Schengen Agreement (Correction to Written Answer)

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Thursday 14th October 2010 Written Statements

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

I regret to inform that House that there were inaccuracies in an answer to parliamentary questions 15306, 15307, 15308, 15309, 15310 and 15391 (linked) on 15 September 2010, Official Report, columns 1077-78W.

The response contained inaccurate statistics and referred to measures which are not the responsibility of the Home Office and which are therefore outside the scope of the question.

I can confirm that the answer should have read as follows:

“The tables placed in the Libraries of both Houses set out measures for which the Home Secretary is responsible which have been presented to the Council pursuant to title IV of the treaty establishing the European Community (“TEC pre-Lisbon measures”) and title V of the treaty on the functioning of the European Union (“TFEU post-Lisbon measures” from 1 December 2009) attracting the UK opt-in.

They also set out measures presented following the entry into force of the Lisbon treaty pursuant to those elements of the Schengen acquis in which the UK participates (the police and criminal justice elements) and, pre-Lisbon those measures building on Schengen from which the UK was excluded.

The Lisbon treaty introduced a right for the UK to opt out of Schengen building measures where we were automatically bound prior to its entry into force.

There is one “mixed” measure currently under negotiation which includes provisions which build on those elements of the Schengen acquis to which we are bound: a Council regulation to establish an agency for the purposes of managing existing IT systems in the area of Justice and Home Affairs. The deadline by which the UK had to notify its decision to opt out of that measure was 21 June 2010; the UK made no such notification. The regulation also includes ex-title IV TEC (now title V TFEU) provisions to which the UK opted in on 23 September 2009.

Following the entry into force of the Lisbon treaty, excluding the IT agency, there have been 14 measures for which the Home Office has responsibility to which the title V TFEU opt-in has applied. The UK has opted in to nine and out of three, and is considering a further two published proposals where the Government will take a decision within three months. There have been three measures to which the Schengen opt-out applied (excluding the IT agency). The UK is participating in all three.

Additional information on the dates when all these measures were presented, when the UK signalled its acceptance at the Council, when they were adopted and entered into force are not held centrally and could only be obtained at disproportionate cost. However, all decisions to opt-in to or out of JHA measures are notified to Parliament at the time they are made. The first annual report will be presented to Parliament in December providing retrospective information on the UK’s application of the opt-in protocol from 1 December 2009 to 1 December 2010, a year since the Lisbon treaty came into force”.

Table 1 and table 2 referred to in the corrected answer will be placed in the House Libraries.

Youth Violence (London)

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Thursday 16th September 2010 Commons Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

I thank the hon. Member for Streatham (Mr Umunna) for raising the important issue of youth violence in London. Over the last few years, sadly, we have had several debates about youth violence. It is clear that the issue of violent crime remains a stubborn feature of our society. We need to do more to protect young people from violence and to empower local communities to work together to prevent the spread of violence. There is common agreement on that.

The hon. Gentleman takes a particular interest in this matter. He referred to the fact that he is the trustee of the Generation Next Foundation, and he is a former trustee of the 409 Project, so he has taken a close interest in youth issues and the impact of youth violence over an extended period. I note his approach and welcome a number of his comments. He referred to the sad and tragic murder in his constituency of Zac Olumegbon, and I extend the Government’s condolences to his family and all other families who have lost loved ones through violence. Although we may not always agree on the means to prevent violence, I am sure that all of us here today agree that one young death is one too many, as he said.

As the hon. Gentleman highlighted, we know that the vast majority of young people are well-behaved and that it is a minority we need to focus on, which is why I welcome the campaign led by London’s Serious Youth Violence Board, which highlights the fact that 99% of young Londoners are law-abiding and contribute positively to their communities. We should celebrate that fact. It is worth recognising that young people in our communities volunteer and take part in their communities probably more than any other group in our society, and I do not think we do anything by seeking to stigmatise or create a false impression of the situation. I welcome, congratulate and celebrate that, and it is important that we draw attention to it here.

[Stella Creasy]

I welcome the Minister’s support for the youth voluntary sector, but how does he square that with the Government’s decision this year to cut the final round of the youth sector development fund grant, which was funding many small voluntary third sector organisations that were doing precisely the sort of work he has just talked about and said we need to do more of?

[James Brokenshire]

I will come on to the issue of funding later, but the hon. Lady needs to recognise that there are real challenges here, in terms of the existing financial situation and the funding issues, and obviously the Government’s priority is to ensure that the economy is put on a strong footing. We will, therefore, be looking very closely at these decisions. However, given that the comprehensive spending review has not yet concluded—we will be announcing the details on 20 October—it is not appropriate or helpful for me to speculate.

[Mr Umunna]

On the spending review, can the Minister give us any comfort that the Government will look at the cost of putting a young person through the criminal justice system when they consider funding for the third sector? I referred to that in my speech.

[James Brokenshire]

The hon. Gentleman makes an important point, and it is one reason we are considering issues of early intervention and prevention, and the focus on preventing young people from reaching the criminal justice system. I have characterised it in the past as conveyor belt crime. By focusing on early intervention, we can make a difference. For example, that is why we will take Sure Start back to its original purpose, which was early intervention, increasing its focus on the neediest families and better involving organisations with a track record of supporting families.

I noted contributions made on both sides of the House about the issue of family. For me, one of the most powerful statistics that has struck me over the past few years is that young people in this country spend more time with their peers than with their families than in any other European country.

That issue—cohesion, the role of the family and the support that lies behind that—is an important one that we need to focus on. I am therefore pleased that the issue of family has been focused on in this debate. In that context, I want to pay tribute to those families who have been tragically touched by such appalling incidents. I am always humbled and inspired by the parents, brothers and sisters who have sadly lost loved ones, and by how they are making an enormous contribution by seeking to make a difference and change our society in so many ways, so that it becomes that much safer.

I also want to pay tribute to the work of the Metropolitan Police Service in tackling youth violence in London. Just one example of that is Operation Blunt 2. For more than two years, this dedicated team has been targeting stop-and-search powers to take weapons off our streets. Since April this year alone, it has carried out 55,759 searches and 5,629 weapons sweeps, and seized 591 weapons. In order to ensure that stop-and-search has strong community support, the team has also been engaged with the communities affected by youth violence, who have welcomed this engagement and the significant resources going into keeping them safe.

The Metropolitan police also leads Operation Trident, which is aimed at gun crime, particularly—but not exclusively—where both the victims and suspects are from black communities. The work is developed with community members and independent advisers, because the Metropolitan police understands that communities are a part of the solution to these challenging problems. During 2009-10, Operation Trident seized a third more lethally-barrelled firearms—a total of 104—than in the previous year, and disrupted 75 criminal networks.

[Mr David Lammy (Tottenham) (Lab)]

There is some concern about the use of the phrase “black-on-black violence”, which has been attached to Operation Trident, and a desire to review that in the light of the complexity of backgrounds of inner-city youth in London. Can the hon. Gentleman confirm whether a decision has been made by Boris—the Mayor of London—to cut the marketing budget of Operation Trident? It is important that we should be able to communicate with the young people of London in order to deflect them from crime, so can the Minister comment on whether that is, in fact, true?

[James Brokenshire]

The right hon. Gentleman makes an important point about the complexity of the problems surrounding this difficult issue. I am afraid that I cannot give him a direct answer to the specific point that he raises about any decision that the Mayor may or may not have made on Operation Trident. However, I should be happy to make inquiries and, as required, write to him if that would be of assistance to him. What I can tell him is that the Mayor of London has recently appointed an expert advisory group made up of members of the black communities to support him on a number of those complex issues. The information I have is that the Mayor remains focused on the issue, recognising the difficulties, challenges and complexities that many hon. Members have highlighted in this debate.

There is much more work being led by the Metropolitan police and partners in London. A new anti-violence board brings together partners in the police, health, education, offender management and the community, along with parents. It will focus on the most dangerous offenders, hot-spot locations and protecting the most vulnerable victims. In addition, this year the Home Office is providing £700,000 to tackle youth violence in the capital. Lambeth, in the constituency of the hon. Member for Streatham, is one area benefiting from that funding.

I also want to highlight the Mayor’s “Time for Action” programme, which recognises that to reduce youth violence we must ensure that young Londoners are a valued part of their communities and that they can contribute in meaningful ways. The programme focuses on: for the first time, giving young offenders in custody the tools to get them into work; tackling truancy; supporting young people in care to go to university; promoting sport; working with uniformed organisations to help build young peoples’ character; and sharing good practice.

I would particularly like to acknowledge the Mayor’s work to encourage the mentoring of at-risk black boys in Lambeth and other boroughs. The issue of young black men being disproportionately at risk of being victims and offenders is a challenging one—a fact that has rightly been brought to our attention in the debate tonight—and I certainly support all the initiatives that show a determination to take this on.

So there is an impressive array of work going on in the capital aimed at keeping young people safe. I hope that all hon. Members will join me in extending thanks to all those in London—the police, the Mayor, local authorities, community leaders and those in the local communities—who have worked so hard to contribute to this difficult work. Some of those excellent projects are currently being visited by Brooke Kinsella, whose brother Ben was tragically murdered in London two years ago. The Prime Minister and the Home Secretary have asked Brooke to head up a fact-finding mission to assess the work going on across the country to tackle youth violence. I am very pleased to have her working with us, but sorry that it was the loss of her brother that drew her into this work.

