Mansion House Accord

Debate between Torsten Bell and Lindsay Hoyle

Tuesday 13th May 2025 Commons Chamber

[Torsten Bell]

I will directly address two questions and then come to the overall tone of the shadow Chancellor’s remarks. There has been a debate across this House and in the wider industry about mandation, including on UK equities. It has been led by Conservative peers in the House of Lords—Baroness Altmann has called for exactly that—and by some Members in this House, including the right hon. Member for Salisbury (John Glen) on the Conservative Benches. What we are setting out a voluntary agreement led by the industry. On the industry consensus behind the accord, 90% of the defined contribution industry, by active savers, have signed up this morning—and all providers, including those that did not sign up today, are committed to the idea of more investment in private assets.

More generally, the shadow Chancellor’s tone is disappointing. The truth is that he is a lonely figure. There is a wide consensus about the direction of travel to invest more in private assets, as Canadian and Australian pension funds do, and today’s accord is industry led; it sets benchmarks agreed by the industry, and in fact many industry players want to go further. There should be cross-party consensus. At the event this morning, the Chancellor spelt out that this work builds on the work of her predecessor in supporting the 2023 Mansion House compact. The shadow Chancellor will remember that compact because it was signed under a Conservative Government when he was the Work and Pensions Secretary—he was in the press release, championing it. He was right then, and he is letting himself down now.

I have some news: a response to the accord has just come in from Guy Opperman. Hon. Members will remember him, because he was the Conservative former Member for Hexham and the only Pensions Minister in the last Government to last more than five minutes; he was in post for five years. What did he say about this morning’s accord? He said that it is a “good thing” and “should be welcomed”—he is not wrong.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Chair of the Select Committee.

[Dame Meg Hillier (Hackney South and Shoreditch) (Lab/Co-op)]

I draw attention to my entry in the Register of Members’ Financial Interests as a trustee of the parliamentary contributory pension fund. The points about fiduciary duty have been made. Given that fund managers will need time to pool together funds that reflect the Government’s wishes and the voluntary accord, when does the Minister expect it to kick in? At that point, might he consider mandation?

[Torsten Bell]

The decision by the industry, reflecting the question that the Chair of the Select Committee raises about pace of change, is that the targets for asset allocation are for 2030.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Liberal Democrat spokesperson.

[Steve Darling (Torbay) (LD)]

Liberal Democrats cautiously welcome the response from the Minister. Clearly, ensuring that people have a good return on their investments is essential, but we welcome this step change where we are looking at investment within the United Kingdom within the appropriate parameters. Would the Minister unpick for us what core lessons he has learned from Australia and Canada, which have already embarked on this path? Also, it has long been a long-term investment opportunity for many in the pensions industry to invest in rental opportunities. How can we drive the opportunities in the social rented sector through the accord?

Finally, the Minister rightly talks about a pipeline of opportunity. Our fear is that these might only be large opportunities, such as the redevelopment of an airport, when many of our communities are worried by the collapse of our town centres; there could be buckets of opportunity highlighted there, which could be driven by appropriate investment through sources like this.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Torsten Bell and Lindsay Hoyle

Monday 12th May 2025 Commons Chamber

[Torsten Bell]

We should always learn lessons from Wales. In fact, this Government are already doing that. The roll-out of free breakfast clubs, which is happening across England at the moment, was pioneered in Wales. Children are receiving a free breakfast because of the work done in Wales. I praise my hon. Friend and the entire Work and Pensions Committee for the work that it is doing as part of its inquiry into pensioner poverty. I will be coming to give evidence to the Committee shortly, and I know that its members have been listening not just in Wales but more widely, with events in Glasgow and Manchester as well.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State.

[Helen Whately (Faversham and Mid Kent) (Con)]

I suspect that the hon. Members on the Government Front Bench are now surrounded: I suspect that they are the only people left in this Chamber who are prepared to defend the cutting of the winter fuel payment. Dozens of their own MPs have now joined a long list of people telling the Government that they have got it wrong, including the Welsh First Minister—talking about learning lessons from Wales—the money-saving expert Martin Lewis, and voters up and down this country. The Conservatives have led this campaign from the start, but if the Government will not listen to us, will they now listen to everyone else and think again?

[Torsten Bell]

We have set out our policy, but here we are 10 months on and I have no idea what the Conservatives’ policy is. I am not even sure that they know what their policy is. For all the shouting, there is no promise to reinstate a universal winter fuel payment. There is one policy from the Leader of the Opposition, the very woman who called for the winter fuel payment to be means-tested in 2022: now, she wants to means-test the entire state pension. Apparently, that is “exactly the sort of thing we will look at”. She thinks that is bold policymaking. It is not—it is bonkers.

[Mr Speaker]

The good news is that the Minister has no responsibility for the Opposition.

