Royal Bank of Scotland Branch Closures

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Tuesday 14th May 2024 Westminster Hall

[The Economic Secretary to the Treasury (Bim Afolami)]

I commend the hon. Member for Edinburgh North and Leith (Deidre Brock) on securing this debate. I know this subject is important to many of her constituents, and indeed to those of many other Members.

Just two weeks ago, I responded to an Adjournment debate on branch closures. I want the House to understand that I have been working on this issue a lot in my brief, so I am very familiar with the issues that have been brought up. As I said then, and say again today:

“Banks and building societies are essential in people being able to manage their money on a day-to-day basis, and they hold a privileged and important place in our society. As such, firms must ensure that all customers, wherever they live, have appropriate access to banking and cash services.”—[Official Report, 24 April 2024; Vol. 748, c. 1111.]

We all recognise that banking has changed significantly in recent years, as the hon. Member outlined. The shift towards online and mobile access, although not complete, is significant, and it has given customers many more ways to access banking services conveniently and securely. Customers have clearly taken up those opportunities. Recent FCA data shows that almost nine in 10 adults banked online or used a mobile app. By contrast, roughly a fifth of adults regularly use a bank branch. That fifth is very important—I do not want the House to misunderstand me—but it is important to set out the scale of the change we have seen in quite a small number of years.

That does not mean that we should do away with in-person banking services, which remain critically important for many people, not just for access for cash, which I will talk about, but because of the intangible social role they play in the high street. I recognise that, as do the Government. The Government have taken steps in law to protect access to cash—indeed, we are the first Government to do so. The Financial Services and Markets Act 2023 established the FCA as the lead regulator to deliver that, and gives powers to the FCA to ensure the reasonable provision of cash withdrawal and deposit facilities, including free services, to individuals. Following that, the Government published a policy statement setting out their policies on access to cash. The FCA must have regard to that as part of a regulatory approach. That statement sets out that people and businesses should be no further than three miles from a free cash access point.

The FCA recently held a consultation on its proposed regulatory regime. Under the proposals, designated banks and building societies will be required to assess and fill gaps, or potential gaps, in cash access provision that significantly impact consumers and businesses.

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

The Minister makes the point about the distance that people have to travel to get to their branches. The county of Sutherland is 2,028 square miles, and we have only one branch. My plea is very simple. Governments come and go, in both Edinburgh and London, and I wish the Minister well on a personal level; I just ask that officials in the Treasury are made aware of that statistic about Sutherland, and that they bear it in mind when they think about branch closures, whatever happens in the future.

[Bim Afolami]

I appreciate that intervention from the hon. Member. I will say to him, very directly, something that I was going to say later in my speech. In the case of rural constituencies—he mentioned his very rural constituency—I think that the assessment criteria used by Link for banking hubs, working with Cash Access UK and looking at this whole issue of access to cash, need to be amended. I have communicated that to the industry, and I hope that, over the coming weeks and months, that will happen. It is clearly not working, in a relatively small number of instances in rural areas, where the rules do not appear to be flexible enough. I think that would be useful.

Budget Resolutions

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Tuesday 12th March 2024 Commons Chamber

[Peter Aldous (Waveney) (Con)]

My right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer is quite right to focus on improving the UK’s economic activity, where, as we have heard, we should be doing much better. We have a flexible labour market, and it is vital that we do not imperil it, but we also need a long-term strategy for investments in skills and infrastructure so that our economy can move into top gear, we can compete globally with the highest-performing economies, and we can bring prosperity to all corners of the United Kingdom.

There are measures in this Budget that are particularly welcome and which will help improve our economic performance. The 2p reduction in national insurance contributions and the increase in the child benefit threshold remove barriers to work. It is also vital that we secure investment for the businesses of tomorrow. The £1 billion for the renewable electricity auction allocation round 6, the £270 million combined Government and industry investment into research and development projects in the automotive and aerospace industries, and the £120 million for the green industries growth accelerator will all help to achieve this.

In almost every Budget, it is important to be wary of and to guard against unintended consequences, and there are two that I will briefly highlight from last Wednesday. First, I understand the rationale for extending the sunset clause on the energy profits levy, but there is real concern that this will deflect and deter investment for the industries of tomorrow: offshore wind, carbon capture, and hydrogen. These industries are vital to enhancing our energy security, bringing jobs to coastal communities and delivering our net zero targets, and I am concerned that, as the levy proposals stand, they could deter that vital investment. For my part, I shall be studying closely the provisions of the spring Finance Bill, and I would urge the Government to re-engage with industry at every opportunity.

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

The hon. Member’s point about offshore renewables is very important. Does he agree that we must ensure, as a nation, that we construct those floating wind turbines in the UK rather than overseas?

