Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Brake Excerpts

Thursday 26th April 2018 Commons Chamber

[Patrick Grady (Glasgow North) (SNP)]

7. To ask the right hon. Member for Carshalton and Wallington, representing the House of Commons Commission, what representations the Commission has received on the potential installation of electronic voting systems in the Chamber as part of (a) the restoration and renewal programme and (b) the northern estate programme.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington)]

Representations have been made through previous oral questions to the House of Commons Commission, including by the hon. Gentleman himself. He may remember that I responded in similar terms to the hon. Member for Na h-Eileanan an Iar (Angus Brendan MacNeil) in January. The Commission has given no formal consideration to a move to electronic voting in the House as part of either the restoration and renewal programme or the northern estate programme. Its responsibility in this matter is limited to any financial or staffing implications of any change to the present system were such a change to be agreed by the House.

[Patrick Grady]

Can the right hon. Gentleman explain whether the Commission would be prepared to receive any such representations, or whether there should be some other mechanism by which this House can actually have a proper debate and a proper discussion about dragging ourselves somewhere into the late 20th century in time for this restoration and renewal somewhere in the middle of the 21st century?

[Tom Brake]

I thank the hon. Gentleman. I suspect that, from earlier responses, he will be aware that he needs to present his ideas, in the initial stages, to the Procedure Committee for it to consider. However, there will also be an opportunity, as part of a consultation around the northern estate programme, for him to contribute, and he could contribute in advance of that by contacting Emma Wharton who is responsible for that programme and for the restoration and renewal. I am sure that she would be happy to receive his representation.

The right hon. Member for Meriden, representing the Church Commissioners, was asked—

Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Brake Excerpts

Thursday 25th January 2018 Commons Chamber

[Angus Brendan MacNeil (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP)]

3. To ask the right hon. Member for Carshalton and Wallington, representing the House of Commons Commission, what estimate the Commission has made of the potential cost of introducing electronic voting in the Chamber.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington)]

The Commission has given no formal consideration to a move to electronic voting in the House. Its responsibility in that matter is limited to the financial or staffing implications of any change to the present system, were a change to be agreed by the House.

[Angus Brendan MacNeil]

The voting system here is a bit crazy, Mr Speaker: last week, we spent two hours on eight votes. Most other Parliaments in the world would laugh at that—indeed, they do. Given that MPs do value meeting each other in the Lobbies, can we consider a hybrid system so that we move to something electronic when there is more than one vote? That would save those two hours.

[Tom Brake]

I have some sympathy with the point that the hon. Gentleman is making, but as I am sure he—now an expert in these matters—knows, this is a matter for the House. If he chose to, he could approach the Procedure Committee and ask it to look at this issue.

[Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab)]

We do have a sort of electronic voting now because the Clerks are using iPads—but using the iPads takes longer than using the pieces of paper of the past because it takes more time to spot the individual names.

I still support our going through the Lobbies—it is a good opportunity to meet Ministers and other colleagues—but it would be good if every vote did not take 16 minutes. Would it not be a good idea to consider some swifter form of technology for the Division Lobbies? We could use a fingerprint or thumbprint to vote.

[Tom Brake]

The hon. Gentleman has made a sensible point, which I am happy to take back in considering whether the electronic voting that he has described could speed things up.

The right hon. Member for Meriden, representing the Church Commissioners, was asked—

--- Later in debate ---

[Christian Matheson (City of Chester) (Lab)]

9. To ask the right hon. Member for Carshalton and Wallington, representing the House of Commons Commission, what steps the Commission is taking to ensure the highest standards of employment practice from contractors working on the Palace of Westminster renewal and maintenance projects. [R]

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington)]

The House service’s contract requirements and terms and conditions make provisions for contractors to provide adequate working conditions for employees. The provisions include health and safety, security, training, remuneration and payment of at least the London living wage to employees if working on the parliamentary estate. The working conditions provided by the contractors must be compliant with relevant legislation and ensure appropriate welfare and maintenance of stable and skilled workforces to ensure successful delivery of our contracts.

