Oral Answers to Questions

Michael Gove Excerpts

Thursday 25th March 2021 Commons Chamber

[Martin Vickers (Cleethorpes) (Con)]

What steps the Government are taking to move civil service jobs from London to Lincolnshire.

[The Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster and Minister for the Cabinet Office (Michael Gove)]

As the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, naturally, my heart is always in the north-west of England. However, I am delighted that more civil service jobs will be moving to York. I am also delighted that other Departments have made their own announcements about the relocation of senior positions in our civil service, with the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government announcing plans to create a second headquarters in Wolverhampton, the Treasury creating an economic campus in Darlington, alongside the Department for International Trade, and, of course, DIT has established trade and investment hubs in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. The Cabinet Office has also announced that our second headquarters will be located in Glasgow, with 500 officials to be located there, and the Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office has established a joint headquarters in east Kilbride with 1,000 new roles relocating to Scotland.

[Rachael Maskell [V]]

First came the promise on the House of Lords, then it was the northern Government hub, then some Cabinet Office jobs, with hopes raised and then dashed in York—one of the worst hit economies from covid-19, yet one of the best connected northern cities, with a brownfield site adjacent to the station and full of people eager to serve. Will the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster set out the framework within which his Government determine which locations are recipients of central Government jobs, resources and projects across the piece, so that we can all understand whether transparency or cronyism is driving this Government? And exactly how many jobs will York get?

[Michael Gove]

Transparency drives everything that the Government do—that and a commitment to levelling up and ensuring that our Union is stronger. That is why we are moving jobs to Glasgow, a beautiful city that, sadly, has not flourished as it might have done under the Scottish Government’s stewardship over the course of the last 14 years. It is also why we are moving jobs to York, the city that the hon. Lady so ably represents alongside my hon. Friend the Member for York Outer (Julian Sturdy). We will be increasing the number of Cabinet Office jobs in York by 50% in the coming months, and it is not just the Cabinet Office; other Government jobs will be coming to York as well, because, as she rightly points out, its transport connectivity, its historical connections and its potential for brownfield renovation all make it a superb site for investment.

[Giles Watling [V]]

I thank my right hon. Friend for his earlier answer. Moving Government Departments to the provinces is a fantastic initiative, but I implore him not to forget the southern coast. We may be near to London, but we have deprivation and we need the benefit of civil service jobs in our area. I ask him to give us in Clacton serious consideration.

[Michael Gove]

Thanks to my hon. Friend, I never give Clacton anything other than serious consideration. Clacton, Frinton and the communities that he so ably represents contain talented people who have a contribution to make, and of course we will do everything possible, not necessarily by relocating civil service departments to that part of Essex, but by ensuring that there are opportunities through apprenticeships and the civil service fast stream, to ensure that talented young people in Essex have an opportunity, like him, to serve.

[Sarah Atherton [V]]

The Minister may know that Hollywood has bought into Wrexham football club, and seeing as our American friends are investing in Wrexham, may I ask the Government to consider doing likewise? We already have the much welcome promise of office relocations to the north of England, so will he make such a commitment to north-east Wales? Will he consider Wrexham, the gateway to Snowdon, with its skilled workforce, business-minded council and easy transport links to Liverpool, Manchester and London, as a candidate for some levelling-up relocation?

[Michael Gove]

My hon. Friend is a brilliant advocate for Wrexham, and an economic renaissance is taking place across north Wales from Dolgellau to Wrexham, ably assisted by the brilliant advocacy of new Conservative MPs such as my hon. Friend and her colleagues. The Government want to get behind that, not just by ensuring that our new levelling up fund can provide additional resources for local authorities and businesses in north Wales, but by ensuring that we can have senior decision makers relocated to north Wales—whether that is in Wrexham, Bangor, Prestatyn, Rhyl or other locations that are still to be decided. Of course, the case that she makes for Wrexham is a formidable one, and one that has been heard in the Cabinet Office and, indeed, in No. 10.

[Martin Vickers]

In the recent bidding process for freeports, the port of Immingham in my constituency came out top, scoring high in every category. May I suggest to my right hon. Friend that moving the civil servants who oversee the freeport operation to one of the Humber ports—preferably Immingham—would be a good move?

[Michael Gove]

My hon. Friend makes an important case. Overall responsibility for freeports rests with Her Majesty’s Treasury, and my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer has made clear his commitment to ensuring that civil service and other decision-making jobs are relocated effectively across the UK, with the establishment of a second campus in Darlington in Teesside—something that has been done in partnership with the outstanding Mayor of the Tees Valley, Ben Houchen. Of course, there is a concentration of expertise in Humberside, both in north Lincolnshire and the East Riding of Yorkshire, not just in commerce but in renewables, and we will do everything we can to ensure that that expertise is supported by Government.

