Royal Bank of Scotland Branch Closures

Paul Girvan Excerpts

Tuesday 14th May 2024 Westminster Hall

[Deidre Brock]

I agree with my hon. Friend. He is absolutely correct. I think everyone else here agreed with him as well.

Existing legislation to protect against bank branch closures is far too weak. The Financial Conduct Authority has some powers to protect cash services but not bank branches. Yet, in 2019, the FCA’s own research found that bank branch closures presented particular challenges for older people who would have to travel further to reach a branch. It also said that older people were less likely to turn to mobile banking, which increased their risk of financial exclusion. But it seems the banks can just follow the tick-box guidance and then fire ahead with the closure anyway. We must introduce a community right to physical banking services. I commend the work of my hon. Friend the Member for Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey (Drew Hendry) to introduce a Bill for such a measure. I hope for cross-party consensus to take forward something similar.

I am curious to hear whether the Minister thinks bank branch closures conflict with the Equality Act 2010—specifically part 3, which states that service providers must ensure equal access to services for all individuals? We already have all the evidence we need of the impact on communities, on older people, on people with disabilities, and on small businesses that rely on cash trade.

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

There are banks that say that they are offering another service because they will work with banking hubs, but those banking hubs are not there all the time. They work just the hours that suit them, so they do not give accessibility to all. It just suits the banks to tick a box to say that they are available.

[Deidre Brock]

Yes, the hon. Gentleman is quite right, and there are delays around those hubs, which I will reference later in my speech.

Research from Which? Found that 65% of consumers would find life difficult without the option to access their bank branch. Age UK says that four out of 10 over-65s do not manage their money online. We also know that paper documents are just preferred by many people, and can help them keep track of their finances better.

Oral Answers to Questions

Paul Girvan Excerpts

Tuesday 6th February 2024 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I am not sure that “she” is a good word to use to other Members.

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

11. Whether he has had recent discussions with Cabinet colleagues on funding for a UK-wide infected blood compensation scheme.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

13. Whether he has had discussions with Cabinet colleagues on the potential cost to the Exchequer of compensation for people infected and affected by contaminated blood and blood products.

[The Chief Secretary to the Treasury (Laura Trott)]

This is an appalling tragedy, and my thoughts remain with all those affected. We understand the strength of feeling, and the need for action. The Government have accepted the moral case for compensation, and have acknowledged that justice needs to be delivered for victims. As such, the Government intend to respond in full to Sir Brian Langstaff’s recommendations for wider compensation following the publication of the inquiry’s final report in May this year.

[Paul Girvan]

The Minister’s answering that question has brought forth another question. The Chancellor was previously Secretary of State in the Department of Health, and three of his former colleagues all gave a commitment to address the issue. Now that the Chancellor is in a position to do something about that, how long is it going to take? As this Government’s days are numbered, the difficulty I have is whether this will be in place before we have an election. Will they ensure that the commitment is there?

[Laura Trott]

I know that the hon. Gentleman has a lifelong friend who has suffered from this terrible tragedy, and I can reassure him that we are determined to do right by the victims and those who have tragically lost their loved ones. The victims of the infected blood scandal deserve justice and recognition. On his question on timing, Governments of all colours have failed to sort this out, but I am pleased that the interim payments at least have been paid. As I have said, the Government are committed to the moral case for compensation and we are expecting the final report very soon. We will move as quickly as possible afterwards.

Energy (oil and gas) profits levy

Paul Girvan Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd November 2022 Commons Chamber

[Drew Hendry (Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey) (SNP)]

Opening yesterday’s debate, the Chief Secretary to the Treasury said that this was not a return to austerity. That made me wonder what the Government call a forecast drop of 7% per person in household living standards. Over the past 12 years, we have had Tory Prime Minister after Tory Prime Minister after Tory Prime Minister—I could go on, because there have been quite a few of them—telling us that this is the end of austerity, but in that time what we have seen is growing inequality and mortgages rising, and now we have record inflation and energy costs are skyrocketing.

