Operation Herrick

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 14th May 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

I am sorry about the railway. If my history serves, we never completed the Cape Town to Cairo railway either, but such are plans. I prefer to focus now on High Speed 2—we should look to the future.

My hon. Friend is right. Today’s announcement will mean that it is not necessary to prepare and train a further brigade to deploy. It is not yet clear whether that will make any significant saving for the taxpayer because most of that deployment, had it taken place, would have been in the back of transport aircraft that would have been going out empty in order to come back with repatriated equipment.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I associate my party with tributes to the soldiers who lost their lives in Afghanistan, and I thank the Secretary of State for his statement. He will be aware of the experience and training gained from Operation Banner in Northern Ireland. Will he confirm that the valuable skills developed through that operation will be made available to the Afghan army to the end of 2014, and indeed beyond?

[Mr Hammond]

I can confirm to the hon. Gentleman that we are training Afghan troops in various specialist techniques that will be of value to the Afghan security forces in maintaining security in future. Of course, that draws on all the experiences that British troops have gained over the years, including many valuable experiences in Northern Ireland.

Deployment to Mali

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 29th January 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

Allowing ungoverned space in Afghanistan would also represent a direct threat to Europe’s security. We know that a significant proportion of the security threats to the UK arise, and have arisen in the past, from the Afghanistan-Pakistan region. What is a threat to Europe’s security and Britain’s security is ungoverned space in which terrorists can organise, exercise freedom of movement, and launch attacks. Wherever ungoverned space arises, whether it is in Somalia, the Sahel, or the Afghanistan-Pakistan border area, we have to take appropriate action to close it down so that that space becomes properly governed and properly monitored.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the Secretary of State kindly for clarifying many of the issues that concern us. There is a great humanitarian crisis developing in Mali, with 230,000 people displaced and 150,000 people having left the country. Will the deployment involve help for the deepening humanitarian crisis and for the infrastructure rebuild?

[Mr Hammond]

My right hon. Friend the International Development Secretary is very much engaged with this issue. The deployment that I have talked about today is a training mission, but we are also looking to provide humanitarian support in the short term to deal with the movement of people in response to conflict, and in the longer term as part of an EU initiative to support the development of civil governance and economic development, particularly in the north of the country, thus addressing some of the underlying problems of at least part of this insurgency.

Armed Forces Redundancies

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd January 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Francois]

My hon. Friend is probably the greatest living expert in the House on the reserve forces, so I shall not contradict him here and now. I pay tribute to his work on the reserves commission and to all the preparatory work that he and others, including the vice-chief of the defence staff, undertook in order to put us in the position of having £1.8 billion of resources over 10 years to grow our reserves and to make that a practical reality. I thank him for all that he has done on that.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the Minister for his reassurance about retraining for those who have life after military service. This is not just about the value of military redundancies and the reallocation of housing, however; it is also about mortgages for new houses and how best those people should use their redundancy packages. What monetary advice will the Minister give to those who receive redundancy packages?

[Mr Francois]

We provide financial advice to members of the armed forces at various stages of their careers. When applicants—and non-applicants—go through the redundancy process, the career transition partnership provides them with considerable assistance. I believe that discussions on their financial situation, and on what jobs they might apply for, form part of that process.

Afghanistan

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Wednesday 19th December 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

Yes, I am happy to agree with my hon. Friend. In particular, progress has to be made on the endemic corruption that still exists in Afghan society and throughout the Afghan economy, if the progress already made is to be built on.

Perhaps I could take this opportunity to tell the hon. Member for Islington North (Jeremy Corbyn) that I have become aware—by magic—that the net additional cost of military operations since 2001 is estimated as £17.4 billion to date.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the Secretary of State for his statement. The murder in Pakistan of six aid workers delivering vital polio treatment shocked us all. Can he assure the House that there will be military protection for medical aid workers in Afghanistan to ensure that the polio inoculations and medical treatment that are so important for children and adults can be maintained?

[Mr Hammond]

The responsibility for protecting Afghan local health services will be primarily for the Afghan police and military, but I completely agree with the hon. Gentleman that we were all shocked by the reminder of the primitiveness of some of the Taliban doctrine, and that they would attack people for providing vaccination against life-threatening diseases. That is the scale of the challenge we are dealing with.

Unmanned Aerial Vehicles

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 11th December 2012 Westminster Hall

[Mr Jones]

With respect to the use of UAVs for intelligence gathering and protection of convoys I certainly agree with my hon. Friend. That brings me to the point that my hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham, Edgbaston and the hon. Member for North Wiltshire raised. To people who are against war, we must be honest and say that war is not a pleasant thing; people die in wars. There are individuals and groups active in Afghanistan and northern Pakistan who are bent on undermining not only the way of life of the United States but the one that we take for granted. It is important that any use of force should be a proportionate response.

There has been a lot of talk about the United States and whether the UAV strikes in northern Pakistan are legal. They were authorised post the 11 September authorisation of the use of military forces and have been reinforced by the Obama Administration. When I was at the Ministry of Defence there was a big debate about whether they would continue when President Obama took over, and clearly they have. Article 51 of the United Nations charter, on a nation’s right to self-defence, is also relevant. We must remember that the individuals in question are not sitting around discussing philosophy; they are planning terrorist strikes and atrocities across the world. In the debate about whether we use force to counter those individuals, I am comfortable about recognising the existence of a threat: that has led to disruption of al-Qaeda and other terrorist groups, and it would not have happened without that type of action.

