Investment Industry Exposure to Modern Slavery

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 26th October 2021 Westminster Hall

[Gareth Davies (Grantham and Stamford) (Con)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered investment industry exposure to modern slavery.

Modern slavery is one of the most prevalent and egregious violations of human rights in the world today.

It is great to see you in the chair, Mr Robertson, for what is my first ever Westminster Hall debate. Hopefully my performance will not mean that it is my last. I welcome the Minister to her new, important role. I know she will carry out her brief superbly in one of the most important jobs in Government—safeguarding our most vulnerable people.

I think we can all agree that the shameful existence of modern slavery has no place in a civilised world. It is an issue that should concern every person who believes in the integrity of common humanity, and should be a concern for every business, because it distorts markets and undermines ethical business practices. As an international community, we have rightly taken collective responsibility for defending human rights around the world. Organisations, such as the United Nations working group on contemporary slavery, have drawn increased attention to the issue and made significant strides in defining and identifying this covert and highly complex crime.

That being said, there is a great deal more work to do. Human exploitation continues to pervade every major nation on earth. Almost half the countries in the world have yet to criminalise slavery. In the UK alone, it is estimated that 136,000 people are currently victims of this awful crime. However, we are here today to specifically discuss the role that the investment industry can play in tackling modern slavery because, as it currently stands, financial services are not considered part of the solution in public policy. I want to do my little bit to try to change that.

We must first acknowledge the great work that this Government, and previous Conservative Governments, have done in tackling this issue, thanks to the leadership of my right hon. Friend the Member for Staffordshire Moorlands (Karen Bradley), together with, of course, our late friend and colleague James Brokenshire, the Security Minister at the time, who passed the Modern Slavery Act 2015. The vision for that legislation was truly world-leading, and the UK became the first country in the world to require businesses to identify and address modern slavery risks in their operations and supply chains. It is an Act that we, in this country, should be incredibly proud of, for it has highlighted that modern slavery exists in the private economy. It has also paved the way for legislation in other countries—in Australia, France and the Netherlands.

However, while we reflect on what the 2015 Act has achieved, we must also acknowledge the need for evolution. All legislation requires continual review to keep pace with developing risks, and the Government have therefore, rightly, announced that they plan to strengthen the Act in response to consultation in 2019.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Gentleman on bringing this forward. I spoke to him outside, so he knows what my thoughts are. Does he not agree that it is important that for girls in particular, we need to understand that investment portfolios should show mindfulness on human slavery? It is not enough to say that if we do not use modern slavery in our businesses, our hands are clean. Would the hon. Member agree that we must be cognisant of how investment portfolios gain interest? This can only be done, as the hon. Gentleman says, through legislation and legislative change.

[Gareth Davies]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his intervention, which is a great honour. That is another first for me, so I feel like I am really making it now. I completely agree that young girls and young people—all people, actually—who have investments, savings or a retirement pot, need to know and have confidence that those who invest that money on their behalf are doing so prudently and are putting in place the checks to ensure that there is no inadvertent risk of modern slavery. The Government should do everything they can, as I will come on to in a minute.

The Government’s commitment to amend section 54(5) is intended to make it more prescriptive for investment funds. I completely agree with that, but even with those changes, that section would remain entirely focused on internal business structures and supply chains, not where their investments are made. The good news is that an increasing number of responsible companies are holding themselves to a higher standard. Many investors are already assessing modern slavery risks as part of their robust environmental, social and governance strategies or choosing to report their alignment with the United Nations’ guiding principles on business and human rights.

Yesterday, I met a group of investors, and this year alone, I have met 24 separate financial services companies in preparation for today’s debate. I found that they already have robust measures in place to tackle modern slavery. On the whole, however, the sector has not integrated modern slavery risks into investment processes to the same extent that it has adopted environmental risks. Some 795 financial organisations published modern slavery statements under the Act last year, but of 79 asset managers who submitted a statement, only 27% disclosed that they had conducted due diligence on modern slavery risks.

That is clearly a problem, but I believe that there are three solutions. First, the Government could broaden section 54 of the Act and consult on including a requirement that investment portfolios are included, as they are in Australia. Secondly, the Government could issue specific statutory guidance on how investors can assess modern slavery risks—again, as they do in Australia—so they are equipped with knowledge on that assessment. Thirdly, as it is a global problem that needs a global solution, we should work with our global allies to establish a taskforce, modelled on the taskforce on climate-related disclosures. Although the issue is different, the approach can be the same.

As it stands, financial services firms are a £9 trillion lever that we are not yet pulling in our fight against modern slavery. The UK is the largest net exporter of financial services in the world and the law change that I have proposed could make a difference in eradicating that horrendous crime. It would also protect and promote our democratic values at home and abroad. British savers and investors should never be used to support profit from human slavery. It matters for global Britain, as our leadership in this space will create prosperity at home and help to promote our values abroad. The situation that we walk past is the situation that we accept. It is an issue hidden in plain sight. We need to pull every lever we can to end it once and for all.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Rachel Maclean)]

It is a huge pleasure to be here serving under your chairmanship, Mr Robertson. I very much thank my hon. Friend the Member for Grantham and Stamford (Gareth Davies) for securing this vital debate and for bringing with him a wealth of experience from his distinguished career in the investment industry, which informs us all and helps us all to move further.

I also thank my predecessor, my right hon. Friend the Member for Staffordshire Moorlands (Karen Bradley). I really do feel that I have very big footsteps to follow in. I thank her for all her work in bringing the world-leading and groundbreaking Modern Slavery Act 2015 on to the statue book. Without her work, I certainly would not be here today talking about this subject, and it is absolutely right that we are. Thanks to her work, and that of others, last week we were able to mark Anti-Slavery Day and reflect on the trauma that victims suffer, the cruelty of those who exploit them and the bravery of survivors attempting to rebuild their lives. That was also a moment to reaffirm our commitment to confronting the evils of modern slavery, wherever and whenever they occur. They are utterly appalling crimes that have no place in our society. I very much welcome the interest shown by my friends today, including the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon), so that we can stamp out these crimes.

It is nice to pause and reflect on what we have already done as a Government. We have taken some very important strides forward in recent years, but of course there is more to do. These crimes continue to evolve and we must continue to evolve. As my friends have said, modern slavery is a global problem. We continue to provide global leadership to tackle it. During our G7 presidency, G7 members agreed to joint action on forced labour in global supply chains, and reaffirmed their commitment to upholding human rights and international labour standards. That is why we continue to invest heavily in tackling modern slavery. We have funded a new five-year modern slavery victim care contract to support victims to rebuild their lives. That new contract is worth £379 million over five years and will deliver a much-needed service that is based on need and better aligned to the requirements of individual victims. As we know, victims present with incredibly complex needs, and it is right that we have the support tailored for them.