[Peter Aldous]

Yes. If we look at the offshore wind sector deal that was signed in 2019, we can see progress in building local supply chains, but I share the hon. Gentleman’s doubt to a degree. There is still a lot more work to do, and on the manufacturing side of things I would agree with him that that could take longer than for other aspects of those local supply chains.

Secondly, I likewise acknowledge why the decision has been made to abolish the furnished letting concession. There are areas of the country where holiday lets are badly distorting the local property market, as we heard from my hon. Friend the Member for Cities of London and Westminster (Nickie Aiken), who is no longer in her place. She made that point clearly, but there are many other areas of the country where holiday lets are not distorting the local property market. They are a vital part of those local economies, which are often in rural areas where there are limited other job-creating opportunities, and restrictions and limitations on the opportunity to diversify a business. Many such properties are also subject to planning conditions that prevent them from becoming available for full-time occupation on the open market. It is therefore important to be cognisant of the full impact of this proposal before proceeding. I see that the Financial Secretary to the Treasury, my hon. Friend the Member for Mid Worcestershire (Nigel Huddleston) is listening. We need a full impact assessment of that proposal before it advances.

To remove the stubborn productivity gap, it is vital to invest in skills and infrastructure. With such initiatives as the local skills improvement plans and lifelong learning, the Government have rightly recognised the importance of providing people of all ages with the opportunity to acquire the skills that are needed for the many new and emerging industries that are coming forward. Further education colleges and trainers currently face obstacles in recruiting staff, recovering VAT and supporting those who need to catch up on their learning following covid. It is therefore disappointing that no measures to address these challenges were announced last week.

Investment in infrastructure is vital if the east of England is to realise its full potential. It is therefore vital that funds are made available straightaway so that work on the Ely and Haughley junction rail improvement can begin without further delay. There were welcome announcements on this in the autumn statement, but there is local concern that the Government might be reverse ferreting on this issue. I hope that my concerns can be allayed.

This winter, the Norfolk and Suffolk coast has taken a battering that it has not seen for a very long time. In my constituency, in Lowestoft, Pakefield and Kessingland, this has undermined investment in the town centres, the ports and the tourism industry, including its vital leisure parks and caravan parks. Schemes have been prepared to protect these people and their property, and it is vital that they get under way as quickly as possible.

The Government are right to stick to the plan to halve inflation, to grow the economy and to reduce debt. As I have said, I believe that the Budget’s welcome initiatives will help to achieve those goals, but all around the UK, and particularly in East Anglia, we need to press ahead with strategic investment in both people and infrastructure—in flesh and blood and in concrete and steel.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

I wish to start my contribution with something of a personal anecdote. Just over nine years ago, in January 2015, an almighty storm struck the north of Scotland. At that time—before I joined you, Mr Deputy Speaker, in this place—I was living with my wife and my elderly mother, who, at 91, was in the last year of her life. She was bedridden, and had to be cared for, and I was her carer. In that storm, at 3 am, the electricity went out. That brought it home very forcefully to me what a predicament I was in. How did I boil the water for her hot water bottle? How did I heat the food to feed her? By the grace of God, I had an oil-fired stove, which meant that we could get by. If I had not had any form of heating, I would have been in deep trouble, as we did not get power for another two days.

I share this anecdote with the Chamber because it brought it home to me absolutely how fundamental the ability to keep ourselves warm is to life. I believe the British people have a deep sense of fairness, which we should be very proud of. It led to the national health service, free at the point of delivery, which was probably the greatest thing that Clement Attlee ever did. More than a century earlier, it led to the penny post, which meant that whether a letter or parcel was posted in Kinlochbervie in north-west Sutherland or in London, the cost was the same; it was about fairness.

I have said many times in this Chamber that the coldest village in the United Kingdom is Altnaharra, right in the middle of Sutherland. In 1995, the temperature dropped—unbelievably—to minus 27.2°C. Think how cold that is, and that was coupled with the fact that a lot of the houses are old and not well insulated, incomes are smaller and we pay an awful lot more than many other parts of the UK for our electricity. I believe we must address that fundamental unfairness.

During covid, we knew that keeping warm made recovery as speedy as possible. Good health is about having warmth. We can maximise the productivity of our population by ensuring they are healthy and kept warm. I will not lecture Conservative Front Benchers about that, because Altnaharra has been the coldest village for a very long time indeed. It was the coldest village under Conservative and Labour Governments and—dare I say it?—under Asquith’s and Lloyd George’s Liberal Governments, so the problem has been around for a very long time. My problem is that my constituents are losing out. I hear far too many stories of elderly people, like my mum, who have to make the invidious decision at this time of year, or in January, February or December, about whether to put the heating on, and that strikes me as a fundamental injustice.

