Oral Answers to Questions

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Monday 25th February 2013 Commons Chamber

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

In Portsmouth and the surrounding area, we have world-leading maritime infrastructure, including dockyards, port facilities, marinas, protected and controlled waters, Europe’s largest hydrodynamic tank and a host of high-end maritime electronics system design and integration facilities. As well as maintaining the 200,000 tonnes of warship that will soon be in the harbour, ought we not to be capitalising on those assets too?

[Mr Dunne]

My hon. Friend is right to highlight the wide range of world-class defence-based skills around the maritime industry in Portsmouth. We will continue to capitalise on the capabilities offered around Her Majesty’s naval base, providing vital defence jobs for thousands in Portsmouth and the surrounding area, including along the M27 in Eastleigh.

Maritime Surveillance

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Thursday 7th February 2013 Westminster Hall

[Mr Arbuthnot]

Maritime surveillance is carried out at the moment in a nationwide fashion. To my mind, it is difficult to see how smaller units or entities could have a separate capability not backed up by MOD resources. We as a Committee have not reached that conclusion however, as my hon. Friend knows, because we have not yet concluded our inquiry into the defence consequences of an independent Scotland. When making their decision on independence, the Scottish people will need to take that issue very seriously into account. I am grateful to my hon. Friend for raising that important point.

The 2010 SDSR gave a commitment to enhancing ISTAR. In reply to the debate or later, will the Minister say what progress has been made in taking forward the development and strengthening of maritime ISTAR? What actual measures can he tell us about? What risk are the Government taking in delivering maritime ISTAR for the future?

Our report also looked at the future of maritime surveillance capabilities and what was required. We thought, frankly, that the MOD was sending out mixed messages. On the one hand, its studies identified a maritime patrol aircraft as the solution in the short to medium term, but on the other hand, a maritime patrol aircraft is not in the equipment programme. The MOD seems prepared to wait until the 2015 SDSR before making any decisions or assessing options. It seems to regard the risk as tolerable, on the basis that such equipment could be bought with unprecedented speed and efficiency. I have high hopes for the MOD’s acquisition process being reformed dramatically, but that might be the triumph of hope over experience.

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

Does my right hon. Friend acknowledge that the report found that, though we had concerns over the situation in the short to medium term, the MOD has begun to explore options for future maritime surveillance in the much longer term, looking at unmanned systems and space technology in particular?

[Mr Arbuthnot]

I do acknowledge that. My hon. Friend, whose membership of the Select Committee is extremely helpful, anticipates a point that I was about to come on to—as I would expect her to.

Situations change rapidly: we have been deployed in Libya, and we are now involved in Mali. The question is whether the Ministry of Defence could rapidly regenerate a maritime surveillance requirement. Will the Minister set out what general contingencies are in place to deal with the unexpected? The problem is that he probably cannot, because they are unexpected, but we nevertheless need to have a general ability to deal with contingencies.

We also highlighted the potential for further capability gaps to emerge in maritime surveillance. For example, the Sea King will be taken out of service in 2016, to be replaced by Project Crowsnest, operating from Merlin mark 2 helicopters. The Minister has now confirmed that there will be a capability gap, as Crowsnest is not coming into service until 2020 and existing assets will be required to cover the gap. Will he tell us why that gap has occurred, and why it was not better anticipated?

In the longer term, as my hon. Friend the Member for Portsmouth North (Penny Mordaunt) rightly points out, the Government have committed themselves to exploring all the alternatives for maritime surveillance provision, including unmanned aerial vehicles and hybrid air vehicles. We commend them on that approach and the work that they have already undertaken to facilitate it.

We are grateful to the Government for their commitment to keeping us updated on the issues and to including wider cross-Government issues in such updates. We look forward to the first update in summer 2013, and to the second in summer 2014. We expect the updates to be as full as possible and in a form that we can share as widely as possible. An important part of the work on future maritime surveillance will be specific work in the run-up to the next SDSR. Some might say that that will be the most important part of the next defence review.

--- Later in debate ---

[Bob Stewart (Beckenham) (Con)]

It is a genuine pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Brady, and I thank our Chairman, my right hon. Friend the Member for North East Hampshire (Mr Arbuthnot), for pressing for this debate. While I am in this congratulatory mood, may I also thank the Clerks of the Defence Committee who, with the advisers, have really done all the work?

I classify maritime surveillance as the ability to see and understand what is happening above, on and below the sea, as well as along the coastline. We need to do that not just around the United Kingdom, but throughout the NATO area of responsibility. We also need to support our deployed operations when they are outside the NATO area. Maritime surveillance involves a combination of platforms and sensors to provide a 3-D picture of what is happening, and it uses the combined work of satellites, aircraft, helicopters, ships and submarines. Our maritime surveillance capability has been eroded gradually since the end of the cold war, and significantly reduced since the 2010 strategic defence and security review.

