Israel and Palestine

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Monday 16th December 2024 Westminster Hall

[Mike Tapp (Dover and Deal) (Lab)]

The petitions reflect the deep concern and passion of many in our society about the ongoing conflict and suffering in the middle east, and I respect the sentiment behind them. This Government are already working towards the same objectives that many of the signatories seek: an end to the violence in Gaza, the immediate release of all remaining hostages, an improved supply of humanitarian aid and, crucially, irreversible progress towards a lasting two-state solution. Peace in the middle east will come from negotiations, dialogue and the willingness of both sides to find common ground.

I turn first to the question of recognising the state of Palestine. Both the Israeli and Palestinian peoples have a legitimate right to self-determination. The foundation of a two-state solution is an independent, viable and democratic Palestine living alongside a safe and secure Israel. Since the Oslo accords, the principle has been clear: a two-state solution can be reached only through direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians. An action that undermines that principle, such as unilateral recognition of Palestine by the UK, only complicates that matter and makes peace more difficult. It creates the false impression that a Palestinian state can be imposed from the outside, without the necessary negotiations. Unilateral recognition, as seen with countries such as Spain, Norway and Ireland, has led to no real progress on the ground. It is a symbolic gesture, but it does not advance the cause of peace.

We must also approach the matter of arms exports with a clear-eyed view of the facts. Revoking UK arms export licences would once again be a largely symbolic gesture, with little practical impact on the situation in Gaza. It would also undermine our credibility as a security partner in the region and send the wrong messages to adversaries, including Iran.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

Presumably, my hon. Friend will recognise that 15% of the F-35 construction parts come from the United Kingdom, and they are the choice of delivery of the 2,000 lb bombs that obliterate civilian populations in Gaza. Does he share my concern that continuing to participate in that programme leaves the United Kingdom at risk of being prosecuted under various conventions for complicity in those heinous acts?

[Mike Tapp]

We must bear in mind that 95% of weapons come from the US and Germany, and on the legal side of things, the Prime Minister and the Government have been clear that they have consulted legal advice, which of course will continue—I expect that there will be more from the Minister on that.

That is not to say that we ignore the suffering or the rights of Palestinians—far from it—but revoking arms sales to Israel, particularly when the country is engaged in a seven-front conflict against Iran and its proxies, would undermine our national security interests in the middle east. The UK has a long-standing defence and security relationship with Israel, which played a key role in defending Israel against an unprecedented Iranian ballistic attack earlier this year.

We have real-world experience in peacebuilding through initiatives such as the International Fund for Ireland, which invested in cross-community projects in Northern Ireland long before the Good Friday agreement was signed. Over time, these projects help to change attitudes and foster the conditions for political leaders to negotiate and compromise. The UK can and must apply those lessons to the middle east. By supporting peacebuilding civil society organisations in both Israel and Palestine, we can build the foundations for lasting peace. That approach has already received backing from the G7, and was reinforced by the Prime Minister's recent announcement on supporting civil society peacebuilding.

I urge us all to focus on actions that have a tangible long-term impact. Unilateral recognition of Palestine or the withdrawal of arms exports to Israel may offer a moment of symbolic protest, but will not move us closer to a genuine and lasting peace. The real path to peace lies in dialogue, supporting peacebuilding initiatives and encouraging both Israelis and Palestinians to come to the table. The UK can play a meaningful role by investing in projects that build trust and create the conditions necessary for a sustainable two-state solution.

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[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Affairs (Mr Hamish Falconer)]

It is an honour to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Pritchard. I am grateful to the Petitions Committee for securing this debate, and to the hon. Member for South Cotswolds (Dr Savage) for leading it. I thank hon. Members for their contributions. They have represented their views and those of their constituents, many of whom I know have signed these petitions with sincerity. With your forbearance, Mr Pritchard, and recognising the many pages of questions I have received over the course of the afternoon, I will try to make progress with my speech before taking interventions.

I recognise the tone both of the petitions and of the questions and contributions this afternoon. I think the House is united in wanting to end the agonies in Gaza, return the hostages, end the violent expansion of settlements, and secure a two-state solution. That is my work and the work of this Government, and I am grateful to the right hon. Member for Aldridge-Brownhills (Wendy Morton) for highlighting how different our approach is from that of the Government who preceded us. When we became the Government, we called for an immediate ceasefire. On my first day as a Minister, we restored funding to UNRWA. We have now provided £41 million to UNRWA, recognising its vital work.

