Oral Answers to Questions

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Thursday 2nd March 2023 Commons Chamber

[Mr Harper]

The good news for the hon. Gentleman is that we have made progress on that, and we are hoping to set out what will happen on that publicly in the very near future. He does not have too long to wait and I hope he will have news that he will welcome.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

Network Rail has said that 278 miles of track must be electrified every year to reach net zero. Last year, the Government added only 1.4 miles of newly electrified track, including Bath, and we are still waiting for electrification. To meet our net zero targets, will the Secretary of State commit to electrifying all new railway lines?

[Mr Harper]

The hon. Lady will know that we have electrified 1,200 miles of the rail network in Great Britain since 2010, and that work continues. We clearly think that electrifying the rail network is important for our net zero commitments, and we will continue to make progress. I hope she will welcome that.

Electric Vehicles: Infrastructure

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd February 2023 Westminster Hall

[Steve Brine]

I agree with that point. I would expect the hon. Member for Luton South (Rachel Hopkins) to raise van production for obvious reasons. The mandate is a fine idea, but we need the response to the consultation on the mandate. I suspect the companies that the hon. Lady talks to in her constituency want to know the rules of the game before they can work with those rules. I am sure she is looking forward to that point being raised.

The transition to electric vehicles brings into question fuel and excise duty. It is well known that the Treasury is set to lose a lot of money and a new source of revenue will be required. Fuel duty revenues pre-pandemic were about £28 billion per year, and vehicle excise revenues were approximately £6 billion. I cannot believe this has not been discussed in the hallowed halls of the Treasury, but does that mean that road pricing is a serious possibility? There has been no mention of that as a solution from the Government. Does the Minister concur?

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

It is interesting to hear the hon. Member talk about road pricing. Does he actually support something like “pay as you drive”, in order to charge people for the miles that they drive rather than anything else?

[Steve Brine]

No, and before the Liberal Democrats try to produce another attack leaflet to say that is what I was saying, the hon. Lady can strike that from the record. That is certainly not what I was saying, but I am asking the Minister whether the Government are considering it. Surely the Treasury are considering that loss of revenue. From his previous role as Chair of the Transport Committee, the Minister will know that that was laid down as a challenge to the Government. I know that the Committee is still waiting for a response to that. I am rather cheekily asking the Minister whether he has yet to respond to himself. Could he do so today?

I will raise some more concerns about the availability of electric vehicles. Certainly in my constituency, consumers are embracing the change to electric vehicles as people are understandably more and more concerned about the environment. However, we have already heard about the supply available to buyers. The current average waiting time for an EV is seven months, according to the Library. Companies such as Volkswagen have at least a 10-month wait from the time the car is bought to its delivery. I would suggest that that is a barrier to purchase. It is concerning, because forcing people to make the change to EVs will once again increase the waiting times as demand increases. People cannot be expected to bear a cost that is due to factors out of their control.

There is a current fall in demand for EVs because of the dip in the economy and the spike in inflation. I asked a previous Minister in the Department about this. What conversations are the Government having with industry to try to help them meet demand? I realise that the pandemic has hugely got in the way of that, but what conversations are the Government having with industry to try to stimulate demand?

Tesla has recently smashed the cost of EVs by a reported £7,000. There has been an expansion of EVs, but only 24 models are priced under £32,000 due to the cost of the battery technology. Even the UK boss at Kia, Paul Philpott, has said that car makers are finding it “economically difficult” to bring affordable smaller vehicles to market due to the high cost of batteries, despite the ban on the sale of all new petrol and diesel cars looming in 2035.

I will gently remind the Minister about the up-front cost and a serious lack of a second-hand market for electric vehicles. That is a whole other subject, with only 3% of used car transactions involving EVs in 2021. I hope that that market will start to emerge as we make the transition, so that many lower-income families will not be priced out of even having a conversation about switching to an EV. It is hugely unfair that they want to do the right thing, but they know they cannot.

In closing, I support the move to electric vehicles, and I know that my constituents do. I see more and more EVs on the streets of my constituency. The phasing-out of all new petrol and diesel cars by 2035 has my support, but it is clear that the infrastructure is far from fully developed, with many complaining about teething problems. It is obvious that to meet the target, and seriously increase the rate at which the infrastructure is being implemented, especially the distribution of charging points, we need to see a step change to meet the current ambition.

--- Later in debate ---

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

Owning a car is a lifeline for many people. We need to encourage people to use their cars less and public transport more, but I am not blind to the need for cars. Car journeys are here to stay, but they need to become net zero. The transition from petrol and diesel to electric vehicles is at the heart of this effort, and it is an important step towards decarbonising the transport system and getting to net zero.

The Government’s pledge to end the sale of all petrol and diesel cars by 2030, and hybrids by 2035, has acted as a powerful signal to the car industry and the markets, but the failure to prepare the ground for the transition to EV charging infrastructure is now threatening that target and, indeed, our net zero targets. Like the hon. Member for Winchester (Steve Brine), I am absolutely in favour of the transition to EVs, but we need to prepare the ground. We cannot say, “The target cannot be achieved, so let’s just throw it out altogether.”

