Finance Bill

Christine Jardine Excerpts

Committee of the whole House
Wednesday 11th December 2024 Commons Chamber

[Munira Wilson]

The hon. Gentleman says that I am describing a failed system, and I am; I set that out. The SEND system is failing many children across this country, but I say to him gently—I made this point to the Minister in a similar debate a few weeks ago—that I do not think the level of investment that this measure will make in our state SEND system will fix that system. That will take many years and many billions of pounds, which I suspect that the Chancellor of the Exchequer does not have, and I do not think the answer to that is to penalise those who have scrimped and saved to be able to offer their children opportunity.

If I may, I will give the hon. Gentleman an example of another constituent who emailed me. She remortgaged her home, cashed in her pension plan and is struggling to be able to send her children to a local independent school after the local state school could not meet her children’s special needs. She said something that I think partly echoes what he is saying:

“Is this fair when other children with the same difficulties as mine are not able to access the same level of help? No. Definitely not. Believe me, I would never have chosen this route but I have been left with no choice. Is it fair to punish us further financially for the failings of the state education system? No!”

So I think the hon. Gentleman and I are in agreement, but I do not think the state SEND system is going to be fixed quickly or adequately enough, and I do not think the answer to that is to level down everybody’s opportunities. We need to level up opportunities for all and not penalise the parents who have made the often very difficult choice to ensure that their child has the opportunity that they wish to give them.

[Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)]

Further to the point made by the hon. Member for Edinburgh South West (Dr Arthur), one of the complicating factors in Scotland is that we have no way of knowing for sure whether the money raised from VAT on schools throughout the United Kingdom will go back into our state education system in Scotland, which is struggling just as badly as the system in England, if not more so. On the point about parents of children with SEND, is there not a danger that, rather than paying the extra fees, because they cannot pay them they will take their children out of independent schools and put them into the state sector, whose already overstretched resources will then be stretched even further, and everybody will suffer?

[Munira Wilson]

I thank my hon. Friend for her important intervention. I am interested in how this money will flow back into the Scottish system, if at all. The point, raised not just by me but by a number of hon. Members in the various debates we have had on this issue, is that this will actually put a much greater strain on the state system, and particularly the SEND system. That is my real concern here.

Faced with the coming price hike, many of the families I have described will be forced to choose between returning to the overstretched state sector, as my hon. Friend has just said, where their child’s needs may not be met, and trying to home-educate their child. This choice has wide-ranging implications not only for those individual families but for our economy and our society. My new clause 9 would force the Government to see through the implications of this damaging measure.

I repeat that my party and I are opposed on principle to the imposition of VAT on school fees, but if the Government insist on pursuing this damaging and counterproductive measure, they should do so with their eyes open. They should be clear about the damage this measure will do, they should be clear about how it will affect parents, and they should be particularly clear about how it will affect children with special educational needs and disabilities. New clause 9 aims to ensure that by laying bare the impact of this measure on those families and children, who are already struggling with a broken SEND system. It would also require consideration of the additional children who will be coming forward to apply for an EHCP, so that their parents may be spared the fee hike the Government are imposing on them for trying, as any parent would, to do the very best for their child.

I received an email from one parent who, when his child was in an excellent local state secondary school, was discouraged from applying for an EHCP because of the challenges involved. He made the decision to send his child quite far away to an independent school where his child is doing well. This gentleman emailed me to say: “Well, I am now thinking that we might try to get an EHCP because, over a seven-year period, it will save us an awful lot of money if our son is eligible for one.” We know the EHCP system is overloaded and in crisis, so how much more pressure is going to be put on that system? New clause 9 seeks to measure that.

I urge colleagues on both sides of the Committee to support the new clause, and I urge the Minister once again to rethink this ill thought through policy.

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[Dr Jeevun Sandher (Loughborough) (Lab)]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I thank the entire House for its well wishes.

I rise to speak of how our reforms will raise tax revenues from the wealthiest and use that money to build prosperity for all, because that is at the heart of our governing spirit.