This Tory Government have presided over nothing but austerity, and they offer people no hope of anything else. They have presided over the continued chaotic mismanagement of the UK economy that forces ordinary people to pay the price. That view is shared by many people. When preparing for this speech, I looked at all the different resources—people who have made contact to comment on the Budget statement and the events of the past few months. It was really difficult to narrow them down, because so many people representing so many organisations across business and charities have been critical of the way the Government have handled and are handling things. I will pick out just a few. Paul Johnson, director of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, said:

“The truth is we just got a lot poorer. We are in for a long, hard, unpleasant journey…that has been made more arduous than it might have been by a series of economic own goals”.

He went on to mention the disastrous mini-Budget of course, but he also stated:

“Very clearly, Brexit was an economic own goal. Economically speaking that has been very bad news indeed”.

I notice that no one else dares to speak of Brexit in this Chamber, but the damage is real and has been done. Scotland voted resolutely against Brexit; we voted to remain in the EU and were ignored, and now we are paying the price. In a very impressive speech, the hon. Member for Hampstead and Kilburn (Tulip Siddiq) made a lot of persuasive arguments, but I noticed again that Labour dares not go there, because when it comes to Brexit, they have taken the clothes off the beach and put them on themselves. It is not good enough.

Let me go further and quote the UN Human Rights Council, which includes nations such as Brazil and which has urged the UK Government to implement an energy poverty strategy that addresses the impact of rising costs on child poverty targets. It has gone further still and asked the UK Government to

“improve food security, in particular for children, adolescents and persons with disabilities”.

Does that make the Tories feel proud? It is almost unbelievable. Scotland deserves much better than that.

The Food Standards Agency consumer insights tracker points out that the proportion of people who cannot afford to eat a healthy balanced diet rose to more than a third in October. More than a third of people cannot afford to eat a healthy balanced diet. A quarter of people reported eating cold food because they could not afford to cook. About a fifth are turning off fridges and freezers with food inside them because they reckon they cannot afford the energy to run those appliances. That is a disgrace. All the nations of the UK deserve better. The people I represent in my constituency and across Scotland definitely deserve better.

The Resolution Foundation points out that, far from the Government taxing the rich, as we have heard in this Chamber—taxing those who can most afford it—it is the people in the middle who will be squeezed by a near 4% hit on their income, which is a bigger hit than high earners will experience. The Resolution Foundation warns that the statement means nearly 20 years of wage stagnation between 2008 and 2027 due to the weak forecast for pay and the effects of inflation, hurting people in their homes, hurting families and hurting children. The foundation further points out that households living in harder-to-heat homes with larger families are particularly hard hit by energy bills—nearly a quarter of them are affected. It is worse for people who live off the gas grid—a large number of people in rural communities of the sort that I and many others represent. Look at what they have been offered. Yes, it is great to see a doubling from £100 to £200 in the support for off-gas-grid households, but that is nowhere near enough. Are Ministers living in the real world? At the moment, the minimum oil or kerosene delivery is £500. The amounts offered will not touch the sides, and people living in off-gas-grid households will pay far more than £4,000 for their average energy bill.

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

In mainland UK, heating oil can be bought for 82p per litre, but we in Northern Ireland are paying £1.08 per litre. Fuel poverty is a major problem in Northern Ireland.

[Drew Hendry]

The hon. Member makes a good point about affordability for his constituents. This is a major issue for people in rural communities across the nations of the UK, especially Scotland, although Northern Ireland fares similarly in having a colder climate. These are big, big issues for people. There is no real acknowledgement in the autumn statement of the difficulties for people living their real lives in that type of accommodation in those areas.

The OBR pointed out that Westminster’s Brexit

“will result in the UK’s trade intensity being 15 per cent lower in the long run than if the UK had remained in the EU.”

The Bank of England Governor Andrew Bailey said the UK has suffered a “dramatically” worse recovery than the US or the EU. Government Members like to pretend that the only things that have happened are the war in Ukraine and the global pandemic, but they must take responsibility for the economic self-harm they have imposed on people across the UK and in Scotland through their Brexit ideology, which is resolutely failing and being proved to fail on a daily basis. Scotland deserves better than that.

The CBI director general says of the situation:

“There was really nothing there to tell us that the economy is going to avoid another decade of low productivity and low growth”.

On labour shortages, he called for a practical approach to immigration and urged the UK Government—he might do the same for the Labour party—to be “honest” with people over the UK’s “vast” labour shortages, and said:

“we don’t have the people we need, nor do we have the productivity.”