Until now, drivers have charged at home around three quarters of the time. However, as we shift from early adopters to the mass market, policy needs to support people who do not have the space for their own charge points. We have already heard about the regional disparities: there are many more charging points in London compared with the rest of the country, and yet two thirds of the new infrastructure is proposed for London. The lack of EV chargers is a concern for more than half of motorists. Volkswagen has noticed that, apart from the cost, the key concern for buyers today remains charging anxiety.

The lack of charging infrastructure is leading people towards do-it-yourself charging, and I want to throw that in. Electrical Safety First has found that 90% of EV owners have used domestic multi-socket extension leads and three quarters have daisy-chained extension leads. That is highly dangerous, because daisy-chaining, whereby multiple extension leads are used together, can increase the risk of socket overload and electric shock, so we are putting people at risk. Don’t do it, guys! It is really dangerous, and we need to make sure that this is not happening.

In last year’s EV infrastructure strategy, the Government made no firm commitment to ensure that EV infrastructure roll-out is in line with EV market uptake. The main problem is grid capacity. The Liberal Democrat council in Bath has worked hard to build more charging infrastructure, but it is constrained by the weak grid in the region. National Grid wants to upgrade the grid in the west of England, but Ofgem has not accepted the funding proposals. The Government need to encourage Ofgem to be part of the solution and not the problem. We need a reform of Ofgem’s remit to allow for pre-emptive investment in grid infrastructure.

A publicly funded network needs to prioritise fairly priced and equitable access. If we simply prioritise capacity over the number of locations and usefulness, we risk locking lower-income drivers, who rely on public chargers, into the most expensive rapid charging options. The Government must stop penalising people who are not able to charge their EVs at home. These people currently have to pay 20% VAT to charge their vehicles at a public charge point, compared with the 5% VAT for people charging at home. The Government must end this unjustifiable discrepancy and equalise the VAT rate at 5% for all electric vehicle charging.

Transport is responsible for nearly a third of the UK’s carbon emissions, with more than half of emissions from domestic transport coming from private cars and taxis. The quicker we get people using EVs, the closer we get to meeting our net zero targets. The benefits of owning an electric vehicle must outweigh the costs. From infrastructure to incentives, the Government need to meet words with actions and drive the electric vehicle revolution forward.

[Mr Peter Bone (in the Chair)]

I am very grateful to Members; you have been very good. I will now call Gavin Newlands, the SNP spokesman, who will also be very good.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Huw Merriman)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Bone. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Winchester (Steve Brine) for securing this important debate, and I thank every participant for their words. It may not be possible to answer all their questions, but I hope we can cover the bulk of them.

The Government are committed to decarbonising transport and to phasing out the sale of new petrol and diesel cars and vans by 2030, becoming the first G7 country to do so. The benefits of zero-emission motoring are there to be won: improved air quality in our towns and cities, economic growth through our automotive industry, and ultimately cheaper and cleaner driving for all. Getting to that point will require Government and industry to furnish this country with an accessible, affordable and secure charging infrastructure network.

Perhaps I can give you some reasons to be cheerful, Mr Bone; I fear the hon. Member for Slough (Mr Dhesi) also needs cheering up. Industry data shows that in December 2022, 32.9% of new cars sold were fully electric. That was the best ever month for new battery electric car registrations, with more sales than in all of 2019 combined. The UK had the second highest battery electric car sales in Europe in 2022, with Germany being first and France third. A survey by Zap-Map found that only 1% of EV drivers want to switch back to a petrol or diesel vehicle. One in five public charge points in the UK are rapid or ultra-rapid, and under our plans, new homes and non-residential premises undergoing renovation will have to install charging infrastructure at the point of construction. That should lead to 145,000 further charge points across England every year. Those are some reasons to be cheerful.

Last March, we published our strategy and set out our plans to accelerate the roll-out of the network. To answer one of the questions posed by my hon. Friend the Member for Winchester, the Government expect at least 300,000 public charge points to be installed across the UK by 2030. We do not regard that with the same cynicism as my good friend from the SNP, the hon. Member for Paisley and Renfrewshire North (Gavin Newlands). A recent industry report by New AutoMotive, “On the Road to 2030”, found that the charge point roll-out is

“progressing at an adequate pace, growing by a third every 12 months, and the UK is on track”

to meet the expected 300,000 public chargers by the end of 2030. So do not just take my word for it.

That will all be achieved thanks to billions of pounds of investment by industry. There are more than 37,000 open access public chargers already on UK roads, hundreds of thousands of charge points in homes and workplaces, and more than 600,000 new chargers added to our road network each month on average. In fact, public charging devices have more than tripled in the last four years. We are on track to meet expectations.

On electric vehicle uptake, Government grants have supported drivers to buy plug-in vehicles for over a decade, with more than £1.4 billion already having been invested in the early market. Colleagues at the Treasury are committed to ensuring that motoring tax revenues keep pace with the changes brought about by the switch to electric vehicles, while keeping the transition affordable to consumers.

