Ukraine and Georgia

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Wednesday 15th May 2024 Commons Chamber

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

We are all rightly proud of the skills of our armed forces personnel and the training that they are providing for Ukrainians through Operation Interflex, but I understand that that programme is only designated up until this summer. Can the Minister confirm that it will continue for as long as it is needed?

[Leo Docherty]

Wholeheartedly, Mr Speaker. Our commitment to training our Ukrainian allies is enduring, and of course, we will always respond to the type and form of training that they themselves require.

Defence Spending

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Wednesday 24th April 2024 Commons Chamber

[Grant Shapps]

I thank my hon. Friend and add my condolences to those already conveyed by others. Frank Field was a great statesman with really innovative ideas about welfare reform, which it took this Government to enact, and he is a great loss to us all.

I entirely agree with my hon. Friend about our leadership in NATO in getting to 2.5%. I was talking about that to the Secretary-General of NATO yesterday. We must ensure that 2.5% is the new level at which people operate. If they did—if everyone joined us at 2.5%—there would be £135 billion per annum more in the collective NATO budget, which would make a huge difference.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

Labour is absolutely committed to reaching 2.5%, and we welcome the additional £500 million for Ukraine, but time is of the essence. What is the Secretary of State doing to speed up the delivery of much-needed military supplies to the frontline in Ukraine?

[Grant Shapps]

I warmly welcome the hon. Lady’s comments, and I hope very much that those on her Front Bench, who have not attached themselves to the timeline that she urges, have listened closely to what she has said. As for the delivery of items to the frontline, we will be very fast; we will deliver in a matter of days or weeks quite a lot of the items outlined in the very extensive package announced yesterday, although they come in a number of different forms and some, by their physical nature, will take longer to deliver than others.

Ukraine: Military Equipment

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Tuesday 27th February 2024 Commons Chamber

[James Cartlidge]

My hon. Friend as ever asks an excellent question. As he highlighted, this has to be an international effort. There is a tendency to overplay the negative voices, but my experience from international meetings is of an overwhelming consensus, from small nations to large nations, and of a huge desire to keep supporting Ukraine in every way possible. Obviously, the role of the US is fundamental. I can give him the assurance that we will work with the British defence industry to ramp up production. We will be bringing forward a munitions strategy soon and the goal of always-on production will be most in the interests of both the military and our defence sector.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

Along with colleagues from across the House, I have just returned from a sobering visit to Ukraine, during which we heard about what some refer to as “the slow yes” from a number of our allies on providing military supplies. That is costing lives on the frontline and limiting military options. Will the Minister tell us what specific recent efforts the Government have made to convey a real sense of urgency to key allies? Will he urge his Cabinet colleagues to redouble their efforts in this respect?

[James Cartlidge]

I assure the hon. Lady that at every international meeting and engagement we attend, whether multilaterally or bilaterally, we do everything possible to encourage our allies to join us in support. As I said in answer to the previous question, although there is a tendency to pick out negative voices, the overwhelming consensus among our allies is to want to support and do more. There will always be a debate about how quickly we can get stuff into line. We have done everything possible to get our support out as quickly as possible, including predating the war itself, so we can be proud of our efforts. I am acutely aware that we need to do more, particularly in concert with our allies.

Oral Answers to Questions

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Monday 8th January 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mrs Emma Lewell-Buck (South Shields) (Lab)]

22. What steps he is taking to increase military support to Ukraine.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

24. What steps he is taking to increase military support to Ukraine.

[The Secretary of State for Defence (Grant Shapps)]

We continue to support Ukraine’s priorities, including air defence to protect national infrastructure, further artillery ammunition, and support to sustain capabilities, including 10,000 Ukrainians to be trained in the first half of 2024.

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[Grant Shapps]

I really hope that there can be no doubt about this Government’s commitment to Ukraine. Not only were we first with the training, but with tanks, missiles and commissioning to enable Ukraine to continue this fight in all manner of different ways. On a personal level, having had a family of three Ukrainians live with us in my house for a year, I am personally committed to this cause as well. We are doing everything possible, including working throughout the Christmas and new year period during which I had numerous conversations with my Ukrainian opposite number and others throughout its Government, to make sure we are supporting their action. It is a Ukrainian plan that is needed to win this war, not a British or American one.