We support the move by the United States to codify the use of UAVs, which relates to the points made about new technology. It is partly because of the controversy that we need to do something. It is important that the UK examine whether we should have a code covering the contexts and limitations of usage, the process for internal Government oversight of deployments, command and control structures, and acceptable levels of automation. I accept that there is now someone at the end of a UAV, but the next generation of UAVs may be completely autonomous, and we must ensure that such a change is within a legal envelope.

One important point is that I am in no way criticising the Government by saying that no laws are in place. I am well aware of the legal constraints on the selection of targets, and that the same rules of engagement are used as for manned flights. We should however explain UAVs to the public. With the new technology, trying to codify their use and explaining to individuals exactly how targets are selected, for example, and how UAVs are used for both surveillance and military purposes would be a great step forward.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

UAVs could be used for piracy patrols on the east coast of Africa and for fishing enforcement. Those two examples would clearly show that drones can have acceptable roles. I agree about their acceptability, and I believe that other people can be persuaded to have the same opinion.

[Mr Jones]

The hon. Gentleman is correct. Certainly, if we can have unmanned vehicles in the UK—once agreement is reached with the Civil Aviation Authority—there may be many uses, as he says, including for security.

It would be helpful if we codified the operations. Am I arguing that no laws currently govern the situation? No, I am not. The rules are based on the Ministry of Defence joint doctrine note 2/11 on “The UK Approach to Unmanned Aircraft Systems”, but the MOD sometimes has a tendency not to answer questions and to think that it has to shroud such things in secrecy. Whether or not what is being said is true—in many cases, I do not think it is—the perception is that the technology is used indiscriminately and without control. Some type of code would go a long way towards reassuring people that there is a chain of command, as my hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham, Edgbaston said, for the individual who takes the decision.

There is also a perception that people sitting in Nevada or Florida are killing indiscriminately with no thought of the consequences of what they are doing. I do not accept that. Anyone who has met members of the armed forces of this country or other countries knows that the decision to fire—whether that is Winston Churchill with his revolver, a UAV operator or a pilot dropping munition—is not taken lightly. It is important that people know the full legal background. Unless someone has been involved in operations, they think it is strange that there is a legal context before targetings happen. If we explained that in a codified system, it would help the debate on the use of a new and developing technology.

The Opposition support the use of UAVs. The technology is important in relation not only to military capability, but to the development of our industry and technology in that area. We are developing technologies that will have applications other than military use. As has already been demonstrated in Afghanistan, the technology helps to protect and support our armed forces.

In conclusion, I accept that some of the information about what has happened in northern Pakistan is alarming. The important thing is to understand the context and how the deaths of some individuals have disrupted terrorist networks that were bringing danger not only to parts of Afghanistan and Pakistan but to the streets of London and the capitals of our allies. In terms of the general debate started by my hon. Friend, the use of weapons will never be something that people take lightly, and nor should they. If we can debate the use of UAVs as no different from the use of any other military weapons and we put that into some kind of code, which we could be open about, not secretive, it would do a lot to ensure not only that we in this country are moral leaders in the use of weapons, but that the public have full confidence, as they should, in the existing military chain of command.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Dunne]

Indeed, a number of Opposition Members asked about that issue. The extent to which the Government are supporting UK industrial investment in this technology is demonstrated by the commitments that we have made, in particular for Watchkeeper, where a very substantial investment has been made for a British-designed, British-built capability.

We have also undertaken some collaborative work with other nations. The issue of our collaboration with the French was raised earlier. We have committed, through a memorandum of understanding signed in July, to two specific strands of that work. One is investing in the concept phase for a future combat air system; that is at the very early stages of the work stream, but work is beginning. The second was in relation to potential French interest in procuring the Watchkeeper system. If British industry is able to export that system to the French in due course, that would be a further success for it. We recognise that British aerospace industry will take an increasing interest in this capability, and through our procurement we are seeking to support that interest.

[Jim Shannon]

The Minister, in an earlier response, said that there might not be a role for drones in the MOD in its entirety, but there is a role through the Royal Navy. The Royal Navy’s responsibility is for fishing enforcement, through European regulation. There are three ships set aside for that; I had the opportunity a few weeks ago to be on one, HMS Severn. Is there any intention of introducing drones in the Royal Navy for enforcement of fishing regulation?

[Mr Dunne]

As I mentioned earlier, the Royal Navy is undertaking a short-duration capability concept demonstrator, to inform the future concept of use for tactical maritime unmanned air systems. We are not intending to test a specific system, but a system will go through concept demonstration next year. The uses will be for the Royal Navy to decide, if it decides to procure a system in due course.

I think I have addressed the specific questions that the hon. Member for Birmingham, Edgbaston put to me.

Defence Personnel

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Thursday 6th December 2012 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the right hon. Member for North East Hampshire (Mr Arbuthnot) on setting the scene so well, providing some focus for many of us. I thank other hon. Members who have also made significant, worthwhile and knowledgeable contributions to the debate, and those who will do the same in a few moments.

I begin by saying that I stand in support of the tremendous sacrifice and work that our defence personnel carry out every day of their lives. As a member of the armed forces parliamentary scheme—there are others dotted around the Chamber—I have been privileged to see a lot of what our soldiers, sailors, airmen and women do around the world, and it makes me even more thankful for the job they do, away from friends and family on the front line or in training or when stationed elsewhere. We do not always know what they daily go through—I know membership of the armed forces parliamentary scheme provides some indication of it—in service to Queen and country. We know that because of them there is freedom and democracy not only in this United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland but right across the world—and for that we are truly and immensely grateful.