I will touch on local charging infrastructure, which has been raised. This debate is a timely one. Lack of access to off-street parking should not be a barrier to owning a plug-in electric vehicle. We are working with local authorities to ensure local provision meets local needs. Just yesterday, as my hon. Friend the Member for Winchester mentioned, we announced that drivers across the UK will benefit from a further £56 million of public and industry funding to support the roll-out of electric vehicle charge points across the country.

[Wera Hobhouse]

Will the Minister give way?

Oral Answers to Questions

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Thursday 24th November 2022 Commons Chamber

[Mr Harper]

I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for her question and for her work when she was Home Secretary to strengthen the law to enable us to deal with those who cause disruption on our transport network. I would be delighted to meet her and the leader of Essex County Council to talk about those important road projects.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

Research from the Campaign for Better Transport suggests that the Government are so far behind on their electrification plans that rolling stock leasing companies are being forced to destroy electric units that they cannot use. At the same time, the Government continue to introduce new diesel trains—more not zero than net zero. Will the Government ensure that they order no more diesel trains and get on with electrification?

[Huw Merriman]

The Government are committed to phasing out all diesel trains by 2040. That remains our aim and our ambition. There is electrification going on at the moment along the west midlands line, and we are certainly committed to ensuring that we can roll out more electrification, and indeed use hydrogen and battery power where appropriate, in the years to come.

Night Flights: Impact on Communities

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Tuesday 8th November 2022 Commons Chamber

[Ruth Cadbury (Brentford and Isleworth) (Lab)]

I thank my neighbour, the hon. Member for Richmond Park, for securing this debate. The overflying flights into Heathrow go over her constituency before mine. Does she not agree that we need to be concerned not just about Heathrow expansion meaning a third runway, but the possibility that the airport will try to get more flights on the existing two runways in breach of the 480,000 cap? It could of course do that if it did away with alternation, which provides respite to our residents, and had more flights during the night-time period.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

On that point, will my hon. Friend give way?

[Sarah Olney]

Yes.

[Sarah Olney]

The hon. Member for Brentford and Isleworth (Ruth Cadbury) makes an excellent point, and she and I share views on this issue.

[Wera Hobhouse]

I apologise to my hon. Friend.

Many of my Bath constituents have expressed concerns about the increasing number of flights taking off from Bristol airport late at night. Does she not also agree that the climate emergency compels us to look at an overall reduction in flights, particularly internal short flights where rail is available as an alternative?

[Sarah Olney]

I thank my hon. Friend for that comment. She is precisely right. Our concern relates not only to night flights, but very much to the fact that Heathrow expansion would lead to increased noise levels and around 6 million additional tonnes of carbon being pumped into the atmosphere each year. The UK cannot properly tackle the climate crisis if we continue to expand our airports, especially when we should be promoting greener transport.

Avanti West Coast

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Wednesday 7th September 2022 Commons Chamber

[Trudy Harrison]

Again, it is common sense. That is already happening, which is why I am not calling for it. It needs to continue, and a solution needs to be found to provide an effective rail service—that is absolute common sense.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

Is it not absurd that the Government are pouring billions of pounds into companies owned by other countries’ Governments? Whatever the ownership of the companies, they are failing to deliver services but have been awarded multi-million-pound contracts by the Government. Avanti is supposed to run HS2. Should that really happen in the light of the catastrophic delivery failures, and will the Government look at a new operator for HS2?

[Trudy Harrison]

I repeat that all options are on the table. The decisions on HS2 are a bit further away. As HS2 Minister, I can say that we are having those conversations. I am certainly speaking with Avanti and visiting all phases of HS2, both in development and in construction. Those conversations are live.

Rail Strikes

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Wednesday 15th June 2022 Commons Chamber

[Grant Shapps]

My rail commuting friend makes an excellent point. Every person in this country will want to know and understand how MPs have voted in this place tonight. It matters to them and their families, and it matters for their jobs.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

Is it not the reality that the person who most wants this strike to go ahead is the Prime Minister?

Oral Answers to Questions

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Thursday 19th May 2022 Commons Chamber

[Andrew Stephenson]

Decisions on road charging are of course for the Mayor of London alone to take, but I agree with my hon. Friend that the Mayor must not punish people who need to use their cars, especially at a time when people are struggling with the cost of living.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

9. What steps his Department is taking to increase bus services.

[The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Andrew Stephenson)]

The national bus strategy, published in March last year, sets out the Government’s vision for delivering better bus services for passengers across England. In April, we announced over £1 billion of new funding for the bus service improvement plans, as part of a £3 billion investment in buses during this Parliament.

[Wera Hobhouse]

Well, we are back to buses. My local bus company is really struggling. Numbers 1, 2, 3, 3A, 19, 22, 39, U1, U2, U5 and D2 have all been cut, at a time when we must offer people proper alternatives to car travel. When can my constituents expect bus services to get back to at least pre-pandemic levels?