Brooke is visiting projects in London and across the country that are working to prevent young people from getting pulled into a world of violence. I know that she has visited some of the good work that is under way in the constituency of the hon. Member for Streatham, and seen a great deal of dedicated voluntary and community sector work with young people. Her findings will be presented to the Home Secretary later this year, to help to shape the Government’s work in tackling serious violence among young people.

I would like to take this opportunity to place on record the Government’s appreciation of Ms Kinsella’s dedication. I know that the projects she has visited have appreciated her time and support for their work to protect young people, and that she has been inspired by some of the excellent and varied work being led by local communities up and down the country. Some of those projects have been funded through the Home Office community fund, which, since 2009, has provided 144 small community organisations with £10,000 each per year to stop young people committing violence. I know that funding is always an issue, and in the current financial climate, that will continue to be the case. However, I know that Brooke has been very impressed at the work being undertaken, often with minimal funding but always with a great deal of commitment, hard work and community good will.

[Richard Fuller (Bedford) (Con)]

The hon. Member for Streatham (Mr Umunna) made some excellent points in his speech, and there was only one matter in which I had cause to disagree with him. That was when he described the pessimism about the response of the private sector and corporations. We are talking about crimes against young people in London, which is a centre for many businesses and corporations. Does the Minister accept that this Government, having inherited the current financial situation and therefore being able to do less themselves, have a responsibility to encourage those who are able to create great profits in this same city to do more, using measures such as social impact bonds and early intervention? What can he do to encourage more to happen on that front?

[James Brokenshire]

My hon. Friend mentions social impact bonds and other means of drawing funding together from a range of different sectors. He might be aware of some of the innovative work that has been done in Peterborough prison to look at outcome-based issues and the structuring of a payment-by-results method. The Government are really looking to achieve positive results, and we are certainly looking closely at the way in which the third sector and the private sector can be joined together to make a combined difference. In raising the issue of the role of the private sector and of corporate social responsibility, my hon. Friend has made an important and powerful point.

I also want to touch on the work of the Victims Commissioner, and to reassure families that this Government are committed to supporting victims of crime through the criminal justice system. That is an important aspect of all this. Since Victim Support’s homicide service was set up earlier this year, it has supported 457 individuals from more than 200 families, including after the tragic events in Cumbria. This service ensures that families bereaved by murder and manslaughter benefit from a professional caseworker and tailored, intensive support. I also want to draw the House’s attention to the work of Louise Casey, the Victims Commissioner. In her inaugural public speech, she outlined her first impressions of victim and witness care, and talked about how we could take the work further forward.

I am conscious that the end of the debate is drawing near, but I want briefly to mention the accident and emergency data-sharing work that is under way to ensure that we have good information, as well as the sentencing review that is being undertaken by the Ministry of Justice and the work being done on gang injunctions—

Alcohol Policy (Correction to Written Answer)

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Thursday 16th September 2010 Written Statements

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

I regret to inform the House that there was an inaccuracy in an answer given by the hon. Member for Tynemouth (Mr Campbell), in answer to parliamentary question 313016 on 3 March 2010, Official Report, column 1264W.

The response indicated that eight fines had been issued in 2008 for the offence of persistently selling alcohol to children (section 147A of the Licensing Act 2003) with an average fine of £968.75.

I can confirm that in fact in 2008, four fines were issued for this offence, and the average fine amount was £1,713.

Controls on Legal Highs

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Thursday 9th September 2010 Westminster Hall

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

It is a real pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Davies, in your first debate in Westminster Hall. I congratulate you on your appointment to the Panel of Chairs. I wish you all success in that position and in chairing many more debates in the weeks and months ahead.

In securing the debate today, I wish to address the issue of so-called legal highs, which are new psychoactive synthetic substances. The coalition Government will not lose sight of the harms caused by all drug use. Within our objective of making society a safer place for young people, we need to be responsive to such new threats and new harms. Over the past 18 months or so, there has been a proliferation of so-called legal highs, which are often drugs with a similar molecular structure to a controlled drug, but they have been deliberately altered by unscrupulous manufacturers to subvert our laws by producing an entirely new compound which, although the pharmacological effects may be similar to or greater than the controlled drug, are not already controlled under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971.

Those selling these potentially harmful drugs advertise them as legal and safe, often under purposely enticing brand names such as Fast Lane, Silver Bullet and many others, including Ivory Wave, to which I will refer later. They often label them as “not for human consumption” or “research chemicals”, or describe them as pond cleaner, plant food or bath salts, with the aim of circumventing medicines legislation—a purely insidious ruse. Another alarming feature is the way in which legal highs are advertised and sold over the internet, creating a more connected global marketplace, thus increasing the ways in which it is possible to buy drugs, which can be accessed by people of all ages.

A further layer of complexity is highlighted by the research from test purchases referred to in the latest report on naphyrone by the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs. Although people who sell legal highs often brand them as legal, test purchases demonstrate that they may contain any number of illegal substances, especially cathinones, legal stimulants or other active and inactive constituents. Simply because a drug is marketed as legal does not mean that it is safe or, indeed, that it is legal.

There is no starker reminder of the problem than the UK’s experience with mephedrone, which was rapidly established in the UK and was eventually brought under the control of the Misuse of Drugs Act with cross-party agreement in the final days of the last Parliament. The hon. Member for Tynemouth (Mr Campbell) is here this afternoon, and I know that he was involved in work to secure that position.

I want to discuss first the harms of such drugs, because that is at the root of our concerns and responsibilities. It is becoming increasingly clear that those substances are far from harmless and can have similar health risks to drugs such as cocaine, ecstasy and amphetamines. The ACMD—our independent expert advisers—has provided full assessments of harms on a range of substances that could be described as the first generation of legal highs: gamma-butyrolactone or GBL; synthetic cannabinoids; benzylpiperazine or BZP; and related piperazines and cathinones, including mephedrone and naphyrone. It is clear that some of those substances are so novel that there is little research into the short, medium and long-term risks that they pose.

What we can conclude from the ACMD’s reports to date is that those drugs—in some cases, more properly described as chemicals—are far from safe. By way of example, the harms associated with mephedrone identified by the ACMD include anxiety and paranoid states, and the risk of over-stimulating the heart and nervous system to cause fits and delusions as well as the risk of dependency. The recently published 2010 annual report by the national programme on substance abuse deaths advises that mephedrone has been detected in a total of 38 deaths in the UK, and was the sole direct cause of death in at least two of them. In a further two cases, mephedrone was implicated but there were also underlying health issues. Mephedrone has been implicated in two cases of death by hanging and was a contributory factor to another two deaths by natural causes. A remaining 29 cases await the completion of inquiries by the coroner or the procurator fiscal. It should be emphasised that the risks associated with the substances are increased if they are used with alcohol or other drugs.

For the reasons I have set out, action to address the health risks arising from the use of legal highs, including new ones coming on to the market, is a priority for the coalition Government. We need to reduce the supply of, and the demand for, new substances. Our response must be wide-ranging, encompassing prevention, education, treatment and enforcement, and at its core is our legislative response. As with all drugs, enforcement action must be taken at home—at local and at national levels—at our borders and abroad, to create a hostile environment for those selling legal highs on the internet and in so-called “head shops”.

In many ways, policing legal highs presents particular challenges for law enforcement, but I am encouraged that with joint working across law enforcement we are beginning to gain a better understanding and application of the full range of tools and powers available. We are working closely with the Association of Chief Police Officers and other agencies to develop a comprehensive and robust approach to tackle the mis-selling of illicit substances such as legal highs, by taking local, targeted action. ACPO guidance has been updated and is available to all police forces in England, Wales and Northern Ireland.

My Department has also called on local trading standards teams, through local authority chief executives, to work in partnership with the police to deal with the sale of legal highs, taking full account of the latest evidence that something branded as legal is not necessarily so, and to make appropriate referrals to the police and otherwise apply their responsibility for enforcing offences under the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008. Trading standards and the police, in a number of locations, are working closely with a range of partners, including drug treatment agencies, schools and youth services, to gather intelligence and to tackle sales from head shops and the internet.

In Norfolk, for example, all retailers believed to be selling legal highs have been visited by local trading standards officers. In Suffolk, following effective action by the police and trading standards, all known retailers have now agreed not to stock or to supply legal highs. We should also remember that it is illegal to sell, supply or advertise legal highs for human consumption under medicines legislation. The Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency will take appropriate measures to control and enforce medicines law.

The UK Border Agency has undertaken effective enforcement action against criminal gangs that traffic such drugs across our borders, by seizing and destroying shipments of illegal drugs and of legal highs that have been subject to an import ban under the open general import licence. The Serious Organised Crime Agency has actively developed approaches to identify importers, distributors and sellers of legal highs. That includes activity in conjunction with law enforcement partners and in parallel with work conducted by Europol and by the European Monitoring Centre for Drugs and Drug Addiction to gather intelligence on suppliers of legal high substances on the internet. Productive discussions have taken place with the competent authorities within source countries, mindful of their internal laws and regulations.

Along with referrals for enforcement action where appropriate, SOCA has also taken action to disrupt such activity by using preventive tools, such as the removal of websites, either in tandem with more traditional activity or independently. As part of a wider initiative to disrupt criminal activity, SOCA has closed 113 websites that offered mephedrone or naphyrone for sale after the respective bans.

