Animal Welfare (Livestock Exports) Bill  

Neil Hudson Excerpts

Monday 15th January 2024 Commons Chamber

[The Minister for Food, Farming and Fisheries (Mark Spencer)]

I am delighted to speak to the amendments and grateful to hon. Members for their continued interest and engagement in ensuring that this ban on live animal exports for slaughter is effective and comprehensive. The question of which species should be included in the ban is indeed crucial and is one to which we have given careful consideration. When we carried out a wide-ranging consultation on banning live exports in 2020, we were clear about the species that we were seeking to apply the ban to. We received no evidence then, and have received none since, that a ban on other species was at all necessary.

In the 10 years prior to EU exit, the live export trade for slaughter and for fattening mainly involved sheep and unweaned calves. The numbers of deer, llamas and alpacas kept in the UK are extremely low compared with the species for which a significant slaughter export trade had existed in the past. For example, the June 2021 agriculture census records showed that there were about 45,000 farmed deer, 12,000 alpacas and 1,000 llamas in the United Kingdom, compared with 33 million sheep and 10 million cattle. About 35,000 cattle and 220,000 sheep are slaughtered every week in England and Wales.

I can reassure the hon. Member for Westmorland and Lonsdale (Tim Farron), who is not in his place, on his concerns in relation to his amendment about reindeer. Although reindeer are kept in the UK, they are not really farmed, and they are small in number. Of course, they are imported mostly for use in visitor attractions, especially at Christmas.

We are not aware that any species proposed in the amendments are exported for slaughter or for fattening. It is important to make that distinction: we are talking about the export of animals for slaughter and for fattening. The numbers of llamas and alpacas might be increasing, but they are not consumed as meat in the United Kingdom. Although there is no evidence of demand for trade in live exports from the EU to elsewhere, the definition of relevant livestock covers all live exports where major animal welfare concerns have been identified and a trade existed in the past.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

The Minister is detailing the species involved in the Bill and those potentially not involved. I heard what my friends in the Democratic Unionist party said about animal health and welfare issues in Northern Ireland, and I am sympathetic, not least on the supply of veterinary medicines in Northern Ireland. Although the point has been made that there have not been live exports from the mainland since Brexit, the Environment Food and Rural Affairs Committee has taken much evidence from World Horse Welfare—horse is a species included in the Bill—that hundreds if not thousands of horses have been illegally exported to Europe under the guise of sport or breeding when they were actually for slaughter. This welcome Bill will stop that illegal movement of horses.

[Mark Spencer]

I pay tribute to my hon. Friend for not only his comments but his campaigning against the export of horses for slaughter. He is a tenacious campaigner in this area and I pay tribute to him for his work.

Storm Henk

Neil Hudson Excerpts

Monday 8th January 2024 Commons Chamber

[Robbie Moore]

Back in 2010, 40% of all energy in this country was produced from coal; now, we are at 1%. The Government are taking the reduction of emissions incredibly seriously. We were the first major economy to set a net zero target in law, and we cut our emissions by 48% between 1990 and 2021. Coupled with that, we are taking more proactive measures, including by doubling the amount of funding for improving our flood-resilience programmes from £2.6 billion to £5.2 billion, to better protect more frequently flooded communities, businesses and homeowners.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

I thank my hon. Friend the Minister for his statement and efforts, and I thank the Secretary of State, DEFRA and people across Government for all their work in these challenging times. I pay tribute to the Environment Agency, the emergency services, local authorities and volunteer workers for all that they do to keep people safe at this time.

My hon. Friend will know from our work together on the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee that our “Rural Mental Health” report addressed the impact of extreme weather events on people’s mental health, in terms both of the anxiety about being flooded and the trauma afterwards. Can he reassure people and communities across the country that they will be supported when the blue lights leave and the waters subside?

[Robbie Moore]

I absolutely can. When I was a member of the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee, my hon. Friend, I and others on the Committee did a lot of work to produce that worthwhile report. It is vital that the Government not only pay close attention to the immediate impacts caused by flooding but provide reassurance to homeowners, businesses and those in the farming community who have been affected. We must also pay attention to negative implications, such as the effect on health and wellbeing. I am keen to ensure that we deliver on the recommendations of that report.

Animal Welfare (Livestock Exports) Bill

Neil Hudson Excerpts

2nd reading
Monday 18th December 2023 Commons Chamber

[Ruth Jones]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for raising that issue; I look forward to that discussion in Committee.

Making changes through private Members’ Bills is not leadership. Rather than Tory Back Benchers leading on animal welfare legislation, Ministers need to get on with it. I pay tribute to all the stakeholders and campaigners who devote their time and attention to fighting for the strongest animal welfare provisions we can deliver. The Opposition stand ready to facilitate a speedy journey through the House for the Bill, but we will seek to make it as strong, effective and durable as we can.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

The hon. Lady is talking about the Labour party promoting animal health and welfare. How does she square that with the Welsh Labour Government’s policy on tuberculosis in cattle and the UK Labour party saying it will stop control of the wildlife reservoir for tuberculosis, when it has been scientifically proven that that Conservative Government policy has been reducing the instance of tuberculosis in cattle in the United Kingdom?

[Ruth Jones]

I pay tribute to the hon. Gentleman for his interest, knowledge and expertise in this area, but the science is disputed. We will continue to listen to all sides of the scientific argument and look forward to discussing the issue in Committee.

I am grateful for advance warning of the Committee of the whole House, so staff who support the shadow DEFRA team can do some planning over the festive period and enjoy a well-earned rest. I wish the Bill well. When the question is put today, we will support it and I look forward to seeing it signed into law—the sooner the better.

--- Later in debate ---

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

I declare a personal and professional interest as a veterinary surgeon.

