Oral Answers to Questions

James Cartlidge Excerpts

Monday 20th November 2023 Commons Chamber

[Helen Morgan (North Shropshire) (LD)]

8. What steps he is taking to improve service accommodation for armed forces personnel.

[The Minister for Defence Procurement (James Cartlidge)]

Currently, 96.5% of the service family accommodation meets or exceeds the Government’s decent homes standard; only those properties should be allocated to service families. The Government continue to invest significant sums to improve the quality of UK service family accommodation. The Defence Infrastructure Organisation received an investment of £400 million over this financial year and the next as part of the defence Command Paper refresh, meaning that the forecast £380.2 million for this year is more than double last year’s investment in maintenance and improvements.

[Chris Elmore]

The Minister will be aware that this time last year, almost 5,000 homes of armed forces personnel were affected by black mould and damp, which obviously included many properties that had children in them. A year on, too many of our service personnel and their families still have this problem. No matter whether it is one house or 5,000 houses, can the Minister set out how he is going to tackle this problem quickly? Our armed forces personnel and their families deserve better than what they have been getting to date.

[James Cartlidge]

The hon. Gentleman asks an excellent question. We are aware that what happened last winter was not good enough. Too many homes were affected, particularly by damp and mould. That is why we have prioritised getting the investment in, and it has more than doubled in the current financial year. I am pleased to confirm to him that last week I set out our winter plan. It shows that 4,000 homes in the defence estate would benefit from significant work on damp and mould, which is about 60% of the total number that require that work.

[Helen Morgan]

A constituent of mine who lives in Clive barracks at Tern Hill in Shropshire has reported that he lives in rat-infested accommodation, sometimes with two to six soldiers living in the same room. As a result, shipping containers have been placed in the grounds—about 40 at the end of August—and kitted out like budget hotel accommodation for those soldiers to live in. Can the Minister provide any reassurance that these servicemen will be provided with somewhere appropriate to live in the near future?

[James Cartlidge]

I am obviously sorry to hear about that case. I would ask the hon. Member to write to me with the details, and I will look into it with the DIO. The key thing is that, wherever we are talking about—whichever specific barracks or base—if we are going to get on with the works, we need the money there, and we have got that. We have put in place the extra £400 million, and as I set out in the winter plan, thousands of forces personnel will now benefit from that work.

[Mr Mark Francois (Rayleigh and Wickford) (Con)]

The DIO is not fit for purpose, and the Future Defence Infrastructure Services accommodation contract has been a disaster, including completely unacceptable delays in issuing and checking gas and electricity safety certificates. No private landlord would get away with this without being sued. The Secretary of State had a good run out at the Defence Committee last week, and said he was potentially looking at radical reforms in this area. Can I urge the Minister and his boss to do precisely that to honour our service personnel and their families in a way they are not being honoured at present?

[James Cartlidge]

I am very grateful to my right hon. Friend. He knows that I share his passion for seeing genuine step change improvements in our accommodation. That is why we have announced the spending that we have. On the performance of the contractors, which the DIO ultimately oversees, one of the important aspects of the winter plan is a significant increase in staff manning the telephone service, so that we see better service to personnel. We expect the average waiting time for one of those calls to go from seven minutes to 29 seconds. It will be very important to service personnel that, when they make those calls, they get answered in good time.

[Dame Caroline Dinenage (Gosport) (Con)]

The Minister may be aware that earlier this year one of the accommodation blocks in HMS Collingwood in my Gosport constituency was shut down all together because it just simply was not fit for human habitation. There are also some issues with the accommodation blocks in HMS Sultan. Could I invite the Minister to come to Gosport to have a look at some of the accommodation on offer for our service personnel? It is simply not good enough, and they deserve better.

[James Cartlidge]

I would be more than happy to do so.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Minister.