Many of us will have watched films on TV based on the wars in the past—from the American war of independence, the American civil war and on to the Great war—and we all have seen the march of troops head on into the firing line. That is not the way wars are fought today: warfare has evolved, and the British Army has evolved with it, remaining the foremost Army in the world. I believe that this must remain so. We have obligations worldwide in the security of our nation and in playing our part to help those who are oppressed or living in injustice. Those aims must continue to be fulfilled by whatever shape the new Army takes. The British Army and this Government have not been found wanting when it comes to promoting those good objectives—in Iraq, in Afghanistan and elsewhere across the world.

I want to focus on the changes that will follow the withdrawal from Afghanistan and the draw-down from Germany, and to do so from a Northern Ireland perspective. I want to reflect on what the Army expects to look like then, and, more important, on Northern Ireland’s role in the 2020 British Army.

Northern Ireland has a rich military history. Although we are such a small part of the United Kingdom, our incredible level of military service—which is backed up by the figures—demonstrates that we are intrinsic to the make-up of the greatness of that great nation. It is clear from the fact that Northern Ireland contains only 3% of the United Kingdom’s population but provides 20% of the reserve forces on active service that we more than play our part. We have much to offer in Northern Ireland as a major part of the evolution of the armed forces.

[Bob Stewart (Beckenham) (Con)]

I understand that more Victoria Crosses have been awarded to Irishmen than to the English, the Scots and the Welsh put together. I congratulate the Irish on that.

[Jim Shannon]

The hon. Gentleman’s facts are absolutely correct. I thank him for what he has said. Let me also take the opportunity to thank him for the immense contribution that he has made in his former role as a soldier, both in Northern Ireland and elsewhere in the world, and in particular for the part that he played, as an officer in his regiment, in the peace that we now have in Northern Ireland. His contribution is not often mentioned, and I wanted to put it on the record.

By tradition, we in Northern Ireland have never had to be conscripted to provide service personnel. We go above and beyond our duty, and that should be acknowledged and respected. Although in many instances the troubles in Northern Ireland highlighted segregation, the Army and the cadets now recruit from all sectors of the community. I want to stress to the Minister the importance of our cadets and reserve forces to community involvement and community-building. The Army works hard in those different parts of the community to show people what a great career can be enjoyed in the forces.

Our cadet force recruitment has been second to none, crossing the religious and political divides. The highest levels of recruitment are from areas that are traditionally less supportive of the military—Strabane, Londonderry, Limavady and Enniskillen. The importance of the cadet forces to our society cannot be sufficiently underlined. Northern Ireland, in my view, has the most rationalised and efficient cadets in the United Kingdom. We develop a higher proportion of our soldiers and sailors on operations than any other region, and we have the most and the best recruitment in the UK.

The main link between the Ministry of Defence and the communities in Northern Ireland is first through the cadets and secondly through the reserves. The success story lies in the fact that people from what are, perhaps, the traditionally less supportive areas are now joining the cadets in rising numbers. The position must be enhanced in the future, and that demands a commitment from the Ministry of Defence: cadets today, reserves and a full-time Army tomorrow.

I believe that there is much scope for Northern Ireland to house and facilitate the training of troops in buildings that are already owned and operated by the British Army. I suggest that Thiepval barracks in Lisburn, which currently houses the 38th Brigade, should be retained and enhanced. The draw-down from Germany will provide an opportunity for that to be done. The garrison at Ballykinler and Palace barracks in Holywood provide accommodation and training facilities that are ready and waiting to be fully utilised—and, of course, we must not forget the facilities at Aldergrove, from which forces have already withdrawn. Again, the draw-down from Germany will provide scope for development.

Those buildings are already intrinsic parts of the community. Officers in the barracks ensure that there is co-operation with young people, and with the community as a whole. It makes a great deal of sense to me—and, I know, to other Northern Ireland Members, who unfortunately are not present today—for facilities that are already available to be part of the 2020 plan for the Army, and I ask the MOD to give that serious consideration. I look forward to the Minister’s response.

It is essential for the plan for the reserve forces to constitute 30% of Army numbers by 2018 to be realised through the use of the many troops that are currently trained and ready to go. Through the armed forces parliamentary scheme, I have had the opportunity—along with others, including the hon. Member for Beckenham (Bob Stewart)—to visit our base in Cyprus, and to note the strategic importance of Cyprus in a very uncertain middle east. We need to be able to call upon fully trained and equipped personnel at any time, and I believe the reserves are a way to achieve that. Although these men and women are not in the Army full-time, they are trained to a very high standard. We must ensure the strength of the reserves does not diminish. We have built up expertise, and it should be utilised as needed. The reserves should form the foundation for the proposed changes, and the Northern Ireland reserve members are an important part of them. Given that, the Ministry of Defence must give commitments on Northern Ireland, as part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, and its role in respect of the armed forces.

Everywhere I go in the world, I always come across serving personnel from Northern Ireland with links to my constituency. Fellow members of the armed forces parliamentary scheme have observed that, and they have expressed amazement that there are always such connections. From Afghanistan to Canada, and from Kenya to the Falklands to Cyprus, there is always a Northern Ireland link, which illustrates the commitment of people in Northern Ireland to Queen and country and the principles of freedom and democracy.

