Ukraine

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Monday 28th March 2022 Commons Chamber

[Elizabeth Truss]

I will see what I can do about the medical students. It was a major focus of our initial evacuation to make sure we successfully helped them to leave Ukraine in these very difficult circumstances.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I welcome the statement and commend the Foreign Secretary for her strong leadership. This morning my constituent, a humanitarian doctor on the border of Ukraine, told me she is struggling after seeing children horrifically scarred with third-degree burns. Those children face an uncertain and very painful future, as they need plastic surgery and other interventions. I assured this young doctor and her family that I will be praying for her, but what more will we do to provide specific medical support for those children and, importantly, to provide the vital support that is needed to stop the bombings that are causing this devastation?

[Elizabeth Truss]

The hon. Gentleman is right that these devasting injuries are being caused by President Putin’s appalling aggressive actions in Ukraine. We are helping people with medical emergencies, and we are flying people into the United Kingdom for treatment for some of these horrific injuries.

World Tuberculosis Day

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Thursday 24th March 2022 Westminster Hall

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

It is a pleasure to speak in this debate. I congratulate the hon. Member for Ealing, Southall (Mr Sharma) for setting the scene extremely well. He has been incredibly helpful with the information he has provided. I have spoken on this subject on a number of occasions in Westminster Hall. The former Member for Stafford, Jeremy Lefroy—he was your colleague, Mrs Murray, and you will remember him—used to bring this issue up, and he always reminded us that TB, while a terrible disease, is in many cases complicated by a combination of HIV and malaria. Again, I support the hon. Member for Ealing, Southall in highlighting this matter, and I ask the Minister to give us an idea of how we can respond in a way that addresses some of the issues.

When I was a child, which was not yesterday, I remember hearing the dreaded—in those days—diagnosis of TB. Yet, when I asked my aide, who seeks out the information for my speeches, to prepare the notes for this debate, her first reaction was, “Surely TB is extinct. It’s no longer an issue—they don’t even give the BCG anymore.” Maybe we need to be more aware of the data the hon. Gentleman referred to; some of the information in the APPG’s report illustrates the importance of this issue. The data is there, and it did not take my aide long to learn that she could not be more wrong. The fact that the younger generation believes there is no such thing as TB anymore does not bode well.

The purpose of this debate is to highlight the issue of TB in the countries where it is a severe killer. The disease is rampant in some parts of the world, and the hon. Gentleman helpfully reminded us that there are rising numbers of TB cases in the United Kingdom as well.

The data is clear. Between 2019 and 2020, there was a 9.2% increase in the number of deaths from TB, and the World Health Organisation predicted that the number of deaths would increase in both 2021—which they did—and 2022. During the same period, the number of people diagnosed with TB, according to the APPG’s report, dropped by 18%. Some 16 countries accounted for 93% of that reduction, suggesting that countries that already have a high TB burden have fared worse than others.

Covid has not been kind to any diagnostic data collection. Before covid, TB was known as the world’s deadliest disease, which it quite clearly is. The information in the APPG’s report refers back to when TB was more prevalent in a different century. Between 1980 and 2012, the UK saw a 1.9% increase in TB cases year on year. The number fell in 2018, but rose in 2019. I know it is not directly the Minister’s remit in the UK, but the debate is about TB, and perhaps she could give us some indication of what has been done to address TB in the United Kingdom to make sure it does not become rampant and a serious issue?

There is a TB action plan for England for 2021 to 2026. The Government have recognised that there is an issue, and it is clear they want to ensure that action can be taken and that we can play our part to ensure that TB does not become the problem it was in the past. We are looking to eliminate TB by 2035 across the world, which would be good.

Again, I am not sure this is a question the Minister can answer directly, and I am happy to have a response from her civil servants, who are always helpful. Have we any indication about TB in England? It is the responsibility of Ministers here, and it is a devolved matter in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. Is it possible to find out if there is any indication of those figures for the regions?

The Centres for Disease Control and Prevention noted that in 2018 1.7 billion people were infected by TB bacteria, which is roughly—this is quite worrying—23% of the world’s population, and the disease claimed 1.5 million lives each year. It is clear where it is prevalent. It is a serious and deadly disease. Of the 10 million individuals who became ill with TB in 2018, approximately 3 million were missed by health systems and did not get the care they needed, allowing the disease to continue to be transmitted. I repeat the question asked by the hon. Member for Ealing, Southall: if those 3 million were missed, how can we ensure that others are not missed? We have to, first, raise awareness through this debate and, secondly, make sure we clearly address the issue of TB in parts of the world where it is most prevalent.

From looking at the information that we were sent beforehand, it is clear that there are parts of the world where TB is more prevalent—China, Pakistan, India, Bangladesh, Indonesia, the Philippines, Nigeria and South Africa. We in the all-party parliamentary group for international freedom of religion or belief hope to visit Nigeria at the end of May, so we will need to make sure we get all our inoculations and so on before we go. One of the things I want to speak about is those who travel from a missionary organisation in my constituency, which is very effective.

Statistics show that in 2020, there was an estimated total of 1.5 million TB-related deaths. Some 1.3 million of those were among HIV-negative people, up from 1.2 million in 2019—again, a worrying trend—and an additional 214,000 were among HIV-positive people. I referred earlier to a former Member, Jeremy Lefroy, who always spoke about three things: HIV, malaria and TB. People who have both TB and HIV when they die are internationally classified as having died from HIV; maybe the data needs to be corrected to ensure we have a fuller picture of what the issues are. The combined total is back to 2017 levels, and an estimated 230,000 children died of TB in 2019, including children with HIV- associated TB. Of those children, 194,000 were HIV-negative and 36,000 were HIV-positive. As most of us know, HIV/AIDS affects immune systems, so those infected with TB unfortunately have little defence against it.

In countries such as Eswatini—formerly Swaziland—where the AIDS incidence rate is one in four people, TB is a real and present danger. I have a particular interest in Eswatini because a church in my constituency, Elim church, has a very strong mission there. The church works in Eswatini, as well as in Zimbabwe, and it is confronted with these health issues all the time. It fundraises heavily to support those two countries—Eswatini in particular—and it sends money, drugs, food, and all the other help it can, which clearly makes a significant difference to the lives of the people out there. My constituency always supports those things, and the help its people give is vital.

A lot of work has been carried out by international bodies in the fight against TB. The incidence of TB in Eswatini has fallen gradually from 1,010 cases per 100,000 people in 2001 to 309 cases per 100,000 in 2020, so there has been some positive change as a result of the work of non-governmental and missionary organisations such as the Elim church mission, headquartered in Newtownards in my constituency. That is a victory we can all claim, and it must be replicated in the Congo, where the incidence rate sits at over 440 per 100,000. There are parts of the world that are not shown on the map in the report, so there are other places where there is work to be done. While I understand the rationale behind not vaccinating all our children, families who travel to these countries from Newtownards, for example, need to be aware that they face a risk and should consider getting vaccinated before they go. Obviously, we will also take note of that when we make our journey to Nigeria at the end of May, God willing.

As the hon. Member for Ealing, Southall referred to, we are now encountering drug-resistant TB. Maybe the Minister will be able to give us some indication of how she and our Government are partnering with the World Health Organisation to combat drug resistance. There has been a significant reduction in the number of people treated for drug-resistant TB and with TB-preventative treatments, which are down 15% and 21% respectively, so this is clearly a massive issue that needs more focus than it is currently receiving. We must fund more research into solving this difficult and worrying problem. I ask the Minister again, in a constructive and positive way, what extra moneys have been set aside for R&D to ensure that we can do these things?

I will conclude because I am looking forward to hearing from the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for West Ham (Ms Brown), and especially from the Minister. The shadow Minister takes a particular interest in this matter, and like me and the hon. Member for Ealing, Southall she wishes to see giant steps forward. We aim high with the purpose of trying to change things.

Giving the BCG vaccine to children has reduced TB, but that most certainly does not mean that the disease has gone away. I am thankful for having had the opportunity to highlight that, and to put it to the Minister that the gift of combating the disease lies in our United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and in other developed nations. Will we give that gift or will we choose to accept that we have only eight cases per 100,000 people and leave it there? I sincerely hope not.

I respectfully, honestly and beseechingly ask the Minister to assure every one of us of the steps that we are taking and will take in the near future to combat this dreadful disease. The document that the hon. Member for Ealing, Southall gave me beforehand refers to the Global Fund to Fight HIV, Tuberculosis and Malaria. That is a battle that we all have to fight together. I hope that we have done our part today to help in that battle to eradicate tuberculosis across the world. We in this House, in this great United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, must ensure that, through our Minister and our Government, we deliver for the people who need it. That is what our debates are always about: others.

--- Later in debate ---

[Vicky Ford]

I thank the hon. Lady for her excellent question. I understand the urgency of getting the details agreed, but, as she knows, there has been a restructuring in the FCDO because of the changing situation that we now face, given the geopolitical impact of Russia’s illegal invasion of Ukraine. It is important that we continually assess how best to use our structures to reflect different global challenges to enable us to deliver for the UK. As I said, we maintain a strong commitment to improving global health, and I understand the importance of getting the numbers agreed. We cannot do everything, but we will get the numbers as soon as possible.