Building prosperity for all means creating prosperity for those who cannot afford a decent life, no matter how hard they work, including non-graduates who cannot earn enough to live and the young who cannot earn enough to afford the homes they need. Today, we are proudly raising money from those who can best afford it to create good jobs and build homes across our nation, to create an affordable life for everyone.

[Christine Jardine]

I take exception to this idea of “the people who can best afford it.” A lot of parents who send their children to independent schools cannot really afford it—they scrimp and save. I do not think it is fair to characterise them that way. If they are forced to remove their children from those schools, it will not be the schools that suffer, it will be their children, and an extra burden will be put on the state system. This is hardly raising money to help other people.

[Dr Sandher]

In my constituency, private school fees are £15,000 per child per year. As a point of fact, almost no one in the bottom 80% sends their children to private school. Overall, it is 6%, while more than half of the top 1% send their children there. While I appreciate the hon. Lady’s point, it is not where the numbers are.

The tax changes we are debating today go to the heart of our governing philosophy that those with the broadest shoulders who benefit the most can carry the heaviest load. We all benefit from roads to drive on, a healthy workforce and hospitals when we need them. Those who gain the most benefit the most, and they are the ones we will ask the most from.

National Insurance Contributions (Secondary Class 1 Contributions) Bill

Christine Jardine Excerpts

2nd reading
Tuesday 3rd December 2024 Commons Chamber

[James Murray]

We recognise that tough decisions had to be taken throughout this Budget, but that is exactly why we have balanced the difficult decisions on the rate of national insurance and the decrease in the secondary threshold with the increase of the employment allowance, which helps small businesses and charities. There is no way that we can get through the measures announced in the Budget, and say that there will not be any difficult decisions for organisations or businesses to have to take. We are being up front about this. It is a tough decision for the Government to have to take, and it will mean that businesses must take difficult decisions as well. However, it is essential that we do this to fix the public finances, get our public services back on their feet and restore the economic stability that was squandered by the Conservative party.

[Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)]

How does it help morale and positivity among small businesses, which will be vital to economic growth, if some of them are going to see their salary bills double? An employer in my constituency—not quite a small business, but a medium-sized business—is facing crippling increases in the salary bill. How will it help growth if those companies go to the wall and we lose jobs?

[James Murray]

The hon. Member focuses on the national insurance contributions changes, which is rightly the focus of this Bill, but I urge her to look at that in the context of everything else the Government are doing, not least the employment allowance doubling that I have mentioned. There is also our decision to freeze the small business rates multiplier as it applies in England, our decision to introduce permanently lower retail hospitality and leisure rates for businesses on the high street in 2026-27, and the decision in our corporation tax road map to maintain the small profits rate and other allowances from which small businesses can benefit. I urge her to understand that what we are doing on national insurance is taking a tough decision to fix the public finances, while at the same time providing the stability that businesses need to invest and grow, and that is the way to move our country forward.

--- Later in debate ---

[James Murray]

In the statistics put out by the Government at the time of the Budget, a specific amount is earmarked directly for Departments and public sector employers. That amount is effectively netted off against the amount that will be available for net spending in public services. For other organisations, such as third parties that contract with the NHS, there should be a conversation between the person under the contract and the contracting organisation to consider pressures in the round. As I said, this is in the context of, for example, the local government budget going up by 3.2% next year, and a huge amount of extra investment in the NHS, with £600 million going to local authorities in England to help deal with social care pressures. That is the context of the decisions that we had to take and pressures in the round.

[Christine Jardine]

I thank the Minister for giving way again. What about GP surgeries?

[James Murray]

GP funding for 2025-26 will be confirmed by the Department for Health and Social Care in the usual way as part of the GP contracting process, and it will consider all the pressures on GPs in the round.

I will make some progress, because the points we have made are clear. It is important for me to look also at what the Opposition might do, given the important vote today on these tax changes, which are necessary to raise funding for the NHS and other public services. I would like to think that the Opposition might join us today, back our plans to provide extra funding for the NHS and support this Bill to help pay for it. It seems though, from an article in The Sunday Times in the name of the shadow Chancellor, the right hon. Member for Central Devon (Mel Stride), that that may not be the case. In that piece, he wrote that the Conservatives apparently

“want to provide further funding for the NHS.”

