Children’s Social Care

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

Tuesday 19th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Tyler of Enfield (LD)]

My Lords, I also welcome the Government’s Statement on the reform of children’s social care. Such reform is long overdue. For far too long, children’s social care has been the Cinderella of the Cinderella that is social care, so let us hope that this bodes well for a long overdue reform of adult social care.

With almost half of children in care now living out of area, and children still being placed in unregistered accommodation—even caravans and tents sometimes, I am told—coupled with the egregious levels of profiteering by some children’s residential home providers, this clearly demonstrates a system in crisis, if not broken. I am glad the Government are taking steps to address this, particularly requiring placement providers to share their finances transparently with the Government. The whole system needs fundamental overhaul.

First, could the Minister tell me what level of profit the department will deem appropriate? If profit levels do not reduce, how quickly would the Secretary of State introduce a profit cap? For Ofsted to effectively exercise its new powers, the regulator must have the necessary capacity and expertise. Addressing profiteering and ensuring financial transparency requires a sophisticated understanding of the sometimes opaque ownership structures used by the big corporate groups behind care provision. What assurances can the Minister give me that Ofsted will have both the staff numbers, and critically, the expertise to do this work effectively?

On the sufficiency of placements, national data published last week shows that 45% of all children in care in England are now living out of area, and 22% are living far from home. What steps is the department taking to ensure accurate data about the sufficiency of places, at both a national and a local level, and what assessment has it made of the impact of its proposed measures in preventing children in care being moved out of area?

I strongly welcome the renewed focus on early intervention and family care, keeping children out of care in the first place, and I look forward to hearing more about this in the coming period.

As we have already heard from the noble Baroness, Lady Barran, kinship carers are unsung heroes who often step up at a moment’s notice to look after family members. So, can the Minister say whether the Government will now commit to moving beyond the limited pilots that have been proposed to a universal allowance for kinship carers, on a par with those received by foster carers?

No young person should leave care having had support just stripped away when they turn 18, so I welcome the steps announced to end that care cliff edge so that young people are better supported into adulthood. The Government’s plans to legislate for Staying Close to support all care leavers up to 25 is a good first step. However, do the Government plan to extend the Staying Put scheme to the age of 25, as well as Staying Close, to provide more continuity of care for children whose final placement is in foster care?

Care-experienced children and young people have a much harder start in life and experience much worse outcomes. Liberal Democrats have called for care experience to be made a protected characteristic under the Equality Act to strengthen the rights of people who have been or are in care. Can the Minister say whether the Government are considering this proposal?

I welcome the commitment in the paper to a single unique identifier, which I have long advocated for, along with others in this Chamber. I look forward to seeing the details, and I very much hope that the NHS number will be used, as suggested in the policy paper.

Finally, it is crucial that the detail behind these reforms and the funding underpinning them backs up the ambition that has been set out. Can the Minister say when the overall package of funding will be announced, and can she clarify how the £400 million funding for local government referred to in the Statement relates to the £600 million for social care that was announced in the Budget, which was not broken down between adult and social care?

I finish with a couple of wider questions. Can the Minister say when the Government plan to publish the children’s well-being Bill? What is the overall timescale for introducing the measures that have just been announced? Given the scale of recruitment and retention problems in social care, with many jobs vacant, what will the Minister do to tackle the workforce crisis in the sector to reduce the dependency on agency staff?

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank both noble Baronesses for their positive response to yesterday’s Statement and their positive response to dealing with an area that I think all those who have chosen to attend for this Statement today understand is absolutely crucial for the most vulnerable children and families in our country. I will do my very best to respond to all the questions, and where I fail, I will certainly follow that up in writing.

As the noble Baronesses recognised, this Statement sets out how to rebalance the children’s social care system to improve outcomes for children in care, care leavers and families. It is guided by four key principles: that children should remain with their families and be safely diverted from entering the care system; that where children cannot remain at home and it is in their best interests, we should support most children to live with kinship carers or in fostering families rather than in residential care; that we take action to fix the broken care market and tackle profiteering in the placement market; and that we invest in the key enablers which underpin the children’s social care system, including the workforce, better data and information sharing, and to scale and spread evidence-based and proven approaches.

I will address some of the specific points that the noble Baroness, Lady Barran, raised. On this point about keeping people as close as possible to their families, she asked about family hubs. I can say that family hubs were not specifically mentioned in the Statement because it covered the legislative proposals that the Government are bringing forward. However, we are absolutely clear that they do very good work in helping families to access vital services to improve the health, education and well-being of children, young people and their families. The 75 most deprived local authorities will in fact receive around £300 million from both the DfE and the Department of Health and Social Care up to 2025, to set up family hubs with integrated Start for Life services. Knowing that they improve families’ lives and children’s outcomes, and reduce costly crisis intervention later, we will continue to support that type of initiative. This exactly plays to the point about supporting children and their families at the earliest possible stage before those relationships break down.

On the point about payment by results for the Supporting Families funding, Supporting Families has achieved some very important results for children and their families. However, as is often the case with funding streams such as this, it has also become very bureaucratic. In keeping with the Government’s commitment to resetting its relationship with local government and working in partnership with them to deliver reform for vulnerable children and families, we will be simplifying the funding mechanisms for local authorities as much as possible, reducing the requirement for the payment by results recording and returns. That does not mean, however, that we will not be maintaining the focus on the outcomes for families, as the noble Baroness rightly said. We will continue to expect quarterly returns on the number of successful family outcomes that areas are achieving, so that we can continue to assess the overall impact of the programme. Because we have simplified the processes, we can also say that all local authorities will receive all their remaining available funding for 2024-25 as a one-off payment on 12 December, to enable them to continue making progress.

Both noble Baronesses asked about the £400 million funding. This is £400 million that will go into the overall local government grant, in keeping with the arguments that I made about reducing ring-fencing where possible. The £600 million is additional from this Budget for social care. It will be allocated, and more detail will be provided, at the time of the local government settlement for that.

On the point about agency staff, the noble Baroness is right. We do not believe that it would be possible to have a system with no agency social workers. Lots of agency social workers do very important work. However, when 17.8 % of all local authority child and family social workers are agency workers, that feels like too few permanent staff and too many agency workers. Yes, that does mean that we must work harder to train and retain our children’s social care workforce. That is why we will also be working to ensure that the workforce has the right environment to thrive in, personally and professionally. Legislative measures alone are not the answer, although we will introduce in the Bill a regulation-making power to govern the use of agency workers in local authorities’ child social care. In October, we published a set of online resources, developed by Research in Practice, to support local authorities to improve working conditions, workload, health and well-being and organisational culture. We are also working, through the national workload action group, to identify the unnecessary drivers of workload and to help to provide solutions, so that social workers can spend more time working with children and families rather than carrying out paperwork.

I am glad to hear the welcome of both noble Baronesses for the progress that we are making on kinship care. The £40 million that was announced just in advance of the Budget, and which it was part of, is to enable us to trial the use of the allowance for kinship carers in 10 areas. It would be appropriate to learn from that as quickly as possible, yes, but to learn from that trialling in order to work out how effectively to develop that and other forms of support for kinship care.

On the issue of the placement market, both noble Baronesses argued that a range of methods need to be used to increase the number of placements, in order to get away from the current situation. We do not have sufficient high-quality placements for children, particularly those with the most extreme needs, and we are seeing enormous increases in funding to pay for that. The £90 million we have announced will go alongside encouraging local authorities, charities and ethical investors to enter the market. We will work with the MHCLG on planning and ensure that Ofsted can fast-track the right sort of provision. I am sure I will get to some of the other questions the noble Baronesses asked when I respond to other noble Lords, and if I do not, I will write to them.

[Lord Laming (CB)]

My Lords, I congratulate the Government on this encouraging and very ambitious Statement on the development of services for families and vulnerable children. If it is implemented and put into practice, it will be good for children, good for families and good for society.

Will the Minister do all she can to rebuild the family support services that have been robbed of so much of their resources, and rebalance children’s services away from ridiculously expensive and very distant residential care, in order to ensure that there are preventive services to reduce the ever-growing number of children coming into public care? The continued increase of children coming to public care ought to alarm us. What we need is a better balance between preventive services and coming to care, so that when children do come into care, they are given the opportunity of living in a substitute family, be it kinship care or fostering care, and so that residential care is not robbing the other key services that we so much value.

I will ask the Minister one question. This is an ambitious Statement, and it has attracted widespread support. Is the Minister willing regularly to update the House on what progress has been made? Most of us see this as both a great opportunity and a great challenge, and we do not want that challenge to be lost.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I thank the noble Lord, who has done as much as anybody to improve the lives of vulnerable children, for his recognition of the principles that lie behind this Statement, which are exactly as he says: to prevent children getting into the statutory system in the first place by bringing in services and support for families much earlier on, and by ensuring that all agencies are working together to provide for that. We will of course bring forward the legislative elements of this Statement in the children and well-being Bill, which we hope to introduce when parliamentary time allows. I said to the noble Baroness the other day that we announced it in the King’s Speech and I hope and expect that it will be introduced reasonably soon.

Whether or not it is a formal update, I have no doubt, given the interest noble Lords have shown in this area of work since I have been in this House, that there will be ample opportunity for me to update the House on the progress we are making on what he rightly says is a very ambitious and wide-ranging programme of reform.

[Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top (Lab)]

My Lords, first, I declare a new interest. Tomorrow, I hope to be endorsed as a trustee of Foundations, which is referenced in the Government’s report as having evidence-based the value of family-led decisions when children are at risk of entering care. It has been doing work following on from what the last Labour Government did in establishing evidence-based programmes in this area.

I particularly want the Government, and ask the Minister, to think about earlier interventions, which are mainly pre-school and early school and concentrate on evidence-based parenting programmes and relationship programmes, and which then really reduce the number of children who later in life need to come into care. We know this: the evidence is there in the authorities such as Leeds, which continue to do this despite the heavy cuts. I urge the Government to recognise the importance of these programmes and of sticking with them in the long term. We have learned from the last Government that cutting these programmes ends up in government having to pay far more money and children paying a much higher price.

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[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

First, I congratulate my noble friend on her new role, to which I know she will bring an enormous amount of experience. She is exactly right: this issue goes wider than children who come within the ambit of children’s social care; we need to ensure that we are supporting parenting, children and maternal health, and that we are intervening and providing preventive measures at the very earliest stages of children’s lives. As I suggested in my first response, that is some of the important work that family hubs are doing, but it is certainly very much part of the principles that this Government have set down. We need to continue that investment, as my noble friend says, in evidence-based practice at the very earliest stage for children and families.