Those trafficking banned substances face a substantial term of imprisonment—up to a maximum of 14 years—and, where they have profited from any illegal trade, the courts have the power to seize their property and other assets under the Proceeds of Crime Act 2002. We are also strengthening our forensic capability to identify new illicit drugs and emerging legal highs by creating a virtual reference library of characterised chemical standards. Working with forensics providers, the library will allow new evidential methods to be used to enable the police and UKBA to enforce the law. We are introducing technology at the borders to support UKBA in identifying any new drugs imported into the UK. That work will feed directly into our early warning capabilities.

Enforcement action of that kind is effective. We continue to monitor the impact of the recent bans on mephedrone and naphyrone, but indications are that they have curtailed availability, with law enforcement agencies able to take swift action to seize drugs and, to some degree, with retailers self-regulating themselves. Since the bans were introduced, UKBA has made a number of detections. It has stopped more than 128 kg of chemicals that it suspects to be mephedrone from entering the UK, and has seized more than 125 kg of naphyrone. Early indications from the police and forensics providers suggest that there has been a sizeable number of seizures of mephedrone since the ban in April this year. I hope to see the anecdotal information translated into national statistics in due course.

Prevention of drug use is an absolutely important element of the coalition Government’s approach to drugs. Young people need to be empowered to make the right decisions, and we all have a role to play in helping them to do that by changing attitudes towards any drug use. Young people need to be aware of the dangers of substances, including emerging legal highs. Parents must take a certain amount of responsibility for this. We know that young people listen to and trust their parents on such issues, and that parents can be hugely influential.

We also need to ensure that we get the balance right between communicating information accurately to the media and young people to deter use, and avoiding inadvertently raising interest in experimenting with new substances as they emerge. Interest in mephedrone and searches to buy it online increased with media coverage. In June, I wrote to the organisers of music festivals to make them aware of that, and asked them to review the measures that they put in place to ensure that their festivals are as safe an environment as possible.

Since 2005, the FRANK service has been offering a universally accessible service for anyone wanting help, information or advice on drug issues. The service, which is available by phone, on the web or by e-mail, can put people in touch with local services in their area and send out free information materials. FRANK also provides partners such as schools, youth services, charities and local services with an effective means of engaging with young people through the distribution of leaflets and classroom packs to deliver drugs education.

Later this month, we will launch a campaign to raise students’ awareness of the dangers of so-called legal highs and the risks associated with the use of such substances. We have established a partnership with the National Union of Students to deliver the campaign, which will launch during the freshers period to coincide with the new university year and the run-up to Christmas. Our work will seek to educate students on health risks associated with the use of legal highs and inform them of the possible illegalities of using such substances. As part of that campaign activity, I will write to university vice-chancellors to make them aware of the issue.

The FRANK service will be a key vehicle for communicating those messages. It provides up-to-date information on legal highs to young people, parents and carers via its website, helpline and text service. FRANK’s key messages on legal highs emphasise, first, that just because a drug is legal to possess, it does not mean that it is safe, and, secondly, that it is likely that drugs sold as a legal high may contain one or more substances that it is illegal to possess.

Previously, head teachers and authorised school staff had the statutory power to search without consent only those who were suspected of carrying a knife or other weapon. On 7 July, the Minister of State, Department for Education, my hon. Friend the Member for Bognor Regis and Littlehampton (Mr Gibb), announced that, as of 1 September—very recently, at the start of the term—that authority would be extended to include legal highs and several other articles. Our drug laws need to change more quickly to protect the public, and to combat the unscrupulous manufacturers and suppliers who seek to make huge profits at the cost of the health of the public, especially young people. As set out in the coalition agreement, the coalition Government have made it a priority to introduce a system of temporary bans as such substances emerge, .

The underlying purpose of the temporary banning power is to enable us to legislate quickly, while at the same time providing the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs with the time and space that it needs to formulate its full advice. The power is subject to parliamentary scrutiny, and while it targets supply, it does not criminalise young people unnecessarily, particularly when the true nature of the substance may still be in question.

I want to make it clear that the temporary banning power is a key and necessary tool in our legislative response to this changing landscape, but our preferred approach to drug control will remain the one which the advisory council and the Government have adopted for the past 40 years: a full assessment by the council before any controls are invoked by Parliament. I also wish to endorse and, as advice leads us, continue to adopt the use of generic definitions in our drug legislation to capture not only the substance encountered in the UK but its related compounds.

The Government intend to amend the UK-wide Misuse of Drugs Act 1971 in this first Session of Parliament. The power will have the following features: orders placing a drug under temporary control will be subject to a 12-month time period or earlier revocation if, for example, the drug becomes subject to permanent control in that time; it will be applied to trafficking offences including possession with intent to supply, offer to supply, supply, importation, exportation and production; it will apply class B current maximum penalties and/or an unlimited fine on indictment and six months and/or a £5,000 fine on summary conviction; and it will subject an order for temporary classification to the negative resolution procedure, and retain the affirmative resolution procedure with Privy Council Order in Council for permanent control.

I wish to highlight three features. First, the possession offence ordinarily prescribed for illegal drugs under the 1971 Act will not apply. A possession offence would send the strongest message, but our focus is on targeting importers and suppliers to curb availability, not to criminalise users, especially young people, while the full nature of the substance is mostly uncertain. However, we will ensure that law enforcement officers have the power to seize and retain a drug under temporary classification.

Secondly, as with drugs brought under permanent control, the role of scientific advice is both integral and necessary to ensure that any temporary ban is invoked on a necessary and proportionate basis. The advice that the advisory council has provided is key to the effectiveness to date of the UK’s legislative response, and it has enabled the UK to lead the world in responding to such challenges. It is proposed that the council discharge this role under a temporary banning power in line with its statutory position to provide expert independent advice, including on a drug’s likely psychoactive properties, as well as an indication of likely harmfulness, and legitimate use, for which we would have to consider the impact of control, as we do for drugs subject to permanent control.

We are working closely with the advisory council to develop a protocol under which we would work under a temporary banning power. The council and the Government also need to oversee the development of a more systematic approach to providing early warning of new substances. Thirdly, it is my intention to apply the Proceeds of Crime Act 2002 to drugs that are subject to a temporary control order, so we will seize property and other assets from those who are caught peddling such drugs out of pure greed, recklessly or deliberately disregarding the harm that they cause. Pursuant to our wider communications response, a clear and consistent narrative around the temporary class will support the proposed new power, to ensure that it is not less effective than the current system of control, and that users do not continue to use a drug subject to temporary classification with impunity.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD)]

Can the Minister clarify one aspect of the temporary ban? If the advisory council subsequently finds that the drug is not in fact dangerous in any shape or form, what will happen to anyone who might have been prosecuted for supply?

[James Brokenshire]

The hon. Gentleman makes an important point. In circumstances in which legislation subsequently changes, the criminal sanction still stands. That is why we have focused on the supply and public harm issues, rather than creating a possession offence.

If the ACMD were subsequently to determine that a drug under the temporary classification was not to move into a permanent classification, and someone had been convicted after an offence had been identified and a prosecution secured, that offence would still stand. That underlines the need for the protocol with the ACMD, which I have mentioned, allowing us to seek advice from it on the use of the temporary ban in the first place. That may be done on a more fast-track basis, but certain tenets need to be applied to that process, because the intention in using the temporary ban is not, as I have said, to circumvent the existing system but to use it. Issues to do with mephedrone and other legal highs have highlighted the potential need to act quickly, from a public harm perspective, and that is the focus of our intent.

[John Woodcock (Barrow and Furness) (Lab/Co-op)]

Does the Minister not agree that it would be strange if subsequent medical advice changed our understanding of a drug, and we had to say to a group of people who had deliberately circumvented the law—and not on the basis that they thought that there was a moral right to obtain this harmless drug—“Actually, it’s fine, you can get compensation for whatever penalties we imposed on you”?

[James Brokenshire]

The relevant point here concerning legal highs is that the ACMD flagged up to the Government its concern about mephedrone, pointing out that there was a problem it needed to do further work on to reach a final conclusion. It was so concerned that it was almost advising the Government to take preventive steps. Through this mechanism we want to be able to act, from a public harm and a warning perspective, to ensure that those issues are dealt with swiftly and quickly. In other words, we want to try to reduce the risk of harm occurring. That is the emphasis and intention behind the temporary banning power, and it is consistent with the approach taken in other legislation: that if the law is subsequently changed, pre-existing offences that may have been incurred still subsist.

I should like to mention Ivory Wave, which is causing a number of hon. Members significant concern and has been mentioned in the press and the media. I want to deal with certain reports associating the use of the so-called legal high-branded product Ivory Wave with a number of localised accident and emergency presentations in the last few weeks. Health alerts have been issued by the chief medical officers for England and Wales and Scotland, and the FRANK service was updated to highlight the risks that we are currently aware of that are associated with Ivory Wave. We are actively monitoring the situation. My Department has received early information from the Scottish Crime and Drugs Enforcement Agency that the latest Ivory Wave products associated with the admissions in Lothian may contain a non-controlled amphetamine-type stimulant, Desoxypipradrol, or 2-DPMP. Confirmation from forensic providers and details of other sampling is awaited.

In Edinburgh, Lothian and Borders police, in partnership with the City of Edinburgh public health authorities, have visited a number of head shops, which has led to the removal of Ivory Wave products from sale. Hampshire police have also conducted a joint operation with trading standards, raiding two head shops on the Isle of Wight, resulting in the seizure of large quantities of legal highs and the arrest of two individuals for suspected supply of controlled drugs. In the light of that information, earlier this week I spoke to the chair of ACMD, Professor Les Iversen, and asked the council to keep a close interest in developments here and provide advice as necessary. I have instructed my officials to share with the ACMD information that we have and provide regular updates.

