10 Monica Harding debates involving the Department for Transport

Rail Prices: Contactless Payments

Monica Harding Excerpts
Wednesday 15th April 2026

(2 weeks, 3 days ago)

Westminster Hall
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Rebecca Paul Portrait Rebecca Paul
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It is like the hon. Gentleman has read my mind—or even my speech. I completely agree with his point, and I will go into a number of those issues in some detail.

Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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This is such an important debate. My constituency is the single biggest contributor to the Exchequer of any constituency outside London, yet we were completely missed out from the tap in, tap out roll-out. I wrote to the Minister to ask why, and he did not tell me when we would be included. On behalf of my constituents who are working really hard for that elusive growth, I ask the Minister when that might happen.

Rebecca Paul Portrait Rebecca Paul
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I hope the hon. Lady gets an answer to her question.

On paper, contactless was presented to my constituents as a simple upgrade to how they pay. In practice, it is much more than that. I am not at all suggesting that operators have actively set out to conceal their price rises, but it is fair to say that they were not as clear, prominent or energetic as they should or could have been in explaining the full practical implications for passengers. Indeed, the changes were snuck through without any proper consultation or targeted communication. That is particularly galling since the Government are freezing rail fares across the country to ease cost of living pressures. Why do my constituents who rely on Reigate station not deserve the same?

Contactless was presented to people simply as a way of making payments easier, so many passengers, understandably, assumed that they would not have to pay more or change the time they travelled. Clearly, that has not happened at stations like Reigate. One very brief example will illustrate the point: the first off-peak train of the day is now nearly an hour later than before. That is a ticket price hike by stealth. For many years, Reigate passengers had a settled and well-understood expectation about which morning train to London marked the start of off-peak travel. That was an important part of how they planned their day, especially those travelling into London for leisure, appointments or family trips rather than for the traditional commuting pattern.

Under the new structure, because peak now runs until 9.30 am, and because Reigate’s train pattern does not line up neatly with that cut-off, the practical effect has been to push the first off-peak option later. In other words, a journey that many local passengers had long understood to be available on an off-peak basis is no longer available on the same terms. Some must now travel later, otherwise they must pay more. In that case, the roll-out of contactless has had a measurable negative impact on how some of my constituents travel by rail.

Of course, it is important to acknowledge that not every fare has increased and not every passenger has found themselves losing out. Southern notes that for many people, the contactless fare will be the same as that of a ticket bought on the day, and the whole premise of the system is that, for many passengers making simple journeys, contactless will be convenient and, in some cases, better value.

That, however, is only one part of the picture. The people who are most exposed to the downsides of this transition are the people least placed to absorb them. Currently, existing discounts cannot be applied to pay-as-you-go contactless, and if someone has a railcard or is eligible for other discounts, including a child discount, it may be cheaper to buy a conventional ticket rather than use the contactless system. That means that often the most affected passengers are families, older people, veterans and others whose journeys may amount to something more than the default model of a full-fare adult simply tapping in and tapping out.

--- Later in debate ---
Keir Mather Portrait The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport (Keir Mather)
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It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Dr Allin-Khan, and to respond to this debate. I congratulate the hon. Member for Reigate (Rebecca Paul) on securing it, and I thank the hon. Members for Strangford (Jim Shannon), for Esher and Walton (Monica Harding), for Mid Bedfordshire (Blake Stephenson) and for Woking (Mr Forster) for their important contributions as we consider contactless payment roll-out at railway stations and its impact on ticket prices.

I want to start by reassuring the hon. Member for Reigate that I listened carefully to the concerns she raised. I also want to thank her for the spirit of practicality and openness with which she has approached the implementation of contactless roll-out. Of course, the Department for Transport needs to take on board the concerns of constituents in Reigate and the other areas where contactless ticketing has been rolled out, to ensure that it does what the scheme is intended to do: provide a more seamless, integrated and easy-to-use ticketing experience for passengers. I have taken on board some of her specific points, especially on what can be done for her constituents in Reigate, and the concerns she raised about off-peak and the types of people who take those services, whether they are families visiting London or people relying on the social connections that the railway can bring.