What capabilities have we lost? Most importantly, as we all know in the Defence Committee, we have lost the Nimrod MRA4 maritime patrol aircraft programme. We all understand and accept the reasons for that, but it does not stop us worrying about it. The Nimrod would have been the lynchpin of our maritime surveillance capability if it had been brought into service. The Ministry of Defence says that the UK has a maritime surveillance capability gap; it acknowledges it a little grudgingly but accepts that that gap cannot be covered by the assets that we have in service at the moment. Getting a maritime patrol aircraft back in service is probably the key to solving the problem. A large maritime patrol aircraft fitted with modern sensors, weapons and systems is operationally very flexible. The old roles of the UK’s maritime patrol aircraft fleet included strategic tasks such as intelligence gathering and, as my friend the hon. Member for Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock (Sandra Osborne) said, the protection of our continuous strategic nuclear deterrent at sea with the Royal Navy’s Trident submarines. What does that mean? It means that a maritime patrol aircraft would ensure that our one ballistic submarine at sea providing our deterrent was not tailed by an enemy submarine without its knowledge. The need for that has not diminished.

Our country is internationally responsible for search and rescue to about 1,200 nautical miles into the Atlantic. Right now, however, we can only really reach out to 240 nautical miles, which is the extreme range of the Sea King search and rescue helicopters. We are thus failing to meet our international Atlantic oversight obligations. Of course, the Ministry rightly maintains—I would say the same if I was in the Ministry of Defence—that we can turn to our allies, and the French, Portuguese and Spanish all have maritime patrol aircraft.

Close to shore, we rely on the excellent services provided by the our ageing military Sea King fleet, which will go out of service in 2016, as my right hon. Friend the Member for North East Hampshire said. Of course, we must not forget that the coastguards also have some search and rescue helicopters. In effect, short-range search and rescue operations—by short range, I mean out to 240 nautical miles—are conducted by a mix of military and contractor-operated helicopters, which do an excellent job. They are aided hugely by those incredible men and women of the Royal National Lifeboat Institution, who regularly put their lives at risk when there is a need, regardless of the foul weather, to help people in distress. Everyone in the House will agree that they are fantastic.

Fixed-wing aircraft are just one part of the equation. Maritime patrol aircraft have historically been teamed with the Royal Navy’s frigates, destroyers and organic helicopters in a range of roles, including not just anti-submarine warfare, but search and rescue. Once again, the decisions in SDSR 2010 have had a cumulative impact.

[Penny Mordaunt]

Does my hon. Friend agree that, as well as being able to take a more co-ordinated and strategic approach in the future, the maritime security and oversight group and the National Maritime Information Centre, which our Chairman mentioned, can help to mitigate some of the gaps my hon. Friend has correctly identified?

[Bob Stewart]

I thank my hon. Friend. I certainly do agree. It is good that we have those bodies, and I may speak about that a little at the end.

SDSR 2010 got rid of a number of frigates, including Type 22s and Type 23s, as well as their on-board helicopters. That has further reduced our maritime reach and capabilities. The good thing about such Royal Navy vessels is that they can travel great distances, remain at sea for considerable periods and, crucially, demonstrate intent and presence when that is needed, as part of a combined taskforce or individually.

Collectively, members of the Defence Committee are concerned about the loss of our sovereign long-range maritime surveillance capability. They are also concerned about the United Kingdom’s current dependency on its allies for operations out into the Atlantic and in terms of our wider military defence capability.

The Committee was advised that the anti-submarine warfare capability gap that resulted from the loss of the Nimrod MRA4 is covered by a mix of helicopters, ships at sea and support by our allies. I do not buy that argument. The external situation has not changed. Indeed, with a resurgent Russia and the proliferation of smaller submarines in many areas of the world, it has arguably got worse. To counter such threats, the UK has reduced its capability and capacity by removing maritime patrol aircraft completely, as well as by removing appropriate frigates and destroyers, including their organic helicopters.

As has been mentioned, the Ministry is considering a number of future options. In particular, a decision on maritime patrol aircraft may be considered as part of SDSR 2015. However, such a decision would result in delivery of the new operational capability closer to the 2020 time scale. I would prefer us not to wait until 2015 to make such a decision. I would like it to be considered as soon as possible.

Military Justice System

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Thursday 31st January 2013 Westminster Hall

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

I draw attention to my interest as a member of reserve forces.

I was the Member of Parliament who asked the Select Committee on Defence, of which I am a member, to take evidence from the Service Complaints Commissioner on some of the issues touched on by the hon. Member for Bridgend (Mrs Moon). I asked because of some of my casework as Member of Parliament for Portsmouth North.