[Andrew Stephenson]

We have provided huge support for bus services across the country during the pandemic. I would like to remind the hon. Lady that since the Conservatives came to power in 2010 annual support for buses has been 15% higher in real terms than it was under Labour, and that bus fares rose far faster under the last Labour Government. This Government support buses and bus users and we will continue to invest in bus services across the country.

International Women’s Day

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Thursday 10th March 2022 Commons Chamber

[Claire Coutinho (East Surrey) (Con)]

I congratulate my right hon. Friend the Member for Basingstoke (Mrs Miller) on initiating this important debate. As ever, it is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Canterbury (Rosie Duffield) and the many hon. Members who have spoken so movingly about the women in Ukraine and women facing the most severe violence in this country.

In the spirit of this year’s theme “Break the Bias”, I want to focus my remarks on girls and women in science, maths and tech careers. I want to start by telling two stories. Born in 1815, Ada Lovelace was the child of poet Lord Byron and mathematician Lady Byron, and had a passion for mathematics from an early age. Despite childhood illness, Ada let nothing hold her back. Aged 12, she decided she wanted to fly. She examined the anatomy of birds and explored the best materials to create herself a set of wings. As a teenager—at just 18—she was working with mathematician Charles Babbage on one of the very first computers, almost 200 years ago. Despite later marrying and becoming a countess, Ada did not give up her passion for a life of leisure, and her work on the analytical engine means that she is widely recognised as one of the world’s first computer programmers.

Half a century after Ada was born, Agnes Pockels was born in Germany. She could not study at university like her brother because women were not allowed to at the time, and she had sick parents at home and therefore a lot of caring responsibilities. Stuck at home carrying out all the household chores, which I am sure we will all recognise, Agnes noticed soap building on the surface of her washing water. Aged 18, she began conducting experiments at home to understand more, and although she was locked out of accessing scientific literature, this did not stop Agnes. In 1891 she published her first scientific paper “Surface Tension” and she is now recognised as a pioneer in the field of surface science.

If we ask ourselves why we are here today, it is because women have historically been disenfranchised, disempowered and devoiced.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

The hon. Lady is bringing to our attention a very interesting woman who made a lot of scientific progress. Does she know about Caroline Herschel? Together with her brother, she was an astronomer. She did more work than him, but her work was not recognised. Does she agree that we need to sing the praises of women from the past as much as possible?

[Claire Coutinho]

I agree. There are so many we could mention today—including Rosalind Franklin—whose work was not properly recognised at the time and whom we should recognise now.

Women have been shut out of the room where decisions are made and locked out of the jobs with the highest returns. I am glad that today we can celebrate much progress since the time of Ada and Agnes, but the fact is that women are still playing catch-up after centuries and centuries of inequality. PhD computer and data scientists are powering the economy, creating new billion-dollar companies in life sciences, artificial intelligence, fintech, health tech and beyond. Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg—three of the richest people on the planet—were all STEM students and they now lead companies that are shaping the world around us, with arguably more power and certainly more wealth than our political leaders. In the years ahead the new Wall Street is going to be a wet lab.

We know that STEM subjects are some of the highest value added courses for future earnings. We also know that demand is surging for people to fill new high-quality tech and data science jobs. This field is now where the decisions are being taken and where the high-return jobs are being created. I want women to get their fair slice of the economic pie so that we are not playing catch- up in the decades to come.

Since 2010, under successive Conservative Governments, the number of women accepted on full-time STEM undergraduate courses in the UK has increased by almost 50%, but women still remain deeply under-represented in STEM subjects. Girls are only half as likely as boys to say that their strongest subject is science or maths, despite the fact that we know that they now regularly outperform boys in these subjects. A Girlguiding survey last year showed that over half of 11 to 21-year-old girls and women said that they felt that STEM subjects were more for the boys. Only 14.5% of engineers are women, and only 13% of STEM workers at management level are women. This is bias at work, and for the future of equality in this country we need to break it. There could not be a better time.

The success of the covid vaccine roll-out is an inspiration to so many young women in this country, who want to be the next Kate Bingham, Professor Sarah Gilbert or Dr Emily Lawson—or perhaps the next Ada Lovelace or Agnes Pockels. Luckily, today we live in an open society where women can access the world of academia, science and enterprise. However, we are still fighting centuries of bias. That is why I am delighted to be working with our fantastic Children’s Commissioner Dame Rachel de Souza to encourage more women into advanced mathematical courses in particular. We will be hosting a roundtable later this month, so if any fellow Members are interested, please do get in touch. It is of the utmost importance to ensure that in the centuries ahead women are not playing catch-up once again.

--- Later in debate ---

[Sir Bernard Jenkin]

I thank the hon. and learned Lady for that intervention, and I note what she says.

The SNP Minister Shona Robison said when she was introducing the Bill:

“There is no evidence that predatory and abusive men have ever had to pretend to be anything else to carry out abusive and predatory behaviour.”—[Scottish Parliament Official Report, 3 March 2022; c. 65.]