[Baroness Berridge (Con)]

My Lords, while I welcome the focus on trying to regulate private placements, that is also going to depend on the capacity within the given local authority. I was disappointed that there was not much focus on a strategy or solution, given that just under half of local authorities, when inspected by Ofsted, were rated not good; we need them all to be outstanding. I also welcome the focus across government and beyond, and, as the noble Baroness, Lady Tyler, outlined, on 18 to 25 year-olds. Is the Minister speaking to the Deputy Prime Minister about this? If you are going to build social housing, how you design those houses can help create the support networks for vulnerable young people. As someone who skirted the children’s social care system and ended up in a privately financed, self-financed placement, I know that it is just happenstance —you happen to walk past someone’s window, you happen to be seen by people, who then may take an interest in you. You cannot compel them to, but how you build properties, how architects construct them, can make that more likely. Buildings shape people and can shape the support for some of our most vulnerable children.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Baroness makes an important point about the relationship between this work and the work of MHCLG. Just a week or so ago, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Education and the MHCLG Secretary met with the Care Leavers’ Association. We are working with MHCLG on planning provision for additional children’s placements, in order to ensure that high-quality placements can be developed more quickly. I take her broader point about the way in which we literally build our communities in order to protect our children, and I am sure that good planners and good local authorities will be thinking about that.

[Lord Shipley (LD)]

My Lords, I remind the House of my registered interests. I strongly welcome the Statement and particularly the confirmation that, wherever possible, children should remain with their families. Where it is not possible, children should live close by, not miles away. From what the Minister has said, I have not fully understood how long it might take to achieve that objective, given the Government’s plans.

I see in the Statement that the Government plan to set out funding plans on children’s social care in the upcoming local government finance settlement. I hope it will be possible to have a debate on that, because that settlement will include many things, Sometimes we have a Statement—often there is not even that—but I think that this settlement will need a debate.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I welcome the noble Lord’s welcome for this work. I agree with the point that has just been made that it is important that we work closely with partners across local government to address this. The noble Lord is right that more detail will be set out in the local government settlement, but it is not for me to decide whether there will be a debate. However, I assure the noble Lord that, if there is one and if I am called on, I will be more than happy to come and give more detail on how the spending will help to support progress on the objectives that we have set as quickly as possible, as he rightly says.

The problem of how far children live from their homes—I think over 20% of children live more than 20 miles away from their home authority—has been around for a very long time. That is not a reason not to take quick action; the noble Lord is right. This will be difficult, but we are absolutely determined to make progress.

[Baroness Thornton (Lab)]

My Lords, the Competition and Markets Authority concluded in a recent report:

“The UK has sleepwalked into a dysfunctional children’s social care market”.


That is on the Benches opposite. I raised this as a question a few weeks ago, when my noble friend the Minister agreed to have a conversation about the diversity of suppliers that are needed in this sector: social enterprises, charities and community-based businesses. I look forward to that discussion being helpful in this process.

However, it seems to me that the challenge that the Government and local authorities will face is how to transition away from companies making excess profits in a dysfunctional market to local government getting cost-effective, proper suppliers in this marketplace. One of the reasons that local authorities have been trapped in the profit gouging is their legal imperative to provide care for some of our most difficult children. How do the Government intend to bring about that transition to make sure that no children find themselves with no care at all?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend makes an important point. She is absolutely right that we are seeing profiteering in this market. The Competition and Markets Authority found profit levels of nearly 23% for the 15 largest providers of children’s homes. There is good provision in the private sector and there will still need to be private sector provision as we develop, but a 23% profit level is not appropriate competition.

The first solution, as my noble friend said, is to increase the supply of placements—this is where the £90 million is important—and we can use local authorities, the voluntary and charitable sector and ethical investors to do that. That has to be the first step. In making this Statement, my right honourable friend has also made it clear that we will not stand by if that message and action do not provide the necessary placements and we continue to see the profiteering that is breaking the banks of local authorities, when it comes to providing the care that children need. We will take action on that profiteering, if necessary, and we will have the legislative ability to do it in the children’s well-being Bill.

[Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle (GP)]

My Lords, I declare my position as a vice-president of the Local Government Association. I follow on from the questions from the noble Lords, Lord Shipley and Lord Laming, and the noble Baroness, Lady Armstrong. There is lots in this Statement to agree with about early intervention and tackling problems before they escalate. However, I had a meeting last week with groups supported by the Crossroads Women’s Centre, who are very concerned that parents affected by poverty, particularly single parents, are simply not getting the support they need at an early stage. They referred to Section 17 of the Children Act, which this Statement does not refer to: the general duty to safeguard and promote the welfare of children, which rests with local authorities.

Of course, local authorities are terribly cash strapped. The Statement talks about future investment in preventive services. Can the noble Baroness assure me that local authorities will get the funding they need to provide that early support, so that poverty does not put children on this path—particularly the children of disabled parents, where I heard particular concerns about a lack of support that was desperately needed?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Baroness makes an important point, taking us even further back in the process to the situations that families find themselves in that put them under the sort of pressure that sometimes—not always—brings potential harm to their children. Of course it is important that we think about child poverty in a holistic manner, which is what the task force with my right honourable friends the Secretary of State for Education and the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions is working on now. It is also important that we support local government in providing some of those broader services. At the moment, we are seeing enormous increases in spending on children’s social care but relatively small increases in benefits for children. That is why we need to reform the system, alongside ensuring that the money is there.

[Lord Balfe (Con)]

My Lords, I first declare an interest: I grew up in a children’s home, so I have a bit of knowledge about it. The system is broken. Not by the last Government: it has gradually been broken over 50 years since we got rid of children’s departments. My one criticism of this document, which is a very good step forward, is that it mentions virtually everything except talking to the children about what they want.

Secondly, as I have said before, you cannot devolve compassion. You have to get the private sector out of this business. There is no other way forward. When we had children’s departments, we had university departments backing them up; we had a profession devoted to children, not profit. Will the Minister go back to the department to see how she can get this service back into the public, municipal care that it thrived quite well under from the Curtis report of the 1940s to the Seebohm Rowntree changes in the early 1970s, which undid it because the Treasury got greedy?

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[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I make no comment about the Treasury, but the noble Lord is right to bring us back to the most important element of these reforms: how we can ensure that we not only listen to children’s voices—he is absolutely right that they should be at the heart of our work—but do everything we can, cross-party and with local government, the voluntary and charitable sector and elements of the private sector that are providing a good service, to reform our system so that it puts children and their welfare at the heart of what is happening.

I am not quite sure what the noble Lord means by “children’s departments”. All local authorities have directors of children’s services and those who are responsible for ensuring that children get the services they need appropriately. We also have excellent social workers across the country who deserve credit, alongside those who support them, for their work in protecting and safeguarding our children and, as he rightly says, listening to them so that their voices can be at the heart of the reforms we are making.

[Lord Wood of Anfield (Lab)]

My Lords, I have a question about a category of children who are perhaps the most vulnerable within the category of extremely vulnerable children: those who are subject to deprivation of liberty order. The Children’s Commissioner recently highlighted that the number of people for whom there has been an application for deprivation of liberty has doubled in the last three years, and the conditions in which some of these children are placed are really appalling: roughly 50% are in unregulated or illegal placements. I very much applaud the idea of integration, a comprehensive approach and clamping down on profiteering, but what is the plan for taking urgent action for the most vulnerable children in these appalling circumstances while the longer-term plan is assembled?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend is absolutely right: there has been an unacceptable increase in the number of children subject to deprivation of liberty orders. That is because there is not the often very specialised and regulated provision that is appropriate for them. That is why they need the order to place them in what is essentially unregulated provision. Going back to the urgent action that we need to take to increase the number of placements, I come back to the point I made about the £90 million additional investment. Part of its work will be to find new forms of secure accommodation that can safely, and with high quality, care for the sort of children my noble friend rightly brings our attention to.

Curriculum and Assessment Review

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

Monday 18th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Holmes of Richmond (Con)]

I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper, and declare my technology and financial services interests as set out in the register.

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, the curriculum and assessment review is independent. The review will make recommendations to the Government based on evidence and widespread sector engagement. The ambition in the review’s terms of reference is for

“a curriculum that ensures … young people leave compulsory education ready for life and ready for work”,

with digital skills. This may include the other areas that the noble Lord mentions, but it will be for the review to consider that in the context of its overall recommendations.

[Lord Holmes of Richmond (Con)]

Does the Minister agree that we need not only to significantly increase the levels and quantity of digital, AI, media and financial education but to ensure that it is personalised, flexible, relevant and responsive? One reason alone is that low levels of financial literacy currently cost the country £20 billion and individuals at the sharp end almost £500 a year. Does she agree that if we enable the levels of literacy we need, this will deliver immeasurable benefits to individual flourishing, levels of innovation and economic, social and psychological growth, for the benefit of us all?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord makes an important point about the breadth that we need in the teaching that goes on in our schools and in the skills, attributes and knowledge that young people have when they leave school to enter into life and into work, as I said. That is why this Government set up the curriculum and assessment review: to use the evidence being gained from the wider engagement to make recommendations about how we can improve on providing skills in all those areas, and particularly ensure that the curriculum supports students with special educational needs and those from disadvantaged backgrounds, to close some of the gaps in pupils’ learning.

[Lord Hampton (CB)]

My Lords, I declare an interest as a state secondary schoolteacher. Does the Minister agree that it is ridiculous that our children leave school now with a very good knowledge of the religions and their gods but cannot have a working knowledge of Microsoft Office?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I do not think it is strictly true that large numbers of young people do not have a working knowledge of important areas of digital skills and computing. Of course, increasing numbers of them take GCSEs and A-levels in computing, but the noble Lord makes an important point about it being important to have the necessary skills for life. The curriculum and assessment review will consider that, and this Government will take decisions on it when we receive that review.

[Baroness Blower (Lab)]

My Lords, does my noble friend the Minister agree that, whatever the outcome of the curriculum review, a pedagogical focus on oracy would assist in the teaching of all the important skills that young people clearly need as they enter the world of work, and in being able to discuss issues such as anti-racism?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend is absolutely right. We need to make sure that young people are able to express themselves and to engage in discussion and debate. That is why we welcome, for example, the work that Geoff Barton and his Oracy Commission have carried out in this important area. It is also why developing language skills is vital in early years to enable children to thrive. We are funding evidence-based early language interventions, targeting children who need extra support with their speech and language development.

[Baroness Humphreys (LD)]

My Lords, these Benches support the prioritisation talked about in this Question. There have long been calls to include this on the school curriculum. But young people are generally digitally savvy, and the problem is often the older generations, who struggle with everything going online and are not digitally literate in many cases. What are the Government doing to encourage local authority libraries to offer free courses on digital education to older adults?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I make no judgment about the digital skills of Members of this House, but the noble Baroness makes an important point about the need to ensure that adults can also access digital skills. In referring to libraries, she is also talking, I think, about the importance of being able to access the hardware as well to do that. We continue to fund the essential skills legal entitlement through the adult skills fund, which will enable an opportunity for fully funded study for eligible adults who are 19 years and over and who do not have either essential English and maths skills up to level 2 or digital skills up to level 1. This will ensure that, alongside what is happening in schools, adults have the crucial basic digital skills that they need to access the modern world.

