(13 years, 10 months ago)
Lords Chamber
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what is their assessment of the political situation in Bahrain.
The British Government attach great importance to our relations with the Gulf states and are committed to strengthening our already strong relationship with the kingdom of Bahrain.
We are concerned by increasing tension in the run-up to parliamentary elections there on 23 October. We hope that all sectors of Bahraini society will engage fully in the political process and work to reduce current tensions. We encourage the Government of Bahrain to allow all groups competing in the election level playing fields and to maintain their programme of democratic reforms.
My Lords, the noble Lord must be aware of the deteriorating political situation as he has just alluded to it. Is he aware that political activists have been imprisoned, have been denied access to lawyers, that there are allegations of torture and that opposition parties and NGOs which were legal until recently have been banned in the past few days? How do we expect a level playing field in that regard? There is alleged to have been a terrorist plot against the Government of Bahrain which the US, of course, refutes. Will the noble Lord tell the House whether Her Majesty’s Government agree that there has been a terrorist plot and how they will consider recalibrating their position with Bahrain should the elections turn out to be a complete sham?
I thank my noble friend for her concern in this matter, which is very proper as we take all allegations of torture extremely seriously. We are aware that allegations have been made in a number of cases. Of course, we are dealing with a long-term situation of great pressure under which Bahraini society has to operate, with pressures from all sides, particularly influence from Iran. Nevertheless, these are extremely worrying allegations. Our ambassador has raised them and has demanded and sought transparency and due process in all cases. They have also been raised at the highest ministerial level and we will continue to pursue our questions about the allegations of torture. I have to say that the Bahraini authorities insist that they have nothing to hide and that there is no evidence of torture. Nevertheless, the allegations remain and we will continue to raise them with the Bahraini authorities.
My Lords, I declare my interest as the vice-chair of the Bahraini APPG. While I accept the noble Baroness’s premise as regards some of the difficulties that Bahrain faces, does the noble Lord accept that there has been tremendous improvement in governance structures in Bahrain and that British government support is absolutely critical at this point given that it is one of the two Gulf countries seeking a political mandate from its people?
Yes, I accept that. It is, in a way, ironic that of the two Gulf states that are making most progress on democratic and parliamentary reform—Kuwait and Bahrain—Bahrain should come in for the criticism. Nevertheless, my noble friend is absolutely right to be concerned about the allegations. Torture is unacceptable to us wherever it occurs in the world; and where it occurs among our friends, the very fact that we have friendship and a good relationship enables us to take the matter up in a very frank and effective way. But the noble Baroness is quite right in this regard.
My Lords, we are very grateful to the Foreign Secretary for making a telephone call to the Crown Prince about the detention and torture of a British citizen who is among the dozens who have been detained for political reasons. Will the Foreign Secretary make another telephone call to ask the Bahraini ruling family if they will grant permission to the families of the detainees to visit them without having 10 security men standing in the background, and allow their lawyers to visit without being observed? Finally, will the Foreign Secretary ask the ruling family to invite the UN rapporteurs on torture and arbitrary detention to pay a visit to Bahrain to investigate the circumstances?
My noble friend is talking about a particular case and it is quite difficult to talk about the details of an individual case where permission has not been given by the individual for it to be discussed. However, if, as I suspect, he is referring to the case of Mr Al-Hisabi, who has been detained and about whom a lot of allegations have been made, this matter was indeed raised at very high levels—whether by telephone or face to face. Consular access has been offered to the individual because he has dual nationality. In the future, there could be further consular access. I am advised that there will be no problem at all about further access and about the issue that my noble friend raised on the position of the families and their support.
As to visits from outside bodies to examine the situation, I agree that this is possibly a worthwhile idea. I am advised that the Bahraini authorities would not be averse to the right kind of inspection or visit from outside authorities to monitor the truth of the allegations—some of which may have a basis and some of which may be false—and to present the Bahraini authorities’ case, which is that there is no real evidence of torture.
My Lords, I am sure that we all agree that wherever torture occurs it should be condemned in the unequivocal way that the Minister has done, and we welcome that. But Bahrain is a relatively liberal Gulf state: its elections have been inclusive of women; there have been women at senior levels in the Bahraini Government and it is inclusive of different religious groupings. Given that history and the excellent relationship to which the Minister referred, does he believe that now really is the moment to approach the Bahrainis on inspections of their prisons and places of detention, because, like the Minister, I believe that that sort of approach might be well received?
I agree with the noble Baroness. This may now be an idea that we are certainly prepared to consider and, as I said earlier, my impression is that the Bahraini authorities themselves would be favourable towards some proposition of this kind. It is certainly something that we will consider putting to them.
(14 years ago)
Lords ChamberMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper. In doing so, I remind the House of my non-pecuniary interest as chairman of the All-Party Parliamentary Group on North Korea.
My Lords, we speak with China regularly concerning security on the Korean peninsula. The Foreign Secretary last raised this with Foreign Minister Yang Jiechi and State Councillor Dai Bingguo during his visit to China on 14 July. The UN Presidential Statement on the sinking of the vessel “Cheonan” was agreed with China and it conveys a clear message to North Korea that it cannot act with impunity.
I thank the Minister for that reply. Does he agree that in the aftermath of the deplorable sinking of the “Cheonan”, with the shocking loss of 46 lives, the sort of display of military might that we are seeing this week by South Korea and the United States in their manoeuvres was inevitable, along with the imposition of sanctions? Does he also agree that the Cold War demonstrated that intelligent engagement was equally important, and so it is crucial to keep China engaged in drawing North Korea back into the six-party talks and working for the objective of the denuclearisation of the Korean peninsula?
Yes, my Lords, I agree with both those propositions. We want to get the six-party talks going again to bring China back in. China has a different agenda in some ways from the rest of us for the Korean peninsula, but it, too, shares the broad view that the long-term aim must be the denuclearisation of the whole peninsula.
My Lords, does the Minister agree that there is a temptation in some quarters to dismiss North Korea’s pronouncements as sabre rattling, when history has taught us that the step from sabre rattling to sabre thrusting can sometimes be very short and unexpected? Does the Minister also agree that it is the habit of unstable dictators who feel that they are not being taken seriously to act irresponsibly and unpredictably? Does he agree that talk of sabre rattling is totally out of place in this situation?
The noble Lord speaks wise words. The North Koreans are capable of really dangerous acts. They have the Taepodong missile, which in theory has an intercontinental range. They have tried one—it did not work, but it might have done—and they are prepared, under pressure, to do very dangerous things. This is a very dangerous situation and we should have no illusions that it is just a question of sabre rattling. It is right that the entire community should recognise this and that the Chinese should realise that, although North Korea is their neighbour, they should be as worried as the rest of us to have a neighbour with these inclinations.
My Lords, is the Minister aware of widespread concern over the deteriorating situation in North Korea with regard to human rights, with the recent public executions by firing squad of former Cabinet Minister Kwon Ho Ung, reportedly for failing in his negotiations with South Korea, and also of two young men in their 20s, as well as concern about the US citizen, Mr Gomes, who has recently tried to take his life in prison? Will Her Majesty's Government use the good offices of our ambassador in Pyongyang to raise these serious issues with the North Korean Government?
These are both very worrying situations. The report of the executions is unconfirmed but we have sought to establish what happened. If it is confirmed, the noble Baroness will be absolutely right that it is an extremely grim example. On the question of Mr Aijalon Mahli Gomes and his early release from prison, he is currently on hunger strike. We are aware of his case and are monitoring it closely. However, the Swedish embassy in Pyongyang is the consular protecting power for US nationals in North Korea and is handling the case, although we are keeping a close watch.
My Lords, what is the extent of the concern of Her Majesty’s Government about the treatment of North Korean refugees who fled over the border into China? Does this figure on the agenda of the human rights dialogue between China and ourselves and the European Union?
Yes, it most certainly does. I was recently in Jilin province, where a lot of refugees were coming over the border, and there is no doubt that some were put in labour camps and treated extremely badly. After allowing a lot of refugees in, the Chinese have now cracked down on them, presumably because they create some embarrassment for the Chinese Government. However, it is certainly a matter that we have raised and are worried about because there are signs of these unfortunate refugees receiving some unpleasant treatment.
My Lords, on this, the 60th anniversary of the outbreak of the Korean War, in which 3 million people died, including 1,000 British servicemen, do the Government agree that the serial abuse of human rights in North Korea demonstrates that the sacrifices of 60 years ago did not end the suffering of the Korean people? What are we doing to ensure that the North Korean leadership is brought to justice before the International Criminal Court and that the leaders are not allowed to get away with salting away their ill-gotten gains in foreign bank accounts?