I very much welcome not only the introduction of this animal welfare legislation but, importantly, the cross-party support for it across the United Kingdom. The Bill will ban the export of cattle, sheep, goats, pigs and horses from Great Britain for slaughter or fattening. That has a huge benefit for animal welfare, decreasing both the stress on the animals that have travelled long distances, and the incidences of injury and diseases that are associated with long travel. This will fulfil a 2019 Conservative manifesto commitment, and I strongly welcome that. As has been mentioned by Members across the House, it will also help to ensure that animals are slaughtered domestically and close to home. That is so important to improving animal welfare, because if we reduce the distances that animals are transported, that will be a huge benefit to the animal. It is so important that animals are reared, slaughtered and then eaten locally. That is good for the environment, good for animal welfare and good for local businesses.

Importantly, this Bill stipulates that the meat can then be transported and exported as well. It is much better to transport on the hook rather than the hoof. However, we still need to work on improving transport conditions for all animals—farm livestock as well as horses. I urge everyone not to drop the ball on that. Just because this brilliant Bill is coming in, it does not mean that we do not still have work to do to improve transport conditions for animals.

I welcome the comments of the Secretary of State on the exemptions for the movement of animals for breeding and other purposes, potentially including sport. However, it would be helpful if that was made a little clearer in the Bill and the explanatory notes, so that any doubt is removed. As I said, it is important that animals are slaughtered close to home. The Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee has produced reports on that topic, such as “Moving animals across borders” and many others. One of our key recommendations was that we need to support the UK abattoir network, and ensure that sufficient numbers of abattoirs are spread around the country to reduce the distance to travel. I hugely welcome the Government’s announcement last week of the £4 million smaller abattoir fund, which will go a long way to help with that situation.

I also welcome the Bill’s stopping the export of young unweaned calves for long journeys for fattening and slaughter. In addition to the Bill, we need to ensure that we adapt, and use more of the animals farmed here. We need to reduce the production of dairy bull calves that are then lost to wastage. We can do that with such things as semen selection. We should also encourage the rearing of dairy bull calves locally and the use of less popular cuts and types of meat, such as rose veal. That will help animal welfare in the future too.

Throughout the debate we need to be cognisant of food security, which came into sharp focus with the pandemic and the war in Ukraine. Food security is so important for our country, and we need to be much more resilient in producing food. We need to think about the workforce issues. Again, I declare an interest as a veterinary surgeon. An EFRA Committee report recommended that we keep an eye on the number of vets we train and retain in the profession. Prior to our leaving the European Union, 90% to 95% of veterinarians who worked in the meat hygiene sector were from the EU. We need to keep on our radar the need to staff our abattoirs and food processing plants adequately. Last year, we had a crisis in the pig farming sector, with pigs damming back on farms because they could not be taken to slaughter to be processed.

We need to keep an eye on the workforce issues, and think about the resilience of some of the infrastructure. Carbon dioxide is an indirect result of fertiliser production, and CO₂ is needed for the slaughter of poultry and pigs. In the last couple of years, CF Fertilisers has shut its plant in Ince and ceased ammonia production at its Billingham plant. For food security and resilience, Government need to keep a watching brief on that.

[Mr Francois]

As my hon. Friend has mentioned pigs twice, another area where we would like the Government to move—I hope with the support of all parties—is on banning the awful use of pig farrowing crates. I am sure that were the Government to introduce legislation for that purpose—again, the issue was close to Sir David’s heart—it, too, would enjoy great support in this House.

[Dr Hudson]

I thank my right hon. Friend for that intervention.

On horses, I welcome the comments of the Secretary of State, and the Bill’s provisions, but huge numbers are still being illegally exported to Europe, under the guises of sport, competition or breeding, where they end up being slaughtered. On the EFRA Committee we heard harrowing evidence from World Horse Welfare that the practice still goes on. I welcome the Bill’s trying to stop that illegal practice, but we need to do more work on that. We need to improve the identification of horses and get a central equine database. The Bill is welcome, but we must not drop the ball on other issues.

Prior to our leaving the European Union, we had a tripartite agreement whereby high-performance, elite and high-health horses were able to move smoothly between Ireland, France and the United Kingdom. We need to try to get a replacement scheme in place. The movement of animals in and out of the country is important in animal health and welfare, and for the United Kingdom’s biosecurity. I welcome the Government’s moving forward with the border target operating model. Hopefully, the station at the Sevington campus in Kent will be in place soon to help with that.

The Secretary of State mentioned the great work of the Animal and Plant Health Agency. I put on record my thanks to the staff of APHA for maintaining our biosecurity—for animal health, plant health and, indirectly, human health. Those staff do so much in keeping the sector safe. As has been mentioned, avian influenza is still with us. The Farming Minister is well aware of that; I have had correspondence with him about it. The bluetongue episodes in ruminants that we are seeing in both Kent and Norfolk show us that we must be diligent with our biosecurity. African swine fever is rising up through the continent of Europe; we need to ensure that we are vigilant to stop that horrific disease coming into the United Kingdom. Heaven forbid that another disease like foot and mouth disease comes into the country. That shows us how important APHA is for our biosecurity and for the future of British business. I urge Ministers to keep making the case to the Treasury to refurbish the APHA HQ in Weybridge, Surrey. It is so important for our national security.

The Bill also has many pragmatic measures. It does not apply to movements within the United Kingdom, which will help, and importantly Northern Irish farmers will still have access to the UK and Irish markets. Some of the practical measures in the Windsor framework are developed in the Bill, but we need further clarity on the movement of animals between GB and Northern Ireland, and vice versa. I know that colleagues in the Democratic Unionist party feel strongly about the availability of veterinary medicines in Northern Ireland; 50% of veterinary medicines were going to be lost, but a suspension in December 2022 has extended availability for a further three years to 2025. It is important that we work with our European friends and allies to get clarity on long-term availability of veterinary medicines in Northern Ireland.

The Conservative Government have a strong record on animal welfare. I agree that it should not be a party-political issue. The Government have passed the Animal Welfare (Sentience) Act 2022; created the Animal Sentience Committee so that every piece of legislation must have due regard to animal sentience, which is so important; passed the Sentencing Act 2020 to increase the penalties for cruelty to animals; and brought in the compulsory microchipping of cats. Just last week, we talked about banning the keeping of primates as pets. As we have heard, individual Bills such as today’s are being introduced, as well as private Member’s Bills to tackle pet theft, pet smuggling and puppy smuggling, and to stop the import of dogs that have had their ears horrifically cropped, of cats that have had their claws horrifically taken off them, and of heavily pregnant cats and dogs. Those Bills are being introduced, as is another on livestock worrying.