Research was mentioned in the opening speech. The UK is a global leader in the funding of TB research. We continue to support academics and industry to develop the evidence, and new technologies and approaches to diagnose and treat TB. We have been a critical investor in product development partnerships to combat infectious diseases, including TB, for many years. The FCDO has supported the Foundation for Innovative New Diagnostics to develop a new PCR-based technology to test for TB, which is now available in more than 140 countries worldwide, including in the NHS.

Our investment also helped the TB Alliance to develop new combinations of drugs that significantly reduce the severity of side effects and the length of treatment from over 18 months to six months for drug-resistant TB, and even shorter for drug-sensitive TB. UK funding is bringing partners together to solve critical problems. For example, through support to British Investment International, MedAccess, the Clinton Health Access Initiative and Unitaid have secured a lower price for an innovative short-course TB preventive therapy.

As a further demonstration of our commitment to invest in the fight against TB, I am pleased to announce £6 million of funding for TB REACH, which will support piloting innovative ways to hunt down and treat millions of missing TB cases. I am pleased that the US and Canada are also backing that fantastic work; only through joined-up efforts with our partners will we meet our target to eliminate TB. The UK Government are one of the largest bilateral funders of TB research and development globally, and we continue to invest in research and development, including developing new tools and approaches to tackle TB.

The hon. Members for Ealing, Southall and for West Ham spoke about the situation in the UK. With an eye on the global picture, it is important not to lose sight of the challenge that TB presents here in the UK. As in other countries, we see that the disease often affects the most marginalised and vulnerable people. We are investing in early detection and treatment, including genome sequencing, which can help to detect drug resistance and clusters of transmission.

As the hon. Member for Ealing, Southall said, the UK has a TB action plan for England, which will run for five years from 2021 to 2026. It was jointly launched by the UK Health Security Agency and NHS England, and it sets out the work that will support year-on-year reductions in TB incidence in order to move England towards its elimination target. It includes specific actions relating to underserved populations.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank the Minister for her positive responses; we are greatly encouraged. I do not expect to have an answer today, but will she let us know the number of TB cases in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland compared with England?

[Vicky Ford]

I will get back to the hon. Member with the impact on Northern Ireland. England is one of the few countries that routinely use genome screening for diagnosing and detecting drug resistance and clusters of transmission. The technology was pioneered in the UK and is routinely used in England, Scotland and Wales, but I am not sure about Northern Ireland.

People born outside the UK account for more than 70% of TB notifications, so the UK has a latent TB infection screening programme that detects new migrants with latent inactive TB. That early detection and treatment reduces the chances of a reactivation of the active disease. The Government’s additional £36 billion investment in the health and care system over the next three years will also support TB detection and treatment.

I was born in Northern Ireland, so it was heartening to hear the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) speak about the relationship between his constituents and the people of Eswatini and Lesotho—two countries that I visited in, I think, my second week after taking on my current role. It is important that we support smaller countries as well as larger countries, and the Global Fund is working in both Eswatini and Lesotho. I assure the hon. Member that we work globally to tackle the risk factors for TB, including poverty and malnutrition.

To conclude, the UK will continue to work with partners to pioneer scientific breakthroughs, to invest in detection and treatment, and to strengthen health systems globally. That is the only way that we will make tuberculosis a thing of the past.

Future of Soft Power

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Wednesday 16th March 2022 Westminster Hall

[Mr John Baron (Basildon and Billericay) (Con)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered the future of soft power.

It is a pleasure to be called to speak, Ms Rees. I thank the Speaker’s Office for selecting it and the Minister for Asia and the Middle East, my right hon. Friend the Member for Cannock Chase (Amanda Milling), for attending. I know she is very busy.

It is fair to say that the west has relaxed its guard and enjoyed a peace dividend following the cold war. We thought the concept of democracy would sweep the field—that the very righteousness of the cause would sweep all before it—and it therefore required little investment. But democracy is a fragile concept; it needs nurturing, encouraging and protecting. Many in this world do not share our values. As Ukraine has shown, we are engaged in a new battle for democracy. If there was any doubt about that, we need only look at the recent UN vote on the cruel invasion of a sovereign country, where more than half of the world’s population as represented by their Governments did not condemn it.

In this new era, this new cold war, we need to talk softly and carry a big stick, if we are to defend our values. Our values have stood the test of time but, at times, have required defending. I suggest that we now require a significant and sustained increase in spending on both hard and soft power capabilities. Soft power was a key factor in our victory in the cold war.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. It was President Roosevelt who said, “Talk softly but carry a big stick”—I understand it is an African proverb. If we are going to have soft power, we need to have hard power behind it to back it up, otherwise it does not work. I think we are at the stage where we have learned from our mistakes in the west. It is time to get it right.

[Mr Baron]

I completely agree with the hon. Gentleman. We have to do more to realise that democracy needs defending. We have to step up to the plate—not just this country, but the west generally—and commit sufficient resources, to ensure that we can talk softly, which we should always do first, but carry a big stick, because the big stick reinforces the weight of the soft diplomacy. We live in a hard world, but people will listen if they think we have assets that could be committed. I am an ex-soldier. War should always be the measure of last resort, but we need to talk and have the assets behind us to reinforce the weight of those talks.

This country should be proud. We have the BBC World Service, the British Council, our music industry, our culture, our values and the rule of law. There is little doubt—in fact, it has been shown through various measurements—that the UK is the world’s soft-power superpower, and we should be very proud of that.

During the invasion of Ukraine, the number of listeners to the BBC World Service in Russia went up three or four times. Listeners to the Ukrainian service went up to 5 million. Yet we are still debating whether the BBC World Service and BBC Monitoring budgets should be ringfenced. There is a question mark over their funding.

The British Council last year was in touch with more than 750 million people worldwide for education, arts and the English language. That is a phenomenal achievement. On the UK music industry, I will share with colleagues that I am not very good at contemporary music, but I am reliably informed that three of the top 10 artists came from these shores. That is punching above our weight and helps to create the positive view of this country—there is a lot to be positive about—but it also reaches out and makes contact with people globally.

There is, however, growing competition for influence. We cannot stand still. Individual states, many of them not democratic, are looking to invest and are investing to enhance their soft power around the world. Cultural institutes such as the British Council are an effective way of doing so, and one which truly global nations all employ. As chair of the British Council all-party parliamentary group, I will confine my remarks to that wonderful organisation.

I remind the Minister that other cultural institutes of other countries receive far greater amounts and proportions of public funding, between 40% to 50% of their total income. Whether it is the Goethe-Institut, or Confucius Institutes, or whatever, they get around half their income from the state. The amount is only around 15% from the British Government, because the British Government have said that the British Council must rely on its own commercial activities to help fund its endeavours. That is fine, except when those revenues fall through the floor in a pandemic year. It is, therefore, with regret for many of us—across the Floor in this House, but also in the other place—that the Government did not fully compensate for the loss of commercial income by the British Council as a result of the pandemic.

Commonwealth Day

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 15th March 2022 Westminster Hall

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Member for Bridgwater and West Somerset (Mr Liddell-Grainger) on setting the scene so well. His deep interest in this subject is apparent from his comments, and I thank him for all the hard work he does.

The hon. Member referred to the work of the Commonwealth Parliamentary Association. I endorse his comments about what the CPA does and the importance of having it in place. He also referred twice to parliamentary democracy and how important it is to set an example, which the Commonwealth clearly does. As we are all reminded every morning and night on our TV screens, some parts of the world are fighting for their democracy; we think of Ukraine, as the hon. Member rightly said at the beginning. We concur with his comments about Russia, but we are greatly encouraged by the Ukraine military’s spirit and the courage that people are showing against Russian aggression. We are proud of that.

We are also very proud to be part of the Commonwealth of 54 nations. The Commonwealth spans 54 independent countries, and about 2.6 billion people—out of some 7.9 billion globally—live in the Commonwealth. That tells us about the size and importance of the Commonwealth, and about what it does. I share people’s adoration of the Queen, who by her very Christian faith and life sets an example for us all in this House and across the world. She is also the Queen of 15 Commonwealth nations, whereas five other countries have their own monarch and 34 are republics. The Commonwealth makes up a quarter of the world’s landmass. Such stats illustrate the importance of the Commonwealth, its size and the role that it plays across the world.

Along with India and Australia, the giant of the Commonwealth group is Canada. I well recall emigrating to Canada as an 18-year-old—it was not yesterday. Canada was the country where I was a landed immigrant for a year. I was a bricklayer there; it was good to experience, as a young person, what the Commonwealth has in Canada and what it can offer. One of the great things about the Commonwealth is being able to enjoy that. Canada is the world’s second largest country by area, but the beauty of the Commonwealth is that we also embrace the smaller states to which the hon. Member for Bridgwater and West Somerset referred— states such as the Pacific islands of Nauru, Samoa, Tuvalu, Vanuatu, as well as Dominica, Antigua and Barbados in the Caribbean. This great Commonwealth represents a cosmopolitan world through countries large and small.