I agree totally with the sentiments behind what the noble Lord says. As to bringing these matters before the International Criminal Court, the ICC can go against an individual in a country that is not a party to the ICC only if the action is triggered by the UN Security Council, and there we have a problem. China is a member of the UN Security Council and therefore the chances of progress there are very small. However, these matters are constantly in our minds and certainly, if the ICC chooses to make further investigations and can identify an individual rather than just generalise against a whole country, we will be very glad to see that.
My Lords, coming back to the Question of the noble Lord, Lord Alton, does my noble friend agree that the role of China in several international disputes—not least with Iran, as well as with North Korea—is becoming similar to that with Russia during the Cold War? Do we not therefore, across the other partners in the Security Council, need to take a more robust stand, otherwise we will end up with an impasse, as was the case with Russia, for 30 or 40 years?
My noble friend is right. Of course we must be robust but I emphasised earlier that China has its own view of reform of the DPRK. It is not content with the present situation—understandably so—and has supported the sanctions movements against North Korea, which are strong in the European Union and have also recently been beefed up at the suggestion of Secretary Hillary Clinton in America. Therefore, the Chinese are supporting these sanctions and that is an advance, but I think that we have to move in the right direction through a combination of skill, diplomacy and persuasion to bring North Korea to a realisation that it must act responsibly or it will be on the path to its own self-destruction.
(14 years ago)
Lords ChamberMy Lords, in the absence of the noble Viscount, Lord Waverley, and at his request, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in his name on the Order Paper.
My Lords, the Prime Minister and President Medvedev are agreed that they want to see a stronger, more positive relationship between the United Kingdom and Russia, including through an exchange of ministerial visits. Although our bilateral differences will take time to resolve, we will take forward a broad agenda of practical co-operation that is in both our interests, engaging on the major global, political, economic and security challenges and working to enhance our prosperity.
My Lords, I thank the Minister for his reply. Does he agree that, in matters of international affairs, Russia is most important in matters such as Iran, the Caucasus, Nagorno-Karabakh and, of course, the Middle East? It is also one of the most important developing economies in Europe. Do we not need relations that are more positive and which depend on the United Kingdom engaging with rather than talking at Russia? That was my experience, regrettably, when I was in the Council of Europe Assembly, and I know that my noble friend Lord Waverley shares this opinion.
The noble Lord is absolutely right. We need to engage very carefully. The Russians have been through the great traumas of the 20th century and while there are always difficulties and tricky aspects in dealing with them, this is certainly not a relationship of lecturing or harassing, or any other thing like that. This is a relationship of mutual respect, understanding the differences that we have but not letting them overwhelm the important, positive developments of our relations with such a vastly important nation in a whole range of areas. As for the EU, we certainly want to see there a united momentum in engaging with Russia and moving forward positively as well.
While regular meetings between senior political and business leaders would obviously be very welcome, will the Minister not forget the importance of the links between the Russian and British people? Perhaps some thought can be given to something the Russians have already helped on—a visit to Poolewe where the Arctic convoys assembled during the war to supply Russia, at great loss of British life. The possibility of developing that link could be examined so there is a better understanding of the relationship between Britain and Russia. It has already been developed in a very limited way by the museum at Gairloch just a few miles from Poolewe.
I agree with the noble Lord that that is a positive and interesting aspect and there have of course been others. I do not know whether your Lordships shared my view that there was something rather splendid about seeing a platoon of the Brigade of Guards marching through Red Square the other day in full dress. I liked that.
My Lords, picking up the last point made by the noble Lord, Lord Kilclooney, can the Minister tell us whether Russia, as a member of the quartet, is playing a significant and positive role?
I think it is in so far as the quartet as a whole is able to get into a positive position. Certainly President Medvedev indicated to our Prime Minister that that was what it wanted to do, but it has found some difficulties dealing with Israel’s position. All members of the quartet are still engaged and want to go forward together and I do not think there is any major gulf between them in recognising the vast importance of trying to make progress on that front.
My Lords, while it is important to improve relations between Britain and Russia, what moves are the Government making to free the occupied zones of Georgia—Abkhazia and South Ossetia—and making Russia comply with the Sarkozy agreement which it has clearly failed to do?
My noble friend is quite right. At present Russia is not complying with its commitment to evacuate Georgia, where it still has troops, as well as South Ossetia and Abkhazia. We are all the time raising this issue and pressing the Russians to get into a more acceptable and positive position but progress is slow. At the moment they are not moving.
My Lords, the noble Lord mentioned the economy and the important issues between Russia and us. He will know that the UK-Russia intergovernmental steering committee on trade was successfully relaunched in 2008 and last met last November. Are there any plans for that steering committee to meet again this year and, if so, will it be touching on some of the thorny issues such as international banking standards, concerns about corruption and corporate governance taxation?
I cannot answer the noble Baroness on her precise question about the meeting at this moment, but I will check. On corruption, she puts her finger on one of the central problems. There is no doubt that there is a very great deal of corruption still in Russia today and some of it at alarmingly high levels. President Medvedev has highlighted this and says he wants to tackle it. We will do everything to support him but we would like to see more results in certain cases than we have seen so far. Corruption is the cancer that could undermine the whole Russian progress.
My Lords, in spite of the invasion of Georgia, the Litvinenko affair and the spies in New York, is it not true that we should build on areas where there is a mutuality of interest? One, surely, is the intelligence relationship because we both face Islamist terrorism. What are the prospects of reviving an exchange that I believe has virtually dried up?
I hope that the prospects are getting better. They have not been good, as the noble Lord recognises. There have been real difficulties and building up the degree of mutual understanding and trust on which aspects such as joint intelligence can develop is very difficult and slow. But it is certainly an objective, and part of our view that we should have a better and stronger relationship with great Russia, which remains a major world power.
(14 years, 1 month ago)
Lords Chamber
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what is their response to the outcome of the Review Conference on the Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court held in Kampala, Uganda, from 31 May to 11 June.
My Lords, our response is positive. The ICC review conference in Kampala was a major milestone in the international community’s fight to combat impunity for the most serious crimes of international concern. The stocktaking of international criminal justice will help shape the future development of the court. The UK will now consider whether to ratify the amendment on the use of certain weaponry in a non-international armed conflict. The conference agreed a package, including the definition of the crime of aggression and the conditions for exercise of jurisdiction, to be put forward for discussion and possible adoption in 2017.
I thank the Minister for that reply. Is he aware—I am sure he is—of the considerable gratitude from across the world to the United Kingdom for the support which successive Governments have given to the ICC, as I learnt when I represented your Lordships’ House at an international meeting of parliamentarians for the ICC? Perhaps I may ask him a specific question about sexual violence, which is such a major and horrible aspect of war crimes and crimes against humanity. The Government pledged to the review conference to do more for victims, particularly victims of sexual violence. Can he tell us what the Government plan to do specifically to help victims of this deeply appalling crime?
I thank the noble Baroness for her comments, which of course apply equally to the previous and the present Government of the United Kingdom. The conference at Kampala adopted a resolution on the victims issue which recognised the rights of victims to have access to justice and to participate in judicial proceedings. That applied to victims generally. For our part, the United Kingdom is committed to tackling the problem of violence against women. We will continue to promote programmes in support of this agenda, including measures that will address the special needs of women and children in areas of conflict.
Will the Minister confirm the importance of the step taken in amending the Coroners and Justice Act, particularly in regard to enabling prosecutions of suspects for genocide, crimes against humanity and war crimes from 1 January 1991? However, can he also tell us how that will be implemented to enable, for example, the prosecution of suspects such as the four Rwandans who have been accused of war crimes but whose extradition failed last year, which has left us in a quandary?
In answer to my noble friend I can only express the hope that this will be resolved. The Kampala conference addressed these issues but did not reach any final conclusions. A great deal of the conference was simply carrying forward and firming up the work of the ICC in the light of its experience, of which my noble friend has just mentioned one example. I cannot give a more specific answer at this moment.
I congratulate the Government on the amendment to define aggression. However, does the noble Lord agree that the decision to defer its implementation until 2017 demonstrates that those who oppose international answerability are at least as determined as those who support it? Can he assure the House that the Government will oppose any further attempts to undermine what has been achieved?
I do not quite agree with the implication of the noble and learned Lord’s question although obviously I agree with him about the importance of the issue; it is a very complex question which was discussed in considerable detail at Kampala. The UK has a principled position: that the UN Security Council has primary responsibility for dealing with aggression. We maintain that that is right. If in the discussion the complexities of developing a further definition can be overcome, then the general purpose—all are agreed —is the right one. However, there are some obvious complexities here that need resolving. They are not in any way against carrying forward the concern with crimes of aggression; the only question is the technique and method by which that should be done.
My Lords, can the Minister confirm that an International Criminal Court arrest warrant still is outstanding against Joseph Kony, the leader of the Lord’s Resistance Army? The LRA has been responsible for some of the worst violations against women, such as those described by my noble friend Lady Stern a few moments ago, especially in the Democratic Republic of Congo and in Uganda, where it is estimated that the LRA has killed over 1 million people. Will he confirm that a letter was received by the Prime Minister only a week ago from a young woman called Juliet, who is here in London and who was herself raped by the LRA when she was just 12 years old?
