(13 years ago)
Commons ChamberRead Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Mr Russell Brown (Dumfries and Galloway) (Lab)
1. What steps the Government are taking to stimulate demand in the construction sector in Scotland.
Jim Sheridan (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (Lab)
7. What recent discussions he has had with the First Minister on the construction industry in Scotland.
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Michael Moore)
I recognise the vital role that the construction industry plays in the Scottish and UK economy. The plan for growth includes a wide range of measures to support the industry across the UK. I have regular discussions with Scottish Ministers on these and other matters of importance to the Scottish economy.
Mr Brown
May I say to the Secretary of State that his Under-Secretary and I have one thing in common? We still have construction workers who remain unemployed after R & D Construction went into administration earlier this year. Does the Secretary of State fully recognise that throughout the UK, and especially in Scotland, there are far too many unemployed construction workers, who desperately want to get back to work? He needs to encourage the Scottish Government to stimulate that sector.
Michael Moore
I agree that we must take all appropriate measures to get the economy on the right footing. As he will appreciate, we have a big challenge clearing up the mess left by the previous Government and the challenging situation in the eurozone, but we are determined, through our credible deficit plan and with a strong economy, to get construction and other sectors in the right place.
Jim Sheridan
The Secretary of State might be aware of the major lobby today by construction workers throughout the UK, many of them from Scotland. They are concerned about proposals by six national construction companies to change the national agreement for electricians. Given what is going on in Scotland, when he next meets the First Minister will he remind him of the excellent work being done in both Parliaments in providing quality partnerships? The proposal by those construction companies could undermine all that good work.
Michael Moore
I agree that it is vital that the UK Government and the Scottish Government work together. Whether that is on terms and conditions or on the general state of the economy, it is extremely important. We as the UK Government have taken important steps to support the Scottish Government in their efforts with the economy.
John Thurso (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)
Is my right hon. Friend aware of the considerable construction activity taking place prior to deployment of marine energy in the Pentland firth, particularly at places such as Scrabster harbour? What more can this Government do to ensure that the right infrastructure is constructed now so that we benefit from the opportunity of marine renewable energy in the future?
Michael Moore
As my hon. Friend knows, through our plan for growth, which sets out the basis on which we will support the economy through these difficult times—cutting corporation tax, reducing the burden of income tax, reducing the national insurance burden and, with a huge investment in marine renewables, reforming the energy market—we are laying the foundations for that important sector to develop. It is important that that is not undermined by the uncertainty that the independence referendum is causing in Scotland at present.
Angus Robertson (Moray) (SNP)
A competitive tax position is vital for the construction sector and the rest of the Scottish economy. That is why the Scottish Government have called for the devolution of corporation tax powers. Will the Secretary of State confirm that the UK Government are actively considering the devolution of corporation tax to Northern Ireland?
Michael Moore
The hon. Gentleman knows full well that we have had a consultation about corporation tax devolution to Northern Ireland and we are reviewing the responses to it. I wish we could say the same for the response to the Scottish Government’s consultation on their corporation tax proposals. We have asked a series of fundamental questions about the proposals but they have gone unanswered. We have yet to see the consultation responses, so I suggest the hon. Gentleman ask his friend the First Minister to get on with that.
Angus Robertson
The Secretary of State has taken the opportunity in the past to say that the UK Government will consider the devolution of corporation tax powers to Scotland, but Dr Graham Gudgin, an adviser to the Northern Ireland Secretary, confirmed in evidence to the Scottish Parliament that the UK Government have already ruled out the devolution of corporation tax “under any circumstances”. Both statements cannot be true, so which is true?
Michael Moore
We have said that we want to consider any valid proposals brought forward by the Scottish Government, but they must first establish a credible, detailed position, maintain the consensus across the parties and ensure that there is no detriment to Scotland or the rest of the UK. The Scottish National party and the First Minister have so far failed to deliver the detail.
Margaret Curran (Glasgow East) (Lab)
I ask the Secretary of State to pay particular attention to the concerns raised this morning about the construction industry in Scotland, where 10,000 jobs have been lost this year and the number of companies facing bankruptcy has risen by 135% in the past two years. With that in mind, will he support Labour’s call, and that of the Scottish Building Federation, for a one-year cut in VAT on home improvements to 5%, a specific action to help boost the construction industry and get the Scottish economy moving again?
Michael Moore
I welcome the hon. Lady to her new post, without, if I may say so, wishing her too much success in it. She brings a great deal of experience to the House and I look forward to our encounters. We have heard Labour’s proposals for reducing VAT, but I have to tell her that when that was last done it did not deliver the hoped-for outcome. As we are seeing across the eurozone, countries cannot spend their way out of a debt crisis. We need a credible plan and we have to deliver on it, which is what we are doing.
Margaret Curran
I thank the Secretary of State for his kind opening remarks and look forward to robust debates and work in the coming years. I am sorry to say that his answer is completely inadequate, because previous VAT cuts did deliver growth. The Government’s failed policies mean that they are set to borrow £46 billion more this year, rather than reduce the deficit. In reality, Scots face a double-whammy: a Tory-led Government cutting too far and too fast, and an SNP Government presiding over stagnant growth and cuts in capital spending. Scotland is in the midst of a crisis—a jobs crisis and a growth crisis. If he will not follow Labour’s five-point plan to boost jobs and growth in Scotland, what specific action will the Government take in Scotland and for Scotland to get our economy moving again?
