Oral Answers to Questions

Ruth George Excerpts

Tuesday 11th December 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

Yes. There cannot be strong defence without a strong economy.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

In the next two months, the Royal Bank of Scotland will close all but 56 branches in cities across England, leaving banking deserts in towns and rural areas like mine. What is the Chancellor doing to use the Government’s shareholding to exert public pressure on RBS and ensure that we have no banking deserts?

[John Glen]

The Government hold a 62.3% shareholding, but we do not run the bank. Decisions on the branch network are a matter for the bank.

ATM Closures

Ruth George Excerpts

Tuesday 4th December 2018 Westminster Hall

[Ged Killen]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. He makes an excellent point about the existing pressure on our high streets. Removing ATMs and other services does not help that pressure one bit.

LINK has now been given a specific direction by the PSR to review its financial inclusion programme, due to its failure to protect the spread of free-to-use ATMs. However, I have little confidence in the regulation of the sector. LINK’s changes to ATM funding were the PSR’s first major regulatory hurdle. In my view and that of many stakeholders, it fell at that hurdle. Common themes related to the reporting of issues and access to the financial inclusion programme have been reported by those involved in the industry pretty much since day one. I sat across from the PSR and explained the concerns I had heard about the closure of free-to-use ATMs and about their operators, and from the many people who are against the cut to LINK’s interchange fee, and I was met with silence. On every occasion when concerns were raised, the PSR failed to act. Only latterly has it taken action.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

I thank my hon. Friend for bringing forward this important debate. My very rural constituency is similarly affected. When I met the PSR, I found its attitude was, “Wait and see whether there are any problems, and then we might think about acting.” Does he agree that that is not the correct attitude for a regulator to take when it has such a weight of evidence before it that there will be problems?

[Ged Killen]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. When I met the PSR, it seemed wholly satisfied with listening to what LINK, rather than everyone else involved in the industry, had to say about the issue. That was surprising and disappointing.

The closure of free-to-use ATMs highlights the significant problem we have with the way access to cash is managed in the UK. There seems to be no effective oversight of the issue, and responsibility sits across numerous Departments, regulators and private companies. We need a regulator to have the powers to take a rounded view and implement effective measures that will ensure access to cash is protected. It seems likely that the PSR either does not have the power it needs or has not utilised fully and effectively the abilities it has. I should be grateful if the Minister would comment on that.

We are in a transition towards a cashless society, but we are not there yet. We need to be careful about how the transition is managed. Most importantly, we have to think about the impact on people who still rely on cash. Access to cash remains an important part of many of our constituents’ lives. Research from Which? has highlighted the fact that four in five people said that access to the free-to-use network was important in their daily lives and in paying for goods and services. Removing free access to cash would leave one in 10 people struggling to make payments, and would shut many consumers out of local shops and services.

We also need to think about what happens when the technology fails or in the case of hacking. This year the Visa payment system crashed and there were major online banking issues for TSB customers, many of whom of course did not have a local branch to visit as an alternative. The experience of other countries further along the journey towards a cash-free society, such as Sweden, where there has been a huge rise in the number of places that simply will not accept cash, is that there are now serious concerns about the lack of cash in the economy, so that the Government are looking at ways of addressing that retrospectively.

Finance (No. 3) Bill

Ruth George Excerpts

Committee: 1st sitting: House of Commons
Monday 19th November 2018 Commons Chamber

[Leo Docherty]

I am wholehearted in my support for the changes to entrepreneurs’ relief. I was in my constituency of Aldershot on Friday, visiting one of the many small and medium-sized enterprises that are the backbone of our economy there. Gemini Tec is one of the leading manufacturers of short circuit boards in the country, and that business is successful because of the entrepreneurs who have been driving it forward for the past 40 years. They do not ask any special favours from the Government. Indeed, they want the Government to keep out of their way and let them thrive. However, if the Government can in some way create an ecosystem and an atmosphere, through measures such as entrepreneurs’ relief, that is wholeheartedly to be commended. We have a tradition of tremendous innovation and creativity—not least in Aldershot, north Hampshire, the Blackwater Valley and Farnborough—and this drives a lot of the job creation that we are now seeing in this country. As I have said, this has led to the lowest rates of unemployment since 1975, the year before I was born.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

Does the hon. Gentleman believe that money to support entrepreneurs is being well spent through the Government giving an average of £450,000 in entrepreneurs’ relief each to just 6,000 entrepreneurs? Does he acknowledge that the Government will take £1.5 billion off the 300,000 small businesses that will lose out through the universal credit minimum income floor, which the Government are driving through?

[Leo Docherty]

This is not a debate on universal credit. This is actually about job creation. That is the more important point when it comes to entrepreneurs’ relief.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jack Brereton]

The hon. Gentleman will have seen the figures that show that debt is now coming down to lower levels than ever before, and we have seen the deficit back under control after the failings of the previous Labour Government who got us into an horrendous mess that working families in this country ended up paying for.

We are now seeing the numbers of low-paid workers at a record low, and we are seeing low taxpayers now paying record low levels of tax. The astonishing turnaround achieved in making work pay, not least through tax measures like those before us today, means that the Office for Budget Responsibility has now revised up its assumptions for the trend labour market participation rates and revised down its estimate of the equilibrium rate of employment. As the Treasury rightly highlights in the Red Book paragraph 1.15, both of these revisions raise the level of potential output, which is good news for the sustainability of the labour market boom which has undoubtedly been the greatest achievement of the policies pursued by this Conservative Government.

[Ruth George]

Would the hon. Gentleman not agree with the Institute for Fiscal Studies that the cumulative impact of personal tax and benefit reform since 2015 has been that the bottom two thirds of society is far worse off and that the only people who are better off under this Government’s policies are the top third?

[Jack Brereton]

I totally disagree. We have seen increases in the national living wage and reduced tax in this Budget, and further measures in this Budget to support UC.

--- Later in debate ---

[Alex Burghart]

My hon. Friend is too modest; I know not only that it was an excellent reform brought about under a Conservative Administration, where we went from the LEGO building-block approach to stamp duty that he described to something much smoother and more pristine, but that he was working in the Treasury at the time and was instrumental in bringing about that excellent reform. It has made stamp duty not only fairer, but much more sensible for anyone seeking to buy a property.

Let me turn to business, clause 38 and the necessary additional relief being given to entrepreneurs. As a number of hon. Members have made clear, these are people who are looking to start businesses, so as to employ people, and to create an economic dynamism in their communities and their areas. I go back to remarks made by my hon. Friend the Member for Stoke-on-Trent South (Jack Brereton) about how he has seen employment and business growth in his area. I was having a conversation earlier with another hon. Friend from the north-east, where the Conservatives again have seats in Parliament—that is no accident. We have seats in Parliament in the north-east because of the record levels of jobs growth and business growth that have happened in those constituencies since 2010. Voters understand success and successful policies when they see them, which is why people such as my hon. Friend are capable of winning seats such as Stoke-on-Trent South. This happened because of the enormous benefits of Conservative policy since 2010.

