The Chief Secretary to the Treasury (James Murray)
I thank the right hon. Member for Central Devon (Sir Mel Stride) for opening the debate. I can tell that he spent his summer polishing some of his rhetorical flourishes, which he has shared with us today, but I suggest that he could have spent his time rather better.
Thank you for your words of congratulation, Mr Speaker. It is a real honour to be here as Chief Secretary to the Treasury. May I put on record my tribute to my predecessor, now the Chief Secretary to the Prime Minister, my right hon. Friend the Member for Bristol North West (Darren Jones), for all his fantastic work, notably delivering the spending review? I welcome the Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury, my hon. Friend the Member for Chipping Barnet (Dan Tomlinson), to his new role. I thoroughly enjoyed the role myself, and I am sure that he will be excellent in it.
Conservative Members will appreciate that today’s motion, as tabled, simply cannot form the basis of a specific debate on individual tax measures. Members from across the House will know that the Government do not respond to speculation in advance of a Budget, which the Chancellor has today announced will take place on 26 November. This has long been the case: the shadow Chancellor knows it well and he knows that it would be irresponsible to engage in that speculation. Whatever political rhetoric he and his colleagues will use in today’s debate, and no matter how many variants of the same question they ask, I know that he will understand that I cannot engage with speculation about individual tax measures ahead of the Budget.
Jerome Mayhew (Broadland and Fakenham) (Con)
The hon. Gentleman says that he cannot speculate on individual tax measures, but will he deny that the No. 11 machine has been leaking these stories to the national press over the summer?
James Murray
I am not going to engage in speculation about tax measures or any of the mechanics around them. The hon. Member and his hon. Friends will simply have to wait until 26 November to hear the specifics of the Budget. At that point, I am sure that he and his colleagues will have plenty to say.
Sir Oliver Dowden
I genuinely congratulate the hon. Gentleman on his appointment as Chief Secretary to the Treasury. I have always found him to be an honest and straightforward speaker in the House and he deserves his position. On the point about speculation, can he confirm reports that the Government are looking again at welfare? Surely he will agree with me that, in any process of fiscal consolidation, one must look to tax rises and to spending cuts. There has been a lot of reporting about there being further measures on welfare, so will there be further measures on welfare under consideration—yes or no?
James Murray
I thank the right hon. Member for his kind words. As he will know, welfare measures are already going through Parliament and being investigated by my right hon. Friend the Minister for Social Security and Disability through the review that he is undertaking. This Government are determined to ensure that the safety net is there for the people who need it, and that the people who can work have the support they need to get and maintain a job.
Freddie van Mierlo (Henley and Thame) (LD)
What is not speculation is that the largest rise in property taxes happened under the Conservatives, when Liz Truss crashed the economy and increased interest rates for everyone in my constituency. Will the Minister speak to the fact that house prices are different in different parts of the country, and that must be reflected in Treasury thinking about tax and the Budget this year?
James Murray
The hon. Gentleman is right to remind everyone of the record under the short-lived Prime Minister, Liz Truss. I notice that Conservative Members do not refer to that themselves when evaluating the economic situation, but the British people will not forget it. On his wider point about housing across the country, we want to ensure that we are building affordable homes in every part of the country. One of this Government’s priorities has been to reform the planning system, to enable the building of 1.5 million homes and ensure that every community has those homes, so people have homes that they can afford to live in, in the area where they grew up, where they want to live or go to work. That is a central mission of this Government.
James Murray
I will give way one more time, but then I will make some progress.
Harriet Cross
The fact that the Government hope to build all those new homes shows that they recognise the importance and value of a home to a family. The Minister says that he will not talk about specific tax measures, but does he recognise the principle that we should not tax people’s homes if we are a country that values home ownership?
James Murray
I gently remind the hon. Member that council tax—a tax on property—exists in this country, so the principle of applying some taxes to property is well established in the UK, and has been for some time. She is trying to tempt me to engage in more speculation, but as I said to the shadow Chancellor, I am not going to engage in speculation about what may or may not be in the Budget.