The Home Office has invested a further £1.4 million this year to support the police’s response to modern slavery, bringing the total investment in policing to £15 million since 2016. That funding in the round has helped us to pursue perpetrators and drive an increase in modern slavery investigations and operations. Following our recognition that the nature of modern slavery has evolved over the years, the Home Secretary announced a review of the 2014 modern slavery strategy, which builds on the considerable progress, by adapting our approach and maintaining our position as an international leader in this area.

We will publish a new strategy next spring, which will set the strategic direction for years to come. Through the Modern Slavery Act 2015, the UK became the first country in the world to require businesses to report on the action they were taking to address modern slavery risk in their operations and supply chains. That legislation acts as a call to action for businesses, investors and the international human rights community—no doubt the businesses that my hon. Friends were involved in before they brought their expertise to this place.

Following the recommendations of the independent review of the Modern Slavery Act and a consultation, the Government committed to introduce an ambitious package of measures to strengthen our world-leading legislation on transparency in supply chains. We will extend the reporting requirements to public bodies, to leverage public procurement and address risks in public supply chains.

We will mandate specific reporting topics that statements must cover, set a single deadline for reporting, require organisations to publish their statements to a new Government registry for modern slavery statements, and introduce financial penalties for organisations that fail to meet their reporting obligations. Those changes require legislation, but I want to reassure colleagues that this Government remain committed to legislating on modern slavery and will implement the measures as soon as parliamentary time allows.

In addition to the changes we have already committed to make, we will consider our future approach to transparency in supply chains, as part of our modern slavery strategy review, including how we can best utilise the unique power—and pockets—of the financial sector, to tackle modern slavery.

Let me now turn to some of the specific points referenced in the debate. Individual organisations must focus on preventing harm in their practices. We do not believe that physical remoteness or being several steps away from the supply chain is an excuse. Investors do need to hold their organisations to account, as my hon. Friends so eloquently set out. People who are saving for their pensions or retirement should not be exposed to criminal activity.

I am grateful for all the work done by my hon. Friends the Member for Grantham and Stamford and for Totnes (Anthony Mangnall). Through their convening power, they have brought together financial institutions and organisations. I am also grateful for the work of the Independent Anti-slavery Commissioner, highlighting the role that the financial services sector has to play. It is clear that there is more to do, but investors can help to drive this change by fully harnessing their leverage. I highlighted that message this week at a meeting jointly hosted by the Home Office and CCLA, a fund manager, to discuss how Government, businesses and investors can work in partnership to tackle modern slavery. There are some really good examples of investor-led initiatives, with investors taking collective action, such as the CCLA-led Find It, Fix It, Prevent It and Rathbone’s Votes Against Slavery project.

However, we know that there is more to do here. While I am encouraged by the positive initiatives already under way, we need to make sure that we continue on the right track and that investors scrutinise their investment portfolios to engage and challenge companies on their response to modern slavery.

As hon. Members have said, when it comes to those environmental, social and governance issues, we know that businesses and investors have responded well to the environmental challenges they face. As we look to accelerate progress on tackling modern slavery, the Home Office is working with investors to understand what more we can do to encourage and incentivise businesses and investors to place the same emphasis on social issues. This issue is now, rightly, rising up the agenda.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank the Minister for her excellent response. Minister, last week in the press over a hundred MPs had signed a petition and a letter of concern about investment in Chinese companies, some of which are using Uyghur Muslims as slave labour. Is the hon. Lady able to give us any guidance on how we can take that further to try to make that stop?

[Rachel Maclean]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that. It is an egregious example of abuse of human rights; just because it is happening overseas does not mean that we should turn a blind eye to it. We in the Home Office are looking closely at all of these issues as part of our review of the modern slavery strategy. I would be very happy to continue in discussion with the hon. Gentleman to provide further reassurances on what can be done. However, I want to make very clear from this Dispatch Box that companies have a responsibility to their consumers and shareholders to do the right thing and not enable slavery in the pursuit of profit.

As we look to accelerate progress on tackling modern slavery, it does seem very challenging. However, we do know that the business and investor community has taken huge strides, and it has succeeded in making better, more informed green choices. We should hold and demand those same expectations for modern slavery. We should not walk by. We should not ignore the crimes that are hiding in plain sight.

My hon. Friend the Member for Grantham and Stamford called for the legislation to be extended to financial services so that they address modern slavery in their investment portfolios. I have taken close note of that. Legislation is important, but it is not the only factor driving responsible behaviour. Many organisations already report voluntarily under the Modern Slavery Act and publish modern slavery statements. I would strongly encourage any responsible organisation to do the same, and I would encourage shareholders and consumers to ask those questions about where they are putting their money and their investment.

I have noted very carefully the points that my right hon. Friend the Member for Staffordshire Moorlands and my hon. Friend the Member for Totnes made. I reassure them that we will consider extending the scope of section 54 as part of our strategy review.

In closing, let me once again express my thanks to my hon. Friend the Member for Grantham and Stamford for securing this debate on such an important subject. It is a real tribute to him to have brought forward a debate on a topic that is sometimes hidden, but should not be. I thank him for shining a light on all the work that the Government, many NGOs, my right hon. Friend the Member for Staffordshire Moorlands, the Anti-Slavery Commissioner and many others are doing. Modern slavery is utterly abhorrent, and I can assure hon. Members that this Government remain steadfast in our determination to root out such crimes, protect the vulnerable and support victims.

Question put and agreed to.

Violence Against Women and Girls: Police Response

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Rachel Maclean]

The hon. Gentleman is right to highlight this culture. He is also right to say that it is unacceptable. This type of violence against women and girls has no place in our society. Publishing the strategy is simply the first step. There are a number of actions that many actors in the system have to take. They include, but are not limited to, our significant public communication campaign, as well as working with our colleagues in education and schools, driving through our priorities and making it crystal clear that this culture has no place in our society and that we must tackle it.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I welcome the hon. Lady to her place and wish her well in her new ministerial role. Bearing in mind the shocking increase in domestic abuse throughout lockdown, has any consideration been given to allocating additional funding to women’s aid charities to help them to make contact with their vulnerable clients and to offer them the help that they very much need?

[Rachel Maclean]

The hon. Gentleman will be aware of the landmark Domestic Abuse Act 2021 that we have passed, and we will be publishing our domestic abuse strategy setting out more detail of how we will work across the whole system to ensure that those places of safety are rightly available. Any conversations around funding are a matter for our colleagues in the Treasury, but he should be in no doubt that we are strongly advocating to see adequate funding going into those vital services.