Animal welfare unites us in humanity and across the House. It is so important that we pass the Bill. I welcome the cross-party support, and I wish the Bill well as it travels.

Public Sector Food Procurement

Neil Hudson Excerpts

Tuesday 12th December 2023 Westminster Hall

[Anthony Mangnall]

I did not expect the debate to be going in that direction, but I wholeheartedly agree with my hon. Friend. He is absolutely right. How can we get game meat into our schools and places of education? How can we find a better link to that and a better understanding of the food that is in abundance across this country? I think that is a perfectly reasonable and sensible point.

My proposal, as I said, is a simple concept but a complex challenge. We spend £2.4 billion annually on public sector food procurement and catering, and there is the opportunity to support local producers, improve food quality and diets, and safeguard the environment, all of which can be achieved by setting national standards. As I have found over the last four years, half the battle in this place is persuading others, including the Government, that a point of view or argument is the right one—and even when we are proven right, it may not count for much.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing the debate. Food security and the production of high-standard, locally produced food are vital. In 2021, the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee produced a report on public sector food procurement. It highlighted the loophole in Government buying standards for food and catering that allows public sector bodies to purchase food that does not meet our UK legal standards in food production or animal welfare on the basis of cost.

Does my hon. Friend agree that we should close that inconsistent loophole as soon as we can, so that we can become a beacon to the rest of the world on food production and animal welfare standards? In so doing, we would be backing our fantastic British farmers and food producers, who produce food to the highest animal welfare and environmental standards.

[Anthony Mangnall]

I congratulate my hon. Friend on all his work as a member of the EFRA Committee, in which he brings his expertise both as a veterinarian and as a representative of a rural constituency with many farmers. He is absolutely right that we must close those loopholes. We must take the recommendations in the EFRA Committee report, to which I will refer later. I will be happy to follow through with anything he needs to strengthen his arm on that point.

The Government already accept the premise of what I am calling for. The Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs consultation on possible changes to the public sector food and catering policy stated:

“Government is adopting an ambitious and transformational approach to public sector food and catering. We are determined to use public sector purchasing power to ensure positive change in the food system. Our vision is that public sector food and catering is an exemplar to wider society in delivering positive health, animal welfare, environmental and socio-economic impacts.”

That is exactly the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for Penrith and The Border (Dr Hudson). The consultation ran from June 2022 to September 2022, and there were hundreds of submissions from worthwhile national organisations. Unfortunately, the Government have yet to respond to their consultation. Will the Minister say when we are likely to see the findings of the consultation and any recommendations, so that we can recognise the opportunity to see those targets and ambitions met?

To make those changes and recognise the ambitions stated in the consultation, the procurement process has to be widened to encourage and incentivise small businesses to engage with the system. Whether it be a national or a local authority contract, it is time consuming, risky and costly for small farms, fisheries or local food producers to submit a bid. That clearly needs to change. The Procurement Act 2023 reforms the procurement process to make it simpler, faster, more transparent and less bureaucratic. It is perhaps one of the most boring pieces of legislation that has ever been passed by Parliament, but it is an important one that will make a huge difference to small businesses. With the measures coming into force in October 2024, the Government have rightly made it their ambition to open the market for public contracts to new entrants, especially small and local businesses. The Act is the catalyst for reforming our food procurement system, to ensure healthier, higher-quality food is at the heart of our publicly funded organisations.

When the Act was debated in the Lords, a number of amendments aimed to set national targets, such as ensuring that 50% of purchases must be from the UK or that “locally” would mean within 30 miles of a contracting authority. I understand that those proposals would have contravened many of our World Trade Organisation legal obligations, but there are steps that we can take to develop and improve local purchasing strategies while continuing to adhere to WTO standards. Will the Minister say when the Government will use section 107 of the Procurement Act to introduce secondary legislation to disapply section 17 of the Local Government Act 1988, which

“currently precludes local authorities from awarding public supply or work contracts by supplier location”?—[Official Report, House of Lords, 28 November 2022; Vol. 825, c. 1641.]

That was stated at the Dispatch Box in the House of Lords by a Minister. Introducing secondary legislation would be welcomed, I presume, by both sides of this House—I see the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Cambridge (Daniel Zeichner), nodding—so there is an opportunity to quickly see that reform brought to reality.

The more sceptical might think that this is all wishful thinking, but international comparisons should be made, and some of the successes are remarkable. For instance, in 2001 Denmark introduced an organic action plan aimed at 60% organic procurement in all public kitchens by 2020. Evidence showed an increase in public kitchen procurement of organic food of 24% by 2016. The policy proved so popular that the city of Copenhagen increased the target and achieved it, at 90%, earlier this year. The policy improved not only the health of those using public kitchens, but the understanding of food and nutrition, as well as cooking skills. The Danish agricultural community also found themselves boosted when able to bid for local tenders, with small and medium-sized businesses actively engaging and benefiting from the policy.

Brazil passed a law that requires 30% of the national budget for food served in school meal programmes to be spent on food from family farms, with priority given to those using agroecological methods. Perhaps the most interesting point about that policy is that it has also restricted the purchasing of processed and ultra-processed food with taxpayers’ money. That has had a positive impact on the farming and fishing communities, as well as benefiting schools, hospitals and other publicly funded organisations. In the United States, which we are often quick to deride, states such as California and Massachusetts have put in place frameworks that steer public purchasing towards local sources, with the express purpose of improving the diet, health and nutrition of their citizens. Austria and the Nordic countries also have fantastic examples.

Even in my area of south Devon, in the south-west, we have piloted interesting and innovative schemes such as the dynamic purchasing system to help to facilitate greater buy-in from small and medium-sized enterprises to allow them to take advantage of public tenders—all with the express hope of streamlining the consolidation and delivery of orders from multiple suppliers with an online food store, a local delivery hub and knowledge of local suppliers. Both at home and abroad, there are examples of how the proposals that I have put forward could and should work.