The noble Lord, Lord Alton, always speaks with authority and knowledge on these issues. It is significant that this meeting was held in Kampala, and of course it is in Uganda that these arrest warrants are currently out for a number of people. It is also where some particularly horrific crimes appear to have occurred, including crimes against women, about which we were talking a moment ago. That is the position and I can only reaffirm what the noble Lord has said: this is a good example of where the ICC really can carry forward the causes of peace and justice together in what we hope is an effective way.
Does the noble Lord agree that it is very important that our allies operate under the same conditions as we do? Would he therefore tell us whether the Kampala conference has advanced at all the prospect of the United States committing to the International Criminal Court, and will the Government—both parts of the Government—encourage the United States to join?
I think that the answer is maybe. The United States sent 23 delegates to the Kampala conference; they all turned up and discussed these issues in detail. I asked those at the conference whether that will lead to a better prospect of the United States signing up to this but they were not sure of an answer. They say that the United States is involved in the discussions and interested in carrying matters forward, but the signs that it will actually put its signature to it are, I am afraid, still a bit fuzzy and remote.
(14 years, 1 month ago)
Lords ChamberMy Lords, with permission, I shall now repeat a Statement made in another place by my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary. The Statement is as follows.
“Mr Speaker, with permission, I will make a Statement on the outcome of the Kabul conference and on progress in Afghanistan.
My right honourable friend the Deputy Prime Minister today paid his respects to the four servicemen to die in Afghanistan in the past week. They died in the service of their country and the whole House will join me in expressing its gratitude to them and the British forces in Afghanistan. The past month has been a difficult one, but we should not lose sight of what has been achieved since the London conference on Afghanistan six months ago.
I would not want to minimise in any way to the House the immense challenges that we and our allies continue to face in Afghanistan, or the difficulties and dangers we continue to encounter on a daily basis. Bringing security and stability to Afghanistan remains an exceptionally demanding task for the men and women of our Armed Forces, our diplomatic service, and those involved in development. Their work is rarely less than outstanding on a daily basis. There will continue to be setbacks and discouragements, even while progress is being made. We must therefore always guard against over-optimism, but we must equally guard against listening only to bad news or failing to notice the millions of Afghans who want us to succeed.
In the past six months, our troops have consolidated their position in Helmand, taken the fight to the Taliban and trained hundreds of Afghan troops; our diplomats and aid workers have worked with Afghan colleagues to promote a more inclusive political process and intensify our work, including on education and governance; and the Government of Afghanistan have acted on their London commitments and drawn together for the first time a cross-government strategy to deliver widespread reform.
As the Prime Minister said, our objective is a stable Afghanistan able to maintain its own security and prevent al-Qaeda from returning, so that within five years we can drawdown British combat troops.
The NATO objective in Afghanistan is simple—to assist the Government of Afghanistan in exercising their authority and influence across the country, paving the way for reconstruction and effective governance. This requires the protection of the population, the provision of more effective governance at every level and the creation of an Afghan security force able to maintain security and prevent the return of Al-Qaeda. This is the strategy that UK forces are helping to implement, through their training and partnering of Afghan troops, and their efforts to create the opportunity for more effective local governance in central Helmand. General Petraeus, the newly appointed commander of ISAF, has made clear that this remains his approach.
Together with my right honourable friend the International Development Secretary, I attended the Kabul conference yesterday, following visits I made to China, Japan and Oman. Some 40 Foreign Ministers and international organisations—including the UN, NATO, the EU and the World Bank—attended, in what was an unprecedented event for Afghanistan. It was also unprecedented in the number of Muslim partners represented at such a conference. It showed the world that Afghanistan is increasingly able to run its own affairs, and was a further step in the process of transition from direct international military and civil intervention to Afghan leadership.
The conference issued a communiqué agreed among all participants, which builds on the progress made in the last six months. It establishes the Kabul process, an Afghan-led process which aims to accelerate Afghanistan’s ability to govern itself with accountable government, reduce dependence on the international community, enhance its security forces and provide better protection for the rights of all its citizens. This is a single implementation plan for the coming years. International donors including Britain have committed themselves to realign their funding behind the Kabul process. This is a significant achievement for a country as beset by conflict and poverty as Afghanistan. The Kabul process holds out the prospect of a more secure future for Afghans.
The Afghan Government made yesterday a number of important commitments: to concentrate efforts on a limited number of national programmes and projects to transform the lives of people and reinforce the relationship between state and citizens; to have Afghan security forces take the lead on security throughout the country by 2014 and to set up an Afghan NATO board to analyse whether provinces are ready to begin the transition process; to create a lean, effective and appropriately paid public service, retiring those civil servants who are unable to perform or are not needed in a renewed and revitalised civil service; to ensure that the wealth generated from the mining sector is invested to benefit future generations; to require new national development programmes to be designed with international partners to ensure the highest standards of accountability and transparency; to amend the criminal law to increase penalties for the failure to disclose assets and to take to trial Ministers and other high-ranking officials who do not comply; to strengthen the High Office of Oversight for Government Accountability and the Major Crimes Task Force in order to tackle corruption; to establish a commission to find ways to bring together the public and private sectors to stimulate accelerated economic growth; to work with parliament to strengthen its constitutionally mandated role; to improve financial management and agree a system with donors in order to allow more donor funds to be channelled through the Afghan budget.
This Afghan plan will be supported by the UK Government and by international partners. On 10 June, my right honourable friend the Prime Minister announced an additional £200 million in funding to promote stability and development over the next four years. My right honourable friend the International Development Secretary will set out further details on this in a Written Ministerial Statement tomorrow.
Britain will intensify and reinvigorate our development efforts, increasing the pace of work and the achievement of specific results, in line with the Government of Afghanistan’s priorities. We will work closely with the Afghans, the United States and others to accelerate the stabilisation effort in central Helmand and the 81 key districts targeted under the ISAF plan. We will work with others to ensure the successful implementation of the agreed peace and reintegration programme and help to support the forthcoming elections, and we will invest in improving the quality and effectiveness of the police. Our overall aim is speeding up the pace of transition to Afghan security leadership.
We will also support the Afghan economy and help new jobs through investment in mining, roads, power and irrigation, and by bringing community-driven development to isolated areas of the country. We will help the Government of Afghanistan to deliver vital services and to tackle corruption, providing increased support for education, including technical and vocational training, and for the administration of justice.
Our international partners have committed themselves to do their part to support the Kabul process. Afghanistan’s near neighbours will work to accelerate regional economic co-operation. An important milestone was reached in the days before the conference with the conclusion of the Afghanistan-Pakistan trade transit agreement. This much desired economic measure has taken some 40 years to achieve.
The Kabul process is a major step forward for Afghanistan and an important staging post in Afghanistan’s development. There remains more to do, notably in the areas of governance. Measures to enforce transparency, anti-corruption and accountability have slipped and need to be brought back on track as soon as possible.
We will pursue this and other issues as part of the follow-up to the conference. The Kabul process contains strengthened review mechanisms, which include a more robust Joint Co-ordination and Monitoring Board in Kabul and an overarching annual assessment, which will report to an annual Kabul ministerial conference. My department, the Ministry of Defence and the Department for International Development will be closely involved in that process.
The Kabul conference has established a road map for more professional, functioning and mature institutions. There will be other important milestones this year, including parliamentary elections, the NATO Lisbon summit and President Obama’s review. Her Majesty’s Government will build on these steps to help to put in place the conditions for a stable, secure and increasingly prosperous Afghanistan”.
That concludes the Statement.
I am grateful to the noble Baroness for her considerable number of very important questions. I shall do my best to answer them, taking them in the order in which she raised them.
A functioning justice system is vital—the noble Baroness is completely correct about that—and we welcome the progress which the Afghan Government have made already in crucial areas of justice reform. We are working with the Afghan Government to clarify how they intend to drive forward progress, and with the wider international community, including the European Union—which the noble Baroness rightly raised and reminded me of—to establish how best we can support justice reform in Afghanistan. This is a vital area. I leave no one in any doubt about that.
The noble Baroness said that no mention was made of the parliamentary elections. I thought that there was a mention but, if there was not, I will say now that they are coming up. I shall check the Statement in a moment—I have not had time while listening to all her questions. Obviously the elections are important and it is vital that they are conducted effectively and efficiently.