Unlike the hon. Member for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman), whose contribution I greatly enjoyed—like many in the Chamber, I will miss him, and I wish him a happy retirement—I intend to return to this place if I humanly can, depending on what the SNP decides to do; we will see about that. If I do return to this place, I give you warning, Mr Deputy Speaker, that I am not prepared to drop this issue. I will use whatever persuasive ability I have to get some assistance for those people.

Some say that people who live near wind farms should get a discount. I do not think that would work, because what about the people who do not live near wind farms? The problem is that once a wind farm is built, the energy comes almost for free—the wind is free—and that is what is so galling to my constituents. Anywhere they drive in Caithness and Sutherland, they see massive great wind farms, and yet they pay over the odds for the electricity, which comes from the wind farms, goes somewhere else and comes back with a big bill attached.

That is the end of my contribution. I give notice that I shall return to this issue at every possible opportunity if I am fortunate enough to return to this place.

Finance Bill

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Report stage
Monday 5th February 2024 Commons Chamber

[Drew Hendry]

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Obviously, it is entirely appropriate to have paused for that statement. I was unaware of the news brought to the Chamber, but it is clearly significant. Our thoughts are with the royal family at this time.

As I was saying, we need consistent policies to help the renewables sector, and we are not seeing that either from the Tory Government, who have run out of ideas, or from the Labour party, which makes promises and then ducks responsibility for what is required.

We would have liked new clause 5 to flesh out the Chancellor’s promise, made in the autumn statement, to take up to £1,000 a year for up to 10 years off the electricity bills of people living near new generation equipment. We have not heard that today, so we do not know what schemes are coming up.

As I intimated earlier, I would have liked to table an amendment on this point: if new clause 5 is applicable to people living next to new generation equipment, what about those who already live among generation equipment in, for example, the highlands and islands? We have the coldest climate in the UK. Most people are off the gas grid, so we have higher average bills than the rest of the UK. We pay the highest standing charge for electricity, 40% more than here in London, and because of UK Government policies, we have the highest level of fuel poverty in the UK, yet we export six times more electricity than we use in the highlands. It would have been entirely appropriate for the Minister to agree to introduce a highland energy rebate, to put some of that contribution back into the pockets of people across the highlands and islands who are struggling because of those conditions.

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

The hon. Gentleman is making a very good point that rings true in my constituency, too. Of course, the problem is made more difficult still because of the other costs faced by people living in our constituencies, such as delivery charges and the cost of other services. Even a tube of toothpaste can cost a little more the further away it is from the big urban centres. That makes the problem a lot worse.

Cost of Living Increases

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Tuesday 25th April 2023 Commons Chamber

[Tulip Siddiq]

I will come to energy shortly. If the hon. Member were able to answer, I would ask him whether he thinks 50% is enough, because it is not enough. If he speaks to people on the ground, he will see how much they are struggling. The rising costs of everyday essentials mean that families across the country are making cutbacks just to stay afloat. That has been devastating for local economies, with communities losing the businesses and institutions that bind us together.

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

It is a fact that the village of Altnaharra in my constituency is every year the coldest place in the entire United Kingdom. We already have pensioners having to make the invidious decision to wrap themselves up in blankets and put the heating off. No one should face that sort of decision.

[Tulip Siddiq]

I thank the hon. Member for his intervention. The situations being described are not what we want to hear about in our country in 2023, and we should not be proud of this record; we should be trying to do better.

Under this Government, more than 6,000 pubs, nearly 4,000 local shops and 9,000 bank branches have closed on our local high streets. That is nothing to be proud of.

Finance (No. 2) Bill

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Committee of the whole House
Wednesday 19th April 2023 Commons Chamber

[Mr Carmichael]

Thank you, Dame Eleanor. It is perhaps not a novelty to see you back in the Chair, but it is still a great pleasure none the less. I am delighted to serve with you in control.

I rise to speak to amendment 7, which stands in my name and those of my hon. Friends. In doing so, I should indicate at this stage that it is my intention to divide the Committee and establish opinion on it. The effect of amendment 7 would be to freeze the level of duty on the production of spirits. The Minister kept saying these are Scotch whisky amendments. He maybe knows me too well, but I would readily concede that many other spirits will be affected by this, and they are just as important. I think the hon. Member for Aberdeen North (Kirsty Blackman) will speak to her amendments, which do relate specifically to Scotch whisky, but I have had discussions with her, and she tells me that SNP Members are in fact minded to support our amendment, instead of pursuing their own. She will doubtless speak for herself, as she always does, later in the debate.

