Damian Hinds
Main Page: Damian Hinds (Conservative - East Hampshire)Department Debates - View all Damian Hinds's debates with the HM Treasury
(2 months, 2 weeks ago)
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Damian Hinds (East Hampshire) (Con)
I beg to move,
That this House regrets that the Government has decided to impose VAT on independent school fees; believes that educational provision should not be taxed; regrets that the Government is rushing to implement this change part-way through an academic year; calls on the Government to exempt from the VAT charge fees paid in respect of children of military and diplomatic families, all children who have an Education, Health and Care Plan, or who are in the process of applying for one, all children on SEN support, Centres for Advanced Training and schools in the Music and Dance Scheme, all children at schools whose fees are lower than the average per capita funding for a state school place, and children at religious schools of denominations for whom there is no faith school provision in the state sector; further calls on the Government to postpone imposition of the VAT charge for schools in areas where state schools in the relevant key stage are already on average over 95% full; also calls on the Government to postpone imposition of the VAT charge for fees paid in respect of children who have started a public examination course, to September 2025 for pupils currently in Year 11 or Year 13, and to September 2026 for pupils currently in Year 10 or Year 12; and calls on the Government to publish a full impact assessment of the effects of this policy on independent schools and the state sector ahead of the Budget.
There are 85 days to go until the introduction of Labour’s education tax, and we are still in the dark. Many questions remain for parents, for children and for schools—when I say “schools”, that is both independent schools and state schools—and also for the local authorities that are responsible for special educational needs provision and generally for ensuring that everyone can get a place at school.
This is a huge change, which is being made in a headlong rush. There are big worries about children with special educational needs or a disability, about military families, about the talented musicians and dancers of tomorrow, about small religious faiths and about the widest impact of all—that on state schools, because this means disruption, bigger classes, budget overstretch, and ultimately, parents being less likely to get their preferred choice of school. Even those who do not necessarily object to this in principle are saying it cannot be pushed through this fast, from the Chartered Institute of Taxation to the NASUWT.
It is a long-standing principle that you do not put tax on learning—a principle all but universally observed around the world. On the Conservative Benches we believe in that principle and we believe in the sanctity of parental choice. The vast majority of children, of course, go to state-funded schools, and we defend the right of parents to choose those schools and defend the diversity of those schools. A small number of parents choose home schooling; we defend that right too. And yes, some choose the independent sector.
Parents are the first educators of their children. The state sets an expectation of a suitable education for all children, and beyond that, parents should make the choice of what is best for their child. Parents might decide to opt out of state education for any one, or many, of several reasons—quite often simply because they have found the school that they believe is right for their child, and where their child is most happy.
Graham Stuart
During the election, in the Monks Walk pub, I met a constituent who has stayed in his small home and has one car for the family, because they decided their bullied daughter needed to go to another school. They have sacrificed, with the support of wider family, so that that child with special educational needs can go to a private school. It is children and families like that who will be the victims of this spiteful policy. Does my right hon. Friend agree?
Damian Hinds
My right hon. Friend is right to identify that many parents make great personal financial sacrifices to do what they believe is best for their children. Some parents whose children go to independent school are rich, and some are definitely not. I include in that latter bracket most of the parents sending their children, for example, to small religious schools in Hackney, Salford or Birmingham. Very many more are in the middle, including many professionals working in our public services.
Jim Shannon
The shadow Minister has rightly underlined the issue for those who send their children to faith schools or independent schools. Many constituents in Strangford have told me that they have saved and persevered, have not been on holidays, have not bought a second car, or have even continued to use their old car longer than they should, so that those moneys can go into their children’s education. Does he, like me, find it impossible to understand how it can be that it is the Labour party—the party of conscience, I would say—that has let us down on this issue and is going to penalise people who are hard-pressed to find education for their children?
Damian Hinds
The hon. Gentleman is right about the financial sacrifices some make. Let us be clear: it is possible to tax wealthier people or people with a higher income more, but the Government should be honest about it. The way to do so is through the income tax system, not through a choice that people make to have their child in an independent school. The hon. Gentleman did not mention this, but I might add that because the situation in Northern Ireland is different from that in England—by the way, the situation in Scotland is different, too—the Government need to think carefully about how the policy is applied throughout the whole United Kingdom, because VAT is a reserved matter, and about what it means for the hon. Gentleman’s constituents and others across these islands.