Salisbury Incident 2018: Update

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 21st September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Priti Patel]

The hon. Lady is absolutely right, as have been many other right hon. and hon. Members, to touch on the cyber-security threat to our country. Of course, cyber-threats manifest themselves in many forms and guises, from attacks on key and critical national infrastructure right down through attacks on local government, financial institutions and retail outlets. Extensive work takes place across the entire UK intelligence community. The National Cyber Security Centre is led by incredible individuals with whom we have the privilege to work on a daily basis, and there is work across the Cabinet Office as well. Extensive work is taking place in the cyber space, and not just Russia but other countries are involved in the cyber-threat. When it comes to cyber, all Members have a responsibility to ensure that we take all the necessary measures and steps, and our local authorities and the organisations that we come across on a daily basis should also make sure that they are doing everything to enhance their cyber-security.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the Secretary of State for her statement. Among those in and outside the House, there can be no doubt about the Secretary of State’s determination to catch those responsible for the murder of British citizens on British soil by subversive Russian agents. Will the Secretary of State confirm what discussions she has had with other countries regarding the parameters of diplomatic immunity and whether we need to and should reconsider them?

[Priti Patel]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right about the need to work with other countries and, as I said earlier, to use every diplomatic lever we have. Post the appalling Salisbury incident in 2018, we saw the work led by our then Prime Minister, my right hon. Friend the Member for Maidenhead (Mrs May), and the collective diplomatic effort in terms of expulsions and sanctions. I touched on the fact that the Foreign Secretary is currently in New York at the UN General Assembly, and we are in no doubt that we are pressing every single lever. The FCDO and the Foreign Secretary will rightly lead on the key discussions.

Local Policing

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 7th September 2021 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Gentleman on securing this debate and support what he just said about community policing. The difficulties to which the hon. Member for Birmingham, Erdington (Jack Dromey) referred are replicated throughout the whole of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that community policing, to which he has referred, with local faces and compassion, understanding and an unwavering desire to serve the local community, is what is needed? Furthermore, does he also agree that the creation or enhancement of such a force needs the necessary investment and funding?

[Andrew Bowie]

I absolutely agree with everything that my hon. Friend said. Given that we are speaking about police forces throughout the whole United Kingdom, we should pay special recognition to the Police Service of Northern Ireland, which does so much on a daily basis, in incredibly difficult circumstances that are not faced by any other police service in this country, to maintain the peace and safety of the people in my hon. Friend’s constituency of Strangford and, indeed, throughout the whole of Northern Ireland. I am glad that he brought that point to the House.

Policing is, of course, devolved. That decision was taken in 1999 and is one that I wholeheartedly support, for I believe that, just as with our continued support for locally elected police and crime commissioners, the power over such things should lie at the level that is the closest possible to the public. But that does not mean that policing exists in a vacuum or silo, and that is even more true in the digital age. Our forces co-operate on a number of fronts, up and down the country. That being the case, I envisaged this debate as an opportunity for MPs from every part of the United Kingdom—we have heard from the west midlands and Northern Ireland—and of all parties to reflect on the challenges faced by local policing in their constituencies, whether because of geography, financing or the impact of covid-19.

Let me give some examples. In my constituency, following the tragedy on the railway at Carmont last year, we saw the British Transport police keeping passengers safe and working closely with Police Scotland to secure the site and assist the investigation. In the largest joint operation to take place in Scotland—and perhaps throughout Britain—Operation Venetic involved police forces throughout the UK and the National Crime Agency. It resulted, in July last year, in 59 arrests; the seizure of £7 million of laundered cash, along with guns, ammunition, explosives, stolen vehicles and industrial pill presses; and a major haul of drugs of every classification. It ended in the takedown of a digital platform, EncroChat, used by criminals around the world to get poison into all our communities—technology that did not respect borders, political or geographical.

In the north-east of Scotland, which is my part of the world, we have seen many examples of what is known, perhaps too blithely, as cuckooing. It is the last step in what is often referred to as county lines drug trafficking, where dealers from large cities expand their operations into smaller towns. They endeavour to exploit young and vulnerable people to sell drugs, carry cash and weapons, bringing violence, coercion and abuse. They may also take over a vulnerable person’s house. Again, this is where policing blurs lines between public protection and being present and knowledgeable in the communities where officers live and work, acting on intelligence that has been passed on by colleagues in the north of England or the Metropolitan police.

That brings me on to the subject proper of local policing, particularly the presence and visibility of local officers. Even today, I have obtained figures that show a serious reduction in the number of beat bobbies since 2017—almost 80 officers in A division of Police Scotland alone. Of course it can be shown that the number of national officers has increased, but that is of little value to someone who has been broken into in Kemnay or in Laurencekirk in my constituency. Our hard-working officers on the frontline in Aberdeenshire, which I am lucky to represent, deserve to be fully resourced, and I am sorry to say that the closure of stations across my constituency will only heighten the problems. Communities such as Portlethen, which I represent, deserve more police patrolling in their streets, just as they do in the west midlands and in Northern Ireland. Indeed, if Portlethen police station closes, officers will be based 10 miles away in Stonehaven.

Sadly, despite the excellent work of individual officers and cross-border working on so many issues, we have seen over the past few years an increase in the centralisation of police services in Scotland. In 2013, we saw the loss of local accountability following the merger of eight police forces in Scotland into Police Scotland, which is governed by the Scottish Police Authority and accountable solely to Scottish Ministers. In 2017, we saw the closure of the Aberdeen and Inverness Control Rooms, which followed Dumfries, Stirling and Glenrothes, with the whole country now covered by Dundee, Motherwell and Glasgow.

It is now questioned whether Peel ever said that

“the police are the public and the public are the police”,

but that very principle is at the heart of how the police in the United Kingdom operate. Very often, it is about the presence of the police in the community that can make people feel safer and more secure. At the very heart of that principle—at the very heart of how we police this country and of how our people are protected from harm—is the idea of local community policing, by which I mean a police presence in each local community.

Police Scotland, especially the north-east division, is an excellent police force. Its officers carry out their duties diligently and with commitment to the people of the communities they serve. I am proud to say that I often hear constituents praising police officers, but I fear that the work that they do, particularly in the Old Grampian police area in the north-east of Scotland, is being undercut by decisions being made elsewhere.

Across Scotland, since 2015, 134 police stations have been closed, including five in Aberdeenshire, a large part of which I am privileged to represent. In Aberdeenshire, notwithstanding the incredible work of local police officers, crime has increased by 5% in this period. Figures show that police numbers have dropped by almost 80 since 2017. How is the main priority of local policing—keeping people safe through a community-based approach—to be achieved if we do not have the numbers or the proper resources? Our communities and our hardworking officers on the frontline deserve better.