When we consider that 70% of the gin produced in this country is, in fact, produced in Scotland—my constituency has no fewer than four gin distilleries, and we find that situation replicated across Scotland—the impact of rises in duty are not just going to be felt by areas that produce Scotch whisky. We have also seen a number of distilleries appearing in recent times—a much smaller number, but it is significant none the less—producing rum. So it is important that we have a coherent strategy for the excise duty on these products. The difficulty I have with what I hear from the Treasury Minister is that it is difficult to discern exactly what the Government are trying to achieve in this Budget.

Scotch whisky in particular is very important to the UK as part of our manufacturing base. Indeed, it is an enormously important part of our export portfolio. It is also critical for many of the most economically fragile communities that can be found around the highlands and islands of Scotland. I was born and brought up on Islay, and people will know the importance of the whisky industry, and in recent years the growth of whisky tourism to that economy. In my constituency we have Highland Park and Scapa. Occasionally other interests are declared, but we still have only two producing distilleries. They are very important to our local community, not just in relation to the jobs they provide directly, but because of the spin-offs—the visitor centre, the merchandising, and the visitors that those distilleries bring to the community. Whisky tourism is enormously important, and it is it enormously important that the whisky industry has confidence that the Government are on their side. I am afraid that the signals we have seen from this Government in recent months have been, if I am to be kind to them, mixed at best.

The Chancellor was right to say in December that there would be a freeze on duty. We welcomed that, as I am sure did others. Three months later, to then turn around and whack a duty increase on spirits in the region of something just north of 10%, makes us wonder what the Government are trying to achieve. When I was Secretary of State for Scotland, along with Danny Alexander, who was Chief Secretary to the Treasury, we argued successfully for a 2% duty cut. In 2015, the Red Book of the day said that that would bring with it a reduction in the amount of duty received and revenue brought in, but in point of fact we brought in more revenue with a lower level of duty than had been the case before it was cut.

If we are trying to do something that will bring in more money to the Treasury, surely a duty freeze, at the very least, should be on offer. Indeed, Treasury data illustrates the point well, because a recent history of cuts and duty freezes has actually had a beneficial effect on revenue brought in. For some reason, we now seem determined to introduce a duty increase that will have an inflationary impact, and for some of the most economically fragile communities in the country that will have the effect of stymying growth.

The position laid out by the Minister on sales of beer was exceptionally interesting. He will be aware that spirits account for one third of the serves of alcohol consumed in this country, but less than one fifth of the units consumed. On the other hand, beer has 60% of the units consumed but accounts for less than 50% of the serves. It is clear that the effect of this measure will be inflationary and have a detrimental effect on the economic growth that we are all supposed to be pursuing.

The Chief Medical Officer tells us that we should safely consume 14 units per week—I think I have read this correctly—per week. If we are to consume 14 units of cider, we pay £1.13 in tax. If we consume 14 units of wine, we pay £3.36 in tax. But if we consume 14 units of spirits, we pay £4.06 in tax. To put it another way, Scotch whisky, and spirits as a whole, are taxed 256% higher than cider, and 16% higher than wine.

It was presumably for that reason that the Secretary of State for Scotland is reported in The Scotsman as having argued against it. This was not some source quoted as saying that, but the Secretary of State himself. He said that he was disappointed the Chancellor acted in the way he did. I think we can all very much share the disappointment of the Secretary of State for Scotland. For the avoidance of doubt, I did let him know that I would be referring to him in the course of my speech. Our real disappointment, however, is that, having publicly disagreed with the Government on the matter, I have a strong suspicion that if it is put to a Division he will be in the other Lobby. It is all very well to wring your hands, but if, when the moment comes and the Division bells ring, you are not prepared to do what you know is right for such an important industry in Scotland in so many of our communities, then I feel we are, as politicians, failing in our duty to our constituents and those whom we seek to serve.

We heard a lot from the Minister about the harmonisation of duties, but the House has heard the truth of the matter. The position in relation to on-sales consumption of beer will widen the gap. It simply makes no sense. If the Minister can answer no other question when he comes to respond, can he answer this: what strategy are the Government seeking to deliver by bringing forward a duty increase in excess of 10%? I do not see it. It flies in the face of the Treasury’s own data and contradicts it. It is difficult to understand what the purpose of it is, other than simply an attitude that says, “Well, you’ve had it good for a few years now, so we’re going to treat you differently and it’s time for you to take some of the pain.” An industry as important as the production of spirits deserves rather better consideration from the Treasury.

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

I rise in support of my right hon. Friend the Member for Orkney and Shetland (Mr Carmichael), who speaks for my constituents as much as he does his own.