As a Commonwealth of nations, we believe in democracy, freedom and a common purpose to extend the arm of friendship to many countries across the world. It is mutually beneficial to be a member, and the combined GDP of the 54 countries is some £7.5 trillion—twice the size of Japan’s, but some way behind that of the US. Trade with the Commonwealth accounted for some 9.1% of the UK’s total trade in 2019, and UK exports to the Commonwealth were worth around £65 billion. That tells us that the importance of the Commonwealth lies in our trade and in nations coming together. Imports from the Commonwealth were worth around £64 billion, so the value of what we sell them is comparable to the value of what they sell us.

It is clear that it is a good thing to do business with friendly neighbours. Although this is not a Brexit debate, it has always been my hope that we can be separate yet distinct in Europe with our friendship. The despicable treatment of my country, Northern Ireland, as a political football has disabused me of that notion. Were we to treat one of the Commonwealth countries with such malice and contempt, the world would rightly call us out. Unfortunately, Northern Ireland’s treatment by Europe has been widely accepted and continues—but that is a discussion for another day as it is not the subject of this debate, although it is important to put it on the record.

Now, more than ever, the arm of friendship should be extended within our Commonwealth family to ensure that we are getting and giving the best of those with whom we share the commonality of the Commonwealth. We share many cultures, much history and even, in many cases, the same language. We must also use our position to encourage members that do not allow religious freedom to do so. The Minister knows that I often speak about that and although I suspect that she has already prepared the answer to the question that I will ask, it is important to put it on the record.

According to the Pew Research Centre, 70% of people who live in Commonwealth countries face high or extremely high Government restrictions on their right to freedom of religion or belief. Worse still, some 88% of those people face high or very high social hostility simply for holding minority beliefs. I declare an interest: I am chair of the all-party parliamentary group on international freedom of religion or belief. As we celebrate the Commonwealth, will the Minister tell me, the House and those watching the debate what has been done to address the persecution of those in this great Commonwealth who have Christian beliefs, other beliefs and, indeed, no beliefs? I would like there to be freedom of religion for all—and I know, without even asking, that the Minister does as well. It is important that one of our pleas should be for that to be improved, and I hope that it will be.

I will also make another honest plea. As we approach St Patrick’s day on Thursday, I am ever mindful that the Republic of Ireland is not part of the Commonwealth. Would it not be great if they were? It is not too late to ask them—we ask them regularly. We want them to consider that gently but honestly, as friends. I see membership as something that could be advantageous to them and to us. Their inclusion would make the Commonwealth bigger, greater and better. I ask the Minister this: has there been any opportunity to see whether the Republic of Ireland would join the nations brought together by this great multicultural Commonwealth and by a common desire?

This great challenge must be met head on. I urge the Minister to take the baton of that challenge and work sensitively and effectively with all our Commonwealth brethren to bring about religious freedom for all. Trade is a wonderful positive point, but we must all ensure that we exert any positive influence that we can, at any opportunity, to bring about change.

I am eternally grateful for the leadership of Her Majesty the Queen in matters of faith—I know that those are a priority for her. We can and should follow the example of that wonderful lady by pressing for religious freedom for all. We can do more with the body and the mechanism of the Commonwealth to improve lives, but we must also take the opportunity, in this dark world, to shine a light at any and every opportunity. The goodness of the Commonwealth, in what it does and what it can do, can help this country to be a brighter shining light for all.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jim Shannon]

I asked the Minister about the persecution of Christians and how they are focused on in the Commonwealth. I also asked about the Republic of Ireland. Will the Minister comment, if she is able to?

[Amanda Milling]

I was just coming to countries re-joining the Commonwealth. The UK is open to considering new applications for membership on their merits. The interest of potential new members is a sign of the Commonwealth’s vitality. Decisions on membership are made by consensus of all member states. I believe that some of the countries mentioned earlier were members in the past. Whether they want to re-join is up to them, but as I say it is by consensus of member states.

The hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) is a passionate champion of freedom of religion or belief, which is established in the Commonwealth charter. We would like Commonwealth leaders to recommit to promoting and protecting those freedoms at CHOGM. He will be aware that the Prime Minister appointed my hon. Friend the Member for Congleton (Fiona Bruce) as his special envoy, and will host an international summit in July. We continue to raise human rights with countries wherever concerns exist. My hon. Friend the Member for Stafford, my next-door neighbour, mentioned the Queen’s Commonwealth Canopy. We hope that all 54 member states will have committed to participate by the time of CHOGM in June.

My right hon. Friend the Member for Dumfriesshire, Clydesdale and Tweeddale mentioned HIV and AIDS. I know that he is a passionate champion of this issue. The UK’s Global Fund and the Global Alliance for Vaccines and Immunisation are a really important way of supporting international progress on HIV and AIDS. There is strong engagement across Africa, including in many Commonwealth nations, as this issue is exceptionally important. We have a global AIDS strategy, which focuses on addressing those inequalities.

I think I have about one more minute before I must let my hon. Friend the Member for Bridgwater and West Somerset wind up. I am sorry that I have not been able to cover all the points made, but we have been able to get a snapshot of our co-operation with the Commonwealth and Commonwealth countries. Those partnerships and today’s debate demonstrate how the Commonwealth brings great benefits to diverse communities across the globe. As we hand over the baton of chair- in-office to Rwanda in June, our commitment to the Commonwealth and the shared values of the Commonwealth charter will not dim. The pandemic, the growing impacts of climate change and the rise in global prices make these testing times for all members of the Commonwealth, but as Her Majesty said in her Commonwealth Day message yesterday, we can

“draw strength and inspiration from what we share, as we work together towards a healthy, sustainable and prosperous future for all.”

Executions in Saudi Arabia

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Monday 14th March 2022 Commons Chamber

[Amanda Milling]

As I have said, we were shocked by the executions. We have raised our concerns and, through our ministerial and diplomatic channels, we will seek further clarification on the details of those cases.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

May I thank the Minister for her reply, declare an interest as chair of the all-party parliamentary group for international freedom of religion or belief and express concern over the restrictions on religious beliefs in Saudi Arabia? These executions are deplorable and they shock the people of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Has the Minister made any representations to her Saudi counterparts to review the rationale behind this mass execution? Can we apply any diplomatic pressure to urge a reconsideration of executions carried out in that way, which makes them appear as a spectacle rather than the murderous, sombre, sober and shocking events they truly are?

[Amanda Milling]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his question and I know how passionately he campaigns on all matters of freedom of religion or belief. As I have said, the UK ambassador has raised our strong concerns about the executions at the weekend; through ministerial and diplomatic channels, we will seek further clarification on the details of those cases.

Oral Answers to Questions

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 8th March 2022 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

What representations has the Minister made to our counterparts in Kazakhstan on the security forces’ use of force on people protesting against living standards and on the oppression of peaceful protest?

[James Cleverly]

Following the outbreak of violence in Kazakhstan, my noble Friend Lord Ahmad met senior representatives of the Kazakh Government, including President Tokayev’s special representative. In those contacts, he underlined the need to ensure that law enforcement responses are proportionate and in accordance with Kazakhstan’s international obligations. He also stressed the importance of conducting the investigation into the unrest urgently, transparently and effectively.

Christians and Religious Minorities: India

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Thursday 24th February 2022 Westminster Hall

[Graham Stringer (in the Chair)]

Before we begin, I remind Members to observe social distancing and wear masks.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I beg to move,

That this has considered the matter of the persecution of Christians and religious minorities in India.

It has been a while since we had a debate on this issue, although a few days ago we were fortunate enough to have a debate on India-UK trade negotiations, introduced by the hon. Member for Harrow East (Bob Blackman). I commented on the issue of the persecution of Christians and other ethnic groups in India during that debate, ever mindful that this debate was coming up. I am pleased to see the hon. Gentleman here; in fact, I am pleased to see everyone here. I wanted to mention that debate, because perhaps it was a warm-up for this debate. I declare an interest as chair of the all-party group for international freedom of religion or belief. Looking around this hall, I see that most of the people here are members of it. Indeed, some are officers of the APPG.

I am always an optimist, and always have been; I live my life along those lines. I always look to better things. This debate looks to better things in India, ever mindful that we have a special relationship. It is my hope that things in life will get better. I prefer the glass half full to the glass half empty, and think we should try to build the world a better future. That is at the crux of this debate. With prayer and perseverance, crises may resolve, relationships will heal, and collectively we inch towards a better world. I believe we can achieve that if we all have the same motivation, and try to achieve the same goal.

I am pleased to see the Minister for Levelling Up Communities in her place—I look forward to her response—and the hon. Member for Sheffield, Brightside and Hillsborough (Gill Furniss) on the Opposition Front Bench. I am also glad to see my good friend from the Scottish National party, the hon. Member for North Ayrshire and Arran (Patricia Gibson)—there is not a debate that she is at that I am not at alongside her, and vice versa. I am very pleased to see the hon. Member for Coventry North West (Taiwo Owatemi), who has just joined the all-party parliamentary group, here to support the debate. I thank the Library for the background information it has given us.