[Luke Pollard (Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport) (Lab/Co-op)]

There is a new Defence Secretary, but it is the same old story in service accommodation, with reports of broken boilers, black mould, leaky roofs and painfully long waits for repairs. Last Christmas, one service family told me that they went without a working boiler for three weeks and were forced to live in a hotel over Christmas and new year. Can the Minister assure me that no one who serves our country in uniform will go without heating, or be forced out of their home this winter because of the dire state of their military accommodation?

[James Cartlidge]

I am grateful to the hon. Member, and I repeat the point: we recognise that performance was not good enough last winter, which is why the Secretary of State made it an absolute priority to get the extra investment in. Having done that, I am pleased to say that the winter plan does include boiler and heating upgrades for about 1,500 homes.

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[Neale Hanvey (Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath) (Alba)]

6. If he will make an estimate of the annual maintenance and running costs of the Trident nuclear programme.

[The Minister for Defence Procurement (James Cartlidge)]

The Ministry of Defence co-ordinates a range of interdependent programmes to support, maintain and renew the nuclear deterrent. The expected cost of the combined defence nuclear enterprise will be set out at supplementary estimates in February.

[Neale Hanvey]

The estimated costs of Trident’s renewal stand at the moment at £31 billion, with a further £10 billion earmarked for contingency. We know that containment of nuclear material is a problem for the Ministry of Defence, and we also know from recent reports that a Vanguard-class submarine nearly had a collision over the weekend. Our party put in a freedom of information request asking about transportation of nuclear material through Scotland, and that was rebuffed. The UK Government may be content to play second fiddle to the US on weapons of mass destruction, but can the Secretary of State explain the lack of transparency on WMD movement in Scotland, and justify Scotland’s being kept in the dark? Is it not time to abandon this costly and dangerous bomb and get it out of Scotland for good?

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Let us help each other to get through the list, please.

[James Cartlidge]

I profoundly disagree about this being the time to abandon the deterrent. I could not think of a worse time. The policy of the hon. Gentleman’s party is not just to abandon the deterrent but to withdraw from NATO. I could not think of a more reckless policy to undertake in the face of Russian aggression. We support the deterrent and we will continue to invest in it.

[Sir Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con)]

Does the Minister share my relief that both main parties in the House of Commons support the retention and renewal of the nuclear deterrent? Did he also share my relief that, in July 2016 when the vote was held on whether to renew the nuclear deterrent, there was a massive majority of 355 in favour of doing that? That sends a message to the Scottish nationalists about how unrepresentative their views are.

[James Cartlidge]

I am extremely grateful to my right hon. Friend for that remark. I was delighted that those on the Labour Front Bench showed their agreement by nodding when I gave my previous answer. I am delighted that there is consensus. I think we all agree that, particularly at this time, the country needs the security of a deterrent to deter what would be the most aggressive threats to our nation’s freedom.

[Mr Speaker]

I welcome the shadow Minister to her place.

[Maria Eagle (Garston and Halewood) (Lab)]

May I confirm again that Labour’s support for our nuclear deterrent, which we maintain on behalf of our NATO allies, is total? However, following reports in newspapers about a malfunctioning depth gauge on a Vanguard submarine at sea, can the Minister explain what steps he has taken to ensure that such an incident never happens again?

[James Cartlidge]

First, I am delighted to hear confirmation of Labour’s total support for the deterrent. That sends a very powerful message to our adversaries about our national endeavour to support the deterrent and its renewal. On the specific story that the hon. Lady mentions, she will not be surprised to hear that we do not comment on operational matters in respect of our submarines.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the SNP spokesperson.

[Martin Docherty-Hughes (West Dunbartonshire) (SNP)]

This one will break the convention.

Let me also welcome the Secretary of State to their position. The nuclear enterprise has an uncapped budget, and, after the demise of HS2, is the largest single public procurement project on these islands. For those of us on the SNP Benches at least, that is money spent on a weapons system that is designed never to be used, which not only bleeds money from the conventional MOD budget but sucks it from hospitals, schools and social care. On a day when the preview of the autumn statement in the Financial Times reads,

“Stagnation nation: governing the UK when ‘there is no money’”,

can the Minister advise the House what steps his Department is taking to ensure that there are no further cuts to conventional forces or elsewhere because of the uncapped, runaway Trident budget?