On the general question of objectives between now and 2015, there is a clear and firm commitment to work for the withdrawal of all combat troops by 2015. That was the clear statement by the Prime Minister yesterday and by other of his colleagues. Obviously after 2015 some troops will still be there for training purposes but that will be the end of the combat involvement. It seems more than reasonable—indeed it is a sensible and strategic task—to place that date. This is not a rush for the exit; it is nothing like that at all. This is a firm harness of pressure on both the Karzai Government and the Taliban underlining the fact that there will be an exact and organised timetable up to that period. It makes sense to have the firm date which has been agreed. Of course, there is a dovetailing with the plans of Mr Obama, which my right honourable friend the Prime Minister discussed with him yesterday.
The noble Baroness asked about Taliban negotiations. Our view is that there are Taliban moderates—that not all Taliban are extremists. We support any moves which President Karzai makes in making contact with them if they are people who commit to the overall framework of a unified Afghan nation and to the conduct of that nation in a civilian, non-violent and democratic way. If they are prepared to talk, we support President Karzai making contact with them.
The noble Baroness asked about the need for a firm plan. The Kabul process, which my right honourable friend has worked on in the past two days, is the transition plan. The long list of commitments that I read out in the Statement made by my right honourable friend describes the bones of the plan. Obviously one cannot work out exactly to the minute at which point different bits will be achieved, but here is a very detailed set of commitments which will be monitored.
The noble Baroness then turned to the immensely important issue of women’s rights, and she is absolutely correct to lay emphasis on this. The conference communiqué contained clear commitments on women’s rights, including implementing a national priority programme for human rights and civic responsibilities, mainstreaming gender equality across all programmes, and undertaking a human rights, legal awareness and civic education programme targeting communities across Afghanistan.
The noble Baroness is not right in saying that there were no representatives of women’s organisations at the conference. Representatives of civil society, including women’s organisations, were at the conference and presented a statement to participants on behalf of civil society organisations including women’s groups. In addition, a separate conference on women’s rights was organised by the Afghan women’s movement, which was attended by around 200 women from all 34 provinces in Afghanistan and played a key role in contributing to the civil society statement made at the conference. So, although I totally understand her concerns and priorities, I hope she will accept that the problem is at least recognised and is of course vital and central. There can be no balanced future for this nation without the role of women being fully and properly recognised in building that future.
I think that that covers most of the noble Baroness’s points. On the question of how the extra moneys will be spent, I cannot give precise details at this point, but a system has been set up to monitor them very carefully indeed. We are determined to see that there is no filtering away of these funds into corrupt practices or dubious activities. We will make absolutely sure that they are spent in effective programmes in line with what I know will be the wishes of your Lordships and indeed of the whole British people.
My Lords, I thank the Minister for repeating the Statement. May I, on behalf of the Cross Benches, offer profound sympathies to bereaved families and, once again, pay tribute to the courage of the forces fighting in the south of the country?
I would like to ask two very brief questions. First, in view of very recent events—the killing of soldiers—what measures are being taken to prevent and/or weed out any Taliban presence in the Afghan national army? The second question, which the Minister certainly alluded to, is what new measures will now be taken as a result of the Kabul conference to ensure that aid is actually used to build and improve infrastructure in the form of transport, health and education facilities?
I am very grateful to the noble Baroness both for her questions and, indeed, for the brevity of her questions.
Of the tragedies which we have seen in recent times, the appalling killing of military personnel, very tragically including three British soldiers, by a member of the Afghan forces was a horror. There have been other incidents of a similar kind, but I think that my answer has to be that there is no question of this being a general problem. It does not in any way deter us from the overriding commitment of moving forward to the transition and enabling a proper, well-trained Afghan force, and indeed Afghan police force, to take over the security of their own country. However, there has to be very careful monitoring and watching to make sure that this kind of tragedy does not occur. It is something that one just has to watch for. There can never be any guarantee that personnel will not somehow be perverted, twisted or lose control of themselves and do terrible things; but the whole system is being very carefully monitored and watched, and we hope and pray and work to ensure that it does not happen again.
As to the destinations of aid, these can be tightened up. Of course there have been criticisms that not all aid is reaching the right points. We have strengthened a number of the monitoring processes, and they will be even more strengthened as a result of the Kabul conference in order that we may continue with the infrastructure development, which has gone on apace. We should not underestimate the fantastic things that have been done in the years since the original invasion. I shall share with your Lordships one figure that quite surprised me when I looked at some of the briefing for today. The Afghan economy is growing incredibly fast—last year it grew at 22.5 per cent. We could do with that kind of growth here.
My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that Statement and welcome the £200 million in additional funding to support stability and development. I recognise that the Afghan Government, with our support, favour a broad dialogue with the Taliban—the noble Baroness, Lady Kinnock, spoke at some length today about what that means—but I wonder whether we are exercising leverage with Pakistan, which is critical to the success of our mission given the role of the Inter-Services Intelligence Agency in supporting the most violent and reactionary elements of the Taliban in terms of the reconciliation. Unless the Pakistanis lean on their friends to desist from disrupting the peace and reconciliation that there is, we are not going to get very far. I notice that the Foreign Secretary sets great store by the UK-Pakistan strategic dialogue. Does that include a security dimension, and are these talks happening in that format? Finally, will the Minister tell us whether the Prime Minister intends to appoint a new special envoy to Afghanistan given the departure of Sir Sherard Cowper-Coles? Surely a regional approach dealing with India, Pakistan and Afghanistan would be facilitated if we did not rely solely on the Americans and had our own sources of influence in those capitals.
I am grateful to my noble friend. On her second point, William Patey, a very able ambassador, is appointed to be our man in Kabul and fulfils that role. I had the pleasure of meeting him only two or three days ago when he was here. I was enormously impressed by his experience and grasp of the complexities. This is, in effect, not quite the replacement but the development of the role that Sherard Cowper-Coles had previously. He has now completed his assignment there.
Pakistan’s role is vital—my noble friend is completely correct. My right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary has visited Pakistan and discussed in detail with the Pakistani leadership how we can work more closely together, how we can support them, and how in particular they can achieve their twin aims: to defeat—that is a strong word—the Taliban elements on their own territories and their side of the border; and to help contain—that is perhaps not quite such a strong word—the Taliban activities on the other side of the border in the Pashtun-related areas. This dialogue is crucial. Without sensible progress on that front, there will be no stabilisation in Afghanistan. That is why we place the highest priority on a very close dialogue with our Pakistan colleagues.
I agree with every word that the Minister said about William Patey. He is an excellent diplomat, one in whom we can have the utmost confidence. Perhaps I may remind the Minister that, on a recent occasion when we discussed this issue, he assured the House that the 2015 date was not a “deadline”. It now seems that it is a firm date. It is a bit hard to discriminate between a firm date and a deadline. The problem is the implied comfort that it gives to the Taliban.
Can the Minister tell us what action is being taken in relation to Yemen? There is a genuine fear that the Taliban are melting away in the way that Osama bin Laden has evaded all capture over recent years, however hard the allied forces have tried. The Taliban will melt away into Yemen and will simply re-emerge after 2015. What can the Minister tell us about that?
I return to the point made by my noble friend Lady Kinnock. She did not say that there were no women at the conference. She said that the women at the conference did not feel that their concerns were being taken seriously. I can understand that. There are 10 important commitments in the Statement, but there is not a single mention of women, although the noble Lord in answering the question said that the issue was immensely important. If it is immensely important, why is it not mentioned properly and prominently in the Statement?
Women had a terrible time under the Taliban. We all remember those terrible newsreels of women being shot in the football stadium. The Government have to do better on bringing women’s points more to the fore. I would suggest that, among the many able women I see on the government Benches, it might be sensible to ensure that there is an envoy on women for Afghanistan so that we can be assured that women’s rights are being properly dealt with.
The noble Baroness again raises a vital point and perhaps I may reassure her. The communiqué also develops and strengthens commitments made initially at the London conference in January to implement the national action plan for women and the elimination of violence against women in law. The noble Baroness probably took part in that very constructive conference. Certainly, I would be the first to recognise the valuable work done by the previous Government in creating that conference and in providing a foundation on which to build.
We welcome the Afghan Government’s continuing commitment to protect the human rights of the Afghan people, which is enshrined in the Afghan constitution and the national action plan for women. If it was not in the 10 commitments in my right honourable friend’s Statement, I will note that and see that it is pointed out in my department. It is certainly plumb in the middle of the communiqué, which is valuable.
As to what women’s organisations felt, I am sorry if I got that slightly wrong. I thought that the noble Baroness, Lady Kinnock, was saying that they were not represented, but she did not say that; she said that they were not satisfied. I obviously cannot comment on the state of satisfaction except to say that the endeavour was there and the realisation is there, as is the central importance of women’s role in all this. Given the horrors of women’s treatment in the past and the evil viciousness with which under Taliban rule girls’ schools were closed, women were abused and so on, this issue could not be other than absolutely central to the future. I emphasise that and I am glad that the noble Baroness, Lady Symons, raised it again.