I congratulate the hon. Lady on securing this debate. I will raise various points, but it is important to put on record that these cases are not the norm. I say that not to belittle the issues that have been raised or to dispute the figures that she quoted. The one message that must go out from this Chamber today is that if someone in the armed forces has been the victim of such behaviour, they must report it. As a member of the Royal Naval Reserve, I would say it is their duty to do so. We must ensure that people do not lose confidence in their ability to report such matters.

I am glad the hon. Lady recognises that our armed forces are highly professional, and I testify that the training we receive and the protocols we are taught are extremely politically correct—in fact, they might be a little over the top for our own Speaker—but they are very good. The emphasis in training on leadership, responsibility and integrity is important. I disagree with her on the armed forces’ ability to address equality issues with their own people without relying on external trainers; I think they can address that in-house.

The hon. Lady might wish to seek out Captain Hancock, as she now is, who received her fourth band of gold on the day I passed out of Dartmouth. She has done an amazing amount of work on equality in the armed forces and is a real trailblazer. I think she was the first female club swinger for that service.

We must recognise that the cases we are discussing are not the norm, and we must also recognise the good work that has gone on. In her session before the Defence Committee, Dr Sue Atkins highlighted many examples of good practice, such as how the Royal Navy addressed the backlog of complaints that all the services were facing by being extremely pragmatic, by empowering people lower down the command chain to clear the general admin cases—issues about pay, terms and conditions, and so on—and by putting resources into the more serious issues that the hon. Lady has raised.

The bulk of the cases addressed by the Service Complaints Commissioner are on things such as pay and admin. I have raised with the Minister many times the importance of getting that right and the woes of joint personnel administration. It is important to learn from that and to note that the lessons and good practice that are going on in one service are being shared across the other services. There are many things in the Service Complaints Commissioner’s report that give us confidence for the future.

Unfortunately, things go wrong, particularly in a case I have dealt with: a nasty assault that I will not detail, although the Minister is aware. I will highlight a few learnings from that. First, it would be helpful if serious allegations are immediately picked up centrally. The chap I was dealing with, after he made his allegation, was placed back in the unit with the perpetrators of the assault. That is absolutely wrong, and if allegations were picked up centrally, that would not happen.

Secondly, there are clearly complexities in taking statements from individuals. Someone may be deployed between an incident happening and being reported, but it is important that we ensure such investigations take place swiftly.

Thirdly, there must be support for the individual. From my experience, I praise the work of the Royal Marines. The chap I was dealing with is from the Army. He had a placement on light duties with the Royal Marines, which was not only a way of parking him until things were resolved; there was proactive work to help him to get his confidence back. That was deeply impressive.

I also want to highlight support for families. People who have experienced a traumatic event often leave their unit and their service accommodation to stay with their parents, who are sometimes elderly. With the emotions they are going through, such people might be violent or kicking off a bit, and dealing and coping with that is particularly hard for older parents. In cases I have seen, the Service Complaints Commissioner and the Naval Families Federation were wonderful: they got in touch with the individual, and were able to provide him with a safe house to go to when things got a bit too much at home.

Finally, we must be aware of how we deliver sometimes bad news to victims of assaults. If an investigation has not gone their way, or if a panel has made a decision that might be difficult for them to hear, support for the commanding officer or the other ranks who may have to deliver that news is vital. On occasion that is done badly. In the case I was dealing with, for example, the parents were asked to be the messenger, which is not good.

We must ensure that people are properly supported. Such cases are not the norm, but they are evidence for why the Service Complaints Commissioner’s role is incredibly important. Her intervention in the cases I have dealt with has been extremely useful. She respects the chain of command, but she points out what is not acceptable. She gives practical help to the individuals and families involved, and, as an individual and an office, she can call on a great network of people across the services. Although this guy was from the Army, the Navy and the Marines provided assistance.

The Service Complaints Commissioner is frustrated in acting swiftly and having basic common sense taken up and acted upon. We must support her and the role. I agree with her call that she should be an ombudsman, which would make a difference in the small cases where we have difficult issues to address. She should be allowed to investigate and report on some of those issues. Given the myriad figures quoted by the hon. Lady, everyone would benefit from ensuring we have got the facts right.

Complaints are seen as an employer-employee dispute. If someone makes a complaint and then dies, whether it is in service or if they are hit by a bus when crossing the road, the complaint dies with them. That is deeply unsatisfactory not only for the family of the victim, but for the person against whom the accusation has been made. The Service Complaints Commissioner ought to be involved in the development of the military covenant, and certainly with its annual report.

Those are all sensible measures that would help to get better outcomes for victims and better support for commanding officers.

[Bob Stewart]

As I recall, Dr Atkins said that she is often overwhelmed by the cases and overfaced by many of the problems.

