Oral Answers to Questions

Sarah Sackman Excerpts

Thursday 12th September 2024 Commons Chamber

[Ellie Chowns (North Herefordshire) (Green)]

1. If she will make an assessment of the potential merits of extending the unduly lenient sentence scheme to include unduly severe sentences.

[The Solicitor General (Sarah Sackman)]

It is a privilege to be appointed as His Majesty’s Solicitor General. My fellow Law Officers and I will be working to restore public faith in government and the rule of law, and to support the Home Secretary and the Lord Chancellor in delivering our safer streets mission.

Sentencing policy is quintessentially a matter for the Ministry of Justice; sentencing is a matter for our judges. Offenders already have the right to appeal to the Court of Appeal against their sentences, including when they consider them to be unduly excessive.

[Ellie Chowns]

Since 4 July, more than 40 people have been jailed in the UK for peaceful acts of conscience: some for protesting climate breakdown, some for taking measures to stop violations of international humanitarian law in Gaza. The UN special rapporteur, Michel Forst, has made public statements to the effect that these sentences violate international law and are not acceptable in a democracy. With our prisons in crisis and radical measures necessary, as we have seen with the release of prisoners this week, will the Attorney General issue guidance to judges to ensure that sentencing for peaceful protest is realigned with common sense, democratic principles and international law?

[The Solicitor General]

Decisions to prosecute, convict and sentence are rightly made independently of Government by the Crown Prosecution Service, juries and judges respectively. As I have already said, if someone wants to appeal an unduly excessive sentence, they can do so and our courts are there to handle that matter.

[Mr Speaker]

I welcome the new Chair of the Justice Committee.

[Andy Slaughter (Hammersmith and Chiswick) (Lab)]

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

The Government have pledged to undertake a review of sentencing generally. I wonder whether I can tempt the Solicitor General to support a wider review of aspects of the criminal justice system that do not seem to be working, in particular the role of the Criminal Cases Review Commission and the CPS in dealing with potential miscarriages of justice. This week, Oliver Campbell’s conviction for murder was quashed by the Court of Appeal as unsafe. The Criminal Cases Review Commission was asked to look at the case in 2005. The CPS resisted the appeal and asked for a retrial after 33 years.

[The Solicitor General]

First, I welcome my hon. Friend and congratulate him on his election as Chair of the Justice Committee. He is right that we will be undertaking a review of sentencing. On miscarriages of justice, we will want to work with him to look into that further. I am happy to meet him to discuss such matters.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Attorney General.

[Sir Jeremy Wright (Kenilworth and Southam) (Con)]

May I first warmly welcome the Solicitor General to her place, and the Attorney General to his place in the other place, in what the Solicitor General will already know is one of the most interesting and challenging parts of government? While I am at it, I should of course also welcome the hon. Member for Hammersmith and Chiswick (Andy Slaughter) as the new Chair of the Justice Committee. May I also take the opportunity to congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for South Leicestershire (Alberto Costa), the shadow Solicitor General, on the responsibilities he will shortly take up on behalf of the whole House, which he will do brilliantly after an all-too-short career on the Opposition Front Bench?

I do not know for how long the Solicitor General and I will have these exchanges over the Dispatch Boxes, but I am glad to be able to start on a note of consensus. I agree with her that it would not be appropriate to extend the unduly lenient sentence scheme to cover unduly severe sentences, for which, as she says, appeal is already available, but she will agree that the scheme is always capable of improvement. It is currently wholly reactive, responding to requests from others for sentences to be reviewed. May I ask the Solicitor General to consider the merits of her Department, and indeed the Ministry of Justice—I see that the Minister of State, Ministry of Justice, the hon. Member for Swindon South (Heidi Alexander), is sitting beside her—monitoring sentencing more proactively, in particular for newly created offences, so that we can all have confidence that, particularly in relation to those offences, sentences are being passed within anticipated ranges?

[The Solicitor General]

I thank the right hon. and learned Member for his question, and also for his warm welcome. He is enormously experienced in these matters, as both a former Attorney General and a former Justice Minister. As he rightly notes, newly created offences, such as those created by the Online Safety Act 2023, do not currently fall within the scope of the unduly lenient sentencing scheme, and I understand that there are no immediate plans to extend the scheme further, but—again, as he rightly notes—we always look for opportunities to reform, and, along with my Department, I will keep that under review.