On the date by which combat troops will be withdrawn, I think that I said the other day—I am always ready for correction—that it was an aspiration. Perhaps that word was a little weak, because of course it remains an objective. However, one cannot in a thousand years be sure that everything will work exactly to plan. We just do not know. I think that the Deputy Prime Minister in another place made a point about it not necessarily being crystal clear or carved in concrete or whatever. That is our plan and our intention; it is the firm Kabul process and what it leads to.
As to the Taliban melting away and the old story that the Taliban disappears by day and comes back by night, one would not want to underestimate the fact that in the next five years—five years is a long time—there will not be a free ride for the Taliban. The combat troops—our marvellous troops—will continue to fight and to carry on their operations. The American surge army is still not complete. There are another 30,000 American troops to come. The Taliban will have a very hard time. If it thinks that at the end of five years it will be intact, it will have another think coming. I hope that that will reassure the noble Baroness to some extent on the important points that she raised.
My Lords, is my noble friend aware that there will be considerable sympathy in the House that he has to face these attacks over the incredibly difficult situation that this Government have inherited? I think that a more constructive approach would be generally welcome.
I quickly make the point that the noble Lord did not answer one question asked by the noble Baroness, which was whether there is any evidence that the Taliban has gone to Yemen. Al-Qaeda certainly has. Yemen is an extremely dangerous place. However, most of the Taliban who are killed by coalition forces are dying within 20 miles of where they were born. I strongly support the suggestion that the Government should not treat the Taliban as one uniform mass of hopeless people but recognise that in many cases the Taliban represents villages, different outlooks and different tribal backgrounds. We need to see whether we can establish a sensible dialogue with those who do not wish to see their country destroyed.
Undoubtedly, one of the most disappointing things relates to the amount of money that has gone—or was meant to go—into improving the condition of the people. Much of it has been wasted and or has not been possible to spend because of the lack of security. I welcome in the Statement the idea of concentrating on a few simple objectives so that the people of Afghanistan can see ringing benefits. In that connection, if we can concentrate on safe transport on main roads—so that people can get their goods to the market—electricity and water, people in Afghanistan will be able to see some real benefit coming from the brave work and tragedies that have gone into attempts to make the country secure.
This is going to cost a lot of money. One of our complaints in NATO is the lack of active military support from a lot of NATO members. Can I take it that those NATO members will at least be prepared to make substantial cash contributions to this continuing effort?
I thank my noble friend for his wise words. He is right, of course, that part of the battle is against young men who are near the homes where they were brought up, which makes it a local battle and not a nationwide battle at all. As to driving out al-Qaeda, there is evidence that there may be some al-Qaeda training units left in Afghanistan, but they have dispersed. People ask whether, in that case, we will look at other areas where they may have gone—Yemen, Somalia and so on. We have to watch these things carefully, but it is fairly clear that al-Qaeda is more dispersed and that the comfort that it originally had, using Afghanistan under the protection of the Taliban for its operations, has been significantly disrupted to the benefit of our security and that of the wider world.
We are contributing more resources and we are looking to our allies to make similar contributions—obviously, the Americans are making a substantial contribution. We think that this money can be focused on the real needs of the Afghan people, although I repeat that we should not underestimate the fact that in some areas—not all—very remarkable progress has been made in recent years. There are signs of the return of real economic growth and growing prosperity for a people who have suffered very greatly in the past.
My Lords, I presume that the clearly stated NATO aim in the Statement applies also to all other countries that are at this moment helping and supporting Afghanistan. We hear quite a lot about Pakistan and its involvement but we hear little about India, yet there are reports of considerable and growing Indian influence within Afghanistan. Can the Minister tell the House whether India was represented at the Kabul conference and whether it is a signatory to the motives behind the NATO objective?
I am pretty sure that India was represented at the Kabul conference, as were the other regional powers. We are concerned to see that regional co-operation is strengthened. As to the particular documents that India signed, I will have to write to the noble Lord with the details, but clearly India is a key part in this. I have absolutely no doubt that, when my right honourable friends visit India in considerable numbers the week after next, this issue will be high on the agenda.
In order to help us to assess progress in the future, can the Minister tell the House in how many of the 34 provinces the Afghan Government’s writ effectively runs? When we talk about an Afghan Government, in how many of the provinces does that mean anything?
I cannot say precisely because the situation is fluid and any figure that I hazarded for the noble Lord at this moment may well be wrong. Certainly the strategy is to increase the number steadily over the next five years. As each area becomes manageable under the Afghan authorities and Afghan security forces, it will be possible for the international military forces to run down. I cannot give him a precise, mathematical figure. I shall try to find out for him and send him a note about it.
My Lords, I welcome the Statement on the Kabul process but feel that an opportunity has been missed today. The Minister referred to the Written Statement that is to be issued, but why could we not have had a joint Statement on development and diplomacy at the same time? That would have given the Minister a better opportunity to reply to the noble Baroness, Lady Kinnock, on the role of women and civil society.
I echo the words of the noble Lord, Lord King, and point to the corruption that has occurred in large projects, many involving American security firms and people with whom the Afghans have nothing to do. If we are to have an Afghan-led process, must we not now concentrate on the non-governmental organisations, which are not mentioned today but will be in the Written Statement from DfID? I hope that the Minister will emphasise that to his ministerial colleagues.
I am grateful to the noble Earl. My department is working extremely closely with DfID and the Ministry of Defence on all these matters. This was a question of the best method of informing both the other place and your Lordships’ House. It was deemed that the Foreign Secretary should set out the overarching details today, which I have repeated, and that other of my right honourable colleagues should set out the parts that they are going to play. I have no doubt that there will be Statements beyond the one from the Secretary of State for International Development. That is the way in which information will come forward. My Statement was long enough; if I had covered other departments’ aspects, your Lordships would have become a little weary. However, I take the point. This is an overarching and coherent strategy that runs across departments here and right across the scene in Afghanistan.
The question of sub-national governance activity is very important. The task force co-ordinated by the Afghan Independent Directorate of Local Governance and UNAMA and the sub-national governance policy passed by the Afghan Government in March are being strengthened. They are important steps towards strengthening local government and district delivery. The noble Earl touches on the even more fundamental point that, although in every one of these endeavours Governments can do great things and signatories can approve government documents, it is at the sub-governmental, semi-governmental, non-governmental and voluntary level that often the real weaving together of a better future is achieved.
(14 years, 1 month ago)
Lords Chamber
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what assessment they have made of the recent bombing in Kampala, Uganda.
My Lords, we were deeply shocked to hear of these attacks, and I offer my heartfelt sympathies to the families and friends of those who were killed or injured. I echo my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary's condemnation of these terrible events. The UK is supporting Uganda in its investigations and stands ready to do more. We remain committed to promoting peace and stability in east Africa and support all efforts to tackle the threat from Somalia.
My Lords, I am very grateful to the Minister for that reply. Have the Government had any contact with the Ugandan authorities regarding the 20 or so Somali and Ugandan people who have been identified as being involved with the bombings? Are the Government aware of the growing concerns about the re-emergent Allied Democratic Forces in the DRC linking up with al-Shabaab and creating terror across the region? Finally, are the Government reviewing the deployment of United Kingdom resources and personnel to assist with counterterrorism training across the Great Lakes region?
The answer is yes to all three of my noble friend’s questions. The Foreign Secretary has spoken to Mr Kutesa, the Ugandan Foreign Secretary, here in London. My honourable friend Mr Bellingham, the Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, will be in Kampala next week and will also discuss matters with the Ugandan Government and with Mr Kutesa. We are aware of precisely the worries that my noble friend describes. If, as it claims, al-Shabaab is behind this, and if, as it appears, it is quite friendly with al-Qaeda and other sinister forces, there is a real worry about security which should concern us all. As for supporting Ugandan efforts, particularly through the AMISOM force, we have said that we will do everything that we can to support that, and indeed will do more than we are doing now.
My Lords, will the Minister join me in saluting the bravery of the Ugandan troops who serve in Somalia and the tens of thousands of other troops from the poorest countries in the world who serve in United Nations peacekeeping missions in some of the most dangerous parts of the world? Will he confirm to the House that the United Kingdom and Uganda continue to work together in the United Nations Security Council and elsewhere to improve the effectiveness of those peacekeeping missions and the involvement of troop-contributing countries in the decisions about peacekeeping missions and their execution?
Yes, I can confirm what the noble Lord rightly says. AMISOM consists predominately of Ugandan troops but also has Burundian troops. There is no doubt in my mind that the UN generally needs a stronger and more co-ordinated strategy to deal with the Somalia threat. However, we do not take the view that this is the right time yet for a full-blown UN peacekeeping force, because frankly there is no peace there to keep. Supporting and reinforcing AMISOM is therefore our declared preference at the moment.