Scotland deserves better than this.

Business after business ignored. Organisation after organisation ignored. Expert after expert ignored. The UK Tory Government ignore them all. We have seen non-doms protected. Bankers’ bonuses are now unlimited. Many companies are still avoiding their tax responsibilities and public services are facing their most brutal cuts. The Health Foundation pointed out that the whole health budget amounts to only a 1.2% increase in real terms over the next two years, which is well below the historic average of 3.8%. For Scotland, that means having to draw back on the services we can provide. We are focused on trying to support people with fair pay settlements, so they can navigate the cost of living crisis. The Health Foundation also shows that if spending per person had matched the EU average, the UK would have spent £40 billion more than it has done.

On the climate, where have all the good promises gone? Where have all the warm words gone on taking the global climate crisis seriously? In fact, the autumn statement undermines Scotland’s climate change goals and underlined the dangers of Scotland being held back. The UK Government are pushing ahead with nuclear, which is the most costly and the slowest form of energy to deliver, and has the highest environmental impact. The UK already has the most poorly insulated homes in western Europe. There is nothing to change that situation. They still have not delivered, after a number of betrayals, the Peterhead carbon capture and storage project. They have put a higher—higher!—windfall tax on renewable energy producers than they have on oil and gas. That is quite incredible. They have deterred and deferred the uptake of electric vehicles. At a time when momentum was growing for people to invest in an electric vehicle to be better for the climate, what do this Government do? They introduce a pretty high tax to put people off doing that. People will persevere with their petrol and diesel for a bit longer, and burn more carbon-intensive fuels.

In Scotland, the Scottish Government have been working to protect people, despite a real-terms cut of 10% since December due to inflation. Any Westminster increase as a result of the autumn statement will more than be wiped out by inflation. We prioritised public sector fair pay and are prioritising funding to help households, businesses and people to get through this period, but we are reaching the limit. In fact, the limit of what can be done, without borrowing powers and the powers we need to look after our people properly, has already been reached, in sharp contrast to this place. Under Westminster, we continue to see growing inequality, mortgages rising, inflation rising and energy costs skyrocketing. When we compare countries of Scotland’s size or smaller, we find that, for them, independence works. Compared to the UK, those countries are wealthier and more equal, and have higher productivity, lower poverty, lower child poverty and lower pensioner poverty. They have higher social mobility and higher business investment.

Scotland has not voted Tory for nearly 70 years, yet we are saddled with this. Scotland did not vote for Brexit, and we do not want it. Scottish people, families and children are bearing the brunt of Westminster’s legacy. Scotland is being denied the people it needs to strengthen its communities, its businesses and our country. Scotland has voted time and time again to have its say on its future. It cannot be denied. The choice is between the toxic approach here in Westminster, or a normal independent country.

Financial Services and Markets Bill

Paul Girvan Excerpts

2nd reading
Wednesday 7th September 2022 Commons Chamber

[Dr James Davies (Vale of Clwyd) (Con)]

My comments on this welcome Bill will focus primarily on its ability to improve access to cash and banking services. In my constituency, like many others, bank closures have become increasingly problematic. It is now seven years since the last bank shut in the city of St Asaph in the heart of my constituency, while Denbigh has also seen closures. Last year, TSB, Barclays and HSBC shut in Prestatyn, following the town’s loss of NatWest, Royal Bank of Scotland and building society branches in the preceding five years. Prestatyn High Street was left without a single bank or cash machine, despite being a busy regional shopping centre.

Cash remains important for many residents and businesses in my constituency. Following a campaign, and thanks to Cardtronics and Principality building society, three new free-to-use cash machines have now been installed in Prestatyn town centre. In addition, since June this year new legislation has brought about cashback without purchase services through various local businesses. However, banking services in the town remain lacking.

Last year, Derek French, a former executive of NatWest and the founder of the Campaign for Community Banking Services, identified the 50 communities in Britain where he believed shared banking hubs are most required. Prestatyn is one of the 22 of those communities that have already lost their last bank branch.