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My Lords, one of the early themes coming out of the curriculum review is that teachers feel that there has been overstipulation about the content that they have been required to teach. The Government having a review after 10 years is entirely appropriate. We are encouraged by Professor Francis’s remarks about her concern that,

“by alleviating accountability and prescription, we risk facilitating poor practices that further marginalise disadvantaged young people”.

Can the noble Baroness be clear with the House that there will be no slippage in the academic rigour in the curriculum, particularly focusing on closing the attainment gap in school and post 16?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I can, I hope, reassure the noble Baroness that this Government are absolutely committed to ensuring higher standards in our schools—particularly with respect to English and maths, for example, which are fundamental and important skills—and that we do more to close the attainment gap in both English and maths. In recent years, this has grown between those who achieve the highest levels and those who do not achieve so well, and between those who are advantaged and those who are disadvantaged. Everybody in our schools needs access to the most rigorous and effective curriculum and teaching, which is what this Government are committed to delivering.

[Lord Baker of Dorking (Con)]

My Lords—

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[Lord Berkeley of Knighton (CB)]

My Lords, in addition to the subjects being considered, will the review look at the provision of the infrastructure behind them—for example, libraries for books and, for music, peripatetic teachers, instruments and music itself?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

Notwithstanding the very difficult financial situation that this Government inherited, we are committed—

[Noble Lords]

Oh!

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I am sorry, but I am tempted by murmurs opposite to remind noble Lords that we have inherited a considerable fiscal challenge—in fact, a £22 billion black hole that we have had to close. Notwithstanding that, the noble Lord makes an important point about the importance of continued funding and particularly capital funding, where we have already made some progress in the most recent spending review, and where this Government will continue to prioritise the needs of our children—both the teachers and the equipment they need to learn.

[Lord Baker of Dorking (Con)]

Is the Minister aware that, of the students this year taking GCSE, fewer than 20% took computer science? That is appalling. At the same time, a report from 6,000 companies up and down the land, big and small, showed that the biggest thing restricting their growth in profit was their inability to appoint data analysts. Does she not accept that she has responsibility in this matter, and that children leaving school at 18 should be trained in artificial intelligence, data analysis, virtual reality and cyber security? If she does not introduce these changes next year, the Government she supports will not reach the economic growth that they hope for.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I am sure the noble Lord will know that, in its first report, Skills England identified a lack of digital skills as one of the key areas holding back productivity, and where we need to make progress. I assure him that, whether in schools or later on in life, we will put a priority on the skills that are so important to ensure growth in our economy—and, therefore, future investment in further skills development.

Home School Education Registration and Support Bill [HL]

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

2nd reading
Friday 15th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, I congratulate the noble Lord, Lord Storey, on securing a Second Reading for his Home School Education Registration and Support Bill. The aims of this Bill, as all noble Lords who have taken part in this very helpful debate today have identified, are admirable and important.

All children have the right to a suitable education, regardless of whether they are educated at school or at home. However, as noble Lords have emphasised, to ensure that this is the case, it is vital that local authorities have a complete picture of children in their area, including those not in school. That is why this Government have already committed to introduce proposals in the children’s well-being Bill that would require every local authority in England to keep children not in school registers.

The noble Baroness, Lady Barran, knows that I am not in a position to say exactly when the children’s well-being Bill will be introduced, but we included it in this year’s King’s Speech, and in fact I spoke about it in my maiden speech from this Dispatch Box, so it will be within this parliamentary Session.

My noble friend Lord Watson identified that this is a development which has a very long history, going back, as he said, to the end of the previous Labour Government. I hope that, with the good will of noble Lords across this House, we are getting towards the end of that journey now and will be able to bring forward and get support for those proposals in the children’s well-being Bill when it arrives.

The noble Lord, Lord Storey, was right to preface his comments by being clear that, in needing to know where every child is, that is not an attack on the legitimate right to home-educate when that is appropriate for children. As the noble Lord, Lord Lucas, said, there are some very good home-educating parents who, for a variety of reasons, feel that that is the appropriate decision for them.

However, it is also right that local authorities understand where those parents are, not least because, as noble Lords have identified, in some cases, local authorities are already providing good support to home educators. The noble Baroness, Lady Barran, asked whether there is more we could do in that respect, and I can say that the children not in school proposals in the children’s well-being Bill will include a duty on local authorities to support home educators should they want it.

The noble Baroness, Lady Gohir, talked about the nature of the guidance and the conditions around what forms a suitable home education. The department’s elective home education guidance details eight components that local authorities should consider when determining whether a child is receiving a suitable education, and that includes literacy and numeracy standards, among others. But we recognise that every child learns differently, and relevant case law gives a broad discretion in how the fundamental right to an effective education is implemented. A local authority may request different types of evidence to help demonstrate that education provision is suitable. That could include samples of work, a meeting with the child, or a visit to the home.

Having been clear that there is a right to home-educate, it is important that we recognise the very big change that has happened over recent years. We cannot ignore official data that shows rising numbers of home-educated children, and that increasingly children are being moved into home education due to mental health concerns or special educational needs. In those cases, parents may be ill-prepared to begin home-educating, so children may be at risk of receiving an unsuitable education or no education at all—a point made by the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Hereford.

The noble Baroness, Lady Gohir, was right to say that we need to be clear about the characteristics of those children who have shifted out of schools. That will be an important way of identifying their needs and ensuring that they are safeguarded.

Local authorities have legal duties to identify children in their areas who are not in school and not receiving a suitable education, but this duty, as many noble Lords have said, is undermined by the fact that parents have no obligation to inform their local authority of their decision to home-educate. That is why this Government will use the children’s well-being Bill to require parents of eligible children to provide information for children not in school registers. This will help local authorities to identify all children not in school in their area, particularly those who are missing education, and, where this is the case, to take action to support those children.

The noble Lord’s Bill would require parents to provide information for children not in school registers, but it does not include a consequence if parents do not fulfil their legal duty. We think it is vital that local authorities can take action if parents attempt to evade registration—actions such as initiating the school attendance order process. Where a child is not receiving suitable education, the school attendance order process gives them a route to a suitable education through regular attendance at a named school.

Noble Lords rightly identified that there may be a variety of other reasons why the numbers of children either being home-educated or missing school are rising so considerably. I share noble Lords’ concerns that some parents are home-educating because they perceive that schools cannot meet their children’s special educational needs or disabilities. Making improvements for special educational needs and disabilities is a vital part of the Government’s opportunity mission, breaking the unfair link between background and opportunity. This starts by giving every child with special educational needs or disabilities—along with all other children—the best start in life. To do this, we urgently need to improve inclusivity and expertise in mainstream schools, while ensuring that special schools can cater to those with the most complex needs. This is an area of real focus for the department, and we will come forward with more action and reform here.

Other noble Lords raised mental health, and I am concerned by the rise in parents reporting mental health as their reason for choosing to educate their children at home. As of the autumn census day in October 2023, local authorities have reported that mental health is now the second most commonly reported reason for moving to home education. That is why this Government are committed to improving mental health support for all children and young people, because that is critical to breaking down barriers to learning. The right support should be available to every young person who needs it, which is why we will provide access to specialist mental health professionals in every school. It is why we will put in place new Young Futures hubs that will include access to mental health support workers, and it is why we will recruit an additional 8,500 new mental health staff to treat children and adults.

As the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Hereford spelled out, we are aware of cases where parents have felt forced or coerced into home education by their children’s schools. This is a clear instance of home education not being chosen in the best interests of the child. Ofsted takes any use of unlawful exclusions and off-rolling very seriously and, where evidence is found by inspectors, it will have a significant impact on the school’s leadership and management judgment.

As several noble Lords identified, many children who are home-educated use out-of-school settings, such as tuition centres, to supplement their education or provide enriching or social experiences. Many of those settings do a great job of providing safe and enriching activities to children. However, we recognise that there are concerns about the safety profile of some of those settings, which is why we are taking forward a package of measures aimed at improving safeguarding in the out-of-school settings sector. This includes updated safeguarding guidance for parents, providers and local authorities, as well as an accompanying e-learning package and a call for evidence on future policy proposals for raising standards.

My noble friend Lord Watson, the noble Baroness, Lady Burt, and the noble Lord, Lord Desai, raised the issue of illegal schools. We do not choose to call these schools “unregistered” because, by being unregistered, they are illegal. The Government’s aim is that all children of compulsory school age receive a safe and suitably broad education. If parents secure part of their child’s education through attendance at an unregistered independent school, they are putting their child into an illegal school—one that is not known to the department and not subject to inspection against the independent school standard. There is therefore no system to assure their performance, and they can and often do pose a safeguarding risk. It is illegal to operate an unregistered school, and those conducting an unregistered independent school are committing a criminal offence. The premises from which they run may already be subject to no-notice inspections by Ofsted and, if sufficient evidence is found, those running them may be prosecuted. We will keep the powers available to Ofsted during these inspections under review, but I make clear that we are not willing to see children being put in danger in illegal schools.

There has been some debate today about how children not in school registers may impact particular communities. The noble Lord, Lord Storey, raised the correspondence from Rabbi Gratt, and I have received it as well. I want to reassure the House that this Government’s proposals would not give local authorities additional powers to mandate the content of home education. Parents could continue to instil in their children religious and cultural values, provided that the education being received is suitable.

My noble friend Lady Whitaker highlighted that home education is often a necessary choice for the Gypsy, Roma and Traveller community, for reasons that are less to do with making a positive decision. On her question about support for distance learning schemes, as she knows, my department convenes a stakeholder group of representatives from the Gypsy, Roma and Traveller communities and education sector to inform thinking about which policies and reforms can make the greatest positive difference to children and young people from these communities. I will write to my noble friend to provide more detail on the work being taken forward to provide the sort of support that she has argued for.

In thinking about the implementation of these registers, I assure noble Lords that we will look to engage broadly and to engage with marginalised groups of parents to ensure that we are putting in place appropriate arrangements.

In conclusion, while we wholeheartedly support the intention behind the Bill, I do not believe that it is the most effective way of bringing compulsory children not in school registers into being. That is why I must express reservations on the contents of the Bill. This Government already intend to legislate for children not in school registers through the children’s well-being Bill. We are committed to ensuring that these measures are as robust as possible, to minimise the risk of children slipping under the radar. I look forward to discussing the Government’s Bill with noble Lords in due course, and I thank the noble Lord for bringing forward this important debate today.

Education (Values of British Citizenship) Bill [HL]

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

3rd reading
Friday 15th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, I want to thank first of all the noble and right reverend Lord, Lord Harries of Pentregarth, for highlighting in the Bill the importance of the fundamental British values in preparing young people to take their place in society and, as he identifies, in the modern world, as responsible and active citizens. I thank too all those who have taken part in the debates on the Bill. It was an extraordinarily good Second Reading debate, where noble Lords raised a whole range of different issues and rightly pushed the Government to ensure that those issues are addressed.