The DFT keeps implementation continuously under review. I will ensure that anomalies in the system such as those that the hon. Lady raised are passed through to the Rail Minister. Her point about guidance and communication is especially important. We want people to benefit from contactless roll-out, which means that they need to be fully informed about the implications of these changes. I thank her for raising those points in a spirit of practicality and openness.

More broadly, I know that the hon. Lady is a determined advocate for her constituents. Like the Department for Transport, she understands that our railways are catalysts for cultural connection and economic growth, and I believe that her constituents in Reigate should be able to benefit from them to the same extent as those in every other part of the United Kingdom. She has mentioned the challenges people face due to limited transport connectivity, and I welcome the opportunity to respond in more detail to those concerns today.

On the matter of expanding pay-as-you-go with contactless ticketing at Reigate station specifically, I appreciate how important flexible ticketing and payment options are for passengers and want to provide some information on the progress being made on the points that the hon. Lady raised. On 7 December last year, we introduced changes to paper fare pricing at 50 stations across the south-east in preparation for the launch of the pay-as-you-go ticketing system. A week later, on 14 December, pay-as-you-go was launched at 30 stations, including Reigate, enabling passengers to benefit from simpler, easier and more flexible ticketing.

The introduction of new, simplified single-leg priced fares, like those already successfully implemented in London, means there is now just one peak and off-peak fare, with consistent restrictions across those services. Prices were adjusted so that a single ticket is around half the price of a return ticket, although I am cognisant of the anomalies that that has created, which the hon. Lady pointed out.

The move to single-leg pricing unfortunately means that some passengers may pay more, and that is something that I will reflect to the Rail Minister, but it is important to note that, in return, it unlocks more flexibility, and other passengers may see a reduction in their ticket price. These changes apply not only to pay-as-you-go, but to paper ticket prices.

We are already seeking to roll out this improved flexibility in pricing and ticketing beyond London and the south-east; we are now firmly in the delivery phase of launching pay-as-you-go to more than 90 stations in Greater Manchester and the west midlands. However, I take the point made by the hon. Members for Reigate and for Woking about the need to ensure that we learn the lessons of the roll-out as we bring it to more places, so that we can fully secure the benefits of a contactless system.

Greater Manchester is already benefiting from new, simpler fares in advance of pay-as-you-go ticketing, and the west midlands will have full, integrated multimodal fares and ticketing from day one. Alongside that, we are testing other ticketing innovations through digital pay-as-you-go trials, three of which have gone live across the north and the midlands since September last year. They will help us to understand how best to deliver this new, innovative ticketing option, to meet the needs of passengers.

The hon. Member for Reigate made a point about consistency of communications and a seamless experience for passengers. As we move towards delivering Great British Railways, our priority is to strike the right balance between affordability for passengers and taxpayers, to ensure that everyone gets a fair deal but also to run the railway in a more holistic way so that passengers get a consistent experience wherever they travel. GBR will enable more consistent ticketing practice across the network, ensuring that wherever people travel they can be confident that they are buying the right ticket and getting the best fare for their journey.

We must also acknowledge the very real cost of living pressures that are facing many households, including in Reigate. Transport costs form a significant part of that mix, and we must balance the need to fund the railway through passenger revenue with the need to reduce the burden on taxpayers. For too long, passengers have endured relentless fare increases. Between 2010 and 2024, fares rose by around 60%, placing real pressure on hard-working families and commuters. This Government are committed to turning the page and in March we took the significant step of freezing regulated fares for the first time in 30 years. We are taking immediate action to ease the burden on passengers and to begin building, longer-term, a more affordable railway.

Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding
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Of course it is really important that we bring fares down, but we also need to make sure that the trains actually work. In February, 5.82% of all South West Railway services were cancelled on the main line that runs through my constituency. I wonder whether the Minister thinks those figures are accurate, but they are very poor figures for a commuter line, where anything over 3% is considered poor. Will he comment on that?

Keir Mather Portrait Keir Mather
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The hon. Lady is absolutely right to raise disruption of commuter services on behalf of her constituents. It links back to the point that our railways are meant to be catalysts for economic growth, which should be the case in Esher and Walton, as in any other part of the United Kingdom.

