Infected Blood Compensation Scheme
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(5 months, 2 weeks ago)
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John Glen
Yes I absolutely can—I have been very clear about the Government’s continuing commitment on existing support schemes. However, there is a point at which the assessment for compensation entitlement is made under the new scheme, and there will be an interaction with schemes that have come before. Options will then be set out. I want to provide reassurance on that today; the detail of how that will work out must be done with the consent and approval of the communities involved.
Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
I want to build on a point made by my right hon. Friend the Member for North Durham (Mr Jones) earlier about the risk of unscrupulous financial advisers swooping in. It is appalling even to think that it might be possible, but we have a lot of experience of that from dealing with the British Steel pension scheme, and I would be happy to discuss any of those lessons learned with the Minister.
My constituent David Farrugia tragically lost his father 40 years ago due to this appalling scandal. Can I press the Minister for more detail on the specifics of how the scheme will work for bereaved children and parents of victims? How and when will they be able to register for compensation?
John Glen
I thank the hon. Gentleman for his question. We have previously engaged on the British Steel matter and the unscrupulous exploitation of people moving from defined benefit to defined contribution schemes. That is at the top of my mind and I am applying it to my consideration of these matters.
The hon. Gentleman asked about his constituent David and bereaved children. The principle is that affected and infected individuals qualify in their own right. The passporting of affected individuals to qualify, based on the infected and the estates of infected, is clear. The details of how that process will happen will become very clear very quickly. We will make resources available through a website, and people can register for updates so that they can receive them as quickly as they wish. Forgive me, I cannot say more than that today, but I think I have set out the principles of how this will operate. The operationalisation needs to happen quickly, and I will provide updates on that in due course.
Cyber-security and UK Democracy
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(7 months, 2 weeks ago)
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The Deputy Prime Minister
Yes, we do, on both fronts. My right hon. Friend will be well aware of our National Cyber Force, but I do not comment on the conduct of that from the Dispatch Box.
Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
In January 2023, Lord Cameron of Chipping Norton—prior to his appointment as Foreign Secretary, of course—went to Sri Lanka to drum up investment for Port City Colombo, which is a belt and road project launched by President Xi, which many believe will become a military base for the Chinese navy. Following Lord Cameron’s appointment as Foreign Secretary, many freedom of information requests have been submitted to the Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office to try to shed some light on his visit to Sri Lanka, including who he met and what sort of conversations took place, but to date not a single one of those FOI requests has been complied with by the FCDO. Does the Deputy Prime Minister agree that that is a matter of the highest public interest and that sunlight is the best form of disinfectant, and therefore the FCDO should comply with those FOI requests as a matter of urgency?
The Deputy Prime Minister
The Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office always deals with FOI requests in the proper way. I have to say that trying to link Chinese cyber-attacks to our current Foreign Secretary is pretty desperate stuff. It just does not wash.
Steel Industry: Wales
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(8 months, 2 weeks ago)
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Each debate is chaired by an MP from the Panel of Chairs, rather than the Speaker or Deputy Speaker. A Government Minister will give the final speech, and no votes may be called on the debate topic.
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Dame Nia Griffith
Indeed, we do seek a just transition for the steel industry.
Of course, it is not just Trostre that Port Talbot supplies. If, as current plans indicate, the idea is to close the blast furnaces several years before the electric arc furnace is ready, all the downstream customers will need supplies. The Government could argue that if Tata closes the blast furnace in 2024 or 2025 but does not have an electric arc furnace up and running before 2027, how it bridges that gap, how it sources supplies elsewhere and how it keeps its customers happy are its problem. However, if those supplies are not there, downstream businesses could go out of business, causing huge job losses. It would be catastrophic for us in Llanelli to lose Trostre. Because the Government are putting half a billion pounds in, and because of the worry about job losses, they should seek assurances from Tata about Trostre, which is why I asked the Minister that question.
We accept that the electric arc furnace has a role to play. Indeed, CELSA Steel UK in Cardiff, a very successful business, produces steel from an electric arc furnace. However, there is work to be done to assess the suitability of the steel produced in electric arc furnaces to meet all the requirements of the products produced in Trostre. It is not as simple as throwing any old scrap into the electric arc furnace; clearly, the quality of the source material is important. I understand that a certain amount of metallics are required, which are not necessarily easy to source. We currently export scrap steel, and it is easy to see the logic of recycling that steel here in electric arc furnaces. However, we cannot assume that all that scrap steel will just turn up at the electric arc furnace in Port Talbot or at the one that I understand is planned for Scunthorpe: it must be sourced.
Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
My hon. Friend is making an absolutely excellent speech. Picking up on her point, there is a need to sweeten the mix in an electric arc furnace with iron ore-based metallics; otherwise, there is no way that we can make the high-value products such as those for the automotive sector and tin cans. Is she aware that only 3% of the world’s iron ore-based metallics are in a pellet form that can be transported across the world and put into an electric arc furnace? Does she therefore agree that by far the best option would be to keep blast furnace 4 going so that we can continue to produce the ore-based metallics for the electric arc furnace, because with 3% of the global supply there is no way that that will be possible?
Dame Nia Griffith
I absolutely agree.
The Minister has previously referred to steel as “infinitely recyclable”. It is indeed a marvellous material, which is so much easier to recover and recycle than many other materials. However, while the lifecycle of a tin can may be a matter of months, steel used in car manufacturing or construction will be tied up in those products for many years to come. I very much hope that we will see an increase in investment in infrastructure projects.
We on the Opposition side have plans to make the UK a clean energy superpower. We have so much potential in Wales, with the prospect of building floating offshore wind farms in the Celtic sea and using Port Talbot and Milford Haven to deliver and service those projects. It is just a pity that through either incompetence or stubbornness the Government have wasted a year failing to get any takers for floating offshore wind because of the unrealistically low strike price offered.