[Angus Robertson]

The hon. Gentleman talks of a specific Northern Ireland perspective, and he is no doubt aware that recently the service chiefs met representatives of the political parties from Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland for the first time. His colleague, the hon. Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley), was present as was the right hon. Member for Dwyfor Meirionnydd (Mr Llwyd), and the discussions were valuable. Does the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) agree that they should be continued?

[Jim Shannon]

I entirely agree, and I would like the Minister to comment on that in his concluding remarks. The Northern Ireland link is clear and necessary.

I want to touch upon the importance of the Cyprus base. Cyprus has become a point of interest not only for Russia, but for China, and the strategic importance of Cyprus is underlined yet again by the fact that China wants to make Cyprus the base for its European operations. That is a small part of a bigger story.

Our Cyprus base provides training for soldiers going to Afghanistan and for officers from Sandhurst, and it is essential that it is retained after any shake-up. The right hon. Member for North East Hampshire (Mr Arbuthnot) mentioned soldiers coming home having a chance to unwind in Cyprus. It is a tremendous base and it has a major role to play in helping soldiers unwind from combat stress before going home.

In these times of economic uncertainty, people are having to look outside the normal comfort zones to find work. There is therefore a rise in Army recruitment everywhere, but especially among nationalists, which speaks volumes about how the younger generation see themselves. When the main town in my constituency, Newtownards, celebrated the homecoming of the Irish Guards, one soldier remarked to me that when they were told that some in Belfast did not want them to parade there, they were bemused as some members of their regiment were Catholics and Belfast was their hometown. I was told that there was no real sense of religion among the troops, and I know that to be the case: those who serve in the British Army are brothers, full stop.

I am pleased that recruitment is up, especially as many young people will find not simply a pay packet but a vocation for life. That feature must be encouraged in any changes in the armed forces. I am all for the armed forces changing, and I ask the Minister to say something about the possibility of using the Northern Ireland bases to facilitate the draw-down from Germany. I am today putting down the mark for Northern Ireland and for her to play a major role in the future of the armed forces in Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

Captain Wilfred Spender of the Ulster Division’s HQ staff was quoted in the press as saying after the battle of the Somme:

“I am not an Ulsterman but yesterday, the 1st July, as I followed their amazing attack, I felt that I would rather be an Ulsterman than anything else in the world. The Ulster Division has lost more than half the men who attacked and, in doing so, has sacrificed itself for the Empire which has treated them none too well. Their devotion, which no doubt has helped the advance elsewhere, deserved the gratitude of the British Empire. It is due to the memory of these brave fellows that their beloved Province shall be fairly treated.”

Can anything different be said of our troops today, and can the response from the MOD be any different?

Ex-service Personnel (Psychological Welfare)

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Thursday 6th December 2012 Commons Chamber

[Jim Sheridan]

I am not aware of the precise details, but I am extremely disappointed to hear that. I am sure that the Minister will address that when he gets the opportunity.

My right hon. colleague, the Minister for the Armed Forces, has said that he

“takes the issue of mental health very seriously, and we recognise that operational deployments will inevitably expose personnel to stressful experiences.”—[Official Report, 12 June 2012; Vol. 546, c. 447W.]

Similarly, when he was a Health Minister, the right hon. Member for Chelmsford (Mr Burns), claimed that the coalition Government

“considers the health and wellbeing of…armed forces personnel, veterans and their families to be a top priority.”—[Official Report, 18 June 2012; Vol. 546, c. 801W.]

I agree with these sentiments, as I am sure we all do. Those veterans have put their lives on the line so that we can be safe. They have done a great service for their country and they deserve the top service from their country in return. So why then do the actions of Ministers not speak louder than their words? Their statements are commendable, but their funding commitments are not. I am calling today for more public funding to be directed to the issue and for the psychological well-being of our veterans to be considered a top priority.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

The hon. Gentleman referred to the great work done by charitable organisations —for instance, SSAFA Forces Help, the Army Benevolent Fund, the Royal British Legion, Help for Heroes and many others. Would it be more constructive if the Government were to work with those charitable organisations to address the problem?

[Jim Sheridan]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that contribution. I will come to that important aspect.

It is important that we tackle the issue now as we are only a few years away from it becoming more serious. The Prime Minister confirmed at the end of November that the combat mission in Afghanistan will end in 2014. With this will come the return of thousands of troops who have been serving abroad so that we can remain safe in our own country. Combat Stress estimates that 7,600 of the 191,000 personnel who have served in Iraq and Afghanistan could develop PTSD, and that 37,600 are suffering from other disorders, such as depression, mood disorders and anxiety. It could be up to 13 years before the problems reveal themselves, so work done now in this area could prove invaluable 10 to 15 years down the line.

However, we should not be alarmist. Most British military personnel do not suffer any mental health problems while in service or afterwards. We also cannot be certain that the numbers of personnel suffering from mental health issues are disproportionate to the population as a whole. There are conflicting views on this. I have spoken to Veterans Aid, which says that there is no problem with ex-service personnel care, yet PTSD Resolution, a charity that gives counselling to veterans, talks about a much larger problem that is not currently acknowledged. The Royal British Legion anticipates a growing number of problems due to the rebalancing of the armed forces towards reservists.

