Universal Credit and Personal Independence Payment Bill

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Committee of the whole House & 3rd reading
Wednesday 9th July 2025 Commons Chamber

[Deirdre Costigan (Ealing Southall) (Lab)]

I will speak to the Government amendments and against some other amendments. Before I was elected, I worked for the trade union Unison where I was the national officer for disability equality. In that job, I saw every day how disabled people who love their jobs are often pushed out of the workplace by employers who refuse to make the small changes that would help them to thrive at work.

Through the Mayfield review, this Labour Government are seizing the opportunity to finally make the workplace more accessible for disabled people. The Employment Rights Bill will bring in flexible working, allowing disabled workers to perhaps start a little later in the morning when tablets have kicked in or to work from home to avoid the painful morning rush hour. Alongside that, I have also introduced my own Bill for a deadline for employer responses to reasonable adjustment requests from disabled workers. We are transforming the workplace for disabled people, and Labour is also making work pay. No longer will it be a choice between benefits and a bargain basement job. We have increased wages for 3 million low-paid workers, committed to introducing mandatory disability pay gap monitoring and delivered the biggest upgrade to workers’ rights in a generation.

Government new clause 1 and associated amendments will ensure that for those who cannot work, their universal credit health benefit will increase in line with inflation. The Bill ends the absolute indignity of constant reassessments for those with severe conditions. Almost 15,000 families in Ealing Southall will also see the basic rate of universal credit increase by a record amount, lifting thousands of children out of poverty across the country. New clause 12 would rob those 15,000 families of that money—it must be rejected.

It cannot be right that almost 3 million people are off work long-term sick, 1 million young people are not earning or learning, and a thousand people a day are applying for PIP. We are an outlier internationally. No other country in the world sees the same massive increase in people on sickness-related benefits. It is unique to this country, and we do no favours to people with long-term conditions by ignoring it. The Tories created this broken system where people are better off on sickness benefits than in work and there is no help for those who want a job. Everyone knows the system needs reform, but amendments 2(a), amendment 2(b) from the Chair of the Select Committee my hon. Friend the Member for Oldham East and Saddleworth (Debbie Abrahams), Conservative amendments 50 to 55, and new clause 12 would continue to put reform on the long finger and delay change.

Last August, after 14 years of the Tories, when I visited west Ealing jobcentre and asked who I could speak to if I was a disabled person who needed a job that would work around my needs, I was told there was no one—no one at all. That is why we need change now. Under Labour, west London is one of the 14 Get Britain Working trailblazers across the country. People on long-term sickness benefits with back pain and other musculoskeletal conditions, which are the second biggest reason why people claim health-related benefits, have been contacted and asked if they want help to get a job, and hundreds have replied that they do. They have been sat there waiting for us to contact them. Those people were ignored by the previous Government—people who wanted to work but were left on the scrapheap.

Some £8 million from the Government is helping west Londoners into work. The Bill is part of a much bigger £1 billion plan to extend that to every jobcentre and to every disabled person who wants a good job. The new right to try will build a more flexible benefits system that does not force people to put themselves in a box, locked out of work for ever, but allows them to try work without losing benefits.

I am glad that the Government have ensured that no one on PIP will lose it, and that they will co-produce the PIP review with disabled people—it has been over a decade since the PIP system was last reviewed, and since then we have learned more about the impact of mental health conditions and fluctuating conditions—but true co-production means letting the review go ahead without this House trying to control it, so we must reject the rigidness of new clauses 8 and 11 in favour of true co-production.

Disabled people were let down again and again by the previous Government. Labour is finally delivering equality for disabled workers while fixing the broken system that forces almost 3 million people to languish on long-term sickness benefits without help. If colleagues across the House genuinely want reform that builds a better, more flexible benefits system that makes work pay, takes 50,000 children out of poverty and properly supports disabled people who cannot work, they must do more than just talk about it; they must vote for the Bill and get on with the job of changing Britain for the better.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

I rise to speak in support of new clauses 8 and 11, amendment 38 and the Bill more broadly. This informed debate has been conducted respectfully. Throughout the entire process, it has been illuminating to hear from so many Members with such in-depth personal, familial and professional experience. I urge those on the Government Front Bench to look upon such Members from across the House as a resource, because they speak with great authority. I mention in particular the speeches by my hon. Friends the Members for Stourbridge (Cat Eccles), for South West Norfolk (Terry Jermy) and for Beckenham and Penge (Liam Conlon), which were so informative.