[Penny Mordaunt]

There is a resource issue. The bulk of the cases the Service Complaints Commissioner is addressing are technical. Although serious for the people making the complaints, the cases are about terms and conditions, pay and so on. We need to address her resources, but we must also consider how she may use them and who else she can call on.

The things we would like to see for the Service Complaints Commissioner are completely compatible with the chain of command. I thank the Minister for his support with the casework issues I have raised with him. When we deal with tough stuff such as this, and the general challenge of defence, it is reassuring that we have a ministerial team that, as well as talking the talk, has walked the walk. The Minister is a former Territorial Army officer for the Royal Anglian Regiment, and his colleagues have distinguished service careers, too. I think he appreciates what needs to happen for us to improve on the good work that has already gone on.

We all owe Dr Sue Atkins a tremendous debt of gratitude for her excellent work in moving this agenda on, day to day, whether speaking at a warrant officers’ conference or in the work she does on these complaints.

My hon. Friend the Member for Canterbury (Mr Brazier), who is not here today, deserves a mention. The way that he dealt with the case of Sergeant Danny Nightingale, getting the balance right between justice and the debt and duty of care that we owe to those—

[Jim Dobbin (in the Chair)]

Order. I remind hon. Members that the case of Danny Nightingale is sub judice and should not be mentioned in this Chamber.

[Penny Mordaunt]

I apologise, Mr Dobbin.

The balance that my hon. Friend struck on those issues, between justice and our duty of care to individuals who serve, and the services that they work in, shows exactly how we should approach these issues.

[Mrs Moon]

The hon. Member for Canterbury (Mr Brazier) wanted to attend, but he is serving on a Bill Committee and that is the only reason why he is not here.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jim Dobbin (in the Chair)]

I remind hon. Members that we are time-limited.

[Penny Mordaunt]

That was my final point, Mr Dobbin. I thank the hon. Lady for her intervention and for securing today’s debate.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Minister of State, Ministry of Defence (Mr Mark Francois)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship this afternoon, Mr Dobbin. I start by congratulating the hon. Member for Bridgend (Mrs Moon) on securing this important debate. It is testimony to her determination to raise the profile of the issues under examination today, and I know that she takes these matters seriously. She kindly said that I do as well, and I hope that in my remarks over the next few minutes, I will be able to persuade her and the rest of the Chamber that I intend to continue taking this issue seriously.

Our armed forces can be asked to deploy anywhere in the world, often in unstable areas. That kind of agility and reach, coupled with the professionalism that is their hallmark, requires the highest standards of discipline. In order to enforce those standards, they are subject to a justice system that, although encompassing the key tenets of the UK criminal justice system, is, to some extent, separate and distinct from it. That point was made clearly by my hon. Friend the Member for Beckenham (Bob Stewart), who brings to bear in this debate his personal experience as the commanding officer of a regular infantry battalion—and a very good battalion at that.

The system that we have in place reflects both the unique role of the armed forces and the environment in which they live and work. It recognises offences specific to the armed forces and calls to account those who are found, after a proper investigation, to have fallen short of the high standards that we rightfully expect. The Armed Forces Act 2006 drew together the disciplinary systems of the three services, so that all service personnel are dealt with under a common system. Acknowledging that our armed forces train and operate in some countries with legal systems unlike our own, the service justice system applies a single code, based on our own criminal laws, transportable anywhere in the world.

Separate from the service justice system, but acting in parallel with it, is the distinct service complaints process. That has been a matter of considerable discussion this afternoon, and was raised by my hon. Friend the Member for Portsmouth North (Penny Mordaunt), the hon. Members for Chippenham (Duncan Hames), for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) and for West Dunbartonshire (Gemma Doyle) as well as the hon. Member for Bridgend. The Service Complaints Commissioner, Dr Susan Atkins, and her staff act as an independent starting point for personnel who want to make a complaint but are concerned about how their chain of command might deal with it. In addition, they provide independent oversight of how the complaints system is working and report back to Ministers and Parliament. In cases of bullying, harassment or discrimination, the MOD is obliged by law to update the commissioner on progress with allegations that she has referred to the chain of command for investigation.

I have great respect for the role of the commissioner and recognise the enormous benefits that we have derived from Dr Atkins’s unique, independent position. I met Dr Atkins before Christmas and will do so again in March. We are actively engaging with her to determine what further resources, including staff, we can offer to assist her in carrying out her important work. One thing that we will discuss in March is the expected benefits of the changes that we have just made this month to speed up the administration of the complaints system—changes that I believe will have a real effect in 2013. For instance, we are encouraging greater use of informal means of resolution, and stressing to commanding officers the importance of getting to grips with complaints early to maintain unit cohesion and, ultimately, operational effectiveness.

