Business of the House

Lord Young of Cookham Excerpts

Monday 4th July 2011 Commons Chamber

[The Leader of the House of Commons (Sir George Young)]

With permission, Mr Speaker, I should like to make a short business statement. The business for tomorrow and Wednesday remains unchanged to that announced previously. However, the remaining business will now be:

Thursday 7 July—Proceedings on the Supply and Appropriation (Main Estimates) Bill, followed by consideration of a business motion, followed by all stages of the Police (Detention and Bail) Bill.

I can advise the House that my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary will make the final draft of the Bill available to hon. Members in advance of its formal introduction and publication tomorrow. I have been advised by the Home Office that copies of the final draft will be available in the Vote Office by 6 pm this evening. I will of course make my usual business statement on Thursday.

[Hilary Benn (Leeds Central) (Lab)]

I am grateful to the Leader of the House for his statement and for advance sight of it, which responds to the point that I raised with him last Thursday. It has taken Home Office Ministers far too long—six weeks now—to respond to a court judgment that was originally given on 19 May. The result has been a complete mess, with doubt about the enforcement of bail conditions—for instance, in domestic violence cases—and the Leader of the House having to make this statement, completely changing the business for Thursday. Can he give us any news on the application to stay the judgment pending the appeal hearing, which I understand is scheduled for 25 July, because it might have a bearing on Thursday’s business?

As I indicated last week, we are very willing to assist in getting the legislation on the statute book as quickly as possible, because we all want to ensure that the law is restored to what everyone thought it was before the judgment. However, let me ask the Leader of the House two questions. First, can he confirm that the Home Secretary will be leading the debate? We see from his statement that all stages will be taken in one day, including the Committee stage on the Floor of the House. Secondly, when does he anticipate the Bill being considered in the other place?

[Sir George Young]

I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for his renewed offer of support for getting the legislation on the statute book. On his first point, the timeline was dealt with on several occasions on Thursday by the Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice.

On the application to the Supreme Court, the greater Metropolitan police are asking for a stay of execution. It would not resolve the main issue, and it would not happen until later this month, by which time the House will have risen. The Home Secretary will indeed be taking Second Reading. I anticipate that the Bill will then go to the other place on Thursday evening, and I hope that it will be dealt with early next week.

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr James Gray (North Wiltshire) (Con)]

The very important business that the Leader of the House has announced will mean that an hour and a half debate on the use of electronic devices in the Chamber will not now occur. Will the Leader of the House tell us when he intends to allow that debate to occur?

[Sir George Young]

First, may I say that in replying to the shadow Leader of the House I should have said the Greater Manchester police, not the greater Metropolitan police?

I am sorry that the debate on Thursday will not now take place. I will make my normal business statement on Thursday outlining the business for forthcoming weeks.

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab)]

In his business statement on Thursday, could the Leader of the House tell us what the Home Secretary seems not to be capable of telling us about the case of Sheikh Raed Salah, including when she signed an order that he was to be deported from this country, why he has been held for some days in Her Majesty’s Prison Bedford, why he is being denied legal access until tomorrow and why, and under what pressure, she decided to make what I believe to be a retrospective decision?

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I think this is a question for Thursday, unless the Leader of the House has any plans to indicate that the matters will be debated on Thursday.

[Sir George Young]

I understand that the matter is before the courts.

[Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con)]

I assume that the Leader of the House is not going to move item No. 2 on the Order Paper tonight, but has he considered whether it could be moved and tacked on to whatever time we finish our debate on the emergency Bill?

[Sir George Young]

My hon. Friend is quite right that there is now no need to move the motion that protects the Backbench Business Committee debate for 90 minutes. We do not propose to add that debate to the end of business on Thursday; it will have to be dealt with on another occasion.

[Mr John Spellar (Warley) (Lab)]

Obviously, no leader of the House likes having to change business, although that is often necessary under the force of circumstances. We fully understand why that is being done in this case and the Opposition have indicated that they support that. However, I hope that the Leader of the House has satisfied himself regarding this question: did officials, when they knew about this decision, not tell the Minister, or is it the case that the Minister was told and did not act on it? What is the answer?

--- Later in debate ---

[Sir George Young]

If the right hon. Gentleman looks at Hansard for last Thursday, he will see the timeline outlined by the Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice. Ministers were told on 24 June.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

I have Hansard for last Thursday, and the Minister made it quite clear that the original decision was on 5 April and that a judicial review gave oral confirmation of that decision on 19 May. Can the Leader of the House say whether he was alerted, after 19 May, to the possibility of the need to legislate on the Floor of the House to reverse that decision?