Mike Amesbury (Runcorn and Helsby) (Lab)
My late mother and dad used to run a pub, and they paid their taxes. It was a private business that made a profit. Why should these businesses not pay their taxes? Why should they not pay what is owed?
Damian Hinds
This is a completely different situation. Independent schools do pay tax.
Damian Hinds
No, independent schools do pay tax on supplies. No tax is charged on education, whether in an independent school or in other settings, and that is a very long-standing principle.
Let me clear up one very important definitional point, which I ask colleagues to reflect on. There is no tax break involved. It would be a tax break if a person who had a child at an independent school and was not taking a place at a state school were charged less tax as a result. That does not happen in the United Kingdom. Everybody contributes to state sector education, whether or not they take up a place.
The principle of no tax on learning is a fast one, and once we loosen it, we do not know where we will go. Where might the Treasury look next? Private nurseries, perhaps? Music lessons? Private tutoring? What is the philosophical difference between independent school education and private tutoring?
Alicia Kearns (Rutland and Stamford) (Con)
Let me make a point to demonstrate how rushed and ill thought through this policy is. My understanding is that if a child in a nursery has turned five but the other children in the class have not, all the parents in that nursery year will have to pay VAT on their child’s nursery fees. That is how badly this has been thought through.
Damian Hinds
My hon. Friend is right. That comes from the rushed nature of the legislation. The sloppy drafting means that children who are not of school age get dragged into this tax if they happen to be in the same room as children who are, and there are concerns about what might follow in other borderline cases.
The Government claim that the policy is about revenue, not politics, but having read the Secretary of State’s twitterings, I think hon. Members could be forgiven for mistaking the motivation. It is entirely spurious, for multiple reasons, to link this tax to 6,500 teachers, mental health support or anything else. The money will go into general Exchequer receipts, and anyway, 6,500 teachers is not that many in the scheme of things, given the 468,000 there are now. That is a compound growth rate of 0.3% over five years—and, by the way, a lot fewer teachers than we recruited in the last five years. Mental health support teams are already being rolled out, and they cover primary schools as well as secondary schools. It is not clear what the difference is in the new Government’s policy on mental health support, other than that it will not include primary schools.
To the extent that the VAT revenue could be hypothecated, it looks a lot more like that revenue would reduce cuts to education resourcing, rather than increasing it. If the policy is about revenue, not politics, the Government could easily commit to one simple thing today. They are confident, they tell us, that the policy will raise a large sum of money and not create large costs. Will they commit to measuring and reporting back on that, and if it turns out, against expectations, that they were wrong, will they reverse it?
Dame Harriett Baldwin (West Worcestershire) (Con)
I thank my right hon. Friend, who is giving an excellent introduction to the debate. Is it his understanding that our military personnel, and those serving in our diplomatic service, will also be hit by this tax?
Damian Hinds
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. As things stand, those who get the continuity of education allowance would be hit, in part, by the tax.
Dr Andrew Murrison (South West Wiltshire) (Con)
In the calculus that my right hon. Friend rightly asks the Government to publish, can we include the foreign receipts that the independent sector generates? The roll of a school in my constituency includes a very large number of children from overseas whose parents pay directly into the UK economy. That school is now under threat. The loss of that revenue will be substantial, and the local impact huge. May we have that factored in, given that, so far, we have not seen any figures on the loss of money and reputation that the closure of many such schools will entail?
Damian Hinds
My right hon. Friend is correct: substantial export earnings come from the sector, and from a globally mobile set of families. But I would go further; in addition to the direct export earnings effect, there is also an indirect effect. For companies deciding where to site their European headquarters, English education is a big factor. That is partly because of our brilliant state schools, which have improved so much over the past 14 years, but the availability of independent schools is also a factor.
Kit Malthouse (North West Hampshire) (Con)
The shadow Secretary of State makes a strong point about the sanctity of zero-rating VAT for education. I am concerned that children’s clothes, which are currently exempt from VAT, may be the next target. Notwithstanding the impact that the change to VAT will have on individual families, does he agree that private and prep schools—my constituency has five—are enormous employers of people involved in building maintenance, such as electricians and plumbers, and that the impact on the wider economy could well be profound?
Mr Speaker
Order. I remind Members to look towards the Chair when they are speaking, or what they say will not be picked up by the mics; I then struggle to hear them. I know that the Minister was struggling as well. If Members keep the chatter down, it will help us both.
Damian Hinds
My right hon. Friend is of course correct about the economic contribution that schools make locally and the large numbers of people they employ. That point was also made by NASUWT, which is worried about teachers being inadvertently pushed out of the profession if redundancies are made mid-way through the school year.