Freedom of religion or belief is always my hope, but looking back on the past year in India, it cannot be said to have been there for Christians and other religious or belief minorities. Back in 2016, in his address to the United States Congress, India’s Prime Minister, Narendra Modi, said that

“For my Government, the Constitution is its real holy book. And in that holy book, freedom of faith, speech and franchise, and equality of all citizens, regardless of background, are enshrined as fundamental rights.”

To be fair to President Modi, he has the motivation to do that, but the reality is very different. Some of the examples I will refer to are evidence of where that is not happening. That is what the debate is about. President Modi also said, referring to some extremely violent clashes, that a new law would have

“ no effect on citizens of India, including Hindus, Muslims, Sikhs, Jains, Christians and Buddhists.”

Well, if only. In fact, it has an effect on all the religious minorities. They no longer have the freedom they once had. They can no longer follow their beliefs and express their religious views. Today’s debate offers time to stop and reflect on the situation regarding freedom of religion or belief in India and the problems that persist today.

In January 2021, this same topic was discussed by this House. I have no doubt that the hon. Member for Harrow East and everyone else here was present for that debate. Some might wonder why we are raising the subject again. Well, I will tell the House: we are raising it quite simply because, looking back at developments in India over the last 12 months, we find a string of human rights abuses and the suffering of Christians. More than ever, Her Majesty’s Government need to take additional steps to encourage full and rigorous defence of freedom of religion or belief for all. The steps they have taken so far are clearly not enough. Christians and other minorities continue to be failed by efforts in this regard.

In the previous debate, I commented on the lack of representation of Christians and other groups in the political sphere, but looking through the Library background briefing, I see it shows that at least one of India’s states is taking steps to ensure that there is political representation of all groups.

[Theresa Villiers (Chipping Barnet) (Con)]

Many minority communities have played prominent roles in Indian politics and public life since the country’s foundation in 1948, and that continues today.

[Jim Shannon]

The right hon. Lady is right that there are examples in the past, but in many Indian states, representation for minority groups is not in place. Previously, there was a free country where freedom to practise one’s religion was in place, as President Modi said in 2016, but today, in 2022, the same cannot be said. I note that the right hon. Lady is a sponsor of the annual Open Doors event. I gently remind her that in the past year, India has seen grave violations of freedom or belief. A report by the United Christian Forum highlighted that 2021 was one of the worst years for attacks on Christians in India, with ongoing impunity for the perpetrators of violence. In 2013, Open Doors’ world watch list ranked India 31st of the 50 countries where Christians face the highest levels of persecution; and last month, in its latest list, India was ranked 10th. In short, there can be little doubt that the situation is getting worse at an alarmingly fast rate.

The research sounds the alarm on the escalation of freedom or belief violations in India—not just against Christians, but against those of other faiths and beliefs. In many cases, freedom of religion or belief is a litmus test for the full realisation of other human rights. When citizens cannot freely exercise their right to freedom of religion or belief, it is depressingly inevitable that other human rights are being compromised.

At the heart of all freedom of religion or belief is the ability freely to change one’s religion or belief, free from fear. In other words, a Hindu should be able to become Muslim or Christian. Unfortunately, that is practically impossible in about a third of India’s states. There is some flexibility in some states, but there are certainly states where there is no flexibility at all. A third of India’s 28 states prohibit or limit religious conversion to protect the dominant religion, Hinduism, from perceived threats from religious minorities. That is entirely unnecessary; it stems from prejudice against non-Hindu religions and support for Hindutva, an ideology that does not count Indians who are Christian or from other religious minorities as true Indians because they have allegiances that lie outside India. They might believe in something other than Hinduism, but their allegiance to the Indian state is not in doubt. The Indian Government must look at where they are on that, discuss those issues, and make sure that there is opportunity for all.

Speaking of opportunity, the background information given to us for this debate says:

“Christians and Muslims…do not qualify for the officially reserved jobs or school placements available”

to Hindus,

“putting these groups at a significant economic and social disadvantage.”

These things need to be fair. If a country’s constitution mentions freedom and equality, the country should ensure those things, not draw away from them.

This is not an easy debate. I am well aware of our countries’ close relationship and I welcome it. Indeed, the other day, the hon. Member for Harrow East and I mentioned how important that closeness was, particularly when it comes to trade between the UK and India.

[Patricia Gibson (North Ayrshire and Arran) (SNP)]

The hon. Gentleman talks about the close relationship between India and the UK. Does he agree that that relationship puts the UK in a unique position to be a positive force for change, and to encourage and pressure India to respect religious minorities?

[Jim Shannon]

I thank the hon. Lady for her intervention. I hope, as I think we all do, that we can achieve that through this debate. That is why I look forward to the Minister’s response. She is always fair and always gives a calculated response. We are conveying our feelings and thoughts to her, and ultimately, I am sure, to India, so that it takes the opportunity to address these issues.

It is not my wish to alienate a close ally, but these caveats must not prevent us from speaking up when we see the mistreatment of minorities and mistreatment on grounds of religion or belief. Indeed, it is the close relationship between the UK and India that necessitates our raising the alarm, as the hon. Member for North Ayrshire and Arran says. The UK is the third biggest investor in India, and in 2020, India became the second largest investor in the UK, so trade is clearly an important issue. To be frank, people including my constituents—and me; I am no different—care where their taxpayers’ money goes. Customers increasingly care about corporate responsibility and social impact; our country should not think that it is above such standards. We are not. The majority of people think that if the United Kingdom were to trade with a country that violates and abuses the human rights of its citizens, the UK would be somewhat complicit in that abuse.

In various debates this week, most of them to do with Russia, we have highlighted human rights abuses and persecution. We have also talked about China and where it has done wrong. In the main Chamber and Westminster Hall, and through our Government officials and the steps that the Government are taking, we are highlighting these issues, and today, we are doing the same. One thing is clear: our nation cares about human rights abuses in India. A majority of people think that the amount of foreign aid that the UK provides to a country should be tied to its performance on certain human rights standards. It is undeniable that one human right currently being violated in India is freedom of religion or belief. A range of religious and belief minorities, not the least of whom are Christians, are suffering infringements of this right. I will go through some of these violations.

Attacks against Christians have been refuelled in recent years and months by the impact of online disinformation and hate speech. How easy it is to hide behind a screen and destroy people, or fill people’s head with things that turn them against others. On 6 December last year, a mob armed with stones and iron rods attacked St Joseph’s school in Ganj Basoda, days after a video was circulated on social media that falsely claimed that the school was forcibly converting Hindus to Christianity. The video was not filmed at the school; it was not even filmed near the school, and none of the students were present, yet the misinformation was peddled through that video. The language and disinformation in the video were deliberately provocative and sought to target the local Christian minority community.

The video succeeded in its aim, which was the attack organised for the following day. When the school’s principal was warned of the imminent attack, he immediately requested police protection, but—alarmingly—no such protection was provided. That is a terrible stain on the police. Although the police assured him that the protests would be peaceful and that they would send officers to guard the school, on the day itself the police failed to show up; they arrived only after the crowd had dispersed, having already caused distress and destruction. As this tragic event shows all too well, online misinformation and hate speech accelerate violent attacks, and the relevant authorities often do not do enough to prevent the brutality. There is no doubt that online misinformation can lead to violence, which happens on a frighteningly regular basis, and indeed today.

Another example of the horror that Christians face can be found in countless reports issued over the last year. Ours is a country of freedom of religion and belief, free from persecution and intimidation, and we know that Christmas is a very important date in the calendar for Christians—indeed, for many people, but especially Christians. In the run-up to Christmas in India, many churches in Karnataka state were forced to cancel their Christmas celebrations following threats from radical groups. More than 150 churches did not open over Christmas due to the fear of attacks, and many other churches opted to limit their Christmas celebrations. Their caution was not without cause. On 24 and 25 December, Christmas eve and Christmas day, dozens of churches were attacked across the states of Assam, Haryana, Karnataka and Uttar Pradesh. Services were stopped short, Bibles were set on fire, a statue of Jesus was torn down and the crowds shouted, “Death to missionaries!” Is that what their religion tells them—“Death to missionaries”? It is not what my religion or my beliefs tell me, and it should not be what any other religion or belief tells anyone else either.

Father Anand, a priest at one of the targeted churches and therefore on the frontline, said that the protests were indicative of the increased attacks that Christians in India have been facing in recent months. He said:

“This is a symbol of what is happening because these people have impunity, and it creates tension…Every Sunday is a day of terror and trauma for Christians, especially those belonging to those small churches”,

which feel under threat. I go to church every Sunday, Mr Stringer, as I suspect others in this place do. We are free to do so and we enjoy it in peace, but for those Christians in India every Sunday is a day of terror and trauma. Let the devastation of that phrase just sink in; think about what that means. When we go to church on Sunday, we do so in peace, and we thank God for it. If we had to go through a crowd to get to church, and if we came out to be stoned or potentially face attacks against our property or damage to our cars, it would put things into perspective.

