Finance Bill
Alan Reid Excerpts(12 years, 4 months ago)
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Miss Smith
I am grateful to my hon. Friend. She is not only in fine fettle, as she is standing without crutches, but rightly points to the effect that we know this will have on households and businesses.
Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
I, too, welcome the decision. This Government are certainly on the side of rural motorists. Will my hon. Friend confirm that as well as fuel duty on the mainland being 10p a litre lower than it would have been under Labour’s plans, on the islands it is 15p a litre a lower thanks to the Government’s adopting the island fuel discount—a policy that Labour refused to adopt?
Miss Smith
I am pleased to confirm that. I am glad to hear my hon. Friend’s welcome for the scheme on behalf of his constituents and others in rural areas where we are piloting it.
Sheila Gilmore
I understand that it is in the region of £725 million. That is quite a large hole in what was presented in March—it seems a long time ago now—as a balanced Budget. That was one of the Chancellor’s key themes in his Budget speech. We now appear to be faced with something of an unbalanced Budget.
Sheila Gilmore
It is clear from the pattern of fuel duty rises under the last Government that such things were never set in stone and were not intended to be so. One has to look at the situation with which one is faced.
Cathy Jamieson
I was not sure whether the fuel duty debate or the intervention from my hon. Friend the Member for Edinburgh East (Sheila Gilmore) had exercised the power of persuasion that led the hon. Member for Harlow (Robert Halfon) to cross the Floor and spend some time on the Opposition Benches, Madam Deputy Speaker, but I shall now return to the subject of the amendments, which are fairly simple and straightforward.
Amendments 1 and 2 would remove the cut in the top tax rate for people earning more than £150,000 a year, and amendment 23 would prevent the abolition of the age-related allowance that would increase the tax on millions of older people—the so-called granny tax. As we said in the earlier debate, the amendments are based on the straightforward principle that when times are tough and there is less money around, we must ensure that the burden of deficit reduction is fairly shared. That theme of fairness will be a feature of the contributions of Labour Members this evening.
As I said at the outset, however, the Government have chosen to cut taxes for the richest 1% of the population, and that tax cut is worth £40,000 to those who earn more than £1 million a year. At the same time, they are raising the taxes of 4.4 million pensioners by, in some instances, hundreds of pounds a year. Most of those pensioners are living on less than the average taxpayer.
Cathy Jamieson
I hear what the hon. Gentleman says, but many people will be about £511 a year worse off. Many, particularly those on the lowest incomes, will not benefit from the rise in the income tax threshold, and a large proportion will be part-time workers who cannot work for the extra hours that they have been told will enable them to continue to qualify for tax credits.
Finance (No. 4) Bill
Alan Reid Excerpts(12 years, 7 months ago)
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Mr Stuart
I fear that the hon. Gentleman may be right.
As I was saying, there is the supply chain and manufacturers, all of which are UK-based, then there is the sales channel and the deployment of the end product. Where? That is in rural and often coastal areas and areas with low incomes all over the country. What is the effect? It is to bring people, once they have made the capital investment in a caravan, to visit those areas week in, week out, bringing all sorts of economic benefits to areas that otherwise do not have a lot of industry to fall back on. When one looks at the industry in the round like that, one sees that it is special. Perhaps everybody says that, but we must consider how successful it is and who it serves. I have not even got to the point about who will be affected. We are talking about people who want to make a purchase of a home for about £30,000, not people who can switch easily to making a bricks-and-mortar purchase. When the tax-dodging, socialist, multi-millionaire candidate for the London mayoralty goes off to console himself by buying a cottage, he will not have to pay VAT, but when hard-working, decent people who like to pay their taxes go to get a slice of the decent life and have a stake in the countryside they will find that the caravan they want to buy at £30,000 now costs £36,000.
Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
The hon. Gentleman is making his case eloquently. In my area, which is a large, rural, coastal area, there is a large number of caravan sites, which bring a lot of money into the local economy. He is right that this measure will affect large parts of the country. I fully support him in his new clause and I hope that the Government will have second thoughts.
Ian Lucas (Wrexham) (Lab)
I wish to speak in support of new clause 2, which stands in my name. It deals with a long-standing campaign that I have undertaken alongside a charity in my constituency, Chariotts, which offers dial-a-ride-type services to disabled people and has been established for a number of years. It has become more and more successful, transporting people in wheelchairs and those with severe disabilities across the constituency.
The problem in recent years is that as the charity has grown, so has the likelihood of its becoming registrable for VAT in the near future. A VAT anomaly exists that is relevant to Chariotts, as well as other organisations across the country, which is that there is an exemption from VAT for public transport vehicles with 10 seats or more, but not for those with fewer than 10 seats. That means that a disabled passenger undertaking a journey in a small vehicle will have to pay VAT on the journey. When the charity becomes registrable, there will be a 20% increase for disabled passengers, which is extremely serious for individuals on fixed incomes.
I have raised this issue on many occasions in the Chamber, as well as with the Exchequer Secretary elsewhere. He told me in a written answer:
“No estimates have been made of the cost of extending this zero rate as long-standing formal agreements with our European partners prevent us from unilaterally extending the scope of our existing zero rates or introducing new zero rates.”—[Official Report, 28 November 2011; Vol. 536, c. 718W.]
That was quite a categorical no to extending the exemption, to go alongside the statement that European policy was preventing it from occurring. Imagine my astonishment, therefore, when I learned on Monday that the Budget introduces an exemption—a further VAT concession—for small cable-based transportation systems. Ski lifts and the like will benefit from a tax cut from 20% to 5%. There is to be a reduced rate of VAT for skiers on the piste. We have already heard about pasties and caravans. Now, for reasons that are unclear, the Government are giving a tax cut to people having a luxury holiday.
Ian Lucas
I beg to differ. It will affect one particular sector. It is rather convenient that the Chief Secretary to the Treasury, who has Aviemore in his constituency, has been much more amenable to this tax cut than to a tax cut for disabled people not only in my constituency but in Skye, in the highlands of Scotland and right across the country. It is a disgrace that the Government said no to me when I asked for assistance for disabled people but then said yes to a request from the Chief Secretary to the Treasury, who has a major constituency interest. I want the Exchequer Secretary to tell the Committee how much this tax cut is going to cost the Treasury, and to undertake to look into the matter, for the benefit of disabled people and not of skiers.
Mr MacNeil
I am glad that the hon. Lady seems to support devolving air passenger duty to Wales. Perhaps that could be extended to Scotland as well.
Without the ability to negotiate our own air routes, we therefore need other economic levers to attract businesses and travellers to Scotland. The current situation forces business and travellers to commute to Scotland via one of the most congested air hubs in the world. The south-east can absorb the impact of an 8% increase in air passenger duty. With the countless flights that go through London everyday, it would take a very severe drop in tourism indeed to affect travel through London. However, given that Scotland has already seen a serious decline in air routes—from BMI pulling out of Glasgow, as well as Ryanair—we have to think about the impact that the APD rise will have on us.
Mr Reid
I infer from what the hon. Gentleman is saying that if APD were devolved to Scotland, the SNP in the Scottish Parliament would want to cut it. Does he accept that that would mean less income for the Scottish Government, and if so, what cuts does he plan to make to services to make up for that?
