Oral Answers to Questions

Liz Kendall Excerpts

Monday 7th October 2024 Commons Chamber

[Gregory Stafford (Farnham and Bordon) (Con)]

24. What estimate she has made of the number of pensioners in poverty who will not be entitled to the winter fuel payment in winter 2024-25.

[The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Liz Kendall)]

May I say briefly, Mr Speaker, that as my right hon. and learned Friend the Prime Minister has said, 7 October last year was the deadliest day in Jewish history since the Holocaust, and we stand firm in our commitment to bring the remaining hostages home and secure the immediate ceasefire and aid that civilians in Gaza and Lebanon desperately need.

An estimated 880,000 of the poorest pensioners are not claiming the pension credit they are entitled to, so they do not get the winter fuel payment or pension credit of up to £3,900 a year. That is why we have launched the biggest ever drive to increase pension credit uptake and ensure that the poorest pensioners get the support they deserve.

[Ben Obese-Jecty]

Having spent the run-up to the election scaring pensioners into voting for them by claiming it was the Conservative Government who were a threat to their wellbeing, some of our poorest pensioners will now be forced to find out how difficult it is to keep warm huddled around Labour’s gaslight. Given that the Government’s own equality analysis states that only 100,000 of the 880,000 pensioners who are eligible for pension credit are expected to apply for it, if all those who are eligible do apply, how much more will that cost compared with the initial saving from removing the winter fuel payment?

[Liz Kendall]

I say gently to the hon. Gentleman that upon coming into government, we discovered that 880,000 pensioners are not claiming the pension credit they are entitled to. Given that his former Government failed to take action to deal with that issue, I suggest that instead of making that point, he works with his council to increase pension credit uptake and looks at the £1.8 million we have given to Peterborough council to make sure that all the help for pensioners, including on winter fuel, is made available.

[Wendy Morton]

I remain deeply concerned about the pensioners in my constituency who will not be entitled to the winter fuel payment this winter—we are now into October. Given that we now know that just 14% of pensioners in absolute poverty receive pension credit, how can the Minister justify her Government’s claim that they are focusing support on those in the greatest need?

[Liz Kendall]

Again, I say to the right hon. Lady that the reason so many of the poorest pensioners are missing out is that her Government failed to increase pension credit uptake. We have launched the biggest ever programme to increase uptake of pension credit. For the first time, we will be writing to all pensioners on housing benefit, and I urge the right hon. Lady to work with her local council and others to make sure that the poorest in her constituency get the money they are entitled to.

[Gregory Stafford]

Over 18,000 people in my constituency will lose the winter fuel payment, but this is not about figures; it is about individuals, which is why I am running a pensioners advisory service on Friday to help them with this issue. This is about people, so what does the Secretary of State say to people such as Rita in my constituency, who is looking after her husband who has multiple sclerosis and who will not be eligible for pension credit and therefore the winter fuel payment?

[Liz Kendall]

I know that the hon. Gentleman has focused over many years on health and healthcare issues, and I would say to him that we are in this situation because his Government left a £22 billion black hole in the public finances. Unlike Conservative Members, we take our responsibilities seriously, and I would urge him to work with his councils—they have received £7.1 million in Hampshire and £5.3 million in Surrey from the household support fund—to make sure that all pensioners get the money they are entitled to.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Chair of the Work and Pensions Committee.

[Debbie Abrahams (Oldham East and Saddleworth) (Lab)]

I welcome the work that my right hon. Friend is doing in ensuring that the uptake of pension credit is increased, but there are genuine concerns about people who are just above that threshold who will remain in poverty—just under a quarter of a million in the north-west alone. In addition to the fantastic commitment there has been through the household support fund, will my right hon. Friend be undertaking any other mitigations to ensure that those pensioners living in poverty, particularly disabled pensioners, will not fall foul of this?

[Liz Kendall]

I thank my hon. Friend for her question, and I welcome her to her position as Chair of the Select Committee. Alongside our work to increase pension credit uptake, the household support fund is available for those just above the pension credit level. My own council has done a lot of work to make sure that pensioners just above that level can get extra help with the costs of heating or energy debt. There is also the warm home discount, which is available not just to those on pension credit, but again to those just above that level if they are on low incomes and have high housing costs.