Increased renewables and increased use of electricity mean upgrading the national grid structure. We need investment in our railways, housing, hospitals and so on. Have the Minister or her Department made any assessment of how much steel the UK is likely to need in the coming decade? How much of that steel will be used for short-term products that will reach the scrap market fairly quickly, and how much will be locked in infrastructure that we hope will last for decades?
Returning to the broader picture, while I recognise the contribution that the electric arc furnace can make, it is bitterly disappointing that the Government plans look likely to leave the UK as the only country in the G20 without primary steelmaking. While countries across Europe have been working on greening the primary steelmaking process using technologies such as direct reduced iron and green hydrogen—indeed, Sweden will start production in 2025—the UK Government have not supported any such venture.
There is huge competition out there to woo investment in the green technologies of the future, whether it is the US Inflation Reduction Act or similar incentives in the EU. When we look at the €2.5 billion that Germany has invested in developing green primary steel, hon. Members will understand why we in the Labour party say that that is the sort of sum needed and why, if we were in government, we would look to invest a total of some £3 billion in the industry, rather than this Government’s £500 million.
The reasons why we now face the end of primary steelmaking in the UK must include the failure of the Government to respond adequately to the asks of the steel industry, which it has set out so clearly time and again. We have pointed out, time and again, how much cheaper energy costs are in countries such as France and Germany, while in the UK there have been specific negotiated packages.
Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Sir Gary. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Llanelli (Dame Nia Griffith) on securing the debate and on making such a powerful case both for the Trostre works in her constituency and for the entire Welsh and British steel industry.
It has been said many times, but merits repetition, that the Port Talbot steelworks in my Aberavon constituency is the beating heart of our community and our economy. For generation upon generation, the people of Aberavon have made the steel that has built our country. Quite simply, steel is who we are. This debate is not just about what steel means to my constituents; it is about our entire national story, because Britain as we know it today simply would not exist were it not for our steel industry. Steel makes everything from the cars we drive to the houses we live in and the offices we work in. It even makes the knives and forks that we eat our meals with, and the humble tin can, as my hon. Friend pointed out.
But our pride never slips into sentimentality or nostalgia. Steel is not a sunset industry, and the steelworks is emphatically not a museum. Steelworkers have experienced enormous technological change over the last 30 years, and every time they have risen to the challenge and adapted to it. When a customer asks for a new grade or quality of steel, our steelworkers deliver it. Indeed, most of the grades of steel being made in the Port Talbot steelworks today did not even exist 10 years ago. It is a hotbed of innovation, and every time I go into the steelworks—I have been many times—I am truly impressed and inspired.
When I go into the works, I also see a workforce that is deeply frustrated. The steelworkers know they are making the best steel that money can buy, but for 14 years they have been competing with one hand tied behind their back. They face almost twice the energy costs of their competitors in France and Germany. Government contracts are going to foreign steelmakers, and Royal Navy ships are being made with foreign steel. Our steelworkers are forced to look on helplessly as other Governments around the world bring forward policies, strategies and billions of pounds of investment to support their steel industries, while our Government sit on their hands. We are not here to plead for special treatment or charity; we simply demand a level playing field.
That brings me to the deal between Tata Steel and the UK Government, which is based on £500 million of taxpayers’ money being spent on making 2,800 people redundant—and that is not counting the huge impact on supply chains and contractors. As I have said, nobody is burying their head in the sand. Everyone can see that our planet is burning, and that customers around the world are looking for zero-carbon or low-carbon products. Even countries such as India and China will ultimately be forced to phase out their blast furnaces. The question is not whether the transition is coming, but how to make it work for jobs, our planet and national security.
It is crystal clear that the plan that is being pushed by Tata Steel and the UK Government fails on three counts. First, it fails on jobs. In the US, Joe Biden’s £290 billion Inflation Reduction Act is creating 170,000 green jobs. In Europe, national Governments are investing billions of euros in decarbonising their single steel plants. The UK is the only country that is throwing thousands of steelworkers on the scrapheap.
Secondly, the plan fails on decarbonisation. The Tata-Tory plan is based on importing millions of tonnes of semi-finished products from India, where steel production is 30% to 40% more carbon intensive than in the UK. The deal is based on exporting jobs from Wales to India, and importing carbon from India to Wales. You could not make it up.
Thirdly, the deal fails on our national security. Electric arc furnaces alone are not capable of making all the grades and qualities of steel that are required to meet the current order book, let alone to embrace the opportunities of the future. The result, in this dangerous and turbulent world, is that the UK will be the only country in the G20 that is unable to make its own steel from scratch. That is madness.
Tata has a choice. It could carry on with both blast furnaces for the foreseeable future, which would mean losing customers, making big losses and eventually closing. Nobody wants that. It could go for the 3 million tonne electric arc furnace-only model, which forces a dependency on scrap steel and on imports while making 2,800 people redundant. Let us call that the cliff-edge option.
The final and best option is to adopt the compelling multi-union plan, which would protect 2,300 jobs nationwide over a decade and would see no compulsory redundancies at Port Talbot. In that plan, blast furnace No. 4 would continue to run until the end of its lifecycle in 2032, and a combination of new technologies, such as direct reduced iron, would reduce reliance on scrap and enable Port Talbot to produce the iron ore-based metallics that are vital for the electric arc furnace to function and deliver the entire customer portfolio. Let us call that multi-union plan the bridge from where we are today to where we need to be.
I urge the Tata leadership and the UK Government to walk back from the cliff edge. Choose the bridge to 21st-century steelmaking. Choose the bridge to a committed workforce that will strain every sinew to deliver. Choose the bridge to long-term commercial competitiveness and profitability. I also say this to Tata: remember that a general election is coming, after which, I hope, Labour can deliver a new Government that will replace the chaos and incompetence with stability, predictability and diligence. In place of the laissez-faire negligence of the last 14 years, it will find Labour’s £3 billion steel renewal fund to drive and support the transformation of our steel industry in a way that sustains jobs and bolsters our national security.