I want to make two simple points. First, the distilleries in my constituency—I could name them all, but I have done that before in this place—are part and parcel of each community in which they are based, and they are important to the people in those communities. They see them as their own. As my right hon. Friend said, the jobs they provide in some of the most sparsely populated and economically fragile parts of Scotland are absolutely crucial. Inver House, a company that owns two distilleries in my constituency, Balblair in Edderton and Old Pulteney in Wick, sponsors the Wick Gala each year. As something that epitomises the culture of Caithness, I would honestly recommend that all right hon. and hon. Members come to Wick and see the Wick Gala—it is something they will not forget. That company is a part of it and makes it happen, which is incredibly important. In my own home town of Tain, Glenmorangie, now owned by the French company Louis Vuitton, has for a number of years pretty well paid for the Tain highland games. Again, I say to Members: come see them and enjoy. So the distilleries are a part of the community and what they do is crucial for the community. It is about rural jobs in sparse areas.

The second point I want to make to those on the Treasury Bench is about levelling up. Those are not the words I would have chosen, but it is a good concept to take parts of the UK that have lost out in the race and bring them up—giving them a leg up—to be equal to the richer parts of the UK. By definition, the areas where there are distilleries are very often some of the more hard-up parts of the Scottish highlands and of Scotland. If Government Members want to go about levelling up, they need to get into the parts of Britain that need help.

[Mr Carmichael]

As my hon. Friend says, these are often some of the more hard-up areas of the country, but the truth of the matter is that down the years they have contributed enormously to the GDP of this country and they have the potential to do more. We are not looking for any special treatment. We are not looking for any favours or handouts. All we are looking for is a fair crack of the whip.

[Jamie Stone]

That is an extremely valuable point. I would bolt on to it that we have new distilleries starting up. In John O’Groats, there is a brand new one called 8 Doors. These enterprising local Caithness people have done it off their own bat. To get tourists to go to John O’Groats, we have 8 Doors, which has done it along the coast of Caithness. We have Wolfstone—I think I have that right.

[Mr Carmichael]

Wolfburn.

[Jamie Stone]

You’re dead right—I stand corrected by my right hon. Friend. Tourists love it and it contributes a huge amount to the Exchequer. It matters passionately to my constituents and to me. If I do nothing else for my constituency, I will try to boost the economy in every way I can because every job counts. I rest my comments with that.

[Kirsty Blackman]

I fear that, if I was to talk about the names of all the distilleries in my constituency, the debate would be much shorter than if the hon. Member for Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross (Jamie Stone) were to do so. In fact, I have much more of a tendency to drink gin than whisky, although other spirits are available.

It was interesting to hear the words “economically fragile”. That is an incredibly good point. Rural depopulation is a real issue. The Scottish Government are doing what we can to ensure that it does not continue, but if the UK Government keep working against what we are doing to encourage people to live and stay in our rural communities, we will have a real problem. That is not a small thing.

We tabled our amendments because we specifically wanted the word “whisky” on the Order Paper and we wanted to make the case in relation to whisky. However, I will not be pushing our amendments to a vote, and will support that of the right hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland (Mr Carmichael) because I concede that his is better. I am always happy to do that in such situations.

The reality is that Scotch whisky is 4.9% of the Scottish economy. Some £8.1 billion can be attributed to the sale of alcohol, around 60% of which comes from whisky exports. The numbers stated by the right hon. Member about how the differential rates work and how much people are taxed on those 14 units were incredibly interesting. The Government’s purpose is to make money from some of the alcohol measures, but there is also a population behaviour change intention behind what they do with tax on spirits and alcohol, particularly the allowance on draught beer. They have different taxes to encourage a change of behaviour, or differential behaviour in people. The Government may intend to use this tax to shift some of the population, but they are actually discouraging people from buying the very spirits that a huge amount of our livelihoods relies on. It is the case that 90% of spirits in the UK are produced in Scotland. The Government’s measures therefore have a massive negative impact on Scotland.

The average price of a bottle of Scotch whisky is £15.22 at a supermarket in Scotland. Following the new alcohol duty plus the VAT, £11.40 of that £15.22 will go to the Treasury. That is such a significant amount, and does not compare with other alcohol. I appreciate what the Government are trying to do on draught, and it is important that they have laid out their rationale for doing so—that was very helpful—but this is incredibly unfair and risks damaging those economically fragile areas, particularly in rural Scotland. Those areas have already suffered as a result of Brexit, with people’s reduced ability to freely move here.

I want to raise a small flag with the Minister in relation to the Public Bill Committee. When we come to that stage, I will be raising questions around clause 87, which is on post-duty point dilution of alcoholic products. I know there have already been problems in relation to that, so when we come to that stage of the Committee, I would appreciate Ministers being absolutely clear about their reasons for the changes in clause 87. If they are able to lay out those reasons clearly, that will reduce the number of questions I am likely to ask.