Although the Government agree with the sentiment of the Bill, we do not believe that legislation is the right way to secure effective implementation by schools. Schools already embed these values through their statutory duty to promote pupils’ spiritual, moral, cultural, mental and physical development, supported by statutory curriculum content, notably in citizenship and relationships education.

I reiterate to the noble and right reverend Lord my support for citizenship education, given my role in its introduction in my previous incarnation at the Department for Education. It is, though, important that schools retain the autonomy to tailor their approach to the needs of pupils and to reflect new developments, societal changes and topical issues. This approach will ensure that students understand the relevance of the values to the rights, responsibilities and opportunities of living in modern Britain.

Schools have a good understanding of these values and integrate them well. However, it is right to push this Government and we will continue to support our teachers, provide resources and, through the independent curriculum and assessment review, ensure that young people develop the knowledge and skills required to thrive as citizens in work and throughout life, and in a curriculum in which they are represented. I thank the noble and right reverend Lord for bringing this forward.

[Lord Harries of Pentregarth (CB)]

May I say something very briefly in response? I remind the House that fundamental British values already have to be taught in schools. It is not a question of inventing something new; they already have to be taught. It is a question of giving them a sharper focus and more solidity.

I have to say, with all due respect, that I was extremely surprised to hear what the noble Earl said because, although there are of course certain values that vary between people—some people are vegetarians while other people are not, for example—there are certain fundamental values that are essential to our political life. I wonder which of the values the noble Earl would disagree with. Democracy, the rule of law, freedom of religion, the equal worth and dignity of every person are not arbitrary values or a matter of personal taste; these are fundamental to the whole life of this country, and pupils should be taught them.

Universities

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

Thursday 14th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, like others, I am very grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Warwick, for raising this debate and introducing it in such an interesting and broad-ranging way. As noble Lords have said, as always with debates on the subject of higher education in the House of Lords, this has been a high-quality debate—not least when there are contributions from both those who have first-hand knowledge of higher education and those who have previously been university Ministers. I must make a confession at this point that, as a student, I probably protested against at least one of them—and I may well have been wrong.

In considering the Universities UK blueprint, I put it on record that Universities UK plays a crucial role in the higher education ecosystem and is an extremely well-regarded government stakeholder. As the collective voice of our universities, UUK advocates for the interests of higher education providers, offering invaluable insights into the concerns of the sector.

We welcome the report. Taken as a whole, it is an important contribution to the wider and crucial debate that we will of course consider carefully in our policy development, which I shall touch on later. It will help to ensure that our higher education sector, as all noble Lords have argued for today, remains resilient and continues to drive innovation and inclusivity. I reassure my noble friend Lord Griffiths that the Government remain committed to the most famous principle of the Robbins report on higher education,

“that courses of higher education should be available for all those who are qualified by ability and attainment to pursue them and who wish to do so”.

As others have said, our higher education system is not set in aspic. It is important—as is reflected in this report, and something I wholeheartedly agree with—to evolve our higher education into a lifelong journey, accessible to a larger and more diverse cohort than ever before. That transformation will ensure that the UK’s higher education providers remain world-leading and continue to play a key role in meeting the UK’s current and future skills needs. So many of our businesses and so much of our economy are dependent on skills gained in higher education degree courses.

I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Willetts, that universities provide academic, vocational and technical courses, and I will place in the Library the answer to the question he outlined. As the noble Lord, Lord Lucas, also identified, some courses enable us to combine different elements of learning, which is enormously helpful for us in balancing our lives.

The Budget set out the major challenges facing our public finances and public services and the tough decisions the Government are taking to fix the foundations and deliver change, some of which I know will affect higher education providers. As the noble Lord, Lord Johnson, pointed out, the teaching income per UK student that higher education institutions receive has declined in real terms since 2015-16 and is now approaching its lowest level since 1997. That is the reason why the Office for Students reports a growing number of higher education providers facing significant financial difficulty, with 40% forecasting deficits in 2023-24. As many noble Lords have argued, we need to put our world-leading higher education sector on a secure footing. In line with this, from 1 August 2025 we will be increasing both the maximum cap for tuition fees and maintenance loans for students, in line with forecast inflation.

The noble Lord, Lord Willetts, calls on me—as did my noble friend Lord Blunkett earlier this week—to engage the services of Martin Lewis in order to make sure that the explanation of the impact of that on students is clear: that there will be no upfront payment and no increase in monthly repayments. We will certainly take on board the need to continue to communicate that to students. I also recognise the case made by my noble friend Lady Young, the noble Baroness, Lady Grey-Thompson, and the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Sheffield regarding the hardship experienced by students who have been impacted by the cost of living. This is reason for our increasing the maintenance loan as well, but I take the point that, in our further reform, we need to consider how to support students. I particularly hear the point about how we can ensure that this system is progressive.

Additional funding for higher education, which is of course an increased investment that we are asking students to make, has to be coupled with reform. I share the view of the noble Baroness, Lady Barran, that those things need to run concurrently. That is why, in the reform programme that we are engaging in, we will expect higher education providers to play a stronger role in expanding access and improving outcomes for disadvantaged students; to make a stronger contribution to economic growth; to play a greater civic role in their communities; to raise the bar further on teaching standards; and to drive a sustained efficiency and reform programme. I know that there is much good practice already under way, and this Government are also committed to respecting the autonomy and diversity of the sector. I note and agree with the points made by the noble Lord, Lord Rees, about the benefit of that diversity; it is a great strength of our world-leading system. This agenda will need a real change of approach, from both the Government and the sector itself. We will set out the Government’s plan for higher education reform by next summer to ensure that the system delivers against these priorities. I can reassure my noble friend Lord Liddle that there will be more thought and more reform.

Several noble Lords raised the issue of regulation. As noble Lords are I hope aware, the Government moved fast to deal with the focus and leadership of the Office for Students. Within weeks of entering office, we accepted in full the recommendations of Sir David Behan’s report on the Office for Students and appointed him as interim chair to begin the work of change that the OfS needs. He will oversee the important work of refocusing the role of the OfS to concentrate on key priorities, including the higher education sector’s financial stability.

While the OfS has statutory duties in relation to the financial stability of higher education providers, the Government also have a clear interest in understanding the level of risk across the sector. That is why my department works closely with the Office for Students, and other relevant parties, to understand the ongoing impacts and changing landscape of financial sustainability. The department will come forward with proposals, as raised by the noble Lord, Lord Willetts, about the potential intervention that might be necessary in the case of real financial crisis for a higher education provider, although we have been clear that our focus will be on protecting the interests of students in those cases.

In the case of freedom of speech, I assure noble Lords that while we have paused the implementation of the Act, we are looking seriously at how we can respond to the challenge of ensuring academic freedom and freedom of speech. We will come forward with proposals soon.

I share the views of those noble Lords who have argued that we need greater transparency, transformation and efficiency within the sector. The most recent report from the OfS on the financial health of the sector makes it clear that the business models of a significant number of providers will need to change in the near future to ensure that they remain financially sustainable. That is why we welcome the commitment that Universities UK has made to establishing a cross-sector transformation and efficiency task force by the end of the year, to seek savings through greater collaboration. I am pleased to see the focus on sector evaluation, shared services and structural opportunities, and look forward to the task force reporting. However, I share the views of the noble Baroness, Lady Barran, and the noble Lord, Lord Lucas, that it should include greater transparency and comparability of the finances of higher education.

Noble Lords have rightly raised the issue of access and participation. The House will note that this is the first area of the Government’s reform programme. My noble friends Lady Blackstone and Lord Griffiths identified the challenge of ensuring that all those who can benefit from higher education are able to. Sadly, the gap in outcomes between disadvantaged students and others from higher education is unacceptably large and widening, with participation from disadvantaged students in decline for the first time in two decades. To support not just disadvantaged learners, but all learners, we need to do more to create a culture of lifelong learning and help everybody to access higher education.

We will expect the sector to work closely with the Government and the Office for Students to tackle these issues, making sure that it is delivering strong and ambitious access and participation plans, and implementing the lifelong learning entitlement to the fullest degree. I reassure the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Sheffield that we will bring forward the lifelong learning entitlement. In response to the noble Baroness, Lady Garden, I say that this will bring with it some improvement to maintenance for some of the areas that she identified. Of course, that will ensure that both young people and adults, as my noble friend Lady Blackstone argued for, can upskill and reskill in an ever-evolving economy and get the benefit of a lifelong education.

This will also require different forms of delivery. The noble Lord, Lord Rees, argued for this; he is right that we should look at this to enable more students to benefit. The noble Baroness, Lady Grey-Thompson, identified in talking about the Open University some of the really imaginative ways in which it delivers access. We need to learn from that as we take forward the work on access and participation. As the noble Baroness, Lady Bottomley, said, in this area we must be radical and not defensive.

I heard the points of the noble Baroness, Lady Finlay, about the efforts being made by medical schools to increase attainment. I will reflect on the points that she made about the accountability measures and how they might act against broadening access.

We recognise that, for some young people, an apprenticeship is the most appropriate route, and the Government are taking action on that. We also recognise that degree apprenticeships support employers to develop high-level skills and provide valuable opportunities for those who would not otherwise go to university and begin a career that requires a degree. We will work with Skills England to ensure that the level 6 degree apprenticeships are part of the growth and skills levy-funded training offer and continue to offer good value for money while supporting our missions for growth and opportunity.

On the issue of quality, while we can rightly argue that UK higher education is world leading, an engine of growth, supports local communities and breaks down barriers to opportunity, we also need to ensure that this is not compromised by low-quality provision. We want to see higher education providers aspiring to improve the quality of the education that they deliver, far beyond minimum expectations. The noble Lord, Lord Lucas, is right: students make a considerable investment in higher education, and they deserve the highest quality teaching to support them in progressing and achieving to the best of their potential. They also deserve to know what to expect when making this investment, and providers should be clear and transparent about, for example, the number and nature of contact hours that students will have.

Several noble Lords rightly talked about the significance of research for both our higher education sector and our country. The noble Lord, Lord Krebs, raised several questions, as did the noble Lord, Lord Patel, and my noble friend Lady Young. It is of course significant that total government investment in R&D is rising to a record allocation of £20.4 billion in 2025-26. As part of this, core research funding is rising to at least £6.1 billion to offer real-terms protection to the UK’s world-leading research base. That increase will support UKRI to deliver on the UK’s key research priorities. In addition, at least £25 million will be invested in 2025-26 to launch a new multi-year research and development missions programme. This will solve targeted problems and will help to crowd in private and third-sector investment to accelerate delivery of each mission.

The Government have maintained long-term institutional funding for university research and knowledge exchange through quality-related research funding and higher education innovation funding. It will be provided on a recurring basis in order to allow universities to plan over a longer time horizon and smooth out funding fluctuations. Nevertheless, the Government are determined to work with sector to transition to sustainable research funding models. Having said that, as with other areas of work, universities will also need to take their own steps to ensure that they are working as efficiently as possible and, where necessary, make difficult choices.