I know that the Minister on the Front Bench has no responsibility for these decisions being taken in Edinburgh, but as a constituency MP, I have had hundreds of emails and letters about local policing matters since my election to this place in 2017. Although I know that, by the powers of his office, he cannot effect most of these decisions, I believe that I have a duty as a locally elected representative to raise these concerns brought to me by my constituents in this sovereign parliament of the United Kingdom, to which I have been lucky enough to be elected.

In response to a local consultation on the proposed closure of its police station, more than 100 residents of Portlethen, a large and growing commuter town on the edge of Aberdeen, expressed their concern that a permanent presence in their community would be lost. Many people expressed their concern that, on the occasions that they had knocked on the door, there was no one in; and few people had called in due to the common knowledge that it was unstaffed most of the time. However, to me that is a result of understaffing and a lack of investment, not an argument to close the station and create a hub at Stonehaven, 10 miles further down the coast. Portlethen is a growing town, close to Aberdeen city, on the east coast main line.

I am not for one minute suggesting that I or the community are wedded to the existing building—having visited it, it is clear that it is not what the public expect of a modern police station—but to remove the permanent physical presence of the police from Portlethen altogether is a move based on budgetary decisions in Edinburgh rather than on the needs of the local area. It will mean that police officers will be worked even harder than they are; that they will, by necessity, provide a more reactive service with less ability to provide proactive intelligence gathering; and, ultimately, a reduction in the level of community policing that we know is valued by all our constituents across the UK.

The North East division of Police Scotland is 60 officers under establishment. We know the pressure that police services across the country are under, not least in this year of dealing with enforcing covid regulations, securing the G7 and preparing for COP26, on top of all their usual duties. The closure of Portlethen police station, as an example of a move away from having a permanent police presence in our communities, is a worry to many people. I urge those in charge to look at alternatives—not necessarily maintaining the present building, but using imagination and investment to build a better and more visible police force in my part of the country.

Let me be clear that I do not blame Police Scotland. I do, however, point the finger of blame at others with responsibility. For example, one of the biggest barriers to keeping police offices open, even for a few hours a week in more rural areas, is actually non-domestic rates. This issue is not specific to Scotland, but Police Scotland’s capital spending is ranked at 38 out of the 42 UK forces when considered per employee. I wonder whether we would be seeing these decisions in Scotland today if we had more local accountability in Scotland—elected police commissioners, or even local authority police boards with a connection to local communities.

Every constituency in this House is represented by passionate, committed Members of Parliament. We know and hear the concerns of our constituents on a whole heap of issues every day. I could not not raise those concerns when presented with this opportunity today. I therefore thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker, for indulging me in raising on the Floor of the House what is nominally a devolved issue. I also thank the Minister, who I know will join me in thanking all those in the police service across the entire UK for keeping us safe; will commend the police forces for their incredible cross-border work across our one nation; and will reiterate our commitment to and our championing of local policing, be that in Aberdeenshire or anywhere else on these islands.

Strategy for Tackling Violence Against Women and Girls

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Wednesday 21st July 2021 Commons Chamber

[Victoria Atkins]

I thank my hon. Friend, who has been a strong campaigner for some time on modern slavery and on the care of victims of modern slavery. On the care of children, the national referral mechanism applies to adults, but children go into children’s services because of the statutory requirements under the Children Act 1989. I am, however, interested to hear how he believes support could be improved. The Government have, as he may know, set out plans to refresh the modern slavery strategy in the coming months and I would be pleased to meet him to understand where he believes that could be improved.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the Minister for her encouraging statement. No one can doubt her clear personal commitment; I appreciate that very much. I welcome this move to take every available step to tackle violence against women and girls; it is not before time. The new strategy involves new legislation to deal with stalking, forced marriage and female genital mutilation, and yet, as the shadow Minister said, more work needs to be done on sexual assault and rape. Recent Home Office statistics show that 83% of sexual assaults go unreported. What additional work will be done to encourage victims to come forward about their assaults? What will be done—I say this respectfully—to fix the lack of trust there is between victims of violence and the policing system?

[Victoria Atkins]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for dealing with some important points in a sensitive way. He will know that, alongside the violence against women and girls strategy, only a matter of weeks ago we published the rape review, which is focused on the end-to-end results of the criminal justice system from the moment at which the police record a crime through to a conviction or the other ways in which a case can be finalised. There is a real action plan in that rape review dealing specifically with rape prosecutions, and that forms part of our work to tackle this.

On building trust, a measure in the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill sets out and clarifies the law on the extraction of data from mobile phones. This will not apply for every victim of sexual offences, but for many victims handing over their phone and losing it for months at a time has a real impact on their willingness to continue with the investigation, if indeed they volunteer at all. Through the Bill, we will be able to clarify the law and ensure that victims are treated properly in that regard. Of course, the rape helpline that we have announced in the strategy will also go a long way to helping victims have the immediate support they need, as and when they need it.

Nationality and Borders Bill

Jim Shannon Excerpts

2nd reading
Tuesday 20th July 2021 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I wish not only to speak about the Bill, but to describe the type of Bill that I would like it to be. The Minister and I have similar opinions on many matters, and I know that he has spoken about these matters before, so I am fairly hopeful that in Committee we can make changes to bring about what I would like to see in place.

I am ever minded that children from the Kindertransport came to my constituency during the second world war. They came to my constituency because they had nowhere else to go. When it comes to speaking in debates on this topic—and I have spoken in many—I express my belief that there is a right to flee persecution on religious grounds. We want to see the safer legal route to which the Government have referred; I certainly do, as chair of the all-party parliamentary group for international freedom of religion or belief. We speak up for those with Christian beliefs, those with other beliefs and those with no beliefs.

Across the world, so many people find themselves in positions where they cannot practise their religion, or enjoy the human rights that we enjoy in this country. When it comes to putting a legal system and an immigration system in place, I look to the Minister, because I see in him someone who encapsulates what I believe to be a system that helps people in other parts of the world to relocate here because of the persecution they have been experiencing.

[Alison Thewliss]

The hon. Gentleman is making a good point about religious persecution. Does he agree that sometimes it is the very Governments of the countries that people are from who engage in and endorse such persecution? That makes it all the more important that we have safe and legal routes, because those Governments would not allow people to leave their country.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank the hon. Lady for her intervention. I agree with her.

The Minister knows that I have been a great supporter of the Syrian resettlement scheme throughout. I was glad whenever we were able to send people to Newtonards town and families were able to relocate. The Government bodies and the Churches that were there brought communities together to help. Those people are well settled today. None of them want to go home. Their home is now Newtonards in my constituency. Will there be more opportunities through the Syrian resettlement scheme? If there are, I believe we can produce a safe haven in Strangford and across the whole of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

The world is a dangerous place. People are persecuted because of their religious views. Their human rights are abused. I would like to think that the United Kingdom has a reputation for being a generous country, and part of that lies with having a fair and efficient asylum process for those who need it. Recent stats show that in the year ending March 2021 the UK received 26,903 asylum applications, meaning that possibly that number of people needed a better life with better choices and better opportunities. There has been a lack of direction in the past number of years regarding the position of asylum seekers, meaning that people are left in disarray, unable to seek work or resettle. I want to see that system improved in the future; access to the UK asylum system should be based on need, not ability to pay people smugglers, to whom other hon. Members have referred.

