Oral Answers to Questions Debate
Full Debate: Read Full DebateDepartment: Department for Energy Security & Net Zero
Michael Shanks
Main Page: Michael Shanks (Labour - Rutherglen)Department Debates - View all Michael Shanks's debates with the Department for Energy Security & Net Zero
(1 week, 2 days ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Watch Debate Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Joe Morris (Hexham) (Lab)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero (Michael Shanks)
In just four short months, we have made rapid progress on achieving our mission for clean power by 2030. We have set up Great British Energy and announced its headquarters in Aberdeen, secured a record-breaking 131 renewables projects, and consented to record amounts of solar. We are getting on with delivering lower bills, energy security, good jobs and climate action.
Catherine Atkinson (Derby North) (Lab)
Rolls-Royce in Derby is an international leader in research on and the development of small modular reactors, and it is fantastic that the Government have acknowledged the role that SMRs will play in clean power generation, energy security and green jobs. In the Budget, we heard that the final decision on Great British Nuclear’s SMR competition will conclude next spring. Does the Minister agree that it is important for this opportunity to be seized as soon as possible?
Michael Shanks
I agree with my hon. Friend that nuclear will play a central role in our clean power mission, and will continue to be a critical part of our energy mix as we progress towards 2030 and far beyond. Great British Nuclear is continuing to drive forward the competition on small modular reactors, with bids currently being evaluated by the Department, and I look forward to having more to say about this in due course.
Bill Esterson
The last Government held a consultation on electricity market arrangements, but despite having said that that was their flagship policy in this area, they did not publish the results of that consultation. Does my hon. Friend agree that electricity and, indeed, energy market reform is crucial to achieving the Government’s stated 2030 clean energy targets and to reducing bills, and can he say whether this Government will publish the results of the last Government’s consultation and if so, when?
Michael Shanks
I congratulate my hon. Friend again on his appointment as Chair of the Select Committee—he brings a huge amount of knowledge and experience to the role—and I agree with him about the importance of reviewing electricity market arrangements. We are building on the last Government’s consultation, and we will have more to say in the months ahead. This is a crucial element of how we achieve clean power by 2030 and ensure that our energy system of the future is fit for what will be a different way of managing energy throughout the country. We will have more to say about that in the months ahead.
Baggy Shanker
Last week a report published by the National Energy System Operator noted that although the programme to roll out new small modular reactors was being developed for the mid-2030s, a 2030 roll-out date would in fact be possible. Given that SMR technologies hold exciting and significant potential for investment in jobs and infrastructure in constituencies such as mine, has the Minister considered the value of bringing the roll-out forward to 2030?
Michael Shanks
My hon. Friend is right to say that nuclear will play a vital role, and that it not only delivers on our energy security but creates good, well-paid jobs. Unlike the last Government, who in 14 years did not deliver a single nuclear project—there were many consultations and processes, but not a single nuclear power station was built—this Government are getting on with delivering a nuclear future.
Joe Morris
Last week’s report from the National Energy System Operator showed that not only is clean power by 2030 achievable, but it can lead to lower bills and more secure systems. Does the Minister agree that the only way to protect bill payers permanently is to go as far and as fast as possible towards our clean power mission by 2030?
Michael Shanks
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The report published by the independent National Energy System Operator laid out not only that reaching our clean power mission is entirely achievable, but that it will bring down bills. The importance of the report is that it set the course for how that is possible. The reality, which the Conservative party refuses to accept, is that the only way to get us off the rollercoaster of high bills is to deliver at pace the clean energy that we know will deliver energy security and climate leadership, and bring down bills for people right across the country.
Tom Tugendhat (Tonbridge) (Con)
I am delighted that the Minister is setting out that the report promises an extra £40 billion of investment a year in the energy sector and, presumably, the taxes to go with it, which will of course come from the businesses that are paying for everything else in the Budget that has just gone by. Is there anything at all in his proposals that will actually bring down the cost of energy and not be replaced by taxpayer funding? It appears at the moment that there is nothing, and energy prices are already going up.