We have taken a different approach on questions of international law in relation to the ICC and the ICJ, and in our votes in the UN Security Council. Even when resolutions have been defeated, we have been clear on our commitment to international humanitarian law and the need for a two-state solution. In relation to sanctions on settlers and settlements, we have taken far-reaching action, which I shall cover briefly in my speech.

I would like to say something, given how strongly many of our constituents feel about the issues. I am a Labour Member and Minister, and other Labour MPs send me the videos the photos and the many reports that I know constituents see every day, as so many people have referred to. I see them too. As a Labour Member and Minister, I am never far from the reality of the situation. I am grateful to my colleagues for helping to ensure that that is the case.

I will turn briefly to the petitions that we are debating, trying to give substantive answers to both, then I will take interventions. First, on the call for immediate recognition, I want to I want to make it clear that this Government are unequivocal in their support for recognition and of a two-state solution. Palestinian statehood, as my hon. Friend the Member for Poplar and Limehouse (Apsana Begum) said, is the right of the Palestinian people; it is not in the gift of any neighbour, and it is vital, as was set out, that the people of the west bank and Gaza are given the political perspective of a credible route to a Palestinian state.

We are committed to recognising a Palestinian state, and we will do so at the time most conducive to the long-term prospects for peace. We must take that step when we think that it will make the greatest contribution to bringing about the reality of a sovereign Palestinian state, alongside a secure Israel, which I know is the end goal we all agree on.

Many Members have referenced the decisions of allies. We watch those carefully and discuss the issues diplomatically, as one might expect. Simply saying a thing does not make it so, however, and this Government are driving their efforts towards the practical questions: creating the conditions necessary for a two-state solution to become a reality. The Prime Minister reiterated that commitment and his support for reforms to the Palestinian Authority—mentioned by a number of Members—when he met President Abbas in September.

The hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) asked about our support for Israel’s security. Of course, that remains steadfast, as it does for Israel’s right to self-defence against terrorism and state threats. However, as we have said repeatedly, Israel must do that in accordance with international law. We have taken decisive action against extremist Israeli settlers who undermine the viability of a two-state solution and we have called out the unacceptable rhetoric of some Israeli Ministers.

As Members have said, settlement expansion and violence have reached record levels. The Israeli Government seized more of the west bank in 2024 than in the past 20 years; that is completely unacceptable. We recently sanctioned three illegal outposts and four organisations that have supported and sponsored violence against communities in the west bank. Those sanctions are focused not just on the violence, but on the settlements themselves, which are contrary to international law. We will continue to take action necessary to challenge those who undermine a two-state solution. On the questions asked about sanctions, I am afraid that I will not provide—in a way that Members will be familiar with—a commentary on whom we may target with sanctions, but I reassure the Chamber that we will continue to take the action necessary.

Let me turn to the call in the second petition to revoke all licences for arms exports to Israel. I recognise the strength of feeling. It is why on day one, we commissioned a review into Israel’s commitment to and compliance with international humanitarian law and we took decisive action where the review found possible breaches. On 2 September, the Foreign Secretary announced that decision to Parliament, and it followed a conclusion of the clear risk of items being used in violation of IHL. Let me be clear: that is not a partial suspension; it is a full suspension of all licences for equipment for use in military operations in Gaza.

I will come to the F-35 points shortly, but on the remaining licences that are not in relation to the F-35s, they are for body armour for journalists and NGOs; equipment for re-export to close allies; and items utilised for training and never intended to see conflict. Those are the remaining military licences to Israel. In my view, it is not right to suspend those when there is no clear risk that they could be used in the ongoing conflict. The majority of licences to Israel are not to the Israel Defence Forces and not for military equipment. Under this Government’s watch, there are no extant licences that could be used by Israel to commit or facilitate a serious violation of international humanitarian law in the Gaza conflict. All of this is subject to the measures set out in Parliament excluding exports to the global F-35 programme from the scope of the suspension. Some Members have questioned that, but let me be clear about the Government’s view: suspending F-35 licences could not be done without prejudicing the F-35 programme.

My right hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham Hodge Hill and Solihull North (Liam Byrne) asked how that is consistent with the law and referred to some of the opening speeches in the ongoing judicial review. I will not comment in great detail on the judicial review, which is considering these legal questions in greater detail. The section of the arms trade treaty to which he referred asks us to tend to questions of international peace and security. We have been clear in the House, and I am clear again today, that to bring down the F-35 programme would have significance to international peace and security and to our broader strategic role in NATO, and would affect western equipment support for Ukraine. This is not an arbitrary decision that we have taken. We will keep this and all aspects of our policy under close review.