Michael Moore
The hon. Lady cannot skip so lightly away from the mess we inherited from the previous Government: the highest deficit in peacetime history and we were borrowing £1 for every £4 we spent, which was simply unsustainable. It is absolutely vital that we keep to our credible deficit reduction plan and deliver on the plan for growth by cutting corporation tax, maintaining low interest rates and reducing regulatory and national insurance burdens. As far as Scotland is concerned, I agree that the tax hike in the Scottish Government’s spending review is bad for business. They must acknowledge that we have helped with pre-payments for the replacement Forth crossing and by making land available from the Ministry of Defence. We are helping the Scottish Government in many ways.
Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab)
2. Whether he has a policy on a threshold that would be required to vote in favour of independence before legislating for Scottish independence.
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Michael Moore)
The Government have no such policy. The Scottish Government have said that they will introduce proposals for a referendum, and we urge them to end the delay and uncertainty by doing so. Whenever there is a referendum, the UK Government will make the case for a prosperous Scotland in a modern UK.
Kevin Brennan
Should not any referendum that has profound implication for Wales, Northern Ireland and England as well as Scotland involve an absolutely clear and straightforward choice between remaining in the UK and separation, rather than muddying the waters with what my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow South (Mr Harris) has called the “I can’t believe it’s not independence” option?
Michael Moore
The hon. Gentleman makes a fair point. With a BBC poll at the weekend showing that barely a quarter of Scots favour independence, it is no great surprise that the SNP is taking Scotland for granted and running away from an independence poll. It is creating uncertainty that is damaging for business. Let us have a clear question and get on with it.
Mrs Eleanor Laing (Epping Forest) (Con)
In considering Scottish independence, has the Secretary of State seen recent legal advice stating that an independent Scotland would be either outside the European Union, and therefore would lose EU funding and access to free markets, or required to join the euro as a new accession state? Does he agree that that is further evidence that breaking up the UK would be bad for the people of Scotland?
Michael Moore
I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend. The idea that the SNP can take it for granted that Scotland would enter the EU without negotiation and consideration of such issues is entirely fanciful. That is part of the uncertainty that needs to be resolved sooner rather than later.
Stewart Hosie (Dundee East) (SNP)
On 8 May the Scottish Secretary ruled out a 40% rule in a rigged referendum. He also said that the referendum was entirely a matter for the Scottish Government and that he would not be raising any constitutional questions. Does he stand by that?
Michael Moore
I do not think we should take any lessons on rigged referendums from the hon. Gentleman’s party, which is determined not to have a straightforward question on Scottish independence—the whole reason it exists—but to bring in other issues as well. Let us get a straightforward question now and end the damaging uncertainty.
Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con)
3. What steps he is taking to reduce administrative costs in his Department.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland (David Mundell)
Scotland Office Ministers are determined that the Office contribute to the Government’s task of reducing the budget deficit. I and my officials are bearing down hard on administrative costs through a range of efficiency measures, including using framework contracts negotiated by other Government bodies, sharing resources with the other territorial offices and making more efficient use of leasehold property.
Mr Bone
The Prime Minister wants to see smaller and more effective government. Only last year, the Secretary of State for Scotland called for the abolition of the Scotland Office. Would the very capable Minister not be making a career enhancing move if he suggested now from the Dispatch Box that we should abolish the Scotland Office, the Wales Office and the Northern Ireland Office and replace them with an office for the Union?
David Mundell
Absolutely not. At this time, when the United Kingdom faces its greatest ever danger from separatists, the Scotland Office is a bulwark against independence.
Mr Brian H. Donohoe (Central Ayrshire) (Lab)
Is that what is called cutting the Department to the bone? Will the Minister name all the staff of his Department? I remember telling a previous Secretary of State that it must be the only empire in the whole of Westminster where the Secretary of State is able to name all his staff: can he?
David Mundell
I pay tribute to the staff of the Scotland Office. With a small number of staff, we have pursued the Scotland Bill, a very significant measure, through this House and into the other place. The Scotland Office has a key role to play as we move forward in preserving Scotland’s place in the United Kingdom.
Mark Menzies (Fylde) (Con)
4. What recent assessment he has made of the benefits to Scotland of the Union; and if he will make a statement.
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Michael Moore)
As part of the United Kingdom, Scotland’s economic opportunities are larger, our public finances are more robust, our defence is stronger, our influence on the international stage is greater, the welfare system is more secure and our cultural and family ties are closer. Those are just half a dozen reasons why we are stronger together.
Mark Menzies
Does the Secretary of State agree that, given the tough economic crisis facing small European countries, the worst thing for Scotland would be to become a small independent country dependent on the eurozone, rather than being part of the United Kingdom and having the strength that brings?
Michael Moore
My hon. Friend is absolutely right to highlight the issues that face Scotland if it chooses to be independent and the fact that such a process cannot take place without some very hard-nosed negotiations with our European partners, who are facing real difficulties all over the continent. We need the SNP to spell out its plans on how it will deal with those issues—then let us get on with the independence referendum.
Mr Angus Brendan MacNeil (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP)
Does the Secretary of State agree that the social union, the Commonwealth, the monarchy and particularly the current Queen—Queen Elizabeth—will be important whatever constitutional arrangements Scotland has in the future? That, of course, would mirror the situation in independent Canada, New Zealand and Australia, with Scotland being the Queen’s 17th independent realm.
Michael Moore
I understand the hon. Gentleman’s passion for Scotland’s independence, but I wish it were shared with some intention to get on with the debate. The chairman of the independence campaign is sitting beside him. What are they scared of? Let us get on with it.
Sir Menzies Campbell (North East Fife) (LD)
My right hon. Friend has outlined the benefits to Scotland of European Union membership and the uncertainty that would surround those benefits in the event that Scotland were to be independent. Does he agree that it would help to resolve that uncertainty if the Scottish Government published the legal advice they have had on the point, so that it may contribute properly to the debate?