May I correct one earlier comment? We heard from one Opposition Member that “no recourse to public funds” means “recourse to public funds.” Well, the clue is in the descriptor. I know that Boris Johnson struggled with that, but “no recourse to public funds” means exactly what it says.

I wish to speak about the impact were the House to pass amendment 2. I recognise that the amendment adopts some of the previously announced concessions and somewhat limits the damage of clause 2. But let me be clear: even with the amendment, the clause is not acceptable. The Bill is not welfare reform; it is a cut—deliberate, far-reaching and deeply damaging. Even after amendments, clause 2 will remove £2 billion from disabled people in the years ahead. Three quarters of those affected are already in material deprivation. Around 750,000 individuals—people who are too ill to work—stand to lose an average of £3,000 a year. Members must consider today which constituents whose doors they knock on will find themselves £3,000 a year worse off. The weekly top-up for those too unwell to work, which is currently £97, will fall to £50 for new applicants—the same condition and need as current claimants, but half the support. That is not fairness; it is the creation of a two-tier welfare system. We are not talking about abstractions; we are talking about people who cannot walk 50 metres, or who need constant supervision, or who cannot operate a keypad unaided. They currently receive £423 per month. Soon, some could receive as little as £217 per month. That is not a budget decision; it is a moral one.

--- Later in debate ---

[Freddie van Mierlo (Henley and Thame) (LD)]

One amendment tabled by the Conservatives seeks to strip foreign nationals of the right to claim benefits. That could mean that some people are left with no support whatsoever, which could include my father, who has been in this country for 40 years and paid into the system. The amendment tabled by the Conservatives is absolutely despicable, and I invite the hon. Member to join me in agreeing with that statement.

[Andy McDonald]

The hon. Member makes a powerful point. We have to raise our heads and look at our brothers and sisters, who are actively and economically engaged in our country, and think about the contribution they make and the payments they make into the Treasury, through tax and national insurance. We must treat them with dignity and respect, rather than trying to other them at every opportunity.

[Simon Hoare (North Dorset) (Con)]

The hon. Member makes an incredibly powerful and telling point about the disincentive of trying to get into work for people who have a varying and fluctuating condition, such as MS. That is an unanswerable point and I will listen with interest to what the Minister has to say in response. Does he agree with me that in conversations that the Minister has with what we are too lazily inclined to refer to as “the disabled community”, unless we are able to break down disabled groups into those who have a permanent condition and those who have a fluctuating condition, and to individually tailor responses to that, it will be a missed opportunity to get this right?

[Andy McDonald]

The hon. Member makes an important point, and it is critical that that is reflected on the face of the Bill. With all sincerity, we cannot walk away from here thinking that guidance notes are enough. They may change fundamentally in further iterations and say something completely different from what this honourable and decent Minister is saying to us today. Policy for disabled people must be made with them, not imposed upon them.

If we are serious about ending austerity, we cannot keep balancing the books on the backs of the poorest. That means revisiting not just what we spend, but who we tax and how. We have heard about the party of millionaires making their case that this country has done so well by them—they are so privileged to have made a success of their lives and to have flourished—that they are looking at the opportunities they were given and saying, “Please, we can make a further contribution.” It is they who made the argument about a wealth tax that would raise £24 billion. Nigel Lawson, when he was Chancellor, thought that the differential between capital gains tax and income tax was an anathema, and he equalised it, so there are opportunities for us there.

The Employment Rights Bill also presents us with wonderful opportunities. If we could grasp the issue of “single status of worker” and deal with the issue of bogus self-employment, limb (b) employment, zero-hours contracts and the rest of it, that not only represents secure, well-paid, unionised work for people to give them a flourishing life; it also gives us the opportunity to collect currently uncollected tax and national insurance, to the tune of £10 billion per annum. That would also mean supporting people according to their needs. That is not Marx, but the Acts of the Apostles.