[Dame Nia Griffith]

Labour fully supports providing military aid to Ukraine, but what steps is the Secretary of State taking to speed up the development of a stockpile strategy, in collaboration with NATO allies, to replenish supplies and ensure that Ministry of Defence procurement and parts of the defence industry are on an urgent operational footing both to support Ukraine for the long term and to rebuild UK stocks for any future conflict?

[Grant Shapps]

The hon. Lady is absolutely right. We already have a huge amount of military munitions and equipment on order both to replenish and to help continue to support Ukraine. When it comes to Ukraine itself, the United Kingdom set up the international fund for Ukraine, through which we have numerous different orders in place for equipment for Ukraine, which has raised nearly £800 million. I think up to £400 million is already committed through those contracts.

Former Afghan Special Forces: Deportation

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Monday 11th December 2023 Commons Chamber

[James Heappey]

The House may think that I am speaking relatively plainly in response to these questions. Undoubtedly, a significant number of people who served in the Afghan national security forces, like the person the hon. Gentleman referred to, are in mortal danger as a consequence of having served in the Afghan army, air force or special forces. It is also a reality that no country has set up a relocation scheme that extends beyond those who worked directly for that country and that verifies the service of those people, unless directly alongside the UK special forces or UK intelligence communities. That is extraordinarily hard. I would like to sit down with the hon. Gentleman, who is a great champion of this cause, to talk through the case that he knows of. There is no point pretending that there are not many others. But there is also the reality of how hard it is to verify the service of those who just served in the unit rather than explicitly alongside UK personnel.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

Given the contrast between the rhetoric and promises of resettlement, and the shambolic reality facing many Afghans who worked for us, with us or fought alongside our troops, as detailed by many Members across the House, what assessment has the Minister made of the likely impact of his apparent bad faith on the willingness of foreign nationals to offer us their assistance in future?

[James Heappey]

I push back on the idea that this is all some sort of failure. The reality is that we have moved out very nearly 14,000 people. We have continued to do so against incredible difficulties in Afghanistan and while needing to work very carefully alongside the Pakistan Government to meet their requirements, so I do not accept that initial characterisation. As for the hon. Lady’s wider question about what impact the scheme may have on our ability to work with partner forces and locally employed civilians in future, I would turn the question round the other way. My grave concern is that, while I think we are doing the right thing by those we served with and alongside in Afghanistan because of the circumstances of our departure from Afghanistan, if we set the precedent where every time our military works anywhere in the world those who work for us or alongside us in a partner force have an expectation of immigration rights in the UK, that will make it incredibly difficult to operate. That was not the question she asked, but I think the counterfactual is equally worth considering.

Ukraine

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Tuesday 28th November 2023 Commons Chamber

[James Heappey]

Absolutely. There is a military line of endeavour, but so too there is a diplomatic and economic one. The Minister for Europe—the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Affairs, my hon. Friend the Member for Aldershot (Leo Docherty)—was on the Front Bench to hear my right hon. Friend’s question. My right hon. Friend is absolutely right to note the importance of advancing on all fronts with equal vigour.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

The renewed attacks on Kyiv at the weekend and the threats to power plants remind us how widespread the impact of the war is on Ukraine. Could the Minister update us on what recent talks he or ministerial colleagues have had with Ukrainian Ministers about recovery and reconstruction? Can he give details of what the UK is doing to help now?

[James Heappey]

The Prime Minister and other Ministers, including the Defence Secretary—this mostly sits in other Departments—meet the Ukrainians all the time to discuss exactly that issue. Indeed, the new Foreign Secretary was in Kyiv only last week. It is hugely important that alongside Ukraine’s military resilience, its economy and democracy remain equally resilient and are not strangled out of existence, which would undermine the existence of the state of Ukraine just as much as any military failure. In answering the previous question, I noted that it is important that we advance on all fronts, that we support Ukraine militarily, and that we help Ukraine to maintain resilience and even growth within its economy. It is important globally that a key part of that economy—the export of grain—flows as freely as possible, hence the amount of effort we are putting into the western Black sea.