I noted the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Patel, about doctoral students; perhaps I can come back to him on that. Several noble Lords rightly talked about the civic contribution of higher education providers; they are important not only for learners but for local economies and local communities. There is an array of public benefits to providers engaging with businesses, policymakers and civil society in their local areas, as made clear by the noble Baroness, Lady Prashar, the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Gloucester, in talking about the University of Gloucester, and the noble Baroness, Lady Grey-Thompson, in talking about the work in Northumbria. This is enormously important work, and we want to promote it as another element of our reform. There are parts of the country where the full civic contribution of providers and their potential to benefit local communities has not yet been unlocked.

We want higher education providers to be civic anchors in our communities and the beating heart of local life in our towns and cities, not ivory towers far removed from local concerns. It is right that they have a role to play in regional and national growth, and we want to work with the higher education sector to maximise that.

I strongly support the comments made about the collaborations between higher and further education. That can be instrumental in improving access for disadvantaged groups to levels 4 and 5, as well as to degrees, and to ensuring that there are clear pathways from further education to higher education. Greater collaboration through local skills systems is also crucial for supporting regional growth and local communities, recognising the different and distinctive roles that different types of providers play regionally and nationally.

We want to ensure that all parts of the country enjoy the benefits of higher and further education collaborations. This will be a key part of our post-16 strategy, where we are exploring how government can foster and encourage stronger relationships and collaboration between higher and further education providers. As part of that, we will make further announcements about how we will allocate the £300 million additional funding that we received for further education in the Budget.

On the issue of international students, I want to make clear the Government’s position. We recognise the vital contribution that international students make; we are committed to a United Kingdom that is outward-looking and welcomes international students. We are conducting a review of our international education strategy to ensure that it continues to reflect the priorities of this Government, including on international students. To the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Willetts, this will be done alongside the Department for Business and Trade and the Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office.

I will certainly undertake to raise the issue of the speed of visas with my former colleagues in the Home Office. On the point about students within the statistics, it is the independent Office for National Statistics that is responsible for that.

In conclusion, the discussions today have underscored the pivotal role that higher education plays in shaping our nation’s future. We have demonstrated our commitment to sorting the most immediate financial challenges for the sector, but we expect that to be associated with and done alongside a significant programme of reform. We are committed to working collaboratively with Universities UK on that, and its blueprint will help us in this very important task.

Sharia-compliant Student Finance

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

Wednesday 13th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Sharkey]

To ask His Majesty’s Government what progress they have made towards the introduction of a Sharia-compliant student finance product.

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, we are committed to delivering an alternative student finance product that is compatible with Islamic finance principles as quickly as we can. We are making good progress to achieve this. This month we are reconvening the alternative student finance working group for its first meeting since the election, which I am grateful to the noble Lord for being part of. We have also appointed a secretariat to take forward the sharia certification of the product.

[Lord Sharkey (LD)]

My Lords, Muslim census research shows that over 6,000 students annually miss out on university entirely due to the lack of sharia-compliant finance. I know that the Minister is alive to the problem, its scale and its 11-year history. I thank her and her predecessor, the noble Baroness, Lady Barran, for the work that they have done or are doing in moving the alternative student finance project forward. However, progress is slow, largely because ASF is being produced sequentially to the lifelong learning entitlement, which is delayed in the Budget by a year. What is now the latest date for the full implementation of the ASF? We should surely be able to move faster. Can, for example, ASF development be uncoupled from the LLE and progressed in parallel? What consideration has been given to the use of outside contractors to speed things up?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I think it would be fair to say that that was the question I asked at the point at which it was suggested to me that we should link the delivery of the ASF to the introduction of the lifelong learning entitlement. I think that the last Government were right in making that decision, because the lifelong learning entitlement brings about a fundamental change to the system of student finance, and it is important that, to be able to access the alternative student finance provisions effectively, they are linked to the overarching system for student support. We are introducing the lifelong learning entitlement for applications from September 2026 and for courses and modules that begin from January 2027.

[Baroness Manzoor (Con)]

My Lords, will the Minister say what the Government are doing to raise awareness of sharia-compliant finance to all students and what training is being offered to those that work in this sector?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

For students, we are raising information about, for example, degree apprenticeships that would allow students to study towards a degree while they work, without paying for tuition. Students can also find information on other forms of support on GOV.UK, including bursaries, scholarships and awards for eligible students to ensure that, as the noble Lord pointed out, we help to make progress for the about 6,000 students per year that the Muslim census suggested might not be able to access higher education because of the nature of mainstream student finance.

[Lord Watson of Invergowrie (Lab)]

My Lords, I commend the tenacity of the noble Lord, Lord Sharkey, in pursuing this issue, which I know he has been raising since 2012. I recall being in debates with him on what became the Higher Education and Research Act 2017, when it seemed that a solution was close to being found. Yet, as he said, many young Muslims have a barrier to higher education because of this, and those who go to university none the less suffer severe financial hardship. But I disagree with him and say to my noble friend that, rather than separating the need for a sharia-compliant loan to be found and the lifelong learning entitlement, the lifelong learning entitlement’s rollout from 2026 should be used as a backstop. If it is not available to young Muslims, it cannot properly meet the reason that it is being established.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend is right. That is why, in working towards the lifelong learning entitlement rollout, we will also be making progress towards delivering the alternative student finance. We will be able to look at the details about the progress that has already been made and the steps we still need to make in the working group, which I am glad that the noble Lord, Lord Sharkey, will be able to attend.

[Lord Forsyth of Drumlean (Con)]

My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for answering my Written Question as to what the nominal value of student debt will be. In her answer, she said that, in five years’ time, the cumulative total debt will be £540 billion and, in 10 years, £869.4 billion. I understand that this is being used to kind of create more headroom for the Government’s borrowing. Is she really satisfied with student debt soaring to those levels?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I am not sure whether the noble Lord is arguing for a wholesale reform of the student funding system—it would be legitimate if he were, although this Government have taken a different route at this point. I think it is important, notwithstanding the impact on the national finances, to be clear for individual students that an increase in their tuition fees and the loan they take out to fund them will not increase their repayments, because repayments of this loan are wholly linked to earnings levels, so no student will repay higher levels per month as a result of the most recent decision that the Government have taken to increase tuition fees.

[Lord Vaux of Harrowden (CB)]

My Lords, interest rates are not only a problem for Muslim students. Can the Minister explain why it is appropriate that all students should pay a rate of 7.3%, which is somewhat usurious, for the period in which they are studying?

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

Obviously, we keep interest rates, which are linked to the RPI for student finance, under review. But in principle, as far as the student finance system is concerned, it is right that students who continue to get considerable benefit from higher education help to fund that higher education, alongside the taxpayer, who also of course stands behind the loan system. At the end of the period of its term, a loan will be written off for any student who has not repaid by that point.

[Lord Ahmad of Wimbledon (Con)]

My Lords, in welcoming the continuation of the initiative of the previous Government, it is also important that the principle of takaful, which is inherent in Islamic finance, is also made abundantly clear to the community. Building on my noble friend’s question on the issue of communicating, it is a barrier to entry and to higher education, particularly for young girls. These girls are often very high attainers.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord makes a very important point. Perhaps I was not clear enough in response to his noble friend. Part of the work that we are doing is to engage with the Muslim community, firstly to ensure that the plans the Government are putting in place will be sharia-complaint and acceptable to the community, and also to ensure that the message about the ability to take up this student support in order to be able to undertake higher education is properly communicated. We are absolutely committed to continuing with that engagement, including with Islamic finance specialists.

[Baroness Swinburne (Con)]

My Lords, can I ask the Minister what the Government will be able to do to help prospective and existing students understand what their loan commitments mean for them? I have had recent experience with my own children and their friends, who had no idea what they signed up to several years ago.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I think the Student Loans Company works quite hard in order to ensure that students understand the commitments that they are taking on with student loan finance. But it is a fair point that it is important not just for the Government but for higher education institutions to be clear with students about what they are getting for their money, and then for us and the Student Loans Company to be clear with students about the impact later on in their life of the loans they are taking out.

I will reiterate the point I made earlier that sometimes there is confusion among students, who think that student debt is similar to other forms of debt, when clearly it is very different. Repayment is linked to earnings levels and, at the end of the term, any remaining debt will be written off. I try to say that as frequently as possible. It is a fair challenge that we should ensure that as many students as possible understand that that is the situation with student debt.

[Lord Blunkett (Lab)]

Would my noble friend the Minister recommend that anyone who is confused should go on Martin Lewis’s website? He is very clear about this and it might help them to understand precisely what the scheme is all about.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend is absolutely right and I am pleased to say that I will be meeting with Martin Lewis, who does a sterling job of explaining not just this but many elements of finance. I will be keen to hear from him what more he thinks we should do to make the position clear.

Higher Education Reform

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

Tuesday 5th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Storey (LD)]

My Lords, we welcome the Secretary of State’s Statement on universities in the Commons yesterday. Labour introduced student loans, and in opposition Keir Starmer wanted to abolish them. No doubt he cannot because of the £22 billion black hole.

We know that in 2015, the Liberal Democrats paid the price for making a pledge on tuition fees that we could not keep, but our reforms at least made the system fairer by giving more support to pupils on low incomes and ensuring that the least well-off graduates repaid the least.

Now, our universities are crying out for government to look at their funding, which has remained frozen for eight years. The Conservative Government, while espousing their importance, did nothing but abolish the maintenance grant, so that living costs became a barrier to university learning for disadvantaged students. The previous Government also cut the repayment threshold to £25,000, so that today’s students have to repay hundreds of pounds more per year than older graduates on the same salary. They lengthened the repayment period from 30 to 40 years, so today’s students will still be paying back their loans in 2066.

Does the Minister agree that the crisis in funding must be addressed, and have the Government considered how to support universities without raising fees? Will the Minister look at the benefits of international students and give universities stability in this area of policy? Finally, will the Minister look at how universities spend their allocation of £10,000 per student, so that students get value for money and a good university education experience, and the money is spent as efficiently as possible?

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, first, I welcome the positive response to yesterday’s Statement and announcements. I think we all understand that this country is blessed with a world-class university sector whose teaching, research, contribution to the staffing of our public services, international reputation, earning and impact are significant and something we want to defend and ensure continues into the future.

Sadly, on coming into government we feared that the crisis in the funding of higher education put all these things at risk. That was the reason for taking the action we announced yesterday: to increase tuition fees by 3.1% and to reflect the challenge that students have faced, particularly from the cost of living, by increasing maintenance loans as well. We were also very clear that alongside that increase in investment that students will make in our higher education sector, we also expect to see considerable reform, which I will come on to in a moment.

Let me respond to the points raised by the noble Baroness, Lady Barran. First, on repayments, she is right that the way in which both tuition and maintenance loans are repaid means that no student will pay more per month. Of course, no student pays anything, up to £25,000-worth of annual income. The total amount a student pays depends on whether they repay within the 40-year time limit for the loan. Any student who currently would not repay within the 40 years—because they were on a low income or had gaps in work—will not pay any more with the increase in tuition fees. It is of course right that anybody who would have repaid during that time period will now have a larger debt to repay; but to reiterate, that is no cost upfront and no higher repayment per month after graduation.