The Government buying standard for food and catering services sets out what public sector organisations should apply when procuring food and catering services. The standards relate to food production, processing, distribution and nutrition. Some of the standards are mandatory; some are best practices. DEFRA is responsible for updating public sector procurement standards, and the Department of Health and Social Care is responsible for the nutrition standards in the GBSF, as it is known.

The “National Food Strategy” report and the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee report that has already been mentioned on public sector procurement of food rightly consider what needs to be done to update the GBSF: the buying standards should be updated to ensure procurement of healthy and sustainable food; standards should be mandatory across the entire public sector; the monitoring of compliance with the standards should be improved; and supply chains should be opened up to a wider range of businesses. Some of those measures are already under way.

However, it is frequently remarked on that the lack of joined-up thinking between Departments when it comes to food has been the predominant block to action in this space. Reshaping the GBSF to take on board the food strategy recommendations plus improved oversight and strategy, coupled with mandatory targets and enforcement mechanisms, will be the only way in which we can speed along the change that we wish to see in our public sector. Mandatory standards across all sectors of public sector food procurement would not only be a huge vote of support for our food, farming and fishing communities, but necessitate an oversight body to ensure that targets were met and promises delivered.

I have sought to demonstrate that my proposal is not out of kilter with the Government’s ambitions. I have referenced the fact that the Government’s consultation on this topic asked for submissions on the very points and ambitions that I have raised. We wait in hope for its findings. I have provided the international comparisons that show that we can not only be compliant with WTO rules, but ensure that we have strong and robust legislation that meets our own domestic interests. We can do that while adhering to our international commitments.

I will end on the work of the Food, Farming and Countryside Commission, whose excellent work on this topic and so many others has demonstrated the overwhelming positive public appetite—no pun intended —to change the public food procurement system. Specifically, citizens across this country want the Government to improve public sector food procurement and nutrition standards, with 84% of people believing in stronger standards for the food provided in our hospitals and schools.

--- Later in debate ---

[Dr Hudson]

Can I just highlight again the loophole in the Government buying standards the Minister mentioned? The public sector can deviate from buying high-quality food on the basis of cost; it can deviate from animal welfare standards if it is cheaper to do that. The Minister’s predecessor gave us very encouraging answers on the EFRA Committee on our recommendations for closing that loophole. It is a simple thing to do. I really urge the Government to look at that and to close the loophole, so that we can give the best example with our local public sector food procurement.

[Mark Spencer]

Of course, we want those consuming food purchased in the public sector to have access to the healthiest, best-quality food possible. We need to balance that with a desire to get good value for taxpayers’ money at the same time. Where foods are of the same quality and standard, we would of course expect people to purchase locally wherever possible. We want to use our influence to encourage people in the public sector to make the most of locally produced, high-quality British food. That is done through a blend of mandated standards that apply to central Government Departments —His Majesty’s Prison and Probation Service, NHS hospitals and the armed forces in England—and best practice standards, which exist to encourage all public sector organisations to work towards having healthier and more sustainable food in their supply chains.

Public sector food should champion healthier, sustainable food that is provided by a diverse range of suppliers. To underpin that approach, we held a consultation last year on public sector food and catering policy, including on updating the Government buying standards for food and catering services, which were last updated in 2014. Leaving aside the nutritional standards, which were updated in 2021, there was broad support for some of the proposals we included in the consultation, including pursuing greater environmental sustainability gains and increasing the opportunities for small and medium-sized businesses in the sector.

I am pleased to say that we have worked hard with colleagues across Government to take our response through to the final stages of drafting. I am confident that the revised standards will deliver positive change, as well as making life easier for those implementing them. The team has been working across Government with those Departments that have a vested interest, such as the Ministry of Defence, which has specific operational challenges in feeding its workforce, and with the Crown Commercial Services to oversee the consideration of SMEs in its new Buying Better Food and Drink agreement. That agreement will help SME food producers to access public sector food opportunities, provided that they meet the GBSF.

The GBSF already supports and strengthens cross-Government policies linked to environmental sustainability, animal welfare, food safety and nutrition. With regards to the environment, for example, the standards encourage the championing of seasonal produce and mandate that a proportion of food in the supply chain meets higher environmental production standards. That can currently be demonstrated through membership of organic and LEAF—linking environment and farming—assurance schemes, and we will continue to work to link them to world-class environmental land management schemes.

As well as bringing the standards up to date, the refresh will make the GBSF simpler and more engaging for those in the sector to interpret, whether returning to the standards or coming to them for the first time. Accompanying guidance will clarify how any changes can be applied, as well as improve the transparency of the supply chain, so that a greater range of potential suppliers are able to understand the opportunities the sector has to offer. To continue driving improvement and ambition in the sector, we will continue to develop and refine guidance following publication by engaging with the sector to improve uptake and retain Government focus on the priorities I have mentioned.

We have had a very interesting debate. I hope I have reassured Members that we are on the right track.

Oral Answers to Questions

Neil Hudson Excerpts

Thursday 7th December 2023 Commons Chamber

[Steve Barclay]

Let us look behind the rhetoric. Given that the Leader of the Opposition keeps telling us that he wants the Labour Government in Wales to be his blueprint, it is probably worth our taking a look at Labour’s record in this respect. [Interruption.] The hon. Gentleman asked the question, but he does not seem to want to hear about Labour’s record, which is not surprising. Under Labour in Wales, the average number of spills from storm overflows last year was 66% higher than the average in England. We have introduced unlimited fines and tougher regulation, and we have set strong targets in legislation. We can see what Labour in power would deliver—we can see it in Wales: a 66% increase in storm overflows.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

T5. Can the Minister give me an update on the investigation by the Department and the UK Health Security Agency of the recently confirmed human case of influenza A(H1N2)v, which is similar to influenza viruses currently circulating in pigs in the UK? Does he agree that infectious diseases such as this with a zoonotic potential underline the importance of the Animal and Plant Health Agency to our national biosecurity and public health, and that we should definitely be investing in the long-term redevelopment of its headquarters in Weybridge?