Christians are not the only ones who suffer. In recent years, there have been several high-profile murders of well-known rationalist leaders. I am not sure my Ulster Scots accent will aptly render this gentleman’s name, but in 2015, Malleshappa Madivalappa Kalburgi, a 77-year-old scholar and university professor, was killed after receiving death threats following criticism of idol worship during a seminar. In 2013, Narendra Dabholkar, president of the Federation of Indian Rationalist Associations, a member organisation of Humanists International, was murdered in Maharashtra state. Despite both cases being high profile, to this day there has been inaction and a failure to prosecute suspects for either crime.

Muslims suffer challenges and attacks too. At a conference of the right-wing Hindu Mahasabha political party on 31 December, delegates were encouraged to attack Muslims with the words,

“If 100 of us become soldiers and are prepared to kill 2 million”

Muslims

“then we will win. We will protect India, and make it a Hindu nation.”

That is not what should be said by any religion, and it certainly should not be said by the Hindu political party. My God tells me that he is a God of love. He is also a God of judgment, but he is a God of love. I suspect that everybody else’s religion tells them something similar, so why turn it into a campaign? Despite immediate international condemnation, Pooja Shakun Pandey, who made the remarks, was only arrested weeks later after sustained pressure from the international community.

The double vulnerability faced by female Muslims was also highlighted this year when Karnataka state introduced a ban on Muslim schoolgirls wearing a headscarf. Malala Yousafzai has since responded by saying that the move is forcing Muslim girls

“to choose between studies and the hijab.”

The choice between an education and one’s religion should never be a dichotomy that anyone, let alone a child, should ever have to face. In addition to the attacks, Muslims have faced increased discrimination during the covid-19 pandemic. In 2020, Indian Government Ministers accused the Muslim Tablighi Jamaat minority of spreading covid-19. It was an absolute fallacy, but people were geed up and fired up by it, and they took action against Muslims.

[Mark Logan (Bolton North East) (Con)]

I thank the hon. Member for securing the debate. I would like to speak briefly on behalf of my constituents in Bolton North East. I have one of the largest Indian Gujarati Muslim communities in the United Kingdom—it numbers somewhere around 14,000. What are the hon. Gentleman’s views on how important it is that, as we increasingly develop our bilateral relationship with India, we bring all the opportunities and things that could be better to the table in those sorts of discussions?

[Jim Shannon]

That is one of the objective of today’s debate, and we hope that we can reach a better understanding. The views that I had when I was 20 are very different from the views that I have now, in my 60s. I see things very differently today from when I was younger. I feel responsible for the words that I use, which is why I try to be very careful with my terminology and what I say. As the hon. Gentleman says, it is important that we pick our words and try to understand someone else’s point of view. We may not agree with it, but we should certainly understand it and appreciate that they have a point of view. The hon. Gentleman is right to suggest there is a duty on us all to do so, and I make that point on behalf of Muslims, because it is important.

As I mentioned earlier, freedom of religion or belief is a gateway right and a strong indicator of the future trajectory of the human rights landscape in a country. Often religious or belief minorities are the first groups to be targeted before other rights are eroded. Sadly, we are now seeing warning signs that attacks on fundamental human rights are targeted not only on religion or belief minorities, but on journalists and critics of the Government. Human rights apply to religious minorities and ethnic groups, but they also apply to journalists who are critical of President Modi and who often find themselves being denounced as anti-Indian. Earlier I said that they are not anti-Indian, but they want to have freedom. They are as proudly pro-Indian as any other citizens. Two UN special rapporteurs recently highlighted the treatment of journalist Rana Ayyub, who is a victim of intensifying attacks and threats made online by far-right Hindu nationalist groups due to her critical reporting on Prime Minister Modi and issues affecting the Muslim community—the very people to whom the hon. Member for Bolton North East (Mark Logan) referred a few moments ago.

What is happening in India cannot be overlooked and deserves greater attention from the international community and Her Majesty’s Government. There is broad consensus among academics and civil society that there are increased attacks against India’s religious and belief minorities. The evidential base is there and cannot be ignored. When a country’s constitution calls for freedom for all religious and ethnic groups, it has to mean more than just words. There has to be action as well.

The United States Commission on International Religious Freedom, Amnesty International, Genocide Watch, the London School of Economics, the Institute for Development Studies, Humanists International, Christian Solidarity Worldwide, Hindus for Human Rights and Open Doors—the right hon. Member for Chipping Barnet (Theresa Villiers) is a great promoter of that organisation, and we never miss the event that she hosts every year—all agree that the situation for religious and belief minorities in India is dire. The hon. Member for Bolton North East, whose accent gives him away, knows that we use that word often and regularly, because it describes the issues very well.

This is the question we are asking: when will our Government gently remind President Modi and his Government that they have to do more to address the issues? Important though trade is, that is a key question in the debate and from me to the Minister, to my Minister in my Government. Earlier this week, in the debate led by the hon. Member for Harrow East, I encouraged the Government to raise the human rights violations as a new trade deal is negotiated with India. Since the 1990s, it has been the norm to include human rights provisions in international trade deals, and such provisions have the overwhelming support of the British public when they are asked if the UK should take into consideration human rights standards in a country with which we are negotiating and signing a trade deal.

As a country, we must use our new trade agreements to pursue broader international objectives and defend human rights across the world, in particular the right of freedom of religion or belief—I believe passionately in that, as the chair of the APPG. I believe in standing up for those with Christian beliefs, those who have other beliefs and those who have no belief, on the grounds that that is the right thing to do. That is what the debate is about today. This is just one of many things on which more can and must be done.

To conclude, India shares a very close relationship with the UK—we all know that well, and the Minister knows it in particular. My hope is that the debate is not seen to be disrespecting that relationship. Always, my hope and prayer is to strive to improve it, as I believe we can. Just as we are judged by the company we keep, so too are states by the allies and trade partners they keep. In the interests of accountability and of ensuring full freedom of religion or belief for all, the Government of this country—my Government and my Minister—must strive to hold all allies and friends to higher standards when it comes to freedom of religion or belief. No longer can we turn a blind eye—that cannot be the default.

[Several hon. Members rose—]

--- Later in debate ---

[Bob Blackman]

I thank my right hon. and learned Friend for his intervention. He rightly refers to investments that have been made, not only by the UK but by the various different religious groups across India.

We should also remember that India has state government as well as federal government, and therefore the state government should make decisions as well as the national Government. Indeed, independent democratic institutions, such as the National Commission for Minorities, the National Human Rights Commission of India and the Ministry of Minority Affairs, safeguard those rights. National Minorities Rights Day is observed in India every year on 18 December. Given that we are talking about what should happen in India, perhaps we might think about having a national rights day in this country. India has one already, so let us learn the lesson from India and give minorities that opportunity.

We should equally look at the growth of the different minority religions’ populations. India is an incredibly diverse country; there are more Muslims in India than in Pakistan and Bangladesh combined. We should remember that minority religion is growing demographically, up from 15% in 1947 to around 20% in 2011. That is completely unlike the trend in our country. With over 207 million followers of Islam, India has the second largest population of Muslims in the world. Indeed, that is 10% of the world’s Muslim population. Not only is that number growing, but it is expected that by 2050 India will have the largest Muslim population in the world, overtaking Indonesia.

Of the 28 states, four—Meghalaya, Arunachal Pradesh, Mizoram, and Nagaland—have a Christian majority. I hope that they have enlightened policies and enable other minority religions to prosper and grow. Kerala and Tamil Nadu have the largest section of Christian population anywhere in India. I know the hon. Member for Strangford has not had the opportunity to do so yet, but I invite him to come with me on a visit to India and we can see that first hand. Kerala is the state that is visited most by people from the UK, and there not only the churches but the synagogues are preserved. It was the centre of the Jewish population in India before Israel came into existence, and, after that, many of those people chose to migrate to Israel from their ancestral home. These circumstances demonstrate that clearly not only is there an opportunity but there are centres of Christianity in India.

Jammu and Kashmir has a Muslim majority and Ladakh has a Buddhist majority, so it is not fair to say that India is not a diverse country. That can only be possible when minorities feel safe, secure and nurtured. Across the board, minorities have been the torchbearers of India’s scientific and economic success and leadership. From Indian states in the north-east and regions in the north where minority religions form the majority, minorities’ visibility, success and leadership in all spheres of human activity—from the civil services to political representation and civil society, and from media to corporate houses—is a true reflection of the Indian people’s genuine commitment to their age-old tradition.

In any thriving democracy there are bound to be questions, debates and challenges from time to time. There might have been—and have been—isolated cases and reports of minorities facing discrimination. However, there are independent institutions to address them, such as the National Commission for Minorities, and others that I have mentioned, as well as an independent judiciary. Those reports and cases need to be reflected on in the context that there are 200 million religious minority members. The incidents are very rare, relative to the population size.