Once a blast furnace is extinguished, that is it—there is no turning back. So I urge Tata not to take any decisions now that cannot be reversed following the general election. Tata and the Government can either take the path of managed decline, or they can get behind the multi-union plan. They can either take the cliff edge, or choose the bridge. Let us hope they make the right choice. We need our steel—let us value and fight for it.
Stephen Kinnock
I know that my hon. Friend is reaching the end of her speech, but something just occurred to me. I was very pleased to join the Welsh Affairs Committee evidence sessions, and during the second session I asked the Secretary of State for Wales whether the UK Government have attached any strings to their £500 million in the form of job guarantees, and whether he was clear that the electric arc furnace model is going to work without access to iron ore-based metallics. In response, he referred me to the Department for Business and Trade, and said, “Well, they struck the deal, so they should be able to answer your questions.” I wonder whether my hon. Friend might wish to add another question to her list—whether there were any strings at all attached to the £500 million.
Beth Winter
That is an extremely important question. Another question that my hon. Friend raised to which we did not get a response was on the timeframe within which the £500 million is going to be paid. A series of questions were asked during the four evidence sessions that day—if the Minister has not seen the transcript, I urge her to look at it—and a number of them remain unanswered. We have brought some of them to light here today.
My hon. Friends have spoken in much more detail about the devastating impact that the closure of the steelworks in Port Talbot, and many other businesses in Wales, is going to have on our communities. Wales was at the forefront of the industrial revolution—our communities were built on coal, iron and steel—but our history is one of wealth being extracted from our country for the benefit of a few, and that continues. This is a prime example of the lack of consideration given to the people and communities of Wales.
We can and will be at the forefront of change. The multi-union deal—indeed, all the deals that have been proposed by the trade unions—offers a solution. Wales can be at the forefront of a green industrial revolution, where the wealth is not only created in Wales but retained in our communities, so that we no longer suffer unacceptable levels of poverty and deprivation. We are a wealthy nation in terms of our natural resources, and we deserve a different future. We will continue to stand in solidarity with our workers as well as our trade unions to say that we are not going to put up with the continued extraction and exploitation of our communities in Wales. I look forward to hearing the Minister’s response to my specific questions. Diolch yn fawr.
Sarah Jones
That is not my understanding—no. What we are trying to focus on in any conversations we have about any industry on steel is what the future is and where we go from here—that is the important question.
My advice to the Minister is to go to the hon. Member for Ashfield (Lee Anderson) and talk to him about when he worked down the mines, and what happened to his communities when the mines shut—the cliff edge, the redundancies, and the closure of all the community assets that went with it. That is what we risk doing in Port Talbot with the cliff edge that we face—nearly 3,000 jobs, as well as the huge knock-on impact of one job in the plant linked to three jobs in the community. Let us not lose 3,000 jobs in Port Talbot. Do not spend half a billion pounds on that. Let that not be the Government’s legacy.
It is not too late; there is an alternative that we could all work towards. The multi-union plan helps us to transition in a way that protects jobs. That is what the Government should be talking about to Tata. It is not too late for the Government to have a steel strategy, to spend taxpayers’ money in a way that works for the UK, our economy and our security, and to listen to their own work, if not Labour’s. The Government’s 2017 review, “Future capacities and capabilities of the UK steel industry”, identified the barriers to growth: supply chains, competitiveness, skills, and research and development capability. Has the Minister read that? What is the Government’s response to that review from 2017? It could do with an update now but the basics are there. The Harrington review is clear:
“The reality is that many of our competitors chase investments via their industrial strategies backed by substantial government support…The UK needs to respond.”
Has the Minister read the Harrington review and what is the response on steel? What is the Government’s steel strategy?
Ministers talk about how important scrap is going to be, and of course it is for electric arc furnaces, but how are they incentivising measures to keep our scrap here rather than exporting it, which is currently the case? Ministers talk about how we need new technology, but electric arc furnaces are not really the new technology any more—they are years old. What are we doing to take us towards a direct reduced iron facility in the UK using hydrogen? What is the plan? What is the plan to grow the steel industry and where is the ambition? What are the Government doing about carbon border adjustment mechanisms? The steel industry will be exposed to unfair competition, so what is the Minister going to do about that? What is the plan on skills, and what is the Government’s view of the multi-union plan for steel in Port Talbot?
Many of the manufacturing industries that I meet across different sectors are at a crossroads. Bills are high, there is no strategy to support them, they are reducing their output and they are struggling to find people to work with them. The steel industry in Wales is a case in point; the Government’s last-minute, chaotic deal was a masterclass in how not to run the transition. Members across the House are worried about the future of the UK steel industry. Members across the House do not want thousands of steel workers to lose their jobs.
Stephen Kinnock
My hon. Friend is summarising the discussion extremely well. I declare an interest as a member of the transition board. During the board’s discussions, we talked about what the vacancies looked like in the labour market in south-west and south-east Wales, and the vast majority of vacancies are in the retail and healthcare sectors. Those are really important sectors and really important parts of our economy, but does my hon. Friend agree that there is not really a connection between the skills and experience of the men and women who have worked in the blast furnaces, for example, and those required to fill the vacancies in the labour market outside those steelworks, and that that is extremely worrying?
Sarah Jones
My hon. Friend makes a really good point, which is why we keep coming back to this cliff-edge approach and saying that it is not the way to transition. If we think about south Wales and the Celtic sea, we think about the huge opportunities with an industrial strategy and industry working together with Government, including the jobs and growth that we could create, but do we have any of that under this Government? No, because they do not even have the starting point of a plan for steel.
Members across the House do not want to see this country becoming the first developed country in the world without the capacity to produce primary steel. Is the Minister concerned about our defence capabilities if we lose the capacity to make steel here from scratch? Does she think that the Government’s plan is really money well spent? Can she answer the question that was originally put today: what conditionality has been placed on this deal? We keep asking for the answer to that question, but we have yet to receive it.
Labour will have clarity of vision on steel. We will invest to unlock private sector investment and we will work hand in glove with the private sector. We will use our flagship policies—the national wealth fund, GB Energy becoming a clean energy superpower, grid reform and an industrial strategy—to make the UK a place to invest in, not a place to leave.