Mr MacNeil
Perhaps I can expand the hon. Gentleman’s thinking. If we were to grow from four non-EU routes to 10 or 15, or to the 24 that Denmark has, we might see a growth in revenue. This is about raising revenue, not the precise level of taxation. We would be looking to raise revenue in Scotland and grow our economy, which is the plan for independence—indeed, it is why we want independence.
If APD is increased, Scotland will be put at a further disadvantage in attracting not only international passengers, but international business. As I said earlier, the Government have already conceded that point in devolving APD to Northern Ireland.
Oral Answers to Questions
Alan Reid Excerpts(12 years, 10 months ago)
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Danny Alexander
Once again, the hon. Lady is wrong in her economic policy pronouncements. The Office for Budget Responsibility has the UK growing more slowly this year, but faster than countries in the eurozone in the next few years. That is a testament to the Government’s economic policies. If she wants to know who is at least partly responsible for the mess that the country is in, she should just look immediately to her left. It has come to something when Katie Price’s tweets make more sense about the economy than Labour Front Benchers.
Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
The economy in our islands will be greatly helped by the reduction in fuel duty that the Government are introducing. Will my right hon. Friend update the House on progress towards introducing that fuel duty discount?
Danny Alexander
I am grateful for the opportunity to do that. The fuel duty discount will come into force for customers, including on the islands in my hon. Friend’s constituency, from 1 March. That will reduce the cost of fuel by 5p a litre in the most remote island communities, reflecting the fact that they have the highest cost. The scheme has been open to retailers to register for it since 1 January, and I am pleased to report that almost every retailer has already signed up.
Fuel Prices
Alan Reid Excerpts(13 years ago)
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Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Harlow (Robert Halfon) on his campaign to secure today’s debate.
I represent a sparsely populated constituency where long drives for essential business are common, so I am well aware of the impact of high fuel prices on individuals and businesses. For example, the price of fuel on some of the larger islands in my constituency, such as Mull and Islay, is typically about 15p to 20p a litre higher than in a city centre supermarket, and on the smaller islands, such as Coll and Colonsay, the price is usually about 30p a litre higher. It should be stressed that this is not because of profiteering by the local filling stations. The reasons for the higher prices are low turnover, compared with all the fixed costs that a rural filling station has to pay, and the costs of the distribution network. The costs of fuel distribution in the highlands and islands are very high, and I hope that the Office of Fair Trading will investigate them.
Mr Angus Brendan MacNeil (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP)
I understand exactly what the hon. Gentleman is saying about Coll and Colonsay, but he will know that a newspaper on Coll and Colonsay costs the same as in the city centre. Should the Government not move towards more parity and equality between islands such as Coll and Colonsay—or, indeed, Na h-Eileanan an Iar—and city centres?
Mr Reid
I agree with the hon. Gentleman, and I hope that he will give credit to the Government for what they are doing on fuel duty on islands. The high price of fuel obviously has a great impact on people’s living standards, and makes it difficult for anyone trying to run a business on an island or in a remote rural area.
Sir Robert Smith (West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine) (LD)
My hon. Friend is making the important point, which has come out again and again in the debate, that people in remote rural areas in constituencies such as ours have no choice but to use a car. Does he agree that, in the long run, the Government will have to look at a system of variable road user pricing that is based on the choices available and that will enable essential users to pay a lower price?
Mr Reid
I certainly agree with my hon. Friend.
There has always been an environmental argument for higher fuel prices, in order to persuade people to use public transport rather than a car. That argument works fine in a city with plenty of bus and train services, but it falls down completely in a rural area, and particularly in a remote rural area such as Argyll and Bute, where in places there is a bus service only on school days. That might be okay for getting schoolteachers to and from work, but it is no good for anyone who needs to be at work outside school hours. The advantage of road user pricing would be that more could be charged for driving on city roads, with a much lower price for driving on a remote rural road. The problem with fuel duty is that it is a blunt instrument, in that the same level of duty is charged in all parts of the country, irrespective of whether public transport alternatives exist or not.
Mr Reid
I am sorry; I have used both my interventions.
To go back to the point made by the hon. Member for Na h-Eileanan an Iar (Mr MacNeil), I was delighted when the Government announced their intention to pursue a pilot scheme whereby there will be a 5p a litre fuel duty discount for those on many of the country’s islands, including all those in my constituency. That reduction will go part of the way towards removing the price differential between fuel on the islands and fuel on the mainland. I hope that the scheme will be up and running soon, and I ask the Minister to give us an update at the end of the debate on how the negotiations are going in Europe. I am sure that the pilot scheme for the islands will be successful; if it is, I would like it to be extended to remote parts of the mainland. Operating a rural filling station is clearly not a profitable business these days. On the Kintyre peninsula, two of the five filling stations that the area had at the start of the year have closed.
There was a time when it could be argued that high fuel taxation was needed to discourage people from driving and polluting the environment, but market forces have already achieved that. The environmental argument for high fuel duty is not sustainable in the present circumstances. The high price is already discouraging people from driving, and they are making only journeys that are absolutely essential. Changing people’s behaviour is possible only when public transport alternatives are available, which is simply not the case in the highlands and islands.
I was also delighted when the Government abandoned Labour’s fuel duty escalator in the Budget, introducing the fuel duty stabiliser instead and bringing down the fuel duty because the price was so high. The Government have scheduled a fuel duty increase for January, because it was hoped at the time of the Budget that prices would have decreased by then. Prices show no sign of coming down, however, so I hope that the Government will listen to everyone who has signed the motion and spoken in the debate, and not proceed with the January fuel duty increase. The price of fuel adds to the price of everything in a rural area. The high cost is holding back economic recovery, so anything that the Government can do to bring the price down would be greatly welcomed in all rural parts of the country, and particularly in the highlands and islands.
Owen Smith
I am not going to give way on that point.
What all those Back Benchers have wanted is action. The crucial difference between what they have called for today and what has been called for by Opposition Members, including my hon. Friends the Members for Ynys Môn (Albert Owen), for Livingston (Graeme Morrice), for Dumfries and Galloway (Mr Brown) and for Stoke-on-Trent South (Robert Flello), the hon. Member for Dundee East (Stewart Hosie), my right hon. Friend the Member for Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill (Mr Clarke), and my hon. Friends the Members for East Kilbride, Strathaven and Lesmahagow (Mr McCann) and for West Lancashire (Rosie Cooper) and many others, is that we want something substantive done. For example, we want what we might have seen in the motion had it pursued the line of thought that the e-petition did. We want to see something tangible. What Opposition Members have called for is straightforward. We have said, “Cut VAT by 3p on a litre of petrol, reverse the tax increase that the Chancellor put on ordinary working people in the Budget and get the economy moving.”
Owen Smith
I will not give way because we do not have much time. [Hon. Members: “Go on.”] I will give way once.