Michael Shanks
I would encourage the right hon. Gentleman to read the NESO report, because it sets out in great detail not only that clean power is achievable by 2030, but that it will lead to lower bills. What he says about investment misses the point: in the last few weeks, we have announced billions of pounds of private sector investment in these projects; indeed, Scottish Power has announced today that it will provide £1 billion. Companies are choosing to invest in this country, whereas they did not under the Conservative party. The reality is that once upon a time, the Conservatives recognised that the drive to net zero was important. They have abandoned that commitment now.
Sir Bernard Jenkin (Harwich and North Essex) (Con)
I thank the Minister for agreeing to meet the OffSET—offshore electricity grid taskforce—group of MPs later today; we are very much looking forward to the meeting. Does he recognise that achieving the 2030 deadline set out in the NESO report requires an acceleration of the process, which, in turn, is dependent on much higher levels of public consent?
Michael Shanks
I recognise the hon. Gentleman’s point, and I am looking forward to meeting him and his colleagues this afternoon to discuss the particular issues in his area. We need to build more network infrastructure across the UK to make this endeavour a reality, but he is right: we want to bring communities with us on this journey. That is why we have said that we are looking again at what community benefits will look like, building on some of the work that the previous Government did in consulting on this issue. Crucially, however, if want to bring down bills and deliver energy security, we will have to build the infrastructure, and that is what this Government are committed to doing.
Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
The Minister knows well the Liberal Democrats’ commitment to community energy. Will the Government establish a clean community energy scheme, look at the barriers that currently face community energy projects and look at supporting the National Grid to deliver community energy?
Michael Shanks
The hon. Lady and I have had a number of conversations, and I recognise her commitment on this issue. We have committed in the local power plan to delivering investment in community energy across the country. Importantly, we want not only to invest in schemes, but to deliver across Government the mechanisms needed to make it more possible for communities to deliver such schemes. That will build capacity in communities so that we can see more community energy.
Sir Desmond Swayne (New Forest West) (Con)
What is the beef behind the Government’s reluctance to embrace with enthusiasm locally generated community energy? Why did they vote against the amendment tabled to the Great British Energy Bill by the hon. Member for Bath (Wera Hobhouse)?
Michael Shanks
I think the right hon. Gentleman thinks that was a “gotcha” question, but, of course, the Conservative party did not vote for the Bill at all. Amendment or not, I do not think he can really speak about what Great British Energy might deliver, because, despite it being one of the most popular policies at the last election, the Conservatives failed to bother to vote for it.
Claire Coutinho (East Surrey) (Con)
Last week, the National Energy System Operator published a full systems cost analysis of the Secretary of State’s flagship project to carbonise the grid by 2030. This morning, the Secretary of State said on several media outlets that the report shows that his plans will lower bills. I remind the House that the report assumes that gas prices are 40% higher than the Department’s own estimates, that the price of carbon price is at least double what it is now, that the Government can commission more offshore wind in the next two years than in the last six combined without moving prices, and that they can build the grid at a pace we have never seen before in this country, without any delays. Even if all that is achieved, page 78 of the report shows that the cost of the system will be higher. For clarity, would the Minister like to repeat at the Dispatch Box the Secretary of State’s claim that the NESO report shows that Labour’s system will lead to a lower cost of electricity?
Michael Shanks
What the shadow Secretary of State has just outlined quite coherently is that the Conservatives have no ambition in this space whatsoever, but we do. I am very happy for the right hon. Lady to outline where our ambition is. We will build faster than the previous Government, although I have to say that that would not be difficult. The shadow Minister sitting next to her, the hon. Member for West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine (Andrew Bowie), said quite clearly at their conference that the previous Government had built infrastructure far too slowly, and their former Energy Minister, the right hon. Member for Beverley and Holderness (Graham Stuart), said that their onshore wind ban was “always mad”. We are quite happy to pick up where they left off and deliver the clean power that this country needs.