I will make two separate points. First, if the hon. Lady writes to me specifically about the disruption being experienced in her constituency, I will ensure that she receives a full response about what the Department for Transport intends to do, working with the operator, to achieve changes. Secondly, if she feels that the ministerial correspondence that she received on ticketing, which she mentioned in her intervention on the hon. Member for Reigate, did not go quite far enough in giving her the information she needs, I will ensure that she receives a fuller response to that point, too. I thank her for raising that important point.

Thanks to this Government, the price of travelcards will be frozen until March 2027, meaning that weekly and daily caps will remain unchanged from 2026. That will make a real difference for people who rely on pay-as-you-go travel in places such as Reigate, allowing them to reach their caps sooner and ensuring that the cost of their journeys does not rise significantly throughout the year. These decisions will put more money back into the pockets of working people and form part of our wider plans to bring the railway into public ownership, in order to create a simpler and more reliable network that delivers for passengers.

The hon. Member for Reigate also highlighted the challenges that constituents face with transport connectivity more broadly. On securing reliable rail and bus connectivity, we recognise the concerns that exist and have a clear plan to address them by equipping major city regions with the tools they need to roll out locally ticketing that reflects local travel patterns. This will include a shared technology solution allowing for integrated pay-as-you-go with contactless across different transport modes. We will set out further details in due course, while of course taking into account the specific challenges that the hon. Lady raised.

I assure the hon. Lady that the Government are firmly committed to improving the travel experience for her constituents and for passengers across the network. That means simplifying fares, making them more flexible to meet the needs of passengers, and delivering innovative solutions that fully realise the benefits of a truly modern transport network. I assure her that I have taken on board her specific points about the roll-out and will ensure that they are reflected through to the Rail Minister. I thank her for her contribution on this incredibly important topic.

Question put and agreed to.

Oral Answers to Questions

Monica Harding Excerpts
Thursday 8th January 2026

(3 months, 3 weeks ago)

Commons Chamber
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Heidi Alexander Portrait Heidi Alexander
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The right hon. Gentleman has raised the question of accessibility at this station with me at Transport questions, and he is right to say that it is one of the schemes being considered as part of the Access for All programme. He is also right to say that decisions about that scheme are literally on my desk at the moment. He does not have too long to wait until we make an announcement about which schemes we will be taking forward, both for further design work and to construction.

Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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My constituency is the highest contributor to the Exchequer of any constituency outside London, and most of the people who pay those huge taxes commute into London on South Western Railway, which is London’s least reliable train network. A major cause of that poor performance is an outdated signalling system at Clapham Junction. It is way out of date, and in November alone it accounted for 7% of all cancellations. Will the Secretary of State set out what plans exist to go beyond piecemeal repairs to a root and branch reconstruction of the signalling at Clapham Junction?

Heidi Alexander Portrait Heidi Alexander
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I am fully aware of how important South Western Railway is to the hon. Lady’s constituency and to the economic performance of the south-east as a whole. I can give her good news: we have appointed a new integrated managing director of South Western, who is responsible for both the infrastructure and the train operations. I will be sure to write to the hon. Lady with more details about potential improvements to the signalling system, so that we can see the greater levels of reliability and punctuality that I know her constituents want to see.

Railways Bill

Monica Harding Excerpts
2nd reading
Tuesday 9th December 2025

(4 months, 3 weeks ago)

Commons Chamber
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Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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The experience of my constituents in Esher and Walton, served by South Western Railway—the first of the train operators to be taken into public ownership—is not that nationalisation guarantees a better experience. This autumn feels as bad as the last. I feel it on my way—or not—into this place, and I have a sack load of constituent complaints about delays and cancellations.

At Esher station, 30% of trains were delayed last month. Only yesterday, a constituent told me that he was forced to spent £60 on taxis and two hours of extra childcare because of a train cancellation—something that is too frequently experienced by us in Esher and Walton. School children are missing hours of school because their trains are consistently delayed and they miss their connections. On 16, 17, 20 and 23 October, and on 7, 10, 12, 13, 18, 19 and 24 November, the trains were delayed and 278 students were affected. I understand the under-investment, the lack of accountability and, frankly, the shameful mess that the Conservative Government left this Government to sort out, but I urge the Minister to go further and faster on reform to ensure that the Bill is not a continuation of this disappointment.