Detention Action—a charity that dedicates much time to ensuring fairness for asylum seekers—has used a great slogan to describe the situation. It says:

“It is political will—rather than legislation—”.

That is wholeheartedly accurate. Welfare should be at the core of legislation. In 2019, 24,400 people entered immigration detention in the UK—the lowest figure since 2009. However, I am not classifying that figure as necessarily low.

Another major issue surrounding the Bill is that young children are being placed in immigration detention. I made that point to the Secretary of State yesterday. I make it again today because it is a key issue for me and where I am. I want to see young children getting opportunities. They are often separated from their parents and family members. They come here and are sent straight into detention. The Secretary of State mentioned it yesterday, and I very much look forward to seeing changes on that. I wish to see legislation to protect children, particularly those who are fleeing persecution.

The Government have stated that they will support victims of modern slavery. What they have said so far is good news, and it is important that we have on record where we are on that. The Government have also stated that they wish to give people the opportunity to come here if they are under any distress in other countries. While asylum seeking is something that we should take seriously, illegal immigration also needs to be taken into consideration when discussing the Bill. In the year 2020-21 alone—I conclude with this comment, Mr Deputy Speaker, ever mindful of your request about time—3,500 people are said to have crossed the Channel to enter the UK illegally to work and live without the correct documentation. Both issues need to be given the same importance, and I urge the Minister to shed some light on the steps that he will be taking to address both. A humane approach must be used when discussing such a sensitive issue. Individuals should not be criminalised for seeking asylum. A sustainable system needs to be in place for those who want to enter the UK and can legally do so. There should not be a prolonged process. More important, asylum seekers should not be mistreated.

I call on the Home Office and the Minister to provide the necessary assurance that the United Kingdom can and will deliver a trustworthy haven for those who seek asylum. I wish to see in the legislation that we give protection for those overseas who are persecuted because of their religion and whose human rights are abused.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I thank Mr Shannon for his co-operation, but the Clerk informs me that trauma management is one of his specialities, so we have decided to introduce a five-minute limit, which means that we will now get everyone in. I will call Peter Gibson next. If you do not mind, Peter, could you stick to that limit?

Tackling Knife Crime

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 20th July 2021 Westminster Hall

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Paisley. I thank the hon. Member for Luton North (Sarah Owen) for setting the scene so well, and I associate myself with all her comments. As I always do, I am trying to put myself in the hon. Lady’s position in relation to her constituent, and I would have found it very hard to deal with that situation. It is never easy.

This is a topic that I feel we have been discussing and debating for years and, sadly, it seems to be an ongoing issue, with crime figures still on the higher side and continuous calls for the Government to act. I am of a certain age, and I was a member of the boy scouts. I remember well that we each had a small penknife. What did we use them for? To make bows and arrows, to carve sticks and for all the innocent purposes a boy scout would. Today, however, in the society we live in, things are very different.

I want to go back to basics and ask why knife crime is such an issue to begin with. Knife crime is a complex social problem, as hon. Members have said when they have spoken about the issues in their own constituencies. It is a symptom of toxic environments that are created around younger children. Socialised by their peers from a young age, these children grow up to become the perpetrators of such violence. Knife crime figures may be higher in certain sections of the United Kingdom, but such crime impacts on all regions of the United Kingdom, including back home in Northern Ireland.

I will give an example. I told you this story at the table last night, Mr Paisley, and I told it to the hon. Member for Lewisham East (Janet Daby) beforehand. My son is the manager of a shop in Newtownards. I met him on a Monday morning when I went to collect the paper as usual, but he was outside and the shutter was down. I asked, “Jimmy, what’s wrong?”, and he said, “Dad, I was robbed last night at five to 10.”

The guy who came to rob him had a long-handled fish-knife, and in all honesty he was probably spaced out. Jimmy said to him, “Look, the tills are cleared. We clear them early. All we have here is the £50 float.” The man pushed by him with the knife, and Jimmy said, “If you want the float, take the float; don’t stab me. Take the two bottles of Buckfast and move on.”

As I said to the hon. Lady beforehand, in this case, the better part of valour was to do nothing. It is not as if Jimmy is not courageous or does not stand up for himself; he was also a manager of a shop in a different part of Northern Ireland and he got to know people like that quite well. On other occasions, when he knew who the people were and they tried to rob him but they did not have knives, he took them on. In many cases, the police were called to arrest them.

The point I am making is: why do these people use knives? The knife this man had was a large fish-knife. We have a fishing community in our area; did the knife come from there? Those knives are incredibly sharp. One wrong move, and we could be looking at a very different situation. The point is that it is not just a problem in the constituencies of the hon. Members for Luton North, for Lewisham East, for Vauxhall (Florence Eshalomi), and for Sefton Central (Bill Esterson). It is a problem across the whole of the United Kingdom, and it is particularly worrying. It is worrying because a person can get a knife from their kitchen. They can take one from their job down in the fishing ports in Portavogie. They can lift one up in a shop, or from the hardware shop two or three doors up. That is how easy it is.

Recent police recorded crime figures published by the Office for National Statistics show a 2% increase in the number of knife offences recorded: from 35,146 in the year ending March 2019 to 35,815 in the year ending March 2020. It has continued to increase since 2013. I am looking to the Minister—I am not being critical, by the way, and I always try to be constructive in my comments—but the frustration is, how do we stop this crime? That is the question we are all asking. How can we stop it happening? I look to the Minister in the hope that he will give us some encouragement. I know that the Government are doing lots of things; I always like to give credit where credit is due. They have lots of strategies and policies, but I want to put forward something for down the line, which I hope the Minister, in conjunction with other Ministers, will take on board.

We have proof that current ways, means and legislation are not working. I say that really respectfully. Across mainland England there is an increasingly concerning issue with knife crime in schools. In 2019, 45,000 young people aged 10 to 17 were sentenced for carrying a knife or offensive weapon, with more than 1,000 of these weapons found on school property. In my day, school was always a safe place to be. We have to ask how we can make it the safe place that it was before. Every one of us today wants to make sure that that can happen again. Why do they carry knives? I cannot fathom why they do. If they carry one, the use of it is not too far away. It is easy to pull it out and then the inevitable can happen. We want to stop that.