Michael Moore
My right hon. and learned Friend makes a very important point. The idea that we would somehow simply get membership of the European Union with complete agreement, without discussion and without needing to worry about the terms of negotiation is quite fanciful. It is a journey into the unknown and we need to have the detail.
Mr William Bain (Glasgow North East) (Lab)
One of the many benefits associated with the Union is the certainty provided by Scotland’s continuing membership of the European Union. Has the Secretary of State seen the impartial Library research published yesterday, which indicates that Scotland may have to go through an accession process to stay in the EU if it becomes a separate state? That research also shows that if Scotland were accepted as a member state, according to the most recent data, net annual contributions to the EU from Scottish taxpayers would rise to £92 per capita compared with only £57 per capita from the rest of the UK. Would it not be contrary to Scotland’s national and economic interests to separate from the rest of the UK if it meant Scotland ended up out of the EU or paying more to stay in the EU, and only if it adopted the euro?
Michael Moore
I welcome the hon. Gentleman to his new role, in which he is already demonstrating his forensic attention to detail. I am delighted that he has put his point across, and I completely agree with him about the uncertainty that all this causes.
John Robertson (Glasgow North West) (Lab)
5. What recent discussions he has with Ofgem on energy prices in Scotland.
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Michael Moore)
I recently discussed this issue with Ofgem and other key stakeholders at the energy summit I held in Bathgate on 20 October. This Government are determined to help people to reduce their energy bills and I welcome Ofgem’s recent proposals to reform the retail energy market.
John Robertson
The right hon. Gentleman’s Government want to put a bonfire under quangos, so how does Ofgem chairman Lord Mogg’s £200,000-a-year salary for a three-day week sit with not going above the Prime Minister’s salary?
Mr Speaker
Order. We are talking about energy prices rather than salaries, but I am sure that the talents of the Secretary of State will allow him to remain in order.
Michael Moore
I am delighted to say to the hon. Gentleman that I recognise his long-standing concerns on all these issues—not only salaries but energy prices. Our proposals to simplify matters and to help people to switch and to get greater transparency in their bills, and all the other reforms being introduced by Ofgem, are crucial. I look forward to Ofgem getting on with that work.
Sir Robert Smith (West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine) (LD)
One of the key groups of customers facing high energy prices this year is those who are not on the gas main and heat their homes with oil, LPG and other fuels. At the moment, sadly, Ofgem does not have a remit for them. Will my right hon. Friend discuss with the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change whether there is any way that those suppliers can be made to engage with their vulnerable consumers in the same way as mains gas suppliers have to?
Michael Moore
My colleagues in the Department for Energy and Climate Change will meet to discuss this in the next few weeks. My hon. Friend is right to highlight the issue, and I look forward to picking it up with him at some time in the near future.
Mr Mike Weir (Angus) (SNP)
Yesterday the Secretary of State for DECC sent a letter to all MPs promoting the Government’s policy of check, switch and insulate, but how does the Secretary of State suggest that off-grid customers can check or switch when in many areas there is a virtual monopoly on home fuel oil? [Interruption.]
Mr Speaker
Order. Far too many private conversations are taking place in the Chamber. We need to hear the Secretary of State.
Michael Moore
As I said in answer to my hon. Friend the Member for West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine (Sir Robert Smith), we want to discuss these issues. Representing a big rural area without gas grid access, I recognise that this is an important matter, and I am happy to discuss it with the hon. Gentleman too.
Mike Freer (Finchley and Golders Green) (Con)
6. What assessment his Department has made of the report of Electoral Commission Scotland on the 2011 elections to the Scottish Parliament; and if he will make a statement.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland (David Mundell)
I welcome the Electoral Commission’s finding that the Scottish Parliament election was well administered and voter focused.
Mike Freer
Given that the Scottish Government did not complain about the Electoral Commission being involved in the elections, does my right hon. Friend think it odd that they now want to set up their own independent commission on the referendum?
David Mundell
I agree with my hon. Friend. The SNP Government had no complaint about the Electoral Commission’s involvement in the Scottish Parliament elections and the alternative vote referendum but, at great cost to the taxpayer, they intend to set up their own commission to oversee the referendum. No wonder so many people are speculating that that is an attempt to rig the referendum.
Mr Ian Davidson (Glasgow South West) (Lab/Co-op)
Will the Minister meet the Electoral Commission in Scotland on 30 November, or will he, like me, be supporting the public sector strike against Tory cuts in pensions?
David Mundell
I welcome the fact that the hon. Gentleman, as convenor of the Scottish Affairs Committee, brought the Electoral Commission before his Committee. That will provide valuable evidence in the debate on the role that it should play in any referendum.
Iain Stewart (Milton Keynes South) (Con)
Is my right hon. Friend aware of any recommendation in the report about changing the electorate in Scotland in the same way as the Scottish Government want to gerrymander the electorate for their independence referendum?
David Mundell
I am not aware of any such suggestions in the Electoral Commission report, but my hon. Friend is correct to highlight the issues with the Scottish separatists’ referendum that are causing such uncertainty—the franchise, the question and the timing. [Interruption.]
Mr Speaker
Order. I appeal to the House to come to order and listen to Mr Frank Doran.
Mr Frank Doran (Aberdeen North) (Lab)
8. What recent discussions he has had on the deployment of carbon capture and storage technology in Scotland.
The Secretary of State for Scotland (Michael Moore)
My most recent meeting with the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change to discuss this issue was on 10 October. Although it was not possible to reach a deal on Longannet, the Government remain firmly committed to carbon capture and storage and I welcome the confirmation given by the Treasury that the £1 billion of funding will be made available for future CCS projects.