[Christian Matheson]

I refer to my entry in the Register of Members’ Financial Interests and thank the right hon. Gentleman for that answer.

Companies such as McAlpine, which is up to its neck in blacklisting, have contracts on the parliamentary site. Since the best form of protection for workers is membership of a strong trade union, will the Commission consider giving named officials of the relevant trade unions security access so they can come in and check to make sure blacklisting is not taking place on these premises?

[Tom Brake]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for advance notice of the supplementary question. I am afraid that the current position is that passes can be issued, for instance by Members, only for a specific purpose in supporting that Member. However, the hon. Gentleman has made a specific request and I undertake to secure a written response to it for him.

Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Brake Excerpts

Thursday 7th December 2017 Commons Chamber

[Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con)]

5. What estimate the Commission has made of the level of financial subsidy on sales of alcohol on the parliamentary estate in each of the last three years.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington)]

There is no direct financial subsidy on alcohol sales in the House of Commons. Alcohol is sold in House of Commons bars and some catering venues, and at banqueting and events, achieving a gross profit margin of some 69%. The profit of some £1 million a year helps to offset the total cost of catering.

[Mr Hollobone]

I am pleased to hear that there is no subsidy of alcohol sales on the parliamentary estate. There have been some recent, well-reported incidents of bad behaviour in bars on the estate. What steps are the Commission taking to prevent such incidents?

[Tom Brake]

The hon. Gentleman may be aware of the incident a couple of days ago in the Sports and Social Club, which is run by the House of Lords. An investigation is under way, and the issue is under review for the reasons that he has set out.

[Jo Swinson (East Dunbartonshire) (LD)]

7. What progress has been made on implementing the recommendation of Professor Childs’s “The Good Parliament” review to publish information on the diversity of the members of the parliamentary press lobby to whom passes are issued.

[Tom Brake]

Professor Childs recommended a target of a representative parliamentary Press Gallery—Lobby journalists—such that neither women nor men should be in receipt of less than 40% of Lobby passes by 2020. As of 6 December, 25.6% of the 246 valid Lobby passes on issue were for women. As a result of my hon. Friend’s question, I will seek the best means of publishing those figures on a regular basis.

[Mr Speaker]

They really will have to do better, won’t they?

[Jo Swinson]

Diversity matters in our democracy— both in this House and also up there in the Press Gallery, among those who create the lens through which our politics is viewed. I am glad that the Commission will look to publish diversity data on the journalists covering Parliament, but I encourage it to implement recommendation 4 of “The Good Parliament” review in full by publishing data not only on gender, but on other characteristics; by breaking down the data by media organisation; and by setting clear targets so that, by 2020, men and women each have no fewer than 40% of passes for the journalists’ Lobby on the estate.

[Tom Brake]

My hon. Friend may be aware that currently neither the Commons Reference Group on Representation and Inclusion, nor the Commission, has considered the recommendation of “The Good Parliament” report. However, following her question, I will certainly ensure that they do as soon as possible, and I will look specifically at ensuring that the extensive level of detail that she has requested is reflected in future reports.

[Patrick Grady (Glasgow North) (SNP)]

I think that “The Good Parliament” report will come to be seen as a pivotal and seminal publication in the history of the reform and modernisation of this place. Will the right hon. Gentleman say a bit more about how its recommendations, including those relating to the Press Gallery, are being taking forward, and how the Commission is considering them in the light of other opportunities to renew and restore this place, including in the northern estate?

[Tom Brake]

One of the measures of the importance that is being placed on the report is the emphasis that Mr Speaker and the House of Commons Commission are putting on it. This is clearly something that Members of Parliament are actively tracking. I am therefore confident that both the Commons Reference Group and, indeed, the Commission, will want to ensure that due priority is given to the recommendations of “The Good Parliament” report, and that they are implemented as soon as possible.