Claire Coutinho
This is the ministerial team who told the electorate they were going to cut their bills by £300, without doing any homework to find out how those plans would work. They voted against our amendment to hold them to account on their own pledge just two weeks ago, and now they are trying to claim that the NESO report shows that their approach will lower bills when in fact it shows in black and white that the system will be much more expensive. Does the Minister not see that if they follow this plan, we will be a warning, not an example, to the rest of the world and that the British people will be colder and poorer as a result?
Michael Shanks
Time and again, the Conservatives run away from their record on this in office. The reason why people right across this country are paying more on their energy bills is that the Conservatives did not get us off the rollercoaster of fossil fuel markets, but we are now moving at pace. The right hon. Lady may want to keep us in the vulnerable state where we are reliant on international gas markets, but we are determined that we will not do that. We will bring down bills and deliver energy security. I am not ashamed to say that we will move with great ambition to deliver what this country needs and to deliver the good jobs that go with it.
Douglas McAllister (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero (Michael Shanks)
We are moving at pace to set up Great British Energy. So far we have appointed the start-up chair, Jürgen Maier, we have announced that the headquarters will be in Aberdeen and we have progressed the Bill through the House of Commons. This builds on the first partnership announced for Great British Energy, with the Crown Estate, and on a recent new deal to collaborate with Scottish public bodies. We are getting on with the job of delivering 21st-century public ownership for the British people.
Douglas McAllister
Every family and every business in my constituency paid the price of 14 years of Conservative failure with rocketing energy bills because the last Government failed to invest in clean energy. The Opposition continue to oppose Great British Energy. Does the Minister recognise the absurdity of their argument that they are quite happy with foreign public ownership as long as it is not UK citizens who own our energy?
Michael Shanks
My hon. Friend makes a good point. It is important to remember that, despite what the Conservatives might have us believe, Great British Energy is overwhelmingly popular with the British people. That includes the people in Scotland, because of course it was not just the Conservative party who did not vote for Great British Energy; surprisingly, the Scottish National party also failed to vote for a publicly owned champion in our energy space. We are getting on with delivering jobs and growth, delivered with public ownership through Great British Energy.
Neil O’Brien (Harborough, Oadby and Wigston) (Con)
Before the election, Labour said that Great British Energy would cut electricity bills by £300. After the election, the Labour Government voted against writing that into law and instead took away people’s winter fuel payments and made their bills more expensive. The Institute for Fiscal Studies has now said that their policies are fundamentally raising prices for consumers to the tune of £120 per household, and we know from the NESO report that this will get worse. Even if they triple the pace of wind roll-out, double the pace of grid connection and make other heroic assumptions, all of this is going to bump up costs further, is it not? We are doing this from the basis of having the high electricity prices in Europe. What assessment has the Minister made of the impact on British industry?
Michael Shanks
Question after question from the Conservatives shows that they do not recognise the part they played for 14 years in why we are paying higher bills than ever before. We are the only party with an ambitious plan to get us off the volatile fossil fuel markets. The Conservatives used to believe that, in our drive to net zero, we should build this infrastructure for the long term. They are now opposing it, but they will have to tell their constituents why they want to leave them exposed to rising bills.
Jo White (Bassetlaw) (Lab)
Dr Andrew Murrison (South West Wiltshire) (Con)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero (Michael Shanks)
The Government regularly meet stakeholders to discuss the development of our energy infrastructure. Last week, the Government received advice from the National Energy System Operator outlining its advice on the pathway towards clean power by 2030. Later this year we will publish our 2030 action plan, which will set out details on the future of our energy mix.
Dr Murrison
Offshore wind has been a real positive for our energy security and grid independence, but unfortunately not when the wind does not blow. Given the election of a President who tells us he is going to “drill, baby, drill,” what revision does the Minister anticipate to his timetable towards net zero?