Owen Smith
Interestingly, the Government tried to tell us that there was no prospect of our seeking a derogation in respect of VAT on petrol, but they are, in effect, seeking a derogation for their rural subsidy—or their rural special pilot. [Interruption.] We are not opposing it, but we are saying that they could go further than simply seeking a derogation for rural areas; they could cut 3p off VAT right across the country, not just on fuel, but on all things, and get the economy moving. That is what they could do. There is a reason for them to do it, and here they should have listened to the hon. Member for Romsey and Southampton North (Caroline Nokes). She gave a very interesting speech and it was interesting to hear a Conservative Member acknowledge, so many years after Conservatives have protested that it was not true, that VAT is a regressive tax. VAT hits the lowest-paid people the hardest, and VAT on fuel does exactly the same.
It is very instructive today that so many Conservative Members should have signed the motion, albeit this bowdlerised, Whip-friendly motion. It is evidence that Conservative Back Benchers, unlike those on their Front-Bench, are perhaps concerned about the living standards of ordinary people in this country. It is also evidence that they have spotted, at last, that they were sold a pig in a poke by their Chancellor at the Budget last year. What he said when he announced, with such great hubris, that he was putting fuel in the “tank” of the economy was that the Government were going to have a fair fuel stabiliser—this is the fair fuel stabiliser that he had been promising since 2008. Hon. Members may remember that this was a pledge to link the prices of unrefined petrol and refined petrol in order to smooth out volatility. Of course that is not what Conservative Back Benchers got at all. They have not got a mechanism that smoothes out volatility or that connects petrol prices to oil prices. They have not got what they all stood on as a manifesto pledge. This is yet another broken promise from this Government.
Road Fuel Duties
Alan Reid Excerpts(13 years, 2 months ago)
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Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Hancock. I congratulate the hon. Member for Central Ayrshire (Mr Donohoe) on securing this debate and on bringing this important issue before the House.
I represent a sparsely populated constituency, so I am well aware of the impact of high fuel prices on people and businesses. I represent many of the islands of the Inner Hebrides. The price of fuel on the larger islands, such as Mull and Islay, is typically 15p a litre higher than at a city centre supermarket, and on the smaller islands, such as Coll and Colonsay, the price is usually about 30p a litre higher. That is not due to any profiteering by local filling stations; Office of Fair Trading investigations have shown that there is no local profiteering. The main reason is the low turnover. The high fixed costs of running a filling station mean a high price.
Mr MacNeil
On that point, Donald MacNeil of the Burnside filling station in Daliburgh, South Uist, has told me that, if he paid somebody to sell fuel all day, they would not raise their own wage from the amount they sold, which is a reflection of why the price of rural fuel is so high. There is no profiteering. Apart from the high prices, we also know that there are distribution issues.
Mr Reid
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. He is correct that there is no profiteering at the local filling station, although the distribution network, as he has indicated, might be another issue.
The high price obviously has a great impact on people’s living standards and on anyone trying to run a business on an island or in a remote rural area. I was therefore delighted when the Government announced their intention to pursue a pilot scheme under which there will be a 5p a litre fuel duty discount on many of the country’s islands, including all the islands of the Inner Hebrides and the Clyde. The Treasury is currently consulting filling station operators on the terms of the pilot scheme. Its original consultation proposals were met with significant concern by filling station operators, because they would have caused a cash-flow problem. I was pleased when the Government responded quickly to those concerns and revised their proposals in a way that removes the cash-flow problem.
The revised consultation proposals envisage two possible schemes—a distributor-based scheme and a retailer-based scheme. Of the two, it looks like the distributor-based scheme would be easier to operate, because the distributor has the resources to carry out the administration, which the small retailer would often find more difficult. I appreciate, however, the Government’s concern that a distributor-based scheme may fall foul of EU state aid rules and might not be approved by the European Commission. I hope that a distributor-based scheme can be devised that is acceptable to the Commission. If not, we would have to proceed with a retailer-based scheme.
The cash-flow problem in the original proposals has been overcome, but filling station operators are still concerned that it is not clear how they can prove to the Treasury that they are passing on the discount to the consumer. An essential principle of the scheme is that the 5p discount is passed on to the consumer. What retailers have asked me is whether the Government can provide clarity on how they should demonstrate that they are passing on the discount. That clarity would be welcomed because, as I say, the retailers are still not clear what they would have to do to comply with the scheme—and, of course, they are all keen to participate. If the islands’ pilot scheme is successful, as I am sure it will be, I would like it to be extended to remote areas of the mainland.
Anne Marie Morris
I absolutely endorse what my hon. Friend says, but some of the rebates that have been given in France, Portugal and so on are not limited just to the islands. The Government’s current view is that it is only in an island situation that such relief can be made available, but that does not seem valid.
Jim Shannon
The hon. Gentleman refers to the mainland; obviously, I am very keen for the same opportunities to exist for the people of Northern Ireland. Will he address that issue and does he agree that Northern Ireland also needs to have a similar pilot scheme, because the prices there are equal to those in the western islands of Scotland?
Mr Reid
We are straying into another debate here. I think we will stick to fuel duty, which is probably a lot less contentious.
Operating a rural filling station is clearly not a profitable business these days, and we heard from the hon. Member for Central Ayrshire about how many have closed. In my constituency, I can point to 10 that have closed since I became an MP in 2001, and that is fairly typical of the country as a whole. On the Kintyre peninsula, only three of the five filling stations that the area had at the beginning of the year are still open. Two have closed this year, which is causing real concerns on the peninsula. As the hon. Gentleman who opened the debate pointed out, people are therefore driving longer distances to fill up their tanks and the choices available to rural motorists have been reduced. Action to help rural motorists is certainly badly needed.
There was a time when it could be argued that high fuel taxation was needed to discourage people from polluting the environment, but market forces have already achieved that. Nobody drives for the fun of it these days unless they literally have money to burn and, of course, anyone in such a position would not be deterred by high fuel duty anyway. High fuel duty has played its part in discouraging people from using their cars when public transport alternatives were available but, of course, in a rural area those alternatives are not often available. The price of fuel is already very high and the Government should not be considering putting duty up any further.
I was delighted when the Government abandoned Labour’s fuel duty escalator in the Budget, introduced the fuel duty stabiliser instead and brought down the fuel duty because the price was so high. The Government have scheduled a fuel duty increase for January as it was hoped at the time of the Budget that prices would have decreased by then, although they show no sign of doing so. If prices are still at this level in January, I hope that the Government will not press ahead with the increase.
My final point, which was also touched on by the hon. Member for Central Ayrshire, is about what exactly is causing the high price of fuel. The hon. Member for Coventry South (Mr Cunningham) referred to oil companies storing fuel rather than putting it on to the market. I want to ask the Government whether any collective action can be taken internationally—for example, through the G20—to bring the price of fuel down. The price of fuel adds to the price of everything in a rural area, so anything that the Government can do to bring the price down would be greatly appreciated by my constituents and all hon. Members who represent a rural constituency.
Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab)
This is the first time I have taken part in a debate that you have chaired, Mr Hancock, and so far you have been handling the discussion very well.
I want only to make one or two points of emphasis because I am conscious that all hon. Members present represent constituencies that are under the cosh in certain ways regarding fuel prices. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Central Ayrshire (Mr Donohoe) on securing the debate. I know that there is high feeling in the country about fuel prices because I get regular letters about the subject. I also note one of the points that he made earlier: so far, we have not seen the lorry drivers demonstrating. I do not know and would not like to say whether that will happen, but I would not like it to. I would prefer to think that the Government will take action, as they promised in the run-up to the general election when they were condemning us for the fuel price escalator.