Today, on Second Reading, I wish to make the case for Hersham station, which is long overdue for improvement and another shameful example of the neglect of our railways and lack of accountability. Hersham sits on the south-west main line in my constituency, which contributes more to the Exchequer than any other outside London. People are using the station every day, commuting into London and creating the growth that our country needs. Despite being used over 600,000 times a year, Hersham station is an eyesore, ramshackle and rundown. There is nothing at the station that tells these communities to go and get growth as part of a national mission. There is nothing to suggest any ambition as a country, or that we are on the sharp end of innovation and technology, efficiency and delivery. The only message they get from the station is that the Government and train operator have neither the desire nor ambition to get them to work on time.

At Hersham, the stairs up to the platform are crumbling—visible holes expose the long drops below—and they shake underfoot. Needless to say, there is no step-free access. The roof is exposed corrugated iron. Both platforms were built in the 1960s, using materials meant for temporary use. When groups of schoolchildren step off the train and walk down the platform, shaking can be felt underfoot. Last year, someone put their foot straight through the platform, and it took the managing director of South Western Railway coming down to get the hole fixed. Should I give up hope on a complete refurbishment of the station for my constituents in Hersham, who have put up with this for too long?

Clauses 46 and 47 give us, for the first time in decades, a national centralised mechanism through which we can say, “This is not good enough, and it must be fixed.” However, the clauses do not go far enough. For decades, oversight was provided by the design panel of the British Railways Board; the Government used that to raise the standard of design across the British nationalised railway system from the 1950s. That system disappeared with privatisation. Since then, station design has been neglected, and passengers have paid the price in exactly the kind of decay that we see at Hersham station.

I would like to see clause 46 strengthened by amendments, so that minimum station standards must explicitly include design quality, accessibility, durability and engagement with the community. There must also be clear time limits for fixing safety and accessibility-related defects. I ask the Minister to look at the matter carefully, and to provide the funding, resource and ambition to give Hersham station what it so desperately needs.

Driving Test Availability: South-east

Monica Harding Excerpts
Wednesday 26th November 2025

(5 months ago)

Westminster Hall
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Al Pinkerton Portrait Dr Pinkerton
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I am incredibly grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for that very important observation. The plight of bots stealing places from under people on a Government-registered system strikes me as utterly inappropriate. I have heard internal stories that the DVSA has been in a state of upendedness for some time. I am also grateful to him for his observation about Loveday Ryder.

As of June, the average waiting time for a practical driving test stood at about 22 weeks, although the nearest centres for my constituents, in Farnborough and Guildford, reported waits of 24 weeks. Many have told me that they have waited up to a year to secure a test slot.

Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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I am one of those parents who scrambles for the driving test, and many of my constituents have written to me about this issue. For Martha in Molesey it took more than 15 months, and for Evan in Thames Ditton it took more than six months. Last week, one of the driving instructors in my constituency told me that a lack of tests affects every single one of their students In 2023, the DVSA temporarily moved a significant amount of its workforce into examiner roles, and that enabled 150,000 test slots over six months. Does my hon. Friend agree that that is the way to go—

Carolyn Harris Portrait Carolyn Harris (in the Chair)
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Order. I remind hon. Members that interventions are meant to be just that: a short intervention, not a speech.

Heathrow: National Airports Review

Monica Harding Excerpts
Wednesday 22nd October 2025

(6 months, 1 week ago)

Commons Chamber
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Heidi Alexander Portrait Heidi Alexander
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We are moving at pace on this, but I do believe it is possible to have meaningful consultation opportunities as well. If through the review that we are conducting in the next couple of months it becomes apparent that we need to change the ANPS, we will consult on a new draft by the summer of next year. I will ensure that I remain in close contact with my hon. Friend, who is a fearsome advocate for his constituents, because I know that it is important that we not just address concerns about noise, air quality and carbon, but demonstrate the important economic effect that expanding Heathrow could have.

Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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My constituents, particularly those along the river in Molesey and Ditton, are concerned about an increase in the noise pollution that already affects us from a third runway at Heathrow. How can they be reassured that their views will be taken into account, unlike in the top-down centralised planning policies that this Government have implemented? Will the four tests be transparent, meaningful and readily available to constituents? Can I please ask again: should it be shown that the climate commitments of the UK will not be met by this expansion, will the Minister U-turn?