[The Minister for Food, Farming and Fisheries (Mark Spencer)]

Swine influenza is endemic in the UK pig population. It generally causes only mild illness, but the Health Security Agency’s investigation, with support from DEFRA, is ongoing. We are committed to upholding the UK’s high level of biosecurity, and work is under way, with £200 million in the current spending review, to safeguard the long-term future of Weybridge as a centre for scientific excellence in tackling high-risk diseases such as this.

Legislation on Dangerous Dogs

Neil Hudson Excerpts

Monday 27th November 2023 Westminster Hall

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

It is a privilege to serve under your chairship, Dame Caroline. I declare my professional and personal interest in this matter: I am a veterinary surgeon and a fellow of the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons.

I fully understand the passion and emotion on both sides of this very important debate, but I have sadly come to the conclusion that the Government are doing the right thing in banning the American XL bully dog. We have heard accounts of recent attacks, and some of us have seen videos; we need to act swiftly. This has been a difficult decision, but the Prime Minister has called for a ban and the Leader of the Opposition has supported him, so the ban is coming and as legislators we need to ensure we get it right. As a veterinary surgeon and MP, I believe we can get it right, but we need to work with all stakeholders.

This is not a party political issue. How we think about human and animal welfare unites us in humanity across the House. We need to protect people and other animals. The ban is coming, and we need to make it work practically, sensitively and compassionately. As we have heard, we also need a longer-term piece of work in parallel to reform the legislation and look closely at responsible dog ownership.

The 1991 Act covers four types of dogs—the pit bull terrier, the Japanese tosa, the dogo argentino and the fila braziliero—and the American XL bully will be an important addition to that list. I am aware that many XL bullies are friendly pets in the right homes and with the right ownership, but sadly, because of their sheer size and weight, they can become uniquely dangerous. They are hugely powerful dogs, with a hugely powerful, muscular jaw structure, and they can weigh more than 50 kg or 60 kg.

We have heard public statements from consultant human surgeons about the severity of the wounds that these dogs can cause. The bites cause crushing or tearing injuries that are worse than the wounds from other types of dog bites; the statements back that up. The implications of being bitten or attacked by that type of dog, compared with a dog such as a French bulldog or a Jack Russell, are orders of magnitude worse.

Some of these dogs are bred for exaggerated conformation and extreme conformational features, and some have had their ears horrifically cropped. The breeding of these animals has been fuelled by the uptick in unregulated canine fertility clinics, which are not supervised by veterinary surgeons although acts of veterinary surgery, such as blood sampling and artificial insemination, take place in them. The EFRA Committee has looked at that issue closely in our “Pet welfare and abuse” inquiry, and we will be making recommendations about that. Unscrupulous breeders are fuelling the trade in these dogs, some of which are used as status symbols—I emphasise again that it is not all XL bullies, but it is a significant number.

Ear cropping is not clinically indicated in the dog; it is a cosmetic procedure that is illegal in this country, although there are loopholes that mean that the dogs can be imported. I am pleased that in this parliamentary Session the Government will introduce legislation to ban the importation of ear-cropped dogs, because that loophole means that some dogs are being illegally cropped horrifically—potentially in people’s back gardens because kits can be bought online. The procedure does not benefit the animal but it makes it look more intimidating.

Popular culture also has a role to play. Look at some of the really popular animated films: some of the dogs in “Up”, one of my favourite films that I have watched with my kids, were cropped; and one of the lead characters in the film “DC League of Super-Pets” from a couple of years ago had his ears cropped. People going to the cinema and seeing dogs with their ears cropped normalises the practice in society. People think, “Well, that’s normal” and “That’s what dogs should look like,” when actually the procedure is horrific and should be outlawed completely.

As we have heard, there is complexity in typing and defining. The Government have engaged closely with police, veterinary and animal welfare experts, and local authorities to produce guidance and advice, but I stress that this is an evolving, iterative process, and I urge the Government and stakeholders to continue to work together to stay around the table so that other types of dog are not inadvertently caught up in this ban.

I firmly believe that we need to be very careful about some of the language we use in this debate. We should not be talking about mass culls or killing of animals. Very early on, when this debate came to a head in September, the chief veterinary officer, Christine Middlemiss, spoke of this ban dovetailing with the humane and sensitive managing of the existing population of XL bully dogs. I stress that if these dogs are safe and responsibly owned, people can keep them. They can register them as long as they are neutered, insured, and kept on a lead and muzzled in public.

I urge the Government and local authorities to work with and support all the animal welfare charities. We have heard about the stresses and strains on the animal welfare sector. It was already under significant pressure, and the pandemic put it under much more. I also urge the Government to continue to work closely with the veterinary sector and look at expert opinion, such as that articulated by the British Veterinary Association last week in its letter to the chief vet, which talked about elements like neutering. I think the Government will get the veterinary profession to come along with them by having some flexibility and potentially extending the neutering deadlines, under which many of the dogs will be neutered when they are under 18 months—the age recommended for heavy types of dog. Extending the deadline until the end of June 2025 for dogs of this type that are under seven months at the end of January 2024 could help. It could benefit health and welfare, as there have been studies suggesting that neutering some of these heavy-type dogs too early can lead to an increased risk of developmental orthopaedic disease and some other medical conditions. It is important to try to work closely with the veterinary profession; working collectively will help.

That brings me on to some of the mental health implications of what we are talking about today: for the owners of these animals, the general public at large, the veterinary profession, and the animal welfare sector, which are taking some of the hit on this. We looked very closely at some of these issues in our EFRA Committee inquiry on pet welfare and abuse and in our rural mental health report, which we published this year. Many charities and veterinary professionals will become involved in euthanasia in cases where the dogs cannot be kept. We need to be cognisant of what that means for the veterinary profession, for the paraprofessionals and professionals working in it, and for the animal welfare sector, which works with them.