Sadly, they refuse to take the tough decisions to pay for it.

I note that in that article, the shadow Chancellor rehashed the discredited pledge from the recent Conservative manifesto to make £12 billion of welfare savings, which the Institute for Fiscal Studies politely described at the time as being “difficult in the extreme.” Perhaps he missed the admission from his predecessor, the right hon. Member for Godalming and Ash (Jeremy Hunt), during the election campaign that those welfare cuts were in fact not new, and the money had already been spent. Either way, it is hard to fathom why the new shadow Chancellor would rest his first intervention on a pledge from a manifesto that led to his party losing nearly 250 seats. It only serves to underscore the fact that the Conservatives are getting further and further away from being a credible Opposition by the day.

We recognise that the decision to increase employer’s national insurance will have impacts. Although measures in this Bill will help to protect small businesses and charities, other measures mean that larger businesses and organisations will have difficult decisions to take. Let me be clear, however: the Budget was a one-off and a once-in-a-generation event. The difficult decisions we took meant that we were able to wipe the slate clean of the previous Government’s fiscal irresponsibility and economic mismanagement. Public services now need to live within their means and the means we have set them for the rest of this Parliament. The Budget delivered stability and fiscal responsibility, meaning that our focus can now be resolutely on boosting investment and growing the economy. That fiscal responsibility is possible only when we take tough decisions. This Bill makes it clear that this Government will not shy away from tough decisions and that we will do what is right in the circumstances we face. I commend it to the House.

--- Later in debate ---

[Dr Sandher]

Not only are we protecting the smallest businesses by raising the employment allowance, but there will be business rates relief for the hospitality businesses to which the hon. Gentleman refers.

[Christine Jardine]

Does the hon. Gentleman understand how frustrating it is for Liberal Democrat Members to be told that this is the Scottish Government’s problem? It is not the Scottish Government’s problem; it is the problem of Scottish businesses if they are being hit by national insurance contribution increases without business rates relief. We are tired of hearing that this was a tough decision; it was an easy decision that is tough for businesses.

[Dr Sandher]

It is the responsible decision to invest in this country’s foundation, so that we get the doctors, nurses and teachers that we all need, and to insulate our homes.

VAT: Independent Schools

Christine Jardine Excerpts

Tuesday 8th October 2024 Commons Chamber

[Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)]

It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Hartlepool (Mr Brash). I would just mention that I am the child of aspirational parents from a working-class background. There were three little words uttered by Tony Blair that gave a lot of my family faith that an incoming Labour Government would be a good Government. Those words were, “Education, education, education.” Now those same people tell me that they are disappointed in a Labour Government who are going to tax education. Let me be clear about this. Charitable education is not about the children in the school; it is about the children who are not at the school. It is about opening up the facilities to the community, which I am sure the hon. Gentleman knows, and it is about serving the community. That is where the charitable status comes from. I know that because my child was one of the 7% who went to an independent school.

The hon. Gentleman talks about allegations of vindictiveness and ideologically driven policies. They are coming not from those on the Opposition Benches, but from the hundreds of emails that we are getting from our constituents. Our constituents are worried about how they will get their child into a state school, and the parents of children at state schools are worried about what is going to happen to the resources at their school when it has to cope with the influx of children from the independent sector.

Every year, 20% to 30% of children in Edinburgh go into the independent sector. Figures produced by the Labour-led council just before the general election showed that, by the end of this decade, 16 schools will be over capacity, without any influx from the independent sector.

We have problems in education, but this is not the solution to it. It is especially not the solution in Scotland— I am not going to preach to Members about English education. We have had 17 years of damage and mismanagement of our state sector in Scotland from the Scottish National party. To parents in Scotland now, it just feels like the Labour party is joining in.

There is one big flaw in this: the Minister said earlier that the money will go back into education, but parents in Scotland would like to ask how. There is no mechanism. It is a reserved tax, and education is devolved. Even if the Government could come to some agreement with the SNP, how will they ensure that places for the 9,000 children in Edinburgh in independent schools are available in their catchment area? How will they make sure that they will be studying the right subjects, and how will they do it by January? It is just five months before they disrupt children’s education. I have listened to lots of people here today say that every child’s education is important—yes, it is. Every parent has aspirations for their child—yes, they do. And every child deserves not to have their education disrupted with just five months to find a solution. That is not fair.