Heidi Alexander Portrait Heidi Alexander
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This is the start, not the end, of the process. We will be transparent and clear about those four tests. We will consult on an amended ANPS if that is required following the review. A planning application would then come forward, and there would be consultation around that. There would be a public inquiry led by the planning inspector. There will be ample opportunity for people to make their views known. I refer the hon. Member to the remarks I made earlier about treating this whole process with professionalism and integrity to ensure that we make the right decision for the future of the country.

Pavement Parking

Monica Harding Excerpts
Wednesday 3rd September 2025

(7 months, 4 weeks ago)

Westminster Hall
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Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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I thank my constituency neighbour, my hon. Friend the Member for Epsom and Ewell (Helen Maguire), for securing this debate. I recently met the Walton-on-Thames macular degeneration support group in Esher and Walton to discuss some of the challenges faced by my constituents with sight loss, including pavement parking. I urge the Minister to finally take the step of banning pavement parking. I recognise, however, that poor parking is often due to carelessness more than malice, so I suggest to the Minister that a public education campaign about how to park more considerately is in order—perhaps some Tory MPs would like to attend, since they do not seem to think it is a problem.

A number of my constituents have written to me specifically about the prevalence of pavement parking around schools in pick-up and drop-off hours, which is dangerous for children. Part of tackling this issue is proper enforcement of the rules. What steps is the Department taking to support local authorities in dealing with improper pavement parking?

I want to flag another issue: placing street furniture such as A-boards on streets in Surrey does not require a licence, yet it presents huge obstructions to visually impaired constituents. I congratulate the hon. Member for York Central (Rachael Maskell) on dealing with it—maybe she could share what happened there with Surrey county council.

Finally, on many social housing estates, which were often built in the 1950s and ’60s when cars were small and there was probably only one, if that, many cars are now parked on pavements and on green spaces meant for children. What can the Government do to encourage social housing providers to knock down the derelict garages that are not being used to provide proper parking?

Sustainable Aviation Fuel Bill

Monica Harding Excerpts
2nd reading
Wednesday 11th June 2025

(10 months, 3 weeks ago)

Commons Chamber
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Heidi Alexander Portrait Heidi Alexander
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My hon. Friend is completely right to highlight the benefits of cracking on and delivering airspace modernisation. It could mean not only more direct flights and therefore less use of carbon, but noise benefits for communities close to airports.

We are determined to make rapid progress on this issue because we have an iron-clad belief that our success as an island nation rests on our international connectivity. The flow of trade, exporting British expertise and the movement of people for business and leisure all depend on aviation continuing to grow and thrive. We could put our head in the sand and pretend that people do not want to fly, that the sector does not support hundreds of thousands of jobs, that people do not look forward to foreign holidays or family reunions and that air freight is not a significant part of our trade by value, but we would be on the wrong side of both reality and public aspiration.

The truth is that demand for flight is only going in one direction. According to the Civil Aviation Authority, passenger levels were 7% higher in 2024 than in the previous year. If we do not respond and if we do not set aviation up for long-term success, we do not just make ourselves poorer today, we kiss goodbye to the growth and opportunity this country needs in the decades to come.

I want a future where more passengers can take to the skies, not fewer. But like the rest of our economy, that must mean emitting less carbon, not more. This Bill will help secure that future. It builds on the fantastic work across Government and industry, led by my hon. Friend the Aviation Minister, which saw the SAF mandate come into effect earlier this year. As we run towards a future of green flight, we know that sustainable aviation fuel is one of the biggest levers we can pull. It emits 70% less greenhouse gases on average than fossil fuels. It can be used in existing infrastructure and aircraft engines, and it is now backed by a mandate that is rightly ambitious: 10% SAF in the fuel mix by 2030 and 22% by 2040. I want as much as possible to be made in the UK.

Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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The mandate, which we welcome, calls for only 22% sustainable jet fuel usage by 2040, while the Chancellor has said that she wants a third runway in use at Heathrow by 2035. That would mean more aviation-related health hazards to my constituents. Does the Minister agree that we should not pursue Heathrow expansion until we can turbocharge the SAF mandate and bring non-sustainable fuel usage down further?