A measure in the Budget that has meant a great deal to my area has been the substantial improvement in business rates. As I say, Brentwood and Ongar is a hive of Thatcherite prosperity. It has a huge number of small, medium-sized and large enterprises within its boundaries, most of which have been built by the sweat of local people, and are the product of good, old-fashioned British graft and nous. People in my area are proud of their high streets and want to see them do well. They want their local retail areas to be bustling and thriving. These measures are an enormous shot in the arm for those smaller businesses, which add not only vibrancy and character, but employment and economic opportunity to our local areas. I cannot praise them highly enough.

In conclusion, this is a Budget to help the people who drive the economy. It is a Budget for the businesses that help drive the economy. It offers dynamism to the economy. It will help deliver the growth we need to grow our revenues and our public services, and offer a future for our children which has jobs and is not shackled by an enormous debt left by the previous Government.

[Ruth George]

With such disagreement on statistics between hon. Members on both sides of the House, it would be helpful to refer to an impartial observer from the United Nations who has spent the past two weeks going across the United Kingdom and looking at our levels of poverty and the associated political choices. It is a damning indictment of not just our country but our Government that he concluded:

“The experience of the United Kingdom, especially since 2010, underscores the conclusion that poverty is a political choice. Austerity could easily have spared the poor, if the political will had existed to do so. Resources were available to the Treasury at the last budget that could have transformed the situation of millions of people living in poverty, but the political choice was made to fund tax cuts for the wealthy instead.”

I find that absolutely shocking in this day and age, given that there is so much evidence on this, not just from the likes of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, but in every region and on every street in our country. I live in a relatively affluent constituency, but I have had thousands of constituents come to me suffering from poverty.

[Lyn Brown]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for mentioning this, because the rapporteur came to my constituency last week and I sat through a harrowing three hours listening to the testimonies of people who are really in need and suffering. So I am genuinely grateful to her for raising this issue now.

[Ruth George]

I find it hard to believe that any of us, as Members of Parliament who are seen to be compassionate and caring people who represent our constituents, do not have struggling constituents coming to them. A single parent came to me who has had to give up his job because his child is disabled. He has found that he is going to lose the disability element of child tax credit and will be £1,500 a year worse off. He said, “This Government says that it will protect the most vulnerable in society. If they cannot protect disabled children, who is more vulnerable? Who are these people that they claim to be protecting?” Answers are there none.

As I said, the Institute for Fiscal Studies has shown that since 2015, the overall impact of tax and benefit reforms has hit the poorest two thirds of the population. They are the ones who have lost out—the poorest have lost out by a shocking 10% of their income. The only section of society to have gained is the richest third. The only difference the Budget will make to the incomes of the poorest 10% is that instead of their losing 10% of their income, they will now lose 9.8%. I am sorry, but when we are the fifth richest economy, that is just not good enough.

The previous speaker, the hon. Member for Brentwood and Ongar (Alex Burghart), praised the previous Secretary of State for Work and Pensions, the right hon. Member for Tatton (Ms McVey). Admittedly, she argued for Budget redistribution to people on universal credit, but the increase in the work allowance gives £630 a year to 2.4 million families. That will not make anyone better off: 3.2 million families were due to lose an average of £2,500 a year; now, those families will lose an average of £2,100 a year. The Budget will not make those people better off; it will make them very slightly less worse off.

When 14 million people—a fifth of the population—are in poverty, what do the Government have to say to them? What do they have to say to the 4 million people who live 50% below the poverty line, or to the 1.5 million who are destitute? Are they proud of those figures? Are they proud to meet people like my constituent Billy, who is doing his best? He suffers from a disability and has taken on some self-employed work, with tax credits. He has done his very best and recently took on an afternoon shift with Royal Mail, delivering the Christmas post. He has just found out that when that job ends after Christmas, he will be put on to universal credit. Because of the minimum income floor, he will have absolutely no income whatsoever to see him through until the months when he can work again as an entertainer. What do the Government have to say to people like Billy? How is he supposed to get by? He has sought to do his best and to do what the Government have asked people to do—go out and get a job—but people like him are punished for it.

When 8 million working people are in poverty, that is not a benefit to them. Two thirds of children living in poverty are in working households. Does the hon. Member for Brentwood and Ongar think that their parents’ employment is a gift? These children are still in poverty. Employment is a benefit only where it can lift a household and children out of poverty.

[Alex Burghart]

I fully respect the hon. Lady’s position on welfare—I often think it is a gift to the Government that she does not serve on the Front Bench—but it is slightly absurd to suggest that people are not better off in work. They are better off in work. We would all like people to earn more money in work, but to suggest, as Opposition Members often do, that work is no benefit is ludicrous. Work does help. It is a route out of poverty. The first stage of getting into work is not the conclusion of the journey.

[Ruth George]

I am afraid that for constituents like mine, about whom I was speaking earlier, work is not a route out of poverty. For them, trying a temporary job and moving into work is a fast route on to universal credit and into absolute poverty.

In spite of all the promises made to the House when cuts to universal credit were forced through after the 2015 Budget, not everyone will be protected as they move from legacy benefits to universal credit. Not even half the people who transfer from legacy benefits to universal credit will be protected from the average £2,100-worth of cuts. Managed migration has been delayed and reduced, and the criteria for transferring people from legacy benefits to universal credit have been widened so much that 4 million people will move on to universal credit naturally, with no protection whatsoever. Fewer than 3 million people will move over under managed migration. That is contrary to the promises that were made to the House when those cuts were brought in.

Some absolute anomalies in universal credit will seriously increase the amount of child poverty, which is why at the very least the Government have a duty to measure the impact of the provisions in their Budget. Some 3.2 million children are due to be affected by the two-child limit, and 1.4 million of those children live in families with four children or more, who will lose an average of £7,000 a year. That is a huge amount of money, which no family with children can afford to lose, much less the poorest and those households bringing up children on such low incomes. According to the Office for Budget Responsibility, £3.2 billion will be taken off people with disabilities by 2023.

What about the self-employed? The Government claim to support entrepreneurship, but their entrepreneurs’ relief enables 6,000 people making profits of more than £1 million on the sale of their business to benefit by an average of almost half a million pounds each. That costs this country and its economy £2.7 billion. People starting out in self-employment, on low earnings, such as my constituent Billy, are among the 430,000 who will lose an average of £3,000 a year, mostly because of the minimum income floor.

[Neil O’Brien]

Is the hon. Lady calling for entrepreneurs’ relief to be completely scrapped?

[Ruth George]

I believe that the relief should be reviewed, which is what new clause 3 would require. We could then see its impact on the most well off and on the poorest, and in particular its impact among those who aspire to be entrepreneurs and who aspire to bring themselves out of—

[Neil O’Brien]

So you don’t know.

[Ruth George]

That is what the new clause would require. If the Government wanted us to abolish entrepreneurs’ relief and had given us a Finance Bill that we could actually amend, and if they had the courage to put their policies to votes on the Floor of the House and to give us any alternative, other than to amend the Bill to require reviews, we would gladly do so. Perhaps the Minister could indicate from his sedentary position whether he is prepared to allow the Committee to make such an amendment to abolish entrepreneurs’ relief.