On the impact of both the national insurance contributions and the changes to foundation degrees, we will publish an impact assessment alongside the statutory instrument that will bring about the increase in the fees, and we will spell out the analysis at that point. Regarding students who have already started, the intention is that the tuition fee increase will apply to new and existing students, but that could depend on the contract and arrangements made between the university and the individual student. We will make further announcements on the changes to postgraduate support and the disabled students’ allowance in due course.

The noble Baroness also raised the issue of the gap in respect of disadvantaged students. I think she conceded, as my right honourable friend stated yesterday, that this year the gap between those who are more advantaged and those who are more disadvantaged has widened. Although there are more students, both advantaged and disadvantaged, going to university now, it is not good enough to rest there: not only have we been incapable of closing that gap, but it has widened in the last year. That is why, as the first of the elements of the reform programme, we will undertake serious work with the sector, with those who support students in applying to higher education and with schools, and think about what more we can do to support anybody who could benefit from and wants to take part in higher education, so that they can access it.

We are determined to close—

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

Before the Minister moves on, first, I would be grateful if she could confirm that since 2013-14, the percentage of disadvantaged children going to university has grown faster than the percentage of those from advantaged homes. Secondly, while the free school meals measure has shown an increase in the gap, if we take the POLAR4 quintiles—I am sorry to be, as the noble Baroness, Lady Sherlock, would say, a wonk about this—the gap has decreased. Does the Minister agree with her department’s data on that?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I am sure that my department’s data on that is correct, but I stick with the point made yesterday, which is also correct: if we take the free school meals measure in the most recent year, in contrast to what happened previously, we have seen the gap widen. My broader point was that, frankly, it does not matter which measure you take, we have not seen a sufficient closing of that gap. It is still wrong that students from disadvantaged backgrounds who could benefit from higher education are not getting that benefit. That is why we will take action, alongside the sector and others, to make sure that we can improve both access to higher education and the measures of continuation and progression out of higher education. In those figures, we have seen a differential between those who are disadvantaged who come into higher education and those who are advantaged. Not only is it more difficult to get in but it is more difficult to continue in their courses and to succeed. That is where we need to take action to improve the situation.

On efficiency, we are absolutely clear that providing additional funding for higher education brings with it a responsibility for the sector to spend that money as efficiently as possible—to provide the quality of experience that students have the right to expect, and in a transparent way—and we can use appropriate metrics to measure that. We will want to do that work alongside the sector itself, but we are clear that we need to see improvements in efficiency in exchange for the increase in investment, and that that is non-negotiable.

On the maintenance loan, the important point is that the maximum loan for any student will be going up by 3.1%.

On the other areas of reform, access is very important, but we have also made it clear that universities need to play a crucial role in the Government’s growth mission. We need to see them working alongside Skills England. We need to work with them to see what more they can do to contribute to growth in the economy. They already play a crucial civic role; we want to see that strengthened so that all those who argue for universities in their areas—quite rightly, because they understand the social, cultural and economic benefit—will see that maximised. We recognise the quality of what is provided in English higher education, but we want to ensure that where there are pockets of bad quality that is tackled, and that everywhere there is an emphasis on improving the quality of teaching provided for our students.

On the alternative financing mechanism, we will make progress on that, building on the work of the previous Government and the noble Baroness in particular—she knows that we are reconstituting the working group on that because she will be invited to be a member of it, so she will share in the responsibility for the progress that I hope that we are going to make.

The noble Lord, Lord Storey, asked whether other methods of funding universities had been considered. We have given considerable thought to the options for how we can help to bring some stability to the financial position in HE and to support students. Given the current financial situation and the constraints on spending, this was the most appropriate way to provide some additional income and certainty for HE. As a matter of principle, it is right that students who benefit from higher education—it is still the case that a degree or a qualification through a university will give you on average higher lifetime earnings—make a contribution to that through repaying their loans, alongside the contribution made by the taxpayer and the Government more broadly, particularly for those students who do not end up paying off all their loans, and the strategic priorities grant and other forms of support for higher education.

I agree with the noble Lord and hope that he has seen a very different tone towards international students from this Government than was the case previously—universities tell me that they have seen that. We will continue to welcome international students, not only because of the finance that they bring but because of the benefits to students and our role in the world that come from that. I think I have already covered the point about value for money, which we are absolutely committed to ensuring.

[Baroness Morris of Yardley (Lab)]

My Lords, it is difficult to be pleased that fees will have to be raised, but I acknowledge the parlous state that HE finds itself in, and I welcome that the Government have taken as much early action as they can to try to make the situation better.

I will put just two points to the Minister. First, can she clarify what I think I just heard in response to a previous question, that for students who are already at university—that is, not becoming first-year students from the start of the next academic year—whether they are charged the increased fees may vary from university to university depending on the contract? If I heard that correctly, when might that be announced, so that we have certainty as to what will happen for the majority of students in September?

Secondly, I very much welcome what the Minister said about looking to do more to widen participation. In the work that she and the department carry out on that, will she have a look at the statistics for students from less advantaged backgrounds who are already at university to see what the dropout rate is? I know that it has been higher than for other groups. One challenge is getting those young people to university, but if they then drop out, we have not achieved a great deal. I would be grateful if she could confirm that that could be part of the considerations.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I thank my noble friend and wholly agree with her. It has been a difficult decision to ask students to pay more to safeguard the future of higher education, but I think it was the right decision. On the point about students who are already there, yes, it is the case that the increase in tuition fees will cover students who are already studying. In some ways it is not for the Government to clarify the position. Higher education institutions are autonomous and will need to be clear with their students about the impact on them of the increase in fees. I will correct myself if I am wrong but for most, the assumption would be that the increase in tuition fees will go ahead in the way we have described. My noble friend is right that there is a big differential in those who drop out of university, with more disadvantaged students being more likely to drop out, less likely to continue and less likely to have good outcomes at the end of their time at university. As well as widening access, that is another area where we want to make progress with the sector.

[Baroness Fraser of Craigmaddie (Con)]

My Lords, I declare an interest as the mother of a third-year undergraduate student at a Scottish university. I support the Government’s determination to break down barriers to opportunity and agree that higher education is central to this. I also welcome the promise of a wider review and hope that despite education being a devolved issue, this Government will carefully consider what influence they can bring to bear to address the now even greater funding gap between universities in Scotland and those in England.

The Minister will be aware of the shameful record of the Scottish Government in promising free tuition but not giving universities the funding to deliver it. But I am also concerned that a consequence of this will be that the brightest and best Scottish students are not able to take advantage of the wider opportunities that are offered within higher education across the whole of the UK. In 2023, Scotland had the lowest Cambridge acceptance rate of any UK region, at just 14.1%. Only 45 students were admitted to the university from the entirety of Scotland, compared with 844 from Greater London. Will the Minister do all that she can to ensure that talented Scottish students are not forgotten?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Baroness makes an important point about honest policy-making. While sometimes it is politically easy to make extravagant promises, what is important is that you are actually able to deliver them for the good of both students and universities. She makes a strong point there.

The work that we will do alongside universities—and to be fair, this will include universities in Scotland—to broaden access and ensure that students have a successful experience when they get into university will also benefit Scottish students, whether they are studying in Scotland and or at English universities. I very much share the noble Baroness’s objective of ensuring that students can get the very best possibility of the very best university option for them. That is something that I think all of us want to see from the system.

[Baroness Hodge of Barking (Lab)]

My Lords, I refer noble Lords to my interests in the register. I welcome the Statement. It is high time the Government recognised the financial challenges that face the higher education sector, which were, I am afraid, ignored and swept under the carpet by the previous Government. However, responding to these challenges by raising fees risks making it even more difficult for young people who are eligible for free school meals. They are the ones who we are most interested in seeing go to university, but they are simply petrified by the debt they will incur. I know, as a Member of Parliament before the general election, that I had really talented young people in my constituency who were getting three As at A-level but turning down university places because of the fear of debt. This will add to that.

Can the Minister assure me that when she undertakes the review that is being proposed by her department, she will focus on ensuring that both the Government and the sector prioritise widening participation and bringing more people who have received free school meals into higher education, and that this becomes something that is measured by the Government and the universities?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I understand my noble friend’s point about young people, particularly those from less well-off backgrounds, being worried about their student debt. We all, therefore, have a responsibility to continue pointing out that this is a very different type of debt to a credit card or another form of loan. There is no upfront payment for their university education, and their repayment is dependent on their level of income; and if that is not paid off at the end of the period of the loan, it will be written off completely; that is a very different category of debt. I understand her point, which is why I can give her the commitment that we will prioritise, as part of the reform programme we will work on, how we improve participation, how we close that gap, so that disadvantaged students can achieve the ability to go to university when that is something that they want to do and they have the ability, and we will ensure that their experience when at university makes them more likely to continue and be successful.

[Lord Lucas (Con)]

My Lords, I too welcome the Statement and look forward to the ideas that are coming forward over the next few months. The Secretary of State said:

“I heard too often from students of the gap between the course they were promised and the experience they had”.

In that context, will the Government encourage universities to give much better information to students about what courses lead to and what jobs and careers their students go on to from each course? At the moment, it is extremely thin, and it is very hard for a student, who will after all invest a large amount of money, to see whether a particular course actually does lead on to the career that they hope to follow.

Secondly, the Secretary of State said she had heard from international students that they felt “neither valued nor welcomed”. Will the Government, therefore, put their weight behind the British Council’s excellent Alumni UK initiative, which would give international students a real and lifelong sense of belonging to the UK, with real, lifelong practical benefits and connections? It would considerably benefit this country, but it seems to me that universities are being very slow to sign up at the moment.

Lastly, in deciding to increase fees, did the universities provide evidence of why it costs them 50% more than a sixth form college to educate a student when universities provide less contact time and less pastoral care by a considerable margin? If they provided that information, will the Government share it with the House?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord is right in his demand and his expectation that universities need to improve the information that they provide for students about the course and about potential progression. That is an important area that we will want to work with the sector on improving.

On international students, I would strongly support anything that enables international students to maintain their contact with the university and with the country. One of the big benefits of our ability to attract international students is precisely that, for example, nearly 60 world leaders are former students at UK universities. That is an enormous amount of soft power, as well as very strong relationships that have been built up, and I would support any initiative that ensures that continues.

On the noble Lord’s final point, one of the first things that we did in government was to ask the Office for Students to focus more clearly on identifying the financial situation of universities. I cannot say that, at this point, we have the metrics around the value for money that the noble Lord is asking for, but that is one of the areas where, in terms of the efficiency work, we need to have much better transparency within the sector about how money is being spent, how it is being allocated, for example, between research and teaching and how that then results in student experience. That will be one of the things we expect to see.