[Andy McDonald]

Will my hon. Friend please accept from the people who make this argument that there is strength in it? The issue is the end user of the F-35 programme. There is no suggestion that the UK should withdraw from the programme entirely, only that there be a block on the end user. Those F-35s are delivering the 2,000-pound bombs that are rending asunder civilian communities in Gaza and we must play our part in making sure that does not happen any longer. Will he please accept that?

[Mr Falconer]

I want to be clear to my hon. Friend and to everybody here that the direct selling of F-35 parts to Israel has now been suspended; it is indirectly that we are not in a position to determine the end user. Members are saying that we could determine the end user. I reiterate the Government’s position that the global supply chain is critical to the operation of the F-35 programme and that we cannot suspend licences to end users in the way that my hon. Friend would like without imperilling that.

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[Mr Falconer]

I will try to push on, if that is okay.

We have announced £112 million for the occupied Palestinian territories this year. We will continue to press for the vital services that civilians in Gaza and the west bank desperately need. That includes £13 million that the Prime Minister announced as our commitment to UNRWA when he met Commissioner-General Lazzarini on 11 December. As I understand it, he is the first ever Prime Minister to meet an UNRWA Commissioner-General.

We have continually supported hostage talks, and I welcome the reference that fellow Members have made to the British national who is still being detained by Hamas. We will continue to work alongside our allies and partners in the region, exercising every possible diplomatic lever to see the hostages immediately and unconditionally released.

As I said, we have imposed sanctions against those perpetrating and inciting human rights abuses against Palestinian communities in the west bank, and since July we have sanctioned three illegal outposts and four organisations. I welcome the comments from hon. Members about the importance of peace-building efforts.

[Andy McDonald]

The Minister has mentioned several times the three illegal outposts and four organisations. All outposts in the west bank are illegal. As a nation, why are we not taking much more strenuous action against all illegal occupation of the west bank and the occupied territories?

[Mr Falconer]

I thank my hon. Friend for the opportunity to reiterate this Government’s policy towards the west bank. It is occupied Palestinian territory: that is clear in international law, and there is no dispute about that. The sanctions that we imposed had quite far-reaching implications, including for organisations that are involved on a broad and structural basis in helping to construct settlements. I hope that there is no ambiguity about our position.

Syria

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Monday 9th December 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

Working with the OPCW on the ground is hugely important, and the work of the UN envoy is also essential. We will do all that we can to ensure those stockpiles are properly protected.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

There will be great jubilation at seeing the back of Assad. I very much welcome the Foreign Secretary’s statement, including his reference to illicit finance, which is critically important, and what he said about building an inclusive society that protects minorities. This is a great moment of hope, but it comes with trepidation as well. The Foreign Secretary spoke of a new hope for Syrians getting their country back, and I am grateful for his clarification regarding the Golan heights. Whatever emerges from this transition, I know he shares the desire to seek a reliable partner and a supporter of democracy to replace this dreadful regime, but can he say something about the urgency of establishing that partnership and the timescale for it? What work is going on with partners to make sure that it happens quickly?

[Mr Lammy]

I am very grateful for the interest in these issues and in the region that my hon. Friend has shown over many, many years. He will understand that we are in the foothills here, and that a lot has to be done to stabilise Syria at this time. In that context, it is a little premature to give a timetable. I understand why he wants one—he wants to guarantee that things will not go south over the coming months—but the issues that I raised relating to oil, fuel and energy and support for public services are pressing on our minds. We have to ensure that disorder does not set in, and that is what we will be working closely on with partners over the coming days.

Israel-Gaza Conflict: Arrest Warrants

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Monday 25th November 2024 Commons Chamber

[Hamish Falconer]

I will not go into operational details, but I can assure the House that the surveillance aircraft are unarmed and do not have a combat role. They are tasked solely with locating hostages, including a British national, and they will continue to do so.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

In response to the right hon. Member for Witham (Priti Patel), I note that the UK under the previous Conservative Government signed an ICC state party statement in support of the ICC and to preserve it from political interference, just before the election. The Foreign Secretary has confirmed the UK’s acceptance of and respect for the ICC arrest warrants for Netanyahu’s war crimes. Therefore, is it not now incumbent on the Government to take effective, concrete steps to prevent further such acts by banning all arms licences to Israel, including those relating to F-35 parts; by imposing sanctions on individuals, on assets and on goods trading with the illegally occupied west bank; and by the urgent recognition of Palestinian statehood?