My Lords, does this incident not indicate that there is a continuing, and indeed an increasing, threat of terrorism from Somalia as well as from al-Qaeda in other parts of the world? Notwithstanding the fact that there is to be a comprehensive spending review, will the Minister give this House a categorical assurance that there will be no cutbacks in the money available to our security and intelligence services?
I cannot anticipate the fine detail of the strategic defence review, but I can certainly say that it is clearly and rightly a supreme priority that we look after our security and that we have the wider reach necessary around the world to safeguard our security and prevent the growing development of sources and activities that may lead to horrors being visited on our own country.
My Lords, is the Minister aware that European Union advisers, under a Spanish commander, are currently training Somalis loyal to the Government in Mogadishu and that they are being billeted with the Ugandans? That was not mentioned. Will he confirm the Government’s support for this programme, and indeed for the need to ensure that they receive a salary to avoid the risk of any defection among those European Union-trained troops when they go back to Somalia?
I was not aware of the detail which the noble Baroness, who is very well informed in this area, has put to me of that arrangement, but I confirm that we want to support all efforts, particularly those of the Ugandans, who seem undeterred by this horror and who are determined to maintain and indeed reinforce AMISOM, to ensure that the Transitional Federal Government in Mogadishu are supported and that the forces trying to overthrow them are minimised. It requires efforts on all fronts, I fully agree.
My Lords, is the Minister aware of the number of Somali communities in this country, and will the Department for Communities and Local Government look at what the impact of these events will be on those communities?
I will look into that. This will affect not only Somali communities but Somaliland communities, and it is very important to bear in mind that there are those two communities here. I will certainly pursue the matter which the right reverend Prelate raises.
My Lords, the Government in the past have said repeatedly that there is no evidence that the proceeds of piracy off the coast of Somalia are not going into the hands of terrorist groups like al-Shabaab. Is that still the case?
I think I am right in saying that there is no hard evidence but it seems a possibility and a likelihood. A great many sinister things are happening in that part of the world. It could well be that resources from piracy are going in that direction and, similarly, that the piracy is being supported by those who wish to destabilise the whole area.
(14 years, 1 month ago)
Lords Chamber
To ask Her Majesty’s Government what plans they have for the BBC World Service.
My right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary has described as essential the role of the BBC World Service in helping to deliver an ambitious foreign policy agenda. We continue to respect its complete editorial independence, and it is of course respected worldwide for its balanced and well informed programmes. The BBC World Service is funded through the Foreign and Commonwealth Office through grant in aid. In line with the rest of Whitehall, we face budget pressures and are carefully scrutinising all expenditure. The BBC World Service is not exempt from that ongoing process.
My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that reply. Will he also remember some other words of the now Foreign Secretary last year:
“Britain will be safer if our values are strongly upheld and widely respected in the world”?
The World Service has an audience of 180 million people a week across the globe—a figure far higher than that of any other international broadcaster. Is not the World Service an unrivalled way of demonstrating the values of this country?
I heartily endorse everything that my noble friend, with his considerable experience, rightly says. The World Service is an immensely powerful network for soft power and for underpinning and promoting the values for which we all stand. Everything that he says is right.
Does the Minister agree that in these very unstable times there is a clear need for unbiased and independent news and information, which is uniquely provided by the BBC World Service? Does he also agree that a 25 per cent cut will inevitably lead to challenges that the World Service will find difficult to meet? That is what is being proposed and it is an unacceptable threat to the world’s most respected broadcaster.
I certainly agree with the first point that the noble Baroness makes. Indeed, one wants to see a well funded and effective BBC World Service, but she has to recall that under her Government a substantial cut was imposed as a result of the fall in the value of sterling, which must have hurt a lot. Under the cuts announced on 22 June by my right honourable friend the Chancellor, the BBC World Service has to make a modest further contribution and—I have to say, given the appalling financial situation that we have had to unscramble and are still unscrambling—there will be further spending-round cuts. That is unavoidable and we will all have to share them.
My Lords, given the general recognition that peace in our world requires more religious understanding and peace between religions, does the noble Lord share my disappointment that over the past 10 years the religious programming output of the World Service has dropped to a third of what it was before?
Yes, I share the right reverend Prelate’s disappointment. Although this is strictly a matter for the editorial decision of the BBC World Service and has nothing to do with government guidance, I share his view and hope that some changes may be possible. However, that is a personal view.
My Lords, one of the lessons that we should learn from the Cold War is that benighted people living in beleaguered lands were often told the truth as a result of BBC World Service transmissions. Particularly in this day and age, against the hubbub of internet transmissions often made by extremist organisations with their partisan agendas, is it not more important than ever to do as the noble Lord, Lord Fowler, said and maintain our maximum support for the BBC World Service?
It certainly is. The noble Lord, Lord Alton, is absolutely right and I emphasise that the overall budget still allocated is substantial, has risen substantially over the years, and amounts to more than 20 per cent—possibly almost 25 per cent—of the total budget of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office. We are talking about very large sums of money backing the BBC World Service, not small sums.
My Lords, the FCO is not ring-fenced like DfID and clearly always looks to the grant-in-aid bodies such as the British Council and the World Service when cuts come. Can the Minister confirm that the BBC Arabic TV service and the BBC Persian service are both at risk and explain how that coincides with the vision statement of the Foreign Secretary on 1 July this year, when he spoke of extending our “global reach and influence”?
My Lords, the question of what services are adjusted, reviewed and so on is for the BBC World Service. The Arabic service is under review, not, I think, for funding reasons but because impact and competition have been the problem. The Farsi service continues to be well funded, as my right honourable friend the Prime Minister said the other day in the other place.
My Lords, in view of the rather ominous last sentence in the Minster’s original Answer, I ask whether he is aware that the World Service has made cuts in the last two financial years of some £11 million. It is making strenuous efforts to use the new technologies and reduce costs. If the Foreign Office grant is cut, can we not look to DfID to make up any shortfall?
My Lords, it is possible that some of the BBC World Service activities can be categorised as overseas aid and could be supported by DfID. I know that matter is being looked at. The other problem for the BBC World Service is that, as the shortwave transmission systems tend to become outdated, it has to seek transfer on to FM systems with local co-operation of local stations around the world. I am afraid that all that costs money. The cuts in the past as the result of the fall in sterling were bitter and tough. The cuts under the 22 June restraints announced by the Chancellor are modest. For the future, I can only say that I totally share your Lordships’ view that this is an immensely valuable service. We will do our best to safeguard it but we are not ring-fenced.
My Lords, while understanding the need to make necessary cuts, as a former Development Minister I recommend that my noble friend has a serious talk with the Department for International Development. It is engaged in much valuable education work. That is also what the BBC World Service does. That should be a shared responsibility, not one falling solely upon the Foreign Office.
My Lords, my noble friend is absolutely right and I always listen closely to her recommendations. This is a correct recommendation: we are having such close talks. The possibilities for the future are there but it remains the fact that the World Service is independent, financed by grant in aid. It is an immensely valuable tool, as my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary said, in the promotion not only of this country’s interest but of peace and stability throughout the entire world.
(14 years, 1 month ago)
Lords ChamberMy Lords, the Maldives Cabinet was reappointed on 7 July following its resignation on 29 June. This represents a step towards the restoration of political stability. We continue to monitor closely developments and press the Government and Opposition to co-operate on the key issues of national interest.
Two Members of Parliament have been released but the Deputy Speaker of the Maldives remains under house arrest. We have stressed to the Government the importance of all being treated in accordance with Maldivian law.
My Lords, does the Minister share my disappointment that President Nasheed seems to be reverting to the bad habits of his predecessor, which he criticised at the time, of arresting MPs—which has been declared illegal by the Supreme Court—and pressurising the Maldivian media and the courts? Will the United Kingdom Government use all their contacts—governmental, party and personal, as the Foreign Secretary is a good friend of President Nasheed—to ensure that all democratic freedoms are restored as quickly as possible?
We are pursuing full encouragement through our high commission in Colombo and other means to ensure that democratic development continues. We regard the restoration of the Cabinet as a step forward. We have a friendly, constructive and supportive interest in the sound stability of the Maldives and we will continue on that path.
Is my noble friend aware that the Maldives is no longer a protectorate of the United Kingdom? The country has gone from being a sultanate to a single party presidential system, to—with all our support—a democratic society. That being the situation, what role do we have at all to interfere in what is in fact the Maldivian exercise of democracy as they interpret it?
The word “interfere” is wrong. It is supportive because we and other democracies have a concern about the dangers of extremism taking hold in communities such as this throughout the world. This would lead to immensely damaging consequences for neighbours and ourselves, so we have a broad concern and the idea of friendship and support. In return, the Maldives has been a good supporter of our interests in the whole region. The Maldives has of course been very strong in its support for sensible and balanced concerns over climate change, including having a Cabinet meeting underwater, though I understand there are no plans for the British Government to do the same.