Michael Shanks
As I said in my previous answer, later this year we will outline our action plan on how we will deliver on the 2030 target; there is no change to our timetable in that regard. The right hon. Gentleman raises a good point about what happens when the wind does not blow and the sun does not shine, and about ensuring we have a mix in our energy system. That is why we remain supportive of nuclear and why we have recently announced investment in long-duration energy storage, to ensure we can capture energy and use it when we need it.
Jenny Riddell-Carpenter (Suffolk Coastal) (Lab)
I was delighted by Ofgem’s announcement this morning that it now recommends that the proposed Nautilus interconnector should be located at the Isle of Grain, not on the Suffolk coast. Since I have been elected, I have made firm representations to the Minister and Ofgem, including via its consultation, that the Suffolk coast should not have been considered and brownfield sites should have been considered first. Will the Minister meet me to discuss other National Grid projects in my constituency?
Michael Shanks
Ofgem has announced today decisions on a number of interconnectors. Those are decisions for Ofgem and not for the Government. We have recently announced the launch of a strategic spatial energy plan, to ensure that we plan such projects holistically, across the whole of the United Kingdom, and take into account a number of schemes when planning future energy, such as those my hon. Friend mentions in her constituency. I will continue to have discussions about that with Members from across the country.
Nick Timothy (West Suffolk) (Con)
China’s largest offshore floating wind turbine company, Ming Yang Smart Energy, plans to build its first manufacturing plant outside China in Scotland. Ming Yang benefits from huge subsidies in China, but there are serious questions about energy security and national security. The Secretary of State says he wants to end reliance on foreign autocrats, but when he was asked about this on the radio this morning, he had no answer. Will the Minister rule out allowing any turbines that might be controlled by hostile states?
Michael Shanks
We are encouraging investment in the UK to build the infrastructure that we need in the future. Just today, we have announced the clean industry bonus that will give as much support as possible to companies to build their supply chains here in this country. We will continue to look at supply chains and, of course, we take seriously the companies, across the range of business projects, that are investing in this country. There is a series of processes already under way across Government. Whenever anybody wants to invest in this country, those processes will be followed in the usual manner.
Ms Polly Billington (East Thanet) (Lab)
Mr Speaker, will you and the Minister give the House an opportunity to celebrate the £1 billion of investment announced today in offshore wind in this country? It will provide jobs across the country, as promised by this Government, which the British people are not used to after the past 14 years. Will the Minister meet me to discuss the infrastructure required to connect that clean, secure energy to our homes, in particular the Sea Link project that could have an impact in my constituency?
Michael Shanks
My hon. Friend is right to highlight the fantastic announcement today by ScottishPower of £1 billion of investment here in the UK, building the infrastructure that we need, and delivering jobs and skills in this country as well. It is one of a number of announcements that we expect, because we are not agnostic in this Government on delivering the industrial strategy that we need. My hon. Friend the Minister for Industry is working on that at the moment. We will deliver the jobs in this country to build the clean power of the future. We will deliver good, well-paid jobs and the energy security we need.
Andrew Pakes (Peterborough) (Lab)
Joani Reid (East Kilbride and Strathaven) (Lab)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero (Michael Shanks)
The energy transition presents an incredible opportunity for job creation right across the UK, particularly in our industrial and coastal communities. Through Great British Energy, we will build on Scotland’s reputation as a world leader in energy and secure long-term, well-paid jobs in the industries of the future.
Joani Reid
I recently had the privilege of opening an extension to the Kype Muir wind farm in my constituency. The extension alone will generate enough power for 53,000 homes for 30 years. My constituency is also home to part of Whitelee, the largest onshore wind farm in Europe. However, not one of those turbines was manufactured in the UK, let alone locally. What steps is the Minister taking to develop UK manufacturing capacity in that area?
Michael Shanks
I know well my hon. Friend’s constituency—it is next door to mine—and both wind farms she mentions. She says quite rightly that, for all the expansion in those technologies over recent years, very few of those jobs, particularly in manufacturing, have been in this country. We will do everything we can, through Great British Energy and the clean industry bonus we have announced today, to grow our domestic supply chains, build industry in this country and win jobs for Britain.