With more and more armed forces coming back from Afghanistan, the possibly low estimate of 4% of personnel with probable PTSD, 19.7% with other mental disorders and 13% with unhealthy relationships with alcohol will become a much larger problem. I say possibly low estimate because the United States’ estimates of its defence personnel with PTSD range from 12% to 20%. Whether our figures are low or not, all personnel suffering from PTSD and other mental health issues deserve the highest quality post-deployment support services.

I find it a huge cause for concern that these services are at present undertaken, by and large, by charities. They rely on the generosity of the public and in the current environment, where donations to charities are down by 20%, according to the Office for National Statistics, we cannot go on in this way. Let me provide some examples. The Big White Wall online support network is propped up by a £100,000 commitment from Help for Heroes. That is almost a third of its total funding. Combat Stress, a veterans charity, is currently supporting over 5,000 veterans aged from 20 to 101 and it says it

“simply couldn’t do what we do without the generosity of the great British public.”

PTSD Resolution provides counselling to UK veterans, with a 78% success rate, but gets no recognition for its work from the MOD. Erskine hospital in my constituency provides vital care to veterans suffering from mental health issues, among others, and relies on donations to cover a large part of the £7 million a year that it needs to keep going.

It is unfortunate that those charities have to rely on fundraising to undertake work that provides a lifeline to those suffering after service. Veterans are clearly not a priority for this Government; they were not for the previous Government either. They are a priority for the charities, but it is a sad fact that in our society it is charities that are caring for our war wounded. More funding should be directed to the psychological welfare of ex-service personnel, and it should come from the public purse.

The funding issue will only get worse. The Government are planning to double the number of reservists, from 15,000 to 30,000, by 2018. That raises a key question, because reserve personnel are more likely than regular soldiers to suffer from PTSD. Therefore, we need a strategy for the future to tackle that invisible consequence of service.

Funding has been allocated for those brave personnel, but we do not know whether any of it will cover increased mental health provision. I have a few precise questions about the Government’s plans to care for those additional members of the armed forces, who take on the responsibility alongside their day jobs. Since reservists are going to be more exposed to the front line, will there be a change to the pre-deployment training to reflect that, and will there be any additional provision for reservists and their families?

On that point, let me underline the importance of including families in any post-deployment care. PTSD and other mental health problems do not have individual victims; their effects permeate the lives of sufferers’ friends and family, and often that effect is overlooked. It is perhaps more pertinent for reservists, as they return to environments where their experience is not particularly well understood. They can find it hard to readjust to civilian life, and their friends and family find it hard to see the person they loved change into someone new.

As an MP with a long history of standing up for rights in the workplace, I am also interested to hear how reservists’ rights will be protected. Will the Minister be looking to change post-deployment rest and recuperation, given that it is a key factor, cited by many experts, for why they do not recover? That seems a sensible suggestion to help mitigate the effects of traumatic experiences in the field. If that was the case, how much extra time away from work would that imply? Will reservists be given guarantees by the Government that their involvement will not hinder their job applications or relationships with employers?

Reservists, as with all other armed forces personnel, make a great sacrifice for their country and should not be penalised for that. They face specific issues on return, such as a lack of understanding from friends and family and more open criticism of the war in Iraq. They are also usually called upon to fill gaps in the regulars, becoming out of sync with the rest of their unit and, therefore, lacking the comradeship that can be such an important part of service. As such, they should be given the proper prevention and intervention strategies they need to readjust to civilian life and prevent any mental health issues from manifesting themselves.

I am sure that the Minister agrees with me on many of these issues. He might be searching desperately in his limited budget for spare cash to spend on mental health care for veterans. Perhaps I can help him in that regard. We have called for deeper cuts to the number of one-star officers and those above, the highest paid, in order to correct the top-heavy imbalance across our services. I am not usually in favour of redundancy policies, but the number of the most senior officers in the MOD has risen by a third since 1990. We have more admirals than ships. We have a higher number of officers across all three services than do the French and US air, maritime and land forces. Although 20% of more junior ranks look set to lose their jobs, just one in 20 of the most senior officers in all three services have been made redundant. The money spent employing senior officers could be much better spent helping to ease the burden of veterans’ charities. The £1 million could be spent on a fund that would focus research on mental health issues and charities could bid for funds to support their own policy research.

It is estimated that by 2020 1.8 million people in the armed forces community will be living with a long-standing illness. I have spent much of my political career fighting for people who have been injured or made ill as a result of their job. Serving in a combat zone where their life is constantly imperilled places unique burdens on our service personnel. It is imperative that the Government recognise the need to ensure that our armed forces are afforded not only the best physical care but the best mental health care while serving and after returning to civilian life. We cannot rely on charities to do this vital work any longer. I sincerely hope that this debate has managed to bring some of the issues to the table, and I will be interested to hear the Minister’s plans to ensure the mental well-being of our respected veterans.

Finally, it would be inappropriate in the context of this debate not to mention the Christmas Island veterans, who are still looking for compensation after almost 40 years. I hope that the Minister will say something about them as well.

Military Covenant

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Wednesday 21st November 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Donaldson]

I can only echo what the hon. Lady has said. I agree that there should be adequate resources not just for a proposed facility for Northern Ireland, but for other facilities for veterans and members of the Northern Ireland armed forces. I take her point that not all of them would want to receive their respite care in Northern Ireland itself.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

The week before last, I had an opportunity to meet a gentleman from Help for Heroes, a charity of which every Member present will be aware. When I mentioned this very issue to him, he said that although the organisation currently made no such provision specifically for Northern Ireland, it was seeking to do so, and I hope that that will be possible in the near future.