Independent Schools: VAT and Business Rates Exemptions

Christine Jardine Excerpts

Tuesday 8th October 2024 Westminster Hall

[Bradley Thomas]

My right hon. Friend makes a valid point, which I will touch on later, and I hope the Minister will address it. Independent schools provide additional value-adding capacity to SEND education, as has been acknowledged, and VAT on fees risks their ability to do that. There is simply not the capacity in the state sector to accommodate all those extra pupils, particularly when SEND services are already under pressure.

[Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)]

I congratulate the hon. Member on securing this important debate. My city of Edinburgh has the highest proportion of independently educated children in the country, at between 20% and 30% every year. According to the local Labour authority, 16 schools will already be over capacity at the end of this year. If the predicted percentage of children drop out of independent education into the state sector, it will not be able to cope. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that this measure is ill thought-through and that the Labour Government must come up with a way to support education, particularly as the matter is devolved in Scotland and VAT is reserved?

[Bradley Thomas]

I agree with the hon. Member. The examples she cites highlight the situation perfectly. The Government have failed to consider that the capacity is not there. We have already seen, in the few months since this Parliament began, several debates highlighting issues of SEND capacity.

Another mother wrote to me to outline the benefit that independent schools can have for children with SEND needs:

“We moved our autistic child to a small independent school and the transformation was immediate. Classes are small and quiet, and the school is very nurturing and family oriented. It has been wonderful to see her blossom and slowly get more and more involved in school life. We would not have chosen for our daughter to go to private school but there was no suitable state provision available. We are paying a significant amount of money to be able to do this. Adding VAT on top feels like we are being punished twice for having a child that doesn’t fit into the state system, either in mainstream or specialist schools.”

Winter Fuel Payment

Christine Jardine Excerpts

Tuesday 10th September 2024 Commons Chamber

[Emma Reynolds]

The right hon. Gentleman did indeed say that he supported the principle. The Liberal Democrats, in their manifesto of 2017, also said that they supported means-testing this benefit.

[Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)]

I thank the Minister for giving way, but I think she fails to understand that while we accept the principle of means-testing—we accept that there are many pensioners who can afford not to have the winter fuel payment—it is the manner in which the Labour Government intend to bring it in, with a sharp cliff edge and no accounting for the people close to the pension credit limit, that we find abhorrent.

[Emma Reynolds]

I will come on to that point, but first I want to say how crucial it is to boost the uptake of pension credit.

We are taking immediate action to increase that take-up, given that up to an estimated 880,000 eligible pensioners are missing out on this support, worth £3,900 on average. I hope there can be some consensus across the House that we need to work together to boost that uptake. That is why last week we launched an initial pension credit week of action to boost awareness. We will continue to raise awareness until the deadline, 21 December, for making a successful backdated pension credit claim.

Public Spending: Inheritance

Christine Jardine Excerpts

Monday 29th July 2024 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)]

I call Christine Jardine.

[Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)]

I would also like to welcome you to the Chair, Madame Deputy Speaker.

Much of what the Chancellor says I welcome—no fresh income tax, national insurance or VAT—but I am sure the Chancellor will recognise the concern that many pensioners, particularly in the coldest areas of the country, will be feeling at the announcement of the withdrawal of winter fuel payments. Although she is saying that she will work on bringing more people forward and encouraging them to sign up for credits, can she tell us how she is going to do that if she is also going to cut the Government communications budget?

[Rachel Reeves]

I think the hon. Lady for that question. There are a couple of things we are committed to do. First, pension credit and housing benefit are due to be amalgamated. The previous Government put that back; we will bring that forward. We know that take-up of pension credit will increase when it is merged with housing benefit. That will make an impact in ensuring that people get the money they are entitled to. However, we have also committed, as elderly people’s charities have asked, to central Government working with local government to better identify people who are entitled to pension credit, but are not claiming it today. We want to make sure that everyone who is entitled to pension credit gets it, and with it the associated winter fuel payment.