In summary, we support the amendment proposed by Liberal Democrat Members. We agree with the Scotch Whisky Association and think that the increase in duty is unfair and hits spirits, particularly Scotch whisky, unfairly. We want to stand up for our constituents, our constituencies, rural Scotland and Scotland as a whole in supporting the amendment.

--- Later in debate ---

[James Cartlidge]

I have to disagree with the right hon. Gentleman’s use of the word “realistic”. I have met representatives of the Scotch Whisky Association, whom I greatly respect, and they have said to me that if we freeze the tax we get the revenue. Unfortunately, however, the Government have what I believe is the very important and successful policy of using an independent body, the Office for Budget Responsibility, which makes forecasts independently for Governments on the effects of fiscal measures. [Interruption.] I hear voices behind me saying that they are wrong. The point is that the OBR is not a collection of soothsayers employed to predict, entirely accurately, exactly what will happen in the future. With the greatest respect to everyone, if that was the case, I suspect they would spend rather more of their time looking at accountancy of the turf-related kind rather than trying to forecast the national accounts. The point is that this enables us to ground fiscal events in a forecast of where we are at that time and the fiscal costs at the time, therefore adding credibility to the decisions we make and avoiding the easy situation where we do not have to make the difficult trade-offs that households and businesses know that, in reality, we have to face. If we want to cut one tax, we have to find the money from somewhere else. It is a good discipline.

[Jamie Stone]

Will the Minister give way?

[James Cartlidge]

I will take this very last soupçon: a final intervention from the hon. Gentleman.

[Jamie Stone]

The Minister is nothing if not courteous, but does he not accept that he would increase the revenue base by increasing industry and economic activity? What message does this send to—let me get the names right—Wolfburn in Dunnet or 8 Doors in John O’Groats? These are new distilleries, just starting out. From little acorns, mighty oaks can grow, and those mighty oaks can give the Government lots of acorns in tax revenue.

[James Cartlidge]

The hon. Gentleman is always courteous, and I send the message to him that for every single business, charity and household in the country, one thing that trumps all is wanting the Government to run the public finances in a stable way so that businesses can have confidence that the investments they make will be in a growing and stable economy. I totally understand where he is coming from, but he has not persuaded me that he has a way to find those billions of pounds. I hope that I have nevertheless offered the assurance needed for hon. Members to retract their proposed amendments, and that clauses 27, 47 to 48 and 50 to 60 will stand part of the Bill as we end our theme of alcohol for the evening.

Question put and agreed to.

Clause 27 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clauses 47 and 48 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Amendment proposed: 7, in schedule 7, page 334, line 18, leave out “£31.64” and insert “£28.74”—(Mr. Carmichael.)

Question put, That the amendment be made.

Digital Pound

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Tuesday 7th February 2023 Commons Chamber

[Andrew Griffith]

I thank my hon. Friend for her endorsement of today’s proposals. She should know that I am as concerned as she is about the fair deal for savers in general. As interest rates have increased, it is absolutely appropriate that savers benefit. It is a virtuous activity, and one that we on the Conservative Benches are very keen to support. The issue of central banks paying other banks interest on deposits is complex. There is a matrix of regulatory advantages and disadvantages from the status of being a bank, and I would be very happy to engage with her more to understand that.

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

I do hope that one day the Minister will come to the Durness highland games in north-west Sutherland. He will be very welcome, and he will see just how much money is taken out of the cash machine in Durness—by the way, what a battle we had to get it put back when it was removed! If he goes along the north coast to Wick, he will see how much money is donated to the Wick gala: it is gathered in small shrimp nets and buckets. Tapping an iPhone on a shrimp net simply does not work.

My point is obvious: we rely on cash. In my vast and remote constituency, access to cash is a real challenge if people have to travel huge distances. May I have an assurance that when the Treasury looks at safeguarding access to cash, it will take into account the challenges facing constituencies such as mine?

[Andrew Griffith]

It is indeed my aspiration to visit the hon. Gentleman’s expansive and rural constituency one day. Let me reassure him and the House that this long-term project will in no way take my or my officials’ time and attention away from any of the endeavours that have been put in place to promote access to cash. There are new powers in the Financial Services and Markets Bill, there are obligations on the regulators, and we are working with the banking industry and with Link.

As a Member who represents a rural constituency, albeit somewhat south of the hon. Gentleman’s, I fully understand the importance of access to cash for communities, for people who may be disadvantaged and use cash to budget, and for our increasingly elderly population. That focus remains, and it is not diminished by this longer-term project. As hon. Members, particularly Opposition Members, have highlighted, we have the opportunity to design in financial inclusion and to ensure that no matter who someone banks with, they can benefit from the UK digital pound.