[Sir George Young]

This is rehearsing to some extent the arguments that were dealt with on Thursday. As my right hon. Friend the Minister said on Thursday, we had to wait for the written judgment to follow the oral one.

[Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con)]

When will the House consider Lords amendments to the Fixed-term Parliaments Bill? Given that the Leader of the House has effectively included an extra day of legislation into Parliament’s proceedings, does he anticipate that the House will run for longer than intended in the current Session?

[Sir George Young]

That is not the Government’s intention. We plan to adjourn on the day that has already been announced.

[Mr Gerry Sutcliffe (Bradford South) (Lab)]

We had a statement last Thursday. Why are we waiting until this Thursday when we could have debated the exceptional Bill today? There is an increased cost to the police in not understanding what the position is and having to do bail at the doorstep level. Could we not have had the opportunity at least to see the draft Bill given that the Minister had the statement ready on Thursday?

[Sir George Young]

The Bill had to be drafted before it could be presented to the House. We have worked as quickly as we could and the Bill will be available to Members by 6 o’clock this evening—in good time for discussion on Thursday.

[Diana Johnson (Kingston upon Hull North) (Lab)]

I do not understand why we cannot have the Bill earlier in the week. I am particularly concerned about the people who are suspected of domestic violence and have conditions on their bail, which I understand will not be enforced. That is clearly a major problem and I wonder why it is taking so long—until Thursday—to bring forward the Bill.

[Sir George Young]

The announcement was made on Thursday and the Bill will be available later today. I think that is moving at good speed. On the specific issue the hon. Lady raised, the police service is dealing with the implications of the ruling, including in the circumstances that she outlines, and the Home Secretary has been told that the police will be able to manage operationally in the meantime.

[Mr Dave Watts (St Helens North) (Lab)]

Can the right hon. Gentleman explain why it has taken five weeks to deal with this matter? Is an investigation going on to find out why this important legislation has taken five weeks, and is it true that the Government are only acting on the back of the report and legal advice of the Association of Chief Police Officers?

[Sir George Young]

Again, this is rehearsing to some extent the exchange we had on Thursday, and an exchange that can take place again this Thursday. The announcement that I have just made relates to the business we are dealing with on Thursday; the substantive matters will be dealt with on that day.

[Chris Leslie (Nottingham East) (Lab/Co-op)]

Although it will be good to have time to debate the Bill—that is all very well—can the Leader of the House allow us time for a separate debate about the general shambles in the Home Office and which Ministers and Law Officers were clearly asleep on the job?

[Sir George Young]

If the hon. Gentleman comes along on Thursday, he can put in a bid for such a debate. I am not sure whether he was here last Thursday, but there was a protracted exchange involving the Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice on precisely the issues that the hon. Gentleman and his colleagues continue to raise.

[Keith Vaz (Leicester East) (Lab)]

Two promises were made last Thursday. The first was on the request from the police that they should have the best legal advice from the best legal brains. I am sure that refers to the Solicitor-General. The second promise was that the Bill would be discussed with the Select Committee on Home Affairs and with the shadow Home Secretary before the final draft appeared. As the Home Secretary will be appearing before us tomorrow morning, could she please bring her latest version to the meeting?

[Sir George Young]

Indeed, the Home Secretary will be bringing a copy of the Bill with her, and I hope that the right hon. Gentleman will also have his copy—available from 6 o’clock this evening.

[Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab)]

With regard to the timing of the debate on Thursday, is it not true that parliamentary business is being lost and legislation is being made in an emergency because the Home Office was not on top of its brief in the first place? Is any investigation going on to make sure that next time round we get legislation to protect the police earlier?

[Sir George Young]

Again, these issues were raised last Thursday, and the hon. Gentleman will have an opportunity this Thursday to discuss the background to the Bill. My responsibility is simply for announcing the changed business on Thursday, and in response to requests from some of the hon. Gentleman’s colleagues we are dealing with this as quickly as we possibly can.

[Mark Tami (Alyn and Deeside) (Lab)]

Why did it take the Home Secretary so long to tell the Leader of the House that there was a need for this change?

--- Later in debate ---

[Sir George Young]

The moment the statement was made last Thursday, and it was clear that legislation was needed, we decided to change the business of the House, and a statement was made at the earliest opportunity.

[Vernon Coaker (Gedling) (Lab)]

What a fiasco! Why does the House have to wait until Thursday before it debates the emergency legislation when the Home Office has known about this for six weeks? Will the Home Secretary be able to tell us what the current situation is with respect to those on police bail? How many people are being let out who should not be? How many people do not know what is happening? Should there not be an emergency statement now, rather than waiting until next Thursday?

[Sir George Young]

Yes to all the questions except the last one, which is no.