[Debbie Abrahams (Oldham East and Saddleworth) (Lab)]

2. What steps she is taking to help increase prosecution rates for cases relating to violence against women and girls.

--- Later in debate ---

[Anneliese Midgley (Knowsley) (Lab)]

10. What steps she is taking to help increase prosecution rates for cases relating to violence against women and girls.

[The Solicitor General (Sarah Sackman)]

For too long, women and girls across the country have faced routine threats of appalling violence and abuse. This Government were elected with a clear mandate to halve violence against women and girls within a decade; that is what we will deliver, and it is something to which I am personally committed. In the early stages of that process, I have recently met both the Domestic Abuse Commissioner and the Victims’ Commissioner to discuss how the Crown Prosecution Service can work closely with the police from the earliest point to build robust, victim-centred investigations that will drive improvements in conviction rates.

[Debbie Abrahams]

I, too, welcome the Solicitor General to her position. She will be aware of the appalling increase in crimes against women and girls throughout the United Kingdom, including my constituency and Greater Manchester more widely. More than a million such crimes were recorded last year, constituting both 20% of all crimes logged and an increase in the number of violent crimes against women and girls. Given the seriousness of the situation, what plans do the Government have to ensure that we prosecute effectively and quickly?

[The Solicitor General]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on her election as chair of the Work and Pensions Committee. The statistics that she has given are indeed worrying, and the mission of halving violence against women and girls is therefore central to the Government’s agenda. Behind each of those statistics lie heartbreaking personal stories. We need to do much better, which is why the Lord Chancellor has committed herself to introducing specialist rape courts to fast-track rape cases and why the Home Office is delivering plans to introduce specialist rape and sexual offence teams in every police force. It is measures of that kind that will address the problems highlighted by my hon. Friend.

[Peter Swallow]

The 2023 police efficiency, effectiveness and legitimacy report on Thames Valley police established that the force did not make full use of Clare’s law. Does the Solicitor General agree that Clare’s law is a powerful tool to protect women from those who have already been prosecuted for domestic violence?

[The Solicitor General]

I thank my hon. Friend for raising an important issue. He is right: Clare’s law is a powerful tool, and it needs to be applied more evenly and consistently. The domestic violence disclosure scheme, known as Clare’s law, enables the police to disclose information to a victim, or potential victim, of domestic abuse about previous abusive or violent offending by a partner or ex-partner. The police need to consider each request on its own merits. However, more needs to be done to ensure that the scheme is used consistently by police forces across the country, and I understand that the Home Office is currently engaging with the police to see how its application can be improved.

[Catherine Fookes]

May I warmly welcome the Solicitor General to her place? I am sure she agrees that the dreadful legacy of the last Government’s record on rape convictions cannot be allowed to continue. She knows that behind the statistics—less than 2% of rapes are prosecuted—lie real people such as a woman in my constituency of Monmouthshire, who has been waiting on a CPS decision for two years and three months. Her life has been on hold and in limbo as she waits to hear whether the perpetrator will be charged. She has summoned up the courage to report, and we cannot leave her or anyone else in indefinite limbo. Can the Solicitor General share what progress has been made on the introduction of the Government’s new rape courts? What impact does she expect them to have on the time lag between reporting and charging, and on prosecution rates for those charged with violence against women?

[The Solicitor General]

I absolutely share my hon. Friend’s concerns. As her constituent’s heartbreaking experience illustrates, such delays are traumatic for victims. They too often lead to what is known as victim attrition, which leads to trials collapsing and deters others from reporting these sorts of offences. This has gone on for far too long, and we need to get a grip on the situation. That is why the Lord Chancellor has committed to introducing specialist rape courts and working with the judiciary to drive down wait times. Obviously, those need to be carefully considered while navigating other pressures on the justice system, and I hope to be able to update the House on the Government’s plan in due course.

[Anneliese Midgley]

Between 2022 and 2023, my constituency of Knowsley had the highest number of deaths per capita due to domestic abuse, but very few people are charged for domestic abuse, let alone prosecuted. Will the Law Officers meet me to discuss how we can join up the criminal justice system so that the police and prosecutors work together to take dangerous abusers off our streets?

[The Solicitor General]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right to highlight the incredibly distressing figures. As I said before, the human stories that lie behind them will each tell a tragic tale, which is why tackling this issue is at the heart of this Government’s agenda. I am happy to meet my hon. Friend and her local chief Crown prosecutor, Jonathan Storer, to discuss this serious issue and look at how we can improve joint working between the CPS and the police.