Non-domicile Tax Status

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Tuesday 31st January 2023 Commons Chamber

[Victoria Atkins]

I am genuinely grateful to the hon. Gentleman, because that helps me to set out the progress that has been made in that area in the last decade. Non-domicile tax contributions rightly play an important part in funding our public services. Non-doms pay UK tax on their UK income and gains, and they pay UK tax on foreign income and gains when those amounts are brought into the UK.

I know the hon. Member for Ealing North (James Murray) dismisses £7.9 billion out of hand, as though it is somehow not relevant, but I set out these facts precisely because that is a very large sum of money and it helps to fund public services. It is right, in having a reasoned debate about these measures, that we adhere to the facts.

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

I have a rather technical question about the remittance basis charge. Would His Majesty’s Government consider raising the lower rate from £30,000 to £60,000 and perhaps the upper rate from £60,000 to £90,000? It would make better the balance between taking in revenue and the non-doms paying their share. Furthermore, following on from that, would they index link the charges to inflation in following years?

[Victoria Atkins]

I am very grateful to the hon. Gentleman for that thoughtful contribution. I hope he will understand that I must neither confirm nor deny that given where we are in the Budget cycle, but he makes an interesting point about the level of the remittance and his views on its impact.

Oral Answers to Questions

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Tuesday 11th October 2022 Commons Chamber

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

7. If he will publish an assessment by the Office for Budget Responsibility of the growth plan 2022 before 23 November 2022.

[The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Kwasi Kwarteng)]

The hon. Gentleman will have seen that I have brought forward the publication of the medium-term fiscal plan to 31 October.

[Jamie Stone]

I think the House will agree that the uncertainty over the date has not exactly helped forward planning on benefits. Any real cut in benefits will mean people not having enough money to buy food and clothing for their children, so does the Chancellor agree that increasing benefits in line with inflation is the only fair way forward? Indeed, it would be immoral to do otherwise. As the chief executive of Inverness citizens advice bureau pointed out to me, such benefit money is spent in the local economy and is a boost to what the Chancellor has talked about many times: growing the economy.

[Kwasi Kwarteng]

I am delighted to see that one member of the anti-growth coalition is focusing on growth. However, on the hon. Gentleman’s specific question, he will understand that the medium-term fiscal plan is coming out on 31 October, and I will not prejudge any measures in it.

Cost of Living Crisis: Wales

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Tuesday 19th July 2022 Westminster Hall

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

It is always a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Ms Nokes. I congratulate the hon. Member for Newport West (Ruth Jones) on securing this highly important debate. I rise with some trepidation as the sole Scot among so many Welsh colleagues, but I rise in support of some excellent contributions.

As everyone is saying, this is about families who are right up against it. One of my daughter’s best friends is a single mother who lives in social housing. I sat down with her and said, “Can we go through the budget?” She went through how difficult it is to make ends meet, and how everything matters. Each week and each month is down to just a pound or two. That was a year ago, and we are where we are now, which is a very different situation indeed. It is with her in mind that I think of my huge, far-flung constituency. The hon. Member for Pontypridd (Alex Davies-Jones) said that this affects all of the UK, and it does—right up to the north of Scotland, which I have the honour of representing. The village of Altnaharra in my constituency is—

[Caroline Nokes (in the Chair)]

Order. Mr Stone, please do not stretch my tolerance. This debate is about the cost of living in Wales, not in your own constituency.

--- Later in debate ---

[Jamie Stone]

I am sorry, Ms Nokes. I stand corrected. This particular village has the coldest climate every single year. Am I out of order, Ms Nokes?

[Caroline Nokes (in the Chair)]

Yes. The debate is on Wales, not the climate in Scotland.

[Jamie Stone]

Very well. In that case, I will echo two points made by the hon. Member for Ceredigion (Ben Lake). We need a cap on the price of heating oil. As he said, so many homes in Wales have no alternative at all. They are off grid; they cannot use gas. I approached the Minister of State for Energy in March this year, and he said that it was not going to work because of a survey done in 2011 that said so. How different is our situation now from March of this year, let alone 2011? The first point made by the hon. Member for Ceredigion is absolutely correct. His constituents—and I might say, sotto voce, mine too—are petrified of their bills. They are really terrified. I am the oldest member of the Lib Dem group in this place; I am getting on. I know that old people feel the cold more than young people, and they worry about money more than young people. I go back to my young friend who I mentioned earlier on, who is trying to balance a budget. It is a pretty desperate situation.

The other point made by hon. Member for Ceredigion was about the lack of choice other than to use a car. The price hike on petrol and diesel is really cutting into budgets. Some years ago, a scheme was put in place for certain parts and certain postcodes of the UK. As he said, we seek to extend that to other needy areas, such as Wales and—dare I mention, also sotto voce; I fear that I am sailing close to the wind—the north of Scotland..