Chris Vince (Harlow) (Lab/Co-op)
I thank the Minister for giving way—he is always very generous with his time—and congratulate him on his well-deserved promotion. The Conservatives are not fans of tax, but sadly they are also not fans of supporting public services. Under their Government, thousands of His Majesty’s Revenue and Customs compliance officers, including my mum, were made redundant and we were not able to collect the right amount of tax that people owed. Is that partly why this Government inherited such a large financial black hole?
Madam Deputy Speaker (Ms Nusrat Ghani)
Order. Before the Minister responds, I will say that we have quite a few colleagues hoping to contribute, so interventions should be short. The Minister should be aware of that and consider how much longer he wishes to contribute.
James Murray
Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker—the hint is taken.
I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Harlow (Chris Vince) for his intervention, and I thank his mother for her service to HMRC in the past. People at HMRC do an absolutely critical job in collecting the tax that is important in funding our public services and ensuring that our economy functions effectively. One of our priorities as a Government has been to close the tax gap that existed under the previous Government. At the Budget last year and in the spring statement earlier this year, we set out plans to raise an additional £7.5 billion in tax revenue as a result of hiring people to do those really important jobs, as well as investing in new technology and modernising the service to ensure that people pay the tax they owe.
James Murray
I am going to make some progress, because a few moments ago I said I would do so. I have been gently reminded by Madam Deputy Speaker that I really must live up to my promise on that front.
The right hon. Member for Central Devon asked me questions in his opening remarks—indeed, his colleagues have their sheets from the Whips, and they have been dutifully following up in their comments—but they are on matters that we cannot talk about today. There are of course other important facts that the right hon. Gentleman does not want to talk about, but the British people have not forgotten them. There is the £22 billion black hole in our public finances, which the previous Government hid from the light. There is the disastrous mini-Budget, which caused damage to households across the country and to our reputation around the world. We had stalled housing, unfinished infrastructure and public services brought to their knees by under-investment and disinterest. The Conservatives do not want to talk about those things because that is the legacy of the last Government. We found out just today that the right hon. Gentleman does not even want to talk about things happening in Conservative councils, as my hon. Friend the Member for Basingstoke (Luke Murphy) raised so importantly in his contribution earlier.
Now that the Conservatives are in opposition, the right hon. Gentleman’s party and Reform Members are talking Britain down. They want to claim that Britain is broken, but I believe that Britain is unbreakable. Our country is full of potential. It is home to hard-working people, brilliant businesses, world-leading universities and research institutions, cultural giants and the promise that if people work hard and contribute to the country, it will be a place where they can succeed. Yet undeniably, after 14 years of Tory mismanagement, far too many working people feel that the economy is stuck.
James Murray
I have been asked by Madam Deputy Speaker to make some progress, so I will return to the hon. Gentleman a little later.
I hear from my constituents, as I am sure many other Members in the Chamber hear from theirs. They tell us that no matter how much effort they put in at work, their careful management of household finances and their diligent efforts to save for a brighter future, they do not yet feel that they are getting enough in return, and it has become harder to get ahead. At the same time, our roads and railways seem slow and less reliable and our classrooms seem fuller, while the NHS has a massive backlog. The root cause of all that is the chronic under-investment by the previous Government. That under-investment over many years has slowed our productivity growth to a rate not seen since the Napoleonic wars.
Jim Dickson (Dartford) (Lab)
Does the Minister agree that it is thanks to the tight fiscal rules that this Government have introduced and the changes in the Budget that since the election my residents in Dartford have seen an investment in the lower Thames crossing? They have wanted that for 15 years, and it was not delivered under the last Government. They have also seen a £25 million hospital rebuilding project at Darent Valley hospital and a £1 billion structures fund from the Department for Transport, which will repair the ruined Galley Hill Road in my constituency. Is it not thanks to the Government’s rules and Budget changes that we are seeing those changes?
James Murray
My hon. Friend is absolutely right. It is only thanks to the fiscal rules that the Chancellor introduced at last year’s Budget and our decisions—the right decisions—to ensure that those fiscal rules are non-negotiable and that we keep to them at every stage that we have been able to boost investment by £120 billion over the course of this Parliament in many projects, including those that he mentioned and those in constituencies right across the country. That is the right thing for our country.