It is worth noting and reminding the hon. Member for Argyll and Bute (Mr Reid) that the fuel price escalator was introduced by a Conservative Government—in fact, it was the previous Conservative Government. I was also interested to note that the hon. Gentleman mentioned that the Government had taken action to try to stabilise fuel prices. I think it was 1p or something that they knocked off so, frankly, they did not take very much action.
Mr Cunningham
I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s response because he is only apologising for the Government of whom he is part. When he was in opposition, he said the opposite; but never mind, we shall carry on.
Although we cannot broaden the debate, I would like to mention that one of the major implications of the fuel price increase is its impact on the wider economy. We could talk about pensioners who are on fixed incomes, one-parent families or people who rely on transport—whether it is the motor car or the bus. I need to check this out, but I think that, a couple of weeks ago, National Express announced that it may have to reconsider off-peak fares for pensioners because of the subsidy situation. That is something that the Minister may want to investigate.
Kerry McCarthy
I thank the hon. Gentleman for that clarification. It seems that the briefings from people lobbying on the issue are slightly out of date.
In conclusion, the Government’s efforts to reduce the burden of high fuel bills on households and businesses seem to have run out of steam, rather like a car running out of petrol. Ministers continually try to ignore the fact that their VAT rise has had the greatest impact on petrol and diesel prices by adding almost 3p to the price of a litre of petrol and £450 to the average family’s annual bills. As we know, VAT has a disproportionate impact on those who can least afford it, and evidence shows that that is harming the economy. The Treasury is happy to ask the EU for a derogation on fuel duty for the remote Scottish islands but, as we have heard today, people’s budgets all over Scotland and around the UK are being put under pressure by the cost of petrol and diesel, and the Government refuse to listen.
Scotland Bill
Alan Reid Excerpts(13 years, 5 months ago)
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Stewart Hosie
I have already given way five or six times and I want to make progress. There will be plenty of opportunities for hon. Members to intervene later.
There is a very strong case for additional powers. Evidence shows that corporation tax can be a key element in a country’s overall economic strategy and it has the potential to promote economic growth by enhancing international competitiveness and encouraging innovation and investment. As the Minister said, we have long argued for devolution of corporation tax as a powerful means of addressing the economic challenges facing the Scottish economy. We believe that a centralised and uniform corporation tax structure disadvantages nations such as Scotland to the benefit of London and the south-east of England. To say that is not to be anti-London or anti-south-east; it is just to say that when businesses reach a certain size, they tend, other things being equal, to be attracted to the largest conurbations. In the UK, that of course means London.
The evidence base for devolving corporation tax powers to Scotland is pretty clear. Over the last 30 years, as I said at the beginning, Scotland’s economy has grown more slowly relative to both the UK and the average of other small EU countries. One reason for that relatively weaker economic performance has been the relatively smaller corporate sector in Scotland relative to other parts of the UK. Business birth rates are lower, the business base is smaller and Scottish companies typically engage in less research and development.
As I said, there is also evidence that Scottish headquarters drift south of the border once businesses have reached a certain size. Effective use of corporation tax could serve as a powerful tool to address those trends by improving competitiveness and encouraging investment and expansion. Evidence shows that, at the margin, corporation tax rates can be an important factor in international firms’ decisions about foreign direct investment, which is one of the key objectives of the Scottish Government and Scottish Development International.
At the same time, a number of key sectors in the Scottish economy face tough competition from abroad. Companies abroad receive attractive tax breaks as part of allowances in relation to corporate taxation. The computer games industry, for example, has received a very attractive proposition from Dublin, and receives tax breaks in Montreal that have been denied by our Government despite forceful representations to the Minister by members of all parties. Improvements in those areas will help to boost productivity and, ultimately, the competitiveness of the Scottish economy, which will benefit not just Scotland but the United Kingdom as a whole.
The devolution of corporation tax powers is not solely about making possible the creation of a more competitive environment within the Scottish economy; it also about increasing and promoting accountability. A greater devolution of economic policy levers and tax revenues means that the Scottish Government will have the levers that they need to increase sustainable economic growth, and an opportunity to reinvest the proceeds of that growth—higher long-run tax revenues—in Scotland’s public sector. Having control over corporation tax would also mean that the Scottish Government would bear the risk on the economic levers. We believe that positive reform must be about balancing the revenue and expenditure implications of policy choices, and about giving policy makers the levers to promote economic growth.
Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
According to the hon. Gentleman's logic, if the power were devolved, the Scottish Government would reduce corporation tax. How would the gap in the Scottish Government’s revenue be plugged? Would that be done by means of higher taxes or a lower standard of services?
Stewart Hosie
The hon. Gentleman must have been asleep for the last 14 minutes, because that is precisely the question that the hon. Member for Edinburgh East (Sheila Gilmore) asked. I am surprised that he did not hear or understand my answer to her question, which was that the corporation tax yield would fill the gap caused by the reduction in block grant.
Stewart Hosie
I have two answers to that question. The first is that in the 40 years before the crisis, Scotland experienced a surplus on average. The second relates directly to the hon. Gentleman's question. I am fed up with the argument that runs “Scottish banks bad, English banks good.” There seems to be a failure of basic understanding. Northern Rock took £20 billion, as did the Lloyds banking group. No one seems to speak about Northern Rock. Bradford & Bingley required £37 billion. RBS required £45 billion, but a large chunk of that related to the asset protection scheme. It was not a question of Scottish banks’ being bad and needing to be bailed out while all other banks were fine.
I do not want to drift too far from the new clause, but the Office for Budget Responsibility made it clear in its assessment earlier this year that the net impact of the financial crisis measures would be a surplus of £3.5 billion for the taxpayer. It is interesting that the hon. Gentleman does not seem to know what the out-turn figure is likely to be.
Amendment 25 provides for powers to charge a tax charged on the profits of companies—
Stewart Hosie
Not at this point.
New clause 9 would allow for the introduction of an additional devolved tax charged on the profits of companies, and would require such a proposal to be placed before both Houses of Parliament.
Stewart Hosie
Evidence that I have seen in a significant number of companies suggests that the reductions in block grant would be phased in. We see a trend increase in business tax yield as business tax rates are reduced. I am sure that the Minister has seen similar figures, which may have driven some of his own policy decisions. I suspect that Scotland would be unique if we did not follow a pattern that has been seen time after time in other countries.
Stewart Hosie
I will give way to the hon. Member for Argyll and Bute (Mr Reid), but then I shall try to move on to excise duty.
Mr Reid
If the hon. Gentleman's argument is correct and reducing corporation tax results in an increased tax yield, that will apply in England and Northern Ireland as much as it will in Scotland. If there are different corporation tax rates in different parts of the United Kingdom and if the hon. Gentleman's argument is correct, surely every part of the United Kingdom will enter into a competition to reduce corporation tax, and we will end up with a race to the bottom to the detriment of all parts of the UK.