That comment really misses the point. The point is that the Bill does create new opportunities for predatory men and I am afraid that my right hon. Friend the Member for Basingstoke (Mrs Miller) has to accept that there are plenty of instances where biological men have taken advantage of this new freedom being granted them, to the detriment of the safety of women.

[Wera Hobhouse]

I just want to clarify this point. Because there are some predatory men who will always find loopholes for violence, is that a reason for not protecting the most vulnerable people that we have—that is, the transgender community?

[Sir Bernard Jenkin]

I do not follow what the hon. Lady is saying. I am in favour of protecting the trans community in this country. What I am not in favour of is allowing biological men into women’s spaces where they can threaten women as a matter of right, however risk-assessed they might be. I do not know how you risk-assess somebody going into a public toilet or into other women-only safe spaces. The fact is that women are taking flight from the political parties that are supporting this kind of agenda. At least the Conservative party can be a safe haven for them if we stand up and speak for women.

--- Later in debate ---

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

I want to echo the opening remarks of the right hon. Member for Basingstoke (Mrs Miller). She is absolutely right: today we stand in solidarity with the women of Ukraine. Our hearts go out to them in their suffering, and we stand in awe of their bravery and resilience. Women are all too often the most vulnerable, and they are the real victims of war and conflict. The hon. Member for Sevenoaks (Laura Trott) has just made a passionate speech about that. Globally, an estimated 736 million women have experienced sexual violence—that is one in three of us. More than 80,000 women were murdered in 2020, most at the hands of a close relation. Violence extends to children, too; 60 million girls are being sexually assaulted on their way to school every year. Those are not just numbers—they are human beings who feel pain and fear, and are being traumatised throughout their lives.

UN Women notes that violence disproportionately affects low-income countries, but our country is no beacon when it comes to women’s safety. Last week was the very sad first anniversary of Sarah Everard’s horrific murder by a Metropolitan police officer. The police response to the Clapham Common vigil was violent, too. Today, we are still waiting to hear of serious steps to stamp out misogyny in the Met once and for all, but it is not just about police forces. Misogyny is deeply ingrained in our culture, being present everywhere from schools to nightclubs to the courts.

Drink spiking has received a lot of public attention recently. It is a particularly vile form of violence against women and girls. One third of women have been spiked or know someone who has been.

The Government’s end-to-end rape review laid bare the failures of the criminal justice system. Last year, less than 2% of rape cases ended in conviction, adding insult to injury for survivors who find the strength to come forward and report rape—which only one in six women actually do, because they mistrust the system. No wonder they do.

What has been done in the past year to break the bias and to ensure that nobody is disadvantaged by their gender? Well, not enough. While racism and homophobia are considered hate crimes, misogyny is not, despite nearly every woman having experienced gender-based harassment. We have discussed it in the House, but I am still convinced that misogyny must become a hate crime. Although such a measure would not be a silver bullet, there are many reasons why it would mean progress: it would allow for the more accurate collection of data on harassment and make the collection of such data mandatory; it would set a precedent that such behaviour is unacceptable; it would curb the street harassment that 68% of all women experience on a near daily basis; and it would stamp out low-level behaviour based on misogyny so that it would not lead to much more serious offences based on misogyny.

Misogyny needs to be tackled in all settings. I have previously talked about the provision of age-appropriate education on consent in schools. The delivery of age-appropriate relationship education by experts in every school would be a very good start. It cannot be left to a postcode lottery. Some schools do it very well but, as I have said before, it cannot be for maths or language teachers to do such important work. It has to be delivered by experts.

As the crisis in Ukraine continues to unfold, many women will become displaced and especially vulnerable. We cannot allow refugees from Ukraine or elsewhere to fall into the arms of traffickers or abusers.

Finally, the Government must listen to and champion women’s voices. They are the agents of change. We women have made progress—often painful and slow—and we still have a long way to go, but I wish to echo the words of the hon. Member for Bristol South (Karin Smyth) in saying that it is fun to be a woman. It is important to be here. To everybody who listens to today’s debate I say: come forward. We need you.

Electric Vehicles: Transition by 2030

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Thursday 9th December 2021 Westminster Hall

[Derek Twigg (in the Chair)]

I remind Members that they are expected to wear face coverings when they are not speaking in the debate. That is in line with Government guidance and that of the House of Commons Commission. I also remind Members that they are asked by the House to have a covid lateral flow test twice a week if coming on to the parliamentary estate. That can be done either at the testing centre on the estate or at home. Please give each other and members of staff space when seated, and when entering and leaving the room.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered the matter of support for the UK’s transition to electric vehicles by 2030.

It is a pleasure to serve with you in the Chair, Mr Twigg. I thank the Backbench Business Committee for granting the debate and all those colleagues across the House who supported the application for it. The topic has attracted a lot of interest, as demonstrated by the many emails I have received from a wide range of organisations, including the Institution of Civil Engineers, the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders, Imperial College London, UKHospitality, Energy UK and the British Vehicle Rental and Leasing Association. I also place on the record the report of the Select Committee on Transport, “Zero emission vehicles”, from July this year, and the Government’s response to it.