[The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mel Stride)]

rose—

[Mel Stride]

I was just going to say that, as the hon. Lady will know, all amendments need to be in scope and that that is ultimately a decision for Mr Speaker. I am sure that he has taken the appropriate decisions in this case—[Interruption.]

[Ruth George]

My hon. Friend the Member for West Ham (Lyn Brown) has just said from a sedentary position that the Government have set the parameters for the scope of amendments in this Bill. The same happened with the previous two Finance Bills that they brought to the House. They have not allowed any substantive amendments to the Bill. They will not allow their policies to be tested on the Floor of the House, because those policies have been found wanting in terms of redistribution of wealth from the best off in our society to the poorest. It is actually the poorest who pay 42% of their income, while the richest pay just 34%. How is that fair?

This Budget has done nothing to support the poorest people. After raising VAT to 20%, the Government have doubled insurance tax and are raising council tax across the country by 5% a year, hitting the poorest in our society and hitting those who can afford it the least. They are also hitting those who are homeowners with universal credit. We have heard that the Government aspire to support homeowners, so why is it that, under universal credit, 74% of people who lose out are actually homeowners? They have seen their clawback of income nearly doubling from 39% under the Labour Government to 63% under this Government, and it is going up to 75% for taxpayers.

If the Government disagree with our analysis that this Budget is not helping people in poverty and that it is actually entrenching the serious divides and the serious destitution and poverty within our society, they should prove their case by supporting our amendment for an equalities impact assessment. But they have form on this. I have been calling for an equalities impact assessment of universal credit changes since 2015 and since I first came to this House, and it has been refused. They are now refusing to hold one in this Budget. Anyone would think that this Government had something to hide. I know from people around my constituency, which is relatively affluent, that it is not just the poorest people who are appalled at the level of food bank use, the level of homelessness and the level of evictions that are being inflicted on the poorest people in our society. People across my constituency are writing to me, imploring me to stand up for the poorest, because otherwise we are poorer as a society.

[Rachel Maclean]

It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for High Peak (Ruth George). I rise to speak in favour of the Bill and against the Opposition amendments. I will start by correcting a comment that I made earlier. Just to correct the record, let me say that I incorrectly said—I apologise to the House—that the shadow Chancellor was on record saying that the fact that Labour’s numbers did not add up was largely irrelevant. I offer my apologies as it was not the shadow Chancellor who said that, but a Labour party adviser who wrote it in a book that was endorsed by the shadow Chancellor.

Finance (No. 3) Bill

Ruth George Excerpts

2nd reading: House of Commons & Programme motion: House of Commons
Monday 12th November 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mel Stride]

I can assure my hon. Friend that we are indeed reducing government debt. The Office for Budget Responsibility has forecast that in each year of the coming period we will be reducing debt as a percentage of GDP. We have of course met our two intermediate targets a full three years early. We are fiscally responsible, which is why we are in a position to be able to support our public services in the very significant way that we are doing.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

The Conservative party came to power in 2010 promising to eliminate the deficit by 2015. Not only has it not done that, but it has doubled this country’s debt and brought public services to their knees. Is the Minister claiming that this project has been a success?

[Mel Stride]

The hon. Lady will know that the deficit was up at about 10%—£150 billion a year—at the time we inherited the mess that her party left us with. That deficit has now reduced by a full 80%, to below 2% of GDP, and will go down further as we move forward. Now, let me make some progress.

As I was saying, these are the economic facts of life and, as a great lady once said:

“The facts of life are conservative.”

Under this Conservative Government, sound finances are being restored. The future is brighter, bringing with it our increased commitment to our public services, most notably to our highest priority of all, our national health service. Thanks to the commitment of this Government and the hard work of the British people, we are now entering a new era. The deficit is fading, real wages are rising, the debt is declining and better times are returning. We now have a near record level of employment, with unemployment at a 40-year low, and we have halved youth unemployment since 2010. Central to this progress is my right hon. Friend the Chancellor’s Budget and this Bill.

This Bill introduces a tax cut for 32 million people, through bringing forward by a year our manifesto commitment to increase the personal allowance to £12,500 and the higher rate threshold to £50,000.

--- Later in debate ---

[Peter Dowd]

From a sedentary position my hon. Friend the Member for Stalybridge and Hyde (Jonathan Reynolds) says that one in four policemen have gone from his constituency. That is similar to what has happened in my constituency and, I suspect, in the hon. Lady’s constituency. There is not one penny more of day-to-day spending in the Budget. She should be asking her Government why the police are still being underfunded.

[Ruth George]

Does my hon. Friend agree that the huge rise in council tax for council tax payers on every level of income is a highly regressive form of tax? In my Derbyshire constituency, people are having to pay more council tax for fewer police.

[Peter Dowd]

“Regressive” and “Conservative Government” go in the same sentence pretty easily.

The Budget does not move us towards parity for mental health services. It does nothing to end the crisis in social care, to which the hon. Member for Thirsk and Malton (Kevin Hollinrake) referred, or in children’s services. It gets worse as the days go on. The Budget was a continuation of austerity under anyone’s definition, and the Bill is a written testament to that broken promise.

Oral Answers to Questions

Ruth George Excerpts

Tuesday 6th November 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

Yes, and I remind my right hon. Friend that the fiscal targets are set in cyclically adjusted terms, so that in the event of an economic downturn, fiscal space is automatically created. In addition, I have kept a buffer, over and above any cyclical dividend, of £15.4 billion in 2020-21 to allow us firepower should any unexpected events cause headwinds for the economy.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

After the Budget, then, more than 3 million families will still be losing an average of £2,100 a year by transferring to universal credit. With 40% of claimants in debt and 38% in rent arrears, are not the Government simply transferring the nation’s debt into the pockets of the poorest families, and what assessment has the Chancellor made of their ability to move into work?

[Mr Speaker]

The hon. Lady should not have spoiled it. She was doing very well before she added a further bit that was not required.

Oral Answers to Questions

Ruth George Excerpts

Tuesday 11th September 2018 Commons Chamber

[Elizabeth Truss]

We recognise that social care is an area where reform is needed, and my right hon. Friend the Health Secretary will shortly publish a Green Paper to outline some of the options and to make sure we have a proper discussion as a country about the future of social care.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

My clinical commissioning group in north Derbyshire has seen an uplift of only 1% over the five-year funding settlement from 2016-17, resulting in a deficit of £51 million to find this year in cuts and of £71 million next year. It is having to cut everything that it is not statutorily required to provide, including all voluntary services. Will the Chancellor look at the funding that has gone to the national health service over the past six years to make sure this can be met?

[Elizabeth Truss]

No doubt, the hon. Lady will welcome the additional money allocated to the NHS to reflect the increasing demand. I point out that under the plans proposed by the Labour party, which would mean fewer businesses, fewer jobs and less tax revenue, there would be less money going into the NHS and the hon. Lady’s local services.