There were previous indications that the so-called legal high Ivory Wave had contained certain controlled drugs. Different supplies of Ivory Wave using that brand name contain different drugs, some of which may already be controlled drugs, hence our seeking further information on the forensics and the nature of the drugs seized under that branding.

We are dealing with this emerging and dynamic problem of legal highs, including BZP, synthetic cannabinoids, mephedrone and the latest so-called legal high. Although effective legislation is integral to our response to protect the public—particularly the health of our young people—from the harms of the drugs, there is no easy fix. We are working closely with the ACMD out of a shared concern about these new psychoactive substances. As well as advice on individual drugs, our response will also be informed by the advisory council’s thematic work on legal highs. That response must be wide-ranging, encompassing all the strands that will reduce both demand and supply. But let me say clearly to anyone tempted to try a legal high that just because something is advertised as legal does not mean it is safe—and it may not even be legal.

--- Later in debate ---

[James Brokenshire]

We have had a good, wide-ranging debate about legal highs. Various hon. Members highlighted the fact that even using that terminology brings about a misconception. To take the last point from the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Tynemouth (Mr Campbell), about why people take drugs, including legal highs, when they know the risks, I think that that is part of the problem—they do not know the risks. The fact that something is branded as a legal high implies that it is safe. Therein lies part of the challenge in relation to these newly emerging psychoactive substances—I agree that that does not trip off the tongue, either—that highlights the important need to ensure that the legislation is there as a mechanism for telegraphing clear messages about enforcement of the law and about safety.

I noted the hon. Gentleman’s comments about mixed messages. I say to him very gently that his Government sent out very mixed messages about cannabis, so perhaps he is not in the strongest of positions from which to be pointing fingers about communicating messages.

[Mr Alan Campbell]

I just want to make a very personal point. The records show that in fact the very first time that the messages started getting mixed, it was not this Member of Parliament who supported that process.

[James Brokenshire]

I note the point that the hon. Gentleman has made, but clearly it was his Government who sent out some very mixed messages, even if he was not personally responsible for the decisions that underpinned them.

I want to cover as many as possible of the points raised during the debate, which has been helpful and constructive on the issues and challenges surrounding legal highs. It also touched on the drugs strategy from a broader perspective. I do not regard this as an opportunity for that broader debate, but it is important to recognise that the coalition Government are consulting on their new drugs strategy. We intend to publish the new drug strategy by the end of this year. Our strategic vision is set around the framework for the future delivery of drugs policy with four key themes, to which the hon. Gentleman has already alluded: preventing drug use; strengthening enforcement, criminal justice and the legal framework; rebalancing treatment to support drug-free outcomes, which is an important point to emphasise; and supporting recovery to break the cycle of drug addiction.

The Government are opposed to the legalisation of drugs and to decriminalisation for personal use. It would run entirely counter to our health and education messages. In many respects, the equation of safety with legality, as we have been debating on the issue of legal highs, makes that a very direct construct. On the possession of legal highs, I say to the shadow Minister that the temporary ban is, as it suggests, intended to be only temporary—a maximum of 12 months. If advice supports the classification of a drug within that 12-month period, we would act within that period. It may therefore happen in less than 12 months, which would then create the possession offence. Our approach with the temporary ban is to act quickly to stop supply and prevent harm, which is why we have tailored it as we have. It does not send out mixed messages, due to legality—in its broadest sense—being equated with safety. We have seen that and seen how the classification of drugs can have an impact on whether someone perceives a drug to be safe. That goes back to my original point on the equation of safety and knowledge, which has been highlighted.

We do not support the legalisation of drugs. Many drugs such as heroin and crack cocaine are clearly addictive and harmful to health, and our educational message, to young people in particular, is that illegal drugs are harmful and no one should take them. To legalise their supply for personal consumption would send the wrong message to the majority of young people, who do not take drugs on a regular basis, if at all, and, alongside that, it would increase the risk of drug use and abuse.

On the specific point about the Portuguese model, we are against that proposal. The Government are determined to prevent drug use and strengthen enforcement against supply, which is why we are asking experts for their views on a range of issues, so that users are strongly encouraged to address their dependency. That wider debate and consultation is taking place, but we are not looking at the Portuguese model, and do not think that it is the right way forward.

[Tom Brake]

The Minister says that he is not looking at the Portuguese model, but there were references in the press last week to the Government looking at the Portuguese and Spanish models. Were those press reports wrong?

[James Brokenshire]

I cannot comment on the countenance of reporting in The Observer, but I can send out a very clear message from this debate—the Government do not believe that decriminalisation is the right approach. Our priorities are clear. We want to reduce drug use, crack down on drug-related crime and disorder, and help addicts come off drugs for good. That is the emphasis of Government policy.

I would like to come on to the specific points that have been raised, and, in particular, the important point raised by the hon. Member for Barrow and Furness (John Woodcock) on the Medicines Act. The Act applies to medicinal products, so we need to establish certain key components—in other words, that a substance has psychoactive properties and is potentially meant for human consumption. That is where those who have sought to subvert the law through using certain phraseology in their advertisements have sought to obviate medicines control legislation.

I assure the hon. Gentleman that we remain in close contact with the Department of Health, as well as trading standards, to see how we can use the Medicines Act more effectively and to explore those options. I agree with him that it is absurd that products can be marketed as bath salts and other things, and are “not for human consumption”, when implicitly they may be intended to be so used, or there is recklessness. We are carefully exploring this area to see what enforcement options exist.

The points about the protocol and triggers are important. The purpose of the working protocol is to set out our engagement with the ACMD, and, through it, any legal controls on dealing with legal highs would be enacted. I am in close consultation with the ACMD to develop that working protocol, because it is important to give reassurance that the temporary banning power is appropriate. As I said to the hon. Member for Carshalton and Wallington (Tom Brake), the Government remain committed to the general response to the drugs being based on the existing framework under the Misuse of Drugs Act and on how the ACMD normally operates. Clarity over the protocol and the triggers, and setting it out in the working protocol with the ACMD are important to give reassurance on how we would use the temporary banning power.

[Tom Brake]

The Minister may be about to come on to this, but when does he expect the temporary ban to kick in after a product such as Ivory Wave suddenly hits the market? Obviously he cannot give us an exact response. What time scale are we talking about?

[James Brokenshire]

It is difficult to second-guess the issue or look into a crystal ball. We are in close consultation with the ACMD on the development of the working protocol, which I would not wish to pre-empt. In all the discussions I have had with the ACMD, it is clear that if a newly emerging psychoactive substance is identified, the intention is that advice would be sought on the associated harms. We would seek its advice on whether a temporary ban would be appropriate, so it is about working around that and the identification. Hon. Members also made points about the early warning system, and working with the ACMD on that and picking up things early enough to deal with appropriately.

[Mr Alan Campbell]

I am genuinely confused, but I am sure that the Minister can put my mind at rest. If a substance is subject to a temporary ban, why is it illegal to import or supply it, with fairly draconian penalties, but not illegal to possess it?

[James Brokenshire]

I thought I had already explained the position. I am sorry if I have not made it clear. The emphasis behind the policy is about ensuring that we stop the supply, importation and sale of the drugs and about ensuring that we can act quickly to deal with some of the challenges that I know the shadow Minister faced in Government over mephedrone. Perhaps I share his frustration at being told by the ACMD that there was a problematic psychoactive substance and feeling that one is unable to respond. There are certainly issues; he highlighted importation issues and the general licence that could be invoked, but that does not tackle domestic supply. To ensure that drugs do not get on to the streets and into the hands of young people, it is important to deal with the problem at the border and in this country. That is why we believe that the temporary ban approach is the right way forward when a newly emerging psychoactive substance that has been indentified as harmful comes through.

I would like to address the issue of whether a newly emerging substance has other uses. It is fair to make that point, and the Government will seek parallel advice from the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills on a drug’s legitimate use and will develop any required impact assessment, which will inform the decision on whether to impose a temporary ban on that drug. In the event that a legitimate commercial use is identified in discussions with the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills, the Home Office will take reasonable steps in the light of the ACMD’s advice on the risk to public health when a substance is misused, to ensure its continued availability for legitimate use under the temporary ban and, subject to further consideration, under circumstances in which that ban is made permanent. There are examples showing how that approach could be taken. It is important to recognise that point, and advice will be sought from the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills and the ACMD in relation to the application of those powers.

My hon. Friend the Member for Enfield, Southgate (Mr Burrowes) raised the issue of what other countries are doing, and gave the specific example of Ireland. I am aware of the changes that are taking place there and of the fact that the Irish are considering a broader definition of drugs. We can look, too, at the example of the United States and the analogue legislation that is in operation there. The Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs is considering the broad policy issues and the various different examples. Although I cannot comment on whether it is looking at the Irish situation, it is doing broader work on legal highs. We await its report on appropriate approaches, which may take into account factors such as a broader definition. I do not want to prejudge or pre-empt the work of the ACMD, but we appreciate the work that it is doing, and look forward to its response. Certainly, we are considering a proportionate response based on the tenets of harm before imposing criminal penalties.