This is a moment of reckoning. The country expects better. If we are to lose our nerve now, we will lose more than a vote: we will lose the trust that brought us here. We must reflect that during our discussions about the Bill, each and every one of us has heard the response from our constituents and our offices that this has been a shambles—there is no other word to describe it. Now is the moment to stop the cuts and I implore the Government to rethink the Bill.

[Nadia Whittome (Nottingham East) (Lab)]

I rise to support my new clause 10, as well as a number of other amendments tabled by my right hon. and hon. Friends, including new clause 8, new clause 11 and amendment 38.

I welcome the concessions that the Government have made to the Bill, which I will be supporting. I pay tribute to the disabled and chronically ill people whose tireless campaigning led to those concessions—I have been proud to stand with them. However, the changes do not alleviate all my concerns about the Bill. One in three disabled people are already in poverty. The Bill, even after the Government’s amendments, would take around £3,000 a year from the disabled people of the future, at a time when the extra cost of being disabled is set to rise by 12% in the next five years.

The Government’s analysis states that the measures in the Bill will lift 50,000 people out of poverty. However, analysis from the Joseph Rowntree Foundation and the New Economics Foundation shows that they would actually push 50,000 disabled people into poverty. We know that benefit cuts and loss of payments help to trap women experiencing domestic abuse, make children grow up in poverty and even cost lives, like that of my constituent Philippa Day, who died from a deliberate overdose after her benefits were wrongly cut.

This is particularly pertinent to those with fluctuating conditions, who risk losing LCWRA status during periods of temporary improvement. That is why amendment 38 is so vital, as it would ensure that they are protected. Even with the Government’s concessions, not a single disabled people’s organisation supports this Bill. It is at the request of the disabled people’s organisations forum in England that I have tabled new clause 10, which would require the Government to publish a human rights memorandum before the Bill can be enacted.

No analysis of the impact of the Bill on the human rights of disabled people has been published so far. Last year, the UN found that there had been further regression in the “grave and systemic violations” of disabled people’s rights in the UK, which it reported on in 2016. Last night, the UN wrote to the Government to say that it had “received credible information” indicating that the Bill will “deepen” that regression. We should not proceed with the Bill as it stands.

Disabled people’s organisations remain sceptical about the Timms review into PIP. I am hopeful that the Government will support the amendment tabled by my hon. Friend the Member for Penistone and Stocksbridge (Dr Tidball), which would make provision for commitments around co-production and oversight. They must also support new clause 8, which would ensure that changes from the Timms review are introduced as primary legislation. That is essential in ensuring democratic scrutiny—otherwise, MPs will not be able to amend or vote on the legislation. It would also prevent a reduction in eligibility for PIP, which we know would be disastrous and which motivated so many of us on the Government Benches to call on the Government to think again.

I joined the Labour party because of what I experienced and witnessed growing up as a child and a teenager under the Conservatives. As a disabled MP, I have first-hand experience of the disability benefits system. We have all met constituents who are already not getting the support they need. The question today is this: do we let their number grow? If the answer is no, I urge Members to support the amendments that would strengthen protections for disabled people and, ultimately, to vote down this Bill.

Universal Credit and Personal Independence Payment Bill

Andy McDonald Excerpts

2nd reading
Tuesday 1st July 2025 Commons Chamber

[The Minister for Social Security and Disability (Sir Stephen Timms)]

During this debate, my hon. Friend and others across the House have raised concerns that the changes to PIP are coming ahead of the conclusions of the review of the assessment that I will be leading. We have heard those concerns, and that is why I can announce that we are going to remove clause 5 from the Bill in Committee. We will move straight to the wider review—sometimes referred to as the Timms review—and only make changes to PIP eligibility activities and descriptors following that review. The Government are committed to concluding the review by the autumn of next year.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I would be grateful for your clarification. We have just heard that a pivotal part of the Bill, clause 5, will not be effective, so I ask this: what are we supposed to be voting on tonight? Is it the Bill as drawn, or another Bill? I am confused, and I think Members in the Chamber will need that clarification.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Caroline Nokes)]

The hon. Member will be aware that that is not a matter for the Chair, and the vote will be on the Bill as it stands. We have had a clear undertaking from the Dispatch Box as to what will happen in Committee.