Business Rates

Ruth George Excerpts

Wednesday 13th June 2018 Westminster Hall

[Rachael Maskell (York Central) (Lab/Co-op)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered a review of the business rates system.

Thank you, Mr Gray, for being in the Chair for this important and timely debate.

Almost every day, we learn of a chain of retail stores or local businesses closing its doors, resulting in job losses, people’s lives being thrown into turmoil and empty premises along our high streets. The Centre for Retail Research has said that 10,000 stores will close this year alone, amounting to 384,000 jobs that are forecast to be lost over the next four years—unless, of course, the Government take urgent action now.

Businesses face many challenges at this time, not least the cost of property rental, and that leads into the issue of business rates. I would like those issues be addressed in today’s debate and I look forward to hearing the Minister’s response, because it is time for action to rescue businesses from the current crisis.

Front Street in Acomb once bustled with an array of independent stores serving the west of York. Those premises are now being exploited by foreign investors who are charging extortionate rents, which in turn is driving up the rentable property value, and thus business rates. Today, empty units line the street. York’s city centre is following suit, as are towns and cities up and down the country. This cannot continue to drag on.

The ever-inflation-busting rental levels have over-inflated the local property market. That is exacerbated by the empty property tax loopholes, resulting in units being left dormant, further blighting our beleaguered high streets and letting the owners of those properties off the hook.

The Valuation Office Agency has made its calculations based on this overheated market and set excruciatingly high business rates, as determined by the Government. When I hold business meetings across York, everyone feels that they have been failed by the business rates system, and as the situation gets worse, they want to know why the Government are forever providing sticking plasters when major surgery is required.

In York, where the retail sector accounts for 13% of employment, the toll is being felt. However, it is not only the retail sector that is affected. The hospitality sector employs 2.9 million people across the UK and although it pays 10% of all business rates, the sector’s share of turnover is just 3%—as the sector puts it, it has made an overpayment of £1.8 billion.

Other businesses are also being impacted. In the last couple of years, I have witnessed major employers—employers employing hundreds of people—leaving the city of York, citing excessive business rates as the root of their decision, and moving to areas with lower business rates. The 2015 valuation took a particular toll on businesses in York. We have had increases as high as 600% for pubs and retail outlets, including a bicycle shop in the city. Our city centre is changing dramatically, with the loss of national chains. High rental rates and business rates are to blame.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

My hon. Friend is making an excellent speech setting out the key concerns for retailers and other businesses. Does she agree that the average £3,600 increase in rates for small shops over the next five years is contributing to the demise of high streets up and down the country?

[Rachael Maskell]

My hon. Friend makes an excellent point, because it is the small retailers that are really struggling to survive, and it is an issue of survival in the current age. Of course, business rates are at the heart of the decision by businesses as to whether to remain open or close.

Other organisations have been brought to my attention that are even worse affected than those with the 600% increases I have cited. For instance, there are organisations that have had rooftop solar panels installed and then seen their business rates rise by as much as 800%, and all for doing the right thing. The Valuation Office Agency is discussing similar measures for battery storage, all at a time when green energy and microgeneration should be promoted; instead, people are being deterred from doing their bit for the environment.

Let us remind ourselves that business rates are set by multiplying the valuation rate—that valuation rate is based on the market rental value, as if the property was being placed on the open market—by a multiplier set by Government. In England, that is 49.3p, or 48p for small businesses. It cannot be raised by more than the rate of the retail prices index, or the consumer prices index from this year.

There are certain relief schemes in place, three tiers of arrangements to reduce the burden on small businesses, and an array of different arrangements for charities, rural businesses and community sports clubs. Last April, temporary relief was also introduced, with an additional relief fund of £300 million, which was to be shared between local authorities around the country over four years. Pubs with a rateable value above £100,000 were given relief at a flat rate of £1,000, which is subject to current state aid rules. I would like the Minister to examine that specific issue. There are also relief schemes for fibre infrastructure, local newspapers and empty properties.

York received £788,000, but the local council’s governance of the money provided by that fund has been extremely poor. It started with an application process in May to provide grants to businesses that were struggling and that could guarantee—that is, guarantee—they would be sustainable. However, because businesses were unable to give such an assurance, they were unable to apply. In December, the council therefore changed its mind. All businesses with premises that have a rateable value under £200,000 and that had experienced a business rates increase of over 12.5%—except for national chains and local government premises—automatically received a discount, meaning that the council did not even consider hardship issues; the discount was an automatic entitlement. The Government should have provided far better guidance for councils that were handing out taxpayers’ money; the councils really did not have the understanding of what was required of them to support businesses.

This year, York will receive £383,000; next year, it will receive £158,000 and the following year just £23,000. That tapering leaves businesses in an incredibly vulnerable position, without any long-term solutions being provided by the Government. Businesses are crying out for such solutions.

York is not unique, but it does provide the Government with an excellent case study as to why the business rates system is failing. I will provide some examples of the systematic problems that my city is facing.

Retailers in high-value rental areas pay the highest rates, whereas companies selling goods on the internet from warehouses in low-value rental areas pay the lowest. For example, Amazon is the largest retail business in the UK, with a warehouse of 65,000 square feet outside York. In York, Amazon pays £1.4 million in rates. Marks & Spencer in York city centre is seven times smaller in size, but it still pays £500,000 in business rates, or about a third of the amount that Amazon pays.

The smallest stores pay the most. For example, in York city centre small shops pay up to £950 per square metre, whereas larger companies benefit from a special larger store rate of £110 per square metre. If all companies in York paid the same as small businesses in York, Marks & Spencer would have a rateable value of £9 million and Amazon would have a rateable value of £61 million. Across the sector, the perception has grown that the Valuation Office Agency gives large companies favourable treatment to avoid lengthy and costly disputes, and clearly small businesses are suffering.

[Rachael Maskell]

The point my hon. Friend raises is the point of this debate. The reality is that we are talking often about independent business in which families have invested, maybe for generations, building it up and building a reputation, only to find that the competition from online sales and out-of-town stores is challenging. In addition, such businesses then have the weight and burden of business rates to pay on top of high rental values for their properties. The sums simply do not add up, and it is driving them out of town.

That situation is why we are seeing so many closure notices on shops. Some shops have been part of communities for decades and are sadly no longer there. That is certainly true of York. Our communities are losing their identity as a result and that is changing what happens in our town and city centres. I could relate so many stories from York of how independent shops have disappeared to be replaced by vertical drinking establishments and other such premises. That changes the whole context of our city. It is vital that we get on top of the business rates issue.

We have to recognise that businesses are penalised when they try to do the right thing, as equipment adds to the rateable value of business premises. Companies are penalised for making improvements to their businesses. Labour’s manifesto promised to exclude all new investment in plant and machinery from future business rates to encourage investment. We want to see employers investing in the future of their business, but they are deterred. If that investment would put up their rateable value, why take those steps when they are already struggling?