Mr Doran
The Government in the 1980s refused to invest in wind power and threw away our world lead in renewables. Are this Government making the same mistake by refusing to invest in the most advanced industrial-scale carbon capture and storage project in the world at Longannet?
Michael Moore
I do not agree with the hon. Gentleman on that, but I do agree that we are determined to see Britain take a leading role in this important technology. That is why the £1 billion of investment is still available and why Peterhead and other parts of the UK will be able to bid for it.
Dr Eilidh Whiteford (Banff and Buchan) (SNP)
I hope that the Secretary of State will welcome this morning’s announcement by Scottish and Southern Energy and Shell that they are bringing the project at Peterhead one step closer. What assurances can he give that the project will not be shelved, as the last Peterhead project for carbon capture and storage was by the previous Government, and that we will see this investment?
Michael Moore
In a week when a major international bank has talked about the impact that the uncertainty over independence is having on renewables investment in Scotland, we will take no lessons from the SNP about uncertainty. As I said to the hon. Member for Aberdeen North (Mr Doran), it is vital that Peterhead and other places come forward with their bids, and £1 billion is available to support them.
Miss Anne McIntosh (Thirsk and Malton) (Con)
9. What discussions he has had with the First Minister on reform of the common fisheries policy.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland (David Mundell)
My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State and I have regular discussions with the First Minister and his officials on a range of issues of significance to the Scottish economy. I have frequent discussions with the Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs and Environment, including a meeting last week on the common fisheries policy and other matters.
Mr Speaker
Order. Members are being very unfair to the Member asking the question and to the Minister answering it. Let us have a bit of order.
Miss McIntosh
Does the Minister agree that the direction in which the negotiations on fisheries are going is entirely in the interests of the Scottish and UK fisheries in ending discards and allowing for regional fisheries agreements?
David Mundell
I agree with my hon. Friend, just as I agree with Bertie Armstrong, chief executive of the Scottish Fishermen’s Federation, who stated in his evidence to the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee, which she chairs, that the UK should speak with one voice in fisheries negotiations.
Katy Clark (North Ayrshire and Arran) (Lab)
What discussions has the Minister had with the Under-Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, the hon. Member for Newbury (Richard Benyon) about tradeable quotas to ensure that they are not taken advantage of by multinationals who use the UK as a flag of convenience?
David Mundell
I am sure that the Under-Secretary will have understood the hon. Lady’s point. She, like me, will welcome the fact that there will be a Backbench Business Committee debate on fisheries next week.
Fiona O'Donnell (East Lothian) (Lab)
10. What discussions he has had with the Scottish Government on the level of unemployment in Scotland.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland (David Mundell)
My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State and I are in regular contact with John Swinney, the Scottish Minister responsible for employment, about unemployment in Scotland. Scottish Government officials and agencies have been involved in all the employment seminars that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has held over the past six months.
Fiona O'Donnell
Will the Minister tell the people in my constituency who have lost their jobs since he got his job whether unemployment is a price worth paying for a deficit reduction plan that is choking off growth and raising Government debt?
David Mundell
I tell the hon. Lady to be slightly less predictable and finally to take some responsibility for the situation in which her Government left this country, including the biggest peacetime deficit in our history.
Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
Unemployment in Kintyre could be reduced if the community bid to take over the former RAF base at Machrihanish goes ahead. I hope that the Ministry of Defence will make a contribution towards making the water supply fit for purpose, so that the community’s bid is viable. Will the Minister please encourage the MOD to do so?
David Mundell
I am happy to meet my hon. Friend and take forward his concerns with the MOD.
Mrs Anne McGuire (Stirling) (Lab)
Will the Minister take responsibility for something that his Government have done? This morning, House of Commons figures show that youth unemployment in my constituency has risen by 218.2%. What is he going to tell the young people of Stirling that the Government have done over the past 18 months?
David Mundell
The right hon. Lady knows that youth unemployment rose under the Labour Government too. It is a serious issue, and it should not be the subject of party politicking. We should all work together to resolve youth unemployment.
Dr Julian Huppert (Cambridge) (LD)
Q1. If he will list his official engagements for Wednesday 9 November.
The Prime Minister (Mr David Cameron)
I am sure that the whole House will wish to join me in paying tribute to Private Matthew Haseldin from 2nd Battalion the Mercian Regiment. Despite being in the Army only a short time, he had already proved himself to be a dedicated and courageous soldier. He has made the ultimate sacrifice for the safety of the British people, and we should send our deepest condolences to his family and friends. This week, we will, of course, pause to remember all those who have lost their lives in defence of our country, so that we can enjoy peace and freedom, and we are humbled by their sacrifice.
This morning, I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others, and in addition to my duties in the House, I shall have further such meetings later today.
Dr Huppert
May I add my tribute to the Prime Minister’s about the sad death of Private Matthew Haseldin from 2nd Battalion the Mercian Regiment, especially with Remembrance Sunday so near?
The Prime Minister is rightly concerned about jobs and growth. Crucial to that is consumer confidence. Does he think that telling 25 million workers that they have no job security and can be fired at will tomorrow will boost or reduce consumer confidence?
The Prime Minister
Clearly, we have to make it easier for firms to hire people. That is why we have scrapped Labour’s jobs tax, taken 1 million of the lowest-paid people out of tax, established new rules so that someone can go to a tribunal only after working somewhere for two years, and introduced fees for claims in employment tribunals to stop vexatious claims. Added to that, we are investing in the Work programme and apprenticeships—all as a way of helping to give young people jobs.