The police recorded 275 murders involving a knife or sharp object in the 12 months between April 2019 and April 2020; 23 were children under 17 years of age. Why are under-17s being stabbed to their deaths, and what further action can we take to stop that from happening? The Ben Kinsella Trust, a leading charity in tackling knife crime, has also revealed that from April 2020 to July 2020 there was a 54% increase in hospital admissions for those who were victims of knife crimes. What discussions has the Government had with the Ben Kinsella Trust? There are charities working on the frontline. They must know the symptoms and must have an idea of how to respond to try to control it.

As a possible way forward, there should be more mandatory resources available, particularly for young people, where the danger of knife crime is brought to light. If it happens in a certain area and if it happens on a regular basis, we need to put resources and time into trying to address the issues. All too often, children are blamed and stereotyped for societal issues surrounding knife crime, but the bigger picture is not evaluated. It is all very well to sometimes point the finger without looking at the source of why the problems happen.

For example, I stated earlier that these situations are created around younger children. Ultimately, it can be said that they do not know any better. In some cases, they might not, but they have to be taught what it means to carry a knife. Growing up, we were all taught to do as we were told and to obey our elders. Again, that is a generational thing. I think a lot of us will subscribe to that. Can we really place full blame on the young people?

I believe there is a partnership for the Minister on schooling and education; I hope we get an assurance on that when he replies. This is a crucial element in the debate. It is critical. It is not just the responsibility of the Minster here today; it is the education Minister’s, too. A partnership of the two together could try to address the issue.

Schools are a safe place for children, and the correct facilities should be in place to reassure them that they can talk about issues surrounding knife crime. How do we do that? We need to have teachers available to engage with children and look out for them. I am not saying that they are not doing that; teachers are very responsive to their pupils. However, if young people are worried about getting mixed up with the wrong crowds, support needs to be available.

If a pupil tells a teacher that their friend carries whatever it may be, we need to be able to respond, to take that pupil away and to address the issue for their friend. I therefore call again on the Secretary of State for Education—it is not the responsibility of the Minister—to ensure that schools in England have the funding to add that support for children, so that partnership between schooling and policing can work successfully.

I would also like to mention the relationship between local communities and our policing systems across the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. We need to focus on maintaining a steady and trusting relationship between the two. It is really important that local communities and the police come together—another partnership—to work out how we can provide safety for our young people, as opposed to provoking violence and hatred.

The hon. Member for Luton North referred to the “Bin Your Blade” campaign, and I commend her for supporting it. I hope that it encourages people to come forward, discard weapons and seek help to become better people. It is the second time today that the hon. Lady and I have been in a debate: we did the first one this morning, we are doing another this afternoon. These are important issues that we are dealing with on behalf of our constituents.

There is no time for complacency when it comes to any crime, but especially when it is a crime that is killing hundreds of our young people. It cannot go on. When I read about cases in the press or see them on the TV, I do not know the cases, but I always see the pictures and they tell me about a family that is devastated because their loved one has been killed by knife crime. That has a lasting effect on everyone in the family. Mr Paisley, you and I, coming from Northern Ireland, know that the ripples from those things go long and deep. I cannot begin to imagine the harrowing phone calls that parents must face.

I therefore call on the Minister to encourage the Home Secretary and the Education Secretary to work in partnership. I encourage the Minister to ask communities groups and police to engage together in a more effective way. All those bodies, Ministers and local bodies must get together and take all the steps that they can to reduce knife crime in the United Kingdom.

If we can save one life, and we can stop the heartache of others, we will have done a good job. I very much look forward to the Minister’s response; I look forward to the SNP spokesperson’s and shadow Minister’s responses as well. What the Minister has heard today is a small capsule of what we all think: what we need is something more effective. I hope that the Minister will have answers.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jim Shannon]

In my contribution, I referred to the need for a strategy or partnership between the Minister’s Department and education. Is that part of the strategy? If it is, I believe that is core to changing the mindset but also to improving the situation. I just ask the question.

[Kit Malthouse]

That is a good question. It is certainly the case that violence reduction units, which are led locally, include wider education programmes, and I have seen good examples of that. They are there to generally educate young people about the dangers of carrying a knife, and the fact that someone carrying a knife is more likely to be a victim than to protect themselves. I have seen some imaginative use of such programmes. I was in the west midlands a couple of weeks ago, where a virtual reality set-up was used with schoolchildren to indicate to them the best way in which to continue their lives.

I know that the hon. Gentleman has taken a strong interest in the Bill. It contains serious violence reduction orders, which give the police the power, as the hon. Member for Croydon Central pointed out, to stop those individuals who are known knife carriers, and are known to have been convicted in the past and to have shown a proclivity to violence. They are designed to discourage and deter people from carrying weapons, given the increased likelihood of getting caught, and to protect offenders—to give them an excuse to move away from being drawn into exploitation by criminal gangs.

Nationality and Borders Bill

Jim Shannon Excerpts

2nd reading
Monday 19th July 2021 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

rose—

[Stuart C. McDonald]

Will the Secretary of State give way?

--- Later in debate ---

[Priti Patel]

No, I am giving way to the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon), who has been waiting patiently.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank the Home Secretary for giving way. One of the things that greatly concerns me and others in this House, and I know it concerns her, is the children held in immigration detention. The figure has dropped since 2019, down to 73, but they often arrive having been separated from their family, or they arrive unaccompanied, unaware that they will be placed in detention straightaway. What will be done to help children in particular?

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Speaker]

Excellent—perfect timing.

Ordered, That the debate be now adjourned.—(Maria Caulfield.)

Debate to be resumed tomorrow.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. For those who were on the list and were not called—there were a few people left—can I just ask for your direction and help? Will those who were not successful today be called tomorrow?

[Mr Speaker]

First, I do not think that was quite a point of order. I think you want some clarification for tomorrow and, Jim, I presume you must be acting for others and not yourself when you ask that question. I would say that I think those Members who did not get in today will automatically be put on the list for tomorrow, and I hope those who do not want to be on the list will withdraw.

Prevention and Suppression of Terrorism

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 13th July 2021 Commons Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Chris Philp)]

I beg to move,

That the draft Terrorism Act 2000 (Proscribed Organisations) (Amendment) (No. 2) Order 2021, which was laid before this House on 12 July, be approved.

This motion would ordinarily have been moved by my right hon. Friend the Member for Old Bexley and Sidcup (James Brokenshire), who sadly had to step down from his role as Security Minister a few days ago to assist in his recovery from serious illness. I am sure the whole House will want to join me in sending him our best wishes for a very speedy recovery.