[Mr Donaldson]

I thank my hon. Friend for that information. It is worth noting that the people of Northern Ireland are very generous when it comes to military charities. Year on year, Northern Ireland consistently gives more to the poppy appeal than any other region of the United Kingdom, and Help for Heroes is well supported there. We receive a share of that, and we do not in any way criticise any of the military charities. However, it would be good to see those charities unite with the Government, the RFCA and others in considering what enhanced facilities we might provide in Northern Ireland. That would constitute recognition of the generosity of the people there who support them.

I said earlier that we would meet Ministers to pursue the issues that I have raised. We have already met the Minister for the Armed Forces and we should be happy to meet the Minister of State and his colleagues in the Northern Ireland Office as well. Thanks to my hon. Friend the Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon), we have secured a meeting with the Prime Minister early in December, when we will discuss with him matters relating to the implementation of the military covenant in Northern Ireland.

Her Majesty’s Government have a duty to support the armed forces and the veterans who have served this country so well, and we support them in pursuing the work that they are undertaking in relation to the military covenant. No political obstacle and no political party should get in the way of full implementation of the covenant in every region of the United Kingdom, including Northern Ireland. I commend the motion to the House.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to say a few words, Mr Deputy Speaker. First, I congratulate my right hon. Friend the Member for Lagan Valley (Mr Donaldson) on bringing this matter to the House and on setting the scene clearly for us all. I am proud to stand here today beside my fellow British men and British women to say a big thank you to all those who put their lives, their mental health and their physical health at risk every day.

My constituency was devastated recently by the news of the loss of young Channing Day in Afghanistan. She was a courageous and heroic young lady who gave much. My right hon. Friend and I were both at a dinner in London when we heard the news filtering through that night, and it came as a shock to everyone there. I was shocked to the very pit of my stomach. Many of us were shocked to learn that someone who came from a place not 10 minutes away from my office would never be home in physical body again. The community of Comber turned out in great numbers at the Royal British Legion service on the Saturday before the service that the Minister of State attended in Comber church, and it was a very poignant occasion. All the RBL remembrance services in my area served as a particular reminder, because not too far away was a young lady who gave her life. The Army quickly stepped in to provide the assistance necessary to help the family—to bring them over to receive Channing’s remains when they came home and to come to Comber. The funeral was an occasion of some poignancy and tears for all of us. Those are things that we remember.

Let me make a couple of very quick points. About a month ago, we had a coffee morning in my office for SSAFA—the Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen and Families Association—which raised some £3,600. We have raised £14,000 over four years. That is only a drop in the ocean when it comes to what is necessary, but it underlines the fact that a great number of charities, including SSAFA, ABF and the Royal British Legion, are all doing their best to ensure that the opportunities are open to everyone when it comes to ensuring that people have the chance to receive the help that they need.

I am very privileged to come from an area where people join the armed forces—it is not just an exception, but an everyday part of my life. In my office alone, my secretary’s nephew and my researcher’s friend and husband are serving Queen and country. That is three people out of my office and shows the service from the area. I am proud to stand in the Chamber on behalf of the people of my constituency of Strangford and the service they give across the whole world. It is true to say that wherever a person goes in the world, they will find a soldier from Northern Ireland either fighting a battle or cleaning up afterwards. Wherever I have been in the world with the armed forces parliamentary scheme, I have met soldiers from my constituency who are doing just that—giving a great service across the world.

I have also been an avid supporter of the British Legion’s “Honour the Covenant” campaign, which we should all support. I believe that there have been many changes in how the MOD and the Government treat our returning soldiers. As many Members have said, we need to consider their mental health, but there is also a physical aspect to the question. With growing numbers of injured personnel coming home from Afghanistan, there is an immediate need for a dedicated strategy on care for them and their families. They need to know what they are coming home to and we should be providing that strategy.

Finally, whenever I meet servicemen, they say to me that they will give all they have if we will take care of those they love back home. We have a responsibility to the families, too, and we should and must act on that. I think of this comment: they offer their tomorrows so that we can have our today. Let us honour that and honour the covenant, and let us enshrine it from these green Benches so that it covers each and every corner of the United Kingdom.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I call Mr Weir, who should finish no later than 6.40 pm.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Minister of State, Northern Ireland Office (Mike Penning)]

It is a privilege to wind up the second of this afternoon’s debates. Those who were not here for the first might be quite surprised that a Minister of State in the Northern Ireland Office is winding up a debate on the military covenant. I will explain why in a moment, but first I want to say that I think this has been an excellent debate, although it is a shame it deteriorated a little into party politics. I do not think the military covenant should be about that. It is not about how difficult things are in certain parts of the country; how we do it is the most important thing for our veterans.

The reason why a Northern Ireland Minister is replying to the debate is that the Democratic Unionist party, led by the right hon. Member for Lagan Valley (Mr Donaldson), has used its time this afternoon to discuss the military covenant in relation to Northern Ireland in particular. Perhaps the next time we debate the covenant, we will have a bit more time and be able to discuss the really pressing issues, but I think we can move on.