I have spoken with many in the sector. As has been mentioned, a couple of weeks ago I spoke at the London Vet Show, where I heard significant disquiet and distress among some vets and practices. I firmly believe that if we take that on board, work collectively and responsibly with the sector to see whether we can evolve some points such as the neutering guidelines, and think about the capacity issues with regard to euthanasia, that will help us to get a more practical and sensible ban moving forward. Responding to some of those concerns will get more vets on board. Vets do not like doing things to animals if they do not think there is a clinical benefit for those animals, so some movement would help—the neutering extension would be only six months. From December, it will be illegal to breed from these animals. We want to get the existing dogs neutered so that no more of these dogs come into being, but having a little bit of flexibility in working with vets may help.

Equally, I have spoken to some vets who agree that we need to go ahead with this. There are views very much on both sides of the debate. We need to work together to get through this—it is not an easy thing to do. I do not believe that it is a politically expedient issue: the Government and, now, the Leader of the Opposition have backed it. It is a tough thing to do, but it is the right thing to do.

Some vets and charities will disagree with my view. People talk about judging the animal by the deed and not the breed. As far as I am concerned, once that deed is committed, it is too late: that child or adult is maimed, or worse. We therefore need to look at this in the round and think about the deed and/or the breed. In the short term, however, adding this type of dog to the list is the right thing to do.

[Dr Luke Evans]

My hon. Friend is making a fantastic speech, and I will be grateful for his expertise on this question. Currently, there are no legal ramifications for a dog that attacks another dog. Are there any precedents for introducing such legislation or for starting to collect data on whether that is predictable; and, in his professional opinion, is a dog that attacks another dog predisposed to attack further dogs or even humans?

[Dr Hudson]

My fellow clinical colleague—in a different profession—makes a strong point. During the Select Committee inquiry, we found that there is a paucity of data on this. We have certainly seen an uptick in attacks on people, but there is a lack of data on dog-on-dog attacks. Part of this legislation is very much about keeping people safe, but part of it is about keeping other animals safe. The more data we can get in order to make evidence-based decisions, the more it will help.

As other Members have mentioned, a longer piece of work needs to be done in parallel with this short-term legislation. We need to look at responsible breeding, responsible dog ownership, responsible training and responsible socialising of those animals, and we need to tackle some of the issues that have been raised, such as the iniquitous existence of puppy farms and unscrupulous breeders.

We also need to tackle puppy smuggling, and again I am grateful to the former Secretary of State, my right hon. Friend the Member for Suffolk Coastal (Dr Coffey), who has been supporting—as the Minister will be doing—private Members’ Bills to take elements of the Animal Welfare (Kept Animals) Bill through the House in order to tackle some of the issues and ultimately to help us to improve animal welfare.

The longer-term changes to address the people who are working with these dogs will not happen overnight. That is why the Government are right to carry on with the short-term ban while the longer piece of work is done. We need to make people better at looking after their dogs, but, in the meantime, we need to keep people safe from this particular type of dog.

[Wayne David]

The hon. Member is making a very good case, but does he recognise the danger that, by putting the focus on this one piece of legislation and by talking generally of other issues in the future, the impression will be given that one statutory instrument will be sufficient to tackle the problem? Is there not a danger that people will come to believe that, even though we know it not to be the case?

[Dr Hudson]

The hon. Member makes an interesting point. He also made the point earlier that once we ban this type of dog, people will look to find another type of dog. I acknowledge that some unscrupulous breeders will try to develop the next status-symbol type of dog, but that should not stop us from trying to stop such attacks on people and animals. This legislation is not perfect, but what we have seen in recent times means that something needs to be done now—in addition to a holistic piece of work to address some of the issues that he has rightly raised.

I fully recognise that this is very difficult for many owners. It is very difficult for the animal welfare charities and the veterinary sector as well.

[Ian Lavery]

As a vet, is the hon. Member not bound by some sort of oath? Vets should not be putting down any animals that are fit and healthy, when there is no reason whatsoever to put them down. He has said he feels that it is necessary. What is his personal view?

[Dr Hudson]

I have raised many points about vets being uncomfortable with doing some of this. A lot of veterinary practices and companies have surveyed their staff and will not force vets to do things they do not want to do. That said, I come back to the point that if some of these dogs are safe, they can be kept. As we heard from the Chair of the Select Committee, my right hon. Friend the Member for Scarborough and Whitby (Sir Robert Goodwill), it is not feasible for rehoming centres to rehome dogs that are not eligible and put them into an environment where they could hurt someone. Sometimes we need to make professional and clinical judgments.

Sadly, some of these dogs will have to be put down, but I come back to the language that we need to be using. This is not some form of mass cull; actually, we are keeping dogs safe. If dogs are not deemed to be safe and cannot be registered, we must try to keep people and other animals safe. I recognise the difficulties on both sides, but I believe that the spate of attacks we have seen in recent months means that the Government and Parliament are right to act, but we have to get it right. We have to do it practically, sensitively and compassionately to protect people and other animals.

Oral Answers to Questions

Neil Hudson Excerpts

Thursday 19th October 2023 Commons Chamber

[Rebecca Pow]

I thank my hon. Friend for all the valuable work he does in that capacity. That subject is still under discussion.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

2. What discussions she has had with Cabinet colleagues on introducing the proposed ban on American Bully XL dogs.

[The Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Dr Thérèse Coffey)]

The Prime Minister made a decision about introducing the proposed ban on American XL Bully dogs, recognising the horrific consequences of recent dog attacks and the disproportionate amount of those being undertaken by such dogs. We are working at pace on the legislation, and importantly on how it will be put into practice, and I hope to say more on that soon.

[Dr Hudson]

I thank the Secretary of State for her answer. As a veterinary surgeon, I strongly agree with the Prime Minister, the Home Secretary and the Secretary of State that we need to ban the dangerous American XL Bully dog as soon as possible to keep people and other animals safe. Does my right hon. Friend agree that in parallel to this necessary urgent action, we need to undertake important work with the public on responsible dog breeding, responsible dog ownership and better training and socialising of dogs as part of a holistic, long-term solution to dog attacks?