[James Cartlidge]

The hon. Gentleman talks about budget and cost. I can be open about the figure that matters: 80 million. That is the combined death toll in the first and second world wars. We have not had a third world war and we are profoundly lucky, and I put it to the House that it is not a coincidence.

[Martin Docherty-Hughes]

We know from the official history of the submarine service by Peter Hennessy and James Jinks that, during the transition to Vanguard, contingencies were made in Whitehall for the possible alteration of the continuous at-sea deterrent to take account of the complete breakdown of one or more hulls. This involved diving a Polaris submarine into Loch Long to remain there on a quick reaction alert. Can the Minister advise the House on what discussions his Department is having on the contingencies that we now see arising from an almost 40-year-old Vanguard fleet?

[James Cartlidge]

The hon. Gentleman, too, will not be surprised to hear that we will not comment on that, other than to say that we have had a continuous at-sea deterrent since 1969. We should all be proud of that, and I am delighted to see that Members on both sides of the House who support our Union also support the nuclear deterrent.

[Mr Tanmanjeet Singh Dhesi (Slough) (Lab)]

9. What steps he is taking to increase the number of RAF aid flights to the middle east.

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[Chris Loder (West Dorset) (Con)]

17. What steps his Department is taking to help support the medium-sized helicopter industry in the south-west.

[The Minister for Defence Procurement (James Cartlidge)]

Helicopters form an important part of our integrated operating concept. Through past and current investment in rotary capability, the UK industrial base remains well placed to support existing and future helicopter platforms. Positive progress is being made towards the next stage of the competition with the three downselected suppliers: Airbus Helicopters UK, Leonardo Helicopters UK and Lockheed Martin UK.

[Chris Loder]

Can my hon. Friend confirm that the invitation to negotiate for the medium-sized helicopter will indeed be issued by the end of December?

[James Cartlidge]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend. We are keen to get on with this, and that is certainly our intention. At the moment, we are in the process of securing final cross-Government approval. As I said, that is our aim, but I cannot absolutely guarantee it.

[Mr Rob Roberts (Delyn) (Ind)]

18. What steps his Department is taking to support defence jobs across the UK.

[The Minister for Defence Procurement (James Cartlidge)]

The most recent estimate shows that MOD investment supports more than 200,000 jobs in industries across the UK, and continued investment in defence along with the changes we continue to make as part of our defence and security industrial strategy are contributing to further economic growth and prosperity across the Union.

[Mr Roberts]

I thank the Minister for his answer. As a Member from north-east Wales, I am interested in how we promote defence spending in all regions of the United Kingdom, meaning that there is some balance, with defence jobs and investment not concentrated in the same part of England every time. What can the Minister do to assure my constituents in Delyn that they will have as much opportunity as those in places such as the south-west of England?

[James Cartlidge]

My hon. Friend makes an excellent point. Obviously, we strongly want to see defence expenditure benefiting every part of the Union. I can confirm expenditure with industry in Wales amounting to about £744 million. Just to reassure him and show him how importantly we regard Wales, the week before last I heard I held my small and medium-sized enterprise forum in Cardiff at Space Forge, a brilliant Welsh SME that we are supporting with half a million pounds of funding to develop in-space manufacturing of semiconductors. That is a strong example of how we are supporting Welsh SMEs in the defence sector.

[Richard Foord (Tiverton and Honiton) (LD)]

19. What assessment his Department has made of the potential impact of RAF surveillance aircraft on UK strategy and operations overseas.

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[Alistair Strathern (Mid Bedfordshire) (Lab)]

T2. I am proud that my constituency is home to hundreds of armed forces personnel and their families and former families, but as Members on both sides of the House have mentioned, last winter far too many of them found themselves living in accommodation that simply was not fit for purpose. Can the Minister confirm how we will be getting tough with the contractors who are letting down our families this winter, and can we have some clarity on when all armed forces families will finally be able to live in homes that are fit for their heroes?