[Ruth George]

Businesses often have to invest in CCTV because of rising crime rates. In doing so, they can help the police by providing footage to help catch offenders, but they are then penalised for doing the right thing and helping tackle crime when their business rates increase due to that investment. Does my hon. Friend agree that that is an anomaly that must be looked at?

[Rachael Maskell]

My hon. Friend makes an excellent point. When people try to improve their community, and not just the business itself, that increases the rateable value. Business rates are built on that premise. In York, a company installed air conditioning. That might seem an obvious thing for a business to do, but doing so increased the rateable value by £275. That business now sees air conditioning as a negative, rather than a positive for itself, its staff and the public.

We have to be honest: business rates are an extremely antiquated system that is not fit for purpose in our globalised digital age. The UK now has the highest level of online shopping in the world, and it is essential that the duty that is paid catches up with that reality. We know that online shopping is increasing because when we go to our high streets, the stores that shoppers want to engage with are no longer there. There are also the wider trends we see across the world.

We need to ensure that we invest back into our city centres to revitalise them and ensure that they keep their identity. That is especially important for a city such as York, which has such a great heritage and attracts 7 million people a year. We want to ensure that people continue to come to our city not only for all the wonderful attractions, but to utilise the vibrant shopping area it once was.

Last April, following the revaluation, the average small shop was hit with an extra £3,663 in rates over the next five years, while many large online retailers saw their rates fall. Large supermarket chains saw a 5.9% reduction in their rateable value. There is huge inequality within the retail sector. Pubs are also being put at risk. They pay 2.8% of the total rates bill, yet contribute only 0.5% of the rate-paying business turnover—an overpayment relative to turnover of £500 million. That figure will increase by 17% by 2021-22.

It has been cited that the transitional relief scheme has been of detriment to some businesses. For instance, House of Fraser saw a 10% rise in business rates last year. As has just been announced, it is looking to close 31 stores, of which 28 have been negatively impacted by the relief scheme. It is clear that huge inequality has grown with the advent of large out-of-town retail centres and the online industry. The business rates system simply does not work in the modern age.

Reform has been called for, not least by the Business, Innovation and Skills Committee, as was, which in 2014 recommended changes to the business rates system. The Committee called that system

“a significant barrier to innovation.”

It recommended a Government review of the system to examine the questions

“whether retail taxes should be based on sales, rather than property; whether the retail sector should have its own form of taxation, calculated in a different way from other businesses; and how frequently the revaluation of Business Rates should take place.”

Since those recommendations were made, York Retail Forum has not been idle. It has carried out a thorough piece of work to look into the alternatives, and it has concluded that the best way forward for its businesses is to have a turnover tax. The Centre for Retail Research has come to the same conclusion. Clearly, if that formula were to be adopted, there would need to be tapering to address businesses with a high turnover but low profits, such as small convenience stores.

Local entrepreneur Phil Pinder, who chairs York Retail Forum, has looked at the figures. When just a 1% levy is placed on all online and high street businesses, the resultant revenue exceeds the current total raised by business rates. Governments gain, small businesses gain, local economies gain, high streets are revitalised, and tax-dodging multinationals such as Amazon have to pay up. While the benefits for Government would be the same, introducing a turnover tax would be like handing thousands of pounds to small businesses and would help them to invest in developing their businesses and employing more staff.

Equally, a profit-based levy would provide for a fair system: the more profit, the more a business would pay proportionately. That is favoured by many businesses, as they believe that nothing could be more equitable, and certain exemptions would not be required. With either model, there could be some tapering, so that those with the greatest returns paid more and those with the least paid less. Social interventions could be made—for instance, some relief for those who invest in microgeneration of energy. There is scope to use the system to drive forward our future economies. Either way, we need to find a new way to bring in revenue from businesses to replace the business rates system—perhaps through another non-domiciliary, property-dependent levy. Whichever system is used, it would clearly be a lot easier to operate, to collect revenue and to reinvest in communities and business growth.

One other point that I must raise in today’s debate is that the Valuation Office Agency is not fit for purpose. It has lost staff; its IT systems are creaking; its programme capability is questionable, having failed businesses; its “check, challenge, appeal” system is not thorough in responding to the grievances of businesses; and its time delays are causing more difficulty for businesses that are already struggling.

That brings me to my key point: the Government have prevaricated for far too long over business rates, and we have on our hands a serious crisis on our high streets. Last year, in the light of the business rates crisis, many of us in Parliament gathered momentum to call for change. On 8 March 2017, a business rates review was announced by the Chancellor. Since then, I have continually asked questions about when that review will begin, and have been passed from pillar to post—from the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government to the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy, and from there to the Treasury. That resulted in my having to raise a point of order with the Speaker to identify who was responsible for what, and even then, discussion ensued on the Government Benches.

Businesses are saying that they cannot wait any longer, and the daily announcements of closures testify that that is the case. The Government have to get on and start their major review of a new business levy. In introducing today’s debate, I am calling time on this broken system on behalf of businesses in my city and up and down the country, and asking the Minister to carry out the following with immediate effect.

First, I ask the Minister to open a complete review of a new business levy system to report in the autumn, with recommendations being made in time to be implemented in this year’s Budget. Secondly, I ask him to open the consultation to all businesses across the economy and to commence the review before the summer. Thirdly, I ask him to identify some case studies to gain an in-depth understanding of why the current system is failing. I suggest York would be a good case study for the Minister to look at, and I am sure other colleagues would be helpful in advising why their communities would provide good examples too.

Fourthly, I ask the Minister to look at the offshore rental market and its impact on our high streets and businesses, and at the extortionate rents that people have to pay. There is often no connection between the local community and the offshore business entrepreneurs who seek to reap as much revenue as they possibly can, at the expense of the high street. We need reparation there, too, because that feeds into the business rates crisis that we see today.

There is an existential crisis on our high streets as they are drained of the vital enterprises that give life and character to our communities. There is no scope for further delay. I urge the Government to bring a laser focus to this issue, and I call on the Minister to act. I trust that he will be willing to meet me and other hon. Members to help move the issue forward for the sake of our communities. There needs to be a radical reform of the system. The Chancellor said it was his desire to move away from a bricks and mortar-based system. The review was promised in the Conservative manifesto, as well as in ours, so progress should not be delayed. Time is running out.

I trust that the Minister will respond clearly to the matters I have raised and tell us what actions he will take to secure a new business levy system that is in place in time for an announcement in the autumn Budget.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Betts]

That was a very helpful intervention. It shows that some very interesting things are going on at a local level. Very often, ideas begin in local government, are tried and tested at a local level, and then are moved on to the whole country. It is very important that we do not simply say that now we want to move away from the whole system, and leave those valuable lessons unlearned and unapplied.

The other point is that there is the capability for even more local control of business rates. In the days when we had domestic and non-domestic rates, councillors set the rates. They were nationalised when the poll tax came in and the control for setting the rate in the pound was moved to national level. That is an argument that we have had on the Select Committee. I would like to move towards more local control eventually and the system is at least capable of doing that. Business rates are also easy to collect and difficult to avoid, and we should see that as quite a strong benefit of the system.