Mims Davies (East Grinstead and Uckfield) (Con)
My youngsters have had a mix of excellent learning, including in nursery and in state education, as have youngsters in many families. I have a personal and constituency interest in wanting all education settings to thrive, so I agree with my right hon. Friend. The economic and employment impact of this new tax will be devastating for bus drivers and maintenance teams. It will impact on so many livelihoods and communities. The people picking up the unknown impact will be in the state sector. The policy will just deliver more of the unknown.
Damian Hinds
I will take one more intervention before making progress, so as not to try your patience too much, Mr Speaker.
Mr Speaker
It is not that my patience is being tested, but I do worry when shadow Secretaries of States cover a subject at length. I understand, but we need to get on, because lots of Back Benchers are desperate to get in. In fact, we have a very eager Opposition Whip coming in now.
Paul Holmes
You will find out, Mr Speaker, that I will not test your patience. I want to take my right hon. Friend back to the point he made about the Education Secretary’s tweet, which I thought was disgraceful. [Hon. Members: “Where is she?”] The divisive language behind that tweet was a disgrace, given the many independent schools that work hard and play by the rules. Does my right hon. Friend agree that the embossed notepaper that the Secretary of State focused on is sent to many children who are being sponsored through bursaries or scholarships, and whose parents work hard to give their children the best education? The Education Secretary should apologise for that disgraceful tweet.
Damian Hinds
I am grateful to my hon. Friend, who, as ever, makes important points. I too am disappointed that the Education Secretary is not with us for this important debate. I will make progress, Mr Speaker, because I do not want to go on longer than I should.
To be clear, we want to talk first and foremost not about revenue, but about education, schools and children—all children. [Interruption.] No, I have been talking about schools and children throughout. If the Government insist on ploughing on with this divisive policy, they must at least exempt certain groups of children for whom it would be especially unjust or counterproductive to impose this tax. Surely, schools that charge the same as, or even less than, the average cost of a school place were not in the Government’s sights when they devised this scheme. There are small religious groups that have no state sector provision for their denomination. Why should they be disadvantaged? The continuity of education allowance exists expressly to support families who are serving our nation in the armed forces. Surely they should be protected.
The Government acknowledge the role of centres of advanced training and performing arts schools that come under the music and dance scheme, because, again, there is no equivalent specialist schooling available in the state sector. Then there are the many children who receive special educational needs support, including those with an education, health and care plan, whether or not they are at the school named in the plan, and those children who are applying for a plan.
Damian Hinds
I ask my hon. Friend to forgive me, as I must make progress.
As for children whose parents are priced out of a school, or face its closure, disruption to learning can be difficult at any time, but it is even more problematic when pupils have started a public examination course. Their next school might not even offer the subjects that they were taking, or the exams might not be marked by the same exam board. We need to think about those children. The tax levy should be postponed until pupils who are now in years 10 or 11, or in the lower and upper sixth form, have finished their exams—until 2025 or 2026.
The widest impact of all will be felt by state schools. Ministers have said repeatedly that there is no problem because there are plenty of spaces in state schools. We have repeatedly pointed out that that is of no help at all if those places are in the wrong places or the wrong year groups. They need to be where and for whom they are required.
Iqbal Mohamed (Dewsbury and Batley) (Ind)
State schools in my constituency are bursting at the seams. There are no spare spaces to move into for the more than 1,000 children being educated in independent schools there. The fees charged by those independent schools are a quarter to half of the cost of state school provision per pupil.
Joy Morrissey
In Buckinghamshire, we do not have the places. We have a lot of children in special education needs and disabilities schools, faith schools and other private schools. We cannot cope with the capacity loss. We have parents who are sacrificing everything to send their child to a SEND school. There is no provision in the county for them. The policy will result in a crisis of transportation and places, and children will suffer as a result.
Damian Hinds
I am grateful to both my hon. Friend and the hon. Member for Dewsbury and Batley (Iqbal Mohamed) for their interventions. Indeed, there are many places, particularly at secondary school level, where there are insufficient spaces available to accommodate a significant minority being displaced from independent schools—places such as Bristol and Bedford, Salford and Richmond, Worcester and Wycombe, and Bury North and Bolton North East.