Earlier this year, the Royal Society for Arts, Manufactures and Commerce published a report suggesting that 10 million people would struggle in a cashless society. As incomes are squeezed, there is evidence that some people are turning back to cash to help them to budget. The Post Office reported record withdrawals in July 2022, while LINK ATM withdrawals still exceed £7 billion monthly.

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

I appreciate that the hon. Member has highlighted a number of banks and areas that are being decimated by banks removing themselves from the high street. A section of our community who are not IT literate have a major problem and are being totally disenfranchised. We need to put in place legislation to ensure that those people are not left without access to the banks that they have used all their lives.

[Dr Davies]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely correct. I hope the Bill will go a long way to help that situation. I was coming on to say that 10% of people are planning to use cash more in the coming six months because of cost of living pressures.

The access to cash agenda owes much to Natalie Ceeney and her access to cash review. Following a landmark agreement at the start of this year, the banks and leading consumer groups formed UK Finance’s cash action group. LINK took on the role of assessing the impact of proposed bank branch closures on communities. As of 4 July, the agreement was extended to include communities where bank closures have already taken place. LINK can recommend new cash services, such as banking hubs and ATMs, according to the cash access needs in each community. New services will then be delivered by a new banking hub company set up by the banks, or, in the case of ATMs, by LINK.

This Bill puts this very welcome voluntary arrangement on a statutory footing. It confers on the Treasury a duty to prepare a cash access policy statement, which I understand is currently being drafted, and powers to “designate” banks and firms such as LINK and the Post Office to take steps in relation to that policy. Furthermore, it gives the FCA powers to take action on those designated firms.

This summer, I put forward Prestatyn for assessment by LINK for a banking hub. I am very grateful to Nick Quin, head of financial inclusion at LINK, for his visit to the town in January and for meeting me with his colleague Chris Ashton this week to discuss in detail my application on behalf of the town. A banking hub would facilitate cheque and cash deposits, and cash withdrawals, and banking staff from each of the big banks would be based in the hub on specific days to help customers with community banking issues. So this legislation is very much welcomed, and I extend my thanks to the Economic Secretary to the Treasury and, in particular, to his predecessor, my hon. Friend the Member for Salisbury (John Glen), who I know has put an awful lot of time into this agenda.

I urge the Government to consider ensuring that assessments of the needs of communities by LINK should be transparently published and that there should be a formal process of appeal. I also ask that consideration of access to banking services through the Welsh language be referenced in the cash access policy statement. Furthermore, it would be helpful to explore the scope of the community banking services that banking hubs could potentially be mandated to provide—for example, opening a new bank account, amending direct debits and standing orders, applying for a loan, arranging third-party access or commencing bereavement procedures.

It is also important to clarify whether the Bill will give the FCA the power to prevent the closure of a bank branch, ATM or cash access point of another kind where there is no suitable alternative in place, so that in future new gaps in provision do not occur. I understand that in recent times LINK has protected 3,000 free ATMs in remote and deprived areas, and funded new ATMs in more than 100 communities. I hope the Government will commit to protecting free cash withdrawals and deposits, and that that can be explored in the policy statement. An indication by the Minister of the likely publication date of the policy statement would be particularly appreciated.

Other elements of this Bill will enable credit unions to offer a greater range of products and services; strengthen the rules around financial promotions; and enable regulatory action by the Payment Systems Regulator to require the reimbursement of victims of authorised push payment scams. All of that is very much to be welcomed, but I urge the Government to ensure that the authorised push payment scam regulations cover all feasible methods of payment, both now and in the future.

I fully support the Bill, especially as it responds to significant concerns over the availability of cash and banking services. It is important that the Bill be delivered as soon as possible so that existing cash infrastructure can be protected.

Productivity: Rural Areas

Paul Girvan Excerpts

Wednesday 14th October 2020 Westminster Hall

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

It is a pleasure to take part in this debate under your chairmanship, Ms Ghani. I congratulate the hon. Member for North Cornwall (Scott Mann) on securing this important debate. Some 37% of the Northern Ireland population live in rural areas, so they contribute to a large section of our overall economy. Unfortunately, they are somewhat missed out when it comes to the delivery of public services and public transport, which is also a problem when people go to develop a business in a rural setting. People might need transport for it, but there is no connectivity.