The hon. Member for Tynemouth asked whether other EU countries had taken different approaches on temporary bans. The experience is that those countries have tended to take a very narrow perspective on the utilisation of temporary banning powers. Spice was one of the cases in point. In this country, we have sought to take a more generic approach to a class of drugs, so that we avoid the issue of tweaking and slight chemical manipulation. The temporary bans and the immediate action that were taken in some other EU countries were much more narrowly focused, so we are not comparing like with like in that regard. The approach that we hope to take is very much looking at that broader categorisation rather that at one specific drug alone, without necessarily considering the anologies that may exist alongside all of that. That is very much part and parcel of the work that we would adopt.

I have a couple of things to mention in relation to the New Zealand case. I am advised that its class D is currently empty, but that could be a reflection of the fact that New Zealand has not had to respond to legal highs in the way in which the United Kingdom has. It is difficult to make cross-over judgments. Moreover, the class D model envisages a regulated supply as well, which is not the approach that the UK seeks to adopt.

The hon. Member for Carshalton and Wallington highlighted the issue of khat. The Government acknowledge the concern in communities affected by khat use, particularly in relation to the social problems, which include unemployment, family breakdown and financial hardship. We are committed to addressing any form of substance misuse and will keep the issue under close scrutiny. Home Office research into the social harms of khat use, as well as the treatment needs of users, was commissioned last year by the previous Government, and it looked at a number of communities and areas in England and Wales. We are quality-assuring the work and will produce an independent review of the findings, as is standard practice with all Home Office research reports. We will publish those reports later this year and consider them carefully.

This has been a positive and productive discussion on a sensitive issue that has impacted on far too many communities. Reflecting on conversations with parents of children who have been adversely affected by drugs and with those who have lost very close loved ones, I can say that they underline the importance that we must place on addressing the harms linked to these so-called highs. It is incumbent on us to continue to send out the message that simply because something is marketed as legal does not necessarily mean that it is legal, and above all it certainly does not mean that it is safe.

Question put and agreed to.

National DNA Ethics Group (Third Annual Report)

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Monday 26th July 2010 Written Statements

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

I am pleased to announce the publication of the third annual report of the National DNA Database Ethics Group on 29 July 2010. The group was established on 25 July 2007 to provide Ministers with independent ethical advice on the operation and practice of the National DNA Database (NDNAD).

I welcome the consideration given in the report to a number of important issues. The Government share the concerns of the group to ensure the effectiveness of the database and its ethical operation. Merely building as big a database as possible is neither effective nor does it achieve the proper balance between the rights of the individual and the needs of the state. I believe that the Government’s commitment to introducing the protections of the Scottish model achieves that balance and we are committed to introducing legislation to give effect to that, which I hope will address the key concerns around the database

The report can be viewed from 29 July on the website of the independent Forensic Science Regulator and I am arranging for copies to be placed in the Library of the House.

Justice and Home Affairs Informal Council

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Thursday 22nd July 2010 Written Statements

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

My right hon. Friend the Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice and I attended the Justice and Home Affairs Informal Council on 15 and 16 July in Brussels.

Discussions on the Interior day centred on two themes: how to reach a common European Asylum System by 2012 and crime prevention.

During the first session, the presidency posed a couple of questions asking whether priority should be given to the negotiations on the Dublin and Eurodac regulations and qualification and long-term residence directives while allowing additional time to consider the appropriate way forward on the procedures and reception conditions directives and whether Ministers supported the inclusion of a temporary suspension clause in the Dublin regulation for countries under pressure.

I underlined that asylum required an international response and that the UK had taken in the highest number of individuals in Europe last year. However, the UK did not believe the directives resolved the challenges facing member states: they increased the rights of asylum seekers, at the expense of providing protection quickly for those in need and return for those who were not in need. I underlined the need for practical co-operation to build the capacity of member states’ asylum systems including via the European Asylum System Office and Frontex. On Dublin I said that the UK remained very sceptical of a suspension mechanism, which would address the symptoms not the cause of the problems and risked making them worse.

During the second session, the presidency posed a number of questions on crime prevention, calling for implementation of the EU internal security strategy to focus on practical co-operation and prevention, identification of a methodology for prioritising threats and identified two areas where work might begin on firearms trafficking and itinerant groups.

I welcomed the presidency priority given to the internal security strategy and the Commission’s analysis of the link between organised crime and local crime, particularly efforts to tackle illegal firearms but on itinerant groups I would want more information on how they were to be defined. I noted the role of passenger name records in fighting organised crime and expressed disappointment at the Commission’s recent information that the directive would not be published until next year. Other delegations also called on the Commission to bring forward plans to publish an EU passenger name records directive

Discussions on the Justice day centred on the role of Eurojust and the launch of the e-Justice portal. The Justice Secretary stated that the UK valued Eurojust and felt that the EU should wait until the Eurojust council decision had been fully implemented and evaluated before looking to legislate in this area again. The Justice Secretary reinforced the UK’s position that it would not be participating in the European Public Prosecutor Office.

The European e-Justice portal was launched by the Belgian Justice Minister with Commissioner Reding. The portal is a website that functions as a point of access to a range of information on justice matters across the EU. This first release of the portal concentrates on the provision of information—for example how the legal systems in each member state work and links to websites of most relevant interest to citizens and lawyers.

DNA and CCTV (Crime Prevention)

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Tuesday 6th July 2010 Westminster Hall

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

I welcome you to the Chair, Mr Amess. It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Shipley (Philip Davies) on securing the debate and on raising a number of important issues. I noted the initial comments of the right hon. Member for Leicester East (Keith Vaz), and it is interesting to see the coalitions that can sometimes form during a debate. I do not know whether it includes the right hon. Member for Don Valley (Caroline Flint), but a coalition has certainly been created in this debate.

Perhaps I can reassure my hon. Friend the Member for Shipley and other hon. Members by saying that I absolutely agree with what they said about the importance of DNA and CCTV in tackling crime. My hon. Friend referred to comments that I made, not necessarily in a previous life, but in a previous seat. I certainly believe in the importance of CCTV, which can be harnessed in such a way as to protect our communities.

In many ways—to take the point made by the right hon. Member for Don Valley about many people’s perception or fear of crime within their community—CCTV can be an important tool for that if it is used effectively with the appropriate framework and public support. That point was made by my hon. Friend the Member for Stourbridge (Margot James). I do not want to give the impression that the Government are fundamentally opposed in some way to CCTV cameras. They have an important role in supporting communities and aiding the police in their work.

[Andrew Percy]

Will the Minister give way?

[James Brokenshire]

I should like to make some progress; I need to reply to several speeches, and I might need to take an intervention from an hon. Member who did not get called to speak.

The interesting and perhaps central point in the debate is the balance between the right of the public to be protected from crime and the right of individuals to live their lives without unnecessary state intrusion. That has been at the forefront of many of the speeches this morning. It has been interesting, and there have been some important contributions. I hear what my hon. Friend the Member for Shipley said about drawing a distinction between certain freedoms, which he articulated with reference to ID cards, which he sees as an intrusion, as against CCTV surveillance or the retention of DNA profiles, which he did not see as an intrusion in the same way. Clearly, not everyone shares that view, as we have seen in connection with developments in Birmingham; indeed, many cases from constituency postbags, to do with DNA profiles, for example, show that the issue is considered significant for the way the state may perceive individuals who have done no wrong. That private life interest is involved in the balance.

There have been comments about the role of the police. We have certainly discussed issues with ACPO and other police representatives and shall continue to do so as we progress with and publish our detailed proposals, so that the House can give them proper consideration. I am sure that we are only at the start of discussion of those important issues, which is why I welcome the speeches that have been made, albeit that, while it is a pleasure to continue in debate with the hon. Member for Tynemouth (Mr Campbell), he and I have probably debated the issues six or seven times in the past couple of years and I am reconciled to our not reaching complete agreement. We do, however, find agreement in the importance we place on public safety and the need for checks and balances on the retention of DNA. Although I may the other day have made a pejorative suggestion about the hon. Gentleman supporting the indefinite retention of DNA, I recognise that at the time in question that was not his position: there was recognition of a need for some restrictions on the retention period and related matters. We may not be wholly on the same page, but I recognise that there is at least some agreement about some issues.

[Keith Vaz]

Does the Minister accept the recommendation of the Select Committee that there should be an annual debate on the issue in Parliament, with a report presented to Parliament by the Information Commissioner?

[James Brokenshire]

I very much welcome the contribution made by the Home Affairs Committee on the issues of CCTV and DNA retention. I made sure that I had a copy of at least one of those reports before coming to today’s debate. We shall certainly reflect on a range of issues about CCTV as we proceed with the framework for regulation, and I shall consider the recommendations in the Committee’s report. Other codes of practice have been referred to and the right hon. Member for Leicester East mentioned the Information Commissioner, whose office has published a CCTV code of practice. That is important in informing the debate, as are the findings and feedback that we receive from the interim CCTV regulator, which as the right hon. Member for Don Valley pointed out was set up under the previous Government. We await the regulator’s recommendations and feedback and will reflect upon it closely in relation to how we may proceed.

[Emma Reynolds]

Have the Minister or the Government made any assessment of the cost to businesses of increasing regulation of CCTV cameras? Many businesses in Wolverhampton North East use them to prevent and tackle business crime, which is still a massive issue.