Harriet Cross (Gordon and Buchan) (Con)
Last week, just days after the Budget, Apache announced that it would exit the North sea by 2029. It said:
“The onerous financial impact of the energy profits levy…makes production…beyond 2029 uneconomic.”
What assessment have the Government made of the impact of those policies on current jobs in north-east Scotland, and how will Great British Energy compensate for the loss of those jobs?
Michael Shanks
We are working with industry in the north-east of Scotland to ensure that this is a just and prosperous transition. We have announced our next steps of responding to court judgments, and a consultation is open at the moment. We will have more to say about that in the months ahead. The hon. Lady must recognise that if she wants to see investment from Great British Energy, she might actually have to support its creation in the first place. The Conservatives cannot have it both ways; either they want a public energy company to invest in the jobs of the future—
Michael Shanks
Or they do not, as her right hon. Friend has just confirmed from the Back Benches. She cannot have it both ways.
Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero (Michael Shanks)
My hon. Friend is right; there are good projects right across the country that we hope to invest in in the lead-up to delivering in 2030. The NESO report clearly set out that our aim is achievable. The Conservative party wants to continue having the arguments of the past; we are determined, with ambition, to deliver on the arguments of the future.
Lee Anderson (Ashfield) (Reform)
Michael Shanks
It perhaps will not surprise the hon. Gentleman or the House that I am not going to agree with his final point. Net zero is incredibly important to deliver climate leadership, lower bills and the jobs of the future. But on biomass, we rightly expect full compliance with all regulatory obligations on biomass, and consumers rightly recognise the high standard of accountability from generators.
Lee Pitcher (Doncaster East and the Isle of Axholme) (Lab)
Gareth Davies (Grantham and Bourne) (Con)
Conservative Members will never stop holding the Government to account for their pre-election promise to cut energy bills by £300. Have civil service officials conducted any modelling whatsoever that can legitimise that figure?
Michael Shanks
We arrived at the figure through independent analysis. We stand by the reality that the only way to bring down bills is to commit to our 2030 target. The National Energy System Operator backs that, but the Conservative party fails to support that action. The hon. Member therefore must explain what the Conservative plan is for reducing bills for people who are paying more than they have ever paid.
Tim Roca (Macclesfield) (Lab)
My constituents understand that tackling the climate crisis and getting lower bills go hand in hand, and they are excited about Great British Energy. Will GBE invest in community energy projects in places such as Macclesfield?
Michael Shanks
My hon. Friend is right to make a point about community energy. The local power plan that we are committed to will deliver community energy projects throughout Great Britain. I am sure that Macclesfield has some fantastic projects that Great British Energy will look at. We want to unleash the potential of community energy across the country.
Greg Smith (Mid Buckinghamshire) (Con)
National Grid’s rationale for rebuilding East Claydon substation is based on speculative applications, not consented real schemes. Will the Minister therefore meet me to find a way to get National Grid more grounded in reality rather than speculation?
Michael Shanks
I am happy to look at specific cases, but the Secretary of State’s role as final decision maker on some planning applications means that I cannot comment on them. However, generally speaking, the hon. Member makes an important point about looking at how we plan projects holistically throughout the country. That is why we have announced the first ever spatial energy plan for the whole of Great Britain.
Richard Burgon (Leeds East) (Ind)
The devastating scenes of flooding in Spain remind us all of why urgent investment is needed to deal with the deadly consequences of climate change. Does the Minister agree that that investment should be paid for by the polluting companies that have caused the climate crisis?
Alison Bennett (Mid Sussex) (LD)
Bolney in Twineham parish in my constituency hosts the Rampion windfarm substation, which leads to several battery energy storage solution applications. What reassurance can the Minister give my constituents about the adequacy of the regulatory framework?