[Helen Whately]

That is not something that the Leader of the Opposition said. To the point in hand—the winter fuel payment—I wonder for how much longer this tone-deaf final stand will go on. Every time the Government talk about winter fuel payments, they make out that they had no choice, but that is simply not true. To govern is to choose. At best, this policy was only ever going to save £1 billion or so, but they are spending £8 billion on setting up an energy company, and the cost of asylum hotels will rise to £15 billion under Labour. This has always been a choice, and it is the wrong one. Can the Minister guarantee that next winter, every single one of the 750,000 poorest pensioners who missed out on the winter fuel payment this year will receive it?

--- Later in debate ---

[Torsten Bell]

The implementation of the McCloud judgment—unfortunately, one of the sad consequences of botched reform under the Liberal Democrat and Conservative coalition Government before 2015—is important, and we need to take it seriously. If there are specific cases, please do write to me about them. I am aware of the issue about making sure that scheme members get the details from the NHS pension scheme, and we are working together closely to make sure members get those letters as soon as possible.

[Mr Speaker]

I call Perran Moon.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Torsten Bell and Lindsay Hoyle

Monday 17th March 2025 Commons Chamber

[Torsten Bell]

We are already doing a lot to simplify the process; it now takes 16 minutes on average to complete an online form, and 90% of people apply online or over the phone. However, the hon. Lady is completely right to highlight the fact that we must do more, including by simplifying the form. We continue to keep that under review, and I am always interested in ideas about how we can go further.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Minister.

[Danny Kruger (East Wiltshire) (Con)]

When the Government scrapped universal entitlement to the winter fuel payment, they said that all 880,000 people eligible for it would get it through pension credit. We now know that that did not happen; they have got fewer than 120,000 new pensioners enrolled. More than three quarters of a million of the poorest pensioners have missed out on vital support this winter, so will the Minister tell us whether that was the plan all along—to save money at the expense of the poorest pensioners—or will he admit that he has completely failed in his duty towards the poorest elderly people in our society?

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Torsten Bell and Lindsay Hoyle

Monday 3rd February 2025 Commons Chamber

[Torsten Bell]

I encourage all pensioners to consider whether they are eligible for pension credit, but also to look for the wider support that can be provided via the household support fund and the warm homes discount. I say gently to the hon. Member that the driving up of council tax bills is a direct result of the destruction of local government finances by the Conservative party over 14 years.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State.

[Helen Whately (Faversham and Mid Kent) (Con)]

I welcome the Minister to his place. I have a simple question for him: how many people are still waiting for their winter fuel payment?

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Torsten Bell and Lindsay Hoyle

Tuesday 21st January 2025 Commons Chamber

[The Parliamentary Secretary to the Treasury (Torsten Bell)]

Too many parts of the country and too many families have felt the devastating effects of flooding in recent months, not least in South Wales and in the hon. Member’s constituency. The Government have committed £2.4 billion over the next two years to increase community flood resilience. Everyone in this House recognises that flooding is a challenge that will be with us for years to come, and we will set out further plans at the spending review.

[Mr Speaker]

Right—oh, go on, Bill Esterson.

--- Later in debate ---

[Torsten Bell]

We take very seriously the need to protect communities from flooding and to deliver on our commitments on climate in the years ahead. It is important that we consider both principles and that is what the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs and the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero are doing.

[Mr Speaker]

Let’s go back to Helen Maguire.

[Helen Maguire]

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Recent flooding in Leatherhead left footpaths near essential services such as train stations overflooding with sewage. In Leatherhead, there are no alternative options to divert water. Given the importance of long-term flood preparations, will the Chancellor commit to securing funding for flood defences beyond 2025-26?

[Torsten Bell]

The hon. Member will know that specific flood defence schemes will be considered in the normal way. When it comes to funding beyond 2025-26, those will be decisions on overall levels of funding that are taken in the spending review later this year.

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Let us move to Dr Allison Gardner.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Minister—welcome to the Front Bench.

[The Parliamentary Secretary to the Treasury (Torsten Bell)]

My hon. Friend is a powerful advocate for his constituents, and particularly for those who have suffered in recent weeks, including others across Greater Manchester. As I set out earlier, the Government have put in £2.4 billion to ensure flood resilience over the next two years; as he will be aware, future decisions on flood defence funding will be taken in the spending review in the normal way. I know that he will continue to be a powerful advocate for his constituents.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Torsten Bell and Lindsay Hoyle

Wednesday 11th September 2024 Commons Chamber

[Torsten Bell]

Back in the 1990s, the Conservatives claimed that the minimum wage would cost 1 million jobs. Instead, low earners have seen the fastest pay rises year after year, with no effect on employment—[Interruption.] They opposed it. Today, and on their watch, 1 million workers are on zero-hours contracts and more than 1 million people have no sick pay whatsoever, facing risks that nobody in this House would bear. The details matter, but it is outdated nonsense—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Please sit down. One, it is easier if you face me—I can hear it better. The second part is that it is meant to be a question, not a statement. [Interruption.] No, I decide. I call the Prime Minister.