see the answer I gave to the hon. Member for Rochdale (Simon Danczuk). I said that net migration has come down by a third from its peak in 2010. That figure is absolutely correct, because in September 2010 the figure was 255,000 and the latest figure, therefore, is a fall of 31%.
Mr Speaker
People are free to suggest what they like. These are matters of debate. Of one thing I am sure, having known the hon. Lady for 16 years: she requires no protection from me or, for the most part, I think, from anyone.
Mrs May
I have to say that this morning’s reaction from the shadow Health Secretary, the right hon. Member for Leigh (Andy Burnham), to the proposal to charge for use of the NHS shows that the Labour party is going to be on the wrong side of this argument, because people in this country want to see people being treated fairly in relation to the NHS.
Mrs May
I want to make a little more progress.
Of course, as I said earlier, many private landlords already make checks, on a tenant’s identity and credit status, making it difficult for illegal migrants to rent properties from them. However, not all landlords do it, so we propose to replicate the long-standing requirements for employers to check the immigration status of those they are about to employ.
We are not asking landlords to become immigration experts. Those who undertake simple steps will have nothing to fear and there will not be a penalty. Rogue landlords will face penalties, hitting them where it hurts—in their wallets. This will make it harder for landlords to house illegal immigrants and harder for illegal immigrants to settle in the UK.
It is not excessive regulation. It is a proportionate approach to a significant problem and we have listened very carefully to those who have warned us of the consequences of not doing this properly. We will make it easy for homeless and vulnerable people to prove their entitlement through simple documentary requirements. We will have a statutory code of practice, making it clear that if landlords racially discriminate they will be breaking the law. We will exempt those parts of the housing market, such as homeless hostels and student halls of residence, where further regulation would not be appropriate.
The Bill will also introduce new rules to crack down on illegal migrants accessing banking products and services in the UK. Many illegal immigrants are already prevented from opening bank accounts, thanks to existing identification and fraud requirements. However, there is no specific rule to stop illegal migrants opening an account in the UK. This Bill will require banks and building societies, for the first time, to refuse a customer who wishes to open a new current account when they have been identified as an illegal immigrant.
Having tackled the ability of illegal migrants to work, access health care, rent property and open bank accounts, I also want to ensure that illegal migrants are denied driving licences. The Bill will give legislative force to the current administrative practice, but the measures go further, giving us the power to revoke licences. We will do everything we can to make it harder for illegal migrants to establish a settled life in the UK when they have no right to be here.
Part 4 of the Bill tackles sham marriages and sham civil partnerships undertaken by a fraudulent couple for their own immigration advantage. The Home Office estimates that, every year, between 4,000 and 10,000 applications to stay in the UK are made on the basis of a sham marriage or sham civil partnership. Registration officials already have a duty to report suspected sham marriages and sham civil partnerships to the Home Office. The number of reports of suspected sham cases has risen in recent years, with 1,891 reports received in 2012. At the moment we have the ridiculous situation whereby we cannot always stop a marriage or civil partnership that a registrar believes to be a sham. The current 15-day notice period provides very little time for the Home Office to act before the ceremony takes place.
Henry Smith (Crawley) (Con)
Having listened to the debate so far, I think that hon. and right hon. Members and the public at large will be astounded that these sorts of basic restrictions on illegal immigrants have not been the law of the land for so long. It is about time that we passed this Bill.
Mrs May
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. I think that members of the public will say it is right that we are fair to people living in the UK and to those who have come here legally, and that we ensure that those who are here illegally do not find it easy to stay and that we are able to remove them.
John McDonnell (Hayes and Harlington) (Lab)
A lot of the individual sanctions will be dealt with by statutory instruments. So far it is clear that if a landlord fails to comply and lets a property, they will face a potential fine of £3,000 for each disqualified adult allowed to occupy the property. What sanctions, fines or prison sentence will be given to a doctor or nurse who treats, or a vicar who marries, a disqualified adult?
Mrs May
We are not talking about people not being able to receive treatment in the national health service. We are talking about two things in the NHS. First, when people come here and use the NHS, we will ensure that the NHS recovers the money from their country that it should be recovering. It has not been doing that as well as it should be. Secondly, when people come to stay here for a limited period—for more than six months, but not permanently—we will ask them to pay a surcharge to reflect the fact that they might use public services when they are here.
The Bill will increase the marriage and civil partnership notice period to 28 days—
Mrs May
I have tried to explain the point about sanctions in the NHS by pointing out that the hon. Gentleman’s assumption about the system that we are putting in place appears to be incorrect. He also mentioned members of the clergy who conduct sham marriages. If he looks back at the press from the past couple of years, he will see that members of the clergy have been arrested and prosecuted for conducting sham marriages on purpose.