[Steve McCabe (Birmingham, Selly Oak) (Lab)]

What assessment he has made of the effect of the covid-19 outbreak on the completion of the 2021 census.

--- Later in debate ---

[Chris Law (Dundee West) (SNP)]

How much his Department has spent on native advertising in UK newspapers since the end of the transition period.

[The Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster and Minister for the Cabinet Office (Michael Gove)]

It is very difficult to follow that, Mr Speaker.

We recognise that newspapers are the lifeblood of communities, and we have negotiated an unprecedented partnership with the newspaper industry. Since 1 January, paid advertising has appeared in up to 600 newspapers across the UK, including 60 titles predominantly directed towards ethnic minority communities. We have also supported 105 Scottish titles that reach 3.3 million people—over half the population of Scotland.

Regional and local newspapers received at least 60% of the funding allocated from January to March 2021. All the titles in the press partnership have been selected independently by the media planning and buying agency OmniGov. We publish spending on gov.uk monthly as part of routine Government transparency arrangements, and we regularly review the cost-effectiveness of that spend against audience surveys, focus groups and operational data.

[Kenny MacAskill [V]]

Food producers and manufacturers in East Lothian are in despair at the additional costs, paperwork and procedures brought about by Brexit, costing orders and threatening jobs. Would the Minister care to pay for an advert in the East Lothian Courier setting out the facts of Brexit, not the fiction that has been promoted in other paid outlets and adverts?

[Michael Gove]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for raising that. Not only would I be happy to pay for an advertisement in the East Lothian Courier; I would be happy to come to Haddington to support Craig Hoy, the excellent Scottish Conservative and Unionist candidate standing in the Scottish parliamentary elections, who will be a strong voice for East Lothian in Holyrood, just as the hon. Gentleman is here in Westminster.

[Martyn Day [V]]

In Government-sponsored ads on the alleged success of Brexit, the same three or four companies have been highlighted in at least 16 newspapers throughout the UK. Are these the only companies that the Government could actually find that would be willing to discuss the benefits of Brexit?

[Michael Gove]

No, there is a limitless list, and I could take up the rest of the day by running through all the businesses and all the business people who believe that the Government’s approach is right. One thing I would not be able to do, however, is to find many businesses that would be prepared to endorse the reckless approach towards a second independence referendum that the Scottish National party is pushing. I cannot think of a single reputable business voice that thinks the priority for Scotland now is constitutional uncertainty and wrenching Scotland out of the partnership for good that is the Union.

[Mr Speaker]

Let us go to Chris Law. That is not Chris Law. I do not care what anybody says, that is definitely not Chris Law—in which case, I am going to go to spokesperson Stewart Hosie.

[Stewart Hosie (Dundee East) (SNP)]

In relation to these native adverts regarding the so-called benefits of Brexit, the Advertising Standards Authority says that

“Marketing communications must be obviously identifiable as such”

and that marketers—in this case, the UK Government—

“must make clear that advertorials are marketing communications”.

Some newspapers do say “Ad features sponsored by the UK Government.” Others say, “in conjunction” or “in association”, which is less clear. Many simply say “sponsored” but not who by, and at least one newspaper describes the UK Government—the marketer—as a “contributor”. Why have the Government, as the marketer, chosen to flout the ASA code in this way?

[Michael Gove]

I have been furnished with no evidence of any flouting of the code. Of course if there are any complaints that have been raised by readers or citizens, we will of course investigate them. But it is the case that the Scottish Government themselves, entirely understandably, devote tens of thousands of pounds of taxpayer money to also furnishing content in newspapers such as The Press and Journal, The Courier and even a newspaper called The National, which I understand has some popularity among some communities in Scotland.

[Stewart Hosie]

There are many examples of what I am talking about, and the Government do not know them. That the Minister does not know is to his shame. Rule 7.2 of the ASA code makes it clear that:

“Marketing communications by central…government…are subject to the Code”

and rule 3.5 says:

“Marketing communications must not materially mislead by omitting the identity of the marketer.”

So let me ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, in terms of the code: why have the UK Government, by omitting their own name, chosen to mislead the public?