We should also consider the concerns that have been expressed to me by many people of Indian origin about the activities of those who seek to convert people from one religion to another. We have to be very cautious about that approach. I agree that it is the fundamental human right of an individual to choose their religion. However, it is not reasonable—it is unacceptable—for people to be forced to convert against their will, and against their family’s will as well.

[Jim Shannon]

Of course, if the individual is of age, he or she will be able to make their own decision about which religious viewpoint they wish to pursue or follow. May I say gently to the hon. Gentleman—we are good friends, and I am always very mindful of that fact—that Open Doors, whose event the right hon. Member for Chipping Barnet (Theresa Villiers) chairs every year, said in its report that India was 31st on the list in 2013 and is 10th today, meaning that it went up the ladder of where religious incidents are recorded? That shows that there is more persecution, so how does the hon. Gentleman equate those facts? Whenever persecution is rising in India, the number of incidents rises, and he cannot ignore that.

[Bob Blackman]

Clearly there are tensions, and I would never say that any attacks on individuals because of their religion are acceptable. What I would say, however, is that when a country has a growing population with growing opportunities for employment, wealth and getting people out of poverty, there are bound to be clashes. There are often clashes in India over religious sites, and there is fault on all sides in that respect. In many cases, the clashes occur where there has historically been a temple when a mosque or a church has been erected on that site, or the other way around. That leads to fundamental clashes between religions. It is up to the Government of India and the forces of India to ensure peace and harmony between people, and it is up to the religious leaders of the religions in India to encourage and promote that harmony as well.

I say to the hon. Member for Strangford gently that, having had the opportunity to visit many of these parts of the world and to see at first hand the position in India, I would argue strongly against the position he has taken. Yes, there are problems—there will be problems all over the world—but they are very rare relative to the size of the population and the number of people who celebrate their religions in peace and harmony.

India is a robust pluralistic democracy where the aim is harmonious co-existence of people of all religions, cultures and ethnicities across the length and breadth of the country. That is a fundamental characteristic of the people—certainly in my visits, I have always experienced that. Safeguarding and celebrating India’s unity and diversity is central to the Indian Government’s social and political ethos, and is firmly embedded in the constitution of India through inviolable provisions and plays out in spirit in myriad ways. Finally, India’s unique example of protecting and nurturing religious minorities offers important insights for other countries, including this one.

--- Later in debate ---

[Fiona Bruce]

The concern, of course, is the misuse of such laws.

Pastor Rakesh Babu and his family were brutally beaten at their home in Chandauli, Uttar Pradesh, by unidentified men armed with wooden logs as they gathered to pray in their parsonage, a tiny room attached to the church where Pastor Babu had served for 15 years. A week earlier, he had been threatened with jail if he continued to encourage others to join him in prayer. Worryingly, after the attack, the pastor struggled to get local police to properly register his report. Mervyn Thomas, the founder-president of Christian Solidarity Worldwide, told me that police often refuse to register first information reports and that over a number of years, perpetrators of communal violence in a number of areas have not been penalised. More information about that can be found in the CSW reports.

[Jim Shannon]

The right hon. Member for Chipping Barnet (Theresa Villiers) made the important point about referring things to the police. A number of incidents against Christians—particularly the desecration of churches, the beating up of people, the burning of bibles, and the injuring of people going in and out of churches—have been reported to the police, but there have been instances of the police not turning up as requested. There is an evidential base that cannot be ignored.

[Fiona Bruce]

The hon. Gentleman makes an important point. As I said, more details about such reports can be found in the Christian Solidarity Worldwide reports on India.

I will mention two further reports. On 20 May, Pastor Alok Rajhans was attacked at his church by Hindu nationalists. Most worryingly, we learnt about the death in judicial custody of Father Stan Swamy, one of 16 humans rights defenders, on 5 July. We should applaud Indian civil society for last week launching a popular petition opposing the anti-conversion Bill, which was approved in the Karnataka state Parliament on February 14.

Ram Puniyani, the co-ordinator of the National Solidarity Forum—a consortium of more than 70 organisations and civil society groups of different origins and inspirations—said:

“Wherever the anti-conversion law, ironically called the ‘Religious Freedom Law’, has been passed, it has become a justification for the persecution of religious minorities and other marginalized groups. Attacks on minorities have increased significantly in recent years since this law has been used as a weapon against Christians and Muslims, especially Adivasis, Dalits and women”.

To those who criticise us for calling out those incidents in India, and who ask what it has to do with us, I say that we are all in this together and we must all join together, as demonstrated by this cross-party debate, to unite around the universal human right of freedom of religion or belief. I look forward to working as the Prime Minister’s special envoy for FORB—across party lines and across all faiths and none—to continue upholding that fundamental human right.

--- Later in debate ---

[Kemi Badenoch]

I completely agree with my hon. Friend. It is morally wrong and reprehensible to carry out such actions.

The hon. Member for Hornsey and Wood Green requested UK action in India. As other Members have recognised, faith leaders in India are influential figures in their local communities, so UK Ministers and diplomats regularly meet them to understand their perspectives and hold a dialogue with diverse communities across that country.

Our high commissioner has visited a number of different places of worship in India and met faith leaders there. He has met Christian communities, including visiting Sacred Heart Cathedral, where he met the Catholic Archbishop of Delhi, and the Cathedral Church of the Redemption, where he met the Moderator of the Church of North India.

Faith-based NGOs also make a positive contribution to Indian society. Over the last three years, staff across our network in India have worked with local NGOs to bring together young people of different faiths. Through our high commission, we are supporting a UK-India interfaith leadership programme, which brings together emerging Indian leaders of diverse faith backgrounds, including Christians and Muslims, to exchange UK-India perspectives and foster understanding and respect. In May last year, the high commission held a virtual iftar to celebrate the important contribution that Indian Muslims make to Indian society and to bring together different faith communities. My fellow Minister, Lord Ahmad also met with faith leaders while visiting India last March.

I know that Members are interested in the UK-India relationship. It is central to our foreign policy tilt towards the Indo-Pacific. In May 2021, the UK and Indian Governments committed to strengthening the relationship through our new comprehensive strategic partnership. Our 2030 road map, which was launched by the Prime Minister and Prime Minister Modi last year, will guide our co-operation and benefit people across both countries. It will support regional and global security and prosperity.

The hon. Member for North Ayrshire and Arran asked a few questions to which I am afraid I do not have the answers. I think some of them are DIT questions, but our 1.6 million strong diaspora community provides a living bridge of people, commerce, ideas and culture between our countries. It is an important strategic relationship, but even within that group there are many views that we have to take into account.

[Jim Shannon]

Minister, in the Open Doors top 50 league India is now No. 10; it was No. 31. That is clear factual evidence of lots of persecution and attacks on people of religious minorities. I know that it is not the Minister’s responsibility, but will she ask the Minister responsible to bring this to the attention of the Indian authorities? It is important that we are constructive in our contributions, but also that we are friends who can highlight issues that people are telling us are important?

[Kemi Badenoch]

I understand that. I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. It is something that I can ask my colleagues to do. I know that this is the sort of regular engagement that they have with their counterparts.

I can update those Members who raised the UK-India trade relationship. We recently launched negotiations for a comprehensive UK-India free trade agreement, which would particularly benefit the north of England, the west midlands, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. We will work with India to support its COP26 commitments, including through a $1 billion green guarantee and British international investment partnership. Oxford University, AstraZeneca and the Serum Institute of India are enabling the world to navigate its way out of the pandemic with their collaboration to produce covid-19 vaccines at scale.

I now want to turn to the UK’s wider work on freedom of religion or belief. In July we will host an international ministerial conference. We will use the conference to bring Governments from across the world together with faith leaders to drive collective action in promoting respect between different religious and non-religious communities around the world, so that everyone, everywhere can practise their religion or belief freely. We continue to work with organisations such as the United Nations, the Council of Europe, the G7, and the International Religious Freedom or Belief Alliance, to bolster international action on freedom of religion or belief.

The Prime Minister’s special envoy—my hon. Friend the Member for Congleton—who even now is working in this capacity by participating in the debate, is currently chairing the alliance, and I thank her for her commitment and leadership. In November, the Foreign Secretary attended the alliance ministerial forum and underlined the UK’s commitment to working with partner countries to support freedom and openness around the world. We and our alliance partners raise awareness of cases of particular concern and advocate for the rights of individuals persecuted or discriminated against on grounds of their religion or belief, as we have heard from hon. Members today.

We also continue to implement the recommendations made by the Bishop of Truro’s review of our work in support of persecuted Christians and members of all faiths and beliefs and those of no religious belief. We have implemented 13 of the recommendations. We are close to achieving a further six and we are making good progress on the remaining three.

