Oral Answers to Questions

Peter Luff Excerpts

Monday 19th December 2011 Commons Chamber

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab)]

5. What expenditure on the Trident replacement he expects to have incurred by 2016.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Peter Luff)]

We expect to spend £3.9 billion on the successor submarine programme by the maingate decision-point in 2016. We have deferred the decision on the future warhead until the next Parliament. We are spending around £900 million a year at AWE—the Atomic Weapons Establishment—on capital investment and running costs to ensure that we can sustain the capabilities to maintain the current stockpile. As a consequence of this sustainment, we will also have the capability to design and produce a new warhead, should that be required. We expect to spend around £8 million over the next three years to examine the condition of the physical infrastructure at the naval bases and current communications systems for the successor submarines.

[Jeremy Corbyn]

By the Minister’s own figures, the Government are proposing to spend £5 billion on the submarine replacement and the preparations for a new missile system from AWE Aldermaston, which means that after the next election the new Parliament will be confronted with the decision whether to renew the Trident system, having already spent £5 billion on it. Does the Minister not think that we are walking—indeed, sleepwalking—into a massive expenditure, after that, of £25 billion on a replacement, plus the running costs? Is it not time we brought this vanity project to an end and cancelled the Trident system?

[Peter Luff]

No, I do not think that at all. In fact, not spending that money would prevent us from preserving the option for the next Parliament to take the decision. The hon. Gentleman is fond of pointing out the problems in respect of the capability for the nuclear deterrent, but let me assure him that the work we are undertaking will have benefits for other classes of nuclear submarines in future— particularly in respect of the primary propulsion systems, for example with the PWR3. There are real benefits from doing this work—not just for the security of the nation in the short term, but for the long term as well.

[Dr Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con)]

Given that both the Polaris and Trident submarines came in on budget and on time, is that not a good precedent for the successor system? Will the Minister take the opportunity to repeat in resounding terms the assurance that the Prime Minister gave to Conservative MPs when the coalition was formed—that Trident will be renewed, whether the Liberal Democrats like it or not?

[Peter Luff]

I believe that, notwithstanding the views of the hon. Member for Islington North (Jeremy Corbyn), no programme is subject to greater scrutiny in the House than the nuclear deterrent. That is one of the reasons for the accuracy of our costings. Let me assure my hon. Friend that the primary responsibility for our nation is the security of the country, that the nuclear deterrent is the ultimate guarantee of the country’s security, and that we stand firmly behind it.

[John Woodcock (Barrow and Furness) (Lab/Co-op)]

Will the Minister tell us how many Government staff are working on his review of alternatives to the Trident system, when he now expects the review to end, and whether he has reached a final conclusion on whether its findings will be published?

[Peter Luff]

I cannot tell the hon. Gentleman off the top of my head exactly how many Government colleagues are involved in the review, but I will write to him about it. What I can tell him is that its findings will be available towards the end of next year for the Prime Minister and the Deputy Prime Minister to consider, and that, given that it will constitute a full and frank exploration of the alternative systems at a highly classified level, there are no plans to publish either the report or the information on which it draws. However, we are a long way from the end of the review, and it is therefore premature to speculate on how the final assessment might be used once it has been completed.

[Tessa Munt (Wells) (LD)]

What is the point of having a review if no one, except a select few, has an opportunity to look at its findings? Should not the Liberal Democrats, in particular, be allowed some access to that information? [Interruption.]

[Peter Luff]

As my hon. Friend the Minister for the Armed Forces says, I was of the view that the Deputy Prime Minister was a Liberal Democrat—and he will see the report.

[Eric Ollerenshaw (Lancaster and Fleetwood) (Con)]

8. What arrangements were included in the recent memorandum of understanding with Turkey.

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[Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab)]

10. What assessment he has made of the likely effects on the defence sector of the aircraft carrier programme.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Peter Luff)]

Having visited Govan and Rosyth to see the Queen Elizabeth class carriers under construction, I know that the project is good news for the UK defence industry. It is anticipated that 7,000 to 8,000 jobs will be created or sustained at the tier 1 shipyards, with a further 2,000 to 3,000 jobs in the wider supply chain. Apprenticeship schemes have also been reinvigorated, with nearly 800 apprentices now involved in the project. Some £1.35 billion-worth of equipment subcontracts have been placed, the majority of which have been awarded to more than 75 different UK companies spanning the length and breadth of the UK. With an expected 50-year service life, there will be continued opportunities for UK companies to benefit from this project.

[Mr Cunningham]

I am sure that companies such as Rolls-Royce will welcome the Minister’s statement, but does he agree with the First Sea Lord that if a British aircraft carrier had been available during the Libyan mission, it would have been most cost-effective and efficient to use it?

[Peter Luff]

Actually, I do not fully agree with that. A carrier might well have been deployed, but the aircraft that were necessary to deploy the missiles we needed were the Tornados and Typhoons, and they did a first-rate job. That proved that the Government made the right judgment in the strategic defence and security review by deciding on a gap in respect of that particular capability.

[Sir Menzies Campbell (North East Fife) (LD)]

Does the Minister recall that an important factor in the decision to continue with the construction of the two aircraft carriers was the availability of the F-35, the joint strike fighter? Is he aware of reports that there is a delay in its development programme? What will be the impact on the effectiveness of the carrier force if there are no aircraft to fly off them?