This Government are committed to taking all necessary steps to protect the people of this country. Tackling terrorism, in all its forms, is a crucial part of that mission. This Government’s concerns regarding extreme right-wing terrorism are well documented.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I reassure the Minister and the Government that my party fully supports the motion, but does he not agree that we must send an appropriate message that those on the extremes, whether on the left or the so-called right, must understand that the huge majority of this UK abhor what they do and will not tolerate it, and that there will be continual proscription of cells such as the one in today’s motion? We should call them out for what they are: despicable terrorist cells.

[Chris Philp]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. This House, and the whole country, is united in our disgust for terrorism of all kinds. It is right that we call out these organisations, whatever colour they claim to have, and that we are united in our total condemnation of terrorist acts wherever they may occur.

The use of hateful ideologies to prey on young and vulnerable people is abhorrent and we have a responsibility to do everything in our power to crack down. Terrorist groups can now recruit, radicalise and train individuals from a distance, distributing terrorist material at the click of a button. The use of the internet for these purposes has had a huge impact on the threat and on the way we respond to it.

There are 77 terrorist organisations currently proscribed under the Terrorism Act 2000. Four are far-right groups; the majority are Islamist groups. Thanks to the dedication, courage and skill of counter-terrorism police and our security and intelligence services, most of those groups have never carried out a successful attack on UK soil. I pay tribute to our security services for the work that they have done.

Proscription is a powerful tool for degrading terrorist organisations; I will explain shortly the impact that it can have. The group that we propose to add to the list of proscribed terrorist organisations by amending schedule 2 to the 2000 Act is called The Base; it is a predominantly US-based militant white supremacist group whose activities include seeking to train members with weapons and explosives.

The proscription power arises under section 3 of the 2000 Act. Under that section, the Home Secretary has the power to proscribe an organisation if she believes that it is currently concerned in terrorism. Where that statutory test is met, the Home Secretary may then exercise her discretion.

The effect of proscription is to outlaw the listed organisation, ensuring that it cannot operate in the UK. It is designed to degrade a group’s ability to operate by enabling prosecution for various related offences, allowing the removal of online material, underpinning immigration-related measures such as excluding group members from the UK, and making it possible to seize cash associated with the organisation. It is a criminal offence for a person to belong to, support or meet a proscribed organisation, and a criminal offence to wear clothing or articles that may arouse reasonable suspicion that that individual is a member of that group. Penalties include a maximum 14-year prison term and an unlimited fine.

The Home Secretary takes decisions on proscription only after great care and consideration of the evidence. Having considered carefully all the evidence in this case, the Home Secretary, informed by analysis by the joint terrorism analysis centre, believes that The Base is concerned in terrorism and that the discretionary factors support proscription. This abhorrent group, as I have said, is a predominantly US-based white supremacist militant group that seeks to radicalise and train people for potentially violent activities. It almost certainly prepares for terrorism. We believe that the training that it provides is highly likely to be paramilitary in nature and is possibly preparatory for offensive action.

We therefore believe that the statutory test is met and that the group should be proscribed. That will aid the police in their work to disrupt the threat that extreme right-wing terrorist groups pose to our national security, and will build on the robust action that the Government have already taken in the area, proscribing groups such as National Action, the Sonnenkrieg Division, the Feuerkrieg Division and Atomwaffen, which the House proscribed just a few months ago. It sends a strong statement of intent that their ideology is unacceptable and that the UK is a hostile environment for terrorism in all its forms.

Our message is clear: we will always take every possible action to counter the threat from those who hate the values that we cherish and who threaten our safety. The safety and security of the public is our No. 1 priority. I commend the draft order to the House.

Delays in the Asylum System

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Wednesday 7th July 2021 Westminster Hall

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

It is a pleasure to speak in this debate, Mr Mundell—thank you for calling me. I thank the hon. Member for Stockport (Navendu Mishra) for securing the debate. He and I have been in many debates together over the last two days, and I am sure there will be many more where we will be on the same side.

The way we treat asylum seekers is something that I have spoken about on numerous times in this House and the message remains the same. I am not changing my stance; I cannot give encouragement to the Government. I believe in the immigration system, I understand that an open-door policy cannot work in terms of security and in distribution of resources, but I also believe that we have a duty of care to help those who do not have the capacity to help themselves. While they are in the process of determining their status, we must do better by them.

The hon. Member for Stockport referred to the Baptist church in his town and I want to refer to all the faith groups in my constituency who are enormously active in trying to help in every way. I give credit to the Government and the Minister in particular for the Syrian resettlement scheme, which was an excellent scheme in my constituency. Six Syrian families needed help at a time when they were under pressure. The churches came together collectively and ecumenically in a great way, Government bodies came together, and the people came together. It was a superb scheme. Is there any intention of doing something similar in a wider sense in the future?

I was contacted by the British Red Cross regarding the asylum process. It highlighted the need we are facing and the steps that it believes must be taken. I am happy to give it voice this afternoon. Since the outbreak of the covid-19 pandemic, we have supported more than 30,000 people at all stages of the refugee and asylum process across 58 UK cities and towns, including people who are being accommodated in hotels and military barracks. That shows the scale of the issue faced by the asylum system at present.

I am quite fond of the British Red Cross, which does excellent work. We should give it credit. It asks for the expansion of safe routes for people to reach the UK; improvements in asylum decision making to ensure decisions are made quickly and are right the first time, which is important to retaining confidence; and the provision of the right support to people, at the right time, so that they can engage with the asylum system and integrate successfully.

I totally agree with all those requests. Last week, or perhaps this week, the Home Secretary referred to the family who were trafficked from across the water and who were forced on to a dinghy at gunpoint. The two wee girls were left on the shore. They have not seen them since. That is an example that makes your heart ache. We are all touched by the images of children in dinghies trying to make their way here, but I agree that they should not have gotten this far. However, given that they are here, should we not treat them with the same care and respect with which we would want our own children to be treated? Should we not ensure that they are living free from fear? Above all, should we not extend our compassion? We should and we must.

I recently read an article highlighting that the queue for asylum decisions is nine times longer than it was 10 years ago, rising from 3,588 in 2010 to 33,016 in 2020. The number of children waiting more than a year for an initial decision has risen twelvefold from 563 to 6,887, and 55 applicants who applied as children have been waiting five years, as referred to by some hon. Members here. I have great respect for the Minister and believe that he has an interest in this subject and wants to help, so what is being done to shorten those waiting times?

In conclusion, there are simple and straightforward changes that can and must be made. They will not allow more people in; they will simply help us to treat those who are here better. They seek to cut the waiting times for decisions and improve the mechanisms for living while waiting, which is right and proper. I look forward to working with the Minister and charitable bodies, such as Red Cross and Mears, which has the contract in Northern Ireland to supply accommodation for asylum seekers, to see how we can collectively do this in a better way.