The right hon. Member for Meriden, representing the Church Commissioners, was asked—

Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Brake Excerpts

Thursday 26th October 2017 Commons Chamber

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

10. What estimate the Commission has made of the cost of introducing electronic voting in the Chamber.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD)]

The Commission has given no formal consideration to the cost of introducing electronic voting. Its responsibility is limited to any financial or staffing implications of any change in the present system, were a change to be agreed by the House. Such a change would normally follow a report by the Procedure Committee, which would, I am sure, welcome representations from the hon. Member for Glenrothes (Peter Grant) and his hon. Friends.

[Peter Grant]

While I accept that this is not primarily a matter for the Commission to decide, does the right hon. Gentleman not agree that before we spend astronomical sums on refurbishing this place, the Commission should at the very least build in the capacity for electronic voting in the future, should the House at some point decide to move itself into the 20th century before the rest of the world enters the 22nd?

[Tom Brake]

I have set out for the hon. Gentleman perhaps the most effective way in which he could voice his concerns, but an opportunity may well be provided shortly by a contingency Chamber, in which case it would of course be open to the House to decide to implement an electronic voting system if it considered that to be appropriate.

[Patrick Grady]

We do read reports about a contingency Chamber. Have any assessments been made of the differing costs of installing voting Lobbies—which I assume would have to include little toilets at the end, in which Members could hide if they accidentally made their way into the wrong Lobby—and simply installing an electronic voting system? Would the latter not be a more sensible use of public funds?

[Tom Brake]

I suspect that we have not yet reached the stage of deciding whether the provision of toilets will be needed for a contingency Chamber, or, indeed, establishing whether any financial assessment has been made of the installation of electronic voting. According to figures produced in past debates, however, it appears that the cost might be up to £500,000.

[Hannah Bardell]

In the Scottish Parliament, where there is a seat for every Member and voting takes two seconds rather than 20 minutes, electronic voting is very effective. Is the right hon. Gentleman aware that in this Chamber there were more than 500 votes between 2012 and 2014, which took up more than seven days? Given what is coming down the line with Brexit, does he not think that this is a perfect time to install electronic voting in the House of Commons?

[Tom Brake]

I am aware that electronic voting takes place in the Scottish Parliament, and my personal view is that it is a more effective way of dealing with votes. Members who have not been here as long as I have may not remember that back in 1997 there was an attempt to reform a number of ways in which the House operated. I supported it, but it was blocked by the House.

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

But is it not the case that there are advantages in going into the Lobby—one can meet colleagues and do things? If we listen to the Scottish National party all together, why do we not go the whole hog? Why do we not just sit at home, watch proceedings on the Parliament channel, and vote on our iPhones?

[Tom Brake]

I did not hear in any of the earlier contributions any suggestion that we should stay at home to do our voting, and I am sure that the SNP representatives here today would not favour that approach either.

[Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con)]

As a Minister in the previous coalition Government and now as a Back Bencher, the right hon. Gentleman will appreciate that one of the advantages for Back Benchers of voting in person is that Ministers have no escape from Back Benchers who want to collar them to raise local and national issues.

[Mr Speaker]

I am sure Ministers love meeting the hon. Gentleman in the Division Lobby, and that they have good conversations—although they are probably usually one-way.

[Tom Brake]

I have nothing to add to what Mr Speaker has said.

The right hon. Member for Meriden, representing the Church Commissioners was asked—

--- Later in debate ---

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD)]

Substantial progress has until now been hampered by the lack of a decision in principle by the two Houses on the preferred way forward. The report of the Joint Committee on the Palace of Westminster was published in September last year, and I am pleased that the Leaders of both Houses have indicated that they will make time for a debate before the end of this year.

[Gavin Newlands]

I thank the right hon. Gentleman for that answer, but the replacement of major systems in the Palace has been due for more than a decade. The Leader of the House is now appointing yet another Committee, delaying the repairs yet again, despite warnings that delays increase the risk of serious events such as fires. Has the Commission made any estimate of how much longer the deployment of a new body to consider costings will delay the timeline of the work?