Oral Answers to Questions

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Monday 11th September 2023 Commons Chamber

[Catherine West (Hornsey and Wood Green) (Lab)]

19. What steps he is taking to help support Afghan nationals eligible for resettlement under the Afghan relocations and assistance policy scheme.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

22. What steps he is taking to help support Afghan nationals eligible for resettlement under the Afghan relocations and assistance policy scheme.

[The Minister for Armed Forces (James Heappey)]

The Ministry of Defence’s priority remains the relocation of ARAP-eligible Afghans to the safety of third countries at best pace. His Majesty’s Government continue to accommodate and support ARAP-eligible people in third countries while they await relocation to the United Kingdom.

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[James Heappey]

The Member for Warwick and Leamington (Matt Western) asked a very particular question about Afghan service personnel, as the record will show. I answered it, but I will need to go away and confirm, because that is not something that ARAP is intended to meet and we will need to see if we can find those statistics. The hon. Lady asks how many applicants have been removed from hotels. The plan is to remove all ARAP applicants from hotels, because they are not here illegally; they have not arrived on boats across the channel. They are entitled to be here, they have access to full universal credit and housing benefit, and much more importantly, they have the right to work immediately on arrival. Our priority, unapologetically—I hope she agrees that this is the right approach—is to get people out of hotels and into houses where they can get on with the life that they so deserve here in the UK as legal citizens.

[Dame Nia Griffith]

It is hardly in the spirit of Operation Warm Welcome that, as the second anniversary of the evacuation of Kabul passed, Afghans who supported our armed forces were still left crowded into hotels at the taxpayer’s expense, or expected to move hundreds of miles from where they have managed to find employment and their children have settled into schools. When does the Minister now expect all Afghans in the schemes to be moved out of hotels and given suitable offers of accommodation?

[James Heappey]

I actually agree with the hon. Lady—her question stands in contrast with the previous one, because it was about the need to get people out of hotels, not suggesting that they should somehow be staying in them. The Minister for Veterans’ Affairs has been leading on this task around Government. Few in this House have more emotional energy to drive that mission than he does. He sees it as of huge importance that people are moved out of hotels and allowed to get on with their lives as quickly as possible. I will ask his office to write to the hon. Lady with the exact detail of when he hopes to see the job done.

Oral Answers to Questions

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Monday 15th May 2023 Commons Chamber

[Mr Wallace]

NATO has done a lot of work—not only from February last year when the invasion started—to ensure that it is ready and to use that readiness to deter Russia on NATO’s borders. That is incredibly important. To date, we have not seen any deliberate strikes into a NATO country by Russia. While we have seen deeply provocative events in the Black sea, Russia has so far been respecting those NATO borders.

The most important thing is to ensure that President Putin realises he cannot win this war in Ukraine. His brutality is having the opposite effect—it has driven two new nations into NATO—and the west, including the United Kingdom and Germany, as I saw in an announcement, is stepping up more and more to ensure that Ukraine has success on the battlefield so that it can negotiate, if it wishes, from a position of strength.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

We on the Opposition side stand firmly behind and support Ukraine. However, Ukraine is depleting our military stockpiles, and the Government seem to be acting too slowly to replenish them. What progress has the Secretary Of State made on a stockpile strategy? What talks has he had with NATO allies about their replenishment plans to ensure the most effective sequencing of replenishment?

[Mr Wallace]

The hon. Lady makes an important point that is common not just to the United Kingdom but across Europe. Ukraine has woken everyone up to issues such as ammunition stocks. The first challenge was to wake up that supply chain. Many of the orders we had placed were filled, and the supply chain went on to do something else. We have now placed orders for new NLAWs. Let us remember the anti-tank weapons and new anti-aircraft missiles from Thales in Northern Ireland in conjunction with our Swedish and, I think, Finnish colleagues. We are in the process of, hopefully, awarding a contract to replenish 155 mm shells. At the same time, I have worked across the international community to make sure that we stimulate those supply chains and to make sure that Ukraine does, as well.