[James Brokenshire]

The hon. Lady makes an important point about the nature of regulation. We are considering its ambit and scope in relation to public versus private areas, and publicly-owned versus privately-owned CCTV. Of course we are conscious of the regulatory burden and the possible regulatory impact. That will be a factor that we shall consider—and are considering—as part of the regulatory framework we shall bring to the House, so that there can be further debate.

Perhaps I should return to the central issue of the debate and the balance between the public’s right to be protected from crime and individuals’ right to live their lives without undue interference. I do not see that there is necessarily a conflict between the two. We are rightly proud in this country of our tradition of policing by consent. Securing the trust and confidence of the public is vital to the police, to enable them to detect and prevent crime effectively. That extends to the techniques and tools used by the police in their role. I was struck by the remarks of the hon. Member for Edinburgh West (Mike Crockart); one of his key points was about the concepts of usefulness and effectiveness. If we ensure that there is trust and confidence, and that the scientific elements are deployed so as to be more effective and so as to secure public trust and confidence in them, that in itself aids policing; it aids confidence, trust and belief in the work that the police do on our behalf to make communities safer. That is an important aspect of the debate and I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s speech.

We are all aware of cases in which DNA evidence has been important in proving guilt or innocence, and several examples have been given this morning. The fight against crime necessitates the use of modern scientific techniques of investigation and identification. Indeed, this country claims a pioneering role in utilising DNA technology. As we have heard, it has proportionately one of the largest DNA databases in the world, with more than 6.1 million profiles stored on it. It has grown by more than 1 million profiles in the past two years. The use of technology must strike the right balance between the wider interest of public protection and the respecting of private life rights. That sense of proportionality is central to the debate.

[Mr Nuttall]

Will the Minister explain briefly how having a DNA profile put on a database can affect someone’s private rights? How does their profile being on a database impinge on their rights?

[James Brokenshire]

I think that I touched earlier on the fact that it is a question of the way the state may perceive an individual as a criminal, when they are innocent, and the impact of that on a person. As a Home Office Minister I sign many letters to honourable colleagues who have raised that point, and I am sure that the hon. Member for Tynemouth used to do so before me.

This morning’s debate is drawing to a conclusion. I look forward to continuing debate and I invite right hon. and hon. Members to engage positively in it as we progress and as further details of our proposals are published. We have reflected on the need for and effectiveness of CCTV systems and the DNA database in helping to prevent and detect those crimes that are of most importance to our constituents, in a way that respects their civil liberties and commands their confidence and thus supports the police in making us all that much safer.

Oral Answers to Questions

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Monday 28th June 2010 Commons Chamber

[Jo Swinson (East Dunbartonshire) (LD)]

7. What representations she has received from Scottish Water on removal of the security fences at Milngavie waterworks.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

No representations have been received from Scottish Water, but I am aware of the hon. Lady’s interest and of discussions that have taken place between Scottish Water, the Scottish Government and the Centre for the Protection of National Infrastructure about the replacement of security fencing with less intrusive measures.

[Jo Swinson]

I thank the Minister for that answer, but these so-called security fences around Milngavie reservoir cover only a tiny part of the three-mile perimeter, and as the rest is completely open to the public they serve no practical purpose other than being an eyesore spoiling a beautiful and popular local attraction. Scottish Water has said that it is waiting on a new directive from the Home Office before it can remove these fences, so can the Minister look at this issue again and ensure that that directive is issued without delay?

[James Brokenshire]

I know that the hon. Lady has run the campaign, and I understand her interest in ensuring access to the area around the reservoir. We will discuss with the Scottish Government the application that I understand they have received from Scottish Water in relation to this issue. The continuing need for the security fences will be looked at in the light of CPNI advice and any other alternative measures that may be forthcoming.

[Damian Collins (Folkestone and Hythe) (Con)]

8. What recent representations she has received on the amount of time spent on administrative tasks by police officers each year.

--- Later in debate ---

[Karen Lumley (Redditch) (Con)]

12. What progress she has made reviewing the retention on the national DNA database of records of those who have been neither charged nor convicted of a crime.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

The Government are committed to adopting the protections of the Scottish model for retaining the DNA profiles of those who have not been convicted of an offence. We will introduce our detailed proposals shortly.

[Karen Lumley]

Is the Minister aware that the previous Government failed to ensure that all prisoners were on the DNA database? Can he reassure the House that steps are being taken to fix that problem?

[James Brokenshire]

My hon. Friend makes a very important point. Despite their desire to retain DNA profiles indefinitely, the then Government did not focus on getting those who were convicted, possibly of serious offences, on to the database to ensure that it was effective in fighting crime. That is certainly something that we are looking at very closely in terms of the proposals that we will introduce in the House in due course.

[Mr Alan Campbell (Tynemouth) (Lab)]

I welcome the hon. Gentleman to his post. Why does he believe that the Scottish police support the current English model, rather than the Scottish model, for DNA retention? Is that because the English model is based on evidence, whereas the Scottish model is not?

[James Brokenshire]

The hon. Gentleman makes quite an interesting point. As I understand what he said, he now seems to be arguing for the indefinite retention of DNA, which has been found to be not acceptable and not proportionate. He says in some way that there is no evidence, but I remind him of the comment made in the other place by Lord Bach, who highlighted very clearly the report that Professor Fraser undertook in relation to the Scottish system in which he said that he did not uncover any evidence to suggest that the Scottish approach to retention had caused any detriment to the detection of serious crime in Scotland.

[Margot James (Stourbridge) (Con)]

13. What plans she has for the future regulation of CCTV cameras.

[Ian Lucas (Wrexham) (Lab)]

17. What proposals she has for regulation of the use of CCTV cameras by police services and local authorities.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

In our coalition programme for government, as part of our work on safeguarding civil liberties we have stated that we will further regulate CCTV. We will introduce detailed proposals in due course.

[Margot James]

I thank my hon. Friend for his answer. Although there has been criticism that some CCTV has been used randomly and not always effectively, is he aware of the Safer Leeds project, in which CCTV has played an important role in the apprehension and prosecution of offenders? Can he give an assurance that future regulation will not deter the proper use of CCTV that my constituents in Stourbridge feel is essential in the battle against crime?

[James Brokenshire]

As the Prime Minister made clear in the House on 9 June, we support CCTV cameras. When used properly, they can be a significant asset in the prevention and detection of crime, but any such use involves a need to ensure that civil liberties are properly protected. The use of CCTV has increased in the absence of a specific regulatory framework. For reasons of proportionality and retaining public confidence, it is important that there is appropriate regulation, and it is interesting to note that the previous Administration recognised that when they appointed the interim CCTV regulator.

[Ian Lucas]

In the past 13 years, some 21,000 individuals have been arrested in Wrexham as a result of the operation of CCTV cameras. Wrexham’s CCTV system is widely appreciated. Will the hon. Gentleman confirm whether he expects a reduction in the number of CCTV cameras as a result of the regulation that he is describing, and how will that regulation be consulted on?

[James Brokenshire]

On the latter point, we will announce further details on how we intend to take CCTV forward and on how engagement will take place. As I have said, we recognise the importance of CCTV in the fight against crime. As for moving forward, the installation and use of CCTV systems is very much a matter for local decisions, so the regulation will certainly provide a framework to assist local decision making about the CCTV systems that should be put in place to protect local communities.

[Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con)]

Before my hon. Friend jumps on the liberty bandwagon far too much, may I urge some caution? CCTV cameras do not prevent anyone from going about their lawful daily business freely. Will he acknowledge that the people who were responsible for the tube bombings on 7/7 were identified only through the use of CCTV, as was the person recently arrested in Bradford for the murders of three prostitutes?

[James Brokenshire]

I thank my hon. Friend for underlining CCTV’s important role in policing and protecting our communities. Perhaps more focus could be given to its use in prosecutions and as a forensic tool. However, the use of CCTV has developed in the absence of a specific regulatory framework. We believe, for reasons of proportionality, that regulation should be taken forward, so we shall proceed with that in due course.

[Meg Hillier (Hackney South and Shoreditch) (Lab/Co-op)]

I am interested to hear the Minister talk about CCTV in such a way, as it seems that there is already a slight shift in the coalition Government’s position. We know that CCTV has given people throughout the country their neighbourhoods back and the freedom to go about their daily lives. His Government talk about reducing red tape and regulation for the police, yet they plan to regulate CCTV and perhaps create more hoops for the police, who see it as a valuable tool, so will he answer a simple question once and for all: will the plans to regulate CCTV lead to fewer CCTV cameras? He is fudging.

[James Brokenshire]

It is interesting that the hon. Lady suggests that regulation is not required, because her Government established the interim CCTV regulator, thereby accepting that regulation is required and that the matter needs to be examined carefully. It is all very well for her to talk as if this issue has suddenly arisen, but she and her Government recognised the situation when they were in government. We will ensure that proportionate and relevant regulation is brought forward that will enable CCTV systems to be established by local communities in an appropriate way—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I would be grateful if we could make some progress.

--- Later in debate ---

[Angie Bray (Ealing Central and Acton) (Con)]

One of my constituents, who also happens to be my parliamentary researcher, was seriously hurt in an unprovoked attack after he had been out for dinner with a friend in Croydon last week. Does the Secretary of State agree that late licensing is partly responsible for the increase in violent assaults at night? Will she update the House on how plans are progressing to sort out late licensing?