[Dr Neil Shastri-Hurst (Solihull West and Shirley) (Con)]

May I congratulate the Solicitor General on her appointment?

Among the most serious offences involving women and girls are rape and serious sexual offences. Once victims come forward, there are often delays in their cases being heard, and a frequent driver of that is the difficulty in getting sufficiently experienced counsel. A major driver of that is the gap between the fees for prosecuting and defending counsel. Does the Solicitor General agree that there is an urgent need to plug that gap?

[The Solicitor General]

We know that the availability of sufficiently experienced prosecutors is a problem that needs to be looked at. That is why, in appropriate cases, we are looking at using associate prosecutors to clear the backlog in our courts more generally, but for the most serious crimes of rape and violence against women and girls, we need specialist prosecutors. The Government will be looking closely at both recruitment and retention.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

May I welcome the Solicitor General to her place? I wish her well in the role and hope that it goes according to plan. Can she further clarify that funding is available for each branch of the prosecution services to provide the protection and support that helps victims to speak out? Is there any discussion about whether increased funding for victim support could embolden victims and help to facilitate even more safe prosecutions?

[The Solicitor General]

It is vital that we place victims at the centre of our justice system, which is why this Government are looking to strengthen the powers of the Victims’ Commissioner. As we announced in the King’s Speech, the victims, courts and public protection Bill will strengthen those powers to improve accountability and ensure that victims’ voices are centred and heard from start to finish throughout the criminal justice process.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Solicitor General.

[Alberto Costa (South Leicestershire) (Con)]

May I, too, welcome the Solicitor General not just to the House, but to her place? I thank the shadow Attorney General for his warm words and for the good nature of yesterday’s election.

Only a few weeks ago, the National Police Chiefs’ Council and the College of Policing issued a joint national policing statement on violence against women and girls, which said:

“We are transforming the way police officers investigate rape and serious sexual offences and over the last year we have trained over 4,500 new officers in investigating this complex crime.”

The Solicitor General does not have direct responsibility for policing services, but she did say that she would be working with her Home Office and Ministry of Justice colleagues, so can she confirm that those 4,500 newly trained officers, who were trained under the previous Conservative Government, will dedicate the majority of their policing activities to working on cases exclusively involving violence against women and girls?

[The Solicitor General]

I echo other hon. Members in congratulating the hon. Gentleman. As we have said, the mission to halve violence against women and girls within the next decade is a central priority for the Government. One aspect of that will be cross-departmental working between the Attorney General’s office, the Home Office and the Ministry of Justice, as well as with other departmental colleagues. It is an absolute priority and at the moment—in the earliest stages—we are looking at exactly how we will do that. It is right that those priorities are communicated to every branch of the criminal justice system, including policing, the Crown Prosecution Service and other agencies involved.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Liberal Democrat spokesperson.

[Sarah Dyke (Glastonbury and Somerton) (LD)]

Just one in 83 rape offences recorded by Avon and Somerset Police last year resulted in a charge or court summons. Compared with other police forces in the south-west, that represents a significant increase in 2023-24 for rape and sexual offence crimes. Does the Solicitor General agree that more needs to be done to strengthen the justice system as a whole to properly deal with sexual violence and domestic abuse, not just in Avon and Somerset but across England and Wales?

[The Solicitor General]

I entirely agree with the hon. Member that this needs to be an absolute priority and that we need to drive improvements in conviction rates. That is why there is a commitment to introduce specialist rape courts, working to fast-track rape cases and driving down wait times, and why it is important, at the start of the system, to put domestic abuse experts in 999 control rooms. It is that whole suite of measures that will lead to the improvements that we all want to see.

[Steve Darling (Torbay) (LD)]

3. What steps she is taking to help increase prosecution rates for shoplifting.

[The Solicitor General (Sarah Sackman)]

Our safer streets mission will drive essential change to bring an end to the epidemic of shoplifting that is plaguing our high streets. Between 2018 and 2023, under the last Government, the charge rate for shoplifting offences went down significantly, by 5%, so we are seeing 10,000 fewer charges a year. Rather than criminalising vulnerable people, this Government believe that criminal gangs have been emboldened by poor enforcement and immunity for low-level shoplifting. We are not prepared to stand by and allow that to continue, which is why the time is right to take action against that unacceptable behaviour.

[Steve Darling]

I congratulate the Solicitor General on their appointment. The British Retail Consortium identified a £1.7 billion cost to traders from the offence. Having spoken to traders in Torquay and Paignton, I know that it has a massive impact on the viability of them trading on our high streets. How will the Solicitor General ensure that we expedite shoplifting prosecutions?