Once again I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Llanelli for making such a brilliant speech today and I also thank all the Members who have contributed to the debate. I hope that this debate serves to raise the Government’s game, but Labour stands ready to step in if it does not.
Ms Ghani
I will in a moment.
I am on record as having had a regular, constructive relationship, so it disappoints me when Members come to this place and do not accept the reality of what was taking place in Port Talbot. If we had not provided support—the biggest support we have provided to the steel sector—there would have been a devastating effect on the entire 8,000 jobs.
Stephen Kinnock
Surely when the Government entered into a negotiation with Tata Steel, which is highly experienced in the business of negotiation, they considered the possibility that a gun was being held to their head, and that Tata Steel would of course make threats about total closure because that would strengthen their negotiating position. Were the Government completely naive or just incompetent when they went into a poker game dismissing the possibility that they might be getting bluffed?
Ms Ghani
The hon. Gentleman knows better than most that these conversations and negotiations have been going on for years. The Labour party had an opportunity to invest in the blast furnaces when it was in government, and it did not do so. He also knows that the blast furnaces are coming to the end of their life, so a decision would have to be made at some time. Tata could have decided to exit completely, which would have resulted in a loss of the 8,000 jobs and certainty in the supply chain. The hon. Gentleman knows that, because he had I have been at meetings with the unions and at the transition board. I know it is very difficult when there are potential job losses in one’s constituency, but the reality is that the model was not working.
Before I give way to the hon. Member for Croydon Central, let me say that Opposition Members constantly want harder, greener net-zero policies, and this is what happens when we flow those through. Customers—end users—want cleaner, greener steel that is made in electric arc furnaces, and this is the outcome of that demand. The reality is that, without the support, there would have been a high risk of Port Talbot and Tata no longer producing steel in the constituency of the hon. Member for Aberavon (Stephen Kinnock).
Ms Ghani
I will go on to reference that, but not all unions subscribe to the plan, as the hon. Member knows. It was put forward by a collective, but not by all of them. Tata has been clear that keeping open a blast furnace for a very narrow period of time while opening up electric arc furnaces, which will provide the certainty that we need so that we can use scrap steel in the UK, is neither credible nor financially viable. Keeping a blast furnace open also creates difficulties around security and health and safety.
The negotiations continue, and a consultation is taking place. I was asked about what I am doing to ensure that Tata is observing the parameters of that consultation. The transition board is in place, and our focus is on ensuring that the consultation is as wide and deep as it can be, and that the transition board can do the job that it was set up to do, with huge sums of money.
I have already mentioned, and I cannot reiterate enough, the threat that the Port Talbot plant was under. We recognise the vital importance of the steel industry to the community’s heritage and identity. As I have mentioned, the Government have committed £500 million —the biggest sum ever invested in the steel sector—as part of a total investment of £1.25 billion to ensure the future sustainability of Port Talbot steel. That is what we have been able to do, and we should reflect on that. The investment is a huge step towards fortifying UK steel. Sustaining the blast furnaces would entail significant additional losses for the company and compound its current issues. Moreover, as the hon. Member for Llanelli knows, the UK’s blast furnaces, such as those in Port Talbot, are approaching the end of their operational lifespan.
Stephen Kinnock
The Minister keeps saying that the blast furnaces—plural—are reaching the end of their lifespan. Yes, everybody agrees that blast furnace No. 5 is very close to the end of its lifespan; that part of the heavy end, with the coke ovens, should shut down, because the investment does not wash its face. The lifespan of blast furnace No. 4 is until 2032. It does not require that additional investment. I would be grateful if the Minister would stop saying that both blast furnaces are reaching the end of their lifespan.
Ms Ghani
The hon. Gentleman has been at the same meetings as I have, so he knows that the blast furnaces cannot be going if we are to transition in a period of time to having the electric arc furnaces up and running. However, I know that conversations are taking place with the unions, because I spoke to them this week. They are continuing to put their case forward, which is why a consultation is taking place. The hon. Member also knows that we need to give those conversations time to be followed through.
Stephen Kinnock
On a point of information, the multi-union plan is based on a 1.5 million tonne electric arc furnace. Nobody is denying that electric arc furnaces should not be in the mix. We fully support an EAF. We need a 1.5 million tonne EAF, running alongside blast furnace No. 4, not least because that blast furnace could then produce the iron ore-based metallics that are a vital part of sweetening the mix for the electric arc furnace. That would allow us to continue to deliver the current customer portfolio and be ready to embrace the opportunities of the future. I urge the Minister to recognise that we want an electric arc furnace; it is just that a 3 million tonne electric arc furnace is madness.
Ms Ghani
Three million tonne electric arc furnaces do exist in other parts of the world; it is not a unique capacity of arc furnace. I spoke to the unions on Monday, so I know that they are continuing to put their plans forward. Let us see what happens in the next few weeks.
I think everyone recognises that a transition has to take place. We have talked not only about supply chain resilience, but about how we can use scrap steel in electric arc furnaces as technology moves forward. Tata has confirmed that it will observe 90% of its supply chain contracts.
Ms Ghani
We cannot force Tata. We put the support package in place when Tata said that it was struggling and making losses of over £1 million a day, but we cannot insist that Tata continues. We have provided an offer of support, and we want to ensure that the least amount of people are impacted, that the transition board provides support for those impacted, that supply chains continue to be resilient, and that any decision Tata takes to transition is one that meets the framework it puts forward. For example, if Tata plans to continue with its plan for a 3 million tonne capacity electric arc furnace by 2027, we need to ensure that all the milestones are met.
I want to touch on the issue of procurement, which we really have to address. First, less than 1% of UK steel is needed by the defence industry, and it has nothing to do with Port Talbot. This Government have implemented the procurement pipeline, which I was committed to doing when I became the steel Minister, to encourage our steel producers to access more contracts. In the last reporting year, there was an increase in the value of UK-sourced steel, from £97 million to £365 million. It is important to put that on the record, because Ministers say that they will try to increase UK procurement and we have most definitely done so.