Welfare Reform

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Monday 30th June 2025 Commons Chamber

[Liz Kendall]

I want to make it very clear that the combined rate of the standard allowance and the health top-up will indeed rise in line with inflation, so that existing claimants are protected in real terms, and the incomes of those with severe lifelong conditions and those at the end of their life are also protected in real terms through the combined universal credit standard allowance top-up.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

The Bill still leaves over £3.5 billion of cuts falling on disabled people and unpaid carers, with hundreds of thousands of new claimants set to lose thousands of pounds each year. Protections for existing claimants are welcome, but a two-tier system will generate hardship for many and create societal divisions. We are being asked to vote without vital evidence—without the Office for Budget Responsibility impact assessment, or the Timms and Mayfield reviews. Serious questions remain unanswered, and we are without clarity on outcomes and implementation. Will the Secretary of State continue to listen, withdraw this Bill, and co-design welfare reform with disabled people’s groups?

[Liz Kendall]

I say to my hon. Friend, for whom I have great respect, that none of this takes into account the biggest ever investment in employment support for sick and disabled people. People have often said, “Wait for the OBR’s assessment,” but we have published very clear evidence that good employment programmes can help disabled people into work—programmes such as Work Choice, a Labour programme ended by the Tories, which saw 40% more disabled people in work for eight years. That is based not just on economic theory, but on practical reality. That is the difference that this Labour Government want to make.

Oral Answers to Questions

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Monday 23rd June 2025 Commons Chamber

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

Ministers have highlighted that the PIP recipients who are expected to lose payments make up one in 10 of the total PIP caseload. That suggests that the impact of the cuts will be limited, but it still represents 370,000 current recipients, who are expected to lose £4,500 on average. However, those numbers rest on a set of assumptions that the OBR has described as “highly uncertain”. DWP data shows that 1.3 million people currently receiving PIP daily living payments would not meet the new criteria. Before MPs are asked to vote on imposing such appalling poverty, will the DWP or the OBR provide further evidence underpinning those claims?

[Sir Stephen Timms]

The OBR has published its assessment, and my hon. Friend is right that it has assessed that one in 10 of those receiving PIP in November next year will have lost it by 2029-30—one in 10; not the much larger proportion that we were hearing about earlier. Following that, we will be able to introduce the biggest ever investment in employment support for people out of work on health and disability grounds. We do not want any longer to trap people on low incomes for years and years; we want people to be able to enter work and fulfil their ambitions. That is what the investment will allow.

Disabled People in Poverty

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Tuesday 17th June 2025 Westminster Hall

[Neil Duncan-Jordan]

I absolutely agree with the hon. Member.

All the things I described need to be addressed, but the fear among disabled people is that the changes outlined in the “Pathways to Work” Green Paper, which may or may not find their way into the Bill, amount to piling more cuts on to an already broken system.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

In my constituency, 23,000 people receive universal credit and 11,000 receive PIP. I have asked what impact the changes will have on people going into poverty or being helped into work, and I have had very few answers. Estimates from Health Equity North show that the changes will amount to about £22 million a year being taken out of the local economy. Does my hon. Friend agree that it is utterly unconscionable for us to decide to produce that outcome without any evidence to demonstrate the benefits? We are effectively voting blind, and that is simply not acceptable.

[Neil Duncan-Jordan]

I thank my hon. Friend for his contribution. I will later talk about the evidence that we need to see before we come to a vote.

Personal Independence Payment: Disabled People

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Wednesday 7th May 2025 Westminster Hall

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

We have heard from the Government that by 2029-30, 800,000 fewer people will get the daily living component of PIP. For the 370,000 people already on it, the average loss is £4,500. Three million people will see their health-related universal credit cut, some by as much as £3,000. The consequences will be rising poverty, greater food bank reliance and mounting pressure on public services.