Oral Answers to Questions

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Monday 30th January 2023 Commons Chamber

[James Heappey]

The Government have already committed the same amount of money for this year as it did for last year, so in that sense the job is already done. Of course, how this year’s money is used will depend very much on what is going on on the ground. That is the most important part of the gifting programme. The relationship between the UK and Ukraine is now so strong that we are able to discuss very candidly each other’s plans and make sure that we support Ukraine every step of the way.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

We heard before Christmas that the Government had finally signed a contract to replenish NLAWs—next-generation light anti-tank weapons—but, in order to ensure that we can continue to be a leader in the international effort in Ukraine, how many other contracts have been signed to replace the consumable military aid that has been sent to Ukraine?

[James Heappey]

High-velocity missiles have already been placed on contract. Many of the other systems that have been donated were already in the process of being updated and were gifted when they were coming to the end of their life within our current inventory, and thus would not be expected to be placed on contract because they are part of a routine procurement process.

Ukraine

Nia Griffith Excerpts

Thursday 22nd September 2022 Commons Chamber

[Stewart Malcolm McDonald]

Yes, I think we can come together and agree on that. I am sure that other colleagues will want to discuss it in great detail.

So here we are, seven months on from this invasion, and—as was mentioned by the former Prime Minister—much in the world has changed. Sweden and Finland have joined NATO, unity among western countries is something like never before, and, indeed, unity in this House is something like never before. In fact, we may have been only partly joking with our Ukrainian counterparts, during a recent visit, in saying that supporting Ukraine might well be the only issue that unites this House. Given the noises coming from the new Government, I suspect that that will be even more the case, but it is important for that unity to be maintained and developed in support of Ukraine.

Back in February the German Federal Chancellor, Olaf Scholz, told us that not just his country but all of Europe was at a turning point: a Zeitenwende, as they say in Germany. Seven months on, however, it seems to me less like a turning point and more like Gramsci’s interregnum, in which the old is dying but the new cannot yet be born. At the moment, we are in a messy flux. While I think that the unity of purpose that we have is serving us well to get through the tumult that we are going through and Ukraine is going through, I also think that there is much in our own record—the record of all of us in the House and across the west—that we need to assess, going back, yes, to 2014, but also to 2008. I have to say to the former Prime Minister that we should consider the issue of how Russian money has been treated in this country.

I think it takes a lot to admit it when one has got things wrong, and I think it only fair that we, as staunch partisans at times, give our opponents the space to make that admission. It is easier said than done, but if the new world that is incubating in the messy time in which we are currently living is to be born, that is the way in which I think we have to approach it.

There is another important point to be made. As the winter bites and energy prices go through the roof, and as what in some quarters has been called “Ukraine fatigue” may start to settle in, there is a particular group of people in society of whom I think we should be mindful: those whom the Germans call the Putinversteher, the “Putin whisperers”, who would seek to apologise for, or contextualise, or somehow make excuses for Russian “legitimate” interests in Ukraine. They should be thoroughly ignored. Since the February invasion, they have, temporarily and rather embarrassingly, been silent, but they are undoubtedly starting to rear their heads again.

[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

Does the hon. Gentleman accept that many of those people are being fed by Putin’s cyber-warfare and that this country and our allies really need to invest in counter-offensive material?

[Stewart Malcolm McDonald]

Yes, I agree. The hon. Lady is absolutely spot on. One of the most insidious arguments from that particular group—and they can be found on the extreme left or the extreme right, in every country and in Parliaments, National Assemblies, the media, think-tanks and elsewhere—is that we should stop arming Ukraine. I am sure that I speak for everyone that I was in Ukraine with recently when I say that we could see and hear up close what a difference arming Ukraine is making.

That support has to continue for three main reasons, which I will outline as briefly as possible. First, I do not believe that it is possible to negotiate with Vladimir Putin. We should look at his record not just in Ukraine right now but in Georgia and Syria. This is a Government who practise the famous double-tap strike, whereby the Russian armed forces hit an area, wait for the first responders to arrive and then hit it again. I do not think that it is possible to negotiate with a regime that carries itself in that way.