My Lords, I appreciate the Minister’s concern for what is happening in the Maldives. However, can he turn his eye to what has happened in relation to Palestinian parliamentarians? The Government of Israel, having imprisoned 40 of them for four years, are now threatening to deport four of them for the crime of living in east Jerusalem.
Of course that is a matter of concern, but it is miles outside the scope of this Question.
My Lords, will the Minister confirm that the Government are working directly with regional governments, especially the Sri Lanka Government, who have been involved to some extent? Will he also confirm that the European Union, as a major donor to the Maldives, is actively working to assist in efforts to find a resolution to this crisis? Is this not essential, when so much is at stake, not least, as the Minister said, the threat to foreign investment and the need to deal with the massive fiscal deficits which the Maldives has?
The noble Baroness is correct that the Sri Lankan Minister has been there and played an important part, as has the US ambassador. I am not sure about EU representation at the moment, but it obviously has an interest. We are working with all our partners in a proper concern to see that this republic prospers, without in any way interfering, as was suggested in an earlier question.
Does my noble friend agree that representations to the Government of the Maldives would be a lot easier to make if the diplomatic representation was present there rather than in Sri Lanka?
That is certainly true, but there have to be constraints on our resources. The high commission in Colombo is very active and a British official is now in the Maldives and about to attend a major climate conference in the coming week.
(14 years, 1 month ago)
Lords ChamberMy Lords, the Government are committed to upholding human rights and democracy in our foreign policy. Freedom of expression is fundamental to a democratic, accountable society and to the protection of other human rights. The coalition will support effective international efforts to address impunity for attacks on journalists and practices which curtail the right to freedom of opinion and expression. We will also raise with Governments individual cases where freedom of expression is threatened.
I thank the noble Lord for that reply. Does he agree that the situation is worrying enough with the accumulating evidence from Iraq, Philippines, Algeria, Rwanda, Laos and Cuba, but that, when one considers that in the two years between 2007 and 2009 12 journalists were assassinated in Russia and that there has been no convincing prosecution in any of those incidences, profound questions are raised about our colleague member country in the Council of Europe with all its principles? Will the Government make a rigorous stand to say that it is impossible to accept a trend of this kind in the context of a commitment to the growth of democracy and accountable government?
My Lords, I strongly agree. These are repulsive occurrences wherever they occur and I salute the campaigning zeal of the noble Lord in his feelings on this matter. He mentioned three countries where I agree that some very ugly things have occurred. I have a long list of the areas where we, the Government, are seeking to help and work with the relevant Governments to tackle the terrorising, murder and threatened assassination of journalists, including in Russia, Mexico and the Philippines, as the noble Lord said, as well as in Afghanistan and Iraq. If he would like, I will send him the list, but it is long. We are determined to use what influence we have, which is bound to be limited in some cases, in all these horrific instances.
My Lords, do my noble friend and Her Majesty's Government accept that an attack on a journalist is not merely an attack on a profession and a professional? Because of the extremely important part that journalists play in democratic governance and in holding Governments and others to account, an attack on a journalist in the way described by the noble Lord, Lord Judd, is an attack on democracy. Therefore, countries which do not maintain the special place of journalists and protect them are countries which cannot properly be regarded as truly democratic, as our own can be.
My noble friend is absolutely right to put it in those terms. An attack on freedom of expression and responsible journalism anywhere is an attack on, as it were, the supply chain which leads directly to our own freedoms in this country.
My Lords, will the Minister confirm that Iran in prison tortures and harasses more journalists than any other country in the world? What recent representations have the Government made to that vile regime about these continuing abuses of human rights?
I cannot confirm the precise figure, although I suspect that the noble Lord is right. Given the limitations of our contacts, we seek where we can to make the case—and to urge the lobbies and the countries which have got some influence to press all the time—that these kind of things are not acceptable in countries which seek to be part of the comity of nations and do not want to be branded as anti-democratic pariahs.
My Lords, is the correlation between freedom of association and free trade unions, and the inverse correlation with the number of assassinations, being noted by the Foreign Office? It is not surprising that this is so. Will the noble Lord take into consideration that support for the ILO principles of free trade unionism will be helpful in connection with my noble friend’s Question?
Again, the noble Lord is right. Our freedom is not the sort of thing that you can slice up in different areas. It is a bundle, a grouping of inalienable freedoms and core principles by which we have to stand. People say, “Why bother about the rest of the world?”, but it is in our interests at least to inspire others to follow our own principles and standards, even if we cannot guarantee that they will be accepted.
My Lords, my noble friend has said that he would make available the list of countries. When he puts that list in the Library, would he be kind enough to add beside each name on that list the last time Her Majesty's Government made a formal representation to a representative of the Government of those countries so that we can understand how actively this matter is being pursued, given its importance?
I will do my best to do that, but a number of the approaches are informal and some are continuous. Some have had an impact, as in Mexico, where we have had a lot of co-operation with the Mexican Government. Of course it is their concern, but they have welcomed our help in meeting the horrors of the assassination of journalists and other killings that have taken place.
My noble friend Lord Judd is right to raise these important issues. Is the Minister aware of the murder of a well known and respected Rwandese journalist, Jean Rugambage? Many NGOs and others are claiming that he was a victim of the current clampdown on the independent press and media in Rwanda in the run-up to the presidential elections. Can the Minister assure the House that strong representations have been and will be made by the UK to the Rwandan Government on the need for freedom of expression and freedom of the press?
The noble Baroness is right to raise this. Our embassy engages regularly with the Media High Council of the Rwandan Government and a range of journalists in Rwanda. We are very concerned not only about the case she mentioned but also about the reduction in media freedoms over recent months, including the closure of two independent media outlets and the BBC Kinyarwanda service. We have raised these concerns with the Government and, I should add, we support training for journalists working on both sides of the Rwandan/Democratic Republic of Congo border. These matters assume an additional and critical importance for us because Rwanda is now a member of the Commonwealth.
My Lords, as we try to maintain the freedom of the press and the media throughout the world, what steps are the Government taking to make sure that the BBC World Service receives all the encouragement and support it needs?
My noble friend knows that the service most certainly does receive encouragement and, more than just fine words, it gets very substantial funds. I think that the current outlay for the year is £231 million, which is considerably more than some years ago and is a reflection of the priority we place on the service in the promotion of this country’s culture of diplomacy, reputation, interests and long-term aims.
(14 years, 1 month ago)
Lords ChamberMy Lords, I join noble Lords in thanking my noble and learned friend Lord Howe, one of our wisest Foreign Secretaries and someone whom I greatly respect, for initiating this debate and on seizing the moment. I shall turn to some of the things that he said in a moment.
I greatly enjoyed the maiden speech of my old colleague, my noble friend Lord Maples, who speaks with great expertise. He rightly focused on the need to identify and promote our national interests in this complicated world, a matter that is sometimes forgotten. I am also grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Symons, who has just summed up from her side. I think that her broad strategic stance was supportive, although she asked many detailed questions, which I shall try to answer, although in less than 20 minutes I cannot possibly do justice to all the points that have been made in the debate.
At least one central message emerges vividly and insistently from the debate: the global landscape has changed and is changing significantly. That point was made with eloquence by my noble and learned friend Lord Howe, by the noble Lord, Lord Desai, by my noble friend Lady Williams, by the noble Baroness, Lady Taylor, and by many others. International events and trends that may seem far removed from our day-to-day domestic concerns are proving decisive in shaping everyone’s lives in this country. We are entering a less western age and in some ways a more dangerous and unpredictable age. Against that background, there is an ever more urgent need for clear direction, objectives and purposes in our nation’s foreign policy, as the noble Lord, Lord Kerr of Kinlochard, rightly insisted. That is what my right honourable friend the Prime Minister and the Foreign and Commonwealth Secretary have been regularly spelling out over the past few weeks. As many noble Lords have observed, only this morning my right honourable friend the Foreign Secretary set out these matters again in a major scene-setting and strategic survey.
Of course we want to maintain a close and frank relationship with the United States and a positive and fully constructive role with our fellow European Union states. As the Foreign Secretary has said, we shall be highly active within the European Union and we shall urge our fellow members to overcome the severe current challenges that they face and to adapt to the needs and demands of the new global landscape. Mr Hague has also said that we shall reach out to work with Europe’s smallest states, as we did in the more distant past, a view that I greatly welcome.
Aside from those almost obvious positioning statements, we will also have our own agenda, which, as the Foreign Secretary has also explained, will require new forms of engagement. The key underlying themes in this new approach will be: first, bringing strategic decisions about our foreign policy, our security policy and our development programmes together in a National Security Council—that is already done; secondly, building up vigorous British bilateral engagements beyond Europe and North America, including new partnerships in the Gulf and with the rising Asian, Latin American and other powers; thirdly, working to reform international institutions to maximise their effectiveness and to develop new platforms; and, fourthly, upholding the highest values of our society while we pursue our legitimate interests and contribute to an increasingly interwoven world.