[Hamish Falconer]

I will not rehearse the points that we have already discussed on sanctions. The Foreign Secretary has set out our position in relation to the suspension of arms licences and the F-35 exemptions, and that remains the position. We will keep our assessments under regular review, including the findings of the ICC.

Middle East

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Monday 28th October 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

The right hon. Gentleman has raised a serious issue. This is why the Home Secretary and I are looking far more closely at what it means to bear down on a state that is causing the activity that he has described, rather than a terrorist cell that is causing it. Most often when we are discussing these issues in the Chamber, we are talking about Hamas, Hezbollah or some terrorist cell, but in this instance we are talking about a state, which means that more complex issues come to bear, including, of course, our own presence in that state, and for those reasons we engaging in a more thorough examination.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

The Foreign Secretary will no doubt agree that third states, such as the UK, are obliged not to assist Israel in its annihilation of the Gazan people. Israel continues to target the cynically named “safe zones”—schools and hospitals—in its war of extermination. Although the UK has suspended 30 of 90 licences for the export of arms to the Israeli military, our continued participation in the F-35 global supply chain means that devastating 2,000-lb bombs continue to destroy human beings. The Foreign Secretary rightly asks what must parents say to their children, and how do they explain this living nightmare. Are they not right also to ask where were the international community when they needed them and why were all the levers available not used—to ban arms sales, to use the leverage of recognition of Palestine and to impose sanctions to concentrate minds?

[Mr Lammy]

My hon. Friend will understand that we sell relatively few arms to Israel—I think they represent 1% of the total amount—and that much of what we send is defensive in nature. It is not what we describe routinely as arms, because the licensing regime is about controlled equipment, which is not always arms. However, we have suspended arms that could be used in Israel in contravention of humanitarian law. I made that decision, and I think it was the right decision. As I have said, we continue to do all we can to support the people of Gaza, and I am deeply sad that I and my predecessors have not been able to bring this crisis and war to an end. It saddens me greatly. My hon. Friend evokes my conscience; I believe that I am doing all I can, according to my conscience.

Gaza and Humanitarian Aid

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Thursday 10th October 2024 Westminster Hall

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to see you in the Chair this afternoon, Ms Vaz. I congratulate the hon. Member for Birmingham Perry Barr (Ayoub Khan) on securing this debate. Before the recent recess, I tabled a written question to the Government. The answer is overdue, so I will briefly provide the background and put it to the Minister.

On 2 September, the Government revoked licences for all items used in the current conflict in Gaza that go to the Israel Defence Forces. It did so because there exists a clear risk that they might be used to commit or facilitate a serious violation of international humanitarian law. This is evidenced by events such as the IDF-confirmed use of 2,000 lb bombs, bunker-busting bombs, in a declared safe zone in al-Mawasi in July when they killed at least 90 Palestinians and injured over 30.

The revocation includes licences for F-35 fighter jet components where they go directly to Israel. They are revoked, but those in the supply chain in the global pool are not. Clearly, the components can still be used to facilitate a serious violation of international humanitarian law and to frustrate humanitarian aid. So I ask my Government to make it their policy to seek to negotiate an end-use agreement with F-35 programme supply chain and electronic stockpile management system counterparts, to end the re-export of F-35s to Israel.

The Dutch Government have suspended direct sales but continue to supply the global pool, but surely a discussion must be had with partner nations on managing the programme so that the global pool of spare parts is not used to repair Israeli F-35 jets. Unless the issue is raised and resolved with partner nations, I submit that the Government are at risk of breaching our own commitments to upholding international humanitarian law. I pray in aid the UN inquiry, which said today that it found that Israel carried out a “concerted policy” of destroying Gaza’s healthcare systems in the Gaza war—actions amounting to both

“war crimes and the crime against humanity of extermination”,

so I urge my Government to utilise all the levers at their disposal, and accept that the recognition of the state of Palestine is a prerequisite of peace—and that the optimal time to do so is now.

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[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Affairs (Hamish Falconer)]

I am grateful to the hon. Member for Birmingham Perry Barr (Ayoub Khan) for securing this important debate, and I thank you, Ms Vaz, for your expert management of today’s proceedings. This is my first debate in this place, so I am sure that I will be considerably less expert, and I beg your indulgence at the outset. I will try to be brief so that I can give the hon. Member an opportunity to respond.