One of our biggest bugbears in Northern Ireland is rural broadband and the difficulties with it for businesses going forward. We have bucked the trend to some degree with businesses such as Randox in my constituency. It is a large employer based in a rural area, but it has also come across the difficulties of planning policy and what I call zoning. Zoning problems do not allow businesses to expand. They are good and developing businesses, but because someone has a wee red box drawn around an area, nothing more can be done. That can reduce the opportunities for a business to expand.

Now a Northern Ireland Executive is in place, we hope for access to the apprenticeship fund. Businesses in Northern Ireland contribute to it, but need to be able to access it to bring forward rural apprenticeships. In my constituency, the Greenmount agricultural college is a leading college for agriculture not only in Northern Ireland but throughout the UK, and we want to support it to bring diversification for farms and those involved in our agrifood industry, which is a major player in rural productivity.

Apprenticeship Levy

Paul Girvan Excerpts

Tuesday 11th February 2020 Westminster Hall

[Richard Graham]

The hon. Lady is absolutely right in one way, but of course a lot has changed relatively recently. Levy employers can now transfer 25% of their levy to other organisations, and the obvious opportunity there is to do it through their supply chain. For example, in a briefing I received from it in November, Tesco said it contributed roughly £20 million a year to the apprenticeship levy but that it is able to spend only about 15% of it, due to the inflexibility of the system. We will come on to the inflexibility of the system, but the key thing is that there is now this opportunity for Tesco to deploy a quarter of its levy, which would be £5 million, to some of the companies in its supply chain, which are typically SMEs. That is incredibly valuable, and I hope it is something that Tesco has taken up.

As a result of the hon. Lady’s question, I hope that other levy employers out there will be more aware of this opportunity. Business West asked a very similar question of the previous Minister with responsibility for apprenticeships:

“What would you advise colleges to do in September if they have gone over their non-Levy allocation and have 16 year olds wanting to start an apprenticeship with a non-Levy employer?”

The previous Minister—the former right hon. Member for Guildford—replied:

“I would approach the larger Levy paying firms in the area…There are lots of Levy payers who have not spent their levy pots.”

That is quite true; the question is whether it is as well-known as it should be. I know of examples from Gloucestershire Engineering Training where our county council and I think another public sector employer have used part of their levy to help an SME to ensure that its apprentice receives the training they need. However, such opportunities are not as widely known about as they should be.

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

I welcome the opportunity to speak on the importance of apprenticeships and the benefits that they bring to our overall economy. However, in Northern Ireland we face a difficulty in that, although firms contribute to the apprenticeship levy, no one has access to it. That came from the absence of an Executive, but now that we have one up and running, I hope we can level the playing field and ensure that we get an opportunity to comment on any new scheme that is introduced.

[Richard Graham]

I think the hon. Member was highlighting the issues faced by some small and medium-sized enterprises. There will be great opportunities through some of the larger manufacturing companies with a turnover of more than £3 million in Northern Ireland. I am thinking particularly of companies such as Thales. They have a wonderful opportunity to use some of the levy to help SMEs. It may just be about publicising those opportunities, both among SMEs and larger employers.

Tourism Industry: VAT Reduction

Paul Girvan Excerpts

Wednesday 21st November 2018 Commons Chamber

[Mel Stride]

The right hon. Gentleman makes a very important point. As somebody who philosophically believes in lower taxes, I think that is a very strong argument. However, unfortunately there is the cost argument. To use the same kind of principles to the right hon. Gentleman’s argument on recycling, clearly if we were bringing in less by way of taxation as a consequence of the reduction, there would be less to spend on other things that arguably might help tourism, including improved infrastructure and maybe even tax reliefs in other areas, such as the progress that we have made in reducing small retailers’ business rates.

We have one of the highest VAT thresholds of any country in both the European Union and the OECD, which is an advantage to us and our tourist sector.

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

We see the reduction in VAT as one of the cards in the deck that can help to grow our economy, and it is vitally important, from a tourism perspective, that we look at that. However, one of the other tools in the box is air passenger duty. We are competing against Dublin because the Republic of Ireland has zero APD. That is not just affecting Northern Ireland—it affects airports throughout the UK because, to save on APD, people are travelling from the UK to Dublin to go on to America. That has an impact not just on Northern Ireland but on airports in the UK.