I am worried that we are going to run out of time. The reality is that without our support there would have been a serious conversation fundamentally about the loss of 8,000 jobs at Port Talbot. I appreciate that the Opposition cannot understand the realities of business, but under Labour employment in the UK steel industry was cut back by more than half, or 40,000 jobs. Obviously, the Opposition do not appreciate the number of jobs that we hope to have saved.
We understand that Tata’s announcement will come as a heavy blow to the people of Port Talbot, but I recognise that everyone present accepts that we cannot stop the clocks. Technology has moved on. There has to be a transition, and this is a transition in which the majority of jobs will be supported with a substantial sum of money, and of course by the transition board as well. The transition we are talking about is one that enables us to adopt new technologies, with even more allowed to be adopted further down the line. It prevents the further loss of profit and prevents a dependence on imports going forward because we can use scrap steel within our own economy.
I assure the hon. Member for Llanelli that we are committed to working with Members throughout the House to realise a brighter future for our steel-making industry. If the options proposed by Opposition Members—whether it is the £28 billion or the £3 billion—were seen as serious and credible, I am sure that Tata would have taken heed of those support packages. Obviously it thought either that they were not credible or that they would not enable it to continue to do what it wanted—to transition to electric arc furnaces—and that they could have meant even more job losses in Wales and across the UK.
Stephen Kinnock
The Minister is being generous in giving way. She said that the Tata plan would enable us to be open to new technologies. In fact, the opposite is the case because the 3 million tonne electric arc furnace negates the possibility of direct-reduced iron capability, of an open slag bath furnace and of a plate mill; the plan is closing down routes to other technologies, not opening them up.
Protecting Steel in the UK
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(9 months, 2 weeks ago)
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Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
The Port Talbot steelworks is the beating heart of our community. Generation after generation have worked in that steelworks. Port Talbot is the steelworks, and the steelworks is Port Talbot. Every time I go into that steelworks, though, I do not see something to be sentimental about; I see a hotbed of innovation. I see a workforce who are deeply committed to change and ready to embrace change. This is not about some kind of request for charity or hand-outs; this is about asking for a level playing field. This is about saying that we make the best steel that money can buy.
But for 14 long years we have been competing with one hand tied behind our backs. For 14 years we have been forced to pay twice as much for our energy as our French and German competitors. For 14 years we have seen Government contracts going to foreign steel companies. For 14 years we have seen our Government completely fail to support our steel industry in anything like the way that our competitors are doing.
Let me be absolutely clear: when we look at the deal that is now on the table, we see that it does not work for jobs, it does not work for decarbonisation, and it does not work for our national security. On jobs, 2,800 jobs are set to go, with £500 million of taxpayers’ money to pay for that privilege. On decarbonisation, the deal is based on importing millions of tons of steel from India, where steel production is 30% to 40% more carbon intensive. I am not sure if anyone has noticed, but India is 5,000 miles away, so the carbon footprint will be huge. We are literally exporting jobs from Wales to India, and importing carbon from India to Wales.
I urge Tata Steel to look again at the multi-union plan and to take the bridge, not the cliff edge. Its deal will send our workforce—our proud communities—over that cliff edge. That is not something we can accept. We have to recognise that the trade unions have put together a compelling plan; a plan that would keep one of the blast furnaces going while the transition to an electric arc furnace takes place. That is the right way—the balanced and sustainable way—of doing this. Our country needs its steel. Let’s value it. Let’s stand up and fight for it.
Sarah Jones (Croydon Central) (Lab)
This has been a powerful debate, reflecting the huge strength of feeling in this place, but also the huge knowledge and ambition for our steel industry. I was disappointed that the Minister came to this place and said that this debate was performative, less than a week after Tata Steel announced nearly 3,000 job losses. I think we all would have expected better from her.
Like many others, this afternoon I met steelworkers and union officials not only from Port Talbot, but from all the other steel sectors and steel sites across the country. They have come because they know what this announcement means for them and their future. These actions will have consequences beyond last week’s announcement. The steelworkers here today, like many of us, are baffled by the Government’s approach. They know that steel is a foundation industry. They know how crucial it is to our economy. They know that the world is uncertain—for goodness’ sake, the Prime Minister was here only this afternoon talking about strikes on Houthis in Yemen—and that having our own supply of primary steel is crucial to our security. Our genuine question is: why are the Government so content to be spending half a billion pounds on a scheme that leads to thousands of job losses?
Stephen Kinnock
On jobs, my hon. Friend will have seen that every steel industry across the G20 and around the planet is going through massive change, but the only place where there is a threat of thousands of job losses is the United Kingdom. Why does she think that might be?
Sarah Jones
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. He made a brilliant speech earlier and has been a great defender of his constituents. The lack of any plan from the Government over the last 14 years is at the heart of the problems we see today.
As the shadow Secretary of State, my hon. Friend the Member for Stalybridge and Hyde (Jonathan Reynolds), said in his opening speech, we also risk something much wider: that net zero becomes a zero-sum game for working people and we lose the public consent that we need for the transition. There is no getting away from the facts. The Government have pushed a plan that uses hundreds of millions of pounds to make thousands of people redundant. If Scunthorpe ends up going the same way—the hon. Member for Scunthorpe (Holly Mumby-Croft) made a powerful speech to the contrary—we will be unable to produce primary steel in the UK.
In the Port Talbot plan, the two blast furnaces will shut this year, with a cliff edge for jobs. For at least three years, steel will be completely imported from India and the Netherlands to feed Trostre and Llanwern in south Wales, but there is no guarantee that once the electric arc furnace is built, those jobs will stay. We know that there are huge questions about scrap steel and whether it will produce the steel we need. Many Members, including the Chair of the Business and Trade Committee, my right hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham, Hodge Hill (Liam Byrne), asked questions to which the Government have so far provided no answers.