Heidi Alexander Portrait Heidi Alexander
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The Government have been clear that we will permit airport expansion only when it is consistent with our legally binding climate change targets. SAF is one way in which we can clean up aviation, but the work we are doing on the development of new aircraft technologies, alongside the work we are doing on airspace modernisation, is all connected to how we bring those emissions down. I point out to the hon. Lady that the expansion of Heathrow has already been modelled in relation to the sixth carbon budget.

We have been clear that the mandate alone is not enough. Creating the demand for SAF but not the supply does not get us where we want to be. We have heard the industry’s concerns around risk and uncertainty for investment, and that is why we are acting today. The Bill creates a revenue certainty mechanism that will boost SAF production by giving investors confidence to choose the UK.

Paul Kohler Portrait Mr Kohler
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I agree. We must not focus only on passenger numbers. It is also about connectivity, and about making sure that rural areas thrive.

Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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I would like to concentrate not just on purely rural areas, but on places like Surrey. In my constituency, the 514 bus connects Esher and Molesey, two important centres of our community, but it runs only twice on weekdays and once on a Saturday. On Sundays it is never to be seen. The service was severely cut back in 2016. To travel a distance of a mile and a half, people have to get a bus more than five miles into London and out again, which takes 40 minutes—

Caroline Nokes Portrait Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)
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Order. I have made this point before, but interventions really must be shorter than that. There are many hon. Members who wish to get in.

Road Maintenance

Monica Harding Excerpts
Monday 7th April 2025

(1 year ago)

Commons Chamber
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Heidi Alexander Portrait Heidi Alexander
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We are asking local authorities to publish a report on their websites by June this year. We are tipping more money into highways maintenance and it is absolutely right that people should see visible results on their roads. And it is right that my hon. Friend is holding her local Conservative council to account.

Our investment in highways maintenance is not a sticking-plaster solution; it is a vital investment that could see councils fixing an extra 7 million potholes next year. That is just the beginning. As I said, for the first time we have asked councils to prove that they are using their funding wisely. By June, they will be asked—as I have just said—to report on how many potholes they have filled and provide an update on the condition of their roads. If we are not satisfied that they are delivering value for money, councils risk losing up to a quarter of their funding uplift.

Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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Surrey has 70,000 potholes—5% of all the nation’s potholes and the most in the country—so I welcome the extra money for potholes, but given the recklessness of the Conservatives in Surrey, how will that help my constituents?

Heidi Alexander Portrait Heidi Alexander
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The wider transparency and accountability measures we have announced, whereby we are withholding a quarter of the funding uplift until such time as the local authority has demonstrated how it is using that money, will hopefully be of assistance to both the hon. Lady and her constituents.

It is only right that taxpayers can see how their money is being spent. This new era of accountability and transparency will see their cash being put to good use, and road users will see the results.

Airport Expansion

Monica Harding Excerpts
Tuesday 28th January 2025

(1 year, 3 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Mike Kane Portrait Mike Kane
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I thank my hon. Friend for his support for growth at our ports, which includes our maritime ports. There is £63 million for the advanced fuels fund and £1 billion for the Aerospace Technology Institute to look at net zero emissions. We have already introduced—it was almost the Government’s first act out of the gate; it came into force on 1 January—the SAF mandate, so this year 2% of all fuel will have to be from a sustainable source, and we will shortly legislate on the revenue certainty mechanism to kick-start the SAF industry in the UK. The Government could not have done more in the six months we have had in office.

Monica Harding Portrait Monica Harding (Esher and Walton) (LD)
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I note that the Minister did not mention noise pollution in his statement. As he grew up under a flightpath, I hope that he enjoyed the noise. Eight routes currently pass over my constituency, sometimes after midnight. My constituents struggle with the noise—one said that it was like having an uninvited dinner guest every night. It not only disturbs sleep but has profound health implications. With that in mind, is the Minister going to ignore the health impacts of a third runway?

Mike Kane Portrait Mike Kane
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I cannot comment on the third runway because there is no development consent order before us, but the hon. Lady makes an extraordinarily valid point about noise. That is why the Liberal Democrats should get behind us and support airspace modernisation. We have an analogue system in a digital age, which was designed more for the days when Yuri Gagarin went into space than for today. We can give people under flightpaths more choice in future by differentiation, if we have a better system of airspace modernisation.