[The Solicitor General]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for raising this matter. Members will be all too aware of the impact that such offences have on our constituents, whether they are customers or business owners. The police are working closely with CPS colleagues to prosecute shoplifting, but we know there is more to do. Among additional measures, the Government will introduce a new offence of assaulting retail workers, in order to protect the hard-working and dedicated staff who work in those stores. There are other things that we can do, but that is a start.

[Bill Esterson (Sefton Central) (Lab)]

4. What steps she is taking to help ensure rioters are prosecuted efficiently and effectively.

[Jake Richards (Rother Valley) (Lab)]

8. What steps she is taking to help ensure rioters are prosecuted efficiently and effectively.

[The Solicitor General (Sarah Sackman)]

There seem to have been a lot of congratulations this morning, and I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Sefton Central (Bill Esterson) on being elected as Chair of the Energy Security and Net Zero Committee.

The Prime Minister and the Home Secretary have been clear that there is no place for senseless violence on our streets. During the summer, after the recent disorder, the Crown Prosecution Service deployed an additional 100 prosecutors, expanded its 24-hour charging service and received additional advice from the Director of Public Prosecutions to enable it to charge more quickly. The deterrent effects of this swift action are an example of how the system can work well when it works together.

[Bill Esterson]

I thank the Solicitor General for her kind words, and I congratulate her in turn on her appointment. I also congratulate the Government on their excellent response to the riots over the summer, which she has just outlined.

My hon. and learned Friend has talked about the early release scheme, which is, of course, the result of the shortage of prison places inherited from the previous Government, but does she agree that those convicted and imprisoned as a result of the riots, and those imprisoned for inciting the riots, should not benefit from the early release scheme?

[The Solicitor General]

I express my solidarity with my hon. Friend and his constituents, who will have been closely affected by the awful recent events in his neighbouring constituency. I know the Attorney General was deeply moved by his recent visit to Southport and what he learned there.

On the early release scheme, my hon. Friend will have heard the Lord Chancellor set out very clearly this week the importance of taking action on the mess on prison places that this Government inherited. Without the action we have taken, courts would have been unable to hold trials, the police would have been unable to make arrests and there would have been a total breakdown of law and order. The Lord Chancellor has provided details of the scheme, including its carefully considered safeguards. The scheme will apply across the board to all offenders, including rioters and those convicted of the most serious offences.

[Jake Richards]

It is wonderful to see my hon. and learned Friend at the Dispatch Box. I also congratulate the Government on the speediness with which justice has been done for many of the summer’s rioters, which is testament to the good work of the CPS and defence lawyers. What lessons can be learnt more generally to ensure that speedy justice can occur for specific offences, particularly domestic violence?

[The Solicitor General]

The main lesson that we can take from this is how well the system can work when all of its constituent parts—the police, the leadership at the top of Government, and the CPS—all pull in the same direction. That approach will inform this Government’s commitment to mission-led government, which will bring all the key elements of the criminal justice system together and ensure that decisions are taken with the whole system in mind. That will particularly apply to the mission on halving violence against women and girls.

[Ms Polly Billington (East Thanet) (Lab)]

6. What steps she is taking to help ensure the effective prosecution of street crime.

[The Solicitor General (Sarah Sackman)]

This Government have made tackling antisocial behaviour, which blights our streets and threatens many of our communities, a top priority. The new crime and policing Bill announced in the King’s Speech will include strong measures to tackle antisocial behaviour, to support neighbourhood policing and to give the police stronger powers to crack down on antisocial behaviour and keep our streets safe.

[Ms Billington]

What we have noticed, particularly in town centres such as Ramsgate and Margate, is that antisocial behaviour, drug dealing and street crime, particularly knife crime, continue because of people’s anxiety about giving evidence against the criminals. What will my hon. and learned Friend and the Government do to give people confidence that the criminal justice system and prosecutions will flow once they have given their evidence?

[The Solicitor General]

Just this week the Prime Minister met police, victims, families and media companies specifically to discuss knife crime, which plagues my hon. Friend’s community and many others across the country. The Prime Minister has promised to double down on these crimes, and to halve them in the next decade. I am part of a cross-departmental team that will work to deliver this. The Government are committed to taking back our streets by increasing the amount of neighbourhood policing, recruiting more prosecutors to deal swiftly with these crimes and bringing forward laws to ban zombie knives and machetes.