David T. C. Davies
Let me make a little progress, as I only have about six minutes and I think Members will want me to put things on the record. The hon. Member for Birmingham, Perry Barr (Mr Mahmood) waved around the Syndex plan; as a member of Unite, surely he will be aware that it rejected that plan.
Let me go back to the situation we found ourselves in. It was not a decision of the Government to shut down the blast furnace, but one taken by Tata in the light of the losses it was making.
Stephen Kinnock
I thank the Secretary of State for giving way. Yes, it is a Tata decision, but £500 million of British taxpayers’ money is going into it. Will he set out what red lines the Government put down around that £500 million? Were there any red lines around jobs?
David T. C. Davies
It came down to this: the Government had to find a solution that was acceptable to Tata and that would save the maximum number of jobs. The Government are not paying £500 million to throw 3,000 people out of work—[Interruption.] No, the Government are paying £500 million to save 5,000 jobs, because they will be saved, as well as around 12,500 jobs in the supply chain.
David T. C. Davies
I will give way to the hon. Gentleman in a moment, because he knows more about this than many who have spoken. The reality is that Tata told us that it was looking to pull out completely from the United Kingdom. If the loss of 3,000 jobs is devastating—it certainly is—how much more devastating would 5,000 be, and 12,500 jobs in the supply chain? It was a simple choice for the Government—not a good one—between seeing 3,000 people lose their jobs or around 17,500 people lose their jobs, and possibly even more. That is why the Government committed to pay £500 million towards an arc furnace. Let me make one other thing clear: the Government will not pay a penny to Tata until that arc furnace is built.
Stephen Kinnock
I thank the Secretary of State for giving way again; he is being generous. I think there are many reasons why Tata would not be considering full closure, not least the multibillion cost of closing down the Port Talbot steelworks. The remediation costs would be absolutely astronomical, so that was never on the table. The choice was between the bad deal that the Government have done with Tata and the compelling multi-union deal. Can we please just have the facts on the table, which are that this is not about closing the plant versus the Government’s deal, but about the multi-union deal being the right way forward?
David T. C. Davies
I understand the hon. Gentleman’s position and he is right to stand up for his workers. This is the reality of the situation: that plan has not persuaded Tata. Tata has not said that it is credible. Tata has said to me that it could not go along with that plan, because although one of the blast furnaces—blast furnace No. 4—has a number of years to run, it would still come to the end of the life of the coke plant and the sintering plant, so if Tata went ahead with that proposal, it would keep open one blast furnace, which is still losing a lot of money, and then have to start importing all the coke and all the sinter that it would need for it.
There is then the technical problem in that Tata says it would be very difficult indeed to build an arc furnace next to a working blast furnace containing molten steel. [Interruption.] The hon. Gentleman can shake his head, but that is what it is saying to us. That is what it has said to us as a Government and that is why we find ourselves in the difficult, unpleasant and awful situation of having to choose between 3,000 people losing their jobs and 17,500 people losing their jobs. That is why we came to the decision we did.
David T. C. Davies
May I just continue, because I have only three minutes left?
I want to say something about those 3,000 people. I worked in a steel plant myself. I worked in Llanwern when I left school, so I am directly involved in this and I feel it. I say to the workers that I have met the trade unions on a number of occasions. In fact, I will cancel what I am supposed to be doing next and I will go out there in the Public Gallery and meet the workers, with the hon. Member for Aberavon (Stephen Kinnock) and anyone from the unions, to explain the Government’s commitment.
There is £100 million on top of the £500 million, which will be there for the community in Port Talbot. It will be there to develop infrastructure to get other companies in. But the most important thing, and the hon. Gentleman knows that I have said this in the transition board meetings, is to ensure that anyone and everyone who loses their job has the absolute maximum opportunity to retrain and do anything that they want to do as far as retraining is concerned—to help to set people up in businesses, to get them licences, to get them any training they want. There is a massive commitment from the UK Government to that and we will not turn our backs on the people of Port Talbot.
British Steel
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(12 months ago)
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Ms Ghani
I simply do not recognise the picture that the hon. Lady paints. Our recent decision on Tata Steel was welcomed by UK Steel, the organisation representing the UK sector, which said that it was the way forward. UK Steel itself has a net zero strategy, and wants to see the transition proceed apace.
Decisions have been just left to sit there, but now we are able to provide the support that is needed. What we did in Port Talbot has saved thousands of jobs and allowed the adoption of new technology which will, indeed, create thousands of jobs as well.
Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
Last Wednesday morning, Tata Steel executives in Port Talbot summoned the workforce to tell them of the plan to shut down our entire virgin steel making capability by March 2024. This was utterly shocking, because the understanding had always been that some of the heavy end would continue to function while the electric arc furnace was being constructed, but it takes years to construct an electric arc furnace. The plan is utter madness: it involves importing millions of tonnes of steel from the other side of the world. Electric arc furnaces need the products of virgin steel making, such as iron and iron ore—that is why we need direct reduced iron capability—and the loss of 3,000 jobs over a period like that is completely unacceptable and unnecessary.
When the Government did the deal with Tata Steel about Port Talbot, did they know that Tata was actually proposing not a transition at all, but a potentially lethal cliff edge for our steel industry? Did they know that Tata would be doing that? Does the Minister not agree that the idea of this process is that it should be a transition? It needs to be a bridge, not a potentially lethal cliff edge.
Ms Ghani
Tata Steel employs more than 8,000 people and 12,500 further in the supply chain. All of that would have been at risk if we had not been able to provide the certainty it needed to increase its investment to over £1 billion to allow it to transition. These are commercial decisions relating to the pace of transition. The hon. Gentleman knows that there is a transition board in place because he is a member. If there has been a failure in consultation at the level and depth of time required, there is no doubt that he and I will take that up as we will both be at the next transition board meeting. The reality is that to ensure the long-term viability of steel in the UK, some tricky decisions have to be made, but the company was provided with support to make sure that it transitioned in a way that supported local jobs, knowing that it had to transition and support the supply chain.