Let us be clear: local authorities have a duty to find spaces for children. They take that duty very seriously, and a number of them are considerably worried about what may happen. In-year admissions can be especially complicated in any case: they can involve not only governors but the fair access protocol panel and, ultimately, a Secretary of State direction, all of which can add up to months out of school. Creating additional physical space in schools obviously takes time, and building new schools takes longer still. Time is needed to adjust, which is why our motion further calls on the Government to
“postpone imposition of the VAT charge for schools in areas where state schools in the relevant key stage are already on average”
almost full.
This Government barely have their feet under the table, and already they are a Government in chaos. That chaos is exemplified by this destructive, disruptive and divisive education tax that will interrupt learning; create place demand where it cannot be accommodated; put further strain on the SEND system; hit specific groups that we ought to be trying to protect; likely generate much lower revenue than anticipated; and quite possibly even end up as a net cost to the public purse. In their headlong rush to make a political statement, the Government appear simply to not have thought through the consequences. We call on them now to announce immediately that they are abandoning the unrealistic January implementation date, to publish a proper impact assessment, and then to entirely rethink this entirely counterproductive tax.
Munira Wilson (Twickenham) (LD)
Thank you very much, Mr Speaker, and I am grateful for the Health Secretary’s advice—[Interruption.] I did not need coaching—you will hear that soon enough.
When I heard that today’s debate would be about schools, I thought, thank goodness, we are finally going to give the crisis in our classrooms the attention it deserves and have a long, overdue serious debate about the squeeze on school budgets, the shortage of specialist teachers, the dangerous state of many school buildings, the crisis in special educational needs provision, or the mental health of children, but no. In fairness, expecting the Conservative party suddenly to start prioritising those issues in opposition, after it spent years neglecting them in government, would be foolishly optimistic. Nevertheless, I hope that we will have the chance to debate them properly soon.
A priority for the Liberal Democrats is ensuring that every child, no matter their background, gets the support and attention that they need at school, so that they leave with the skills, confidence and resilience to be happy and successful. That means the Government investing in education as we invest in other vital infrastructure. In fact, Liberal Democrats believe that education is the single best investment we can make in our children’s potential and our country’s future. That is why in our manifesto we set out a number of ways to make that investment. We argued that putting a dedicated qualified mental health professional in every primary and secondary school was important. We argued for an increase in school and college funding per pupil, above the rate of inflation every year. We argued for school meals to be extended to all children in poverty, and for a tutoring guarantee for every disadvantaged pupil who needs extra support.
That package of investment in our state schools would improve and boost the performance and opportunities for every child, as well as closing the attainment gap that limits the life chances of too many children from disadvantaged backgrounds. Crucially, we set out in detail how it could all be paid for, including by increasing the tax on social media firms who have done so much to worsen the mental health crisis in our schools. That is a much bolder package of investment than the one this Government have set out so far, and it is paid for fairly, not by taxing parents’ own investment in their children’s education. I think the shadow Education Secretary was advocating raising income tax to invest in education—[Interruption.]
Munira Wilson
The shadow Education Secretary was suggesting to the Minister that that is where he could find some money—[Interruption.]
David Baines
Indeed.
There is a lot that deserves to be said about our schools. We have heard many Conservative Members ask about the impact. They suddenly care about the impact of decisions made in this place, but where was their talk of impacts over the past 14 years? In St Helens North, 81% of schools have had real-terms funding cuts since 2010—over £3 million in real terms, or £239 for every pupil. Where was the consideration of impacts when the last Government cancelled Labour’s Building Schools for the Future programme and watched our state schools crumble? Where was the talk of impacts when the last Government presided over a SEND system that is failing over 1 million children and that their own Education Secretary described as a “lose-lose-lose”? Where was the concern for impacts when standards fell, which they did?
David Baines
No, I am pushed for time.
Where was the consideration of impacts when the inspection system did not and does not work for parents, schools or pupils? Where was the consideration of impacts when child poverty increased? Where was the consideration of impacts when the lack of investment in school support staff and basic resources meant that teachers were buying resources for their pupils? Where was the consideration of impacts when we had a recruitment and retention crisis among teachers?
We could talk about all these issues if the Conservatives truly wanted a debate on schools, but they do not. They could have used today’s Opposition day debate to talk about these things, but instead they have used their time to talk about our decision to end a tax exemption that benefits only the wealthiest. They showed no concern whatsoever for state schools over the past 14 years, and now they are apparently concerned about impacts.
I make it crystal clear that the parents of state school pupils are every bit as ambitious, loving and hard-working as those who can afford to send their children to private schools. I stand with them, and I stand with our state schools.