The Government claim that those consequences will be offset by incentives to work. However, estimates from the Learning and Work Institute and the Institute for Fiscal Studies suggest that only 1% to 3% of those affected—perhaps tens of thousands out of millions—may gain employment. That leaves 97% worse off. As the MP for Middlesbrough and Thornaby East, I have repeatedly asked how that will affect my constituents, how many will lose their entitlement, and how many will fall into poverty.

I have asked at Prime Minister’s questions and I have tabled written questions for equality, employment and poverty impact assessments to be published before legislation is introduced. I have asked whether disabled people and carers will be consulted on changes, such as the one requiring claimants to score four points. I have not received any response to those questions, yet the changes will proceed with urgency. This is policymaking in the dark. I will be voting against the changes, because for me it is always country first and party second.

Women’s Changed State Pension Age: Compensation

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Monday 17th March 2025 Westminster Hall

[Dr Savage]

I absolutely agree with the hon. Lady.

The assumption that affected women should have monitored their pensions is deeply offensive. Like most normal people, they were focused on their lives, their work and their families. The oft-cited statistic that 90% of women knew about the changes is misleading; it comes from a 2006 survey about the general awareness of possible future changes, not the specific impact on individuals, and only 5% of the respondents to that survey were 1950s-born women. The ombudsman, in fact, found that only 43% knew that their pension age was 65.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

I congratulate the hon. Lady on securing this debate. Does she share my concern that we are going down a dangerous path when, despite the ombudsman having made a recommendation, that has been rejected? Does that not shake faith in the entire system of ombudsmen?

[Dr Savage]

I agree with the hon. Gentleman that there is an egregious lack of transparency and accountability at the heart of this case.

--- Later in debate ---

[Torsten Bell]

I will make some progress because I have given the best answer that I can to my hon. Friend’s question.

The ombudsman is clear that redress and compensation should normally reflect individual impact, but it also acknowledges the challenges of assessing the individual circumstances of 3.5 million women, as recognised by the hon. Member for East Wiltshire (Danny Kruger) a few moments ago. It took the ombudsman nearly six years to look at just six cases; doing so for millions would take years and thousands of DWP staff.

In answer my hon. Friend the Member for Bedford (Mohammad Yasin), we considered a range of compensation options for women who lost opportunities as a result of the delay in sending letters. For example, we considered rules-based schemes, such as that which the Work and Pensions Committee suggested, and we also considered the possibility of paying limited compensation to a smaller group of women—for example, those on pension credit, as suggested by the hon. Member for Eastleigh.

However, many of those schemes would mean compensating women who were aware that the state pension age was increasing. Payments would not relate directly to the injustice in question but to benefit entitlement or the timeline for the policy change. Paying a flat rate to all 3.5 million women, regardless of whether they suffered injustice, would be neither fair nor proportionate. It would also not be affordable, as such compensation schemes would cost up to £10.5 billion. To directly address the question of my hon. Friend the Member for Falkirk (Euan Stainbank), the Government’s decision was not driven purely by cost.

[Andy McDonald]

The Minister has listed a whole host of alternatives, but is it fair to ignore the ombudsman’s clear conclusion that compensation ought to be paid? Is it fair to do nothing?

[Torsten Bell]

The Government have not ignored the ombudsman’s report or its judgment. We have just come to a different conclusion for the detailed reasons—[Interruption.] I appreciate that I am not going to persuade many Members in the Chamber for the very reason that they have chosen to come today, but on the direct question asked by my hon. Friend, the Government did not ignore the ombudsman’s report. We have come to a different view for the reasons that I have set out, on the basis of the research that I have mentioned.

I have set out the grounds for the Government’s decision. I appreciate that none of that is likely to change the minds of many Members here, or of the campaigners whose tenacity no one disputes, and to which the hon. Member for Torbay (Steve Darling) paid tribute. I fully recognise the challenges that this cohort of women have faced: working hard in sexist workplaces and often balancing that with raising a family. We have a responsibility to listen to their concerns. That is why my predecessor, my hon. Friend the Member for Wycombe (Emma Reynolds), was the first Minister in eight years to meet the WASPI campaign.

Public Authorities (Fraud, Error and Recovery) Bill

Andy McDonald Excerpts

2nd reading
Monday 3rd February 2025 Commons Chamber

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

My right hon. Friend has the House’s wholehearted support in pursuing the recovery of funds taken by fraud and error. The National Audit Office estimates that, in the last financial year, £39 billion of tax revenue was not received due to fraud and error, compared with £7 billion in overpaid benefits classed as fraud, which we want to pursue. Can she reassure the House that an appropriate level of resources will be targeted at recovering this large sum of money, which will bring better dividends back to the Treasury?

[Liz Kendall]

My hon. Friend is right to raise this issue, which he knows the Chancellor and the Treasury team are looking at seriously. The clear message from this Government is, “If you are getting money to which you are not entitled or owe money to the taxpayer through either unpaid taxes or fraud, that is wrong.” We treat everything the same, large or small. We believe in our public services and our social security system, and we want people to know that every single penny of their money is wisely spent and goes to those in the greatest need.

“Get Britain Working” White Paper

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Tuesday 26th November 2024 Commons Chamber

[Liz Kendall]

Of course businesses face these pressures, but I think many of them understand that the Government have to look at the fundamentals. We faced a problem with the public finances when we got into government. My right hon. Friend the Chancellor took the decision that the only way we could sort out the country for the long term was to get the public finances back on a more sustainable footing. The businesses that I have met, including Tesco in my constituency, raised concerns with me, but they also said that they really want to get more young people who have mental health problems into work. Tesco has a brilliant partnership with the King’s Trust to get those young people into work and help them stay there, because it knows that the key to those young people’s future is to get those skills, so that they can grow business and make the changes that this country needs.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

I thank my right hon. Friend for her statement. My constituents will very much welcome the additional funding for young people in the Tees Valley, and the modernisation of jobcentres, which will benefit our wonderful jobcentre staff. Can the Secretary of State say how the changes will dovetail with the Employment Rights Bill? How will we ensure that young people are offered quality employment and training opportunities, and not pressured into accepting inadequate and insecure zero-hours jobs? Can she also say how the Government and Members can monitor and evaluate the combined authorities’ delivery of the youth trailblazer programme?

[Liz Kendall]

My hon. Friend will know of our plans to make work pay, bring in day one employment rights, end exploitative zero-hours contracts and improve flexibility at work. We need to do all those things to make sure that there are good-quality job options out there for young people. There will be new leadership roles for mayors in combined authorities, but also clear accountability for delivering the outcome that we want, which is that every young person has an opportunity to earn or learn. We will make sure that happens.

Social Security Advisory Committee: Winter Fuel Payment

Andy McDonald Excerpts

Tuesday 12th November 2024 Commons Chamber

[Emma Reynolds]

If the hon. Lady looks at the equality analysis, she will see that those with a disability will be disproportionately likely to retain the winter fuel payment. I urge her to have a look at that.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough and Thornaby East) (Lab)]

I thank my hon. Friend for her response to the urgent question. We had a Budget that did so much good for our country in the face of the most dreadful inheritance, and the Labour Government should be congratulated on that. But pensioners in Middlesbrough and Thornaby East are still looking to the Government to further mitigate the impact of the cut to the winter fuel payment. Much has been done by the elected Mayor Chris Cooke to embrace the issues around the household support fund and so on, but the Social Security Advisory Committee noted that the £1.4 billion was based on an increase of only 5% in pension credit take-up, from 63% to 68%. Could the Minister say what the increase in take-up has been to date, and what further steps she will take to provide yet further mitigations and reduce pensioner poverty?

[Emma Reynolds]

We will announce new statistics at the end of this month. The committee asked about the 5% increase; that assumption is based on what happened when the previous Government took away free TV licences and people had to apply for them. The OBR accepted our assumption.