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

My hon. Friend provides a powerful example of the impact of violent crime and alcohol, and certainly 47% of violent assaults are believed to be carried out by individuals under the influence of alcohol. That is why we will bring forward proposals to rebalance the Licensing Act 2003 in favour of local communities, and in particular introduce a proposal for a late-night levy to deal with the costs that are attributed to dealing with licensing problems in certain areas.

[Ian Austin (Dudley North) (Lab)]

My constituency has been targeted by the English Defence League for a series of demonstrations. Recent events have seen violence and disorder on the streets, police diverted to deal with that and property and constituents attacked. On one occasion the entire town centre was boarded up, costing businesses thousands. Could I bring a delegation of people from Dudley to meet the Home Secretary in order to discuss how we might prevent those problems in future?

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Wayne David (Caerphilly) (Lab)]

What progress is being made on the implementation of the European Union’s drugs strategy?

[James Brokenshire]

We are considering the whole issue of the drugs strategy in the context of legal highs and other emerging psychoactive substances, as well as in the context of the prevalence of cocaine use, which remains very significant. That is why the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs is examining the issue and will be providing further advice to Government in that regard.

English Language Schools

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Thursday 24th June 2010 Commons Chamber

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

Order. Has the Minister been notified that the hon. Member for Grantham and Stamford (Nick Boles) or any other Member wishes to speak?

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

Two other hon. Members apart from my hon. Friend the Member for Grantham and Stamford (Nick Boles) have spoken to me. I have indicated that, with your consent, Mr Deputy Speaker, I would be happy for them to speak in the time allowed, if the hon. Member for Bournemouth West (Conor Burns) is also content with that.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

Let me say what a pleasure it is to take part in this debate and to have listened to the excellent contribution from my hon. Friend the Member for Bournemouth West (Conor Burns). Although his maiden speech might have been unconventional in terms of procedure in this House, it was impressive in style, considered in content and impassioned in delivery. He has shown very clearly by his contribution to the debate what an excellent Member of Parliament he will be for his constituents in Bournemouth West. I wish him all success in the House. I have no doubt at all about the contributions that he will make in the months and years ahead.

I also thank my hon. Friend the Member for Grantham and Stamford (Nick Boles) for his contribution. He highlighted a particular case, and although it is difficult to draw conclusions from one case alone, we certainly heard what he had to say and I am sure that, if he provides any further details either to me or to my hon. Friend the Minister for Immigration, we will look into those matters. I also thank my hon. Friend the Member for Poole (Mr Syms) and the hon. Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert) for their contributions. We recognise the importance of language schools and I hope to address some of the points that they raised.

I should also mention that, in a sense, this is my maiden speech as the hon. Member for Old Bexley and Sidcup. It is rather unconventional to be speaking from the Dispatch Box in that context, but I am proud to represent Old Bexley and Sidcup and I will do my utmost to fulfil the responsibilities that my constituents have placed on me. Although I may not always be able to speak in this Chamber on the full range of topics on their behalf, I will certainly do my utmost to fulfil my duties and to ensure that any matters of concern to them are properly addressed and dealt with.

Let me say at the outset that, as my hon. Friend the Member for Bournemouth West is aware, the English language schools in his constituency—and in the constituencies of my other hon. Friends in their places this evening—are involved in challenging by judicial review some of the changes identified tonight, particularly the minimum level of language study permitted under tier 4. That case is ongoing and is due to be heard next week, so I hope that my hon. Friend and others will appreciate that I may be somewhat limited in my responses on certain points raised this evening.

The Government are committed to attracting the brightest and the best to the UK, which is why we are determined to encourage legitimate students to come here for study. The UK is the second most popular destination for international students—second only to the United States. We must therefore ensure that our immigration system does not inhibit the education sector, which we recognise has to compete in an increasingly competitive global market.

At the same time, we need to ensure that our overall immigration system works to prevent abuse, so the Government are now taking the necessary steps to set a new direction in immigration policy, built on the coalition’s core values of freedom, fairness and responsibility. We face a number of challenges, however, in delivering a safe and strong border, which are made even more pressing by difficult economic times. Immigration must be properly controlled, so that people can have confidence in the system. Our intention to introduce new measures to minimise abuse of the immigration system, including abuse of the student routes, is a priority that was outlined in the coalition’s programme for government.

I do not ignore the fact that the English language industry contributes millions of pounds to the UK’s economy every year. As my hon. Friend rightly pointed out, English language schools in the UK provide jobs for their staff, while students spend money on fees and books, and generate additional income for their host families. The English language is a global language, and we are, of course, keen to promote the UK as the home of English. We are also acutely aware of the part played by English language schools in preparing overseas students for further and higher education in the UK.

However, in the past there has been significant abuse of the student route, with the previous Government ignoring repeated warnings of the scale of abuse by bogus students and bogus colleges for a number of years. Bogus students were often found applying with forged documentation, not taking up their course of study or dropping out part way through, and working too many hours. The UK Border Agency dealt with bogus colleges that would engage in simple fraud, such as not delivering courses as advertised, if at all, and collaborating with bogus students to facilitate their entry to the UK—in some cases, falsifying education certificates to allow bogus students to prolong their stay in the UK.

Since the launch of the register of education and training providers by the former Department for Innovation, Universities and Skills in January 2005, more than 300 bogus colleges have needed to be removed from that register. The introduction of tier 4, the student route of the points-based system, along with sponsor licensing, has gone some way to addressing the problem of bogus colleges. Under the new system, students are tied to their sponsoring institution and must seek our permission to change institution. We do not think that that is inappropriate, as migrants should keep in contact with us and we need to know if they are no longer studying, as they will be in breach of their student conditions.

Although colleges might find it frustrating that the UK Border Agency does not routinely inform them when a student has entered the UK—this point was raised directly—it is simply not practical when we consider the millions of arrivals at our ports and airports each year. Institutions will know when their sponsorship has been used in a visa application and they will know when their student is expected to arrive. If a student does not do so, it is this exception that must be reported to the UK Border Agency and we will then check whether the student is in the UK and in breach of his or her conditions.

The difficulty remains, however, in identifying those bogus students who have no intention of studying in the UK, but simply seek a route of entry. Such so-called students have no qualms about deceiving bona fide education providers to obtain an offer of a place on a course that will go some way to securing their entry to the UK. Such economic migrants tend to target courses that have little in the way of pre-entry requirements, and English language courses have proven to be particularly susceptible to abuse by non-bona fide students. Between April and November 2009, UK Border Agency data show that almost a third of English language schools licensed under tier 4 voluntarily notified UKBA of more than 1,100 students who had failed to enrol or who had dropped out of their course of study.

The tier 4 student visa can be very attractive to economic migrants because of the generous entitlements that such visas rightly provide to those who wish to study here. The ability to work part-time during term time and full-time during vacations, and to bring family members to the UK, are two important privileges that help us to compete with other countries and attract the brightest and the best to study here. However, the Government are committed to ensuring that such privileges are not abused. We must therefore be sure that there are sufficient safeguards in place to ensure that the tier 4 requirements are not so abused.

Data collected since the launch of tier 4 showed a surge in the number of applications made under the route, which was certainly a significant change. That increase, coupled with students who had secured entry under tier 4 but failed to enrol on their courses or ceased their studies early, painted a worrying picture. For that reason, changes were introduced from March. As hon. Members will have heard, the minimum level of language study permitted under tier 4 is level B2 of the common European framework of reference for languages. That means that students must be at least proficient to level B1 before they can use tier 4 and enjoy the entitlements that the route confers. Students whose English language ability is not at that level are still permitted to come to the UK to develop it, using the student visitor route, which allows a person to come to the UK for up to six months.

Without wishing to pre-empt the outcome of next week’s judicial review hearing, the Minister for Immigration intends to undertake a thorough evaluation of the student system in the coming weeks and months, to ensure that the measures currently in place strike the right balance between providing a user-friendly route for bona fide students and education providers and keeping out those who would seek to abuse the student system. Let me be clear: the Government want to encourage genuine students who seek to benefit from our world-class education system and to take away knowledge, skills and a sense of our culture, which they can then put to good use in their home countries.

Question put and agreed to.

Cumbrian Shootings

James Brokenshire Excerpts

Wednesday 23rd June 2010 Westminster Hall

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (James Brokenshire)]

At around this time three weeks ago, we were all feeling a real sense of shock as the full horror of events in Cumbria became apparent. The last funerals took place on Friday, and I join other hon. Members this afternoon in expressing condolences to the families and friends of all those who were killed or injured. Our thoughts are also with all those who were caught up in some other way in the tragic events. We should remember in particular the police and emergency services, who had to deal with the immediate consequences of the shootings, and who did so with professionalism.

I also want to join the many others who have praised the resilience of the people of Cumbria, who, with true community spirit, have pulled together in their efforts to come to terms with this and other recent tragedies. They are surely an example to all of us.

I thank the hon. Member for Copeland (Mr Reed) for providing this opportunity to debate the lessons that might be learned from the tragic shootings in his constituency on 2 June, and particularly for the sensitive, considered, measured and moving way in which he opened the debate. I would like to add my tribute to those paid by many others, both this afternoon and in recent weeks, for the way in which he dealt with the immediate aftermath of that shocking tragedy, and the way in which he has conducted himself since then.

I fully recognise the depth and range of feeling on the matter and the need for a broad debate. We have started that process today. A range of issues were touched on and, as the hon. Gentleman rightly said, many fall outside my specific ministerial responsibility, but I know that my ministerial colleagues outside this Chamber will read the debate and reflect on the comments that he and others have made this afternoon, particularly about West Cumberland hospital and its funding. I will draw them to the attention of my colleagues in the Department of Health.