The right hon. Member for East Devon (Sir Hugo Swire) raised some very pertinent concerns about the impact on high streets, which we see whether it is a village, a small town or a major city. We see derelict shops and the change that is happening. The Select Committee is therefore taking evidence in an inquiry on what high streets are going to look like in 2030. We are trying to look ahead to see what change is happening and whether people are planning for it.

A good point was made about the planning system. We ran an inquiry a few years ago on the high street, and it was stark then that very few councils seemed to be adapting their local plans in recognition of the change in shopping habits. Everyone can see it happening, but nobody seemed to be recognising it when they were looking at what town and city centres would be used for in the future. That will be an issue to address.

I know business rates are an issue for some small retailers, and I will come on to a couple of points we ought to address, but I suspect that that is sometimes an excuse when the real issue is the change in shopping habits. People are just changing what they do. Whatever shopping centre it is, people are simply choosing not to go there, or, as has already quite rightly been said, they go to have a look and then buy online. About 30% of retail shopping is now done online. There cannot be that degree of change without an impact on the retail floor space needed. All the signs are that that is going to continue, and I am sure it is one of the issues we will address in our inquiry.

We are also going to look at some of the things being done by retailers and the property owners, such as the company voluntary agreements that are coming out now as retailers try to negotiate their leases effectively, with a bit of pressure. The retailers did sign up to those leases and there are reasons why they did, sometimes on a long-term basis. We are going to have a look at the issues there as well.

We will also look at revaluations, but we have to remember that revaluation is a zero-sum game: it simply changes who pays what and does not actually raise more money. I am not saying that some centres and high streets are not disadvantaged, but somebody somewhere is probably gaining in the system, which is something that we have to think about.

Two points that we have to look at were powerfully raised by my hon. Friend the Member for York Central. In terms of retailing, the change in shopping habits is to businesses that by and large pay very little in business rates. That is absolutely fundamental if we are going to review the system. How do we get from a system that is a bit archaic and a bit stuck in a particular rut, to a situation where we can charge more for those big online retailers, and indeed the out-of-town shopping centres that were mentioned? Why do they pay relatively so little in rates, compared with the often smaller shops on the high street?

[Ruth George]

My hon. Friend is making some excellent points. Does he agree that we need to make sure that we incentivise British businesses that trade in this country and make sure that they cannot be undercut, whether on the high street or online, by companies that are directly importing and often avoiding customs and other charges by doing so?

[Mr Betts]

It is important that we look at those issues in wider taxation. I am not sure we can quite go there this morning, but we certainly need to look at whether we can tax some of those major companies—we know the international conglomerates of online shopping without necessarily having to name them—on the turnover that they have in this country rather than on the profits that they declare, as they move those profits into the lowest- tax countries. Of course that is what happens.

There is a wider tax issue about how we deal with some of those online companies, but in terms of business rates, the unfairness between them and retailers on the high street is very stark, as with out-of-town shopping centres. It always seems unfair. I have a major out-of-town shopping centre in my constituency, Meadow Hall, which provides a great service to people, is incredibly well used and provides a lot of jobs, but nevertheless the rates paid there are not comparable with those paid by many shops in the high street.

We also have to bear it in mind that business rates are not just about retail. Commercial, manufacturing and other businesses pay rates and there are some disparities. One point we picked up was that where manufacturing industry innovates and improves, it gets an increase in business rates on that improvement. There is something odd about taxing improvement in that way. We should also look at that. There are some other strange things, such as hospital trusts trying to claim exemption from business rates, or lower rates, under charitable status. I mean, come on—that is about moving money from one bit of government to another! The hospitals are saying they are not going to pay, but then local authorities do not get the money. The Government have to sort out those issues. There are some nonsenses around.

If there is a review and there are changes, we have to be very clear that, if the Government legislate for those changes nationally, there is a mechanism to compensate local government for any money that it loses collectively. After 2020, that is going to be quite a challenge. My understanding is that when the 75% retention of business rates comes in in 2020, local authorities will receive only council tax and business rates, which will then be redistributed in some form. There will not be a central Government grant, so if central Government are going to compensate local authorities for any change to the business rate system that reduces the amount of money in total going into local authorities, how will they be compensated? That is a challenge we all need to think about.

--- Later in debate ---

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

It is a great pleasure to speak in this debate. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for York Central (Rachael Maskell) for securing it and allowing the very thoughtful discussion from all parts of the House to take place.

I am chair of the all-party small shops group, and I worked for the Union of Shop, Distributive and Allied Workers for longer than I care to remember before coming to this place, so retail holds a very special place in my heart, especially the small businesses that generate the employment that we need, but businesses and employment are under pressure.

We have heard from colleagues from across the House about how the 2015 valuation hit small businesses particularly hard. One convenience retailer in three saw an increase in its rateable value, as I mentioned earlier, and small shops have seen an average increase of £3,600 over five years—an average of more than £700 a year. That really hits their profit margins, which in most cases are already under threat due to changing shopping habits.

We have all heard about the need to support high streets up and down the country, from the city of York to high streets in rural areas such as in Devon, Cornwall and my own area of High Peak. I echo the sentiments of the hon. Member for St Ives (Derek Thomas) about businesses as holiday lets, which is an issue in the Peak district and elsewhere in the country.

Retail is not the only issue. In my area, pubs in particular have seen a huge increase in their business rates due to the change in how they are valued and the turnover basis. For example, the Anglers Rest, a community pub in the small Peak district village of Bamford, was on the verge of closing down but the community came in, took it over and brought that beautiful building back to life. It is one of the only services in the village, but it provides a post office and a village shop, as well as a pub and a café. It keeps that community thriving.

The Anglers Rest is run on a not-for-profit basis and its annual surplus income last year was about £3,000, which was needed for capital expenditure on replacements and doing up the pub. The business rates, however, increased from £11,500 before the revaluation—in effect, the pub had nothing to pay, because it had both rural rate relief from being in the very rural Peak district and small business rate relief—to £21,750, which is a bill for a further £10,000. It does not take someone of the financial stature of the Minister to realise that a surplus income of only £3,000 and a rates bill of more than £10,000 puts that community venture at risk. That is detrimental to the entire community, to which that venture is so important.

Another concern expressed by pubs in my constituency about the turnover basis of the rates is that the valuation goes online, listed among other pubs in their area, and that is seen as a shopping list by criminals looking for cash-heavy businesses. As businesses with high turnovers are being targeted, local pubs are concerned that that could be due to the release of information so readily available online. Criminals are not that stupid; they are quite capable of researching which places take significant amounts of cash.

Will the Minister have a look at that issue, which concerns pubs in my area? We have seen an increase in crime—in till snatches—which is worrying for small businesses and their staff in particular.

That is also why, earlier, I mentioned investment in CCTV. Many businesses feel that they have to make that investment now, either because crime is so high that they need a deterrent or because insurance companies often insist on installation of CCTV and other security measures to make premises viable to insure. Businesses, however, are hit with not just the insurance costs of being a victim of crime, but additional business rates.