To conclude, it is right that we reaffirm our commitment to do all we can to foster intercommunal and interfaith understanding and respect around the world. That is why we continue to discuss issues of freedom of religion or belief with the Indian authorities. This is part of our dialogue and partnership with India, a country with a long history of religious diversity. Our partnership with India is very important to us. It is a partnership that brings great benefits to communities in both our countries.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank all right hon. and hon. Members for their contributions, and in particular the Minister for her summing up. The right hon. Member for Chipping Barnet (Theresa Villiers) sponsors the Open Doors event every year. We thank her for that. I am sure she will bring to the attention of the Indian Government the fact that India is now No. 10 rather than No. 31. We look forward to her using her position to do so.

I thank the hon. Member for Coventry North West (Taiwo Owatemi) for her contribution. She recently joined the all-party parliamentary group for international freedom of religion or belief. We are very pleased to have her on board, and thank her for highlighting that where there is persecution we must stand up and say so. Well done to her for that.

The hon. Member for Harrow East (Bob Blackman) knows that he is a good friend of mine. We might agree on some things and disagree on others, but I thank him for the very balanced point of view that he put over today. He acknowledges that there are issues to be addressed. We are not here to give him a hard time, but to highlight the issues. That is our job. People do not come to us when things are all right; they come to us when things are wrong. They tell us these things, and these things have to be addressed. When there is an evidential base and the police are not providing protection, or are letting things happen, that has to be taken on board, so I thank the hon. Gentleman for that point.

The hon. Member for Bolton North East (Mark Logan) spoke up for Muslims in his intervention. I thank my dear friend, the hon. Member for Congleton (Fiona Bruce), for all that she does. The Government made the right decision in putting her in her post. I mean that genuinely. Forgive me, Mr Stringer, for going all gushy, but she is wonderful. She does that job well, and we are particularly pleased to have her in her post.

[Fiona Bruce]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Jim Shannon]

I am not allowed to take an intervention. The hon. Lady expressed all the concerns that we have about the issues.

The hon. Member for North Ayrshire and Arran (Patricia Gibson), who is also my friend, always brings passion and fire to these issues. The conversation in trade negotiations should be about human rights; they must be at the centre of all discussions.

The shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Hornsey and Wood Green (Catherine West), also highlighted the issues in her summing up. I understand that there are pockets in India where these things are happening. That is what we are here to highlight—where they are happening—not to brush over them like they do not matter, because these people have no one else to speak for them.

I know that the Minister is not responsible for this area, but she always does well and I thank her for that. I am very pleased to know that the Government have the persecution of Christians, and the freedom of religious belief for people of all religions, at the core of what they are doing across the world. As always, I thank the Government for that.

I was reminded by people who emailed or texted me during the debate that, when right-wing groups are emboldened by a culture of state negligence or complicity, such things continue to happen. We need to ensure that they do not happen in India any more, and that the future will be one in which all people, wherever they are from in India and whatever their religious viewpoint may be, have freedom of expression and belief. That is the one thing on which probably all of us present in the Chamber can agree. We believe in that, and we must see it happen. If it does not happen, we look to our Minister and our Government to ensure that they highlight that with the country of India.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That this House has considered the matter of the persecution of Christians and religious minorities in India.

Countering Russian Aggression and Tackling Illicit Finance

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Wednesday 23rd February 2022 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

My hon. Friend is right. We are talking about foreign ownership of property in our country, and that ought to command cross-party support. Just six or seven years ago, I would never have thought that this would feel like a partisan issue and be the basis of an Opposition day debate. It should have had time on the Floor, and we should have had an economic crime Bill years ago, but it takes the Opposition dragging the issue into the public domain to get a response.

To stand up to Putin in the long term, we need to stand up to Putinism, because Putin is not unique; he is the figurehead of an ideology that is being emulated by despots and dictators around the world. Putinism is imperialism. Putinism is authoritarianism. Putinism is ethno-nationalism. The Russian regime represents a fundamental geopolitical threat and we will not defeat the broader threat until we tackle the ideology that underlies it. Part of our message to Putin must be that his actions are a historic mistake.

This is not the first time that a Russian leader has waded into conflict as a result of his ideology. The same thing happened in East Berlin in 1953 when the USSR moved in to suppress riots. It happened in Hungary in 1956 when Russia sent in troops to invade the country as well as in Czechoslovakia in 1968 and in Afghanistan in 1979. None of those acts of aggression was a success in the long term for Russia, and civilians caught in the middle always pay a terrible price. In the invasion of Czechoslovakia, Russian soldiers strode in convinced that their invasion was liberating the Czech people from capitalism, but, when they are arrived, normal Czechs surrounded the invading forces and said, “Why are you here? You aren’t liberators—you are aggressors.” The Russian troops were deflated; the propaganda that they had been fed was a lie. The same thing will happen if Putin moves on the rest of Ukraine.

Only the Ukrainian people should have the freedom to determine their own futures. That fundamental belief in self-determination is shared across so many of our borders. It is a founding principle of so many of our closest allies and partners across this great continent and beyond it. The logic of democracy is why Putin will never win in the end. Any reward that he gains will be pyrrhic.

Putin has made his move. The wider threat that Ukraine faces is immediate, but the consequences for Europe and the west are also stark. This is likely the end of the post-cold war era, but we do not yet know what era is next, because it has not been decided. The effects of this moment will depend as much on our response to this aggression as on the aggression itself.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the right hon. Member for putting forward an impressive contribution to the debate. Following his line of thought, does he agree that, having decided our first step of imposing sanctions, we must do so properly and with wisdom? We also need to act in co-operation with other nations to ensure that we do not see Russian money supply transferred from our banks to friendly banks—those in Switzerland, for example, among other nations—in the next few days.

[Mr Lammy]

The hon. Gentleman is right. He knows a lot about violence and the corruption of money to fund that violence, and I am sure that the whole House is grateful for his wisdom.

What we know is that autocrats from around the world are watching to see if we meet this test of our strength and resolve. China will be watching to see how the west responds to Russia as it plots its next move. We must be strong not only to defend the people of Ukraine whose dignity and resilience has been an inspiration to all of us throughout the crisis but to defend the liberal international order that we need to stay safe.

Labour would go deeper, broader, stronger and faster on sanctions. The Government’s targeting of just five banks and three individuals is simply not enough. They claim that these are the toughest ever sanctions on Russia, but, after the annexation of Crimea, the UK froze the assets of almost 200 individuals and 50 entities alongside a range of other measures. Labour would go much further. We would increase the depth of sanctions by targeting more oligarchs and more banks. We would increase the breadth of sanctions by widening the measures beyond just asset freezes to sectoral measures, blocking dealing in Russian sovereign debt and banning the fake-news producing Russia Today. We would ramp up the speed of sanctions—we would not wait for Putin’s next act of war but introduce the full set of sanctions now. We would increase their coherence, moving in lockstep with our allies who have sanctioned more people more quickly than us. We would have stopped Nord Stream 2 and targeted Belarus as well, and we would make our sanctions stronger by targeting the systems people operate in as well as individuals. That means reforming Companies House so that it is fit for purpose, creating a register of overseas owners of UK property, as has been mentioned, delivering a strong economic crime Bill, as has been mentioned time and again, and implementing the recommendations of the Russia report finally in this House.

Sanctions

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd February 2022 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

It is a pleasure to speak in this debate, and I congratulate all right hon. and hon. Members on their contributions.

I want to make it clear that, having come from a place where I have lost loved ones to terrorism, where I have grown up with the threat of attack, where I have experienced the righteous anger when I have learned of senseless death, I am not a person who wants to see any community facing this. I do not want to see Ukraine facing this either. My heart is with the decent people of Ukraine whose lives are nothing more than pawns in a game, who will potentially lose their homes, their jobs and their loved ones as they seek simply to retain the ability to live their lives as Ukrainian citizens.

One of my very vivid memories as a child is seeing images of the six-day war, during which untrained women and young children took up arms to defend their nation. I remember thinking that this was amazing. It was only when I grew older that I realised that war is no place for anyone, let alone for untrained civilians, children and families.

Never did I imagine that I would again be at home watching a TV screen with images of elderly women and young teenagers being taught the rudimentaries of taking up arms to defend themselves, their homes and their nation against unacceptable aggression. This image did not inspire me as it did when I was a child. Instead, it saddened me that life for that lady will never be the same after she pulls that trigger—possibly—and does what she must do to protect herself and those whom she loves in Ukraine.

This time round, there is a difference for me. I am no longer a boy with dreams of a glorious war, when I did not really understand what it was. I am a man living with the scars of war, as others do in this Chamber. I am thinking here of the right hon. and gallant Member for Beckenham (Bob Stewart).

Just today, I have been contacted by constituents urging us to do the right thing by the Ukrainian people, as, in doing so, we are doing the right thing by democracy. There is nobody in this House who believes that we should do nothing and allow Putin to carry out his plans for Ukraine. The call of freedom and democracy is far too loud, and the question for this House is how we respond.

It is clear from all the comments we have heard so far that, with respect to the Minister and the Government, the steps that are being taken are understandable but do not go far enough. I welcome the sanctions outlined in the statutory instruments, and I welcome these steps, but it must be made clear that they are initial steps—the first stage in what we do. They must be a precursor to decisive action taken with our allies, because it is clear that Russian aggression will not dissolve in the face of what will equate to a parking fine for a millionaire—irritating, but in no way life-changing. That disappoints me.