[Michael Gove]

I am very happy to put my own name and that of the UK Government to all of this material, and I am also proud of the contribution that we have made to supporting independent press and media titles across Scotland. It is vital, as we move towards the Holyrood elections, that we have a strong and vital independent press and that newspapers such as the Glasgow Herald, The Press and Journal, the Dundee Courier and others should hold the Scottish Government to account for what has been happening over the last 14 years.

[Mr Speaker]

Let us go back to Chris Law.

[Chris Law [V]]

Good morning, Mr Speaker, and I also hope that the same press hold the UK Government to account. Does the Minister not agree that the fact that the UK Government need to buy news stories to promote Brexit, rather than relying on companies to share their success themselves, is a sign that Brexit is an utterly failing project?

[Michael Gove]

No, I would not say that. I have a great deal of respect and affection for the hon. Member, and that is why the work that we do in advertising in these titles is work that we do in conjunction with the devolved Administrations. We work with them in order to make sure that we are placing content appropriately, not least of course to help people keep safe during the covid pandemic. The Scottish Government of course also devote money themselves to advertising and supporting newspapers—quite right too; that is something that is appropriate at this time. Of course, he and I will disagree on certain policy questions, but on the broad point about keeping our media live and vital, I know that on that at least we are at one.

[Matt Vickers (Stockton South) (Con)]

If he will make a statement on his departmental responsibilities.

[The Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster and Minister for the Cabinet Office (Michael Gove)]

I would like to place on record my thanks to Lord Dunlop—Andrew Dunlop—for the report that he completed into strengthening institutions across our United Kingdom and, in particular, strengthening intergovernmental relations. It is a great report. Many of its recommendations the Government are already implementing. I commend it to the House, and I also commend Lord Dunlop’s selfless work to this House. He is the very model of a public servant.

[Rachel Reeves (Leeds West) (Lab)]

The ministerial code makes it clear how important the Independent Adviser on Ministers’ Interests is, yet the post has remained unfilled since November last year, when Sir Alex Allan resigned on principle. Transparency International believes that, last year alone, there were a potential nine breaches of the ministerial code—I can share the information with the right hon. Gentleman. So can he advise the House when the unfilled post of Independent Adviser on Ministers’ Interests will be filled, and what guarantee can he give the House that this time, the Prime Minister will actually listen to their advice?

[Michael Gove]

The hon. Lady makes an important point. First, may I place on record my thanks to Sir Alex Allan for his contribution both in that role and previously in public service? We are seeking to find someone who is suitably independent, experienced and authoritative for this critical role. I would be delighted to work with the hon. Lady to ensure that the broadest possible range of candidates can be identified, and that whoever is put forward for that role can appropriately be scrutinised by the House to ensure that we can satisfy ourselves about their appropriateness for the role.

[Rachel Reeves]

It has been four months. A good way to find someone might be to advertise the position and seek a candidate. Let me tell the right hon. Gentleman why this is so important. The Independent Adviser on Ministers’ Interests is responsible for producing the list of Ministers’ financial interests, including those of the Prime Minister. Page 16, paragraph 7.5 of the ministerial code, states that

“a statement covering relevant Ministers’ interests will be published twice yearly”

to avoid any conflicts of interest at the heart of Government. That list was published only once last year, in July, and there has been nothing at all since then. So can the Minister advise the House when that overdue list of Ministers’ financial interests will be published? If he cannot give us that date, should we conclude that the Government are deliberately delaying this to avoid much-needed scrutiny of this Government?

[Michael Gove]

No, not at all. As I am sure the hon. Lady is aware, it is the case that every Minister complies with all the expectations placed on them, not just by the ministerial code but by the Nolan principles on standards in public life. It is also the case that Ministers are transparent about the areas that she correctly identifies as of public interest.

[Mr William Wragg (Hazel Grove) (Con)]

Does my right hon. Friend still agree with himself in his opposition to covid vaccine certification to attend the pub, as he expressed on Sky News recently?

[Michael Gove]

Consistency is often the hobgoblin of small minds, but my view on this issue is consistent. A system that relied purely on vaccination would not be appropriate, but what would be right was a system that ensured that we can open up our economy to the maximum extent, that takes account of vaccine status, but also recent test status and potentially antibody status. But the best thing to do is to be guided by scientific and clinical advice and then to subject that advice to proper, rigorous, ethical questioning, rather than taking an instant, off-the-shelf, instinctive approach.

[Kate Hollern (Blackburn) (Lab) [V]]

  It is important that the Government have the right priorities in these difficult times. But what does it say about the Prime Minister’s priorities that, while he is spending up to £200,000 refurbishing his flat, he is telling NHS nurses that they should receive a real-terms pay cut?