Michael Shanks
Batteries will play an important role in our energy mix in the short duration storage that we need. We will continue to look at whether the regulatory arrangements are sufficient. Obviously, we want all the applications to be for safe projects. The regulations are in place to ensure that. If we need to do any more work, we will happily look at that.
Jayne Kirkham (Truro and Falmouth) (Lab/Co-op)
We had a very successful all-party group meeting last week on floating offshore wind in the Celtic sea. I know the Minister is supportive and ask him to consider mechanisms such as ringfencing contracts for difference and investment in ports to kickstart the investment in the Celtic sea.
Michael Shanks
My hon. Friend is right to raise the important potential of the Celtic sea in our green energy transition. I will be in Wales tomorrow to speak at a green energy conference on exactly that question. There is huge potential in floating offshore wind. We want to bring the manufacturing jobs in the supply chain to this country as well, which is why we launched today our clean industry bonus to bring that investment here to build the factories of the future and deliver the good, clean jobs of the future.
Alicia Kearns (Rutland and Stamford) (Con)
The wind industry has rightly agreed a standard compensation package for rural communities with big wind plants. The solar industry, however, is, unsurprisingly, busy whitewashing Uyghur slave labour in its supply chains rather than doing that. If it will not act, will the Government step forward and recognise that they must support rural communities by creating a standardised compensation programme?
Michael Shanks
The hon. Lady has pursued this and several other issues to do with the solar industry for a long time. We are currently looking at all the options, particularly around community benefits, to ensure that they are at a scale—following on from the previous Government’s consultation on whether they should be compulsory—that genuinely benefits communities.
Dr Rupa Huq (Ealing Central and Acton) (Lab)
My constituent Konnie Huq, with Arts Council and Lottery funding, has compiled a kids’ climate guide, with Jamie Oliver among the contributors. Will Ministers join forces with her to get it out there, preferably to every school in the country, because we have got to start young?
Patrick Spencer (Central Suffolk and North Ipswich) (Con)
I met with National Grid yesterday and communicated my concerns about the Norwich to Tilbury line but we remained constructive and talked about community benefit schemes. Unfortunately, it told me that the Government were dragging their feet on defining community benefit schemes. Can the Minister update the House on when they will bring forward guidance, and can he promise that a community benefit scheme is a real, positive economic benefit for my residents who are impacted by the pylons?
Michael Shanks
Clearly I cannot speak for National Grid but I can speak for this Government and in four months we have moved as quickly as possible on what a community benefit scheme will look like for network infrastructure as well as for generation projects. The Conservative party had 14 years to put in place a different scheme and did not; in four months we are moving as quickly as we can.
Perran Moon (Camborne and Redruth) (Lab)
As Ministers know, the European powerhouse of critical minerals is Cornwall, including its vast quantities of lithium, essential for our transition away from fossil fuels. Will the Ministers agree with the industry’s call for a target of 50,000 tonnes of lithium?
Chris Law (Dundee Central) (SNP)
Ahead of the general election the Labour party was warned that its plans for the North sea in Scotland would lead to up to 100,000 Scottish job losses. Last week this became a reality when the US oil firm Apache said that it would end all its operations in the North sea by the end of 2029, citing this UK Government’s Budget and tax regime. Can the Minister explain why this UK Government sees the jobs and livelihoods of oil and gas workers in the north-east of Scotland as expendable?
Michael Shanks
I do not believe that at all. This Government are committed to a just and prosperous transition. The reality is that 100,000 jobs have been lost in the oil and gas industry in the past 10 years. If we do not recognise that there is a transition under way and put in place the measures to produce the jobs of the future, we will have more losses. The party that the hon. Member represents could have done something about that by supporting Great British Energy headquarters in Aberdeen but he failed to show up and vote for it.
Noah Law (St Austell and Newquay) (Lab)
I declare an interest as a chair of the all-party parliamentary group for critical minerals. Domestic supplies of copper and, of course, Cornish tin are critical to the UK’s energy security. What consideration has the Minister given to ensuring that copper and tin are recognised as critical minerals?