[Tom Brake]

The expectation is that once the shadow sponsor board and the delivery authority have been established, it might take them something of the order of 12 to 18 months to consider the options for decanting. That would therefore add to the timescales. I welcome the fact that we are going to have the debate by the end of this year. We really need that, because meanwhile the fabric of the building continues to deteriorate and the very high maintenance costs that we incur as a result also continue apace.

[Jo Swinson]

Does my right hon. Friend agree that the public might be somewhat puzzled at the thought of a further 12 to 18 months’ delay while options that have already been assessed are discussed yet again? When works are considered urgent for structural and safety reasons, surely we should choose the option that maximises the ability to carry out those works efficiently while minimising the cost to the public purse without any further delay.

[Tom Brake]

I thank my hon. Friend for that question. Since the original Joint Committee report, the idea of creating a contingency Chamber and perhaps doing more works around the northern estate have changed the picture slightly. The sponsor board and the delivery authority will be established according to the timescale set out, and I hope that she and others will take advantage of the engagement programme that the Government have launched, with three separate dates on 14, 21 and 28 November, and that Members will avail themselves of the opportunity to go on the tour of the basements to see why these works are needed.

[Martin Vickers (Cleethorpes) (Con)]

I might be wrong, but I get the impression that the Treasury would much rather spend money over a long period than over a shorter period. Does the right hon. Gentleman know whether the Treasury would prefer to spend £5 billion or £6 billion over five or six years or much more over 20 to 30 years?

[Tom Brake]

As the spokesman of the House of Commons Commission, I am somewhat loth to express a Treasury view—the Treasury is better equipped to do that than I am. However, as for the risk profile associated with doing these works over, say, a 30-year period as opposed to a much shorter period of time, the risk of some catastrophic failure is clearly much higher if the works take place over 30 years while we are in situ debating in either Chamber and, indeed, our staff are here working.

[Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab)]

The right hon. Gentleman says that we are hampered in making a decision because the two Houses have not come to a view, but that is because the Government refuse to table the motion that was agreed last year by the then Leader of the House, which says that there is

“an impending crisis which we cannot responsibly ignore.”

It is downright irresponsible of the Government consistently to delay. The next edition of the “Oxford English Dictionary” will say for the word “procrastination”: “See the inaction of the Tory Government on the misunderstanding of the phrase ‘impending crisis’.” Get on with it, man!

[Tom Brake]

For the reasons I set out about the risk profile associated with the services in the building, I certainly support what the hon. Gentleman says about the need for urgent action to be taken, although I may not echo the tone that he uses.

[Mr Speaker]

I am very grateful to the hon. Member for Rhondda (Chris Bryant) for his attempted imitation. I usually have the copyright on the phrase “Get on with it, man,” but they say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, so I am deeply obliged to the hon. Gentleman.

--- Later in debate ---

[Alan Brown (Kilmarnock and Loudoun) (SNP)]

Given the attitude to change in this place, including the resistance to electronic voting, does the right hon. Gentleman agree that consideration should be given to turning this place into a museum?

[Tom Brake]

When that matter was looked at by the Commission and the Lords equivalent, there was no desire to turn this place into a museum. Indeed, there was a desire to ensure that this building is able to continue to operate for staff, for Members and for visitors and to remain a significant world heritage building. [Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Just in case those attending to our proceedings did not hear, the hon. Member for Lichfield (Michael Fabricant) says that he wants to be an exhibit. He should be careful of what he wishes for.

--- Later in debate ---

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington)]

The House awards contracts to the most economically advantageous tender, in accordance with the statutory regime set out in the Public Contracts Regulations 2015. That involves the evaluation of bids using weighted objective criteria, such as whole-life costs, service levels, equality and other environmental or social aspects to ensure compliance with the principles of transparency, non-discrimination and equal treatment, meaning that tenders are assessed in conditions of effective competition.

[Christian Matheson]

The Big Ben refurbishment contract has been awarded to McAlpine, which is up to its neck in blacklisting. Is it not now time that we gave McAlpine a taste of its own medicine? Is it not possible for us to strip that blacklister of the contract? If not, can the House of Commons Commission take industrial relations and social responsibility into account in the awarding of future contracts?