An issue that came through strongly is the sense of community among the people of Cumbria. It was made clear in many speeches, including the measured contribution from the hon. Member for Barrow and Furness (John Woodcock), who may not have been in the House long, but has shown clearly how he seeks to represent his constituents. My hon. Friend the Member for Westmorland and Lonsdale (Tim Farron) also referred to the strength of the community and emphasised its sense of purpose. The hon. Member for Copeland talked strongly about solemnity, dignity and purpose, and his comments will resonate clearly.

I pay tribute to the maiden speech by my hon. Friend the Member for Penrith and The Border (Rory Stewart). It was considered and eloquent, but also passionate. I got a sense of my hon. Friend’s constituency and of his priorities as a Member of this House, and that is what new Members of Parliament seek to give in their maiden speeches. He made his extremely well, and I well understand why he chose this debate in which to make his first contribution to the House. In doing so, and in his actions as an MP, he demonstrated why he will be a fine champion for his constituents and those whom he serves. The way he conducted himself during his maiden speech demonstrated the values that he spoke about.

I have been particularly struck by the perception of many people that it is difficult to have in place proportionate controls to deal with those rare occasions when, for no apparent reason, someone suddenly embarks on a series of horrific killings. There has been ready recognition, both this afternoon and earlier, that a knee-jerk response is unlikely to provide a lasting solution, or the one that people seek, and that has been reflected in the contributions this afternoon.

Alongside that, however, there is a strong wish to ensure that we do all we can to learn lessons about both how we respond to future incidents and what we might reasonably do to prevent them, which is what we all fervently wish to do. That approach has been characterised today, and the debate has raised much for us to reflect on. Above all, we should listen carefully to what the local communities are saying. The Minister of State, Ministry of Justice, my right hon. Member for Arundel and South Downs (Nick Herbert), who has responsibility for policing and criminal justice, will return to Cumbria in the near future to talk to local groups about what happened, and to hear more about any concerns that persist.

Cumbria police are busy conducting a huge, complex investigation involving 30 crime scenes, 12 deceased victims, one offender and 11 seriously injured victims. Each incident requires a major investigation of its own—Cumbria is running more than 20 at same time. In the initial phase of the investigation, 100 detectives were working on the case and they searched 225 sq km of the country from land and air. Witnesses are still coming forward and the investigation will take many months to complete. I recognise the desire for answers and the points made by the right hon. Member for Leicester East (Keith Vaz), who I understand was not able to stay for the wind-ups—I pass my congratulations to him on being elected Chair of the Select Committee on Home Affairs—but it is important that the investigation takes its proper course. The Association of Chief Police Officers peer reviews—I will talk more about them in due course—are anticipated to report by this autumn.

We all recognise what a huge amount of work the investigation is for Cumbria police, but I have spoken to chief constable Craig Mackey and he has assured me that the force has the necessary resources and expertise to cope with the task. However, if it becomes necessary, the Government will support any bid from Cumbria police for a special grant to help meet exceptional costs on the force budget. Cumbria police have already received some specialist support from neighbouring forces, including police helicopters and scenes of crime officers. I would like to take this opportunity to formally thank Dumfries and Galloway, Lancashire and the civil nuclear constabulary for all the help that they have provided so far—a point made by the hon. Member for Workington (Tony Cunningham). Local forces stand ready to help should further assistance be required as the investigation progresses.

[Tony Cunningham]

May I ask for an assurance that there will be proper collaboration between the two relevant Departments? Obviously the police are the responsibility of the Home Office, but the civil nuclear constabulary is the responsibility of the Department of Energy and Climate Change. I would like to make sure that the connection is there and that, when the inquiry takes place, there will be collaboration.

[James Brokenshire]

Certainly there is a wider point of discussion on policing and cross-border assistance, and the hon. Gentleman has made an important point about the need for any consideration of the issues to take into account other police forces. He has rightly highlighted the case of the civil nuclear constabulary, and other forces, such as the British transport police, sit within the Department for Transport. When considering policing issues, we need to factor in services that might sit within other Departments, too. He makes his point very effectively.

The hon. Member for Copeland has made a significant contribution to the learning process by securing and leading the debate today. There are, as we know, other reviews in hand that will add to our knowledge. I refer to the peer reviews that ACPO has set up at the request of the chief constable of Cumbria, Craig Mackey. Those reviews will cover firearms licensing procedures, the tactical and strategic police firearms response, and any aspect of the incident that may require further national or local guidance.

The ACPO lead on firearms licensing, Assistant Chief Constable Adrian Whiting, will review the file and the procedures adopted in relation to the award of a firearms licence and shotgun certificate to Mr Bird. He will also consider whether there are any significant gaps or risks in the licensing process. The question of the armed police response and the resources that were available for deployment to the scene will be addressed by the ACPO lead on the police use of firearms, Assistant Chief Constable Simon Chesterman.

Following the conclusion of the first two reviews, there will be an examination of firearms tactics and the ACPO manual to see whether any accumulated learning should lead to changes. I should confirm at this point that the firearms response review will cover the issues previously raised by the shadow Home Secretary about the possible need to absorb lessons from counter-terrorism policing. In picking up the lessons from Stockwell, the police service has already put in place systems to ensure that any tactics developed to deal with counter-terrorism are not developed in isolation, but are picked up by authorised firearms officers across the country. The peer reviews are being led by senior police officers who take the professional lead in their areas of expertise and who are therefore uniquely placed to identify the issues. We expect the findings of both reviews to be published in the autumn.

On firearms licensing, the shootings in Cumbria bring home all too starkly just how dangerous firearms can be in the wrong hands, and it is inevitable that questions will be asked about the UK’s firearms licensing laws. It is widely acknowledged that we already have some of tightest legislative controls in the world when it comes to civilian access to, and possession and use of, firearms. Any firearms held must be accompanied by a certificate that is issued following extensive checks by local police, who must satisfy themselves that an applicant is fit to be entrusted with a firearm and will not present a danger to public safety. Local police must be satisfied that an applicant has a legitimate reason for wanting a firearm—for example, target shooting or deerstalking. The police will visit applicants at home to interview them about their application and to check security. They can seek a medical report from the applicant’s GP if they have concerns about any medical condition.

On that point, I would like to come on to an issue raised by my hon. Friend the Member for Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire (Simon Hart). Applicants for firearms certificates must give details of their GP, from whom the police can seek a medical report. That is not limited by time, and the police can approach the GP at any time during the life of a certificate. It is also open to a GP to approach the police at any time to pass on information or possible concerns. However, ACPO is working with medical associations to ensure that any medical concerns are not missed. It is discussing the possibility of placing a marker on NHS patient records, so that a GP will know whether a patient has access to firearms and can notify the police of any concerns about the suitability of that. We are following this process closely and we will feed the outcomes into subsequent work on gun controls as required.

It is only right that we should reflect on whether more might be done in that context to ensure public safety. In doing so, we have to look carefully at the balance between the maintenance of public safety and the legitimate expectations of the vast majority of firearm owners who use their guns safely and responsibly, and who totally condemn those who misuse them. The control of firearms is a complex area that requires careful consideration, a point rightly made by the hon. Member for Tynemouth (Mr Campbell). I thank him for his kind comments and assure him that we will consider all the issues extremely carefully. As he pointed out, we plan to hold a full debate on the issue of firearms before the summer recess, which will provide an opportunity to air in greater depth some of the issues raised today about existing controls.

As I said at the outset, this is the start of a process, and the debate that I just mentioned will provide an opportunity for people who wish to make more detailed comments about firearms legislation to do so. Even then, we should not draw conclusions precipitately. It is important to wait until we have the results of the police investigation and the peer reviews before we decide whether we need to take specific further action, either by issuing further guidance, introducing new procedures or, potentially, changing the law. I reassure the hon. Member for Barrow and Furness that we go into this process with an open mind.

We will also consider at that stage whether there is need for any further inquiry. The Government are committed to supporting the affected communities in this terrible situation, and we want to find out from them how we can best help them. The Department for Communities and Local Government has already asked its emergencies management team, which offers support to local authorities that have suffered disasters and emergencies, to contact the local authorities involved to see what support they require and what assistance they may need. The local authorities were confident that they had the resources available to cope, and that no further assistance was required.

I understand that the Government office for the north-west has contacted Cumbria county council and Copeland district council to offer assistance. Again, no further assistance has been requested at this point in time. We are confident that the local authorities will make immediate contact with the Government office for the north-west should any further assistance be required at a later date. The Government office stands ready to broker mutual aid support with the voluntary sector, should that be necessary.

Copeland and Cumbria councils are working to understand the needs of the families and communities affected, and have put in place arrangements to provide counselling and personal support. In addition, my hon. Friend the Member for Ruislip, Northwood and Pinner (Mr Hurd), the Minister with responsibility for Civil Society, will be visiting Cumbria tomorrow to meet the local authorities and the council for voluntary service to see what extra support or assistance they need.

In conclusion, this is the start of considering the issues that we have debated this afternoon. We have heard much about the spirit of the people of Cumbria and how they have been supporting each other. Such community spirit is truly priceless. For our part, we shall continue to liaise with the Cumbria constabulary to follow up any areas that require further or wider consultation. The learning from the reviews, which is expected in the autumn, will be shared with the public, the wider police service and, of course, the House.