I welcome the Government’s deadline for the end of selling new petrol and diesel vehicles by 2030.

[Sarah Olney (Richmond Park) (LD)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing the debate, and she is making an excellent speech. Does she agree that, since battery production is limited by the availability of lithium, the switch to electric vehicles will not be accessible or affordable to everyone who owns a petrol or diesel car, and that consequently the Government need to invest much more in alternatives to private car use? Does she further agree that, as a start, the Department for Transport should swiftly agree terms with Transport for London for a medium to long-term funding solution that will allow it to be financially self-sufficient?

[Wera Hobhouse]

Today, we are talking about electric vehicles as part of the transition to net zero, but I totally agree that modal shift to other and alternative forms of transport is required, including for public health reasons. During lockdown, many people found that walking or cycling, if they could, was a far more pleasant experience than sitting in a car, yet the large number of cars on our roads makes such modes of transport unsafe and keeps many people from looking into alternatives.

Imperial College got in touch with me, as I mentioned, to tell me that it is leading research into alternatives to lithium use in batteries. I cannot remember what it was—perhaps something like sodium. I encourage my hon. Friend and any Member interested in the subject to get in touch with the research team at Imperial College to find out more.

The cut-off point of 2030 in the UK and countries across Europe sends an unambiguous signal of change. Petrol and diesel, made from fossil fuel, are on the way out, for the simple reason that we must limit global warming to 1.5° C as soon as possible and by 2050 at the latest. There is no plan B. The transition from petrol and diesel-powered vehicles to vehicles powered by electricity is already happening. We are here today to raise the main issues we need to deal with to ensure the success of the transition. We have nine years from today to complete the transition—only a short time.

Like other Members present in the Chamber, I have made that leap and got my first EV. Like others, I believe that I am in a good place to contribute to the debate and to steer Government into making good policy choices for the next nine years, rather than not so good ones. To get the transition right, parliamentarians and Ministers must make informed choices, anticipating the consequences of our choices and welcoming scrutiny from outside and inside Parliament.

In the big debate on how to get to net zero, the Government have too often defended their inaction by saying that it is for the markets to make the transition work. I agree that Government do not have to deliver all the changes and investment, but they do have a crucial role to play in setting the right policy frameworks, from which the market and the private sector will take their cues.

While there is progress in EV uptake, substantial barriers remain, many of which have already been raised in Parliament. They include the high purchase price of EVs, the lack of charging points, and the fear of being caught short while travelling. They all act as a constraint and delay on the transition, with many people continuing with petrol and diesel vehicles. However, time is short, so today I want to dig down to address the structural problems that result in those barriers and delays.

The UK is actually in a good place to make the transition to net zero, and the transition to EVs makes sense only if they use zero-carbon electricity. As long as half of our electricity is made by burning gas, why should consumers switch to something that, from their point of view, is expensive, complicated and full of uncertainties? The consumer association Which? has found that just two in five drivers currently signal some intent to buy an EV. That must change. The first principle must be that all our electric power is made from renewables. That would be a big incentive to consumers to make the switch and take on the inconvenience, because they want to know that they are doing the right thing. It would be a terrible failing of Government if the people who commit to going electric find that their carbon footprint is nearly as bad as it was with their petrol or diesel vehicle.

Compared with many EU countries, Britain is wonderfully placed to produce power from wind and waves, but we need to upscale those technologies considerably. In 20 years, all our power—in fact, more than we need—could and should come from renewable energy. The Government must make that their first priority—no ifs, no buts. Renewable energy, and wind power in particular, needs to be 10 times larger by 2030. Will we be able to power all our EVs from renewables in 2030? The answer is a resounding yes.

Let me move to the challenges. Upscaling renewables has challenges, not least in upskilling the workforce to take up the new net zero jobs while those in the fossil fuel industries are going. That needs forward planning and co-operation with our higher and further education sectors. The upskilling of the workforce will include new jobs in the automotive industry and battery gigafactories. Further education colleges are open to and ready for the challenge, but the Government need to invest in vocational training courses at all levels.

The next challenge—it is a big one—is the national electricity grid. Increased production of electricity—probably at least threefold—will require power cables big enough to take the increased load. Our national grid was built decades ago for much lower electricity usage. Obviously, that problem is now owned by a private company. I leave solving that problem to the governing party that privatised it.

The national grid is a strategic network of cables bringing enough electricity to the edges of cities and towns, and then to the array of substations that feed streets in each community. A threefold increase in electricity usage is anticipated, with domestic demand increasing as gas is replaced by electric heating and cooking as well as EV charging, if that is done from home. In most cases, the existing 63 amps and 100 amps ratings should be sufficient; the real problem is in the grid. Every home will be using more electricity, but the grid will overload if too many homes are taking close to the maximum power. There is no hiding from the reality of the big investment needed in our national grid for the laying of big, new cables, building new substations and upgrading existing substations for the increased load.