That 11 speeches were made in the short time allowed for the debate on the military covenant demonstrates the importance of its effects on our constituencies, no matter what part of the United Kingdom we represent. Listening to the debate, I have been proud to hear how representatives of our country who are not from the United Kingdom have also been honoured. I refer in particular to those from the Irish Republic. It is important that we recognise the dedication they have shown to Her Majesty’s armed forces.

The hon. Member for Belfast East (Naomi Long) is not in her place, but in the previous debate she said that she was born in 1971. I joined the Army as a boy soldier in 1974, which makes me feel extremely old. I did my basic training at Pirbright, where the Household Division trained together. Two young lads there were 16 years of age, like me, and from Ireland—one from Belfast, the other from Dublin. They were clearly from a different religious background and culturally they were very different. They were the toughest two soldiers in the whole of that Brigade Squad. One of them went on to become the company sergeant-major of the Irish Guards boys unit. He was from Dublin and I think he served for nearly 22 years. He was as tough as boots and as proud as punch of being an Irishman and from the south. He served his country, just as others do today, in the way that we would expect of any members of our armed forces.

Some of my hon. Friends have drifted away to other duties, but I joined as a junior guardsman and left as a junior guardsman before re-enlisting as a private in the Royal Army Medical Corps to try to keep my para pay. That did not last very long, so I left as a private. It was particularly moving for me to attend the funeral of Corporal Channing Day and wear the RAMC tie, which I am also wearing today.

The medics are an amazing group of people. During my time in the military they were developing techniques at great risk, literally on the front line. One of our servicemen had been blown up and a young man did a tracheotomy on him by putting a Bic pen straight into the front of his throat. He knew that, otherwise, that man would die. Our medics were not allowed to do tracheotomies, so he took a huge risk: either that person would die, or he would take the punishment. The guy lived and tracheotomy has moved on, particularly with front-line medics.

When I was a shadow Health Minister, I had the privilege of visiting Camp Bastion and seeing mainly NHS medics working on the front-line as Territorials. Much of the skill in our A and E and major trauma units today is a result of the work of our medics out there. Frankly, any soldier or serviceman from any part of the armed forces anywhere in the world will say that being a battlefield medic, which is what Corporal Day was, is one of the most important jobs and that they need them by their side.

[Jim Shannon]

Will the Minister give way?

[Mike Penning]

I would like to make progress, if I may. The hon. Gentleman sat with me at the church. One of the most moving things is that Corporal Day’s father is a veteran of the Royal Pioneer Corps. She desperately wanted to be an engineer, but she was too short and became a battlefield medic instead, and thank goodness that she did.

[Jim Shannon]

The Minister’s comments are very kind. It was a poignant occasion for us all. Camp Bastion has the best care in the world—it has saved the lives of servicemen who have lost three limbs. Does the Minister agree that that is an indication not just of the good work that our medical services do, but of that of the medics on the field of battle as well?

[Mike Penning]

That is a very important intervention. The Minister of State, Ministry of Defence, my right hon. Friend the Member for Rayleigh and Wickford (Mr Francois), has just whispered in my ear that 98%—I knew that the figure was good—of casualties who go into Camp Bastion field hospital alive come out alive. That is amazing and reflects the poignancy of part of this evening’s debate. People with physical and major trauma injuries are surviving today who would never have survived in the old days—sadly, we would have lost them many years ago. That means that our role when they come home is very important. An awful lot of the injured stay in the armed forces—a lot more than when I served—but many still leave.

Those are the visible signs and we need to do everything we can for them, and the Royal British Legion, Help for Heroes and other units and benevolent funds are doing fantastic work. I completely agree that it will be really difficult when we come home from Afghanistan. That is true. When we come home from Afghanistan or from ops, donations to the Legion and Help for Heroes, which started during Iraq and Afghanistan, will drop. That is why it is so important that we get the money in now. The Government can do a lot, but those wonderful charities do an enormous amount of work.

When I was at the Department for Transport, I sat on the military covenant committee chaired by the Prime Minister. I am proud to have been re-appointed to that committee as the Minister of State for Northern Ireland. It is very important that the voice of Northern Ireland is heard on that committee. The Minister for Housing also sits on the committee. The hon. Member for Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland (Tom Blenkinsop) spoke about housing benefit. We know about that issue and the committee is working on how the benefit structure works. I, too, look forward to seeing the report when it comes out before Christmas.

I will now touch on Northern Ireland and, in particular, the conflicting legislation. Rather than looking at why it is preventing us from doing things for veterans and their families, we should consider how we can move forward. It would be a good idea to consider that between now and the meeting with the Prime Minister on 12 December.

[Jim Shannon]

It is on the 19th.

[Mike Penning]

Sorry, the 19th. I expect that it is being moved in my diary as we speak, as I hope to be at the meeting.

My one concern is that we must not be too prescriptive. As the hon. Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley) said, a veteran might be living next door to someone who disagrees fundamentally with their serving in the armed forces. It is not as simple as turning up and saying, “I should be rehoused because I am a veteran.” In Northern Ireland, the situation is very difficult. In many cases, we might not want people to know that somebody is ex-service, where they are coming from or where they live, particularly if they come from the nationalist side. I have met many nationalist young people who have served in the armed forces. We have to be really careful not to make the situation worse for them while we are trying to make it better.

Unmanned Aerial Vehicles

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 6th November 2012 Westminster Hall

[Rehman Chishti (Gillingham and Rainham) (Con)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Sir Roger. May I welcome the Minister to his post? I have great admiration and respect for him in his current role, and the same was true when he was in his previous role. I hope that he has had a chance to read my speech, which I sent over yesterday, and particularly the 10 specific questions I will be asking him to address.