[Michael Gove]

I cannot see the merit in that juxtaposition, but I do see merit in ensuring that the independent advisory body on public sector pay, which governs the NHS, should consider all the evidence. All Members of the House should make clear our solidarity, respect and admiration for those who work on the NHS frontline.

[Robbie Moore (Keighley) (Con)]

I recently met PFF, a fantastic, independent, family-run business in Keighley, which last year diversified and produced personal protective equipment, manufacturing over 360 million aprons for our frontline staff. It is also a proud member of the Made in Britain campaign. Can my right hon. Friend assure me that the Government will do all they can to support British businesses such as PFF which have adapted to help the NHS, and that all procurement will be British-focused where it can be?

[Michael Gove]

I thank my hon. Friend for reminding us that Yorkshire is the home of ingenuity, enterprise and creativity when it comes to responding to all sorts of crises and challenges. In Keighley, the success of the business that he identifies is one that we should all seek to emulate. He points out that sometimes companies that have been strong in one area can adjust over time to produce other products such as PPE. Some people on the Opposition side of the House have sometimes said, “This company doesn’t have a track record, so there must be something sniffy about its producing PPE.” They seem not to understand that savvy, smart Yorkshire business people can actually adapt their business models to help this country at particular times. It is called the free market, and it exemplifies the best of British and the best of Yorkshire.

[Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab) [V]]

Further to earlier questions about basing civil service jobs in the regions, I am sure the Chancellor recalls that, in his previous Cabinet role, he very clearly committed to basing the new Office for Environmental Protection in Bristol. Would he like to take the opportunity to apologise to the people of Bristol for not delivering on that promise?

[Michael Gove]

It is the case that the new Office for Environmental Protection will be in Worcester, which is to my mind an equally attractive location for civil servants and for those who will be working in that critical role. The most important thing is that we have good people, making sure that we maintain the highest environmental standards. That is what the OEP will do, but our commitment to making sure that there are high-quality civil service jobs in Bristol remains. Bristol is one of the principal locations outside London at the moment for civil service jobs, but it is only right that other areas, not least in the west midlands and Teesside, as well as Worcester, benefit, because let’s face it, when we have brilliant Mayors such as Ben Houchen in Tees Valley and Andy Street in the west midlands, making a superb case for locations such as Darlington and, indeed, for Wolverhampton, it would be foolish not to pay attention to their brilliant advocacy and to hope—who knows—that they might be re-elected in forthcoming polls.

[Martin Vickers (Cleethorpes) (Con)]

There are many small and medium-sized businesses in my constituency, particularly in the renewable energy sector. I know that the Government are eager to ensure that SMEs have assistance in securing Government contracts. Ahead of the COP26 conference, when there is a particular focus on this sector, is there anything additional that the Government could do to assist those SMEs?

[Michael Gove]

Yes. I will talk to my right hon. Friend the President for COP26 and ensure that we have a joint roundtable for the companies that my hon. Friend has spoken up for in his constituency and elsewhere, to ensure that the international event taking place in Glasgow, thanks to the UK Government, also benefits people in Lincolnshire and Yorkshire.

[Chi Onwurah (Newcastle upon Tyne Central) (Lab) [V]]

Wylam Brewery in my constituency has a fantastic location—our old science museum—and wonderful beers, which I have personally researched. The EU accounted for half its business last year, but since the Government bungled the EU trade deal, Wylam beers have been stuck in ports or sent back. Official Government advice is to set up a European office, effectively moving jobs from Newcastle to the EU. This week’s Food and Drink Federation figures show that Wylam is not alone in seeing exports collapse, so will the Minister meet me and the brewery to get this sorted and Wylam beers once more enjoyed on the continent?

[Michael Gove]

I absolutely will. I can think of no better contribution to raising morale, not just in Newcastle but in the European Union, than ensuring that people in the EU can enjoy beer brewed in Newcastle rather than the stuff that they brew elsewhere.

[Dr Jamie Wallis (Bridgend) (Con) [V]]

Does my right hon. Friend agree that it is excellent news to hear of so many Government Departments setting up offices outside London and the south-east? Is he aware of any plans for the UK Government to bring anything to south Wales from which my Bridgend constituency may benefit?

[Michael Gove]

Bridgend’s position—brilliantly, close to Cardiff but with good transport links to Swansea as well—gives it the perfect opportunity to benefit from the additional investment that my right hon. Friend the President of the Board of Trade has put into a new trade hub in Cardiff. Of course, it is already the case that Swansea is the home not only to an outstanding university, but to the DVLA. We continually keep under review how we can support civil service relocation, not just to north Wales, as I mentioned earlier, but to south Wales as well, making sure that, not just in Cardiff and Swansea but in communities such as Bridgend, people can benefit.