[The Minister for Defence Procurement (James Cartlidge)]

I commend the hon. Gentleman for raising this important matter for his constituency, and I am pleased to work with him on what we offer his service personnel. I have said that last winter was not good enough, but this year we are ramping up massively. We have at times withheld profit from contractors where they have not performed, but what I want to see from them above all is delivery. We have put in place the £400 million and I now want to see that delivered as improvements to houses, including work being done on boilers and on damp and mould. Thousands of homes will be supported this winter and hopefully we will be in a far better position.

[Andrew Jones (Harrogate and Knaresborough) (Con)]

T5. Does my right hon. Friend agree that we are more secure as a country when the world is a safer and more peaceful place, and that a successful two-state solution for the Israel and Palestine question is therefore a part of our own national security too?

[Andrew Gwynne (Denton and Reddish) (Lab)]

T3.   Labour Party research on waste in the Ministry of Defence shows that over £15 billion has been squandered since 2010, so when are the Government going to get a grip on defence procurement and secure value for money for the British taxpayer?

[James Cartlidge]

On all the key metrics there has been a significant improvement since the hon. Gentleman’s party was in office. If you were to ask, Mr Speaker, what the key test was for a procurement system, I would say it is wartime. Of course we are not ourselves directly at war, but in supporting Ukraine, we have seen excellence in procurement, particularly at Defence Equipment and Support, getting equipment—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I call the Chair of the Select Committee, Robert Courts.

[Robert Courts (Witney) (Con)]

May I take this opportunity to formally welcome the Secretary of State to his position? I am grateful for his comments on military accommodation being a priority for him. The Select Committee is undertaking an inquiry into that as well. One of the issues that has come up is the absence of a military uniformed accommodation officer who is responsible for continually inspecting accommodation and then liaising with the contractors to ensure that the repairs take place. Is that something my hon. Friend the Minister will consider?

[James Cartlidge]

I strongly congratulate my hon. Friend on becoming Chair of the Defence Committee and I look forward to working with him. I know that, predating his appointment, he had a strong interest in accommodation, and I enjoyed visiting his constituency to look at the accommodation for Brize Norton. I will consider his point and write to him.

[Kirsten Oswald (East Renfrewshire) (SNP)]

T6. In 2022, 11.2% of British Army recruits were women. That is down from 12.6% in 2020. In 2021, 9% of British Army recruits were from ethnic minority backgrounds, and that is down from 11.7% in 2020. What is the Secretary of State doing to urgently remedy this reduction in the diversity of recruits?

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[John Spellar (Warley) (Lab)]

T7. The Ukraine conflict has reinforced the need for a thriving defence industry to underpin our security. Will the Secretary of State now take the opportunity to revisit his predecessor’s policy of placing so many orders abroad, rather than in British industry with British workers, and in particular, the building of the fleet solid support ships in foreign yards?

[James Cartlidge]

The right hon. Gentleman talks about the fleet solid support ships being built in foreign yards. I can assure him that recently, I had the great pleasure of visiting Harland & Wolff at its Appledore yard in north Devon. That is in the UK, and it is where a significant part of the FSS contract will be made.

[Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con)]

Rock Barracks in my constituency is home to the excellent 23 Parachute Regiment. I know the Government have invested a lot of money in new accommodation, but people are being let down. We know that Pinnacle is the problem, but it also worries me that people feel they cannot approach their MP directly because of retaliation if they make a complaint. I encourage the Minister to come and visit so that we can fix this problem properly.

[James Cartlidge]

I am alarmed to hear that. It is a pleasure to take a question from my right hon. Friend, who is my constituency neighbour; it is not far for me to travel, and I would be delighted to do so.

[Helen Morgan (North Shropshire) (LD)]

T8. I welcome the Minister’s statement last week that 60% of homes with damp and mould will be receiving support, because that has been such a big issue at RAF Shawbury in my constituency. Can he explain what is going to happen to the other 40% of homes that have damp and mould, and will he commit to a minimum standard for service accommodation for military families?