We need to use every ounce of our united brainpower, national talents, intelligence and experience to handle and influence this new world and to reconstruct and preserve our own national strength and prosperity. Obviously the threat of financial turmoil these past two years has been extremely difficult and great, but that does not mean that this is the time for the UK to retreat from the international stage. On the contrary, it is the coalition’s view that we should move forward with renewed purpose and carve out a distinct foreign policy that truly promotes our interests in the wider sense.
It may be said—and I want to reflect what has already been said in this debate—that our obviously constrained national resources cannot possibly support such a newly ambitious approach to foreign policy or to the work of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office. Indeed, the resource issue has been raised by many of your Lordships, including my noble and learned friend, Lord Howe, the noble Lords, Lord Butler and Lord Hannay, the noble Baroness, Lady Williams, and many, many others. We may be criticised, but we have inherited an appalling situation and savings have to be found.
In answer to the point made by the noble Baroness, Lady Symons, we want to sustain the scholarship programme. I will write to her about the details as they arise from the recently announced list of cuts made by my right honourable friend, but we are fully aware of the significance of the scholarship element in our relationships. However, we strongly believe generally that more can be done with less—indeed, it must be—and with a more skilful balance of resources on the overseas side, and that economic recovery will strengthen our diplomacy and our international capacities as they must be strengthened. If that sounds like wishful thinking, I urge your Lordships, as did my noble and learned friend Lord Howe, to glance at the most recent Chatham House pamphlet, Rethinking the UK’s Role in a Changing World, which shows how a realistic path forward for our country can be shaped. Indeed, it echoes much of the thinking that informs our new policy.
Our new approach requires that much stronger bilateral bonds must be forged with such key centres of influence as Japan, South Korea—incidentally, the G20 summit, which the Prime Minister will attend, will be held there next November—India, Malaysia, South Africa, Brazil, Turkey, the central Asian republics and the Gulf states. In particular, as the Foreign Secretary made clear this morning and many times before, it means elevating significantly our links with India and China, to which Hong Kong continues to provide a brilliant gateway, as the noble Lord, Lord Wilson, who knows more about this than most people, reminded us a moment ago. These are the new nations of universities, technology, advanced skills and capital investment right across the globe—Chinese investment is everywhere—and of massive new consumer markets with which we have both to relate and to compete and which we must address with respect, understanding and language skills, as the noble Lord, Lord Kerr, rightly reminded us.
Our approach means that, rather than just resting on our already extensive membership of international institutions, we have to connect to new global platforms such as the so-called BASIC platform—Brazil, South Africa, India and China—and to a reinvigorated Commonwealth network, to which my noble friend Lord Sheikh rightly referred. We want a Commonwealth which develops a flourishing soft power network of similar values and offers a direct source of benefit to our international purposes and interests—a role which I believe it can fulfil, and which I am personally determined to ensure that it does.
Our more intense contacts will not be confined to government channels. We will encourage a structure of linkages—many already in existence—through trade, educational exchange and services, culture, sport, science and active informal networks. Parliament, its committees, and the universities, with their growing outreach, about which the wonderful lady behind me—my noble friend Lady Morris—referred, will play a key and expanding role in the widened interface between our nation and others. All those points will reinforce our strategy.
One of this Government's first actions was to create a National Security Council. The council will provide a coherent government response to face the challenges and potential threats to our national security, including the situation in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iran, the Middle East, and the threat of nuclear proliferation, about which the noble Baroness, Lady Williams, spoke so eloquently and with such expertise.
I realise that time is against us in these debates and does not allow me to explore with your Lordships all those subjects in greater detail. I hope that your Lordships will forgive a brief, broad-brush approach. In the remaining few minutes, I should like to outline the Government’s foreign policy intentions toward the areas that I listed.
The top national security and foreign policy priority at the moment is, of course, Afghanistan, about which your Lordships have spoken. Our objective is to help the Afghans reach the point at which they can look after their own security without presenting a danger to the rest of the world. The sooner that the Afghan state and the Afghan security forces can withstand the range of security threats that are currently in the country, the sooner our troops, who have made such sacrifices, will be able to come home. Of course, our aspiration is that they should come home in due course, by a certain time—but that is an aspiration.
Recognising that our time here today is limited, let me say something about Pakistan, which my right honourable friend has just visited—a country whose fortunes, like ours, are entwined with those of neighbouring Afghanistan. The Government want to help to ensure the democratic, stable and prosperous future that the Pakistani people deserve. Myriad ties bind the UK and Pakistan together, and Britain will continue to support Pakistan in the difficult challenges that it now faces.
To come even closer to home, my honourable friend the Minister with responsibility for the Middle East, Mr Jeremy Browne, set out the Government's policy towards the Middle East region two weeks ago. He made the point that we are extremely well placed to work in partnership with the countries of the Middle East in a way that benefits their peoples and ours. The countries of the Middle East and the Gulf will continue to be essential suppliers of the world's energy needs, and there are similar mutual benefits of flows of trade and investment between Britain and the region. This week, I had the pleasure of welcoming trade delegations from Egypt and Saudi Arabia, and the honour of meeting their respective Ministers for trade and industry. As the noble Baroness, Lady Symons, reminded us, we have launched a joint task force with the United Arab Emirates as part of that process. I reaffirm to her, as I think she already knows, that the Government have appointed Mark Prisk, Minister of State at the BIS department, to cover trade—admittedly, on a temporary basis. We have further intentions on that front, but Mr Prisk is the Minister in place, with reinforcement from many other Ministers.
We will also work to try to resolve the Arab-Israeli conflict, the poison of the Middle East, support the proximity talks which are currently under way, and pursue the concerns so graphically described by the noble Lord, Lord Wright of Richmond, my noble friend Lady Morris—whose name has now come back into my overloaded mind—and the noble Lord, Lord Hylton.
We remain resolved in addressing the international concerns about Iran’s nuclear programme and the role that that programme could play in creating havoc and instability in the Middle East. We accept the obvious point that Iran’s neighbours have a key role. Indeed, as the noble Lord, Lord Hylton, suggested, Turkey may have an increasing importance in this respect as it readjusts its foreign policy position—not immediately favourably to the West but, in the long run, possibly in a very favourable way indeed. There are some very interesting developments going on there.
We will continue to work with the European Union as well as with NATO and other powers to counter yet another threat, not much mentioned in this debate, which comes from Somali piracy. The international response to the very dangerous situation in the Gulf of Aden and the wider Indian Ocean has seen unprecedented levels of co-operation and co-ordination between the EU, NATO and independently deployed navies. That comprehensive approach is very interesting as it is relevant not only in that kind of environment but in dealing with other security challenges and threats which require an innovative mix of military and non-military responses—hard power and soft power interwoven. In fact a broader recognition that the channels of influence now lie in less traditional places, such as the G20, will be the key to future stability.
We have got to look beyond our traditional horizons for our energy security and energy needs. The emerging economies all need reliable and affordable energy to develop further, but that has a direct impact not only on climate change but on worldwide energy security. There is huge growth of demand for energy in oil-producing Middle East countries which are becoming major consumers as well as producers. We are working with countries such as China and India to help develop, make economic and deploy cleaner technologies, such as carbon capture and storage, and to improve energy efficiency in a vast range of new ways being developed by technology. There is the fascinating development of shale gas, which has changed the energy landscape in the US. If it is replicated elsewhere, it could be fundamental in altering the energy vista in every continent, with great rewards for countries as far afield as China and Poland, although there are some uncertainties about how the whole development can be managed. Other countries, such as Brazil, with its enormous oil finds and sugar cane biofuel, also have a great deal to offer the United Kingdom and the European Union, but we need to make sure that they see British companies and a transparent, open and global market as being in their best interests.
There is a point that I should make to the noble Lord, Lord Hannay, and other noble Lords about the strategic defence review. It will be guided by foreign policy requirements. It would be absurd if it were narrowed into the silos of departmental Whitehall, of which the noble Lord, Lord Butler, reminded us. That is not our approach at all. We have to embrace our thinking in all these areas within the overall framework of our positioning in the world, our foreign policy and our purposes, which in turn reflect back into the greater social cohesion in our own country with its many minorities and multi-ethnic patterns.
We will support closely the opening out of all links, supply chains and investment flows that take us deep into the great emerging markets of today and tomorrow. We badly want to see the Doha round of trade liberalisation help this process. In doing so, we will all along strive at the same time—and it will not be easy—to uphold our commitments to human rights, political freedoms, open and free trade, capital flows and poverty reduction. We will do this by working more closely with our economic partners than ever before. These are big tasks, which this coalition Government are not afraid to tackle. There are big challenges, which the coalition is not afraid to surmount in a united fashion. This is plainly what the country now wants and what it is now our duty to deliver.