The wait for grid investment is the single biggest delay factor in rolling out EV charging. The Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders has undertaken analysis showing that between 689,000 and 2.3 million public chargers are required. I will go further. The Transport Committee has recommended that the planning Bill should

“make public charge point provision a requirement of local plans”

and that the electricity network must be assessed for weak spots. In 10 years, most vehicles on the roads will be EVs, and in 20 years nearly all of them will be, so when we put in new grid infrastructure, it needs to be enough for every car in the future, not just for those that are on the road now. It is disappointing that the Government have only partially accepted the recommendations of the Transport Committee, meaning that we will have to fight for every penny, that investment in the grid will come later rather than sooner, and that we are always going to be behind the curve. We need to plan ahead.

The biggest concern for current EV owners, some of whom are in this room, and future owners is how to charge their vehicles. Let me deal with home or near-home charging first. Imagine two different homes: the first is a home with its own off-street parking, and the second is a home with a pavement or more between it and its parking space, especially terraced housing or flats. In the first example, the charging can be done by the owner from their own electric supply; in the second example, the owner needs to use a supply offered by the local council, which in most cases owns the pavement and the road. We need a complete solution for both. It is obvious that for the home with its own off-street parking, the charging solution is in the hands of the owner: the Government do not need to get involved unless they want to subsidise the equipment. However, homes without off-street parking require Government and especially local government to play a key role.

As has been said by the Transport Committee and many others, the variation in EV charging prices is a problem. The price of electricity is about 20p per kilowatt for charging from the home. I believe that the price for the second group of owners who need on-street charging should be almost the same, but the current prices usually range from 30p to 40p per kilowatt. That is not acceptable: it is discriminatory against many of the people who need the most help and encouragement to move to electric vehicles. For us to achieve 20p per kilowatt for street or car parking charging, it will need to be run as a not-for-profit public service. That is the role of the local authority, but it will need funding, investment, and the full co-operation of National Grid.

On a positive note, providing that service will bring out the best in local government through decisions and actions taken in close consultation with, and with the assent of, the local communities that they serve. Councils up and down the country have declared a climate emergency and have committed to net zero by 2030. My own council of Bath and North East Somerset is fully committed to deliver a big roll-out of EV charging, but it cannot because the grid capacity is not there. I am delighted that the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders agrees that we need

“A national strategic plan delivered locally to uplift the number of chargepoints and ensure the right type of chargers are in the right places.”

In my own city of Bath, there are cars parked bumper to bumper on residential streets. In 10 years, every single parking space should have a charge point, a little bit like the old car parking meters we once had. There should still be some connections there. Let us put in this infrastructure all at the same time, at much better value for the taxpayer, rather than doing it piecemeal.

The final piece of the jigsaw for EV charging is away-from-home charging. How easy could it be to convert the current network of petrol stations to fast-charging hubs? Yes, it takes an hour or even a bit more to charge fast, but combined with a meal or a snack, it could be perfect. Once again, there will be the need for substantial investment in the grid, as fast charging uses a lot of electricity very quickly. I had a meeting with representatives of the Highways Agency a couple of years ago when they were planning for a new highways network. I asked them about planning for the laying of big cables, but they said that that was not the Highways Agency’s responsibility. I could not believe it: if we are planning to build new roads, we should surely bear in mind the fact that the cars on those roads will be electric and will need charging. If everyone knew that they could pull up into what used to be a petrol station and is now a fast EV charging station, the fear of being on the side of the motorway with a dead battery would disappear.

The Transport Committee has already begun scrutiny of the Government’s Project Rapid, their £950 million charging fund for strategic sites. It is clear that the levels of ambition and funding are well below what is needed. To use a driving metaphor, we need to be driving this transition at 70 mph and not going along at a pedestrian pace. The Liberal Democrats pledged a financial investment of £100 billion during this Parliament for the transition to net zero. We are way off that mark.

In conclusion, by 2030 we can become a country where fossil fuels are no longer used for private transport. To do that requires political leadership. That we need alternatives to car use, as my hon. Friend the Member for Richmond Park (Sarah Olney) points out, and to bring in modal shifts and societal change away from our dependency on cars in addition to the EV transition, goes without saying. There is no planet B. Let us speed up and deliver the change.

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[Wera Hobhouse]

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that ultimately local councils are best placed to provide that infrastructure and to ensure that it actually works, because they are the ones who are accountable, whereas any private companies can just do their own thing? Does he agree that local authorities should run these charging points?

[Jim Shannon]

I thank her hon. Lady for her intervention and she is absolutely right. That is what I say when I talk about councils back home. The responsibility should lie with them, because they can specifically monitor their own towns and villages, not only across my constituency of Strangford, but across the whole of Northern Ireland.