I have one final point, in a Welsh context. There is such a thing as digital poverty. We have social tariffs, but their take-up is lamentable. When we look at a food bank anywhere in the UK, many of those people would not quite quality for the Department for Work and Pensions triggers to be put forward for a social tariff. However, we still look at them and say, “I bet you need help.” We need to mobilise. All of us—the Government—need to think about getting people access to social tariffs. It is about information, and working through local authorities and, maybe, banks. Who knows? There could be a huge, much bigger take-up, which would help families all over the UK to balance their budgets.

Delivery of Public Services

Jamie Stone Excerpts

Tuesday 28th June 2022 Commons Chamber

[Mr McFadden]

I detect a pattern with these interventions. They seem to be saying that the problem is everyone’s responsibility except the Government’s. There is no escaping 12 years in office.

There are two issues at the heart of this: workforce and technology. Staff shortages are common in many areas. The unemployment figures have fallen, but so too has the overall number of people in employment. More than half a million people have left the labour market since the pandemic. They are from all age groups, but the biggest group is the over-50s, and their biggest reasons for leaving the labour market are ongoing health issues and caring responsibilities.

This is where the delays and backlogs become a vicious circle. I have already mentioned that when people with medical conditions cannot get a new driving licence approved, it can prevent their return to work. The Access to Work programme is there to help people with disabilities into work, but people face delays of up to 12 weeks in their application being processed, and the waiting list for decisions has quadrupled over the past year. That holds people back from taking up jobs and makes the staff shortages worse.

The NHS employs some 1.2 million people, but it went into the pandemic with 100,000 unfilled vacancies. We have argued for a forward plan for NHS staffing, and for training so that the vacancies can be filled. That was supported by the cross-party Health and Social Care Committee, but fiercely resisted by the Government. I have to say to the Minister that looking the other way will not make the workforce issues go away. Why are the Government so resistant to the forward planning needed by the NHS?

The question is how we make the most of our potential workforce, and help those who could go back to work to do so. Many people in this country are suffering from long covid. There are people with mental health issues, and people for whom childcare costs are a barrier. We support an expansion in mental healthcare, so that we get support to those who need it within a month, and we support mental health hubs in our local communities. More breakfast clubs and after-school activities would not only be good for children but would help parents get back to work, too.

The point of all this is that we should use the talent and energy of everyone who can make a contribution, and address any barriers to work that they face, but that is not the Government’s response to the backlogs; they have proposed staffing cuts of 20%. How will that help anyone to get a passport, driving licence or health treatment quicker, or get their case to court sooner? Is it really the best that the Government can come up with? Is it even a real response, or just another initiative thrown up to provoke a debate that distracts attention from the real issues that people face?

The issue is not just about the workforce; it is also about using innovation and technology to make public services better for the public. Covid has been described as the great acceleration. It was a time when years of change were compressed into months—in education, in the way we work, in the way we shop and pay for things, in accessing healthcare and so on. The question is how we make the most of what we have learned, and of all the other rapid changes in daily life that are powered by technology, to reform our public services for the future. Our ambition should not be just to return to where we were in 2019; it should be to improve, so that we can have high-quality public services for all.

We already knew that the Conservatives were running a high-tax, low-growth economy—we have said that many times—but the backlogs that I have outlined in public services, in area after area, show that it is also a high-tax, low-delivery economy. We have the highest tax burden since the 1950s, but people cannot get a passport or an appointment with a dentist. That is simply not a good enough deal for the British public.

The Prime Minister says that he wants another two terms in office, but our public services cannot afford another two terms of backlogs and chaos. This Government are not really governing any more. They are simply campaigning.

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

My apologies to you, Madam Deputy Speaker, for attending the start of this debate tardily. Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that there is a Scottish dimension? We talk about the number of Governments we have had. Today, pregnant mothers have to make a round trip of more than 200 miles from Caithness to Inverness to give birth. Health services have gone backwards in my constituency, so all that is being said is also relevant to the Government north of the border.

[Mr McFadden]

I am glad that the hon. Member had the opportunity to make that point, whether he is wearing a tie or not.

The sole purpose of the Government is the survival of the Prime Minister. They have trashed standards in public life, as we have seen; they have damaged our standing in the world; and they are now trashing service delivery. When people pay the price for Government dysfunction in constant delays and backlogs, which have a damaging effect on quality of life; when the things that we used to take for granted become an endless slog and a debilitating battle; and when all this comes at the price of broken tax promises, people conclude that they cannot rely on the Prime Minister and on this Government. That is what is happening. As long as he and they remain in office, the chaos that has led to Boris Johnson’s backlog Britain will continue.