In addition, we have also provided a formalised avenue for the Service Complaints Commissioner to approach commanding officers directly, so that if she feels that a complaint has not been dealt with with sufficient alacrity, she can now formally approach the relevant commanding officer and raise that personally with that CO, in order to allow that to progress. To some degree—to be as complete as possible—that already happened in some cases informally, but we wanted to formalise it to make it clearer that the SCC had that right in just about all cases. She—and she can be quite a feisty lady, I have to say—can now go to a CO directly, bang the table and say, “You’ve not dealt with this in the way you should have done”, or “You’ve not dealt with it quickly enough.” By that method, she can accelerate the process.

As I say, we have just brought in those reforms. They have literally just begun, but we believe that they will help to speed up the process. Where there have been delays, we hope that the changes will help to reduce them significantly in 2013.

[Penny Mordaunt]

Will the Minister give way?

[Mr Francois]

I gladly give way to Sub-Lieutenant Mordaunt.

[Penny Mordaunt]

I thank the Minister for giving way. That is excellent news, and from the cases that I have been dealing with, I know that it will help greatly, so that is a good thing. Will the SCC also have similar powers if she spots trends with less serious complaints, such as admin, or something that can easily be rectified? Can she speak directly to someone who could rectify that situation?

[Mr Francois]

My understanding is that the SCC can go directly to a commanding officer about any complaint. She can use her discretion. Whether she would want to go to the CO about every single matter is an issue of balance, and a judgment for the commissioner herself, but she has the formal right to do so if she wishes. If, for some reason, a relatively minor complaint has been—to use a colloquialism—gummed up in the system for some time, she would have the option to go straight to the CO in the unit and say, “Do what you can to speed it up, please.” In our discussions in March, I am hoping to review those matters and take stock of how the new system has been operating in the first three months or so. We believe that it will help to speed up the process materially.

The hon. Member for Bridgend kindly acknowledged that she and I met in early January to discuss sexual offences involving service personnel. I trust that she left that meeting in the MOD with no doubts whatever about how seriously I take her concerns.

Deployment to Mali

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Tuesday 29th January 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

I have already made a commitment that there will be another statement on the outcome of the meetings today. It may be next week; it may be sooner. As soon as we are in a position to inform the House, we will do so. I completely agree with the hon. Gentleman. Of course there is no appetite to be sucked into another war—there never is—but there is an appetite to be safe and secure. There is an appetite to ensure that terrorists cannot establish freedom of movement in an area such as the Sahel in order to attack us in the future. I say again that this appears to me to be a very limited and well-leveraged intervention by Britain in support of the French, who have deployed significant numbers of troops and equipment, and who are doing the heavy lift alongside the Malians. What we are now proposing to do is help to reinforce the English-speaking African countries which have also indicated that they are prepared to contribute forces to deal with this as a regional problem. That is the right way to solve such a problem, and our limited support for it is a highly effective way of Britain leveraging its capabilities.

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

Non-interventionism is in vogue, but does the Secretary of State agree that because of the nature of the UK, our trade routes and our status, we have huge interests across the world, and consequently, that this sort of capacity-building exercise is time and money well spent?

[Mr Hammond]

I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend. I remind her and other hon. Members of the risks to our society and the societies of our allies if we allow areas of ungoverned space to fall under the control of al-Qaeda and its associates and to become a place where they can plan and execute attacks on our interests.

Nuclear Deterrent

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Thursday 17th January 2013 Commons Chamber

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

I want to speak in support of continuous at-sea deterrence—CASD—and explain why it is still relevant and required. Those who disagree tend to mischaracterise the threat in terms of their assessment of the behaviours and future intentions of specific nation states, or underestimate the threat from hostile non-state organisations, or conclude that CASD is a redundant concept because there may be emerging threats that it cannot effectively deter. Such arguments often hinge on the premise that one or more of the necessary conditions for credible deterrence is missing, those conditions being that the aggressor we are seeking to deter has rational political leadership, that the behaviours to be deterred must be a genuine threat to the vital interests of the UK, and that there is a concept of use—an identifiable capability and a declared policy of intent. Opponents of CASD say that there will be no re-emergence of a major direct threat, otherwise known as Russia. They say that other hostile states, such as Iran, fail the rationality criterion to justify the retention of the deterrent, that CASD is of no use against a non-state terrorist organisation whose identity might be unknown and, even if it is known, that there may be no target against which to retaliate.

I say—this is at the heart of the issue—that it is not possible to predict with absolute certainty the intentions or future actions of countries such as North Korea, or what might happen if China, for example, fell under the control of a malign regime. To dismiss Iran’s foreign policy as irrational is also a mistake. It might be unpredictable and it is certainly obnoxious, but that is not the same as irrational. To reject the deterrent—which works in most scenarios—because it does not work in all scenarios is also illogical.