We were just talking about chronic under-investment. We are tackling that through ensuring that the Government invest across the country and by encouraging private-sector investments to get businesses across Britain growing.
Alison Taylor (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (Lab)
Will the Minister give way?
James Murray
I will take a very short intervention, then I really will make progress.
Alison Taylor
Does the Minister agree that taxation is intrinsically linked to economic growth and that there are already green shoots of recovery in the economy, with three trade deals and five interest rate cuts?
James Murray
My hon. Friend is absolutely right; economic growth is of course critical to our plans. She points to the trade deals that we secured. She and other hon. Members will know that the UK was the fastest-growing G7 economy in the first half of this year. There is much more for us to do, but we are showing that because of the right decisions that we have taken we are starting to move in the right direction.
Tim Farron
I do not want the Minister to speculate, but I want him to consider something. We talked about people not paying taxes. A significant minority of owners of second homes in my constituency let their property out for just a few days a year; as a result, they can claim to be a small business and pay no council tax or business rates. People on the minimum wage in my constituency are subsidising those people who pay no council tax at all. Will he change that situation to protect our communities?
James Murray
I congratulate the hon. Gentleman on an inventive way of encouraging me to speculate on tax measures. I am aware of the issue that he points to, and I thank him for raising it in this context, but I am not able to make any decisions on taxation at the Dispatch Box today.
Let me go back briefly to the broader context. It is absolutely crystal clear from the opening remarks of the right hon. Member for Central Devon, and from what all his colleagues have said so far, that Conservative Members are still in total denial about any responsibility they have for the situation that the country finds itself in. They act as if being behind the wheel for 14 years is irrelevant to where we find ourselves now. It may be that they think that if they do not talk about it, the British people may forget the last Government’s responsibility for getting us into the current situation, but the British people know that the Conservatives did this to our country. That is why the British people put their faith in us at the last election.
While there is clearly more to do to bring down inflation and the cost of borrowing, it is clear that we have turned a corner by taking the right decisions for our country. We have taken the decisions to address the black hole in the public finances, fix our foundations and clear up the mess that we inherited from the previous Government. As a consequence, as I mentioned a moment ago, in the first half of this year we were the fastest-growing economy in the G7; we outpaced France, Germany, Japan and the United States.
Since taking office, this Government have welcomed around £100 billion in investment into the UK, with 384,000 jobs being created over the same period. We have cut red tape and changed planning regulations to deliver 1.5 million new homes over the course of this Parliament. We already have nearly 100,000 new homes on large developments that were previously stuck in the planning system or simply not progressing as fast as they should be; they are now being given the support that they need to make that progress quickly. In just over a year, the Bank of England has cut interest rates five times, which means that someone on a tracker mortgage of just over £200,000 will be better off by around £100 a month. Crucially, real wages have risen more in the time since the last election than they did in the first 10 years of the previous Government.
The choice at the next Budget is clear. Over 14 years, the last Government made wrong choices time and again. They, their many Prime Ministers and many Chancellors all embraced the cycle of austerity, debt and decline, and we will never repeat that. We will continue to invest in Britain’s renewal, using every power at our disposal to drive forward an economy that works for working people. As I said, the Government do not respond to speculation, especially ahead of a Budget, and in any case we are not writing a Budget this far out.
The Budget that the Chancellor delivers in November will be carefully considered and designed to get the balance right between making working people better off and raising enough money to fund our public services and getting the country moving once again through investment and growth. Of course, it will also undergo proper scrutiny by the OBR. I was going briefly to address the taxes mentioned in the motion, but I suspect that I should skip over that part of my speech. [Interruption.] I am getting a gentle indication from you, Madam Deputy Speaker, that I have come to the right conclusion.
If we are to get this country moving again, investment from both businesses and Government is essential. We must therefore strike the right balance in our tax system, so that we can put more money in the pockets of working people while supporting the private sector to invest and grow and funding our public services. Members on both sides of the House will have their own views on what the right balance is, and I look forward to hearing those views today. I thank all hon. and right hon. Members in advance for their contributions.
Several hon. Members rose—