[Rachael Maskell (York Central) (Lab/Co-op)]

I congratulate the Secretary of State on her ambition to sign people up to pension credit, but we know that about 780,000 people will not sign up in time and also that there are 1 million people in fuel poverty above that mark. Given that we are really worried now, as winter is approaching, about the impact that this is going to have, particularly on the health of older people, will she look at the work done by Energy Systems Catapult and NHS Gloucestershire on social prescribing to ensure that people can receive energy payments in that way?

[Liz Kendall]

My hon. Friend raises a very important point. This is not just about urging people to come forward and claim. We are writing to pensioners on housing benefit for the first time ever, and I am determined to bring forward the merger of housing benefit and pension credit, which the former Government delayed for years. I very much agree about the need to bring together social prescribing with help from the household support fund and other areas to make sure pensioners get all the help they need, and about the need to work with frontline NHS staff, as we are also doing, to make sure that the poorest who may be stuck at home with chronic conditions also know what they are entitled to.

[Alistair Strathern (Hitchin) (Lab)]

It is clear that one of the drivers of pensioner poverty is the sheer number of pensioners eligible for pension credit who have been left not claiming it for successive years by the previous Government. I welcome the Secretary of State’s zeal for making sure that we put that right, but how can we as Members from across the House work with her Department to make sure that there are no unnecessary barriers for those who are eligible and in need of pension credit to claiming it this winter?

[Liz Kendall]

I would urge all hon. Members in this House to work with their local councils, as I am doing, to make sure that those on housing benefit and other pensioners know what they are entitled to, and to make sure that their councils know that the household support fund—the £421 million we have set aside this year, despite all the problems we face—is also available to those pensioners just above the pension credit level.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State.

[Liz Kendall]

In 2017, the right hon. Gentleman’s party manifesto promised to means-test winter fuel payments. Until Conservative Members know that they have to apologise to the British people for the 200,000 extra pensioners in poverty over the past 14 years, and for a £22 billion black hole in the public finances, which we are now putting right but that has put the public finances at risk, they will remain on the Opposition Benches and we will remain on the Government Benches.

[Mel Stride]

I think I need to correct the right hon. Lady: there were actually 200,000 fewer pensioners in absolute poverty under the previous Conservative Government. She quite rightly is pressing the uptake of pension credit, but if all those who are eligible for it take it up, that will cost £3.8 billion, which is substantially more than the saving that is scored at £1.4 billion. If she is successful in her aspiration, the costs will substantially outweigh the savings; if she is not successful, potentially millions of pensioners will be plunged further into poverty. May I ask her which it is?

[Liz Kendall]

There are 200,000 more pensioners in poverty, and I am happy to put those figures into the public domain to set the record straight. The savings we have put forward take into account the increase in uptake that we foresee. Unlike Conservative Members, we are determined and will do everything possible—they should perhaps ask themselves why they first announced the merger of pension credit and housing benefit in 2012 and then put it off until 2028—to change things and get people the money they are entitled to. We will bring that forward to ensure that all the poorest pensioners get what they are entitled to.

[Mr Speaker]

I call Liberal Democrat spokesperson Steve Darling.

[Steve Darling (Torbay) (LD)]

There are 2.7 million pensioners over the age of 80 who would have benefited from the £300 winter fuel allowance. They are among the most vulnerable in our society. The right hon. Lady is right to say that the previous Government let them down, but let us not add insult to injury and have the new Government let them down. Can she reassure the House that she will reverse the regressive approach that she has taken to the winter fuel allowance, and not hit the most vulnerable people who are over 80?

[Liz Kendall]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his question. He will know that this was not a decision that we wanted or expected to make. The reason we have taken it is that we have to deal with the £22 billion black hole in the public finances left by Conservative Members. But in doing so, we will as a progressive party always prioritise the very poorest pensioners. That is why we are so determined to end a situation where up to 880,000 people miss out on the winter fuel allowance because they are not getting pension credit. We are determined to put that right.