Finally, Russia’s behaviour towards NATO is becoming increasingly aggressive. Last year, Russia’s chief of general staff spoke openly about a first strike against US missile defence installations in Poland and Romania, and Putin shunned both the Chicago summit and the G8. Most commentators are pointing towards growing instability in Russia, a country that, we estimate, today has 12,000 warheads, 4,650 of which are active. We cannot dismiss the possibility of Russia being a real threat over the lifetime of the next generation of the deterrent.

That is the world we live in and it is the world we must prepare for when we renew our capabilities. If we reject CASD, we ought not to kid ourselves that it is not just the UK’s status and influence that we would lose, or that we would successfully achieve our prime duty as parliamentarians and as a Government to protect the United Kingdom, including those who live in Scotland.

Defence Personnel

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Thursday 6th December 2012 Commons Chamber

[Dr Lewis]

I not only agree with the hon. Gentleman but pay tribute to him. I have listened year in, year out while he has raised this subject consistently in debate after debate. He is a champion of service personnel in relation to housing matters.

I know something about this problem because I was recently approached in connection with the situation in the New Forest, a large part of which is protected, with very little available in the way of new housing. What happens if there is only a waiting list to offer to people? Should returning service personnel jump to the head of that waiting list over other people who have been on it for a considerable period? Dr Milroy says that his charity has seen many cases where individuals have taken a copy of the charter to the local authority,

“and the LA has laughed.”

He says that the real problem is that

“if there are no available houses it is a pointless exercise. Until the Government put resource behind this I can’t see things changing.”

Above all, he draws attention to the fact that we are heading for a “huge redundancy programme” that will result in a large increase in the numbers of ex- servicemen returning to civilian lives. Phrases such as “the emperor’s new clothes” feature in his remarks about the covenant, because, as he says, it is a fine idea but it will not change the situation unless backed by resources.

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

Given the challenges with service accommodation and some of the estates that we have, does my hon. Friend agree that there might be opportunities to introduce a right-to-buy scheme for armed forces families?

[Dr Lewis]

Yes, absolutely. I believe that the Government are working on schemes that will make it possible for ex-service personnel to get their foot on the housing ladder. I look forward to what I hope will be positive recommendations by the Minister on this subject.

--- Later in debate ---

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

I was tempted to say “Finally”, Mr Deputy Speaker. I draw the House’s attention to my interest as a member of the reserve forces.

It is appropriate that I started today in Portsmouth at the rededication service of the Falklands memorial plantation on Portsdown hill. It is right that we remember those who made the ultimate sacrifice, acknowledge the courage and professionalism of all those involved in securing that victory and celebrate their legacy. We should do the same for our armed forces in Afghanistan. I know that not all Members agree with our mission in Afghanistan, but, whether we are pro or anti, we must acknowledge not only the skills, courage and professionalism of our armed forces, but their achievements —and not only those achievements in the area of our own national security.

I was in Afghanistan last week with the Defence Committee. While in Lashkar Gah, we had the privilege of meeting members of the provincial peace council. We saw a town that had new schools, including girls’ schools, and whose new governor was in India at a cotton expo, and around us were car lots, wedding shops and all sorts of businesses springing up. We were patting them on the back for their remarkable achievements, but their response was clear. They said, “These achievements are not ours. They are the achievement of your brave armed forces.” They have created the security, space and stability for those lasting changes to occur. I wonder whether, if we added up everything we all might achieve in our long—in my case short—political careers, it would ever come close to the achievement of our troops out there.

Our troops have achieved something else. This is a subtler point. The presence of such professional, diverse and well respected forces has changed for ever the view of the Afghan people of what it means to wear a uniform. When we were out there, President Karzai said that no rich men’s sons were in the Afghan army, but I think that will change because of the presence of our armed forces. We need to talk about that, especially as transition takes place.

We also need to tell our troops that. While I was in Lashkar Gah, I visited a forward operating base called Sparta. Speaking to Afghans in the neighbouring base, I learned that the further away they were from centres of communication in Kabul and Bastion, the less they knew about the achievements being made. We should be putting those achievements on paper-based communications to our troops, perhaps even on their daily or weekly orders. I raised that point before I left the country, and I hope that the Minister will take it up. I can give him a head start: I think that Radio 1 is broadcasting from Afghanistan next week. I hope he will phone up and give a long list of our armed forces’ achievements.

That leads me on to communications. This is a time of immense change for our armed forces, and there are complex personnel issues that have to be dealt with. The MOD has an extremely good internal communications plan, but it is no good if that information cannot be accessed in a timely fashion. There is a problem with people being able to access joint personnel administration, because there are too few secure computer terminals in units. That issue has been raised many times with me, and I am not just talking about the reserves. Surprisingly, not everyone has a personal e-mail account—I met several sergeant-majors in Bastion who did not have one—so it is difficult to get information to people quickly. If we want our armed forces to respond to consultation, especially if they are on JPA, we must do better.