Stewart Hosie
I do not want a race to the bottom, but I do believe in tax competition. It is a pity that the hon. Gentleman and his new-found friends do not.
I must now move on from corporation tax to excise duty. Amendment 37 would ensure that provisions relating to alcohol excise came into force two months after the enactment of the Bill. New clause 19 would amend the Scotland Act 1998 so that alcohol duties became an exception to the general reservation in that regard.
All excise duties are currently levied by the UK Government. Alcohol duty is one of the most important excise duties levied in the UK. It is estimated to raise approximately £800 million a year in Scotland, less than 2% of the total tax yield in and on behalf of Scotland. In addition to raising revenues for the Exchequer, one of the key aims of the duty is to reduce excessive consumption of alcohol, which has been proved to lead to a variety of health and social problems. In the current devolution framework, the Scottish budget typically picks up the cost of addressing those problems through police, health and some social welfare costs expenditures. That is done entirely within the Scottish block. Devolving responsibility for excise duty to Scotland would help to ensure that the tax system for alcohol consumption was consistent with the alcohol policy of the Scottish Government and equipped to tackle one of the greatest health and social challenges facing Scotland.
Stewart Hosie
It is no such thing, as I am sure the hon. Gentleman’s contacts in the Scotch whisky industry will confirm.
There is a strong social case for the devolution of alcohol duty, not least because there is clear evidence that, for alcohol, price is a driver of consumption. There is strong evidence from numerous surveys in Europe, America, Canada, New Zealand and elsewhere that levels of alcohol consumption in the population are closely linked to the retail price of alcohol. As it becomes more affordable, consumption increases, and as the relative price increases, consumption falls.
We, and the Scottish Government, are committed to introducing a minimum price for alcohol, and gaining control over the excise duties would provide an additional mechanism to address excessive alcohol consumption. That would help to reduce the annual cost of alcohol misuse in Scotland. Devolving excise duty would enable a future minimum price per unit to be established within the excise system. Under the current system, the introduction of a minimum price is estimated to generate additional revenue for retailers, not the UK or Scottish Government. That was the argument the Labour party made in the Scottish Parliament. Devolving excise duty for alcohol would therefore result in all the additional revenue from increasing the price of low-cost alcohol products accruing to the Scottish Government, and those revenues could then be reinvested in public services in Scotland. The case for devolving alcohol duties is very strong indeed.
Mr Reid
I agree with one of the hon. Gentleman’s points: alcoholic drinks should be taxed on alcohol content. There is a practical problem with his amendment, however. It is my understanding that he wants to increase taxes on alcohol in Scotland, but if alcohol is then priced cheaper just across the border in Berwick or Carlisle, surely a lot of revenue will be lost by people nipping across the border to buy their drink?
Stewart Hosie
There are always borders. The hon. Gentleman was presumably one of the 28 Lib Dems who backed us in 2009. I am pretty sure some of the Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament now back minimum pricing. I ask for a wee bit of constituency in terms of the policy therefore, and given there are only five Lib Dem MSPs, it should not be too difficult to do a quick phone around.
I turn to the topic of capital borrowing and amendments 26 to 29. We all know that infrastructure investment is an essential contributor to productivity and economic growth. That is presumably why the Chancellor of the Exchequer made great play of spending £2 billion more on capital projects in the comprehensive spending review period than the previous Labour Administration had planned to spend. In the short term, such expenditure can boost economic growth, total output and employment. Over the long term, capital investment, both public and private, is a key driver of productivity, competitiveness and long-term economic growth.
Public sector investment that enhances a country’s physical, technological and digital infrastructure can increase the productive capacity of the economy and drive private sector growth and investment. Indeed, we know that direct capital investment would save or create twice as many jobs as the same amount of investment used for a VAT cut, such is the scale of the economic multipliers of direct capital investment.
Mr Field
I shall answer that intervention and finish on that very point. We do not have the information that we require to argue these points, and the sourness could ensue when the Scottish Government hold their referendum on independence. I believe that a large force in this House will insist on other parts of the United Kingdom having a say in that referendum. Given the sourness that will result if we continue the debate in the way we have tonight and certainly before now, the irony would be that the SNP could well fail to carry the Scottish electorate with it on independence, while the English electorate would vote for it.
Mr Reid
The Bill and the Government’s new clauses will bring about a substantial increase in the taxation and borrowing powers available to the Scottish Parliament, taking the Scottish Parliament and the process of devolution substantial steps further forward. Since the Scottish Parliament was established in 1999, it has been held back by the fact that it has had very few tax-varying powers and that its role has been largely to spend money rather than to raise it. By giving it these extra powers, we will increase its democratic accountability.
Mr MacNeil
Surely there is more to it than that. I often hear politicians and certain sectors of the media talking about democratic accountability, but is not the bigger issue the need to ensure that we have Governments, in whatever country, who are capable of influencing the economy so that it can grow? More important than politicians being accountable are people having jobs and the economy growing, so that we can live in a more prosperous society.
Mr MacNeil
Is not that argument similar to a golfer being told, “Of course you can go and play a round of golf, but you’re only getting a putter to play with”?
Mr Reid
The Scottish Parliament already has more than a putter, and the Bill will give it a lot more clubs in its bag.
I support the Government’s new clauses. I listened to the hon. Member for Dundee East (Stewart Hosie), who appears to have left us, and I conclude that he has not made a case for his amendments. I want to compare the SNP’s approach to that of the other parties in Scotland. The other parties all worked together within the Calman commission and, through deliberation and working towards consensus, came up with a package of measures to give more powers to the Scottish Parliament. The Government are implementing those measures through the Bill. The SNP, however, refused to take part in that process. It has come along tonight with amendments that have no back-up papers, and it cannot make a case to back them up.
When I questioned the hon. Member for Dundee East, I understood his case to be that if corporation tax is cut, more revenue will come in. As I pointed out in my intervention, however, assuming his case to be correct, if one part of the UK were to cut corporation tax, the other parts would be forced to follow suit and there would simply be a race to the bottom, in which businesses would not be paying their fair share of taxes. That would mean either personal taxes going up or services being cut.
Equally, the hon. Member for Dundee East did not convince me on alcohol duties. All the practical problems were put to him and he was not able to answer them. I understand that he thinks the Scottish Government should increase alcohol duties, but if such duties were lower in England, people who lived near the border would simply travel across it to buy alcohol. No doubt when they were in the supermarkets there, they would buy other things as well, which would be a loss to the Scottish economy.
Mike Crockart (Edinburgh West) (LD)
My hon. Friend makes a fine case, but it is not just the people living close to the border who would do that. A large black market would undoubtedly be created in exactly this type of goods and it would grow across Scotland and contribute to the difficulties that we have already mentioned about the country’s dependence on alcohol.
Mr Reid
My hon. Friend is correct. There would be an incentive for a white van man to drive south, fill up his white van, come up to Scotland and sell the alcohol at a profit. When I intervened on the hon. Member for Dundee East, we heard a sedentary intervention from the hon. Member for Angus (Mr Weir) to the effect that Argyll was not close to the border. However, I would point out to him that for a whole variety of reasons people from Argyll regularly visit England and, if they could buy alcohol cheaper there, there would be an incentive for them to fill up their car with it. That would mean a further loss of income to the Scottish economy.