[The Earl of Effingham (Con)]

My Lords, the Statement said:

“We have paused the commencement of the last Government’s freedom of speech legislation”.


It also said that

“universities must be home to robust discussion and rigorous challenge”.

How will the Minister guarantee appropriate freedom of speech, robust discussion and rigorous challenge in those universities?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

Yesterday’s Statement was less about freedom of speech than about the funding of universities but, to reiterate the point I made when we covered this issue previously, I and the Government are absolutely committed to ensuring freedom of speech and academic freedom within our universities. That is why we continue to consider the way forward, to ensure that this can happen without some of the disproportionate burdens and impact on minority groups that the Act in its totality would have brought to our higher education sector. I will return to the House with a way forward on that in the near future.

[Baroness Pinnock (LD)]

My Lords, I have an interest as a vice-chair of the University of Huddersfield, which takes on a considerable number of young people from poorer backgrounds. The finances of the university sector as a whole are in a fairly parlous state—I have to make it clear that the University of Huddersfield’s are not. The Minister has said that the increase in tuition fees is a stopgap to stave off the worst consequences of the very serious financial pressures that some universities are facing. I would like to hear from her whether this relatively small amount of additional funding for universities will indeed stave off quite drastic actions being discussed in the sector, such as mergers between some universities. Can she give us assurance that the additional funding will achieve that? If not, what actions is her department intending to take?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I have it on good authority that the University of Huddersfield has a very good reputation for its work to provide access and opportunity for students, and it should be congratulated on that. The noble Baroness is right, however, that the financial situation for all universities is serious. The Office for Students identified that, this year, 40% of universities would be in deficit. That has already had an impact on courses and on staff being made redundant. The decision that the Government made yesterday about this year’s inflationary increase in tuition fees is a measure to stabilise the system at this point in time. While we have not made decisions about the future, we are committed to the reform package that I have outlined. Alongside that, we will think further about what we need to do to maintain the world-class higher education system that we are so proud of in this country and to ensure that institutions can continue to do excellent work. That might not necessarily mean that they continue to do that completely unchanged as institutions; there are some challenges that should be recognised about the business model and the organisation of higher education, and we will want to consider that.

House adjourned at 8.44 pm.

Education: Early Years Attainment Gap

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

Tuesday 5th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Hughes of Stretford]

To ask His Majesty’s Government what plans they have for reducing inequality and closing the early years educational attainment gap for pre-school children.

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, our plans for the best start in life, to reduce inequality and close the attainment gap, include delivering 3,000 new or expanded school-based nurseries to break down barriers to opportunity; funded hours for families of two year-olds receiving additional forms of support; supporting the workforce to develop skills and confidence to work effectively with children with SEND; funded early language and maths interventions; supporting parents through the home learning environment; and 400-plus family hubs.

[Baroness Hughes of Stretford (Lab)]

I thank my noble friend for that Answer. I know she will agree that the previous Labour Government made significant progress in improving the well-being of our youngest children and reducing the early attainment gap through Sure Start parenting and family programmes. The Institute for Fiscal Studies has shown recently that the benefits of that have been sustained through to the age of 16 at least, although of course now we are seeing those gaps widen because the coalition and Tory Governments abandoned those programmes. I welcome the commitments my noble friend has just outlined, but does she agree that there needs to be a broader, more comprehensive strategy for our youngest children that includes, as a minimum, excellent early years education, support for parents and families—she has touched on some of that—and a highly trained workforce? Can my noble friend assure me that that strategy will be forthcoming?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend is right about the progress that was made under the last Labour Government, and she played an important role in that Government in this area of policy. I assure my noble friend that, as well as the plans that I have outlined, the department is working on an early years strategy that will give consideration to all the areas that she has outlined.

[Lord Storey (LD)]

My Lords, this is a hugely important Question. I wonder if the Minister would take a moment to think that it is not just about provision; it is also about the quality of that provision and of the staff. Does she agree that all nursery staff working with children from the ages of two to four should have a relevant qualification, or be working towards that qualification, in early years?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord is right that the quality of staff is fundamental, but so is the number of staff. We have a big challenge to ensure that we have sufficient staff in place by next September to deliver the outlined entitlement. We are working to provide additional training for staff. I take his point about the training and ongoing support that we need to provide for the staff who do such an important job at the beginning of children’s lives.

[Baroness Gohir (CB)]

My Lords, the largest number of nursery closures in recent years has been in the poorest parts of the country, particularly in areas with large minority-ethnic populations. Will the new and expanded nurseries that the Government are allocating be proportionately allocated in those hardest-hit areas?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Baroness is right that those are the areas where need is very great. In our recent announcement of £15 million-worth of investment in the first 300 nurseries based in schools, we will be encouraging applications from those where there is a particular need. We will be using evidence of those applications to ensure that we are able to improve the provision in the areas that need it most.

[Lord Young of Cookham (Con)]

How confident is the Minister that she will be able to recruit the 35,000 additional staff that she needs to meet her target?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

As I outlined to the noble Lord, it is a very big challenge and one that we inherited from the previous Government. We have reinvigorated the recruitment campaign and are focusing on ensuring that we have those staff in place. Although it will be very difficult, we are committed to ensuring that, next September, we deliver that improved entitlement for childcare.

[Lord Dubs (Lab)]

My Lords, it is good news about increasing the funding for school-based nurseries. Can the Minister say something about childminders? Is there a danger that, if the number of childminders goes down, the net benefit will be less?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend is right. We have already seen a halving in the number of childminders over recent years. Childminders play an important role for those parents who choose to use them, which is why we have implemented improved support for childminders. We want to maintain their important position in the market.

[Lord Laming (CB)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that it is unrealistic to think that all adults are born with good parenting skills? Therefore, it is important that we have in place facilities that help some parents learn new skills and develop confidence about how to bring up their children. By doing that, we prevent a substantial number of children coming into care and save a great deal of money, as well as looking after the well-being of children. Can the Minister say that the facilities that she has described will help parents develop confidence and parenting skills?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord is right. The first years of a child’s life, where they depend on their parents, are fundamental. Supporting parents to be able to take on that job—he is quite right that it is not always easy and does not necessarily come naturally—is really important. Evidence has shown that high-quality parenting programmes, alongside wider integrated support, can be really important. That is why the Family Hubs and Start for Life programme includes funding to improve the parenting support offer, including evidence-based parenting programmes. It is why we will work to ensure that there is further awareness of the importance of parenting in childhood development. We will consider how, through the development of family hubs, we can provide further support for parents, precisely because, as he says, it is good for children and saves money later on in life.

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My Lords, could the Minister confirm that the Government’s childcare funding rates will be increased to absorb the increase in employers’ national insurance contributions?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

We have increased the rates this year, but we will be looking at the implications of national insurance contributions for the early years sector.

[Baroness Lister of Burtersett (Lab)]

My Lords, given the importance of childcare to early years education and development, would our child-centred Government consider as part of their early years strategy, referred to by my noble friend, the extension of free childcare to children whose parents are not working at least 16 hours a week? At present, children from the lowest-income families, who are likely to benefit most, are excluded from free childcare.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend makes a very important point. On the entitlements, we are delivering the programme and the plans set out by the previous Government, but there are also provisions for some parents with children with particular needs, or where they are on particular benefits, to receive childcare provision. Notwithstanding the pressures on the public purse, we will want to think in the early years strategy about how we can extend the support of childcare to more families when we are able to.

[Baroness Berridge (Con)]

My Lords, this is a workforce with a large number of 18 to 21 year-olds. Following my noble friend’s question, will the department consider whether those increased costs are going to be absorbed? If the department decides to do that, what will be the implications for, for instance, hospices, which are charities delivering NHS services? Once one moves to support one sector to absorb the national insurance and minimum wage increases, is there not an issue of principle that other sectors should be supported too?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

With respect to services delivering healthcare, my noble and honourable friends in the Department of Health and Social Care are considering the implications and will bring them forward. I point out to noble Lords opposite that there is no point demanding improved provision and arguing for, for example, a childcare entitlement that will involve considerable additional spending—which this Government have found in last week’s Budget—while being unwilling to find the money necessary to fill the £22 billion black hole that we inherited from them.

[Baroness Whitaker (Lab)]

My Lords, there is a certain amount of research which shows that children who attended early years education thrived more. They had higher incomes and they certainly benefited from higher and tertiary education, and I think they kept out of prison a bit more. Will my noble friend keep an eye on the continuation of this research, which might even help her get more funds for early years care from the Treasury?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend is absolutely right that investing money in our youngest children demonstrably improves their outcomes later in life. It is the most effective place in which to invest that money. That is why my honourable friend the Secretary of State has made it her number one priority for the Department for Education and why we were pleased to receive from the Treasury additional money to enable us to make progress in this last week. I will certainly keep an eye on the evidence that my noble friend identifies, and I am sure my noble friends—including my noble friend Lord Livermore sitting next to me on the Front Bench—will be keen to hear about it when they find additional resources for this very important area of work in the future.

Sex and Gender: Official Data

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

Tuesday 5th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Fox of Buckley]

To ask His Majesty’s Government, following the downgrading of data gathered from the 2021 Census question on gender identity, what steps they are taking to ensure accurate and consistent data on sex and gender are collected to ensure robust official data.

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, the Government value the collection of high quality and robust data on this topic. The Government Statistical Service will publish a work plan for updated, harmonised standards and guidance on sex and gender in December this year. This will align with the Office for National Statistics regulation guidance on collecting and reporting data about sex and gender identity, which was published in February.

[Baroness Fox of Buckley (Non-Afl)]

I thank the Minister for that reply. In the meantime, can she look closely at one worrying consequence? NHS data standards were updated to reflect those very same compromised gender identity questions used in the census. Genspect UK research shows that a significant number of GPs also use them, which in theory means that every time someone registers with a new doctor, patients could informally change the sex registered on their health records. Does the Minister agree that this is concerning because biological sex influences everything from diagnosis to treatment? Therefore, the recording of accurate sex data in NHS records is essential for safe and appropriate healthcare.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The reason why it is so important that we allow the independent statistical services to develop the question appropriately is precisely that it will be used more widely in other public services. Of course it is important that that has the confidence of those responding to the question and of the services being provided. To that extent, therefore, I share the noble Baroness’s concern to ensure that that statistical collection is robust and appropriate and is informing services, including the NHS, in a way that users need it to.

[Baroness Burt of Solihull (LD)]

I hope the Minister will acknowledge that—given the downgraded English figures, which gave the trans and non-binary population as 0.55%, and given that the figure we found for Scottish, Welsh, Canadian, USA and GB patients is 0.44%—we can conclude that the English census figures are not a million miles out and that the actual number of people in question is tiny in proportion to the amount of time we spend talking about them. Can we not, instead, use these figures to help design services appropriately for them, and move on?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

This is my first opportunity to answer a Question on this issue in this House, but I certainly take the noble Baroness’s point that it is important that we have accurate and respected statistics, but that we are also providing services to people on the basis of their needs, particularly for LGBT+ people, and that they are safe, included and protected from discrimination. That, along with protection of sex-based rights where necessary, is what this Government will focus on.