[Johanna Baxter (Paisley and Renfrewshire South) (Lab)]

2. What steps she is taking to reduce the time taken for Access to Work claims to be processed.

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[Torsten Bell (Swansea West) (Lab)]

13. What steps she is taking to progress the work of the child poverty taskforce.

[The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Liz Kendall)]

Tackling child poverty is a top priority for the new Government, and a personal priority for me. Children cannot fulfil their potential without food in their belly or a decent roof over their head, and we cannot fulfil our potential as a country when the talents of so many are left behind. That is why our new child poverty taskforce will drive action across every area of government to drive up family income, drive down family costs and give every child the best start in life.

[Torsten Bell]

I welcome the establishment of the child poverty taskforce. How will the taskforce ensure that lessons, including on the role of housing costs in driving up relative poverty and the necessity of growth to drive down absolute poverty, will be learnt from previous attempts to drive down child poverty in Wales and across the UK?

[Liz Kendall]

My hon. Friend makes a very important point about learning the lessons from the last time we were in government and lifted more than 600,000 children out of poverty, and looking at similarities and differences, not least that there are more children growing up in poverty in households, whether in the private rented sector or in social housing, and that there are more children growing up poor in a household where somebody works. Getting and creating more good quality jobs, and helping families into those jobs, is absolutely a crucial part of our child poverty plan.

[Kirsty Blackman (Aberdeen North) (SNP)]

Yet we have a situation where families with more children are impacted by the two-child cap and the benefit cap, and the Government are refusing to get rid of those things. At a stroke, they could lift thousands of children out of poverty and improve, overnight, their life chances. I appreciate the fact that the Government have the child poverty taskforce, but that is not making a difference to these children today, is it?

[Liz Kendall]

I am under no illusion about the impact 14 years of the Conservatives and the social security system has had on child poverty. That is why we are determined to take action across government to increase family incomes, drive down costs and, crucially, put in place long-term support, particularly in the early years. We will produce the strategy by spring. I am absolutely sure that every part of the plan will lift more children out of poverty.

[Luke Akehurst (North Durham) (Lab)]

14. What assessment she has made of trends in the level of child poverty in the last 10 years.

[The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Liz Kendall)]

The last Labour Government lifted 600,000 children out of poverty. Under the Conservatives, the number went up by 700,000. There are now more than 4 million children living in poverty in the UK in the 21st century. In one of the richest countries in the world, that is a complete disgrace. That is why the work of the child poverty taskforce, which I co-chair with the Education Secretary, is so urgent and so important.

[Luke Akehurst]

Almost a third of children in the north-east live in poverty. The problem is particularly acute in the region. Will the Secretary of State work with our Mayor of the North East, Kim McGuinness, on her excellent regional plans to reduce child poverty?

[Liz Kendall]

Yes, we have already met Kim McGuinness, on 19 September, when she set out the actions she is already taking. Let me say to Members on both sides of the House that our strategy will be out in the spring, but we will not be waiting until then to act. Nationally, we have put £421 million into the household support fund to help the poorest families, and mayors such as Kim McGuinness are doing amazing work: they are working with schools to ensure that people claim the benefits to which they are entitled, and, crucially, working with businesses to help them to do all that they can to tackle in-work poverty and ensure that working families receive the money for those children.

[Alison Hume (Scarborough and Whitby) (Lab)]

15. What steps she is taking to tackle carer’s allowance overpayments.

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[Chris Webb (Blackpool South) (Lab)]

T1. If she will make a statement on her departmental responsibilities.

[The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Liz Kendall)]

I am determined to put transparency at the heart of the DWP, so I have today published 31 reports that were sat on by the previous Government—something that my right hon. Friend the Minister for Social Security and Disability has long campaigned for. Under this Government’s leadership, the DWP will be honest about the problems that the country faces and focused on the solutions needed to help people build a better life. That starts with our forthcoming White Paper, to get Britain working again.

[Chris Webb]

I first joined WASPI women—Women Against State Pension Inequality Campaign—in their welcome campaigning activity back in 2017. Seven years later, they are still fighting for justice. Can the Minister assure women in my constituency and across the country that she will act urgently, unlike the previous Government, and bring this injustice to an end?

[Liz Kendall]

I thank my hon. Friend for his question. I met representatives of the WASPI campaign before this Government were elected. My hon. Friend the Minister for Pensions was the first Minister to meet them in eight years. It really is a serious report that requires serious consideration. We will do everything possible to get this issue resolved as soon as possible.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State.