I hope to see a system, however it is calculated, that does not penalise businesses for investment. A deterrent could be provided with time-limited exemptions for new developments, and we would see greater investment. The convenience store sector invested £856 million in premises over the past year, and any increase in that investment would benefit not only high streets, but the Exchequer.

Communities would all see the benefit too. The Scottish Government’s growth accelerator scheme, for example, delays increases in business rate bills for 12 months, allowing businesses to recoup their investment at least in the initial year.

I am not sure that turnover-based methodologies will be helpful in the retail sector, in particular for convenience stores and the like, which might have a high turnover but a very low profit margin. Petrol forecourt sites are rated on a turnover basis, which causes discrepancies when retailers invest in a convenience store on the same site. They find that it is rated under the same system, causing huge rating bills, which prevents the forecourt retailers from expanding their businesses to offer services to the whole community, often in areas where there is little retail opportunity.

Another issue is to do with cash machines, as has been said. Access to cash is key, in particular on high streets and in rural areas. Retailers are billed an average of £4,000 for hosting an ATM, which is in addition to the rates payable on their shop. I hope that the Minister will look at free-to-use cash machines because they are extremely important for retailers and do not often lead to an increase in turnover commensurate with their business rates increase. The increased risk of crime that unfortunately arises from hosting ATMs means that businesses in my constituency are reluctant to take one on in areas that are in desperate need of them.

I ask the Minister—I am sure that this is a subject close to his heart—to look at the impact on employment of the turnover basis of rating. Pubs that want to open for a few additional hours to increase their turnover, taking on extra staff and growing their business, are disincentivised by the fact that turnover is the basis of their business rates, as they get no relief for the staff. They simply get taxed additionally on the turnover, whereas business taxation is based on profit.

Finally, the “check, challenge, appeal” scheme is an absolute disaster for businesses that wish to challenge their rateable value. Only one case has got to the appeal stage. By February, we had seen a 90% decline in appeal cases lodged. The check stage requires ratepayers to input details about their properties, which needs significant research on details such as the construction date of the building—quite a challenge for some of the properties in my area. The challenge stage requires ratepayers to provide an alternative valuation and to supply all the evidence needed within four months, which is often quite a hurdle. The appeal stage now requires businesses to pay a refundable £300 fee, or £150 for small businesses, which is another disincentive for businesses to go ahead.

There are plenty of issues for the Minister to look at and, I hope, respond to. I welcome the debate and the chance to speak.

Transport Safety: Blind and Visually Impaired People

Ruth George Excerpts

Wednesday 6th June 2018 Commons Chamber

[Liz Twist]

I very much agree that it is important not only that there is specialised transport, but that all public transport is accessible to people with a visual impairment.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

My hon. Friend is making an important speech and I thank her for doing so. A constituent of mine who is blind asked for rail assist at his local station, but their only response was to give him a leaflet, which he could not read. Does my hon. Friend agree that that is wholly inadequate for people with a visual impairment?

[Liz Twist]

I most certainly agree that that is a real problem. That is an absolutely impossible situation. It is not so much rail assist as not caring about what happens to people with a visual impairment and not thinking it through.

Pavement parking is not just a problem for blind and partially sighted people; it is a real problem for wheelchair users and for parents with prams, buggies or young children in tow, who are often forced on to busy main roads to pass cars. Today, however, I want to focus on Margaret and Laurel and others who are blind. They have worked so hard to gain their independence, but cars parked on the pavement, and other pavement obstructions, are making life difficult for them—and dangerous in some circumstances. As I have said, other forms of transport cause problems, too, so we need to look at bus and rail services as well.

This is not a new problem. It has been talked about many times in this Chamber, but it really is about time that we actually did something to sort it out. I read in Hansard that in 2015 the hon. Member for North Dorset (Simon Hoare) promoted a private Member’s Bill on the issue, but it goes way back beyond that time. That Bill was withdrawn following the Government’s commitment to hold roundtable discussions on the issue of pavement parking in particular, but there has been little or no action.

More recently, Transport Ministers have said that they will look at pavement parking in the context of traffic regulation orders. Over the short time I have been in this House, many hon. Members have questioned Transport Ministers on their plans to tackle pavement parking. The war of attrition seems to be showing modest results, as answers to the questions that I have looked at in Hansard have changed from, “We have no plans to do anything”, to leaving it to local councils to resolve the problem, to now saying, “We will look at how we tackle pavement parking as part of the work on TROs.” But we need faster action and we need more of it, please. We all know and understand the problems—we need to do something about them.

Local authorities can take some actions, such as designating specific areas and streets for no pavement parking, but, to be frank, it is a piecemeal approach to identify streets, go through what can be a long and costly TRO process and then try to enforce TROs at a time when local authorities are very stretched after years of reductions in grant funding. My local authority, Gateshead, has been looking at what it can do to help with the problem but, along with Guide Dogs and many other charities, it has concluded that we need a system like the one that currently operates in London, which allows for a blanket prohibition of pavement parking, but with opt-outs for specific purposes. It is clear and straightforward and does not allow for confusion, but it does give some flexibility when there are genuine reasons why it should be varied.

It will come as no surprise that I have a number of asks of the Minister. I am not going to ask her to sort out the bins—I can do that locally, with the council, thanks—but I have a number of specific asks of the ministerial team. Will the Department for Transport now introduce, as a matter of urgency, a new law on pavement parking, and will it announce a date for the delayed consultation on traffic regulation orders?

Will the Department update the guidance on the use and design of shared spaces? Shared spaces sound like a great idea to get traffic and pedestrians to behave reasonably, recognise each other and consider the needs of all road users, but for blind and visually impaired people they bring real problems, with their lack of kerbs and absence of pedestrian crossings, as the Women and Equalities Committee identified in a report last year.

Will the Department issue statutory guidance to licensing authorities to require that all taxi drivers undertake disability equality training? Margaret and Laurel both told me of situations that they had experienced, one in which a taxi driver had asked for a £25 fee, on top of the fare, to valet his car after the guide dog had been in the vehicle, and others in which drivers had been reluctant to take them with their dog. I know that that is not supposed to happen, but it does.

Will the Department consult on and publish regulations on the accessible information requirement as soon as possible? A Guide Dogs report showed that over a six-month period two thirds of vision-impaired passengers had missed their stop, as Laurel and Margaret have both done. It is really distressing for them and can be dangerous, because they are not sure of where they are or the layout of the area in which they are dropped off. That is really important. The Secretary of State already has the power to make regulations to require bus operators to provide accessible information, including audible and visual information. I understand that a consultation on regulations was planned for early 2017, with a view to the publication of regulations this year, but it has now been delayed and we see no signs of it happening. Can we get that consultation going now, please, so that we can get the regulations in place?

I wish to raise one more issue, which I suspect will be much more contentious. I recently heard about some new train carriages being produced for our railways by Hitachi in Newton Aycliffe that include accessibility features for blind and visually impaired people. That is absolutely great and as it should be, but the Government’s intention to take guards off some train services will compromise the safety of not only blind and partially sighted travellers but other passengers with disabilities. I urge the Government to recognise that point and change their position.