Edward Miliband (Doncaster North) (Lab)
May I join the Prime Minister in paying tribute to Private Matthew Haseldin from 2nd Battalion the Mercian Regiment? He showed immense courage trying to protect local people, and our thoughts are with his family and friends. With troops serving in conflict overseas, it is even more important that this weekend, on Remembrance Sunday, we honour all those who have served our country and who are serving our country today.
Will the Prime Minister tell us how many people entered the UK under the Home Secretary’s relaxed border controls?
The Prime Minister
The figures for the period between August 2010 and August 2011 for the number of people who entered the country are published in the normal way. The figures that I have are these: the number of people arrested was up by 10%, the number of drug seizures was markedly up, and the number of firearms seizures was up by 100%. However, we should be clear about what did, and what did not, happen here. First, the Home Secretary agreed a pilot for a more targeted approach to border control. This was for people within the European economic area, and it allowed better targeting of high-risk people and less for others, notably children. This did not compromise security. It was an operational decision, but one that I fully back, and which I think she was right to take.
Secondly and importantly, however, decisions were taken to extend that beyond EEA nationals. That was not authorised by the Home Secretary. Indeed, when specific permission was asked for, it was not granted. This did not mean that our borders were left undefended, and passports continued to be checked, but because this was unauthorised action—as it was contrary to what she agreed—it was right that the head of the border force was suspended. I back that action completely.
Edward Miliband
It is just not good enough. The Prime Minister cannot tell us how many people—how many millions of people—were let in under the relaxed border controls agreed by the Home Secretary. Is it not totally unacceptable that the Home Secretary chose to relax border controls in July, but, even yesterday, could not tell us which airports and ports that applied to, how many took it up and for how long?
The Prime Minister
The Home Secretary provided those figures, and the figures are as follows: firearms, 100% increase in seizures; illegal immigrants, 10% increase in arrests; forged documents, 48% increase. But the simple fact that the right hon. Gentleman—and, I think, everyone—has to accept is this. The head of the UK Border Agency, Rob Whiteman, who also did not know that such unauthorised action was taking place, said this, and it is very important for the House to understand it:
“Brodie Clark admitted to me on November 2 that on a number of occasions this year he authorised his staff to go further than ministerial instruction. I therefore suspended him from his duties. In my opinion it was right for officials to have recommended the pilot so that we focus attention on higher risks to our border, but it is unacceptable that one of my senior officials went further than was approved.”
That is why Brodie Clark was suspended, and that is why the Home Secretary backed that decision, but it is important to understand that he was suspended by the head of the UK Border Agency. It was a decision quite rightly taken by him—backed by the Home Secretary, backed by me.
Edward Miliband
Isn’t it utterly typical? When things go wrong, it is nothing to do with them—[Interruption.]
Mr Speaker
Order. Before the right hon. Gentleman continues, let me just emphasise this: there are Members on both sides of the House shouting their heads off. Members of the Youth Parliament last Friday—[Interruption.] Order. Members of the Youth Parliament spoke brilliantly and passionately disagreed with each other, but they did not shout at each other.
Edward Miliband
What did the Home Secretary say in the past, when she was in opposition and things went wrong on immigration? She said this:
“I’m sick and tired of…government ministers…who simply blame other people when things go wrong.”
The Prime Minister said yesterday, in his evidence to the Liaison Committee about the relaxation of border controls over the past few months, that
“clearly this is not acceptable and it is not acceptable it went on for so long.”
Why did the Home Secretary allow it to happen?
The Prime Minister
The right hon. Gentleman cannot on the one hand blame me for not taking responsibility and then quote very clearly my words taking responsibility and saying what is not acceptable. We are having a lecture on responsibility from a party that trebled immigration, let an extra 2.2 million people into our country, allowed everyone from eastern Europe to come here with no transitional controls, built up a backlog of half a million asylum claims, and made no apology about it. Even today, when the Leader of the Opposition was asked whether too many people were let into this country, his answer was a very simple no.
Edward Miliband
The right hon. Gentleman has been Prime Minister for 18 months. He cannot keep saying that it is nothing to do with him; it is his responsibility. One month ago he gave a speech on border controls called “Reclaiming our Borders”, but while he was boasting about reclaiming our borders, his Home Secretary was busy relaxing our borders. Does the Prime Minister not think that he should at least have known?
The Prime Minister
The pilot that the Home Secretary introduced meant more arrests, more firearms seized and more forged documents found. That is the truth of it. The fact is that officials went further than Home Office Ministers authorised. That is what is wrong, and that is why someone had to be suspended—and that was the right decision.
The right hon. Gentleman asked what we have done. Let me tell him. We are completing e-Borders, so that by next April every flight from outside the EU will be checked; we are creating the National Crime Agency, with the dedicated border police; in the first six months, we seized more drugs than in the whole of last year; and last year we rejected 400,000 visa applications and turned away 68,000 people without the correct documents. I am determined that we have tough border controls, and finally we have a Home Office and an Immigration Minister who actually want to cut immigration.
Edward Miliband
Anyone listening to the Prime Minister would think that his policy has been a great success. It is a fiasco—a complete fiasco. The one thing that he cannot claim to know nothing about is cuts to the UK border force. Can he now confirm how many UK border staff are going to be cut under his Government?
The Prime Minister
By the end of this Parliament there will be 18,000 people working for the UK Border Agency—the same number as were working for it in 2006, when the right hon. Gentleman was sitting in the Treasury and determining the budgets. He asks about what we have done on immigration in 18 months in office. Let me tell him. We have introduced the first ever limit on work visas from outside the European Union. We have stopped more than 470 colleges from bringing in bogus foreign students. We have cut student visas by 70,000. Anyone who comes here to get married has to speak English. We are ending automatic settlement rights and stopping the nonsense of people misusing the Human Rights Act. In 18 months we have done more to control immigration than he did in 13 years.