[Mel Stride]

The hon. Gentleman makes a very important point. In fact, I have been to Northern Ireland and met representatives of Belfast airport and others, and I have met them here in the UK—in London—as well. As he will know, we had a call for evidence on APD, which was launched at the Budget before last, and we have reported back on that. We have now set up a technical working group to see what kinds of opportunities there may be to devolve APD to Northern Ireland, although at the moment there is the critical issue of the absence of a Northern Ireland Executive. In the longer term, we would certainly be committed to seeing the issue devolved, and then of course it would be for the Northern Ireland Executive, once reconstituted and up and running, to take the appropriate decisions around that.

Returning to VAT, we do of course have reduced rates in the United Kingdom in areas like museums and transport such as buses and trains, which is not universally the case across our competitor nations. It is also possible, through the retail export scheme, for certain visitors to the UK to reclaim VAT from certain retailers. That is another important VAT relief.

In essence, the right hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland is right that I was not going to spring up to the Dispatch Box and announce a huge tax cut across the tourism sector, much as I would love to have done. Perhaps in this crazy world in which we are living, I should have done, but there we are—I did not. I restrained myself and was responsible, for once. However, I absolutely reassure him that everything that he has said on this matter this evening, and indeed has said in the past and will say in future, has been and will be very carefully noted. We will continue to look at all taxes, and certainly VAT. I look forward to further engagement with him in the coming weeks and months, and thank him very much indeed for bringing this important debate to the House.

Question put and agreed to.

Finance (No. 3) Bill

Paul Girvan Excerpts

Committee: 2nd sitting: House of Commons
Tuesday 20th November 2018 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon]

I thought the hon. Member for Torbay (Kevin Foster) was going to go before me, but he has not bobbed, so he is obviously not going to. I always follow in his footsteps—I am always glad to do so, by the way, as he knows—but on this occasion I miss his comments, which I am sure would be more than helpful to us.

We are all very aware of the reason for these amendments. It is tremendous to be in the Chamber among many Members from across the House who are of the same opinion, including—he will forgive me if I say this, but I have to say it—perhaps a wee bit belatedly, the Minister, who is also committed to where we are on this.

If she does not mind my saying so, I would like to commend the hon. Member for Chatham and Aylesford (Tracey Crouch) for her principled stand, her courage and what she has done to make this happen. The commitment she has shown does my heart good and does the heart of everybody else good. By the way, I am not surprised that she said 3,000 people had contacted her afterwards. I did not have 3,000 people contact me afterwards, but I had a large number and, for the record, every one of them commended the hon. Lady for her obvious commitment. The reason for the amendment is simple: the need for a massive lowering of stakes is clear.

I also thank my good friend, the hon. Member for Swansea East (Carolyn Harris), for all her endeavours through the all-party group on FOBTs, which has done tremendous work. The right hon. Member for Chingford and Woodford Green (Mr Duncan Smith) and the hon. Member for Inverclyde (Ronnie Cowan) have also endeavoured, through the APPG, to ensure all that hard work came to fruition.

The one thing that sits in my mind is this: why was it important to have those six months slip back from October to April? It is very simple: as has been said, 300 lives—maybe more—were saved. That is a fact.

I am mindful that last week we had the Gambling with Lives event, which the hon. Member for Sheffield Central (Paul Blomfield) referred to. I thank him for initiating that event. I was very glad to be there with other Members and to support him. There were two people there who I knew long before the start of this FOBT campaign, which began about 18 months or two years ago. They are Mr and Mrs Peter Keogh from Enniskillen, who lost their son, Lewis, to a gambling addiction and who even today feel the heartache of that event.

It is for those people that we do these things. It is for our constituents whose lives will be saved because of it, and for those who have lost loved ones and feel the great pain of the loss of someone close to them, that today we can collectively make this legislative change in this House. That is why we make the effort.

The Government accept that they need to lower the stakes; they accept that damage has been done to individuals and families; they accept the fact that the ability to bet as much as £100 every 20 seconds on electronic casino games such as roulette is shocking; and they accept the campaign by anti-gambling campaigners that highlights the fact that machines let people lose money too quickly, leading to addiction and social, mental and financial problems.