[Mel Stride (Central Devon) (Con)]

On 10 September, two days before recess, I led a debate in this Chamber, secured by the Conservative party, on the winter fuel allowance. The right hon. Lady spoke just now about transparency, but there was no equality impact assessment made available for that debate. Indeed, on 30 August, by way of a written question, my hon. Friend the Member for Hinckley and Bosworth (Dr Evans) established that the Government had no intention of publishing that particular report. Yet on 13 September—two days after the debate and the vote, and one day after Parliament had risen—the report was made available. It was clearly, in my opinion, deliberately withheld. Does the right hon. Lady agree?

[Liz Kendall]

That is not true. The Conservative Government did not even allow the Office for Budget Responsibility to do an analysis of Liz Truss’s disastrous mini-Budget and sat on 31 publications that, under their own rules, should have been published. We published an equality analysis. The right hon. Gentleman will know that that was never done for secondary legislation when he was in government, but this Government will be open and transparent, which is what we are already doing.

[Paul Davies (Colne Valley) (Lab)]

T5. Since the election, numerous constituents have contacted me to raise concerns about the Child Maintenance Service’s inefficiency in collecting arrears payments. Can the Minister outline the measures being taken to enhance the service’s effectiveness in this area?

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[Mr Speaker]

Order. These are topical questions, so please can we keep them short? I have to try and get through the list to help others.

[Liz Kendall]

My hon. Friend has raised these issues with me before, and I will absolutely meet children, families and child poverty organisations from her constituency. We aim to visit every region and every devolved nation as part of that strategy, and I look forward to meeting her and her constituents then.

[Vikki Slade (Mid Dorset and North Poole) (LD)]

T2. Data from Marie Curie suggests that 90,000 people die in poverty every year, many of them after a terminal diagnosis. Even with the help of the special rules system, there have been reports of terminally ill people facing mounds of red tape when trying to claim benefits. Is the Minister satisfied that the current 12-month limit on special rules is sufficient, and has she assessed how the current administrative burden on terminally ill people claiming benefits can be reduced?

[Liz Kendall]

The hon. Lady raises an extremely important question, which I have discussed with a hospice and other organisations such as Marie Curie and Sue Ryder in my own constituency. I want to look at how the system can be made to work as quickly and swiftly as possible, particularly for people at this very difficult time in life, and I would be happy for the Social Security Minister and my office to contact her directly to get more information.

[Marsha De Cordova (Battersea) (Lab)]

T7. Research by Sense has found that none of the computers in jobcentres across Britain are equipped with specialist assistive technology, and it has estimated that it would cost £5 million to ensure that every jobcentre had that specialist assistive technology. Will the Minister commit to introducing a jobcentre assistive technology fund in order to aid disabled people in their quest to look for work?

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[Priti Patel (Witham) (Con)]

With employers in Witham and across the country about to be whacked with a barrage of higher taxes, thanks to this Government, how do the Government expect employment levels to stay high? How do they expect small businesses to be at the heart of any employment strategy that they claim to have?

[Liz Kendall]

Under the previous Government, we had the highest taxes in 70 years, and jobcentres to which only one in six employers ever went to recruit. We will transform our jobcentres into a new jobs and careers service, so that people get the help they need, and so that employers can recruit the staff they desperately need.

[Markus Campbell-Savours (Penrith and Solway) (Lab)]

T10. I welcome the Government’s proposed fraud Bill. Can the Minister explain how it will claw back money from people who cheat the system, while also protecting privacy?

[Graham Stuart (Beverley and Holderness) (Con)]

I thank the Secretary of State for her personal commitment to transparency. Further to the question asked by the shadow Secretary of State, my right hon. Friend the Member for Central Devon (Mel Stride), will she share with the House how many thousands of people will die as a result of Labour’s choice to cut the winter fuel payment?

[Liz Kendall]

I am very happy to share the data: there are 200,000 more pensioners living in poverty after 14 years of Conservative government. I am also very happy to publish information showing a 152% increase in pension credit claims, thanks to the big, bold campaign run by this Labour Government.

[Oliver Ryan (Burnley) (Lab/Co-op)]

My constituents want a fair and robust welfare system, but they have no truck with fraud. Can the Secretary of State assure my constituents that she is doing everything she can to crack down on fraud, and to make sure that those who genuinely need help get it?