Pakistan: Evacuation of Afghans
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(12 months ago)
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Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
We owe many Afghans a debt of gratitude for supporting British aims in Afghanistan. In the summer and autumn of 2021, the UK Government rightly promised to honour that debt by offering those Afghans resettlement in the UK. However, the Government’s Operation Warm Welcome fast became “Operation Cold Shoulder”. Of those Afghans who made it to Britain, 8,000 were crammed into hotels over a two-year period. They were then evicted, without consultation with local authorities, leaving many Afghan families facing homelessness this winter.
Worse, the Prime Minister last November personally gave instructions to Ministers that no more flights should be chartered from Pakistan to bring Afghans who have a right to resettlement here to the UK, despite more than 3,000 Afghan refugees being stuck in hotels in Pakistan, when the British Government had promised those very individuals refuge in the UK through the ARAP and ACRS.
Keeping those loyal-to-Britain Afghans in limbo was shameful enough, but even more disgracefully the Prime Minister changed tack only when the Pakistani Government started threatening to send those loyal-to-Britain Afghans back to Afghanistan to meet their fate at the hands of the Taliban. In short, the Government of Pakistan have strong-armed our weak Prime Minister into delivering something that it was our duty as a country to deliver in the first place. That is a truly shameful and humiliating state of affairs.
What we now need to know from the Minister is: how many flights has he chartered? When will they be running from and until? What assurance has he received from the Pakistani Government that they will extend the deadline for Afghans who are to be expelled back into Afghanistan until after all the UK flights have been completed? Are the Government aware of any cases of Afghans eligible under ARAP or ACRS who have been forcibly returned to Afghanistan from Pakistan? If so, what steps are the Government taking to bring those people to safety as a matter of urgency? Finally, what progress has he made on clearing the record high asylum backlog and securing accommodation for these Afghans, whom we desperately need to get out of Pakistan as rapidly and urgently as possible?
Johnny Mercer
It is hard to take the hon. Gentleman seriously when he comes out with statements that are demonstrably untrue; I know that he would not want to mislead the House, but he mentions engaging local authorities and I literally drove round engaging them. As he well knows, this stuff is not correct. Having served in Afghanistan and, during the summer, having driven round every hotel to visit Afghans personally to ensure that none of them slept homeless and that we saw through our duty, I will take no lessons from anybody about how we feel towards this Afghan cohort. Clearly, I will not go into the details of which flights are taking off when.
This Prime Minister and this Government are clear that as the situation has changed we are seeking to get guarantees from the Pakistan Government that those entitled to be here will not be deported from that country. If that does happen, the hon. Gentleman will be able to recall me to this House and I will have failed, but that is not going to happen. This is much like my promise on homelessness; he spent the entire summer saying that something would come to fruition but, again, it never did. On this side of the House we have to govern in the real space, where we deal with operational decisions on a daily basis; we cannot whip ourselves into a lather to try to score points off some of the poorest people in the world. We are determined to see through our commitments to the people of Afghanistan and I look forward to his working with me in that pursuit.
Tata Steel: Port Talbot
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(1 year, 1 month ago)
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Ms Ghani
My hon. Friend is absolutely right on the importance of virgin steel production. She is the best champion for her constituency and her steel plant, which is now uniquely positioned as the blast furnace to make virgin steel. That will be important in line with our mantra of “continuity, certainty and security.” Conversations have been taking place with British Steel, the details of which are commercially confidential. My hon. Friend campaigns incredibly hard for the steel sector both in the constituency and across the UK. Those meetings will continue. She is right that, obviously, we need a place for virgin steel, and that is in her constituency.
Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
When all is said and done, the purpose of the deal should have been to protect the current order book and to prepare us for the opportunities of the future. All investment is welcome— I do thank the Minister for her work in this area—but I am afraid that the deal will fail to keep us competitive and to deliver a just transition for the thousands of my constituents whose dedication to our proud steel industry is second to none.
Could the Minister kindly address the following questions? Why have the Government put all their eggs into the electric arc furnace basket? Where is the investment in hydrogen, direct reduced iron and carbon capture technology so that we can continue to produce virgin steel, as the hon. Member for Scunthorpe (Holly Mumby-Croft) pointed out? Why were the steel unions not consulted in advance of the announcement? There are literally dozens of hydrogen-based steel projects ongoing across Europe. They are not necessarily ready to make steel but at least they are out of the traps, whereas we are still in the changing room putting our trainers on. Why have the Government not actually entered the hydrogen race?
Ms Ghani
The hon. Gentleman, who worked with me incredibly well as chair of the all-party parliamentary group for steel and metal related industries, answers his own question when he speaks about hydrogen. He knows very well the age of the blast furnaces in his constituency and the fact that we needed a transition that enabled certainty to continue. There is no option other than electric to scale up within the time required. [Interruption.] My right hon. Friend the Member for Wokingham (John Redwood) knows that. We have spoken about this many times, so it is disappointing to see the hon. Member for Aberavon being so political about it now. The electric option was a commercial decision for Tata, but it was the only way to ensure certainty to continue. Another Member talked about supply chains and making sure that production continues, so that Tata can deliver the contracts it has in place. The only way to do that is with electric, and that is the way we are going forward.
Commercially sensitive conversations can take place in a much tighter circle, but the hon. Gentleman will know that discussions have been going on for years and years. There is now a transition board, and there will be a huge amount of consultation. The focus is on ensuring that the people impacted are provided with the support they need to transition into the jobs that they should. The fact is that we are securing the future of the steel sector in the hon. Gentleman’s constituency. Without this funding all 8,000 jobs would have been lost, along with 12,000 in the supply chain, and we are not seeing that. We are backing steel in his patch.
Infected Blood Inquiry
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(1 year, 4 months ago)
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Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker, and don’t worry—people have been doing that since I was about 13 years old. You are not the first and I am sure you will not be the last.