It is well past time that we tackled the problem of pavement parking and other transport issues for blind and visually impaired people, so that I can tell my constituents Margaret and Laurel that we really are addressing their safety on our streets and on public transport.

--- Later in debate ---

[Ms Ghani]

I take the hon. Lady’s point and will reflect on her concerns. An independent task and finish group is looking at taxis and private hire vehicles, and we await its report, which I hope will cover this area. I have a concern about this issue as well. There should be very few exemptions—there should be very good reasons why a driver cannot allow a passenger or guide dog into their cab—and we should be absolutely clear about what those are.

I move on now to talking buses. Audible information on buses is key to enabling disabled passengers to take journeys. Disabled people make 10 times as many journeys by bus as by rail, and it is essential that the service provided should be accessible to them. The provision of audible information on all buses will clearly make a huge difference in this regard, but some passengers have raised concerns that there is too much information on buses and that it confuses them even further, so although some bus companies have already introduced talking buses, they will not be required to do so by law until the relevant power in the Bus Services Act 2017 takes effect. We will consult later this year on the regulations that will bring these powers into force.

I accept that some early adopters of talking buses sometimes fail to provide the correct information or information at the right time to enable a blind or visually impaired person to get off at the right stop, and I appreciate entirely the distress this can cause. It only underlines the need to consult ahead of the legal requirement being introduced. We need clear evidence on how much information is needed, at what point in the journey and how often, and we need to factor it into any appropriate regulations. That will allow us to provide clear, evidence-based and legally mandated standards that all bus operators must meet, and that the Office of the Traffic Commissioners will have responsibility to enforce.

I now move to shared spaces, which are a particular concern for people with visual impairments. There is no single definition of “shared space”, but it generally means a space that has different road users, including vehicles and pedestrians, sharing the street. This might be very good for some people with disabilities, especially those in wheelchairs, but kerbs and controlled pedestrian crossings are sometimes removed, which can be particularly difficult for blind or partially sighted people.

The Disabled Persons Transport Advisory Committee, the Department for Transport’s statutory adviser on accessible travel, has written to me about this to highlight its concerns about shared spaces. In addition, the consultation on the draft accessibility action plan prompted a lot of feedback on this issue. Once again, my father regularly updates me on how such spaces are not working for him. In short, concerns about the safety of shared spaces, particularly for blind or visually impaired people and guide dogs, are coming through loud and clear. In the light of these continuing concerns, the Government are considering what further action might be appropriate and will make this clear when the inclusive transport strategy is published.

We take this issue very seriously, and the strategy will cover most of the issues that the hon. Lady has raised, but whatever action the Government and other authorities take to improve the rights of disabled passengers, it will make a difference only if those rights are effectively enforced. To this end, I recently met the chief executives of transport regulators, including the Office of Rail and Road and the Civil Aviation Authority, and underlined to them their responsibilities for ensuring that disabled passengers receive the services they are entitled to.

[Ruth George]

I want to make a point about Passenger Assist. My visually impaired constituent was simply given a leaflet that was supposed to enable him to travel. Does the Minister agree that that is not acceptable? Although Passenger Assist is available to wheelchair users in my constituency, there are no taxis that can accommodate passengers with wheelchairs. I am trying to arrange for some disabled constituents to visit the Minister in a couple of weeks, but they are having real problems in accessing any sort of public transport.

[Ms Ghani]

The hon. Lady is absolutely right. The purpose of Passenger Assist is to assist passengers with all kinds of disabilities, and handing out a leaflet is just not on. The role of Passenger Assist is to help passengers to reach their destination with the service for which they have paid. I look forward to meeting the hon. Lady and her constituents to discuss that further.

As I have said, I have met the regulators and reminded them of their responsibilities, and of the work they need to do to ensure that redress is available when things go wrong. That is another issue that we must tackle: when laws and regulations are in place, we must ensure that they are enforced.

I thank the hon. Member for Blaydon again for securing a debate on such an important issue, and I look forward to working with her and Members in all parts of the House to achieve our ambition to improve the travelling experiences of blind and visually impaired people.

Question put and agreed to.

Oral Answers to Questions

Ruth George Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd May 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Colleagues can help each other by being very brief, which I am sure they will be.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

With child poverty set to increase by another 1.5 million by 2022, according to the Economic Council for Equality, what will the Treasury be doing to help the very poorest households?

[Elizabeth Truss]

What we have seen in the past few years, since 2015, is a 7% rise in the real wages of people on the lowest incomes, and a reduction in income inequality.

Economic and Fiscal Outlook

Ruth George Excerpts

Monday 30th April 2018 Commons Chamber

[Elizabeth Truss]

My hon. Friend is right. We are switching spending from current spending to investment, and that is why we have a 40-year high in our infrastructure investment. He is absolutely right that any spending increases the national debt. Because of the actions of the previous Labour Government, who spent 45% of GDP in the public sector and built up a huge debt, it is our responsibility to bring the debt down and make sure that the country gets back in balance.

[Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab)]

Bearing that strategy in mind, how does the Minister explain the fact that the debt has risen from 73% of GDP in 2010 to nearly 90% now, so it is higher than both France’s and Germany’s? Our debt was below those countries’ at the end of a Labour Government who had invested in public services, bailed out the banks and saved people’s savings.

[Elizabeth Truss]

I find it absolutely astonishing that the hon. Lady would say that, given that her party is planning to spend half a trillion pounds, increasing our debt. She has obviously not read the speeches of the shadow Chancellor and the shadow Chief Secretary. The 20% increase in debt that Labour is proposing would make us much more vulnerable to external shocks. The fact is that we have spent the past eight years repairing the damage done to the economy by profligate spending by Labour Members who did not fix the roof while the sun was shining.

[Elizabeth Truss]

I thank my hon. Friend for making that point. Labour Members seem to believe that by spending more money and borrowing more, we can reduce debt. That simply does not add up. Under Labour’s plans, we would be vulnerable to an external crisis, as we were when it was last in office in 2009. The Labour party seems to welcome that prospect. The shadow Chancellor said that the 2008 economic crash was a “capitalist crisis” for which he had been waiting for a generation. We have a Labour party that is actively planning a run on the banks if it gets into office.

[Ruth George]

Will the right hon. Lady give way?

[Elizabeth Truss]

I have already given way to the hon. Lady.

Ten years ago, under Labour, we were in the grip of a financial crisis and scared for the future. It was a period of profligacy, when Labour was spending money we did not have. The state was 45% of GDP, and we saw the longest increase in debt since the Napoleonic wars. It crowded out the private sector, and youth unemployment was on the rise.

We have worked away at the deficit, replenished the public purse and got people back into work, and all while maintaining Britain’s world-class public services. This report shows our sound public finances and our growing economy. [Interruption.] It is a shame that those on the shadow Front Bench seek to talk down our excellent public services. What this debate shows us is that it is vital we stick to the course.