[Chris Elmore (Ogmore) (Lab) [V]]

The delay in the implementation of the VI-1 forms has been welcomed by the wine and spirits industry, which has been lobbying on this issue along with wine importers across the UK—including Daniel Lambert, who runs a wine import company in Aberkenfig in my constituency. Will the Minister now work with the industry beyond January next year to find long-term solutions, so that these businesses and those who work in the sector are not negatively impacted following the UK’s leaving the EU?

[Michael Gove]

The hon. Gentleman has always been a fair-minded and pragmatic Member of this House and a strong advocate for his constituents. I look forward to working with him, Mr Lambert and others in precisely the way that he mentions.

[Cherilyn Mackrory (Truro and Falmouth) (Con) [V]]

  The G7 in Cornwall is fast approaching, and we are very much looking forward to it. Post summit, Cornwall looks for a legacy that will enhance a clean, green future for business. Will my right hon. Friend support me in establishing an ambitious blue growth plan for the port of Falmouth that ensures that Truro and Falmouth, and the whole of Cornwall, can feel long-term economic benefits from the summit?

[Michael Gove]

It sounds like a brilliant idea. I know that this investment in Falmouth will not cost us a packet; I know that it will be a good investment for the future. Absolutely: we need to make sure that the G7, which is coming to Cornwall for all the right reasons, leaves a lasting legacy of environmentally sustainable investment. I look forward to working with my hon. Friend for precisely that goal.

[Nick Smith (Blaenau Gwent) (Lab)]

Would the Chancellor describe the enforcement powers of the lobbying registrar as draconian or a bit of a soft landing?

[Michael Gove]

I have not given the issue much thought lately, but I will look closely at it and write back to the hon. Gentleman.

[Steve Double (St Austell and Newquay) (Con)]

With the development of the Cornwall spaceport and the Goonhilly earth station, Cornwall is set to become a major hub for the UK space industry. As the Government are looking to relocate Government Departments and agencies around the country, would my right hon. Friend look into moving part of the UK Space Agency to Cornwall?

[Michael Gove]

I think it is a very good idea. I have to say that Shetland and Sutherland are benefiting from space investment as well as Cornwall. At this stage, I cannot make any firm commitment, but I do think that my hon. Friend has made a strong case for Cornwall.

[Stewart Malcolm McDonald (Glasgow South) (SNP) [V]]

We know that hostile foreign actors are spending more money and following more sophisticated methods than ever before when it comes to sowing disinformation, including here in the UK. The latest data from both Facebook and Twitter tells us that in particular Iran and Russia are giving the United Kingdom and politics in the UK a lot of attention. Will the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster arrange a briefing for Members of Parliament and political parties, on appropriate terms, with the security services, so that we can all better understand the threat and ensure the integrity of our political discourse and democracy?

[Michael Gove]

The hon. Gentleman raises an important point; when it comes to many foreign defence and security questions, his is a sane and sensible voice. He is absolutely right that all political parties should be made aware of some of the potential attempts to subvert our democracy. Therefore I look forward to working with my colleagues to make sure that the material that we can share is shared and that everyone is aware of what we need to do to defend our democracy.

[Stephen Farry (North Down) (Alliance) [V]]

The calming influence of the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster is going to be missed in the post-Brexit discussions with the European Union. How does he see long-term sustainable solutions being found around the Northern Ireland protocol in the light of the damage done to trust as a result of the unilateral extensions of the grace periods?

[Michael Gove]

I am very grateful to the hon. Gentleman. The first thing that I would say is that it is important that we make sure that the interests of all the people of Northern Ireland come first. The decision on grace periods was taken in accordance with the freely expressed wishes of commercial operators in Northern Ireland. It is interesting that Northern Ireland retailers, businesses and so on, without prejudice to their views on Brexit or the protocol, welcomed these pragmatic steps.

I have enormous respect and affection for the hon. Gentleman, but this must be the first time ever, in this House or anywhere else, that I have been described as a calming influence, and I can only say thank you. All sorts of epithets have been flung at me, but to be described in such a way as to suggest that a former occupant of your Chair, Mr Speaker, might have described me as the equivalent of a parliamentary soothing medicament is perhaps the kindest thing that has ever been said about me.

[Mr Speaker]

On which basis, I am now suspending the House for two minutes to enable the necessary arrangements for the next business to be made.

10.35 am

Sitting suspended.