Mr Weir
The hon. Gentleman is making a case, but for many years people have been going on holiday to other jurisdictions and bringing back alcohol with them; there is nothing unusual in that. The suggestion that all of a sudden there is going to be a massive influx seems to me ridiculous, especially given the cost of fuel in Argyll.
Mr Reid
But they would also fill up their cars with fuel when they were outside Argyll. The hon. Gentleman makes a point. We have heard about booze cruises to Calais, but despite the high price of fuel, it is cheaper for someone in Scotland to drive to England than to go to France. Britain has a certain degree of flexibility over its excise duties because it is surrounded by water. The one land border we have is between Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic and we have all heard the allegations of fuel smuggling. That shows it is more difficult for a country to set its own excise duties where there is a land border than it is when there is only a sea border. With a land border, setting a separate rate of alcohol duties would be difficult.
The hon. Member for Paisley and Renfrewshire North (Jim Sheridan) mentioned that people working regularly in England would be able to take alcohol back to Scotland on the train. That led me to think about what would happen on the train itself—I can imagine the announcement on the tannoy as the train leaves Carlisle: “Get your drink now because in five minutes the price goes up”!
To summarise, the SNP did not make the case for their amendments. Through their new clauses, the Government are giving substantial extra powers to the Scottish Parliament, so I will support the Government tonight.
Mr Reid
The Bill brings about a substantial increase in the powers that are devolved to the Scottish Parliament, especially those relating to taxation and borrowing. As such, it represents a substantial event in the process of devolution. I congratulate Professor Calman and his commission on bringing forward the proposals after detailed consultation, and on achieving consensus among three political parties. His proposals were subject to detailed scrutiny in the Scottish Parliament Bill Committee and by the Scottish Affairs Committee here. I also congratulate the Secretary of State and the Under-Secretary on their hard work in putting the Bill together and taking it through the House.
It is an old saying that devolution is a process, not an event. This is an important process; there will no doubt be further processes to come, but it is important that the subsequent devolution processes follow the same process as the Calman Commission and the Bill. There must be widespread consultation, detailed evidence should be produced and examined and then the Bill should be taken through after detailed scrutiny. The amendments rejected earlier this evening did not have the detailed evidence behind them.
Mr Davidson
I want to pick up on the issue of process. Amendments have been defeated tonight, but they will probably reappear in the Scottish Parliament. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that before they are debated further in this House, the Scottish Affairs Committee and others must examine them forensically to make sure that the gaps in the evidence that were identified earlier this evening can be exposed so that we can have a proper discussion and debate about the choices to be made?
Mr Reid
I certainly agree with the Chairman of the Scottish Affairs Committee and hope that his Select Committee will subject these proposals to detailed scrutiny.
Two of Scotland’s political parties took part in the original constitutional convention, which went up to three in the Calman commission. The party that has not taken part in any of these processes is the Scottish National party. I accept that it has a mandate for a referendum on independence and I look forward to that campaign. Where I think the SNP goes wrong is that it makes no attempt to bring about consensus within Scotland. Its referendum will fail and I suggest that in future it works with other parties so that detailed proposals can be subjected to scrutiny and we can take the process of devolution further forward. This Bill represents an important step. I hope that the House of Lords will pass it speedily so that all the important extra powers given to the Scottish Parliament can be put into effect.
Amendment of the Law
Alan Reid Excerpts(13 years, 8 months ago)
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Stephen Williams
I well remember sitting on the Opposition Benches during the final Budget of the right hon. Member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath (Mr Brown), and being one of those who spotted the fact that the tax cut being given to higher-rate taxpayers and the cut in capital gains tax, which were cheered by Labour Members at the time, were effectively being funded by a tax rise for the poorest people in society that doubled their rate of income tax from 10p in the pound to 20p.
People are also rightly concerned about their household budgets as a result of high fuel prices. You and I will know, Madam Deputy Speaker, that it is difficult now to find petrol or diesel costing less than 130p a litre anywhere in the city of Bristol. Even the local fuel station in my constituency is now charging 140p for diesel. I therefore welcome the measures to address those concerns by reducing fuel duty by 1p and by stopping Labour’s planned further increases, leading to a further 5p reduction in fuel duty. This will be welcomed by people not only in cities, such as those I represent, but in the rural areas around Britain represented by my colleagues.
Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
I also welcome the fact that the rate of fuel duty on the islands will be cut by 5p a litre, starting from April 2012. That will put an extra £5 million into the economy of our islands.
Stephen Williams
My hon. Friend is of course referring to the derogation from the European Commission that has been applied for in order to ensure that the coalition Government’s Budget promise is deliverable under Community law, unlike the undeliverable measure to reduce VAT proposed by Labour.
Fuel duty is, however, a blunt instrument for taxing the motorist. I welcome the measures put forward today to stabilise the prices in between the oil companies and the consumer, but in the medium term, we must look for a much better way of developing a market mechanism for taxing the use of our roads.
A further issue of fairness relates to tax avoidance. Whether practised by large companies or by rich individuals, tax avoidance is an affront to fairness, when ordinary people around the country are going out to work, paying their taxes on time and making their contribution. It is an affront to them that some companies are using the tax system unfairly to avoid tax. Some rich people in society—including sportsmen whom people admire—are also using those schemes. It is therefore right that the Government should take further measures today to close down some of those avoidance schemes and introduce an increased levy on non-domiciled individuals.
Right across the age scale, from pensioners who will benefit from the triple lock, guaranteeing that their pension will go up each year, to children from the poorest families, whose schools will receive the pupil premium, this Government are delivering for all sectors of society. These are fair measures that meet the concerns of ordinary Britons, the people who, according to the term that my party leader, the Deputy Prime Minister, has recently injected into the political debate, wake up to alarm clock Britain. [Laughter.] I knew people would like that, but those are the ordinary families around the country whom all hon. Members represent, and we should not laugh. They are the people who get up and go out to work. They work hard, they want their children to do well and they want their parents to be secure in old age.
Another major element of the Budget, along with fairness, is the plan for growth in the green book that has been launched today. It is important that the plan should be regionally balanced. One of the unfortunate legacies of the last Labour Government was the overheated economy in London and the south-east of England, and the credit bubble which, as we know, eventually burst. We cannot allow that to happen again. This Government are determined that growth should be shared fairly right across the nations and regions of the United Kingdom. That is why I particularly welcome the announcement today of 21 enterprise zones and I look forward tomorrow to hearing confirmation from the Prime Minister and the Deputy Prime Minister of where they will be based. I hope that one of them will be in the Greater Bristol local enterprise partnership.
Fuel Prices and the Cost of Living
Alan Reid Excerpts(13 years, 8 months ago)
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Ms Eagle
I was trying to help hon. Members by giving way. Obviously, that extends the time that one’s remarks take, but I think that some exchange helps the debate.
I hoped that the Chief Secretary would be here today, but we have the Economic Secretary instead. Why will the Chief Secretary not turn up to one of his own debates? Where is he? Why has he not come to tell us about what he has been doing on all those issues?
Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
The hon. Lady will recall that when she was a Treasury Minister, she received a delegation of highlands and islands Members of Parliament, including the Chief Secretary, and that we asked for a fuel duty derogation for remote rural areas. We had tea and sympathy, but no action. The Chief Secretary is now implementing that policy. Does the Labour party now support reduced fuel duty for the islands?
Ms Eagle
We want to do something that helps everyone in the country, not one third of 1%.
As we all know, VAT applies to petrol. As I said , the Library has calculated that the 2.5% increase in VAT has added nearly 3p to the cost of a litre of petrol when people are least able to absorb that extra cost. We all know that an extra fuel duty increase of 1p above inflation is factored into the Chancellor’s Budget arithmetic and due to be implemented next month. Taken with rising inflation, those changes could put 5p a litre on to fuel duty rates. The combination of sharp rises in world oil prices, ongoing uncertainty in the middle east and the self-inflicted rise in VAT is creating real hardship for many people. It causes higher inflation, lowers consumer spending power, which is already weak, and reduces both consumer and business confidence, thereby putting any prospect of growth at risk. The economy shrank by a shock 0.6% in the last quarter of 2010. People are getting increasingly desperate for some relief from the Conservative Government, but there is precious little sign of it.
Justine Greening
I will not give way to any more Opposition Members, and I will tell the House exactly why. This is not the first time that there has been an opportunity to debate fuel duty rises: last month a Conservative MP had a debate in Westminster Hall. The reason the Opposition have now gone quiet is that they probably did not know that that debate was due to take place, but if they did, it is even more disgraceful. How many Opposition Members turned up to participate in that debate and represent their constituents?
Justine Greening
Absolutely none, so all this is nothing more than political opportunism in advance of the Budget, and it is incredibly poor quality opportunism too, because the Opposition have made a proposal that is impossible to implement and is utterly flawed in every respect.
Fiona O’Donnell
Not at this stage.
The e-mails that I have received have not been the standard campaign e-mails that many of us find in our inboxes every day. I have been genuinely moved and angered by the stories that they have told. They have been from motorists, some of them older people living on pensions, people surviving on disability living allowance—Lord knows, they have enough to worry about under this Government—or people stuck on fixed incomes. This rise in the cost of fuel is hitting them hard.
I have also had e-mails from employers in my constituency. East Lothian relies heavily on small employers, but they are struggling. Two have already told me that their businesses will close this month, and that is bad news for East Lothian and for my constituents. We are promised that we will have a Budget for growth next week, but in East Lothian, the Government’s policy is not working; it is going in the opposite direction.
Fiona O’Donnell
I am sure that all my constituents will feel so much better after hearing that intervention. They do not want to hear the hon. Gentleman’s political point scoring and opportunism; they want to hear what the Government are going to do for hard-working families, for pensioners and for those with disabilities in my constituency.
I have had e-mails from people who have lost their jobs. People living in East Lothian need to be able to keep their cars on the road in order to access the services that will help them get back into work, to turn up for job interviews and to get out there to find and keep a job. I have also had e-mails from people who have been struggling throughout the past few years. I am going to admit that, for those on fixed incomes, times have been difficult, but the message is now clear that, under this Government, they are getting tougher.
I am also going to be unusually generous and congratulate the Tory party on a splendid result in the general election in East Lothian, where it moved up to second place. The Scottish National party—I see that its Members have now deserted us—moved down to fourth. Before the Tories get too excited, however, I should point out that that result involved a 0% swing from Labour. Many of the people who have contacted me voted for the Tories at the election, and I am representing them today without fear or favour. They want to know when the Government are going to deliver for them. If the Government will not listen to me or to those on our Front Bench, I urge them to listen to my constituents.
I know that the first questions that my constituents would want me to ask today are, “Where is the Chief Secretary to the Treasury?” and “Where is the Chancellor of the Exchequer?” They will be insulted that the Chancellor and the Chief Secretary have not had the guts to turn up and take part in this debate and to answer my constituents’ questions. I have something of interest to tell the House. I went to the same school as the Chief Secretary to the Treasury. The right hon. Member for Ross, Skye and Lochaber (Mr Kennedy) also went to that school, and he has remarked to me, “That’s now one of us from each of the political parties.” I am particularly disappointed that the Chief Secretary to the Treasury, who represents a rural constituency, does not see the impact that the increase in fuel prices is having.
I try hard not to be judgmental about the Conservatives, and I try hard not to make the kind of comments that the Minister finds so harsh. But when they talk about the tough choices that they face in government, I have no sympathy for them. I am sick and tired of hearing them talk about that. Being in government and having a chance to reach out to families in East Lothian is not what is tough in life; what is tough for people is working out how they are going to fill up their car at the Co-op in Tranent next weekend in order to keep their family on the road. That is what is tough.
Mr Speaker rightly criticised the hon. Member for Burnley (Gordon Birtwistle) for bringing an electronic device into the Chamber. I presume that the hon. Gentleman has been running around for the past half hour trying to find a printer somewhere on the estate. I have gone to the trouble of printing off a couple of the representations that I have received from my constituents, and I should like to read them out to the House. One comes from Alec Flynn in Tranent, who says of the fuel price rise:
“We are a small family road haulage business…and we would like your support to fight the price the government plan to put on in the budget”.
I want the Minister to address Alec Flynn’s concerns, and to stop moaning about tough choices.
Scotland Bill
Alan Reid Excerpts(13 years, 8 months ago)
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Mr Russell Brown
I did not intend to speak on the amendments tabled by the hon. Member for Dundee East (Stewart Hosie), but I feel that some issues need to be addressed, and I want to put to him one or two questions about fuel duty that I hope he will answer when he responds to the debate.
I am sure that no one in the Chamber does not recognise how difficult this issue has become for motorists in any part of the UK—particularly, I recognise, for those in the northern and western isles. However, when I look at the whole concept of devolving this additional tax on fuel duty, I wonder, in all honesty, whether the proposal would have been before us if fuel prices at the pumps were not so expensive. The hon. Gentleman has not given the slightest indication how this additional income would be used. More importantly, does he have even a ballpark figure on how much would be raised in additional taxation going to the Scottish Parliament? In a previous debate, he and I discussed the fuel duty stabiliser, of which he has been a great advocate. As I pointed out to him, his advocacy has not always been consistent, as there was one year when the SNP dropped the proposal. If he had his way and managed to get the amendment through, and the fuel duty charge became a devolved issue, would he totally abandon the whole concept of a fuel duty stabiliser?
I am not in favour of a fuel duty stabiliser, as I have made clear to constituents who have corresponded with me over recent weeks. I need only point to the campaign run by FairFuelUK, which has not given the slightest indication of what it thinks is a reasonable price for fuel and a reasonable level of duty. The wider public might think that this is a tremendous idea, but I warn the Committee, as I have warned my constituents, to be very careful. With the current fluctuating price of fuel—crude oil—and the way that the marketplace is at the moment, if a fuel duty stabiliser were suddenly introduced, we would end up with fuel pegged at a price that is unsustainable. People filling up their cars are already baulking at the whole concept of what they have to pay, and it is completely wrong to peg pump prices at a level that is unsustainable.