Edward Miliband
The truth is, it is a fiasco and the Prime Minister knows it. That is the reality. It is a pattern with this Government: broken promises, gross incompetence, blame everybody else. He is an out-of-touch Prime Minister leading a shambolic Government.
The Prime Minister
As ever, the right hon. Gentleman just completely lost his way. I think he should spend a little more time listening to the author of “blue Labour”, Lord Glasman, who said:
“Labour lied…about the extent of immigration”.
Where is the apology?
Mr Gary Streeter (South West Devon) (Con)
Q2. On Friday, 3 Commando Brigade will be marching through the streets of Plymouth on their homecoming parade after a successful but costly tour of duty in Afghanistan. I know that the Prime Minister will be with us in spirit, but will he send a message of support today to those brave and very professional Royal Marines, of whom we are all so very proud?
The Prime Minister
I will certainly join my hon. Friend in doing that. I know that the whole of the south-west—and the whole country—is incredibly proud of the Marines, and we are proud of 3 Commando Brigade, who will be marching through Plymouth. I send my very best wishes for the homecoming parade, and we should also put on record what they have achieved in Task Force Helmand. They carried out 37,000 patrols, found more than 400 improvised explosive devices and trained more than 1,300 Afghan uniformed police patrolmen. They have made a real difference to the safety and security of that country, and to the safety of our country too.
Lindsay Roy (Glenrothes) (Lab)
Q3. Does the Prime Minister think it right and proper or in any way defensible that the Royal Bank of Scotland, which received a massive bail-out during the crisis, should be paying out more than £500 million in bonuses this year?
The Prime Minister
No, I do not think it is acceptable. RBS has not yet set its figures for bonus payments. The British Government are a seriously large shareholder in RBS, and we will be making our views known.
Mr Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con)
In joining me in giving our condolences to the relatives of the Red Arrows pilot killed at RAF Scampton yesterday, will the Prime Minister acknowledge the overriding need for safety? Our campaign to save RAF Scampton from closure is based not just on sentiment for the historic home of the Dambusters, but on the overriding need for the safe uncluttered skies above north Lincolnshire that the Red Arrows need to practise safely.
The Prime Minister
I am sure that the hearts of everyone in this House go out to the family of the pilot who was killed in that terrible accident, which comes on top of a second accident that happened in the Red Arrows. This has obviously been a tragic time for something that the whole country reveres and loves, and I know that the Red Arrows’ home in Lincolnshire is extremely important to them. We must get to the bottom of what happened, and I totally understand why my hon. Friend wants to stand up for the air base in his constituency.
Gordon Banks (Ochil and South Perthshire) (Lab)
Q4. The trade unions yesterday published data showing that Clackmannanshire in my constituency has seen the largest growth in youth unemployment in this country. Given that we will not have the opportunity to question the Prime Minister on unemployment numbers next week, will he tell me why he is letting young people down in my constituency?
The Prime Minister
Obviously we face a difficult situation with unemployment, including among young people, right across the country, and we need to do everything we can to help people back into work. That is why there is record investment going into apprenticeships and the Work programme. However, the real need is to grow the private sector, because, frankly, this is a time when whoever was in government would have to make reductions in the public sector. The hon. Gentleman shakes his head, but any Government would have to do that: look across Europe at the reductions that are having to be made. We need to get the private sector growing, which is what this Government are focused on.
Peter Aldous (Waveney) (Con)
Q5. Developing the considerable potential for jobs in the energy sector is central to economic recovery in my constituency, as is providing local people with the skills to take on those jobs. Will the Prime Minister ensure that the Government do all they can to fund the completion of the newly opened Pakefield high school in Lowestoft, which will play such an important role in skilling young people in a deprived area?
The Prime Minister
My hon. Friend makes an important point about the skills that that local school will bring. This year Suffolk has an extra £33 million in capital funds. It is obviously for the local authority to decide how to spend that money, but school capital available throughout this spending round and this Parliament amounts to £15.9 billion, so money is there for important school projects.
Mr Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) (DUP)
Q6. This weekend the nation will pause to remember, paying tribute to our war dead. At cenotaphs across the nation, we will pay homage to the men and women who have made the supreme sacrifice in conflicts down through the years. Does the Prime Minister agree that where there is a desire to display that tribute in an entirely non-partisan way, whether in shops, schools, churches or on football tops, it should be not only allowed, but positively promoted?
The Prime Minister
I completely agree with the hon. Gentleman, and sense that the entire House does too. It is a remarkable achievement of the Royal British Legion and the country as a whole that we have reintroduced over past years the sense of the silence taking place at the 11th hour of the 11th day, which is absolutely right. It is particularly appropriate in Northern Ireland, where so many people have served so bravely in our armed forces. Indeed, whenever I visit the Royal Irish Regiment, I am always struck by how many people from both sides of the border have served so bravely in our armed forces.
Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con)
Q7. Less family breakdown would reduce the costs loaded on to our economy, so will the Prime Minister encourage health authorities throughout the country to take part in “Care for the Families: Let’s Stick Together” pilots, when health visitors and volunteer parents offer relationship support to new parents in the early years of their family life, which is when half of all break-ups occur?