While we must not rush to war, we must not rule out the need for our troops, along with our allies, to remind Putin that democracy is something we have laid our lives down to protect before and that, if necessary, we will do so again. I firmly believe that NATO should invite Ukraine to join it, or Ukraine should apply to NATO and be accepted. Upon that acceptance, NATO troops could carry out NATO manoeuvres in Ukraine, support our allies against the aggression of Russia and protect the 44 million Ukrainians.

[Bob Stewart]

I thank the hon. Gentleman, my good friend. As I know, having spent a lot of time working in NATO, the problem is that NATO requires unanimity for any action. There are 30 members, and one of them is Hungary, which has already said it supports Putin. That will hamstring any action whatsoever.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank the right hon. Gentleman for that intervention. He always brings his wisdom and his knowledge to these debates. At the same time, I am the eternal optimist in this world; I always believe in better things to come—it is probably my nature—so I believe that NATO can reach out collectively and strongly to support that request from Ukraine, if it comes.

Putin has met with Macron, spoken with the PM and Zoomed with America’s president, yet those discussions have only allowed him more time to plan and co-ordinate, and time to wage his misinformation war online to stir up Russians who believe his lies and will stake their lives for the honour of their nation—honour that has not, in reality, been impinged by any actions of the Ukrainian people. We can debunk their videos by looking at timestamps and comparing sound files, and it is clear that misinformation is the cause of the day.

Putin has lied to us, he has lied to his own and he will continue to lie to fulfil his agenda. We cannot take anything he says at face value. We must make the most of the alliance of NATO, the EU and the USA. I have been heartened to see the American President remember that, rather than mere “Brits”, as he calls us, we are, he states, America’s greatest ally. We must be united in the steps that are taken. We must show Putin that division over our exit from Europe or any other issue will not stop the NATO alliance and our determination to meet these acts of aggression in a responsive and suitable manner, as our shared responsibility.

I am thankful for the Prime Minister’s statement of our defence capacity and state of readiness, and I am proud that our troops are well known to be the best in the world. Putin knows that too; while we consider sending troops, he must know there is a mechanism to make that happen if he does not immediately pull back from his nefarious aims.

I support these sanctions, but only as part of a clear and forceful plan to stand against Putin’s aggression and with those who stand for democracy. If we are silent now, there is no doubt in my mind that the forced reunification of the USSR will be the only end to Putin’s scheme. We have a duty to act. We must act with caution, with wisdom and with a cool head, but President Putin must be under no illusion: the British people will meet our obligations through this country and through NATO, with the co-operation of others and the USA, and take action in defence of the very same principle, so important and so critical, that our grandparents fought for and won the victory for—freedom itself.

UK-Taiwan Friendship and Co-operation

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Thursday 10th February 2022 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the hon. Member for Rutland and Melton (Alicia Kearns) very much for her excellent introduction to the debate. The contributions so far have been enlightening. I must also thank the right hon. and gallant Member for Beckenham (Bob Stewart) for his contribution. On most occasions, he and I are on the same page on almost everything. I noted his comment about whiskey and understand that Bushmills whiskey from Northern Ireland is one of the best sellers in Taiwan, so perhaps we have strong economic relations as well.

[Bob Stewart]

I assure the hon. Member, who is a very good friend, that I also have Black Bush—a Northern Irish whiskey—in my office and have always had a sample of it for 35 years.

[Jim Shannon]

I am not surprised—by the way, I suspect that it is half-empty. [Interruption.] Perhaps more than half. In seriousness, the debate is about strengthening the ties between Taiwan and the UK, and I am proud to be associated with Taiwan, which is a bastion of freedom in an oppressed area. Taiwan stands out clearly to me, to all those who have spoken and to all who will speak after as a bastion of democracy and liberty. Information kindly provided to me highlights that, since the 1980s, Taiwan has overseen democratic reforms. Significantly, in 2020, it rose 20 places in The Economist democracy index to 11th worldwide, which shows its commitment to liberty, freedom and democracy.

Taiwan ranks as the No. 1 democracy in Asia, with The Economist describing it as 2020’s “star performer” and upgrading it to the “full democracy” category. It is in the interests of the UK and all liberal democracies to promote peace and stability in the region, especially as the UK increases its level of engagement with the Indo-Pacific region and aims to join the comprehensive and progressive agreement for trans-Pacific partnership. It seems to me, as Member of Parliament for Strangford and on behalf of the Democratic Unionist party, that our relationship with Taiwan is incredibly good and perhaps we can build on it.

In building a network of liberty, Taiwan has become the frontline of democracy against China’s expanding authoritarianism, and I stand with Taiwan in that aim. I absolutely love the Olympics and follow it every morning, looking for those medals to come—so far, they have not, but we live in hope—but I watch our great United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland team at the Winter Olympics in the knowledge of China’s ongoing treatment of the Uyghurs, the Christians, the Tibetans and the Falun Gong practitioners. My friend the Labour spokesperson, the hon. Member for West Ham (Ms Brown), and I have spoken about this very issue on many occasions and, whether it is in the Chamber or in Westminster Hall, we are on the same page. It concerns me greatly that China’s expansionism and imperialistic goals are at the expense of those Christians and other ethnic minorities. We see those who happen to have a different religious outlook or view on the world subjected to commercial-level organ transplantation.

Although we are focusing on UK-Taiwan friendship and co-operation today, I am conscious that at the same time there is an axis of evil, to which the hon. Member for Rutland and Melton referred: Russia, China, Iran and North Korea—four countries, two of which are trying to perfect nuclear power and two of which already have. I am incredibly worried about that. For instance, I understand that in the last week Iran has perfected a missile that can travel 900 miles; North Korea is trying to do the same, although Russia and China are certainly behind on the expertise. But if those missiles can reach 900 miles, they can strike at the heart of Israel and other western countries in the middle east. As the hon. Lady mentioned, the axis of evil shows that we need to have a steely reserve. Although we have seen some of that, I am not sure that we have seen enough. Quite honestly, we need to strike fear into the axis of evil to ensure that those countries understand that if they do something out of place, we will be in a position to strike back with the same intensity.

Way back in 2012 and 2013, I took part in the armed forces parliamentary scheme. I have always remembered our visit to Kenya, because the roads built in Kenya in 2012 and 2013—and probably before—were built by the Chinese. The Chinese influence goes far beyond the far east to the middle east, Africa and South America, with China using vast amounts of finance to encourage countries to withdraw their allegiance or political support for Taiwan. Again, China is core to that axis of evil.

When I see a nation like Taiwan, it is beyond difficult for me to understand how we could not do everything possible to strengthen the relationship—not simply to benefit our nation, but to support democracy in Taiwan. In the military sphere, there is a greater role for the UK to co-ordinate with the US, Japan and Australia, as it tilts to the Indo-Pacific. It is essential that Taiwan is a part of that delicate balance. We must ensure that Taiwan knows that we are on its page and are there to support it.

Over the course of 2021, there were 950 intrusions by People’s Liberation Army Air Force military planes into the Taiwan zone, which is an 150% increase on the 380 sorties recorded in 2020. In January 2022, there were 143 intrusions within 24 days. There is a consistent and worrying build-up in such cases. Looking at the aircraft that China is sending in gives us an idea that its intentions could well be destruction, evil and murder. The military aircraft used in these activities include, but are not limited to: the H-6 strategic bomber; JH-7 fighter jets; reconnaissance models; and the Y-9 electronic warfare aircraft. Those are all part of the influence of that country.

It is clear that things are escalating, and our support for Taiwan is necessary not simply from the perspective of military aid, but because we rely on Taiwan to be able to carry out its business. For instance, Taiwan is estimated to account for a fifth of global chip manufacturing and half of all cutting-edge capacity. Our dependence on Taiwan is important for us in the free world—not just for us here in the UK, but for everyone. Any action that could impact Taiwan’s production and disrupt that vital global supply chain would be of concern to the UK and the whole world.

Total trade in goods and services—exports plus imports—between the UK and Taiwan was £8 billion in the four quarters to the end of quarter 3, 2021. That was an increase of 14.4% or £999 million on the four quarters to the end of quarter 3, 2020. Our trade with Taiwan is important and growing, and can continue to grow. Taiwanese companies have invested in 222 projects in the United Kingdom. British companies have invested in a total of 1,307 projects in Taiwan.

We already have a clear and vital relationship, which we can—and must—build on. The message from this House today is clear from me, my party and as part of this great nation of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland: we stand with Taiwan, be assured of that. We are committed to Taiwan physically, emotionally, financially and culturally, and we hope that economically we can grow. We must not allow the independence of this stalwart nation to be overcome. Rather than lament the further erosion of democracy, now is the time to strengthen mutually beneficial ties, and to keep an eye on the long game. We are in the business of the long game, and we have got to get it right.