I will also briefly mention the rural fuel derogation, about which the hon. Member for Na h-Eileanan an Iar (Mr MacNeil), who is not with us, might have some idea. I hope that the hon. Member for Dundee East will indicate the average mileage of someone living in the northern or the western isles. I recognise how painful it must be for people living in those localities to pay 10p or 15p per litre more than people on the mainland. However, the pain that such people suffer if they do 5,000 or 8,000 miles a year is comparable to that suffered by people in areas such as mine who have to do 15,000 or 20,000 miles a year, or more. Fuel prices are only one element of motoring costs. People in some places pay an astronomical price because of the miles that they have to cover. On an annual basis, people on the islands might not pay more; they might even pay less if they have a low mileage.
Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
The hon. Gentleman should not denigrate the fuel duty derogation in the way that he has. On large islands such as Mull and Islay, people do a significant mileage. The use of fuel is not just about the number of miles one drives; if one drives on single track roads and has to stop and start all the time, one uses a lot more fuel. The important thing is to get the derogation established on the islands and to make it workable. It can then be extended to remote parts of the mainland.
Mr Brown
The hon. Gentleman, like so many people, has merely used the terminology of significant mileage. We need clarification. Will somebody in this Committee please put figures on this? To a person on the islands, significant mileage may mean 5,000 or 6,000 miles. I appreciate how difficult it is for people living in remote, rural localities. However, we are talking about finance—something that I am not an expert on, as I am sure hon. Members know. We need to be clear in our minds about what we are doing here.
Mr Reid
Perhaps I can give the hon. Gentleman an indication of the distances involved. The distance from Fionnphort on Mull to the largest town on the island, Tobermory, is 50 miles. Somebody driving from Fionnphort to the largest town on the island and back therefore travels 100 miles.
Mr Brown
I appreciate the hon. Gentleman’s clarification of the distances that people travel. I believe that that will be important in the case that the Government are trying to make for a rural fuel derogation. I am not demeaning anyone, but saying that we need to be clear when discussing finance what the situation will be.
Those are the brief points that I wanted to make, and I hope that we can get clarification before we vote on these issues this evening.
Fuel Prices
Alan Reid Excerpts(13 years, 9 months ago)
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Mr Alan Reid (Argyll and Bute) (LD)
It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Turner. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Thirsk and Malton (Miss McIntosh) on securing this debate. The issue is important for those of us who represent rural communities, as the large turnout of hon. Members from the two coalition parties and Northern Ireland indicates. However, the right hon. Member for Delyn (Mr Hanson) casts a lonely figure on the Labour Benches. I also note that no Scottish National party Members have turned up, which is a scandal considering all the things the SNP is saying in the Scottish press. It shows that the SNP’s priorities are completely wrong.
Representing a sparsely populated rural constituency as I do, I am only too aware of the impact of high fuel prices on people and businesses. I represent many islands of the Inner Hebrides. To give some examples, the price of fuel on larger islands such as Mull and Islay is typically 15p a litre higher than at a city centre supermarket, and on the smaller islands such as Coll and Colonsay, the price is usually about 30p a litre higher. That obviously has a great impact on people’s living standards and on anyone on the islands who is trying to run a business.
I was therefore delighted when the Government announced their intention of pursuing a pilot scheme under which a 5p per litre fuel duty discount would be introduced on many islands, including the Inner Hebrides. I know that the Government need EU permission to go ahead with the scheme, that it takes time to get such projects through the EU and that it is important that the Government get their proposals right, but I urge them to take the proposals through the EU as quickly as humanly possible. I hope that there will be no objections in the EU. Several other countries—Greece, Portugal and France—have similar discount schemes on their islands, so I hope there would be no obstacle to our island pilot scheme. However, as other hon. Members have said, it is not just on the islands that the price of fuel is high. It is the same in many rural parts of the country.
Andrew George
I am grateful to my hon. Friend, who is making an excellent case. My constituency, like his, would benefit from the proposed rural rebate, especially the Isles of Scilly, which have just 2,000 people. He is absolutely right that it should be a fait accompli at the EU level, because the principle is already established. The difference in price on the Isles of Scilly is much the same as in his constituency. Does he not agree that we must press Ministers not only to get the proposals through the EU as quickly as possible but to indicate where the pilot will be rolled out beyond the small areas that will benefit in the first phase?
Mr Reid
I agree. Some 6,000 of my 60,000-odd constituents will benefit from the pilot scheme, but I hope that it can be rolled out later to other rural parts of the country. However, the most important thing is to establish the principle. My hon. Friend will share my frustration that throughout the last Parliament, we proposed such a scheme every year in the Finance Bill and, although we often heard noises of sympathy from Labour Ministers, no action whatever was taken. It is important to establish the principle, which is why the pilot scheme is so important. Once the principle is established and is shown to work—Labour Ministers always said that it could not, in practice—we can prove it will work. It is important to establish the pilot and prove that it works. Then we can roll it out to other rural parts of the country.
On the coming Budget, the previous Government introduced the fuel duty escalator, which increased fuel duty by 1p over and above the rate of inflation. According to my calculations, that means that the tax on fuel would have increased by 4p in the coming Budget if Labour were still in power. Thankfully, they are not. I think we have established that any argument that fuel duty must increase for environmental reasons no longer stacks up. Market forces have already driven the price of fuel very high, which deters people from using their cars. Any further fuel duty increase would not help the environment; it would simply harm the rural economy.
Dr William McCrea (South Antrim) (DUP)
It is easy for the coalition to knock the previous Government, and I have no objection to that at all. However, the coalition Government will be judged by what they do rather than what they say about the past.
I draw to the hon. Gentleman’s attention the fact that many rural dwellers do not use cars as a luxury. They use them because there is no alternative. Many of my constituents have no good local bus service and no train. We should bear in mind that they use their cars not out of luxury but from necessity. The Government say that transport sits at the centre of the rural economy; let them prove that they mean that.
Mr Reid
I agree. In my own constituency, particularly on the islands, there are no trains, buses are few and far between, and it would not make sense for the local council to subsidise a bus service for only one person. That would be less beneficial to the environment than people using their cars.
I agree that it is easy to knock the previous Labour Government and that this Government must be judged on their record. It must also be pointed out that we face an enormous budget deficit and that the budget has to be balanced. I recognise that fuel duty brings in a lot of money for the Treasury, but I urge the Chancellor to find another way of raising revenue. Fuel duty discriminates against rural areas in a way that no other tax does, and almost any other tax increase to substitute for the fuel duty escalator would be an improvement. I will doubtless be considered a heretic at the Treasury for saying this, but why not put up the basic rate of income tax? The pillars of the Treasury may collapse at the idea that such heretical thoughts are still around. Every Chancellor for the past 30 years seems to have viewed bringing down the basic rate of income tax as a totemic symbol, but it is a much fairer tax than fuel duty because its impact is equally felt throughout the country, whereas fuel duty impacts far more heavily on rural areas. I therefore urge the Chancellor to abandon the fuel duty escalator policy that he inherited from the previous Government, and raise any other tax in order to balance the budget.
In conclusion, let us get the islands’ fuel duty pilot up and running as soon as possible, and abandon Labour’s fuel duty escalator in the Budget.