[James Cartlidge]

The hon. Lady asks a very good question. To be clear, the figure of 4,000 homes with damp and mould is for this winter: we have put in place £400 million of additional spending. Of course, as we move into next year, we will look at what further work can be undertaken so that we can deal with all the other properties.

[Sir Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con)]

Will the Minister confirm that the Ministry would never put serving personnel at risk by putting an open camp for illegal migrants in a serving base, and therefore any undertaking about that is worthless—that the most we will get at RAF Catterick is a closed detention centre?

[Mr Kevan Jones (North Durham) (Lab)]

T9.   Has the MOD made any further payments in addition to the £480 million it paid to General Dynamics in March of this year? I understand that subcontractors on the programme are not being paid, or are not being paid the amounts they expected. Is there any reason why General Dynamics should not be paying its subcontractors on this programme?

[James Cartlidge]

The right hon. Gentleman is very knowledgeable on these matters, and I am more than happy for him to write to me about them. The Ajax contract is a firm price contract, and I am very pleased to say that we are getting very positive feedback from the Household Cavalry about that platform’s capability, its sensors and its cannon. I do not know the answer to the right hon. Gentleman’s specific question about payments to subcontractors, so he is more than welcome to write to me.

[Jack Lopresti (Filton and Bradley Stoke) (Con)]

Will my hon. Friend meet me to discuss a British company, Christy Aerospace and Technology, which has the capability to dramatically reduce the time it takes to train Ukrainian pilots on F-16s, and does he agree that we need to do everything we can to accelerate the rate at which we can get those pilots trained?

[James Cartlidge]

It is always a pleasure to meet my hon. Friend.

[James Cartlidge]

It is always a pleasure to meet my hon. Friend. He has been an absolute champion on the Ukraine issue, and I would be delighted to meet him to see what more we can do.

[Ronnie Cowan (Inverclyde) (SNP)]

T10.   Ian Bernard is a constituent of mine who served in the Royal Air Force and witnessed the nuclear tests on Christmas Island. Ian is still to receive his nuclear veteran’s medal, and he has asked me to ask the Minister whether that omission could be rectified.

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[Simon Jupp (East Devon) (Con)]

The great south-west region is home to cutting-edge defence companies such as Supacat, which makes military vehicles for our armed forces. The Jackal 3 is an incredible vehicle that is being put to good use in Ukraine. What steps is my hon. Friend taking to ensure that more defence jobs come to the south-west?

[James Cartlidge]

It is brilliant to see south-west colleagues standing up for the defence sector in their constituencies, and my hon. Friend is right about Supacat—it is a brilliant platform. In February 2023 Supacat was awarded a £90 million contract by the MOD for 70 high-mobility truck vehicles, to be delivered by the end of the financial year, securing 100 jobs in the UK. Supacat already has two other direct contracts with the MOD for the Jackal military enhancement programme, which is valued at a total of £4.5 million.

[Sir Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab)]

We must ensure that Putin does not win. We must co-operate and help with the reconstruction of Ukraine. Is it not time that we started seizing Russian state assets to help pay for the reconstruction of Ukraine?

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[Holly Mumby-Croft (Scunthorpe) (Con)]

I believe that the ability to make virgin steel is crucial to the UK’s defence capabilities. Does my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State agree?

[James Cartlidge]

My hon. Friend makes an excellent point. She has been a long-running champion of the steel sector and its importance to her constituents. Of course, we want a smooth transition between blast furnace and electronic arc steel making technology. Steel remains incredibly important to the defence sector. Take the Type 26: almost 50% of that is British steel. That is 1,400 tonnes per ship. That underlines why it is so important that, in constituencies such as my hon. Friend’s, we continue to support the steel sector.

[Dave Doogan (Angus) (SNP)]

The Secretary of State and his predecessors rightly called out the wanton and unlawful destruction of civilian infrastructure in Ukraine—homes, hospitals and schools. Why can they not show equal uproar at what is happening to civilians in Gaza?