[Dr Coffey]

My hon. Friend has great credibility in this field, given his professional experience as a vet. I understand that many owners of XL Bully dogs are passionate about their animals—their pets. That is why we are working at pace, but taking our time to get right the definitions and the transition period that we anticipate. It is important that all dog owners work to make sure that their dogs behave and have appropriate training. That is why we established a taskforce that includes dog welfare charities. We expect it to respond to us by the end of the year, and we will potentially take forward some of its recommendations.

Border Target Operating Model: Food and Biosecurity

Neil Hudson Excerpts

Wednesday 13th September 2023 Westminster Hall

[Mrs Elphicke]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. He is exactly right, as ever, in bringing out the very serious issues with the management of the Northern Ireland issue. Controls have to be modern, proportionate, effective, and fair to business. He makes that point very well.

What we have seen on the Dover border is rancid meat, seeds with dangerous levels of pesticides and meat that could contain livestock-infecting diseases. All of these have been detected coming through Dover from the EU.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

My hon. Friend is exactly right. It is fitting that the debate is taking place on Back British Farming Day. Biosecurity is pivotal to protecting UK farming. As she has mentioned, infectious disease is coming in. We know the implications of foot and mouth disease and African swine fever. Does she agree with me that getting this targeted border operating model up and running and working is critical to the nation’s biosecurity, animal health and welfare and public health, and that pivotal to all that is to ensure that we have the Animal and Plant Health Agency resourced and staffed so that it can monitor the borders properly, and also to upgrade the facilities at Weybridge in Surrey, its disease HQ?

[Mrs Elphicke]

I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention. He is incredibly knowledgeable on this issue, as we have just heard, and he is exactly right. We cannot wait any longer. I will be explaining how, at the Dover frontline, we have had a ready-to-go, state-of-the-art facility mothballed for 18 months. It should be put to work straightaway to protect our nation. My hon. Friend is absolutely right. We need to put these facilities and these new measures in place urgently.

What are we finding at the moment? With global food disruption and increased costs of production getting worse because of the war in Ukraine, threats to food safety are on the increase. It is not just food. Farm animals are threatened by the diseases carried in infected meat. We need to be very clear about that. This is not the odd rogue import. Dover Port Health Authority has found it happening on an industrial scale—tonnes of this stuff. It has formally warned the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs about the increased risks and findings.

This meat does not meet our—or even Europe’s—required standards for slaughter, storage or import. It is not just unhealthy, but dangerous. The danger is not just to humans, but to our livestock and therefore to the livelihoods of our farmers and food producers. That is because this rancid, illegal meat can contain live viruses of some of the most serious threats to our animals. As we have heard, diseases such as African swine fever have steadily spread from eastern Europe to Germany and now France. The NFU has said:

“A breakdown in biosecurity is one of the most serious risks we face as a nation.”

I agree with that.

It is welcome that the Government have, at last, published the border target operating model. However, the long delay and continued uncertainty around the new arrangements is worrying. Concerns have been raised with me by Kent-based import-export businesses, national food and drink trade bodies, the British Poultry Council, the NFU and the Dover port health authority. As I mentioned, it is some 18 months now since Dover’s ready-to-go, taxpayer-funded, state-of-the-art post-Brexit facilities were mothballed, awaiting the publication of the proposed target operating model for the border. At the time, the model was expected in some weeks. In the end, it was published just a couple of weeks ago, on 29 August 2023.

Almost a year ago, last October, I led a debate in Westminster Hall on this subject. The then answering Minister said that for traders, the target operating model

“will explain what must be done upstream of the border before goods arrive at it, and what must happen at the border—including border control posts”.—[Official Report, 18 October 2022; Vol. 720, c. 271WH.]

We finally have the border target operating model, but in relation to the short straits, which means the port of Dover and the Eurotunnel, we have no confirmed border control posts even now.

The target operating model says that a decision will be published soon and that facilities will be operational in April 2024. However, as I have outlined, the Dover facility has been ready to go for some 18 months. April 2024 would represent a delay of some two years from when the facility was due to be made live, during which time the operating environment for food and biosecurity has significantly deteriorated, as DEFRA has been told time and again.

Given the importance of these issues, the delay is unacceptable. The state-of-the-art facility at Dover needs to be opened right away. Dover has the expertise needed to secure our borders, but it is not being supported as it should be. Dover needs to be backed in its vital role in keeping our country’s food and farming safe. Government action is needed now to ensure that we are properly protected from dangerous food and diseases coming into the UK. I would be grateful if the Minister could confirm when the new Dover facility, which is so obviously needed, will be opened.

I would like to address why things have taken so long and what needs to happen. There are three issues. The first is the dreaded phrase “cross-governmental working”, which, in layman’s terms, means that no one person is in charge and the buck does not stop anywhere. As I have before, I make the case for a Department for the border to draw together all the border-related functions, as many other countries do, including America and Australia. It would be a single window under a single Department responsible for order at the border. From customs to trade, and from biosecurity to visa entry and migration, there is an urgent need for a single Department in charge of setting policy, overseeing operations and—importantly—taking responsibility for what is happening at our borders.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mark Spencer]

My right hon. Friend raises an important point: we need to make sure that we are using surveillance. As he will be aware, it is often best not to talk too publicly about the methods we use to protect our borders and detect diseases, but I can give him an assurance that we take the issue very seriously. We use intelligence to detect where the risks will be, but we also have robust regimes in place to make sure that we can pick things up as they come into the country.

As my hon. Friend the Member for Penrith and The Border (Dr Hudson) mentioned, African swine fever is moving across Europe. It is vital for our pig sector that we protect ourselves from the disease entering the UK, which is why we are introducing robust regimes to make sure that we protect our border, back our farmers and back our food production system. Working together, that is what we will do, moving forward.

[Dr Hudson]

Does the Minister agree that if we get a fully operational border target model, it will not only protect the nation’s biosecurity, but help to unearth the illicit movement of animals in and out of the country? That includes puppy smuggling, the smuggling of heavily pregnant dogs and those that have had their ears horrifically cropped, and horses being illegally exported to Europe for slaughter. Can he reassure me that the new model will help to stamp out some of those practices?