[Baroness Deech (CB)]

My Lords, the Minister may have noticed that in every questionnaire one comes across these days—applying for jobs and filling in a questionnaire online—the final question is always about sex, gender, identity, binary: there are umpteen choices. How can someone filling in the form know what they are supposed to be if they do not have a gender recognition certificate? What is the accurate answer? How does one get people whose first language is not English to understand, in particular, NHS forms, where the question is crucial?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I should point out that the most recent census was the first time this question was asked, and it is important that a range of questions is asked in the census, on a voluntary basis in this case. However, I also think it important that the questions are designed in an accessible way and that people understand the terms used in them. That is precisely why the Government Statistical Service will be undertaking the work I outlined in my initial Answer.

[The Lord Speaker (Lord McFall of Alcluith)]

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Shinkwin, is participating remotely.

[Lord Shinkwin (Con) [V]]

My Lords, one area where the data in the 2021 census is accurate is disability. I cannot help thinking that, if a fraction of the energy and resources devoted to identity politics had been given to disability access in the 30 years since the DDA was passed by your Lordships’ House, the world—[Inaudible.]

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I think I can probably understand how the noble Lord was going to finish his question. I tend to agree with him, and I will be committed, alongside my other equality responsibilities to this House, to ensuring that we make progress on disability access as well.

[Baroness Thornton (Lab)]

My Lords, having listened to the questions posed by noble Lords and the sensible responses from my noble friend the Minister, I think the Question is really about the need for accurate data on sex and gender identity, and finding the right way to get that data. A climate of distrust and defensiveness is unhelpful if our researchers are to advance our understanding in this area without fear of accusations of bias.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend is absolutely right. It is important that academics and researchers can do their work. It is important that government statistics are determined and regulated independently of government and political arguments. The work plan that will be set out in December is intended to ensure that this happens.

[Baroness Neville-Rolfe (Con)]

My Lords, as this Question is about the census, will the Minister encourage the Cabinet Office to do something about the lack of comparability, between England on the one hand and Scotland and Wales on the other, of many vital statistics of importance to the public, such as waiting times in the NHS? This was highlighted by the excellent independent review of the UK Statistics Authority by Professor Lievesley, and it would be nice to see progress in that area.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I am not sure that waiting times in the NHS are part of the census, but I take the noble Baroness’s point, nevertheless. Although, as I have emphasised, the development of statistical measures should be done independently of government, I am sure that co-ordination between the devolved Administrations, where appropriate, would be a good idea.

[Lord Strasburger (LD)]

My Lords, throughout the criminal justice system, sex registered at birth is the most important variable in the analysis of crime and offending. It underpins the planning of policing services, risk assessments and offender treatment programmes. But recent freedom of information requests reveal that most police forces in England and Wales no longer record sex registered at birth. Instead, they record the offender’s self-declared gender identity—astonishingly, even when the offence is rape. What are the Government doing to stop this corruption of the fundamental data used throughout the criminal justice system?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord identifies why it is important that we have clarity about the measures being used in order to ensure that services are appropriate to people. That is the objective of the work plan that will be set out in December, which will have engagement around it, so that we can be clear about the measures and the definitions not just in the census but for the broad range of public authorities, including in the criminal justice system, that need to use them as well.

[Baroness Ludford (LD)]

The previous Government commissioned an independent review, led by Professor Alice Sullivan of University College London, a statistics expert, to look at problems exemplified by the census fiasco and set out good practice on how to collect data. This review by Professor Sullivan was due to report back in August. Will the Government publish the Sullivan review and their response?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The first part of the review has been received by the Government, who are currently considering it. I undertake to come back to this House with a response to that.

[Lord Lucas (Con)]

My Lords, do the Government have a working definition of gender and gender identity and, if so, could they share it with the House?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord would be well advised to look at the Equality Act, for example. I have to say that this would be a better debate if we spent more time worrying about how we provide services and account for people’s needs, and less about how we catch our political opponents out.

[Lord Markham (Con)]

As a previous Health Minister, I know that there is a serious health reason to have a proper understanding of the answer to the question of when a woman is a woman and needs to have treatment based on her sex. Please: this is a serious question that deserves a serious answer.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

I agree—a woman is an adult female, and her biological sex may well determine what services she needs from the NHS. That is why it is important that, in statistics that are used both in the census and more broadly by our public services, we have a consistent and an agreed approach to that. That is what I have been talking about up to this point. Frankly, I was taking this seriously, and I hope that others around the House will as well.

Unregistered Children’s Homes: Fees

Baroness Smith of Malvern Excerpts

Monday 28th October 2024 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Tyler of Enfield]

To ask His Majesty’s Government what steps, if any, they are taking to lower fees being charged by unregistered children’s homes.

[The Minister of State, Department for Education (Baroness Smith of Malvern) (Lab)]

My Lords, profiteering from vulnerable children in care is unacceptable. Children must live in safe, high-quality homes, which is why it is a legal requirement for children’s homes to register with Ofsted. This means that they can be inspected and children are safe, and that where there are failings, they are addressed. We will strengthen regulation through the children’s well-being Bill so that children’s social care delivers high-quality outcomes for looked-after children at a sustainable cost to the taxpayer.

[Baroness Tyler of Enfield (LD)]

I thank the Minister for her Answer, but there remains a real concern about the number of children still living in unregistered children’s homes. Is the Minister aware of the recent BBC investigation, which highlighted that some unregistered children’s homes are charging up to a staggering £20,000 a week and still failing to keep very vulnerable children safe, which a senior family court judge has described as breathtaking? What immediate steps are the Government taking to address this issue? Does the Minister also agree that the key aim of addressing excessive costs, which I fully support, should not lead to the eradication of children’s homes, and that we need a mix of high-quality, registered provision to meet all children’s needs?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Baroness is right that some extraordinary amounts of money are being charged by placement providers. The Local Government Association found, for example, that in 2022-23, 91% of respondent councils paid at least £10,000 per week or more for one placement, compared to 23% in 2018-19. That is why, as the noble Baroness says, we need to ensure that a range of safe, regulated, high-quality placements are available for children, and to ensure that where there is excessive profit, we take action against that as well.

[Lord Laming (CB)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that local authorities rushed into outsourcing their services some years ago, and now there is insufficient provision but they are paying these huge fees? Could she give some thought to the number of children who are being placed, time after time, in different places, sometimes many miles away from their home base? That is not good for these very vulnerable children.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord is right, in that in the children’s home market, 83% of provision is now private. To be clear, there is high-quality private children’s home provision, just as there is in the local authority and voluntary sectors. What is important, as the noble Lord says, is that children can be placed securely in those homes—that they are not being constantly moved from one to another—and that they get the care they need. It is absolutely true that moving children frequently and taking them far away from friends and perhaps other family members is not in their best interests. That is why we need to tackle this, and we will take further action on regulating the sector in the children’s well-being Bill.

[Baroness Thornton (Lab)]

My Lords, I welcome my noble friend’s announcement today. Surely, the promised reform of public services must prioritise the provision of residential care for our most vulnerable looked-after children, and we have to deal with inadequate care and profit gouging. There are some great examples of good provision, particularly in the voluntary sector and social enterprises. Can my noble friend assure me that this issue is being addressed across government, given that the Cabinet Office is involved regarding procurement, and the MHCLG and Department for Education are also involved? Will my noble friend meet with me so that I can share some of the good practice I have seen and heard about in recent months?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

My noble friend is absolutely right. Because of the disproportionate costs being placed on local authorities and the findings that Ofsted sometimes makes in unregulated homes, if we are not careful, we can forget that some brilliant work is being done, as my noble friend says, in the voluntary sector, in social enterprises and in private and local government-provided facilities. We should celebrate that, and that should be our aspiration for all children. My right honourable friend the Commons Minister and I will be very pleased to hear about those examples. They will inspire us to take forward the provisions we are planning in the children’s well- being Bill.

[Lord Hayward (Con)]

My Lords, the Minister will recognise that a disproportionately high number of the prison population comes from children’s homes; it is a very sad figure indeed. While she is looking at the issue of unregistered children’s homes, can she also look at the broader issue of the number of children from children’s homes who finish up in prison?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord is right. Across a whole range of measures, care leavers do worse than those who have not been in care. Whether or not they end up in prison, they are more likely to be not in employment, education or training and are more likely to be homeless. That is why we must ensure that the care and concern we have for children while they are in care continues after they leave care, and that we set those children up for life as well as possible while we, as the state, have responsibility for looking after them.

[Lord Patel of Bradford (Non-Afl)]

My Lords, although there is clearly good practice in many children’s homes, there are also examples of really bad practice. Do the Minister and the Government have any plans to formally and professionally regulate some of the senior staff, at least, in children’s homes? A number of staff are from very diverse backgrounds and are not necessarily professionally qualified social workers.

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Lord is right that the leadership of these homes is very important in ensuring that they are providing the quality of care we want to see. In thinking about the provisions in the children’s well-being Bill, we are working with the sector, with local authorities, on where we need to improve regulation. In considering that, I will certainly feed back the point the noble Lord makes about staff.

[The Lord Bishop of Newcastle]

My Lords, at the last count in March 2023, 41% of children’s homes in England were located in the north of England. What steps are the Government taking to provide additional support to areas of the country where there is a disproportionately higher number of children in the care home and care system?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The right reverend Prelate raises an important point. In the development of private children’s homes, we have seen a growth: for example, it is possible to get hold of accommodation more cheaply, but that does not necessarily mean that such homes are where children need them. Some 25% of all homes nationally are in the north-west, despite only 16% of children who need to be looked after in residential care coming from the north-west. That is why there has been investment to support local authorities to improve existing provision and to create additional placements; and it is why, through the children’s well-being Bill and in other ways, we will work to ensure that, wherever a child needs care, there is high-quality care that does not involve them having to travel or the local authority facing excessive costs.

[Baroness Barran (Con)]

My Lords, the noble Baroness, Lady Tyler, raised the issue of the costs associated with some unregistered children’s homes, but I want to ask the Minister a more basic question. We know from Ofsted’s 2023 guidance that it is illegal to send a child, even a child with a deprivation of liberty order, to an unregistered children’s home, yet the case to which the noble Baroness referred, as I understand it, was about a year later. What are the Government doing to make sure that children do not go to unregistered homes at all, whatever they cost?

[Baroness Smith of Malvern (Lab)]

The noble Baroness identifies the absolute difficulty and the challenging circumstances that directors of children’s services and others find themselves in. For example, on a Friday afternoon, when faced with having to find a placement for a child urgently, they have no other option, because of a failure to provide sufficient places, than to place a child in an unregulated home. This is so unsatisfactory for everybody, and that is why, through the provisions we will bring forward in the children’s well-being Bill and through appropriate investment in increasing the number of places, we will try to ensure that that happens far less in the future.