[Tom Brake]

I understand the hon. Gentleman’s question. He may be aware that pre-qualification criteria contain grounds for mandatory exclusion where a potential supplier has been convicted for breaching any relevant legislation, including the Employment Relations Act 1999 (Blacklists) Regulations 2010. However, I think the critical issue is there having been a conviction for breaching that legislation. The other difficulty is that, unfortunately, a large number of major contractors in the UK were involved in blacklisting, and an approach that involved offering no work to any of those, including those who perhaps settled out of court, would make it very difficult for any work to be undertaken.

Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Brake Excerpts

Thursday 20th July 2017 Commons Chamber

[Michael Gove]

The law of the land must always be enforced without fear or favour.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD)]

6. What assessment his Department has made of the potential effect on food security of the UK leaving the EU.

[The Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (George Eustice)]

Food security depends on global factors including increasing global production sustainably, reducing waste, and ensuring open markets to facilitate trade around the world. With regard to the EU, we are prioritising securing the freest trade possible, including an ambitious and comprehensive free trade agreement and a new customs agreement.

[Tom Brake]

Does the Minister accept the definition of “food security” provided by the former Government chief scientific adviser, Sir John Beddington—notably, that food security is characterised as requiring a food system that is sufficient, sustainable, safe and equitable? By reference to which indicators of food security will DEFRA be judging the food security consequences of the post-Brexit food and agricultural system?

Air Quality Strategy

Tom Brake Excerpts

Monday 24th April 2017 Commons Chamber

[Andrea Leadsom]

My right hon. Friend is exactly right to raise this issue. The Government have invested a huge amount in retrofitting buses and taxis. Other measures include limiting medium combustion plants, which I was very proud to put in place when I was Energy Secretary, to try to reduce other emissions. My right hon. Friend is exactly right that we need to tackle a number of different emissions. This plan deals with nitrogen dioxide emissions and we will publish it as soon as we can.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD)]

Opposition Members will monitor carefully whether such pre-election sensitivity applies to the announcements or consultations that the Government welcome to the same extent as to ones that cause them embarrassment. Once the UK leaves the EU and the Commission is no longer able to levy fines on the UK Government for failing to act with due speed on the premature deaths of 40,000 people a year that are caused by toxic air, who does the Government expect will be levying fines and initiating cases against the Government for air quality breaches?

[Andrea Leadsom]

I agree with the right hon. Gentleman that this is a very significant and serious issue, but I find his suggestion that the threat of EU fines is the only reason why the Government might be motivated to deal with it rather distasteful. We absolutely intend to deal with the issue to ensure that the air is cleaner for the people of our country and that we are the generation who leaves our environment in a better state than we found it.

Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Brake Excerpts

Thursday 2nd March 2017 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

I am sure that my hon. Friend will welcome the fact that many manufacturers are proactively removing microbeads from their products. We will consider the responses to the consultation carefully and use them to inform any future policy.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD)]

9. I urge the Government to go further than the United States and ban all products containing microbeads that risk getting into the marine environment. Will the Government reject the idea that biodegradable microbeads could be used instead, because there is no evidence that there is such a thing? Will they also commission some research into whether microbeads in human tissue have a long-term health effect?

[Dr Coffey]

The US ban has not yet come into force, but we will continue to monitor its progress and consider any learning from that approach. Our proposals so far are supported by evidence, which shows that rinse-off products can damage some marine environments. We have extended the consultation and issued a call for evidence on other matters.

Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Brake Excerpts

Thursday 19th January 2017 Commons Chamber

[Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab)]

9. What the timetable is for work on the northern estate to be completed.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington)]

The target date for completion of work on the Northern Estate is November 2023, which is the date by which the buildings will have been reoccupied.

--- Later in debate ---

[Chris Bryant]

I am grateful for that answer from the right hon. Member for Carshalton and Wallington (Tom Brake), but the key thing about the date is that that is when the decant from this building is meant to have started, and there is a series of decisions that knock on one from another. If the Government do not bring forward the motion so we can start debating what is going to happen to the Palace of Westminster, is there not a real danger we will put that project and the public finances at risk?