In my constituency, there are only two electric charging points shown on the charge point map for a constituency of approximately 60,000 people, which is shocking. I know that the Minister back home, Nichola Mallon, has committed her Department to improving that situation greatly, and the quicker that happens the better. If it was not the responsibility of her Department but of the council, and there was some money for that, we could achieve some of our goals on electric charging points.

A report undertaken in 2020 by the Department for Infrastructure back home came to some interesting conclusions regarding people’s attitudes towards electric vehicles. Of those surveyed, 33% said they were unlikely to make an electric vehicle their next car buy and 42% would not even consider it. We have to address these attitudes. Why are those figures so high? Indeed, 64% of those surveyed said that they would be discouraged from buying electric vehicles due to the price and—guess what?—the need to charge them.

The hon. Member for Rushcliffe told a story about a nightmare journey from her home to her holiday destination, stopping on numerous occasions along the way. I agree that the education must be there for the UK to fully transition to electric vehicles by 2030, especially for the younger generations. Thousands of young adults and teenagers are doing driving tests and getting their first vehicle. We want to encourage the new generation to buy the cars; we have to enable them to feel confident to do so. That is why I encourage the Minister to engage with the Department for Education to ensure that the benefits of using electric cars are taught to young people. I think we can also address the generational mindset.

I referred to Minister Mallon, the Minister for Infrastructure back home. She has announced a new electric vehicle infrastructure taskforce for Northern Ireland. That is a good step. I welcome it and congratulate the Minister on that. It was announced at COP26—COP26 achieved many things outside the headlines. I encourage the Government to follow suit, and put more responsibility on local councils, as the hon. Member for Bath said, to be accountable for e-charging in their areas. That is the secret. That is the key. That is what we need to do. Having the necessary charging is absolutely essential to progress in our battle with climate change.

I recently made contact with the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy on a new-start logistics business in Newtownards, which is seeking funding to ensure that its entire fleet is made up of electric vehicles. I welcome that initiative, interest and commitment. We need to find funding for future-looking companies such as that one, and we also need electric charge points throughout the constituency to charge the fleets. It is as simple as that. Let us do it.

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[Wera Hobhouse]

I thank everybody for their contributions to the debate. As has been said, there is a lot of consensus. We agree with the Government that the 2030 target to phase out petrol and diesel vehicles is ambitious, but if we want to see the big take-up of electric vehicles, the Government need to do more to support that.

I thank the Minister for addressing some of the points made. What was missing was the national grid, which, as we have heard, is at the bottom of problems with charging. The entertainment prize for a good speech goes to the hon. Member for Rushcliffe (Ruth Edwards), who described what it is like for EV owners on the road. The Government must be more ambitious about these gaps and get to the bottom of why the network does not work. That will need investment in the national electricity grid. As I said, the national grid is owned by a private company and it is for the Government to resolve the problem of how they work with it. However, that must be done, because local authorities want to do something—we all agree on that—but the block is the lack of infrastructure investment.

Finally, it is no use buying electric vehicles if the power that fuels them is not 100% renewable. The Minister talked about nuclear, but I believe that this country is well placed to make all its power from renewables. I hope that the Government will share that ambition with me.

Motion lapsed (Standing Order No. 10(6)).

Oral Answers to Questions

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts

Thursday 4th November 2021 Commons Chamber

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

Stepping back in time at the Dispatch Box, Mr Speaker. Steam is not necessarily an option for that particular line, but I am pleased to confirm that on 1 September this year, £78 million to electrify the route between Wigan North Western and Bolton was announced. It will enable greener electric trains—rather than Thomas the Tank Engine—to run along that route, with more seats to serve passengers across Greater Manchester. The scheme is on track and targeted for completion by 2024.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

In Bath, we are still waiting for the full electrification of our lines, so perhaps the Minister will take that on board too. The direct line from Oldfield Park station in Bath to London Waterloo will be cancelled in December. Will the Minister reconsider these service cuts, which will make travel into south London nearly three times more expensive for my constituents and force them to use the underground while covid cases are rising?

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

On the hon. Lady’s last point, using the underground—and other trains—is one of the safest methods of transport in the covid pandemic. I believe that the air on the underground is exchanged every three minutes, and on trains every six minutes. They are perfectly safe. She referred to the consultation that has just finished on South Western Railway services, and she is quite correct: passenger numbers on that service are remarkably low. I will happily meet her to go through that, and we can talk about how we can improve those services.

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[Trudy Harrison]

Absolutely yes, Mr Speaker. I thank my hon. Friend for his championing of Bus Back Better. The Government are absolutely determined that great bus services be available to everyone, especially those in Stoke-on-Trent. Our national bus strategy explains how we will make buses more frequent, more reliable, easier to understand and use, better co-ordinated and cheaper. We are more than doubling dedicated bus funding compared with the previous Parliament.

[Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)]

Making aviation net zero is clearly a big challenge. Earlier, the Secretary of State said that it is not flying that is the problem, but emissions from aircraft that use fossil fuels. Will he meet me to discuss ideas around synthetic fuels that scientists from the University of Leeds have brought to my attention?

[Robert Courts]

I would be delighted to.