The Bill will increase the marriage and civil partnership notice period to 28 days in England and Wales, and allow for it to be extended to 70 days when there are reasonable grounds to suspect that a marriage or civil partnership is a sham. The Home Office will investigate the genuineness of the couple’s relationship and consider taking immigration enforcement action when we believe it to be a sham. If the couple do not comply with the investigation, we will prevent a marriage from taking place. Should a sham marriage or civil partnership go ahead, couples will not gain an immigration advantage, but will be removed or prosecuted.
Fixing the immigration system cannot be done overnight. There were too many problems with the system that we inherited for that to be possible. However, the Bill will help us further along the road. It is frankly ridiculous that the Government have to operate such a complex system to deal with foreigners who fail to abide by our laws. It is ridiculous that the odds are stacked in favour of illegal migrants. It is unacceptable that hard-working taxpayers have to compete with people who have no right to be here. The Bill will begin to address those absurdities and restore balance. I commend the Bill to the House.
Yvette Cooper
As we have said before, the problem with a net migration target is that it encourages more British people to leave the country or to remain in other countries. The Prime Minister has promised—no ifs, no buts—that he would reach the net migration target of tens of thousands by the time of the election. On the Government’s own figures, net migration is going up.
We believe that the pace of migration matters. It is right to support measures that will bring the level of migration down, but we must also have serious measures to tackle illegal immigration and to ensure that the system is fair, including in its impact on employment and the workplace.
Yvette Cooper
I will give way to the Home Secretary if she will tell us whether she regrets using the divisive ad vans in the first place.
Mrs May
I have already answered a question about the ad vans. Given that the shadow Home Secretary has not answered the question that my hon. Friend the Member for Hertsmere (Mr Clappison) asked about net migration, perhaps she will answer my question. Does she accept that the level of migration under the last Labour Government was too high?
Yvette Cooper
We have said that the pace of migration was too fast. It is right to have measures to bring the level down. We have said that many times. The Home Secretary has had every opportunity to apologise for the divisive ad vans, which she has admitted were a serious problem. I will give her another opportunity to intervene to do so.
Yvette Cooper
I want to make some progress on the measures that are in the Bill, even though a lot of the measures that we need to tackle illegal immigration are not in it. Let us consider the Bill before us. Some measures are sensible and we will support them. Some are confused and we await illumination on how the Government plan to make them work. Some areas raise genuine concerns, and in other areas the Government are not going far enough, particularly on the labour market and on illegal immigration.
I am glad that the Bill includes stronger action against sham marriages. Indeed, we called for those measures. Like the Government, we listened to the concerns of registrars about cases where they feared abuse, but had too little time to ensure that investigations took place. We also called for stronger enforcement powers for UK Border Force officials. The problem is that the UK Border Agency does not use the powers it has in practice at the moment and enforcement has been getting worse.
The Home Secretary talked about biometrics. We agree that there are some loopholes that should be closed for taking fingerprints, but she needs to explain why her Home Office Ministers endorsed stopping the fingerprinting of stowaways at Calais. This is not about a loophole in the law; it is about a loophole in practice that we raised with Ministers two-and-a-half years ago and which they refused to do anything about.
Yvette Cooper
I will give way to the Home Secretary if she can explain why, two-and-a-half years ago when this was raised with her, the Home Office Minister agreed that it was right for UKBA not to fingerprint stowaways at Calais.
Yvette Cooper
And I suggest that the Home Secretary checks her facts, because in April 2011 we raised with Home Office Ministers the importance of restoring fingerprinting to Calais, which border officials had chosen to do. Two-and-a-half years ago, she refused to do that and she has continued to refuse to do that, and her Home Office Ministers said that was the right thing to do. I will let her intervene again if she will tell me that she will now, two-and-a-half years later, restore the fingerprinting of stowaways to Calais. Will she restore the decision to do fingerprinting at Calais? The Home Secretary is refusing, repeatedly, to restore the fingerprinting of stowaways at Calais, despite the fact that we have raised this with her and other Home Office Ministers repeatedly. Her Home Office Ministers have endorsed the decision not to have fingerprinting at Calais, not to be able to check illegal immigration and not to be able to follow up when people attempt to return to this country.
We support measures to restrict access to British driving licences for those who are here illegally. In fact, we introduced those measures. As the Government have admitted, the changes were mostly brought in before the general election, but we are happy to support them all over again. It is also sensible to have stronger checks on bank accounts.
There has been a principle stretching back over 30 years that overseas visitors should contribute for using the NHS. We will therefore support sensible contributions to the NHS from visa payments, and it would be helpful for Ministers to confirm that such payments will go to the NHS. It would also be helpful if Ministers confirmed whether they have dropped proposals for GPs to have to implement the same kinds of checks as private landlords before letting pregnant women see a midwife, or giving children the measles, mumps and rubella vaccination—both issues that doctors have raised as public health concerns.