The Minister responded to the previous speaker, the hon. Member for North Ayrshire and Arran (Patricia Gibson), about things we must address, including online gambling and how it is promoted on TV. At this early stage, I would also like to put down a marker about scratchcards. I was just telling a story to my hon. Friend the Member for South Antrim (Paul Girvan). One day, I saw a lady with two children in a shop. She probably did not have £5 to spare. She was ahead of me in the queue and she put down £5. I was not being nosy, but her wallet probably only had two fivers in it, yet she spent £5 on scratchcards. She went outside to rub the numbers off them and by the time I went outside I saw that not one of the cards was successful.

I thought to myself, “How very sad.” That lady was probably looking at her financial needs for that week being provided by the turn of a scratchcard, which did not deliver. Other things need to be done, but I look forward to the things that the Minister referred to in his intervention on the hon. Lady.

Those arguments had all been accepted, but rather than looking at the human cost it appears that the Government wished to shore up the finances and allow thousands more people to gamble everything away. The situation is like cancer research finding a cure to cancer and the NHS saying, “Well, we have all the chemotherapy, which needs to be used, so we won’t pay for the life-saving drugs until stocks are down. We can’t afford to do this.” That is horrific. I say to the Minister, with respect, that the more I see of this Government's ability to put blinkers on and look only at one aspect—the pounds and the pence—rather than at the entire argument about the need to lower stakes, the more disheartened I become.

The Salvation Army, which deals with the problems that gambling brings to the community, has said:

“It is well acknowledged that FOBTs have caused concern across the political and social spectrum. FOBTs have been labelled the ‘crack cocaine’ of gambling. One gambler told us that he spent £2,000 a day on FOBTs at bookies without being challenged.”

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

I appreciate my hon. Friend’s reference to the Salvation Army. One of the other issues that I have major concerns about—I wonder whether my hon. Friend agrees—is the accounts of people being given a line of credit of £1,500 without any credit checks on their ability to pay it back. People have been given a £1,500 line of credit and unfortunately it ends up being a potential noose—and I mean that—around their neck. That problem is arising and it is caused by those who do not do checks. Any other financial industry would do checks to ensure the person had the ability to pay the money back.

[Jim Shannon]

I thank my hon. Friend for his wise intervention.

The Salvation Army also says:

“Another man who became homeless as a result of his addiction and who was helped by the Salvation Army lost over £30,000 on gambling machines.”

I do not think that there is one Member in this Chamber who would not be able to recollect a story of this kind from their constituencies. It is the story of the man who plays on a FOBT machine on a Friday night and puts all his wages on it, before going home to his wife, who is looking for the money to buy the groceries, and their children. Those are the stories of real life; those are the stories of addiction; and those are the stories that we want to stop in this Chamber today.

That is why we are keen for the Government to implement as soon as practicable the proposed maximum stake limit of £2 for FOBTs. It is of some concern that in the Budget the timeframe for implementation was to have been delayed to October 2019. We note that some campaigners said it would be possible to implement it in April 2019 and that the Government have acceded to that. That apparent delay was deeply disappointing. The right hon. Member for Chingford and Woodford Green referred to the amendment with over 100 Members’ names on it. What changed the Government’s opinion was those 100 names from across the Chamber. I am very pleased that we have achieved that change.

I agree with the change and I ask the Government simply to do the right thing. They seem to have been held to ransom by the gaming industry. Therefore, it should not have surprised me to see how the EU—I use this comparison; I am sure many Members will understand it—has held this proud nation of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland to ransom, and how our Government have capitulated at the cost not of £400 million, the estimated lost tax revenue, but £39 billion, and, most importantly, the sovereignty of Northern Ireland and the sanctity of the Union.

You may not believe that the two are linked, Dame Eleanor, but they are. You may not believe that that should be mentioned in this debate, but it has been. The Government’s decision making is as flawed here as it is in selling Northern Ireland and the backstop. Do the right thing, stop allowing gambling addictions to destroy families and protect people from themselves, in the same way that people must wear a seatbelt whether they want to or not. Step in and step up. I support the amendment and I look forward to working with hon. Members to do even more in this Chamber to address gambling addiction in the years to come.

Amendment 16 agreed to.