As many have said, this week marked one year since Hamas’s brutal attack against Israel. It was the worst attack in its history and without doubt the darkest day in Jewish history since the Holocaust. As many have said in this Chamber, my thoughts are with Jewish people around the world and the Jewish community here in the United Kingdom. More than 1,000 people were massacred, hundreds were taken hostage and many are still cruelly detained today, including Emily Damari. I reiterate our commitment to bringing those hostages home; we will not give up until they are, and work is ongoing on that.

However, as has been the subject of most of the interventions, we also look back on a year of devastating conflict and suffering. I will say a little about the Government’s assessment of the situation in Gaza, then, in the time available, I will focus particularly on the humanitarian situation. I recognise that it is my fault that there are some late parliamentary questions on these issues, particularly relating to the detail on F-35s, and I will be pleased to respond in writing.

A year on, close to 42,000 people have now been killed in Gaza, with over half of all bodies identified being women and children. We believe that more than 90% of the population has been displaced, many of them repeatedly. There is now simply no safe place to go. The humanitarian zone covers less than 15% of the Gaza strip, and as has been mentioned, not even that is always safe. It is chronically overcrowded and the lack of clean water and sanitation means that the risk of disease is rife.

Reference has also been made to the severe lack of food which, according to the IPC, means that the whole population is at risk of starvation, and we expect a further update on that in due course. Sixty-six per cent of buildings, including hospitals—as many have mentioned—are damaged or destroyed. Parents cannot feed their children. Children cannot go to school. Families cannot support each other. I have been asked many questions by contributors about humanitarian access, and I want to be clear on the Government’s position: it remains wholly inadequate. There have been repeated attacks on convoys, evacuation orders have undermined operations and the level is far below Israel’s commitment to flood Gaza with aid.

[Andy McDonald]

I raised earlier the question of the Israeli military action to which the Minister has just referred. In the past hour or so, the UN has stated on its website:

“Israel Defense Forces (IDF) fired on UN peacekeepers in Lebanon early Thursday morning.”

Two peacekeepers were injured, which is yet further evidence that Israel behaves with complete contempt and disregard for international law and norms. Will he join me in condemning such action?

[Hamish Falconer]

They have only just come in, but we are very concerned about reports of attacks on staff of the United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon. The work of UN peacekeepers is incredibly important and a vital contribution to global peace and security. We will be able to say more as reports become clearer.

The situation in Gaza is a catastrophe on all counts. A few contributors have mentioned winterisation. We are deeply concerned that winter is coming in and the shortage of aid into Gaza means that most of the civilian population is unprepared for the drop in temperature. I will be visiting the region next week in part to look into some of those matters further. We intend to work together with our allies. Since entering office in July, we have made a series of key decisions. Along with our allies, we have been pushing for an immediate ceasefire since day 1, and I was confused by the reference to our position on 18 September. We have been calling for an immediate ceasefire since 4 July, and we will continue to call for an immediate ceasefire. The fact that is has not yet been abided by does not in any way undermine the urgency of what we are doing.

Middle East Update

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Monday 2nd September 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Lammy]

The right hon. Gentleman, who has raised these issues consistently in the House over many years, is absolutely right to draw our focus to what is happening on the west bank. Not because of the immediate violence that we have seen in the last two days, but because the level of violence—the expansion and the sense of impunity that one sees when one is in the west bank—is of huge concern. I reassure him that I continue to work with allies and to keep these matters under close review.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

I thank the Foreign Secretary for his statement. I speak as a long-term friend of Palestine and an advocate of a two-state solution. I am sure that he will agree that we want to see all hostages released in their hundreds and thousands.

What assessment has the Foreign Secretary made of the impact of his suspension of 30 licences? Israel has shown little sign of responding to pressure from the outside world, so along with the hon. Member for Oxford West and Abingdon (Layla Moran), I ask what further steps he is prepared to take. We see those egregious behaviours in the west bank, so is it really conscionable that Israel will respond favourably to his limited but welcome announcement today?

[Mr Lammy]

May I say that I know the strength with which my hon. Friend talks about these issues, and has talked about them consistently over many years? Let me make it clear that the announcement that I have made today follows a process, which was set up by the last Government in 2021. We have followed that process to the letter, which is why I am here today. The point of the process is in no way to punish Israel, but to make sure that our export licensing regime remains among the most robust in the world. I recognise what he says about the west bank particularly, which is why I went to the region again just a few weeks ago.