--- Later in debate ---

[Chris Philp]

The German scheme was not a resettlement scheme. What Angela Merkel did briefly in 2015 was simply declare that their borders were open. About 1 million people irregularly just crossed into Germany, many of whom were not from Syria or Afghanistan. That was not a resettlement scheme; that was essentially mass illegal migration. With our resettlement scheme, which we do properly in partnership with the UNHCR, we go directly to dangerous places around Syria, although we plan to expand that in future. We identify people in need of protection and bring them to the UK from dangerous places such as Syria, or near Syria, rather than have them make dangerous, illegal journeys across Europe first. That is the right way to do it. We are committing to safe and legal routes and to being fair to people in genuine need via the Bill, but at the same time it is important that we are firm where people abuse the system.

There are problems with our legal system, to which the hon. Member for Enfield, Southgate (Bambos Charalambous) referred. The legal system often gets protracted in the most extraordinary way when people make repeated claims often over a period of years, many of which turn out to be without merit, and yet they can do that repeatedly, which does not serve anybody’s interest. Partly as a result of that, there are now for the first time ever more than 10,000 foreign national offenders circulating in the community, which is an unacceptable situation that we intend to act on.

It is worth saying a word about illegal migration. When people come here from France—I am thinking about the small boats—that journey is unnecessary, because somebody coming from France is not directly fleeing a war zone. Calais, and France more generally, is not a dangerous place. They do not need to leave France to claim protection or asylum because France has a well-functioning asylum system, and so does Germany, Belgium, Holland, Spain, Italy and the other European countries that people have passed through. No one needs to cross the English channel in a rubber dinghy to claim asylum. They should claim it ideally in the first safe place that they arrive in, which would include France.

Such journeys are dangerous. People have died. A family of five, including an 18-month-old boy, died trying to cross the channel last October. There have been incidents where ruthless people smugglers who take money to facilitate illegal routes have threatened people with guns, including a family that was separated because the people smuggler they had paid to smuggle them into the country turned on them. We should all seek to shut down those routes. It is not humanitarian to have people smugglers paid to smuggle people across the channel. It is dangerous and unnecessary, and we should stop it. Routes into the country should be safe and legal, not dangerous and illegal, and that is the objective of the Nationality and Borders Bill, which I am sure we will debate at length in a few weeks’ time.

Specifically on delays in the asylum system, it is true to say that the delays are considerably higher now than they were a year ago. A great deal of that is due to the disruption caused to the asylum decision-making system by covid, which has obviously affected many areas of our life. It has affected us here in Parliament. We are still sitting here wearing masks and having remote proceedings. It has affected the NHS, our call system, all of our national life, and the asylum system has been affected in the same way.

For some months last year, asylum interviews stopped entirely because it was considered unsafe to have a face-to-face asylum interview. People who worked in asylum decision-making offices, including in my own borough of Croydon and elsewhere in Glasgow, Liverpool, Leeds and other places, were not able to go into the office in the normal way to take asylum decisions and conduct interviews, and that has been enormously disruptive over, roughly speaking, the past year and three months, which means that the number of decisions taken in the past year has been dramatically lower, and we have not yet fully recovered.

We are still sitting here wearing masks, and the asylum decision-making process has not fully recovered either, which means the backlog and delays have built up. I agree with the points made by hon. Members that the delays are not what we want to see at all. For those whose claims will be granted, clearly we do not want to see them kept in limbo for protracted periods of time. If they are going to have their asylum claim granted, it is much better that it is done quickly so that they can move on with their lives. Equally, if the asylum claim is rejected, we should then look to move them to the country of origin quickly, because if someone’s claim is not genuine, it is only right and fair that they are removed. Whether it is accepted or rejected, we need faster decision making. That is a completely fair point.

[Jim Shannon]

Will the Minister and the Government set targets for the reduction in numbers? If targets were set, we could see goals being achieved.

[Chris Philp]

That is an interesting point. We had a six-month operational guideline previously, but that was moved away from in order to try to focus resources on the cases that most need attention. For example, priority is given to cases involving children. Hon. Members have mentioned that some cases have been waiting a long time. We are now putting a particular focus on trying to resolve those long-standing cases, so a slightly more holistic view has been taken, but I will take away the hon. Gentleman’s point and mention the idea, which I know was offered in a constructive spirit, to my hon. Friend the Member for Torbay.

Actions are being taken to address the issue that we have been discussing. First, we have been introducing remote interviewing by video link, like we are using now. We did not really have that at all about a year ago. It has now been introduced and its usage is more widespread. Indeed, for reasons of convenience for applicants and others, it is something that we may well continue with, even after the pandemic, I hope, subsides in the near future. That investment in remote interviewing technology has been made and is being rolled out.

Secondly, we are interviewing on sites outside the Home Office. We are trialling interviews in places such as the Napier barracks in Folkestone, as well as in the hotels where some people are accommodated, to try to speed things up a bit. We have also opened up additional registration centres where people can register their asylum claim, so there are now offices in Glasgow, Belfast, Liverpool, Leeds, Solihull and Cardiff, in addition to Croydon—it used to be that Lunar House in my borough was principally the place where people went before. Those places are now available, too, which was intended as a covid measure, but continues to this day.

We are also investing in better IT systems. We are trying to make the work rate of the caseworkers more efficient by, for example, shortening the letter to someone who is granted asylum. When someone is granted asylum, they are not going to argue with it, clearly, so rather than writing a great long letter, it has been shortened to make the whole process a little faster. There is some effort to prioritise cases in which we think a quick decision can be made. If particular indicators suggest that the case is likely to receive a positive response, we would like to do that. We are also introducing specialist caseworkers, such as specialists in a particular nationality. If people feel familiar with a particular country and its circumstances, that will facilitate quicker decision making.

My hon. Friend for Torbay intends to increase staffing levels, to which hon. Members have referred. About 550 people are currently engaged in making those casework decisions—550 full-time equivalents—and the objective is, over time, to get that up to 1,000, which is almost double. That investment in people should clearly have a dramatic effect on speeding things up. As someone said earlier in the debate, wherever someone sits on the immigration issue—we believe in proper border control, as well as fairness—it should not be difficult or contentious to say that it serves everybody’s interests to get those decisions made quickly, whether they end up being positive or negative.

I have outlined the steps that my hon. Friend is taking, and I am sure that all hon. Members present will hope and expect that the measures I have outlined will have the desired effect and that waiting times will come down. We are of course somewhat in the hands of the intake. We have had an extremely high intake in the last few weeks because of the dangerous, unnecessary, illegal English channel crossings, and if they continue in large numbers, that will add to the backlog. The intake is somewhat unpredictable—I mention that caveat for completeness. In the interests of giving the hon. Member for Stockport an opportunity to reply, I will conclude my remarks.