The former Prime Minister is absolutely right to say—this is another important point—that anything we do going forward has to be on President Zelensky’s terms. Ukrainians do not want to negotiate with the regime in the Kremlin. We only have to look at the sheer joy on their faces when Ukrainian armed forces turn up in their towns and villages to liberate them and save them what has been experienced in Bucha, Mariupol and Kherson. The emotional scenes that we have seen and, I am sure, will continue to see tell us that we have got our support for Ukraine right. They should also put paid to the ideas of extremists—that is the only way to describe them—who would seek to divvy up Ukraine on a map. I would love to hear them tell me which towns they would like to see handed over to the Kremlin.

When we were in Ukraine, we met a young 15-year-old guy and his father. I am sure that Members will have read about Andriy Pokrasa and his father. When Russians were surrounding his village, he had the bravery and ingenuity to launch his own drone into the air to take photographs of Russian positions and send them to the Ukrainian armed forces. Members can imagine what happened to those Russian positions soon afterwards. He is now back at school studying. It was an honour to meet him. I would love to see one of these armchair extremists tell him that he should instead have gone out and negotiated with the Russians at the end of his street. Imagine what would have happened had he been caught. They knew the danger, but still they did everything they could to defend not just their own hometown but their country as well.

Lastly, the war is not just a war on territory. It is a war on values, liberalism, democracy, sovereignty and everything that we have cherished since 1945. I do not think that that is the kind of thing that can be negotiated away lightly. The Putin whisperers must be ignored. They must feel the complete contempt of those of us who want to see Ukraine win. The war could stop tomorrow if Russia stopped fighting, but if Ukraine stops fighting, the country will cease to exist. A Russian victory would be a disaster for everyone in Europe, and it is something that we should not even consider. Russian soldiers and now this latest group of conscripts will be fighting solely for their wages, while Ukrainian soldiers fight for their future and for ours. We all remain united in this House. Ukraine must win. We must continue to support them. And it is in that vein that I offer that support to the Government this afternoon.

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[Dame Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab)]

For years, countries in eastern Europe such as Poland and the Baltic states have been warning about Russia under Putin. We absolutely must recognise the gravity, scale and multifaceted nature of the threat and the lengths that Putin may go to.

While we have some encouraging bits of news, with terrain retaken in eastern Ukraine, we must not underestimate the scale of the challenges that remain. There is still extensive terrain to reconquer, the war efforts are taking a toll both on military personnel and on civilians, and Putin continues in his efforts to sow alienation and give false legitimacy to his invasion through the so-called referenda. A huge effort is also required to rebuild ruined towns and devastated communities.

Putin’s clear aim is to divide and conquer, so while the world is looking at the physical—the ground war and the threat of nuclear weapons—there is at the same time a huge propaganda war, sometimes more subtle and sometimes less so, trying to undermine the west’s unity and resolve, with internet users bombarded with clever false messages masquerading as the truth. I stress again to the Minister how important it is for the UK and allies to invest in combating internet warfare and mounting counter-offensives.

We need renewed efforts at diplomacy and at fostering unity. It is very important that we are putting money where our mouth is and supporting efforts in Ukraine. It is absolutely vital that we stand firm on sanctions, but we must foster the most positive and unified response from other countries. That includes, of course, investing Foreign Office expertise.

This is not just about Europe and NATO. In the wider world, how do we maintain world peace and deal with the bullies? First, we need to be strong and show strength. Appeasement does not work. In 2014, after the invasion of Crimea, the lack of action by the west was a monumental failure. We need to stand strong in the face of aggression. For all their imperfections, we need to rebuild our respect for international organisations such as the United Nations, and repair the damage caused by Trump when he belittled international organisations, tore up treaties and cut funding to important international programmes.

An important part of that international work is the need to tackle the gap between richer and poorer nations. Nations across the globe need reason to buy into international organisations and to feel that they are being heard. Coronavirus has taught us how interconnected we are, but that is also true in respect of security. We need to build up resilience and prosperity in developing nations, to stop them being used and manipulated by the world’s tyrants.

While continuing our direct support for Ukraine, we must also focus on fostering unity among our allies and taking a lead in world organisations to stand firm against Putin.