The Prime Minister
My hon. Friend has a great record in pushing forward that absolutely vital idea. It is a tragic fact that so many couples break up after the arrival of the first child because of all the stresses and strains that can bring. That is dreadful for those couples and dreadful for those children. We spend a huge amount as a country dealing with the problems of social breakdown; in my view we should spend more on trying to help to keep families together. Relationship advice and support, as he says, is absolutely vital in that.
Mark Durkan (Foyle) (SDLP)
Q8. On Friday the UN Security Council will consider the democratically conveyed Palestinian request for full membership of the UN. Might not the international community do more to advance the prospect of a two-state solution by doing more to create a two-state process? In that context, will he ensure that the UK representative casts a positive vote on Friday, and does not go for the cop-out of abstention?
The Prime Minister
My right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary will make a full statement to the House on this issue in a few moments, but let me say this: the British Government are fully behind the two-state solution, but I profoundly believe that we will get that not through declarations and processes at the UN, but through the two potential states—Israel and Palestine—sitting down and negotiating. All our efforts should go towards helping to make that happen.
Tessa Munt (Wells) (LD)
Q9. If he will make it his policy to endorse the Somerset Community Foundation’s 2011 Surviving Winter appeal.
The Prime Minister
The winter fuel payment provides valuable help to millions of people with paying their fuel bills. Individuals are of course free to donate their payment to a charity if they wish, but it must be a decision for them.
Tessa Munt
I thank the Prime Minister for that question. I would like him to congratulate Peter Wyman of the Somerset Community Foundation on having the brilliant idea of people donating some or all of their winter fuel allowance to those who need it most. Would the Government consider enabling such donations by including an option in the letter sent out about the allowance to allow an automatic donation to the Surviving Winter appeal?
The Prime Minister
I shall certainly look at that suggestion, but it is important to keep the promises that we made to Britain’s pensioners about keeping up the winter fuel payments and cold weather payments. I would not want to see any unnecessary pressure put on people to do something that might not be in their own best interests.
Chris Leslie (Nottingham East) (Lab/Co-op)
Q10. The operational instruction from the UK Border Agency on 20 July says:“We will cease routinely opening the chips within EEA passports…checking under 18-year-olds against the warning index”.Did anyone in the Home Office clear that document? Given the conflicting stories between the Home Secretary’s officials and her own version, will the Prime Minister publish all the ministerial instructions to the UKBA?
The Prime Minister
The hon. Gentleman is trying desperately to make up the ground lost by his party leader, but I am afraid that he has rather lost the House in the process. The point is that an inquiry will be carried out by the independent chief inspector of the Border Agency—the very person who found out what was going wrong in terms of operations undertaking that did not have the permission of Ministers, and all these issues will be aired.
Tracey Crouch (Chatham and Aylesford) (Con)
On Christmas day 1914, British and German troops put down their weapons and played a football match in no man’s land. The following day, the bloody hostilities resumed. Today, we wear the poppy in remembrance of our war dead. Will the Prime Minister join me in condemning the outrageous decision by FIFA to refuse the home nations’ request to wear the poppy on their shirts this weekend as a simple mark of respect and remembrance?
The Prime Minister
My hon. Friend speaks not only for the whole House but for the whole country in being completely baffled—and, frankly, angry—at the decision made by FIFA. If teams want to put the poppy on their shirts, as many teams do in our football league, they should be able to do so at national level, whether it is the English team or the Welsh team. This is an appalling decision, and I hope that FIFA will reconsider it.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
Q11. As poverty is rising, the Prime Minister is removing the requirement for people to register to vote in Britain, thereby removing millions of people’s right to vote. Is he not taking their money with one hand and taking their votes with another? Is it not a grotesque distortion of democracy to force austerity measures on the most vulnerable while removing their voting power?
The Prime Minister
The point that I would make to the hon. Gentleman is that we are introducing individual voter registration, which is a Labour policy, so he should be welcoming it. I can understand why he does not necessarily support the idea of making all constituencies the same size, because his constituency has only 62,000 people in it, whereas his right hon. Friend the Member for East Ham (Stephen Timms) represents 91,000 people. I think that it is a basic act of fairness to have seats the same size. It was a demand of the Chartists in the 1840s, and I think that it is time we introduced it.
Annette Brooke (Mid Dorset and North Poole) (LD)
Q12. Is the Prime Minister aware of the growing evidence of the increase in abuse, intimidation and harassment on park home sites across the country? Tackling those problems needs political will, not a large sum of money. Will he address the issues urgently, so that vulnerable park homers get the protection that they need and deserve as soon as possible?
The Prime Minister
The hon. Lady raises an important point. I have had constituency cases myself in which people have been treated very badly by park home owners. There are some extremely good park home owners, who not only obey the rules but demonstrate responsibility and compassion, but there are some who do not. We are committed to providing a better deal for park home residents by improving their rights and increasing protection against bad site owners. I will arrange for her to have a meeting with the Housing Minister so that they can discuss this urgent action.
Hazel Blears (Salford and Eccles) (Lab)
In these difficult economic times, it is even more important for our politics to be in touch with the people we represent. Will the Prime Minister therefore welcome the first people to be successful in getting places on the Speaker’s parliamentary placement scheme, who are with us here today? They are inspiring individuals who would never normally have the chance to work in politics. Will he agree to meet them and listen to their views on the relevance of the issues today, and perhaps on how we are all doing in our politics?
The Prime Minister
I would certainly join the right hon. Lady in the point she makes. She has made a huge amount of impact on this issue of social mobility, of wanting to help people who have not had good chances in life. I applaud her for that. If there is time in my busy diary, I will certainly do as she says. I think there is an important opportunity for everyone in this House to look at organisations like the Social Mobility Foundation that provide opportunities for interns from inner city schools to come and have the experience of working here in Parliament. I have used this scheme, as have other members of the Cabinet, and I think it is an excellent scheme to give people a really good chance to see what we do in this place—not just on Wednesday at 12 o’clock, but more broadly.