Clause 61

Remote Gaming Duty: Rate

Amendment made: 17, page 44, line 25, leave out “1 October 2019” and insert “1 April 2019”.—(Gareth Johnson.)

This amendment is consequential on Amendment 16.

Clause 61, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clause 62 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Schedule 18 agreed to.

New Clause 12

Review of public health effects of gaming provisions

“(1) The Chancellor of the Exchequer must review the public health effects of the provisions of section 61 of and Schedule 18 to this Act and lay a report of that review before the House of Commons within six months of the passing of this Act.

(2) A review under this section must consider—

(a) the effects of those provisions in reducing the negative public health effects of gambling, and

(b) the implications for the public finances of the public health effects of—

(i) those provisions,

(ii) the operation of the law relating to remote gaming duty and gaming duty if those provisions were not given effect.”—(Ronnie Cowan.)

This new clause would require a review of the public health effects of gaming provisions.

Brought up, read the First and Second time, and added to the Bill.

Clause 15

Offshore Receipts in Respect of Intangible Property

Question proposed, That the clause stand part of the Bill.

Leaving the EU: Customs Arrangements

Paul Girvan Excerpts

Tuesday 10th July 2018 Westminster Hall

[Kirsty Blackman (Aberdeen North) (SNP)]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Stephen Hammond]

A panoply of choice! I will give way to the hon. Lady and then the hon. Gentleman.

[Stephen Hammond]

As I have said several times, we do not know the detail, but we should welcome three things: first, that there is a plan, because we are a long way into the process; secondly, that it attempts to put in place a UK-EU free trade area; and thirdly, that there is a common rulebook. As I explained earlier, we cannot just solve the customs part; we need to solve the standards issue as well, because if we do not, we will not be able to trade the products that we want to trade even if we have the best customs arrangements.

None of us has yet seen any of the detail. Some of us will cautiously welcome the plan as a starting point for establishing a free trade area, and some of us will be a bit more positive. We have not yet seen the reaction from others, but I hope they realise that it is an opening offer from the Government that needs to be looked at sensibly.

[Paul Girvan]

This is a two-way traffic issue and there needs to be flexibility from Europe as well. The UK Government have made some movement in relation to what happened at Chequers and in showing willingness to accommodate, but that needs to be reciprocated by Europe. They can allow us to have that access to the open market in Europe.

[Stephen Hammond]

The hon. Gentleman is right, but I say to him, and I am sure that he will accept it, that until we actually put a proposition down to negotiate with, there was nothing to negotiate with. Until the Chequers proposal, it might well have been said by a number of our soon-to-be former EU partners that there actually was not a deal to negotiate on. There were the Prime Minister’s principles: no hard border in Ireland, frictionless trade and the ability to do free trade deals. Those are principles and there is nothing wrong with those principles, but they were not an executable plan. Until they were an executable plan, there was nothing to negotiate on.

Fuel Laundering

Paul Girvan Excerpts

Tuesday 22nd May 2018 Commons Chamber

[Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP)]

I want to draw the House’s attention to a serious problem on a serious scale. It is a problem run by organised crime gangs across our country, yet it appears to many that the Government are lackadaisical or so distracted by other matters that they are not that concerned by it. I want to address the issue of Government concern—they ought to be concerned—as this crime is costing the Treasury hundreds of millions of pounds, so much so that, by a modest calculation, every 10 years the sums the Government could recover would make the Conservative and Democratic Unionist party confidence and supply agreement moneys cost neutral. The Government should consider that when dealing with this issue.

[Paul Girvan (South Antrim) (DUP)]

I wish to raise an area of major concern, which is the position of road hauliers, particularly those in Northern Ireland, who are missing out because they are having to compete against those who are dealing in smuggled fuel and are, thus, unable to compete on a level playing field. Most of the moneys being derived from this are going into the pockets of paramilitaries.

[Ian Paisley]

I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention. The Government’s very conservative estimate of what this crime amounts to is largely down to the lack of resources being directed at tackling it, as measured by the small amount of arrests and convictions, and to the fact that the current Government strategy of markers has failed because the markers do not work as well as the Government pretend. As it is Northern Ireland’s problem, it is often regarded as a problem that is out of sight and out of mind. However, the facts available to me indicate that it is fast becoming a UK mainland problem.