The other communications issue I wish to touch on is a localised one to do with Afghanistan and Camp Bastion in particular. During Operation Herrick 9, our armed forces had free access to the internet, and although they have some access now, it is limited and they have to pay $90 a month to access wider broadband services, such as those that allow them to Skype their family. I raised this issue before I left the country. It is being looked into, but I am sure the Minister will want to know what can be done, especially as transition continues and welfare issues get pared down, as my right hon. Friend the Member for North East Hampshire (Mr Arbuthnot) pointed out. Being able to Skype back home will become even more important as troops pull out. I hope the Minister takes that on board.

[Jack Lopresti]

Will my hon. Friend give way?

[Penny Mordaunt]

I am sorry; I am very short on time.

On welfare services, I pay tribute to all who support and honour our armed forces, particularly—I hope hon. Members forgive me; I have my Portsmouth hat on—the Naval Families Federation and the Royal Navy and Royal Marines charities, which do an amazing job. I want to raise with the Minister again the Service Complaints Commissioner. The role needs to become an ombudsman. We need to review the rules that categorise a complaint as an employee grievance—if the person making a complaint is killed in action, it is dropped and not pursued. I urge the Minister to make best use of Dr Susan Atkins while she is still in post. She has done a tremendous job. He should encourage her to do the review that she wants to do before she goes.

I pay tribute to our armed forces. We do not talk about them enough in this place—actually, we never could—but at least we have had the opportunity to do that today.

Military Covenant

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Wednesday 21st November 2012 Commons Chamber

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

It is not long ago that people taking a stroll around the pubs in Westminster or elsewhere in the country would often see posters saying that members of the armed forces were not welcome to drink there. As a country, we have undergone a massive cultural change in our level of appreciation of our armed forces and how we show it. We hope that the armed forces covenant will take things to a new level, and it is tremendously important that this is led by the Government and local authorities.

[Neil Parish (Tiverton and Honiton) (Con)]

On 18 July, Lyndon Chatting-Walters of 9 Parachute Squadron, Royal Engineers was blown up in Afghanistan and came home with serious injuries. While he was still very ill and at home having them dealt with, he had to sign a form for compensation, and that is now being used to reduce his compensation package. He is seriously ill, and we need to deal with this situation.

[Penny Mordaunt]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. I was going to make five brief points to the Minister about what he should be focusing on as he develops the covenant, and the role of Service Complaints Commissioner was top of the list. It is a unique position. The person has tremendous knowledge and expertise, yet they were not involved in developing the armed forces covenant and they are not involved in the writing of the annual report. It would be tremendously helpful if the Minister could rectify that.

Secondly, I was going to mention the integration between civilian services and services in the armed forces, where health care tops the list of areas that need to be examined. Thirdly, the covenant is really a call to arms. It is a call for good ideas to be brought forward and acted on, so will the Minister ensure that he has enough resources and capacity to be able to examine them and implement them? Fourthly, a lot of money is being put into all kinds of organisations that provide services and support to our armed forces, in part because of the kind of operations we are undertaking at the moment. That might not be the case in the future, so I urge all Departments to take a long-term view of how they plan to upkeep those rehabilitation services when there is less money coming in.

Finally, I ask the Minister to examine the low-level issues as well as the headlines. We have had wonderful, long overdue announcements under the covenant in areas such as education and in vitro fertilisation, but we need to address the downright boring stuff that will make a great difference to men and women in our armed forces, for example, getting their joint personnel administration accounts to work and getting the shower fixed when they are overseas. I urge him to examine those issues and not let up on reforms in that area. I also just wish to say that I am delighted that he is at the helm, and I think that great things can be done under this initiative.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

Thank you for your brevity. I call Jim Shannon.

Future Reserves 2020

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Thursday 8th November 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

Let me be clear about the numbers. The 30,000 figure represents the total trained strength of the Army Reserve in 2018. We currently have a trained strength of about 17,000. In the other two services, the current numbers are not far short of the targets. The big increase must be in the Army reserves. The challenge is to find about 13,000 more reservists over the next six years. I think that that is achievable, especially bearing in mind that in 1990—just 20-odd years ago—the Territorial Army was 72,500 strong, and that it was even stronger than that in earlier days.

However, the hon. Lady has identified what will constitute a tension. On the one hand, we want reservists to be close to regular Army units, because that facilitates training; on the other hand, we recognise that reserve units will need to be based in the recruiting areas within the centres of population, because the part-time training that reservists undertake requires them to be able to reach TA centres relatively easily. In the spring, we will set out a basing plan which I think will effectively manage that tension.