[Mark Spencer]

Those are all things that we want to achieve. The way to do so is by having a very efficient border point where we can check things, deter criminal activity—let us be clear that some of this stuff is criminal activity—and prevent inadvertent infection through diseases and pests at the same time.

We have had a really productive debate. Once again, I put on the record my thanks to the team at Dover for keeping us secure, and to my hon. Friend the Member for Dover for her support.

Question put and agreed to.

Environmental Protection

Neil Hudson Excerpts

Tuesday 18th July 2023 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

The purpose of these instruments is to strengthen environmental civil sanctions, so that our environmental regulators can apply an unlimited penalty to companies that break the terms of their permits and do damage to the environment. We are also making it easier for such penalties to be applied rather than having to resort exclusively to taking polluters to court for fines to be applied.

Rightly, the Government care about the environment, as do the public. In January, we published our environmental improvement plan, which set out an ambitious five-year blueprint for action to make our country cleaner and greener, to restore nature and to improve the state of our environment. In April, we set out our comprehensive integrated plan for clean and plentiful water. Both plans demonstrated our ambition and the action that we would undertake to have a laser-like focus on cleaning up the environment, including enabling our regulators to enforce the law effectively and efficiently.

Let me turn to the enablers that we are debating today. First, the current provision for variable monetary penalties under the Environmental Civil Sanctions (England) Order 2010 is capped at £250,000. Possible penalties are supposed to be an effective deterrent to poor performance. Unfortunately, it seems that some operators may have priced in the fact that it can be cheaper to pay the current penalty than to fix the problem and tackle the pollution. Of course, people who breach their permits and pollute can be taken to court facing a criminal conviction and be faced with an unlimited fine and the prospect of going to prison. However, we know that such investigations and court cases can take years to accomplish such an outcome. Therefore, I am clear that we must provide a strong deterrent, particularly for large operators with significant turnover.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

I very much welcome these Government measures. Last week, we on the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Committee had an emergency session with Thames Water, Ofwat and the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs. We received strong confirmation that the regulators and the Environment Agency now have the teeth that they need to hold polluting water companies to account with unlimited fines or by stopping dividends being paid out. Does my right hon. Friend agree that this Conservative Government are the first Government to take clear and strong action, and that this is in strong contrast to some of the toxic rubbish that comes out especially from the Liberal Democrats, who, I notice, are not in the Chamber today? They seem to forget that, when they had a water Minister during the coalition, they did nothing on this.

Animal Welfare (Kept Animals)

Neil Hudson Excerpts

Wednesday 21st June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Sir Roger Gale)]

I inform the House that I have selected amendment (a), which is in the name of the Prime Minister.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. As the only veterinary surgeon in the Commons, I am passionate about all aspects of animal health and welfare, and I seek your advice. The Opposition motion that we are about to debate seeks to take control of the Order Paper and timetable a Bill, the Animal Welfare (Kept Animals) (No. 2) Bill, about which we have no details whatsoever. How is it possible to debate the motion, which could have unintended and adverse consequences for many aspects of animal health and welfare, with no Bill, and no details? Or are the Opposition aiming to reintroduce the Government’s original Animal Welfare (Kept Animals) Bill? It would be helpful to have clarification on what we are debating and voting on today, and what it may mean for the health and welfare of the precious, much-loved animals in our country.

[Mr Deputy Speaker]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for giving notice of his point of order. The motion seeks to take control of the Order Paper on 12 July, so that the House can consider a Bill on animal welfare on that date. If the motion succeeds, the content of that Bill could then be scrutinised on that date, according to the timetable set out in the motion. The fact that the text of the Bill is not yet available is not a procedural bar to considering today the motion before the House.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jim McMahon]

I will make a bit of progress first, if that is okay. In the end, it is those promises that—if we are not careful and they are not kept—undermine the very foundation of our democracy. Let us be clear: at the last general election, every single Conservative MP stood on the platform of a pledge to voters that they would deliver the priorities subsequently set out in the Animal Welfare (Kept Animals) Bill. It was a key part of their 2019 manifesto.

What has happened since 2019? Well, a fair bit. First, we have witnessed a Prime Minister who did not survive a lockdown party, or at least his catalogue of lies that followed it. We had a second one who did not even survive a lettuce and a third one who will be lucky to survive the post-election fallout, but, regardless of leaders, a manifesto stood on by every single Conservative Member should stand the test of time. The former Prime Minister who has left the House in disgrace promised the Animal Welfare (Kept Animals) Bill but, like much else, he failed to deliver. According to members of her own party, the next Prime Minister, the right hon. Member for South West Norfolk (Elizabeth Truss)—who left Downing Street in disgrace and undercut our animal welfare protections in her botched trade deals—wanted to ditch the Bill, not just failing to deliver that promise but actively selling us out.

[Dr Hudson]

Animal welfare unites us in humanity and across this House. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that the Animal Welfare (Sentience) Act 2022, by creating the Animal Sentience Committee, whereby Governments of all political persuasions have to be cognisant of and pay due regard to animal welfare, is a huge benefit to animal health and welfare?

[Jim McMahon]

The Act certainly has that potential, except for the fact that the committee has not even been set up yet, so let us make some progress on that. On a matter of principle—by the way, I do take at face value the compassion for animals, which we do share across the House—the question is, how are we going to get there? How are we going to increase the protections for the animals that we all say we care about and that we know the nation loves? In the end, whatever is said here is slightly academic compared with the vote that will take place later, because that is what constituents will judge MPs on—not warm words, but the voting records that we all have to defend.

--- Later in debate ---

[Trudy Harrison]

Absolutely. That is just what we will do. The track record speaks for itself.

[Dr Hudson]

As we have heard, countless numbers of puppies, heavily pregnant dogs and dogs that have had their ears horrifically cropped are smuggled into the country, and potentially thousands of horses are illegally exported to Europe for slaughter. Does my hon. Friend agree that the measures the Government will bring forward in legislation will absolutely and unequivocally stamp out those horrific practices?

[Trudy Harrison]

I certainly do. I thank my hon. Friend and constituency neighbour for that intervention. There can be nobody more qualified and experienced in animal welfare than a vet, and he speaks with such sense.