Mr Deputy Speaker
The hon. Member would probably like to know that I remember his father well.
Stephen Kinnock
And so do I, Sir—every single day.
It is a real pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Perth and North Perthshire (Pete Wishart). I also congratulate my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon Hull North (Dame Diana Johnson) and the Father of the House, the hon. Member for Worthing West (Sir Peter Bottomley), on securing this vital debate. My right hon. Friend and others have campaigned unstintingly for justice for the victims and their families. I pay tribute to her for her perseverance and dedication.
My constituent David Farrugia first told me in 2015 of the absolutely appalling manner in which he and his family had been treated throughout this entire sorry affair.
David and his siblings are part of the so-called fatherless generation. Their father was infected with the hepatitis virus in 1977 and with HIV in the mid-1980s. He died in 1986 at the age of 37, and a week later David went into care, where he remained until he was 17. He was separated from his twin brother for three years and from his youngest brother for 13 years. David was not reunited with his other brothers until 2008 and 2010. They have also lost two uncles to this terrible scandal.
Their story—the trauma of losing their father in horrific circumstances and of ending up separated in the care system—and the stigma they have lived with are deeply harrowing. Sadly, their story is not unique, and many of those affected by the infected blood scandal have similarly tragic stories to tell.
Lord Robert Winston described the scandal as
“the worst treatment disaster in the history of the NHS”,
but the scandal and the suffering caused have been compounded by the length of time it has taken victims and their families to receive justice. The wait has had a profound effect on David’s mental health, and yet he continues to fight for justice, like so many others. I pay tribute to David, who is in the Public Gallery today, and to all the victims and their families for their tireless campaign. It has been difficult, but they have never given up.
Let us be clear: this has taken far too long. Thousands have already died, and with each passing day more and more are lost without receiving the justice they deserve. Justice delayed is justice denied, and every day we wait is a day more that justice is denied.
Sir Brian recommended in the second interim report that children of those infected should be admitted into the payments scheme. That report was published in April, but families such as the Farrugias are still waiting to hear about being admitted into the scheme. The Government must act without delay to allow those who are now eligible to receive the interim compensation payments to register with the existing infected blood scheme. Delaying that only prolongs their anguish. Sir Brian has also recommended that an arm’s length body be established to administer the compensation scheme. That work needs to begin as soon as possible, so will the Minister update the House and these families on where the Government are in setting it up and appointing a chair?
Time is of the essence. We simply cannot wait for the final report in the autumn for the Government to respond. Sir Brian has made it clear that,
“The scheme need not await that final report to begin work”,
and that,
“The structure of the scheme should be set up as soon as possible, and before the final report of the Inquiry.”
This scandal has caused decades of suffering, health issues, financial loss and stigma for those affected, as we have heard so powerfully from all Members across the House today. The wait for justice has already gone on far too long. My constituents, along with all the victims and their families, deserve better than endless delays. They deserve to see justice delivered, and they deserve to see it delivered now.
G7 Summit
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(1 year, 5 months ago)
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The Prime Minister
As I pointed out earlier, the session with partner countries that were invited, including India, Brazil, Australia and others, was very good in confirming support for a just and durable peace in Ukraine. On my hon. Friend’s first point, he makes an excellent observation. That is why we have been working hard with other countries to put in place bilateral and multilateral long-term security arrangements.
I have long discussed that with President Zelensky and have spoken to other leaders, because my belief is that if we can put some long-term multilateral security arrangement in place as soon as possible, that will show President Putin that we are not going away and that there is no point trying to wait us out, because Ukraine will get long-term support to defend itself—not just last year, this year and next year but for years to come. That is important for us to do, and my hon. Friend can rest assured that I will continue having those conversations and pushing that point with our allies, all the way in the run up to the Vilnius summit.
Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
The Government’s No. 1 priority should be to strengthen the resilience of our economy so that we can stand more firmly on our own two feet in this dangerous and turbulent world. It was disappointing, therefore, that in the Prime Minister’s statement he failed to make any reference to the central role that steel plays—a key industry that builds our economic and national security and resilience. Given China, the US and the EU Governments are investing hundreds of billions of pounds in their steel industries, can he set out what steps his Government are taking to ensure that we build this vital building block of our manufacturing base?
The Prime Minister
The Government are committed to supporting the UK steel industry. The hon. Gentleman knows full well that I cannot comment on discussions of a commercially sensitive nature with particular companies, but he will know our track record. As Chancellor, during the pandemic I provided financial support to a steel company in south Wales because I believed it was the right thing to do. If he needs any evidence of our commitment to the steel industry, particularly in Wales, he does not need to look too far.
Northern Ireland Protocol
Stephen Kinnock Excerpts(1 year, 8 months ago)
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The Prime Minister
I thank my hon. Friend for those warm and, I fear, over-generous words. I thank him none the less. It would be remiss of me not to pay tribute to colleagues sitting behind me, who have worked in private, in confidence, behind the scenes for some months to bring us to this place, supported by the Minister of State, my hon. Friend the Member for Wycombe. They deserve enormous credit. It is a collective achievement of minds; many Members of the House in their various ways have contributed to getting to this point. I hope that everyone around the House can now support the agreement as a basis for providing a better future for the people of Northern Ireland.
Stephen Kinnock (Aberavon) (Lab)
The scrapping of tariffs on steel will be welcomed by steelworkers in the Port Talbot steelworks in my constituency, but may I press the Prime Minister on non-tariff barriers? Will he confirm that quotas will also be scrapped? He will be aware that the European Union is introducing a carbon border adjustment mechanism. Will he confirm that the Windsor framework will eliminate the risk of a carbon border in the Irish sea?
The Prime Minister
The UK Government are also exploring mechanisms for a carbon border adjustment mechanism—it is something the Treasury started consulting on last year. That is one of the dialogues that we have with the European Union, and other countries are considering such mechanisms to ensure that they can work in a complementary fashion. The work for all these things is at a relatively early stage, so there is lots of development work to be done to make sure we implement them.