[Peter Luff]

The world is full of rumours about the future of the F-35 programme; I hear a new one almost every day. It is true that a lot of questions are being asked, and those aircraft are very important to carrier strike capability, but I shall wait to see what actually happens, rather than joining in the speculation.

[Alison Seabeck (Plymouth, Moor View) (Lab)]

In a written answer to me, the Minister put the estimated cost of converting one of the carriers to the catapult and arrestor system at about £1 billion. Can he therefore tell us whether the Chancellor’s announcement in the autumn statement of real-terms cuts in respect of procurement issues of almost £30 billion, extending into the first two years of the next Parliament, is apt, or whether the Prime Minister’s promise of a real-terms increase in defence spending of 1% will apply to this and other major projects?

[Peter Luff]

I can confirm that nothing has happened to our commitment to increase the equipment budget by 1% in real terms from 2015. I have to say that our job would be a great deal easier if the previous Government had not taken the decision to delay the carriers, thus adding an extra £1.3 billion of costs to the programme with no capability gain whatsoever.

[John Mann (Bassetlaw) (Lab)]

11. When he expects UK troops to be withdrawn from Afghanistan.

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[Andrew Stephenson (Pendle) (Con)]

12. What steps he is taking to support research and development of military capability in the aerospace sector.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Peter Luff)]

I am committed to providing sustained support for science and technology across all aspects of defence. The Ministry of Defence has and will continue to invest in the aerospace sector, developing capability and undertaking research into new ideas. As part of that ongoing investment, I am pleased to announce today that we have placed a £40 million four-year research contract with BAE Systems to explore critical technologies and key systems integration for the UK’s next generation of highly capable air systems. The future combat air system research contract is expected to include significant benefits for the wider UK supply base.

[Andrew Stephenson]

I thank the Minister for that answer and, in particular, for the good news about BAE Systems. However, many companies based in Pendle and Lancashire are small and medium-sized enterprises. Will the Minister say a little more about what he is doing specifically to support SMEs in the aerospace sector?

[Peter Luff]

We have plans to do more to help SMEs and I had hoped to announce them in the White Paper that I was due to publish this month, but the pressure of Christmas business has delayed that until the new year. I can assure my hon. Friend that there will be good news in that for the SME sector and I also reiterate what I said in my original answer: the future combat air system contract will bring real benefits to small and medium-sized enterprises in the UK, including, I am sure, in my hon. Friend’s constituency.

[Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op)]

Does the Minister acknowledge that the British aerospace industry and sector are vital to British manufacturing and that the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills is at this moment conducting a rationalisation of procurement methods? Will he have an intelligent conversation with BIS about how procurement can be longer reaching and longer term in the defence industry?

[Peter Luff]

All my conversations with BIS are intelligent.

[Diana Johnson (Kingston upon Hull North) (Lab)]

14. What assessment he has made of the advice from the Armed Forces Pay Review Body; and if he will make a statement.

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[Harriett Baldwin (West Worcestershire) (Con)]

T3. Cyber-security is an integral part of the nation’s defences, so may I invite the new Defence Secretary to visit the wide range of cyber-security firms located in cyber valley in Malvern in my constituency?

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Peter Luff)]

The Secretary of State and I have just carved up our diaries and I, as the Minister responsible for industry, equipment and science, will be prepared to make the long and arduous journey from Mid Worcestershire to West Worcestershire to visit those firms, hopefully at an early date.

[Paul Flynn (Newport West) (Lab)]

What steps is the Secretary of State taking to reduce tension between the west and Iran, as there is a possibility of a war between our two countries, the consequences of which would be unimaginable?

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[Alex Cunningham (Stockton North) (Lab)]

I am pleased that companies including Darchem Engineering in Stillington in my constituency still have contracts related to the new aircraft carriers, but with which of our partner nations’ carriers will the new carrier-variant aircraft be interoperable?

[Peter Luff]

One major gain of moving to the carrier-variant joint strike fighter is enhanced interoperability with our United States allies, in particular, but there will also be interoperability with the French. The change produces real opportunities for interoperability.

[Mary Macleod (Brentford and Isleworth) (Con)]

T6. I have recently urged Hounslow council to review its banding criteria for council housing for ex-service personnel. What discussions has my right hon. Friend had with the Department for Communities and Local Government and the Minister for Housing and Local Government to ensure that there is provision for ex-service personnel, who have done so much for this country?

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[Caroline Lucas (Brighton, Pavilion) (Green)]

May I press the Minister for more detailed figures on the capacity being built at Aldermaston for a possible new warhead? When will he announce the specific breakdown of costs associated with that and, in particular, with the Octans and Orchard programmes, and will he do so through a statement to the House, rather than by slipping it out in a written answer?

[Peter Luff]

I do not know how often one has to say this: no expenditure at the Atomic Weapons Establishment is being incurred to enable a new warhead; it is to sustain the security of the existing stockpile. I do wish the hon. Lady would get this into her head: no money is being spent on new warheads.

[Mr John Baron (Basildon and Billericay) (Con)]

T9. The Secretary of State will understand the significance of the fact that only 3% of Afghan security forces are from the Pashtun south, particularly when it comes to how successful our handover will be in 2014. What progress is being made to improve the imbalance in ethnicities before our troops withdraw?