[Tom Brake]

I certainly agree that it is important that we have a debate on this matter very soon, and I hope that is going to happen, but although there are linkages between the Northern Estate and the restoration and renewal project, it is my understanding that any delay on R and R would have an insignificant impact on the Northern Estate programme itself.

The right hon. Member for Meriden, representing the Church Commissioners, was asked—

Oral Answers to Questions

Tom Brake Excerpts

Thursday 24th November 2016 Commons Chamber

[Patrick Grady (Glasgow North) (SNP)]

7. When the Commission last made an estimate of the cost of introducing electronic voting to the House; and what that estimate was.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington)]

The Commission has given no formal consideration to a move to electronic voting in the House. Its responsibility in this matter is limited to any financial or staffing implications of any change to the current system, were a change to be agreed by the House. The Procedure Committee, of which the hon. Gentleman has been a member since 2015, will be well placed to inquire into the matter and come up with proposals.

[Patrick Grady]

It is a pleasure to ask a question of a spokesman on the same side of the House. During the Report stage of the Higher Education and Research Bill on Monday we spent nearly an hour trooping through the Division Lobbies. Has the Commission ever made a calculation of the cost to the taxpayer of that dead time in terms of staff, security and utilities? If we are to be decanted as part of a restoration process, surely that presents an opportunity to devise a pilot for electronic voting if we are not going to replicate every last detail of where we are now.

[Tom Brake]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for those two questions. On the time it takes Members to vote, he may not be aware that back in 1997 this House did consider substantial changes to the way in which we voted, and I am afraid it voted to keep things exactly as they were. I hope that by, perhaps, early next year we will have a substantive debate in this place on the restoration and renewal issue, and that would be the appropriate opportunity for him to raise his point.

[Sir Desmond Swayne (New Forest West) (Con)]

Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that the current system affords Members an opportunity to nobble Ministers when they are bereft of their heavies and spin doctors?

[Tom Brake]

It is indeed true that when trooping through the Division Lobbies there are opportunities to lobby Ministers, but clearly those opportunities are more frequent for Government Members than for Opposition Members.

[Helen Goodman (Bishop Auckland) (Lab)]

Does not the right hon. Gentleman agree that it gives Opposition Members an opportunity for team building, which is extremely important? Will he do everything he can to keep the issue at the bottom of his in-tray?

[Tom Brake]

I thank the hon. Lady for her question, which gives me the opportunity to underline the importance of team-building opportunities in the Lobby, particularly for her party.

The right hon. Member for Meriden, representing the Church Commissioners, was asked—

Air Quality

Tom Brake Excerpts

Thursday 3rd November 2016 Commons Chamber

[Dr Coffey]

My hon. Friend is right that we must pull on a number of levers. We should be proud of the innovations that we have undertaken, particularly in the development of low emission vehicles. However, we must be serious when addressing this issue. We are working up targeted interventions that I genuinely hope will mean that in a few years we will be celebrating the fact that air quality is improving for everyone whom we represent.

[Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD)]

The Liberal Democrats have opposed a third runway at Heathrow for 20 years, but the Government are ploughing ahead. What action will the Minister take now to improve the appalling air quality around Heathrow? Will she ensure that the third runway will not be built unless air pollution can be contained within the legal limits?

[Dr Coffey]

In answer to my hon. Friend the Member for Twickenham (Dr Mathias), I set out that the Government believe that the runway at Heathrow can be delivered without impacting on the UK’s compliance on air quality. The Secretary of State for Transport was at the Dispatch Box on 25 October and talked about the Department for Transport, DEFRA and the Treasury embarking on a joint project

“to identify further ways in which we can tackle the issue.”

He continued:

“By the time a new runway opens in the next decade, we intend to have made substantial progress on tackling such air quality challenges”

not only around Heathrow, but

“across our nation as a whole.”—[Official Report, 25 October 2016; Vol. 616, c. 164.]