In recent years, we have witnessed the proliferation of the use of unmanned aerial vehicles, better known as drones. These remotely piloted aircraft are predominately used by states to conduct intelligence and surveillance, and, increasingly, to carry out armed strikes. This debate looks at the military use of armed drones by the United Kingdom and the United States.

It appears that the Government see drones as having an ever greater role in our armed forces. According to the vice-chief of the defence staff, General Nicholas Houghton, we may see a tipping point by the mid-2020s, when the UK will

“move away from manned fast jets to Unmanned Combat Aerial Vehicles and missiles”.

The Government recently announced that the number of Reaper drones the UK operates in Afghanistan was to double to 10 and that operations were, for the first time, to be conducted from RAF Waddington, in Lincolnshire. Currently, the UK’s five Reaper drones are operated by British personnel from Creech air base in Nevada, and the latest figures show that those drones have flown 40,000 hours and fired 345 missiles in Afghanistan.

Although drones offer the potential to target insurgents without having to put our armed forces in harm’s way, we need to ensure that all steps are taken to prevent civilian casualties. Despite the growing significance of drones, there has been little debate about this issue, and the time is right for a review into how they are used and how they may be developed and deployed in future.

The first question I would like the Minister to address is, what is the Government’s policy on the use of drones, particularly in Afghanistan and Pakistan? My second question is, how many civilians have been killed by UK drone strikes in Afghanistan? My third question, which is linked to that, is, does he agree that the death of civilians in Afghanistan undermines the aim of winning hearts and minds, and feeds anti-west feeling? If civilians cannot be protected, does he agree that we should consider suspending the use of drones?

Earlier this year, I visited Pakistan, having been a former adviser to Benazir Bhutto, and I met President Zardari, senior Ministers and many local people. Everywhere I went, concerns were raised about the use of drone strikes in Pakistan by foreign countries. There were real concerns that such strikes would feed into the anti-west attitude played on by radical elements.

Although the UK has operated drones only in Afghanistan, the United States has used them as part of its counter-terrorism strategy in Pakistan, Somalia and Yemen. According to reports, that has resulted in hundreds of civilian causalities. The Bureau of Investigative Journalism believes that more than 350 strikes have taken place in Pakistan since 2004, and 3,378 people may have been killed, including 885 civilians. That has fed into anti-west feeling, with 74% of Pakistanis now seeing the US as an enemy, and only 17% supporting its use of unmanned strikes.

One victim was Daud Khan, a local tribal elder from Datta Khel, who was killed in March 2011, along with 40 other people, while attending a jirga, which is a peaceful council of elders. His son, Noor Khan, has launched legal proceedings in the United Kingdom, alleging that the British Government provided locational intelligence to the CIA about individuals of interest to the United States and that this intelligence is then used to direct drone attacks in Pakistan. The legal statement for the case asserts that if Government officials assisted the CIA to direct armed attacks in Pakistan, they are, in principle, liable under domestic criminal law. Such allegations damage our relationship with Pakistan, which will draw its own inferences from the Government’s refusal to confirm or deny whether intelligence has been shared with the United States.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for bringing this matter to the House. Does he agree that, while we regret the loss of civilian lives, the drones’ military objective of taking on terrorism is vastly important? Is it not better to use them to save British Army lives?

[Rehman Chishti]

I thank the hon. Gentleman. That is an important point. I am not against the use of drones, but it has been asserted that the United States operates drone strikes not simply against known targets, but against suspects, and that is completely unacceptable when somebody may or may not be an insurgent. Drones have their place; if they can be deployed, and the intelligence is good, of course we have to look at using them. However, in Pakistan, there have been 885 fatalities in 3,330 strikes, which is completely unacceptable. I am therefore asking the Minister for assurances that we will ensure that drones are linked to proper intelligence. If steps can be taken to avoid civilian casualties, drones can, of course, be used to target known militants, as they have been.

2nd Battalion the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Thursday 18th October 2012 Commons Chamber

[Simon Danczuk]

I entirely agree. That is particularly important in places such as Rochdale, where the level of unemployment is unhealthily high.

Hundreds, if not thousands, of people throughout our town have served in the Fusiliers, and continue their association with the regiment. Through the Royal British Legion and the Fusiliers Association, we regularly celebrate the commitment and dedication of these soldiers.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Member for Basildon and Billericay (Mr Baron) on initiating the debate. As the only Northern Ireland Member present, I should like to record our thanks to the regiment for the work that it has done in Northern Ireland, for the distinction with which it has served, and also for its contribution to the peace process and where we are today, because it can take some credit for that.

A retired major who had served for approximately 20 years approached me and told me that this was a disgrace. The force that he had signed up to had promised to take care of him and his family when he put his life on the line for his country, and now, through Government policy, his country was abandoning those who had sacrificed their physical and mental health in fulfilling Government policy. It was not their choice to fight in various different countries, but they were commanded to do it and they did it. Does my hon. Friend agree with the question that they ask—

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle)]

Order. I think that we have got the point.

May I appeal to everyone? A lot of Members are taking a lot of interest in this very important subject. If interventions are short, they will all be able to contribute to the debate. The longer the interventions, the less likely it is that we shall hear all who wish to speak, and I believe that it is important for everyone to speak.