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

Let me first draw the House’s attention to my interest as a member of the reserve forces.

Does my right hon. Friend agree that the level of awareness and positive attitudes to the reserves among the regular forces is increasing massively, partly owing to the integration of training that has already taken place under the present Government?

[Mr Hammond]

I congratulate my hon. Friend, who, I believe, has just completed her reserve training. She, at least, is helping me to meet my targets.

My hon. Friend is right to point out that a key measure of success is the attitude of serving regulars to their reservist colleagues. Training together, working together and deploying together is crucial. I have asked regulars in Afghanistan privately, in the canteen, how they work with their reservist colleagues, and the universal answer is “They are no different. When we are out here, we are all doing the same job.” We need to ensure that that ethos is spread throughout the whole force, and I am confident that we shall be able to do so.

Oral Answers to Questions

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Monday 22nd October 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Robathan]

There have been no discussions with the UK Government or, as far as I am aware, with any other NATO member. As I said earlier, I think it incredible that NATO would accept in the alliance a country that would not allow the various weapons used by NATO to be stationed in or pass through it.

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

6. What the timetable is for the production of the Type 26 combat ship.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Mr Philip Dunne)]

The Type 26 global combat ship programme is still in its assessment phase, and the timetable for the build programme of the ships will be determined at the main gate investment decision, currently scheduled for the middle of the decade. Build will commence to meet the current planning assumption of the first ship entering service as soon as possible after 2020.

[Penny Mordaunt]

When the carrier work ends there will be more than 200,000 tonnes of warship in Portsmouth dockyard, and 1,000 extra sailors—numbers not seen in my city since the 1950s. There will then be a two-year gap before work starts on the Type 26. Rather than pay more to stretch out those contracts to cover that gap and retain sovereign capability, would it be a better use of funds to build some much-needed ocean patrol vessels? Would, and when might, the Minister consider such an option?

[Mr Dunne]

As my hon. Friend knows, the Ministry of Defence has a terms of business agreement with BAE Systems Maritime Naval Ships. That agreement commits the company to maintain warship design and build capability, and elements of support covering all complex service warships in the UK. The Government continue to work with BAE Systems on the utilisation of shipbuilding capability once work on the current carrier programme is complete. As my hon. Friend knows, Corvette offshore patrol vessels are currently under construction by BAE Systems in Portsmouth for the royal navy of Oman.

2nd Battalion the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers

Penny Mordaunt Excerpts

Thursday 18th October 2012 Commons Chamber

[Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con)]

I draw the House’s attention to my interest as a member of the reserve forces. I apologise for not being here at the start of the debate because I have been serving on a Bill Committee, and will consequently keep my comments short.

I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Basildon and Billericay (Mr Baron) and the Backbench Business Committee for making this debate possible. It allows us not only to air and scrutinise the nitty-gritty of Army 2020, its objectives and processes, but to show that there are many of us in this place—Back Benchers and those on the Front Bench too—who understand why this process is so difficult and painful. I am sure that will be cold comfort to members and veterans of 2nd Battalion the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers, but I hope that today brings them some comfort.

Change—any change—is hard, but it is doubly so for our armed forces. Why? Because from the moment a person begins their training, in whichever service it is, everything they do is connected to the core values, philosophy, history, achievements and sacrifices of their unit or battalion and regiment. The deep emotional connection that such training creates has a very rational purpose—to produce soldiers, sailors and airmen with the courage to fight and win. Members of the Defence Committee and other hon. Members have monitored and are monitoring that process and the data underlying those decisions. In doing so, I have asked myself three key questions.

First, are the reforms needed and is their scale justified? We all know, and often talk about the massive budget deficit that Ministers have had to deal with, but we do not often discuss its consequences. Poor financial management at the Ministry of Defence costs lives. The reforms are required, to ensure that our armed forces are never again short-changed in the kit or training that we provide, or in their pay, terms and conditions or support for their families.

Secondly, how would I like these reforms to be done? I would want the services themselves to be in the driving seat, and it is my understanding that that has been the case. Thirdly, do I agree with the criteria against which the decisions have been made? The motion clearly does not, particularly the criteria that only one battalion should be lost per regiment and that there should be no deletion of cap badges. For the reasons that I gave at the start of my speech, and because I want a wide geographical presence for our armed forces in the United Kingdom, I am in favour of those criteria. However, despite disagreeing with that technical point in the motion, I am glad that it was tabled and that it has enabled this debate, and I hope that the House will not divide on it.

We do not talk enough in this place about defence. I am grateful that today we have been able to remind this House and the country of the unique difficulty of the reforms to our armed forces, and that the debate has also enabled us to pay tribute, which I wholeheartedly do, to 2nd Battalion the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers.