National Infrastructure Plan
Geraint Davies Excerpts(10 years, 11 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Urgent Questions are proposed each morning by backbench MPs, and up to two may be selected each day by the Speaker. Chosen Urgent Questions are announced 30 minutes before Parliament sits each day.
Each Urgent Question requires a Government Minister to give a response on the debate topic.
This information is provided by Parallel Parliament and does not comprise part of the offical record
Danny Alexander
That is a good question, and I suggest that the hon. Gentleman raise it at Culture, Media and Sport questions.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
The Chief Secretary knows that 80% of the money in the infrastructure plan is being spent in London and the south-east to shore up the Tory vote, but is that also why the company behind the Atlantic array has ditched its plans for offshore energy off Swansea? If not, what is the explanation?
Danny Alexander
The hon. Gentleman will have to talk to the project developer about that. I completely refute his allegation with regard to where the infrastructure projects are taking place. One of the most important projects in the plan is High Speed 2, which will benefit the whole country, including, potentially, north Wales with regard to rail access. We have also made announcements about the M4 and borrowing powers for the Welsh Government. The largest single project where there is progress today is the Wylfa nuclear power station, which the hon. Member for Ynys Môn (Albert Owen) welcomed, and I should hope the hon. Member for Swansea West (Geraint Davies) would, too.
Cost of Living
Geraint Davies Excerpts(10 years, 12 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Chris Leslie
I have not even said a word in response to the point of order. I will do so if the hon. Gentleman will allow me. It just goes to show that the Conservatives will do everything they can to distract attention from the cost of living crisis that is facing this country. As Corporal Jones might have put it, “They don’t like it up ’em!”
The hon. Member for Spelthorne (Kwasi Kwarteng)—
Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle)
Order. You also want to speak, Mr Davies. You are constantly on your feet. I want to hear Mr Leslie. I also want to hear what the Government have to say. I will not hear either of them with the amount of time we have taken so far.
The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Sajid Javid)
When the Opposition first tabled this motion, the title referred to the Government’s “economic failure”. The word “failure” has been mysteriously removed and replaced with “policy”. Perhaps the Opposition originally asked the Rev. Paul Flowers, who was their economic adviser, to help draft the motion. Now that they have been forced to sack him, they have had to amend the deluded original title of the motion. Even before the debate started, the Opposition have had to back down.
The Government recognise that many people up and down the country are facing living standards challenges. Each and every week I speak to many hard-working people in my constituency who are still suffering from Labour’s recession, and whose businesses or employers were hit hard in 2008 and 2009 and are still feeling the impact. Of course we all want the situation to improve.
Geraint Davies
On failure, does the hon. Gentleman accept that the movement of debt to GDP from 55% when he came into office, to 75% now and 85% by 2015, is a sign of failure both in increasing debt to a higher level than we borrowed throughout our term, and through not getting any growth?
Sajid Javid
I accept that the sharpest move in debt to GDP that this country has seen in recent times was under 13 years of Labour rule when national debt more than doubled. We will take no lectures from the Labour party about growing public debt. Allow me to remind the House, especially Labour Members, why people are facing such challenges.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
Today at Prime Minister’s Question Time, I accused the Prime Minister, in essence, of knowingly moving the economy forward in a way that means that real wages continually fall and house prices go up. He knows as well as all of us that we are moving towards the rocks of rising interest rates and a sub-prime debt crisis. He is a man looking to the future, walking backwards.
There is a question over whether the Prime Minister is doing that completely unwittingly—is he sleepwalking towards disaster or knowingly walking towards it? I put it to the House that he is knowingly doing so. He is inflating the housing market when he knows that people cannot afford higher interest rates. He is willing to take those risks in the knowledge that, if and when the Labour party takes office, there will be a sub-prime debt disaster, and he will be able to say, “It is old Labour messing things up.” He is willing to pay that price, because he believes that the feel-good factor from inflated house prices in London and the south-east—his core area—where he is investing 80% of Britain’s new infrastructure to buoy his vote, will be enough, alongside the media spin, to get him back into power. I put it to the House that it will not be enough, and that we should be alerting the British public to it and to what we should do about it.
The Minister loosely referred to the funding for lending scheme used by our banks, but he would not take an intervention from me. The scheme provides easy lending, underpinned by the Bank of England. Lending to households for mortgages is now at the 2008 level, but lending to business is 32% lower than it was in 2008. What does that mean? It means that British money is not investing in productivity and growth for jobs, which means that wages are not growing and will not be strong enough to sustain the cost of higher house prices when interest rates go up.
Interest rates will go up. Mark Carney, the Governor of the Bank of England, has clearly said that, when unemployment goes down to 7%, interest rates can be let free. That is great, is it not? Obviously, unemployment going down must be good—I can see Government Members nodding their heads—but, if overall production has not grown, average productivity will have gone down. Since 2010, productivity, in the main, has been flatlining and there is no growth in the economy. There is growth in the number of people in work because we are sharing the production around, which is why real wages are falling. We do not have the investment in training and in research and development. On investment as a proportion of GDP, we are 159th in the world. On R and D investment, we are at the bottom of the developed world. We are a basket case and it is no surprise that our triple A rating was taken away.
We hear the same old Tory story that we always hear: “Labour messed it up and we have made the recovery.” The reality is that GDP grew by 40% between 1997 and 2008. We then had the international financial disaster. My right hon. Friend the Member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath (Mr Brown) and President Obama stepped in with a fiscal stimulus to get us back to growth by 2010. Hey presto, the Tories arrived and announced that half a million people were going to be sacked, and people in the public sector stopped spending because they did not know when they were going to be sacked. So the Tories deflated consumer demand and growth has been flatlining ever since.
What has happened to our debt-to-GDP ratio? It has gone up from 55% to 75%, and will go up to 85% by 2015, because GDP has been flatlining. Debt to GDP has gone up, because debt has gone up as well. This Government have borrowed more in three and a half years than the Labour Government borrowed in 13 years. The clowns spin the story again and again in this Chamber and in the media, and the marketing campaign is working well. The Prime Minister and the Chancellor are knowingly sending us down the track towards more sub-prime debt. They hope the propaganda war will be won if Labour gets in and it blows up in its face.
This Government, and any future Labour Government, should, through the Bank of England, change the funding for lending scheme so that it focuses on business investment, not mortgage investment. Prior to the onset of the funding for lending scheme in July 2012, the mortgage market had already recovered, so we do not need the money that is going in. The scheme means that if you, Madam Deputy Speaker, were a bank, for every pound you lent to SMEs, you would have another £10 to lend elsewhere. At the moment that is going to mortgages, not SMEs. That will be changed to a ratio of 5:1. If that were to be rebalanced, the Bank of England and the Government could finance business loans—existing loans, as well as future loans—and give more money to SMEs. The financial markets are already servicing the rest of it. In addition, we have the Help to Buy scheme. All the money is therefore being channelled into a fixed stock of houses and prices will go through the roof. Would it not be better to invest in business and construction? That would increase the number of houses, reduce prices and create work.
We want a rational and sustainable economic strategy. Instead, we have a political trick that is sending us towards the abyss and the Government do not seem to care. They say that everything is recovering, but the essence of the debate is that everybody out there looks in their pockets and in their cupboards and knows that they are worse off. That will continue unless something is done to invest in business, productivity and growth.
Simon Hart (Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire) (Con)
If the Help to Buy scheme is such an unattractive prospect, why are the Labour Administration in Cardiff adopting it?
Geraint Davies
I am not quite with the hon. Gentleman. I do not know if my analysis is lost on Conservative Members who are just repeating things without understanding the economic debate, but I am saying that we should work with Mark Carney to rebalance the funding for lending scheme in favour of business, instead of supporting the mortgage market which is already on track. That would take some of the heat out of the housing market, and help to build more houses, grow productivity, increase wages and create sustainable growth. That has nothing to do with what is happening in Cardiff.
A few references have been made to Wales, and I might as well respond to them, now that we have heard another Tory intervention. The reality is that 80% of all infrastructure investment in the UK goes to London and the south-east. Wales is one of the poorest areas of the United Kingdom; a quarter of the people live in poverty, the majority of them in work. The hon. Member for Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire (Simon Hart) will know, because he is a member of the Welsh Affairs Committee, that what is being put in place in Wales, the future jobs fund and so on, works much more effectively than the UK Government’s Work programme. Wales is doing its best in difficult times, but the Government will not even reduce the tolls on the Severn bridge to provide further stimulus, because they do not care. All they care about is sustaining their own backyard. We have this weakened economy when there are enormous opportunities to make us strong. It is a disgrace.
I will continue to make those points about the Government, because it is becoming ever clearer that they are knowingly heading towards a sub-prime debt crisis. They should be ashamed.
Living Standards
Geraint Davies Excerpts(11 years, 2 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Rachel Reeves
She has done fantastic campaigning work on that issue. Labour has said that we would cap the cost of credit, as she has called for.
A one nation Labour Government would be taking action now to secure the recovery and to build a more balanced economy that boosts the living standards not just for the few at the top but for the many. We would act on the recommendations of the IMF to support and secure the recovery by bringing forward £10 billion of infrastructure investment. We would build 400,000 affordable homes, creating more than half a million jobs and making our economy stronger for the long term. We would support house building, encourage private sector investment, and create apprenticeships. A one nation Labour Government would be confronting the scandal of youth and long-term unemployment by introducing a compulsory jobs guarantee.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
I am sure that my hon. Friend knows that household lending from banks is at the same sort of level—3% lower than in 2008—but lending to businesses is 30% lower. Is not the real problem that three quarters of new jobs are low-paid because businesses are not being given support by the banks and the Government are not forcing them to act in the interests of high-paid jobs and growth for the future?
Rachel Reeves
We have had Project Merlin and the funding for lending scheme, and yet lending to small businesses falls and falls.
A one nation Labour Government would offer guaranteed work for young people and those who have been unemployed for over two years—work that they would have to take. We would cut the welfare bill and help people to gain the skills and experience they need to join the work force for the long term. A one nation Labour Government would reform our banking and energy sectors, improving our infrastructure planning and building a skills system that ensures that everyone can play their part. A one nation Labour Government would make fairer choices to ensure that the benefits of growth are fairly shared. We would reintroduce the 10p tax rate, helping 25 million basic-rate taxpayers; and we would not be cutting income tax or increasing pension tax relief for the very wealthiest while cutting tax credits for hard-pressed families. Different choices, different priorities: this Government and this Prime Minister do not get it.
As the LSE growth commission said earlier this year:
“prosperity is strengthened when everyone has the capacity to participate effectively in the economy and the benefits of growth are widely shared”.
Greg Clark
As the hon. Lady knows, I spend a lot of time in Merseyside; we met on the other side of the water in Liverpool recently. I would be very happy on one of my visits to Merseyside to meet her and make the point that making the economy competitive, including in the north-west and her constituency, and getting people into jobs and bringing unemployment down is the best way that people can build living standards that are sustainably high. I will come on to say a bit more about that.
There have been 1.3 million jobs created in the private sector, but what has been the Labour party’s reaction, including today, to that news? The first reaction was silence. The entire Labour Front-Bench team went to ground for the summer, although the hon. Member for Leeds West had an excuse. However, three years have passed since she stated in her excellent maiden speech:
“It would not be responsible or sensible to oppose every spending cut or tax increase.”
It was in that same maiden speech that she told the Chamber that she would
“encourage this Government when they get it right”.—[Official Report, 8 June 2010; Vol. 511, c. 239.]
Now would be a good time for her to do what she promised. I would be more than happy to give way to her if she acknowledges that the hard work of the British people is showing success that she did not predict. No answer.
Geraint Davies
Does the right hon. Gentleman accept that since his Government took office, GDP per person—productivity per person—and average wages have fallen? We are seeing a glimmer of hope, but the reality is that the 1 million extra jobs are on the same baseline. In other words, that is not success; it is failure. There would have been growth under Labour, as was the case up to 2010.
Greg Clark
The hon. Gentleman parts from his Front-Bench colleagues and at least acknowledges that there is progress. He calls it a glimmer of hope, but I think the 1.3 million people employed in new private sector jobs regard it as much more than that. The hon. Gentleman will know that the first step to creating sustainably high living standards is to get people into work and into good jobs. I will say more about that in a moment.
Gavin Barwell
There are certainly some commodity prices that Government can influence—my hon. Friend is quite right to pick me up on that—but there are others, such as the prices of basic foodstuffs, that are beyond national domestic control.
How do we solve the problem? I would like to suggest five possible solutions. The first is economic growth. It is not a solution on its own, because part of the deficit is structural.
Gavin Barwell
I will give way once more, to the hon. Member for Gateshead (Ian Mearns), because I promised I would.
The OECD forecast shows that our economy is projected to grow in quarter 3 by 0.9%, which is more than any other country in the G7 other than Canada, and in quarter 4 by 0.8%, which is the best projected rate in the G7. Unemployment in my constituency of Croydon Central is 6% lower today than it was when Labour left office, while youth unemployment—which the hon. Member for Wigan (Lisa Nandy), who spoke before me, rightly spoke so passionately about—is nearly a quarter lower today than when Labour was in office.
Gavin Barwell
I am afraid I cannot give way again.
That change has taken 2.7 million low-paid people out of income tax altogether and cut the income tax bill for someone on the minimum wage by a half. The shadow Chief Secretary talked about priorities. It is true that this Government have made a change to the tax rates for some of the wealthiest in our country, but if we want to talk about priorities, we have to say that the Treasury has spent 50 times more cutting tax rates for people in ordinary low-paid work than it has paid in reducing the top rate. That shows this Government’s priorities.
As other hon. Members have said, we have ensured that petrol duty is 13p a litre cheaper today than it would have been if we had followed Labour’s policies. We have cancelled the beer duty escalator. We have helped local councils across the country to keep council tax bills down. We have a scheme that we will introduce for tax-free child care, which will help with the cost of child care for people with children under the age of 12. We are ensuring that energy customers are placed on the lowest tariff. We have introduced the triple lock for the state pension, to ensure that we never again have the national scandal of our pensioners being given a derisory pension increase each year. We are also introducing the Help to Buy scheme, to try to help my constituents who want to own a home of their own and take that vital first step to get on the housing ladder, so there is much that this Government are doing.
Gavin Barwell
I cannot give way again.
There is also the crucial issue of wages. I have talked about the national minimum wage already, and there were some interesting reports in the media recently about the Government perhaps looking at what they can do on the minimum wage. As a Conservative, I would worry very much about a uniform increase, which might price some people out of the labour market. However, there is a case for asking whether larger companies or those that are making healthy profits should not be paying their staff more, because at the moment we are subsidising some employers to pay low wages, through the tax credit system that the previous Government introduced. I very much hope that the Government will look at how we tackle the issue of quality of life for people on low pay from both ends, by raising the personal allowance, so that we do not tax them so much, but also seeing whether we can ensure that they are paid a fair wage for the hard work they do.
One Opposition Member who talked about this issue implied that it was just Labour councils that are passionate about a living wage. My local authority, Conservative-controlled Croydon council, pays all its staff the London living wage, while the Mayor of London has guaranteed that that will apply to all staff working for the Greater London authority as well.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
Again, we heard a ragbag of rubbish from the Financial Secretary, who gave us the Laurel and Hardy story about another fine mess from Labour. In fact, between 1997 and 2008 the economy grew by some 40%. It was only when the financial tsunami came that we saw difficulties, but with the fiscal stimulus from Obama and my right hon. Friend the Member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath (Mr Brown), bang, we were back to shallow growth, albeit with a deficit two thirds of which was caused by the bankers and a third of which was caused by spending beyond earnings to pump-prime the economy. That was the right thing to do at the time.
Ben Gummer
Let us try to get the facts right. First, the Government were running a structural deficit between 2002 and 2010. Secondly, the private sector in Britain did not grow after 2003. All growth was down to credit and public sector increases. The hon. Gentleman’s contention that somehow the economy grew by 40% is therefore incorrect.
Geraint Davies
That is certainly not the case. GDP was up by 40%, and the history of the last three years is one of zero GDP growth. I admit that we have seen growth of 0.6% in the last quarter. However, according to the TUC, 80% of the new jobs that have been created—it has been claimed that there are 1.3 million, but that figure is contested by the director of the Office for National Statistics—are low-wage jobs. What we actually have is a low-wage, low-investment, falling-productivity economy, with living standards falling through the floor and prices rising at the same time. It is a complete disaster.
Government Members such as the hon. Members for Dover (Charlie Elphicke) and for Croydon Central (Gavin Barwell) and other economic illiterates have said that interest rates might rise under Labour, but anyone who reads the financial press will know that the new Governor of the Bank of England, Mark Carney, has given undertakings that they will not rise until unemployment has fallen by 750,000, from 7.8% to 7%. So that argument too is a complete load of rubbish.
Ben Gummer
If the hon. Gentleman does not mind my saying so, he is confusing market rates with bank rates. Market rates will rise, because the cost of borrowing for the British Government on the international markets will rise under a Labour Government. That was shown at the time of the general election. The hon. Gentleman is right in saying that bank rates will be fixed, but the two are not connected to the extent that he claims.
Geraint Davies
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for making that point. The point that I was making was that the Bank of England rate would be secure in the way that I described. The other rates depend on confidence. Whatever happened to the triple-A rating? Government Members said “Oh dear, it will be all over. We will lose the triple-A rating if Labour gets in.” Well, we have lost it, and why has that happened? It has happened because objective observers have seen that productivity is falling, not rising, that the jobs that are being created are low-grade jobs, and that the distribution of investment is skewed towards the next general election, with 80% of all infrastructure investment being made in London and the south-east—which needs the least investment—and most of the cuts being made in the north and in Wales: in places such as my constituency in Swansea, where 40% of people work in the public sector. Yes, we want investment in the private sector, but the way to boost local economies is not to cut people’s wages, jobs and services, which is the current prescription.
What is happening is not sustainable, and given the current economic capacity—the manufacturing and construction sectors are 10% smaller than they were in 2008—there is clearly some way to go before unemployment reaches the level at which interest rates will fall, so that point was a complete red herring.
In fact, mortgage rates are low now—as low as 1.5% for safe bets. The Government, alongside the Bank of England, should be thinking about providing more funding for firms so they have more cash flow and can invest in higher-value jobs and products. Household lending from the banks is about the same as it was—it is 0.3% less than in 2008—but lending to business is 32% down. It is massively down in all the major sectors. In January lending to business was 3% lower than a year ago. By June that figure had doubled; it was down 7%. So the Chancellor is a man looking to the future who is walking backwards. The reality is that Britain is 159th in terms of the ratio of investment to GDP, and is lagging around the bottom in terms of research and development.
One might ask why the banks are lending all this money for houses. Part of the reason is because we have a bubble, artificially generated by the Chancellor to get his votes in the south, through what The Economist calls the “daft policy” of subsidising new deposits on mortgages, which will inflate house prices and lead to sub-prime debt downstream.
The banks also now require four times more capital cover to lend to a business than to provide a mortgage. Turning to the question of the complexity of all this, I have run my own businesses and been involved in others, and have therefore looked at business plans. The banks need to look at the business plans too, as opposed to just having somebody in a call centre saying, “All right, fill in the box. You’re all right mate, you can have a mortgage.” The Government should be telling the banks that the funding for lending scheme should be specifically directed at firms to cover new and existing loans. In other words, they should be doing something positive to get the level of business investment up and create real jobs and get wages moving in the right direction. That is what is needed.
The current situation is that house prices are rising and household debt is growing, partly because the cost of housing is going up both in terms of rents and house prices. That is only sustainable if we have real wage growth. [Interruption.] The Exchequer Secretary is mumbling to his mates, but what are the policies for sustainable wage growth? How are we going to move away from this low-investment, low-wages, low-productivity trajectory that we have got? There is no point in blustering and denying it all; we have got this problem across Britain. We have also got inequality between north and south, and obviously between Wales and the south.
I am talking about SME support, but in contrast we have the corporate world, where Vodafone has just done the biggest share transaction of this century. It has taken £54 billion in cash, and it is not paying a penny in tax. What is the Exchequer Secretary doing about that? Nothing. Why does he not do something about procurement, too? We could use our muscle to buy from SMEs locally—companies that pay tax rather than avoid tax—so they can provide jobs locally. This is a complete disgrace. We should be doing something positive with the powers at our disposal, to create higher wages, higher business investment, more security and more focus on emerging markets.
That is not happening, however. This is a complete farce. It is a mess and I hope the hon. Member for Croydon Central (Gavin Barwell) will join the Labour party like his predecessor, Andrew Pelling, did, and stand up for what is right and what makes sense.
Mr Gauke
What is striking about the data we have seen is the encouraging, broad-based signs. The manufacturing numbers are very encouraging. Let us not say that the situation is about consumer spending only. There are encouraging signs in the economy, which was not reflected in the remarks of Labour Members.
Geraint Davies
The Minister will have heard my speech, so I will not recite it, but will he accept that there is a problem with the amount of lending to business by banks? Can he give any undertaking that the Bank of England will put pressure on banks to redirect the funds they have been given under the funding for lending scheme towards business rather than to household mortgages that are now out of the woods?
Mr Gauke
The fact that we have credibility in our fiscal policy means that the Governor of the Bank of England has been able to say what he has said about the greater certainty for interest rates, which is helpful for businesses. If we throw away that fiscal credibility, we will make life more difficult for businesses wanting to get credit.
We have talked about what the motion contains. It says that we should get more people into work: we agree with that. Over the year, employment has increased by 301,000, and unemployment has fallen by 49,000. In July, the claimant count fell, for the ninth consecutive month, to 1.44 million, the lowest level since February 2009. This is the result of a Government who have created the right tax and regulatory environment for businesses to flourish. The proposals from the Opposition would put all of that at risk.
We hear about bringing forward capital investment. We also recognise the need for infrastructure investment to spur the jobs and growth of the future, and that is why in June the Chief Secretary unveiled the biggest public housing programme for more than 20 years; the largest programme of rail investment since Victorian times; the greatest investment in our roads since the 1970s; fast online access for the whole country; and the unlocking of massive investment in cleaner energy to power our economy forward. We have increased expertise in Whitehall and we are working hard to deliver those projects as soon as possible.
The cost of living is an important issue, and we recognise that times are tough for many people. But let us look at the difference between the parties. Whereas we have reduced income tax for 25 million people—we have increased the personal allowance—the previous Government doubled the rate of income tax on low-paid workers. This Government have ensured that we have credibility so that we have been able to keep mortgage rates low: the Opposition would lose our credibility. Council tax doubled under the previous Government: it has been frozen under us.
The previous Government raised fuel duty 12 times while in office and had plans to raise it six more times subsequently—the equivalent of 13p per litre—and we have frozen fuel duty. When we came to office, the UK had almost the highest child care costs in the world, and we will help families with child care. Energy bills soared under Labour. Between 1997 and 2010, the average domestic gas bill more than doubled. Electricity bills went up by more than 50% and Labour remains committed to an expensive 2030 decarbonisation target that will only add to energy bills, whereas this Government are forcing energy companies to put customers on the lowest tariff. When it comes to beer duty, Labour planned to raise the tax: we not only froze it, we cut it.
My hon. Friend the Member for West Worcestershire (Harriett Baldwin), in an excellent speech, asked how we ensure that we have the sustainable growth that we need. We need sustainable public finances—an argument that we have made consistently and that has been consistently opposed by the Opposition. We need a highly skilled work force, and that is why 500,000 apprenticeships have been undertaken under this Government. It is why we are undertaking ambitious educational reform. We need welfare reform, with a system that makes sure that work is rewarded—not something that we inherited from Labour. We need a competitive tax system that encourages investment in the United Kingdom, not one that drives it away. We need to deal with the regulatory burdens that prevent growth—we have undertaken planning reform, which will help to increase housing supply.
What do we get from the Opposition? We get a Labour party that presided over a squeeze in living standards from 2003; a Labour party that must accept some responsibility for the deepest recession in a century; a Labour party that doubled the rate of income tax on low-paid workers; a Labour party that planned for increase after increase in fuel duty; a Labour party that remains signed up to decarbonisation targets that would increase energy prices; a Labour party that has consistently set out an economic policy that would consist of more borrowing, an approach that would lead to higher mortgage rates and ultimately higher taxes; and a Labour party that has opposed our council tax freeze. For Opposition Members to lecture us on living standards is extraordinary. As President Obama might have said, it is the audacity of the hopeless.
If we want to help hard-working people—I think we all do—it is vital that we stick to the task. [Interruption.]
Finance Bill
Geraint Davies Excerpts(11 years, 4 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Chris Leslie
We had that debate on a financial transaction tax a few weeks ago. I think we managed to extricate from the Minister, despite his reluctance, a suggestion that somehow, somewhere, buried in the Government, there was still some flicker of interest in a financial transaction tax. I am not sure whether it has been snuffed out by this particular measure. If this is the abolition of stamp duty on unit trust transactions, what will be next? What else will they give away to this particular set of fortunate investors? Will the Minister rule out plans to abolish the other financial transaction tax, the stamp duty on equity transactions? Do the Government have that long-standing financial transaction tax, which has been around for several hundred years, in their sights? Conservatives are second to none when it comes to defending the best interests of the wealthiest in society, and I take my hat off to the Minister for managing to slip this little one through in the Budget provisions without anybody really spotting it.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
My hon. Friend has already pointed out that this £150 million saving per year for the very richest should be compared with the bedroom tax saving of £450 million from the very poorest. The difference between the two measures is that the bedroom tax is hitting thousands upon thousands of the poorest people. The bedroom tax costs about £10 per week, and I have had people tell me that their disposable income is being reduced from £30 to £20 per week. With this tax, the £150 million saving is going to a very small number of people who will receive a large amount of money. These are the choices we face in Britain today. Does my hon. Friend think that that is disgraceful?
Chris Leslie
I am more disappointed that the Government think they can get away with it. I want very much to hear the Minister defend this decision. I am sure he will do so with gusto and alacrity, as ever, but I know that deep inside—the record will reflect that I am looking into his eyes—he realises that this is a completely daft idea. This is not a priority at this time. It is a crazy priority when the public are struggling, and I know that in his heart of hearts he agrees with me. It is not clear where this idea has come from. I saw something on the Deloitte website that said there had been many decades of lobbying in favour of this particular change. Perhaps the lobbying is something that the Treasury has eventually succumbed to.
When we line this measure up alongside other examples of largesse the Government have shown to those who are doing very well, it is notable. We cannot take it out of the context of the paucity of the bank levy, which was supposed to raise £2.5 billion in the previous financial year but did not. Last night, the Minister said that they will try to get £2.7 billion next year instead, but they are already £1.9 billion in arrears from the previous two financial years. It will be more than a decade before they are able to recoup the loss. It was notable last night that he did not say that he was certain that £2.5 billion would be brought in from financial years 2011-12 and 2012-13.
I will put the bank levy to one side. After all, what is a couple of billion pounds between friends? The Government refuse to repeat the bank bonus tax, despite the fact that financial services bonuses leapt by 64% in the first month of this year, when all those who benefited from the reduction in the additional top rate of tax—earnings over £150,000 were taxed at the 50p rate, but from, I think, 6 April they were taxed at the 45p rate—rushed out all those bonus payments. Of course, those individuals found ways and means to avoid the higher rate of tax, as the Government helpfully flagged the change up for them far in advance.
Geraint Davies
Does that not contrast sharply with the 2 million people in Britain who are on payday loans? They could each be given £70 with that £150 million. They are desperate for the money, but instead these tens and hundreds of thousands of pounds are all focused on, again, the very rich. Does that not speak volumes about the cruel values of the Tories?
Chris Leslie
The point is the context in which these things arrive from the Government. Perhaps it is our fault that we have not successfully flagged up for the wider country what exactly is happening in the Budget or what will happen in future Finance Bills; but for the time being, it is incumbent on the Minister to do at least this one thing: let us have the distributional analysis showing who benefits from the change. Which deciles, in terms of the affluence of society, will gain the most from this £150 million tax cut? The case for it has not been made. It has not been high on the public agenda. There is no problem in the City or the investment management community of such significance that it merits this intervention by the Chancellor, at the expense of the health in pregnancy grant or the cuts to tax credits that merited the pasty tax and the caravan tax.
This £150 million tax cut is an incredibly important totem of the Chancellor’s priorities. It is a sign that he does not care about the fact that most people—the typical family—will be paying an extra £891 this year because of the tax and benefit changes made since 2010. Those who have found themselves pushed into greater deprivation and poverty will look at the decision and be absolutely disgusted that this is the Government’s priority now. This change has no justification. The Minister has not made the case for it. We need more information about who benefits from the arrangement.
All that comes on top of the Government’s giveaway on the bank levy, their failure to repeat the bonus tax, the millionaires’ tax cut from 50p to 45p and other changes hidden in the Bill, such as making the additional tier 1 debt coupon tax deductible for the banks, which The Times described thus: “Chancellor to the banks’ rescue with secret £1 billion tax break”. Lots of people will have questions, although not necessarily about this Minister’s priorities. He is doing the best of a bad job and having to cope with the hand he has been dealt. He is, I am sure, a decent and honourable chap, but when he goes home this evening, turns on the television and sees the hardship afflicting families up and down the country, I would ask him to keep in mind whether making a tax cut of £150 million for those investment managers was the right call to make at this point in the economic cycle, such as there is a cycle involved.
Chris Leslie
That is the £150 million question. The tax cut is £150 million in the key years, but it goes up to £160 million in financial year 2017-18. It gets greater and greater as time goes on. If we roll all the numbers together, as the Chief Secretary to the Treasury is wont to do when presenting figures in the Budget, we get a total of £600 million of tax cuts in this area in the Red Book. I am sure that you could think of a good use for £600 million, Mr Deputy Speaker. At the very least, we want a distributional impact assessment. We want to know who will benefit from the measures, and it is incumbent on the Minister to tell the House the facts.
Geraint Davies
I have been provoked to stand up and speak on this outrageous stealth tax, which is an attempt to subsidise the very richest in a clandestine way. If hon. Members had known about the £145 million being crept into the back pockets of the very richest people in the City, the Chamber would have been full of Members speaking in protest, as I am doing now.
The direction of travel in the Budget and the spending review continues unabated. It consists of blaming the poorest for the bankers’ errors, punishing them with cuts in public service jobs and wages and cuts in welfare benefits, particularly outside London and the south-east—and especially in Wales—then pumping all the infrastructure growth opportunities into London and the south-east, to line the pockets of the very richest, many of whom were responsible for the disaster in the first place.
The Government are allegedly trying to balance the books, but they are dismally failing to do so. They have decided to sack 600,000 public sector workers. This is having a disproportionate effect in certain parts of the country. Many parts of Wales, for example, are 50% more likely to have public sector workers than London, and it is in those areas that the cuts are biting deepest. Meanwhile, the money is going to places such as London, where the cuts are not so deep, not only in infrastructure investment but in measures such as this one. We are talking about getting rid of stamp duty on transactions in the City of London, where a small community of people will benefit from that tax cut of £145 million a year, and rising.
We must set against that the fact that 2 million people are already using payday loans. Dividing the £145 million between those 2 million people would give them about £70 each. Only today, I have been talking to colleagues in Swansea about the emerging problem on our council estates, and on estates generally, of companies setting up shop to take advantage of people in dire need by offering them payday loans. At the same time as the Chancellor announced this cut in stamp duty, he asked the newly unemployed to wait an extra week before receiving their money. That will of course feed the stomachs of the payday loan sharks. Those sharks are not just the well-known wonga people; they are also the new, smaller operations setting up in very poor communities. They hire people in the community, on a commission basis, to persuade their neighbours to take out loans at exorbitant rates of interest that they cannot afford. They then harass them by phoning them in the middle of the night or following them into the supermarket, for example, until they repay the loan. That is the cruel reality of Tory Britain today.
Alongside that reality, we have this ghastly attempt to give another £145 million to some of the richest people in the banking community, who were part of the problem in the first place. The alleged justification is to make the City of London more competitive. It appears that these whizz kid City folk, with their red braces, zoom up in their Rolls-Royces to see their old Etonian friends, such as Ministers, and look in awe at them and say, “Have another champers, will you, Minister?” and all that sort of stuff.
The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Greg Clark)
I think that the hon. Gentleman will find that I went to a comprehensive school in Middlesbrough, not to Eton.
Geraint Davies
I am sorry that the right hon. Gentleman no longer has any school friends. Those who have abandoned the communities from which they came have proposed legislation to punish the poorest and reward the richest, which is a great shame. It is not too late for the Minister to think again about what is fair and right in distributive economics.
The reality is that the marginal impact of this change on the competitiveness of the City of London is very small indeed; it is not a serious argument. I can imagine the greed-fuelled lobbyists who come here on behalf of the City to demand an extra £145 million being the sort of people who say, “Oh, well, we have got to give these people more money, because otherwise they will leave the country.” We have heard all that before. In any case, many of those individuals have all sorts of tax havens, about which the Government pay lip service to investigating.
At the same time as we hear alleged concerns about those rich people avoiding tax, the Government say to them, “I’ll tell you what; here’s another 5p off the income tax.” People sometimes ask why there has been a 64% increase in bonuses this year. Could it be because the Government have provoked it, as people move their income from a tax year where they pay 50p to a tax year where they pay 45p? It was completely predictable, and it was even factored into the Treasury figures in the form of behavioural changes. The perverse thing was to hear the argument, “Oh, well, we are going to move to 45p instead of 50p because more money can be raised that way. Look, we are going to encourage our mates to move all their money to save tax”—[Interruption.] That proves that it is an absolute farce.
Tim Loughton (East Worthing and Shoreham) (Con)
Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Geraint Davies
Of course. I was wondering whether the mumbling man was listening to anything, but I shall certainly give way to him.
Tim Loughton
There is of course always a temptation not to listen when the hon. Gentleman is on his feet. Does he remember the Finance Bill 1997, on which Committee he and I both served? I remember him making a similarly prejudicial class-bashing speech then and accusing merchant bankers or anyone working in the City as parasites, yet this industry accounts for many billions of pounds of revenue to the Exchequer and employs 1 million people. Does he still hold to that completely outrageous view? From what he is saying, it sounds as though he does.
Geraint Davies
It is interesting to see that the hon. Gentleman has changed from his red braces to blue braces—and very nice, too! I obviously do not regard the whole City of London and the banking community as parasites, as they are a major engine for exports, growth and productivity in Britain. The issue is about managed capitalism and what is the acceptable face of capitalism. It seems to me that many people on the hon. Gentleman’s side are not at all concerned, as more and more money is given to people who have already acquired enormous pots of money.
The distribution of income has shifted massively since 2010. We have seen the incomes of a large number of people in the top 10% growing by 5.5% each year over the past two years—at a time when most people have had pay cuts or pay freezes, certainly in the public sector, or lost their jobs. We have heard the Government boasting—this is their latest creative thought—that an extra 1.2 million people are in jobs, yet that has been contradicted by the Office for National Statistics. Even if there were another million extra people in work, with no extra growth and no extra output in the economy, productivity is going down and things are not going well. Nevertheless, the answer from the Government is still to give more and more money to the richest people and less to the poorest, and that is supposed to get us out of the mess, but it does not.
This stamp duty on transactions is the tip of an iceberg. I am sorry, Mr Deputy Speaker, that I have come on to describe the entire iceberg rather than the tip at the top, which we are talking about. It is important for people to stand up and be counted on this issue. There is no justification for these extra few buckets of money being thrown in the direction of those who have most. There is a great need for a more balanced growth strategy, whereby there is investment in infrastructure across the piece and where the opportunities for tax and spend are more fairly spread, so that together we can build a future that works and a future that cares—a one-nation Britain of which we can all be proud. I do not think that this suggestion makes sense, so I am very much in favour of putting a halt to this £145 million handout to people who are already rich, as it will not make any appreciable difference to the competitiveness of the City of London.
Greg Clark
This has been an astonishing debate. I have a lot of time for the hon. Member for Nottingham East (Chris Leslie), but he must have been pretty dozy in recent months if he thinks that this is a Budget measure that has emerged by stealth having hitherto been hidden from view, because it was given considerable prominence in the Chancellor’s Budget speech. The Chancellor said, in the Chamber,
“I also want Britain to be the place where people raise money and invest. Financial services are about much more than banking. In places such as Edinburgh and London we have a world-beating asset management industry, but they are losing business to other places in Europe. We act now with a package of measures to reverse that decline, and we will abolish the schedule 19 tax, which is payable only by UK-domiciled funds.”—[Official Report, 20 March 2013; Vol. 560, c. 939.]
However, the measure did not only feature in the Chancellor’s Budget speech. It was the subject of a press conference, and received quite a lot of publicity on the money pages. I should have thought that the shadow Financial Secretary would be aware of that, and would know what a good reception the proposal was given in the very important financial services industry.
Many misconceptions need to be cleared up. The hon. Member for Swansea West (Geraint Davies) talked about banking, but this measure has nothing whatever to do with banking. A regrettable consequence of what has happened in recent years is that the financial services sector as a whole has too often been equated with the banking industry and associated with its frequently catastrophic misjudgments and regulatory failures, and people have been tainted unfairly by that association. Just as there are hundreds of thousands of ordinary working people employed by banks who bear no responsibility for—indeed, are sickened by—some of the misdeeds that were committed by those at the top before and during the crisis, there are people who work hard for a living elsewhere in financial services, who contribute to our national income, the taxes that pay for our public services and our foreign exchange earnings, and who have certainly not put taxpayers' funds at risk in the way that characterised the worst excesses of the banking industry.
The investment management industry in this country is a case in point. It employs 30,000 people across the United Kingdom, mostly in areas such as administration, IT and legal services. At least 10,000 of these people, who are directly employed in the sector—I am not talking about those who are ancillary to it—are based outside London and the south-east. A large number of them are concentrated in Scotland—I should have thought that the hon. Member for Dumfries and Galloway (Mr Brown) would be aware of that—and in the north-west and the north midlands. In fact, 12% of the asset management industry is in Scotland. I am amazed that the hon. Member for Nottingham East—not just as shadow Financial Secretary, but as a Nottingham Member of Parliament—did not recognise the important contribution made by investment management in his city. He should be aware that the professional services sector in Nottingham is an important component of the city’s economy.
Greg Clark
I want to conclude now. I hope that the House will welcome, as commentators universally have, a significant boost to the competitiveness of a very important sector for jobs in every part of the United Kingdom. I hope that, having had the explanation, the hon. Member for Nottingham East will feel willing to withdraw the new clause and await the formal consultation, which will accompany next year’s Finance Bill.
Finance Bill
Geraint Davies Excerpts(11 years, 4 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Chris Leslie
I would be the first to concede that it was a mistake to abolish the 10p rate in 2007. I do not think that it creates complexity in the tax system. The Institute for Fiscal Studies has long been in favour of simplicity in the number of tax bands, but I believe that there is a genuine debate to be had about progressivity in the income tax system. The hon. Gentleman’s colleagues can see the case for a 10p rate, and I believe that it would be a useful way of introducing a transition from the tax-free personal allowance to the 20p basic rate of tax. A 10p rate would be an important staging post along the way. A tax cut for those on lower and middle incomes would be broadly welcomed throughout the country.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
Does my hon. Friend agree that it is in the very nature of progressive taxation to have increasing marginal tax rates as someone earns more money? The Institute for Fiscal Studies has shown that there is therefore a genuine trade-off between social justice and increasing fairness, as people have more money, and tax efficiency. That is fair enough, and we should opt for progressive justice.
Chris Leslie
Indeed. Having a 10p band in the income tax scale ensures that we can focus on that sense of fairness. “Fairness” is a word that might not necessarily be recognised by some Government Members, but it is important in our tax system. We know that their idea of fairness is to cut the highest rate of income tax from 50p to 45p. They can justify that in their own terms, and to their own constituents, but we believe that it is far better to focus on giving help by introducing that lower rate straight above the personal allowance.
Chris Leslie
I do not know how simple I need to make the point for the Exchequer Secretary, so I will do so very slowly and particularly. The new clause suggests that the Treasury—that means him, by the way—should publish some proper, worked-through evidence on where those properties lie across the country, how a banding proposal might work and what the options for the width of the 10p starting rate of income tax might be. By the way, he did not say a word about whether or not he supports a 10p starting rate of income tax.
Geraint Davies
Surely my hon. Friend will agree that the figure of 55,000 is a complete red herring. It is being said that housing wealth should be progressively taxed, and that the current council tax rates are out of date. Some of these properties are worth much more than £2 million, and perhaps even £10 million—we hear stories about Russian oligarchs and all the rest of it. Add to that the Chancellor’s strategy to generate more sub-prime debt by offering cut-price mortgage deals, and we will presumably have a progressive system of different rates and a thought-out new council tax regime that would be progressive, and we would not end up with everyone paying £36,000 at all, and the Minister knows it.
Chris Leslie
That is why we must ensure that we move the issue forward and get some proper workings from the Treasury—[Interruption.] The hon. Member for Enfield, Southgate seems to think that he has all the answers, so why do the Government not publish them? What is going on with Government Members? They should share these things in the public domain. Do we really have to make a freedom of information request to Ministers in order to get those data?
Geraint Davies
My hon. Friend will know that there is an increasing trend of international financiers buying London properties in particular as part of their asset portfolio in an uncertain world and that, at the top end of the market, an increasing share of them are owned by Russian oligarchs, oil sheikhs and so on. Does he agree, therefore, that this is a great opportunity to introduce a charge on foreign owners who invest in London—which is fair enough—in order to redistribute some of their massive wealth to the poorest people in Britain?
Chris Leslie
Yes, I agree. Governments often ask Oppositions how they will pay for tax cuts for those who need them most. We have given a clear example of one possible option. It is important to show that there is a fair way to give a tax cut to the vast majority of lower and middle-income households through the introduction of the new 10p band. The mansion tax is feasible and has cross-party support, as indeed does the 10p starting rate, and the Minister’s arguments are diminishing by the day, to the extent that we have managed to get him to lift the skirt of the data and publish more of them, which is what we want to see.
It is important to consider the arguments for fairness behind the 10p starting rate, which we think would provide a good tax incentive into work, especially for those on lower incomes. It is widely supported, especially by those Conservative Members who were champing at the bit only a matter of months ago when they tried to persuade the Chancellor and the Prime Minister to consider the proposal. Conservative Back Benchers have managed to get the Government on the run on their favoured topics, including an EU referendum and a tax break for married couples. They have the bit between their teeth, so perhaps we can persuade them to consider the 10p tax rate, too.
The principle of fair taxation is at stake in this debate. It should transcend party differences. We should be looking at funding a tax cut, not defending the wealth of the wealthiest. If the Government really mean it when they say that we are all in this together, the time has come for a mansion tax to help those most in need. The Government have a history of giving tax cuts to the wealthiest—they have already reduced the 50p rate, thereby giving millionaires a tax cut—and they have hit pensioners with what came to be known as the granny tax.
Chris Leslie
I did say earlier—I do not know whether the hon. Gentleman was in the Chamber—that it was a mistake to get rid of it in 2007. There were arguments. The Institute for Fiscal Studies looked at the issues. The basic rate of income tax had been reduced and calculations had to be made about how to pay for it. I think, however, that the right thing to do is to take these steps and have progressivity in the income tax scale.
It is wrong to hurt those in society who are most in need. They are paying the price and life is getting harder for them because the Government’s economic plan has failed. We need to concentrate on the contribution that the wealthiest 1% in society should make. They should pay a fairer share and we should make sure that that money goes to the vast majority—25 million people—on lower and middle incomes.
Geraint Davies
In essence this debate is about political choices and not just the technical efficiencies of marginal rates of tax. When this Government took over from Labour in 2010, two thirds of the deficit had been created by the banking community and a third by pump-priming in response to the financial tsunami after a history of sustained growth under the Labour Government. The new Government decided to focus not on growth, but on cuts to get down the deficit, which was a fundamental error that has led to a flatlining economy. They then had to decide who should bear the brunt in order to pay down the deficit—80% in cuts and 20% in taxes—and the answer that the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats came up with was that it should be the poorest who were hit hardest.
The recent spending review and infrastructure plans replayed the same Tory agenda: the cuts will hit hardest in the poorest areas, including Wales and the north, and 80% of the investment in infrastructure for growth will benefit London and the south-east in order to shore up the Tory and coalition votes. This new clause is about making a move in the other direction so that the very rich make a slightly greater contribution, which will be redistributed to people in the middle and at the lower end of the income scale.
Jonathan Edwards (Carmarthen East and Dinefwr) (PC)
The hon. Gentleman may have read an Institute of Welsh Affairs blog today by Gerry Holtham, the well-respected Welsh economist, who was scathing in his criticism of the hon. Gentleman’s party for adopting Tory austerity policies. How concerned is the hon. Gentleman, on the back of his criticisms of the UK Government’s austerity policies, about the fact that his party has adopted the very same strategy?
Geraint Davies
A moment ago I talked about Arab oil sheiks and now I am going to talk about Welsh milk shakes. On a serious note, what the Labour party has said is that when we take over in 2015, should the people of Britain give us their confidence, as I hope they will, we will inherit—this is self-evidently true—the current Government’s spending plans for 2015-16, so we will carry them out. As we make progress, I hope that the focus will switch to growth more than cuts, as it did after we inherited the Conservative party’s spending plans when we took over in 1997. We ran with those plans for a year and then we had consistent growth. The economy grew by 40% from 1997 to 2008 before the financial tsunami caused by sub-prime debt. I imagine that we will do the same in 2015. We offer no apology that we will have fiscal discipline alongside a focus on growth and that we will get people into jobs to pay down the debt. We will also change the composition of cuts to the rich and poor in certain areas.
Mr Russell Brown
My hon. Friend and I arrived in this House in 1997. In government, Labour confined itself to the overall spending of the previous Government, but we had different priorities which we put in place. It is not as if we came to power in a golden era. There was a debt and servicing it cost the equivalent of what was being spent on transport and defence put together. There was no golden inheritance. We had difficult choices to make as well.
Geraint Davies
I am glad that my hon. Friend brings that point up in this debate about the mansion tax. In 1997, we had the same old Tory economics, which we are seeing again because history is repeating itself. There was massive unemployment and that was being paid for by cutting services for the poorest. There was a huge debt that the Labour party paid down. The interest on that debt was excessive. We all remember Black Wednesday. We made the Bank of England independent to keep interest rates low.
The Opposition are serious about keeping interest rates low and having fiscal discipline, but our priority is economic growth. That is what any sensible business would suggest. A business man in Swansea said to me the other day, “If I was running at a loss, the last thing I would do is sack my workers and sell my tools, because I would not have a business. I would tighten up and focus on new product development and sales.” That is the balance that we want. We want a mansion tax and a 10p rate, because if we can recover some money from the richest and redistribute it to make it more worth while for everybody to work, that has to be a good thing.
The right hon. Member for Wokingham (Mr Redwood) brought out his violin and gave the heart-breaking story of the poor people who have a two-bedroom flat in Chelsea worth £2 million. He said, “Isn’t that awful. Surely you wouldn’t do that.” That is in sharp contrast to what Tory Members say about the person in the two-bedroom council flat who will be punished because their children grow up, get on their bike and get a job, as Norman Tebbit said, and vacate their bedroom. They say that there is nothing wrong with the forced evacuation of such people from London to a one-bedroom flat in a lower cost area; but they say that it is wrong that somebody who is living in a £2 million two-bedroom flat should have to rebalance their asset portfolio to generate revenues to pay the mansion tax. If someone has a £2 million Chelsea flat, it is possible for them to rent it out at enormous rents, live somewhere else in the countryside that is many times bigger, pay the mansion tax and make a handsome profit. That is not a heart-rending problem compared with the bedroom tax. However, it appears that Tory Members are more concerned about people who own £2 million properties than people in council flats.
A woman from my neck of the woods in Swansea came to see me two weeks ago and said that she had been on the waiting list for 11 years, asking to be moved from her two-bedroom flat to a one-bedroom flat, but the council does not have any one-bedroom flats. Why is that? It is because the local council has rightly been building for families in need with children. Suddenly we have the bedroom tax, which makes no economic or social sense, but there is no admission of that from the Government.
We have made the sensible suggestion, which has been thought through by the Liberal Democrats, that we should make the council tax more progressive.
We are all aware that house prices have gone up and down in different areas at different rates. In London, there is a skewed situation, because there is very quick house price inflation compared with elsewhere. People are making enormous capital appreciations. In essence, the financial disaster was caused by the bankers and sub-prime debt. That is likely to be repeated as we approach the general election because the Chancellor and his assistant, the Exchequer Secretary, have suggested triggering more sub-prime debt by covering people’s deposits. On the one hand, they are telling the banks to run a tight ship and to have enough capital reserves to cover their lending, because they do not want them to go bust again. On the other hand, they are saying that they will subsidise the purchasing of new houses. That is likely to happen in London, because people know that there is price inflation and will take a punt with a lower deposit and at a lower risk, hoping that they will recover their money through an escalation in house prices.
The very high-value property in London is being gobbled up by foreign speculation. The expensive property is being bought by people who want to get their money out of places such as Russia and by people who have huge accumulations of money from trade or oil surpluses. There are many cases of blocks of flats in London being bought outright. Nobody is living in them because the people who buy them know that they will make so much money through appreciation that they cannot even be bothered to rent them out. It is unbelievable.
We are asking, at a time of difficult choices and austerity, for a percentage of those transactions by multi-millionaires to be redistributed to make life easier for people who work in communities across Britain, not just in London. I accept that most of these properties are in London. For example, the constituency of the hon. Member for Carmarthen East and Dinefwr (Jonathan Edwards) does not contain a £2 million house.
Paul Uppal (Wolverhampton South West) (Con)
The hon. Gentleman is making some partisan points, so I want to add balance to the debate. I have been poor—dirt poor. I used to share my bedroom with my siblings and cousins. By modern descriptions, I would have been classified as homeless. His main argument is about foreign capital coming to the UK and London. Does he not think that that is symptomatic of people recognising that we have a Government who are making credible decisions and creating financial stability?
Geraint Davies
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for telling me his economic background. It is useful that people of modest means come here and represent a range of views.
I am all for attracting foreign capital into infrastructure and productive opportunities. For example, Swansea will celebrate the centenary of Dylan Thomas’s birth next year and is on the shortlist to become city of culture in 2017. I am all in favour of encouraging foreign investors to invest in infrastructure that supports our cultural asset base. They would get a return from that over time, while generating wealth, tourism and jobs.
However, we are not talking about that. We are talking about people making speculative investments in house prices. They could just as easily be investing in aluminium futures or anything else. It just happens that London houses are on the up. If people have loads of money, they can buy a few of them and their money will grow. They know that that will continue because the Exchequer is irresponsibly putting taxpayers’ money into sub-prime debt to subsidise profits and further boost inflation. That will cause an imbalance in asset values and house prices between London and the rest of Britain. That situation is being stoked up by the irresponsibility of the Government, because they think that rising house prices in London will help them deliver Tory constituencies in the general election. That cynical ploy is unbalancing everything and encouraging foreign investors to take a punt.
That is not a symptom of the great stewardship of the Tories—far from it. The record of the Tory Government has been judged. The triple A rating has been torn up and thrown away.
Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)
Order. Mr Davies, do you think that we could come back to the mansion tax and the 10p rate? Your setting of the scene has gone rather too wide of the specific issues that we are discussing.
Geraint Davies
I am grateful for your expert advice, Madam Deputy Speaker. I will move quickly back to the mansion tax.
At the moment, foreign investors are buying mansions for capital appreciation. A properly worked-out mansion tax would not be a simplistic flat rate of £36,000. That was the Government’s arithmetic—it was laughable, wasn’t it? It was, “Oy, what yer gonna do? ’Ave I got this roight? We want £2 billion, we’ve got 55,000 mansions, so you divoid it in—that’s it, it’s £36,000, innit? That’s what you’re gonna do.” Obviously, that would not be the strategy. It would be to have an escalating rate according to capital values, which would change over time.
The system would obviously have to be refined and played with, and as my hon. Friend the Member for Nottingham East (Chris Leslie) pointed out, the impact would depend on the delivery. To a certain extent, £2 billion is just a ballpark figure. That is why he asked for more detailed figures. There are various factors driving demand for such properties, and they have a range of prices in the marketplace, so the likely yield would change over time. We therefore need to consider a sophisticated system. However, it is clear that it is the right direction of travel for the very richest to make a contribution at the most difficult times, to make work pay for everybody else.
It is clear from international examples, such as in New York city, which already charges a mansion tax on $3 million properties, that the tax is tried and tested. We can learn from our friends and colleagues in America how to apply it correctly. We should come together—I know that the Liberal Democrats have always been keen on the tax, and I hope that they will join us in the Lobby to support it.
Sheila Gilmore
When the debates took place on whether the 50p tax should be changed, Government Members were keen to tell us that we could make up a lot of what was lost, and perhaps make even more, through various forms of property taxation. They obviously had in mind changes in stamp duty, ways of dealing with companies that buy very expensive houses and so on. We were told how much better a property tax would be than a tax on income, and that we would get far more money from it. However, when we follow that train of thought and suggest that there is merit in considering a mansion tax, we are suddenly told, “No, no, that would be terrible.” We are told either that it would be terribly expensive, and people would not be able to afford it, or that it would simply be the wrong thing to do. It seems that when we come to talk about something real, the Government run backwards as fast as they can.
We have had some figures thrown at us that are not mentioned in our new clause. They come not from anything that we have said but from what the Government have said, yet we are being told that we have to justify them. We are being told that figures such as a £2 billion yield and 55,000 houses are correct, which will mean people having to pay £36,000. I do not know whether 55,000 houses is the correct number of those that would be affected, but I do know that at the moment, according to Zoopla, there are 3,847 properties on the market for £2.1 million or more in London. That is not all the properties of that price but just those that are for sale. On that basis the figure of 55,000 is perhaps a conservative estimate, but the whole debate has been based on that figure.
Geraint Davies
Using that argument, people have said, “Oh well, we’ll raise more with a 45p rate than a 50p rate” yet my hon. Friend will know that year on year, bankers’ bonuses went up 64%. Does she agree that bankers were moving their income from a 50p year into a 45p year, and that if we had kept that rate up we would have raised that money? We should have done that as well as the mansion tax.
Sheila Gilmore
It certainly sounds on the face of it as if some sort of income arrangement was possible. For a lot of us, including people on PAYE, that would be difficult to do, but it is easier for other people. I have advocated not running away from a tax on property too easily. Not long ago we had that debate at some length in Scotland after a proposal by the Scottish Government to move to local income tax—again, they decided not to proceed with that. Some of the problems with local income tax concern the mobility of individuals’ incomes and the fact that some wealthy people might be able to avoid paying that tax. Those of us in political parties in Scotland that opposed moving to local income tax argued strongly the advantages of a property tax. Interestingly, the SNP Government, from 2007, backed away from their proposal in the face of those arguments.
Geraint Davies
I am grateful for my hon. Friend’s enormous generosity in giving way. She may know that in the past two years, the top 10% have seen their income rise by 5.5% each year—that is 11% in two years while everyone else is being squeezed. The rich are getting richer and richer, and the Tories are cutting the top rate of tax. Given that people are buying bigger and bigger houses with the great huge buckets of money they are getting, is it not right that they should face a mansion tax?
Sheila Gilmore
I was looking through the property pages of The Sunday Times yesterday, and interestingly it was full of descriptions about valuable houses and how property prices are rising. Since property prices at the top end were rising so much—driven partly by investment from abroad—it was argued that that would be good for everyone because it would lever up property prices for all. The argument is that high property prices are always beneficial, but those who tried to buy homes up and down the country long before the credit crunch know that high property prices are a double-edged sword because many could not get on the property ladder at all. In many parts of the country, not just in London, the amount that must be earned to buy even an average-priced house is more than people can earn in that area.
Sheila Gilmore
There has undoubtedly been a huge increase in the private rented sector. When I was elected as a councillor and became interested in housing, all the housing authorities and textbooks said that the private rented sector had become a residual sector and was disappearing. It might perhaps be there as a niche for young professionals or students, but it was not expected to be an important part of the housing mix. Within a short period—probably 10 to 15 years—we have seen an explosion in the private rented sector and in private sector rents. That is another issue for young people, particularly those who might wish to settle permanently. They cannot afford to buy a home because house prices are too high or they cannot get a mortgage. In the meantime they pay very high rents, which makes it difficult to save. I am not entirely convinced that high property prices are always a great bonus, and we should be looking for a more stable property market.
Geraint Davies
I am grateful for my hon. Friend’s enormous generosity in giving way again. Is she aware—I am sure she is—that property prices in London have grown so much that some local authorities have greater asset value than the entirety of Wales? Therefore, the mansion tax is a sort of cap—
Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle)
Order. Mr Davies, you were right when you said that you have intervened a lot. I do not mind you intervening but please do not take up so much time that you are almost making a speech.
Jonathan Edwards
It has been a number of weeks since we debated the provision in earlier stages of the Bill. My concern about the mansion tax policy, which I support in principle, is whether agricultural land would be included as a part of the estate that would be taxed. Does the hon. Lady agree that we must ensure that farmers are protected?
Sheila Gilmore
And Scottish farmers, I am sure, and so on.
A mansion tax—I think my colleagues on the Front Benches would agree—is about residential property, not business property, which is already taxed in various ways. Obviously, a whole raft of taxes are appropriate for businesses, and that would be the best way to deal with the issue, rather than a mansion tax. If a mansion tax is a way of ensuring that we can appropriately tax wealth, we should consider it very seriously, given that it is probably a better basis for taxation than income, which people can move around—I have yet to see a house be dragged offshore. That may not be impossible, but in this country we generally do not put houses on wheels and move them, unlike in the United States—at least, so we see in the movies. A mansion tax would be a way to help the low-paid, through the introduction of the 10p rate.
Investing in Britain’s Future
Geraint Davies Excerpts(11 years, 5 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Danny Alexander
I certainly agree with the hon. Gentleman that the innovative UTC model offers real benefits to the Government’s strategy on raising educational standards across the whole schools system. That is why we have invested in more UTCs, and I am delighted to hear that the one in his constituency is working so well.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
The vast majority—some 80%—of investment announced is in London and the south-east, and there was virtually no mention of Wales. Why is there no investment in an M4 relief road, a high-speed rail link to Wales, superconnectivity status for Swansea or a reduction in the Severn bridge toll, so we are not taxed for our infrastructure in Wales, or more money for the Welsh Government? Where is the cash for Wales?
Danny Alexander
There are projects and programmes announced today, including on energy and broadband, which will be of huge benefit to the hon. Gentleman’s constituents, and I hope that he would welcome them, as well as the new prison in north Wales, which his hon. Friend the Member for Ynys Môn (Albert Owen) welcomed just a moment ago—[Interruption.] A prison for English people? I am sure there will be some Welsh people in there too, if that is what the hon. Member for Swansea West (Geraint Davies) would like. As for the M4, this is closely connected to the discussions, which are in their final stages, on our response to the Silk report, which we will publish very shortly. I hope that he will, in due course, have news that he will wish to welcome.
Spending Review
Geraint Davies Excerpts(11 years, 5 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Mr Osborne
What I am talking about is that the Labour leader said on Saturday that Labour would not borrow more and the shadow Chancellor said on Sunday that it would. Because there are two alternative Labour economic policies out there, I would quite like to know which one is which.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
Bankers’ bonuses are going up 64% this year because bankers have moved their income from a 50p tax year to a 45p tax year. Will the Chancellor act to reverse that tax evasion, which he caused?
Mr Osborne
Bank bonuses are down 85% since the previous Government left office. We have curbed irresponsibility in our City, which was rife when the shadow Chancellor was City Minister. In all the years for which the hon. Gentleman was a Member of Parliament for Croydon and sat on the Government Benches, I do not remember him getting up and saying, “I want a higher top rate of tax, Gordon Brown”—sorry, I mean the right hon. Member for Fife. We did not hear that. The truth is that the tax rate for rich people is higher under this Government than it was when the hon. Gentleman represented the good people of Croydon.
Royal Bank of Scotland
Geraint Davies Excerpts(11 years, 5 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo)
Last but not least, I call Geraint Davies.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
This announcement has already helped to wipe £2 billion off taxpayer-held share value, so will the Economic Secretary consider a staged sale of RBS, in chunks, to maximise the return? Will he also consider keeping a residual shareholding, to maintain influence so that the ambition we all share can be met that RBS continues to focus on small and medium-sized enterprises, rather than runs off, as it has before, in ways that are not in the interests of the British economy?
Sajid Javid
First, the hon. Gentleman should know that share prices go up and down, often with the general direction of the market. If he is really concerned about shareholder value, presumably he was against all the changes that the Government he supported made during their time in office, which led to the true destruction of taxpayers’ money. The Government believe that the strategy RBS has set out and made clear yesterday—a bank that is more focused on the UK economy and working with British business, with a smaller investment bank—is the right one, as is the strategy of getting a CEO who can see that process through for the next few years. We think that that will lead to value creation.
Economic Growth
Geraint Davies Excerpts(11 years, 6 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Geraint Davies
As my right hon. Friend knows, today’s figures show that unemployment has risen again. He also knows that the EU provides 50% of our trade. In the event of our securing a free trade agreement between the EU and the United States, alongside bilateral trading agreements between the EU and other countries such as China, what does he think the impact of withdrawal from the EU would be on growth, jobs and trade?
Ed Balls
In 1983, our party supported the idea of withdrawal from the European Community, as it was at the time, but the Conservative party and the Confederation of British Industry agreed that it would cost 2.5 million jobs. Our trade share with Europe has deepened since then, and our labour market is bigger. I think that upwards of 3 million to 3.5 million jobs would be lost now, because we would be turning our face away from those big markets around the world.
Mr Osborne
Let us look at what the Governor of the Bank of England said in his press conference this morning:
“there is a welcome change in the economic outlook…But this is no time to be complacent—we must press on to ensure a recovery”.
Yes, there was also the disappointing news that unemployment had gone up, but we also saw that the claimant count and youth unemployment had come down, and the monthly unemployment data were a lot more encouraging than the three-month survey. That is the reality of the current data.
Geraint Davies
Does the Chancellor agree that the key problem is that the debt:GDP ratio will rise from 55% in 2010 to 85% by 2015? The answer to that problem is not just to cut the debt, but to increase GDP. Under Labour, GDP went up by 40% between 1997 and 2008, and the Chancellor inherited a growing economy which is now flatlining because of his policies.
Mr Osborne
We inherited an 11.5% budget deficit that was adding to our national debt every year, and what the hon. Gentleman and the shadow Chancellor want to do is add further to borrowing. The shadow Chancellor was asked time and again what the cost of the proposals in the amendment the Opposition are asking the House to vote on tonight would be. He would not give that figure, but I will give it for him: it is a £28 billion amendment that would add to borrowing. He comes up with the ludicrous argument that by borrowing more, we can borrow less. That is why he is making so little progress with his economic argument.
Danny Alexander
I have to say to the hon. Lady that I think the fact that we inherited a welfare system where for too many people it did not pay to work is one of the greatest scandals of Labour’s time in government, so I make no apology whatever for reforming the welfare system and putting in place a universal credit where everybody on benefits knows they would be better off in work. That is the right thing for the country, and I am happy to support it.
The measures in the Queen’s Speech will also help all those workers who want to get on and plan for their futures. Our changes to the single-tier pension will provide millions of people—particularly women with broken work records, the low paid and the self-employed—with a firm foundation to support their saving for retirement. The single tier will be implemented from April 2016, and I am sure Members will join me in congratulating the Minister of State, Department for Work and Pensions, my hon. Friend the Member for Thornbury and Yate (Steve Webb), on his excellent work in bringing this policy forward to this stage.
The Queen’s Speech recognises that if we want our economy to succeed in the 21st century, we need to make significant changes to our business environment. We will not succeed in the 21st century if our businesses are slowed down by regulation, which is why we are taking steps through the deregulation Bill to remove excessive red tape from small businesses and to repeal legislation that no longer serves a practical use.
Danny Alexander
I want to make some progress, as I have a few further things to say.
We will not succeed in the 21st century if our businesses are slowed down by an outdated infrastructure. That is why we are increasing capital investment plans by £3 billion a year from 2015-16, meaning public investment will be higher on average over this Parliament than it was under our predecessors. That investment will help to improve our digital networks and our road and rail networks. We want to connect our biggest cities in a manner fit for modern business needs, and our investment in High Speed 2 will be a crucial investment for British jobs and prosperity. The hon. Member for North East Derbyshire (Natascha Engel) spoke against HS2 partly on the basis that there had been a decline in wedding bookings at an important venue in her constituency. I hope very much the progress of the equal marriage Bill will help raise demand at that venue.
In a debate focused on jobs and growth, a lot of Members have talked about the subject of Europe, and I have to say that I do not think contemplating British exit from the EU is helpful in supporting jobs and growth in this country. So I would like to remind the House of some of the economic opportunities that we gain from our membership of the European Union. Our EU membership supports UK jobs, prosperity and growth through increased trade, both inside the single market and outside, through free trade agreements. One in 10 jobs in this country—3.5 million jobs—are linked to that trade with the European Union. If we want to win the global race, we need to be part of a strong team.
Oral Answers to Questions
Geraint Davies Excerpts(11 years, 6 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Danny Alexander
I am grateful to my hon. Friend, who raises an important issue. We are all aware of the continuing difficulties of small firms in getting access to the finance they need. The business bank, which is being taken forward by the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills, is acting to address gaps in the financial offering for small firms. The funding for lending scheme is substantially expanding lending to small businesses, which is one of its objectives. The business finance partnership is investing £87 million through non-bank channels, such as peer-to-peer platforms, that can reach SMEs in a different way.
Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op)
Does the Chief Secretary agree that an EU-US free trade agreement would help private sector job creation and that the noise about EU exit is undermining such an agreement? We would get no benefit from such an agreement if we were out of the EU, so why don’t they shut up?
Danny Alexander
I agree, as do the entire Government, that an EU-US free trade area would be of substantial benefit to the United Kingdom and to the whole of the EU. I welcome the fact that the Prime Minister is in Washington this week precisely to advance that agenda.