Karen Lumley (Redditch) (Con)
Q13. Does my right hon. Friend think it right for hon. Members to take instruction from the GMB about how to vote on amendments?
The Prime Minister
My hon. Friend raises a serious issue—[Interruption.] I can hear, and I can sense, a bit of resistance, which is perhaps not surprising when 85% of Labour’s money comes from the trade unions. When we discuss legislation in this House, we should be bringing our judgment, our ideas and our arguments, not just picking up a tired old brief from a trade union.
Cathy Jamieson (Kilmarnock and Loudoun) (Lab/Co-op)
Q14. In my constituency of Kilmarnock and Loudoun there are over 3,000 people claiming jobseeker’s allowance, but the latest figures show that there were only 300 job vacancies available. Jobs are being lost in the public sector and the private sector. How high does unemployment have to go before the Prime Minister will accept that his economic policies are simply not working?
The Prime Minister
Unemployment is too high today, and I want to see it come down from its already high levels. What we have to do to make that happen is to put resources into the apprenticeship scheme and into the Work programme to make sure that we do all the things that help businesses to employ people. That is what this Government are doing. We are cutting corporation tax, introducing enterprise zones and doing everything we can to help businesses. We will do that in the hon. Lady’s constituency and throughout the country.
Joseph Johnson (Orpington) (Con)
Italian bond yields have jumped this morning by more than a percentage point to an unsustainable 8.1%. Could the Prime Minister please say what eurozone leaders must now do to stop the contagion?
The Prime Minister
My hon. Friend makes an important point. If you do not have credibility about your plans to deal with your debts and deal with your deficits, whether you like the markets or not, they will not lend you any money. That is what we are seeing in countries like Greece and now, tragically, in Italy, where the price of borrowing money is reaching a totally unsustainable level. It is a lesson for all of us to have sustainable plans to get on top of our debt and our deficits. In terms of Europe, the problem of contagion is that as we agree a decisive write-down of Greek debt, people inevitably start asking questions about other countries. As that happens, you need to have in place the biggest possible firewall. That is what the European Financial Stability Facility is all about, and eurozone leaders urgently need to put flesh on the bones and put figures on the size of that firewall, to stop this contagion going any further.
Andrew Gwynne (Denton and Reddish) (Lab)
Q15. Last year youth unemployment in Tameside stood at an unacceptable 20%—one in five. Today it stands at 34%, which is shocking. In light of that, does the Prime Minister still believe that the decision to scrap the future jobs fund was the right one?
The Prime Minister
Let me just make the point that under Labour youth unemployment went up by 40%—and the evidence that we received on coming into government was that the future jobs fund was three or four times more expensive than other job creation schemes. Indeed, in many parts of the country, including in the west midlands, the percentage of future jobs fund jobs that were in the private sector was as low as 2% or 3%. It was right to scrap the future jobs fund and put in its place apprenticeships, the Work programme and work experience that will make a difference to young people.
Alec Shelbrooke (Elmet and Rothwell) (Con)
War is a failure of politics. The people who go to war are not politicians; they are brave service people who die in the service of their country. May I urge my right hon. Friend to write to FIFA to point out that the poppy is not a political symbol but a symbol that says that we respect the sacrifice that people have made on behalf of their countries?
The Prime Minister
I will certainly do as my hon. Friend suggests. I think that it is a question not just of writing to FIFA, but of asking its membership bodies, including the Football Association, to take a strong line. As my hon. Friend says, this is not an issue of left or right, Labour or Conservative. We all wear the poppy with pride, even if we do not approve of the wars in which people were fighting. We do it to honour the fact that those people sacrificed their lives for us. It is absolutely vital for FIFA to understand that, and I think that a clear message from the House and the Government can make it think again.
Sir Stuart Bell (Middlesbrough) (Lab)
Given that Italy is now on what the Prime Minister has described as a “credible fiscal path”, will he help the Group of Twenty’s Finance Ministers to meet and contribute to the creation of a European financial stability pact in a way that will assist the eurozone?
The Prime Minister
The hon. Gentleman has made an important point. However, the first responsibility for building the bail-out fund must lie with the eurozone members. As we said in the House on Monday, the problem at the G20 is that the G20, the International Monetary Fund and countries such as Britain cannot be asked to do things that the eurozone members are not themselves prepared to do.
We do stand ready to boost the IMF, we do want to help countries in distress, and we do not want to see our trading partners collapse. We understand that, even though we do not support membership of the euro, if countries fall out of the euro it could be very painful for our economy. However, it is for the eurozone countries to sort out the problems. It is their currency.
Mr William Cash (Stone) (Con)
In reply to my hon. Friend the Member for Orpington (Joseph Johnson), the Prime Minister referred to a firewall in relation to the bail-outs. Does he accept that what we really need is structural renegotiation of the treaties, given the impact that this is having on the United Kingdom? If I may use a cricketing analogy of which the Prime Minister will be aware, he would not be sent in with a broken bat. He would be sent in with a new bat, and with a united Conservative team behind him.
The Prime Minister
There is a long history in my party of cricketing metaphors and Europe ending unhappily, so I will not necessarily follow my hon. Friend down that path. What I will say is that we will defend the national interest. When there was a treaty change in the European Council we got something back for Britain, which was the ability to get out of the EU bail-out fund. If there are future treaty changes—some European countries are pushing for them—we will make sure that we achieve a good deal for Britain and protect our national interests.