Term-time Leave

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Monday 26th October 2015 Westminster Hall

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to serve for the first time in a debate under your chairmanship, Mr Hanson. This has been a lively, interesting, timely and useful debate. First, I thank the campaigners and petitioners whose efforts led to this debate in Westminster Hall today. People feel passionately about this issue, and it is right and proper that we spend time thinking through how best to respond to the heartfelt concerns of people who feel that the current Government’s policy on term-time holidays has been detrimental to their family life or their relationship with their children’s school.

I know from personal experience of running a college that there is a strong relationship between attendance and achievement. That is why education maintenance allowances were so transformational in impacting on students’ performance; they incentivised attendance and thereby transformed attainment. It should go without saying that all children should aim for 100% attendance and that any absence from school is to be regretted and therefore discouraged. That is why I applaud all those children up and down the land who are achieving high levels of attendance and why headteachers and their teams should be congratulated on the work that they do day in, day out to encourage and celebrate high levels of attendance.

However, this is not a simple issue. Would that it were. It is rather complicated. That is why it is helpful that we are having this debate today. A pretty tough approach to attendance was in place up to September 2013. That gave headteachers the discretion to allow up to 10 days’ absence from school if they felt that the circumstances warranted it. I have not seen any evidence to demonstrate that headteachers were failing to use that discretion effectively. After all, headteachers are pretty hard-headed individuals who are well aware of the relationship between attendance and achievement. They know the families and parents of their pupils better than any Secretary of State and are capable of using discretion sensibly. They are accountable to their communities through published results and Ofsted inspections. It is not in their interests to abuse the discretion entrusted to them. The hon. Member for North Cornwall (Scott Mann) was right to underline in his contribution the importance of headteachers in this decision-making process.

There was a very useful and interesting exchange between the hon. Members for Central Suffolk and North Ipswich (Dr Poulter) and for Southport (John Pugh) on the relationship between types of absence and impacts on achievement—how the impact on achievement depends on the type of absence. The hon. Member for Central Suffolk and North Ipswich is undoubtedly right to say that there is a relationship between longer periods of absence and an impact on performance. However, the hon. Member for Southport was right to remind us of the evidence published by the Department for Education in 2011. That analysis of performance at key stage 2 concluded that the likelihood of pupils achieving the expected key stage 2 level differs greatly not only according to the amount of absence accrued, but according to the different reasons behind the absences. The proportions of pupils achieving the expected level stay relatively similar for increasing levels of absence due to authorised family holidays, religious observances and study leave. However, long-term absences due to exclusions or illnesses tend to be associated with significantly lower proportions of pupils achieving the expected level.

The policy existing up to 2013 appears to have changed, as the hon. Member for North Devon (Peter Heaton-Jones) said in his helpful contribution, after work by the Government’s expert adviser on behaviour in his review of attendance. However, that review looks primarily into the issues around serious and persistent absence, does not appear to have drawn on evidence from parents or children themselves and contains no reference to academic sources.

The hon. Member for St Austell and Newquay (Steve Double), whom I commend for getting the debate off to a very good start, made the telling point that when the statutory instrument was considered, the impact assessment basically said that there was no impact, although we have heard in contributions by hon. Members from across the House and particularly from St Ives and other parts of Cornwall and Devon that there is a clear impact that they can observe in their communities and that information on that has been shared with them.

I first became aware of the change in policy and the difficulties that the change was causing when I was contacted by a local primary school headteacher who was concerned about a letter that she had received from North Lincolnshire Council stipulating the following:

“The amendments from this month make it clear that head teachers may not grant any leave of absence during term time unless there are exceptional circumstances. Unfortunately, there is no definition, nor are there any examples provided, in relation to exceptional circumstances. However, the word ‘exceptional’ would imply that leave in term time should be granted only on rare occasions where the head teacher believes this is justified.”

I took the matter up with the then Under-Secretary at the DFE who is now the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs. She wrote back to me to say:

“We changed the regulations because it was necessary that we addressed the widespread misconception about term time holidays. Over the years, some schools and parents interpreted the previous law to mean that parents were entitled to two weeks holiday during term time. This led to some pressure on headteachers to grant holidays during term time. This led to some parents booking holidays when it was convenient and putting pressure on headteachers to grant their request to take their children out of school. There was never an entitlement for parents to take their children out of school during term for a holiday, and this has always been at the discretion of the headteacher.”

The hon. Member for Mid Worcestershire (Nigel Huddleston) was right to underline the fact that there should never be any sense of entitlement to time off. Of course that would be completely wrong. However, I have never picked up from headteachers that there was ever any sense of that under the previous regulations; nor have I seen any evidence to support the contention in this letter, which goes on to say:

“Headteachers will retain this discretion to grant leave, but they may only do so in exceptional circumstances. Headteachers must consider each request on its own merits.”

Everything hinges on the interpretation of “exceptional”. Is it exceptional, if parents work in industries in which access to holiday is severely limited—as we have heard, that is the case in the tourism industry in Cornwall and Devon, for example—and does not match the child’s holiday time, for the child to miss some school time to access a family holiday? Is it exceptional to attend the funeral of a family member? Is it exceptional to attend a family wedding? We could go on asking such questions ad nauseam. The Minister is smiling; I am sure that he has thought of even more questions.

It is clear to me that no headteacher worth their salt would encourage children to take time off—quite the opposite. Such a headteacher knows the relationship between attendance and achievement and wants all their children to achieve 100% attendance. The change in rules has meant that headteachers have less discretion than they had, however, and they were initially less confident about how to apply the changed regulations. That has led to an increase in situations in which headteachers and parents have come into conflict, as we all know from our postbags. In some circumstances, it may well have resulted in families being unable to respond to a family situation as constructively as they would have wished. In other circumstances, it has clearly resulted in a rise in truancy with parental support, which is a very bad thing.

Among the 98 councils that responded to a recent survey about the number of fixed penalty notices issued, there has been a rise from 32,512 in 2012-13 to 62,204 in 2013-14 to even more last year. These statistics are of concern, because they represent a growing problem with school attendance that needs to be addressed. Parents being lured into thinking of going on holidays in term time for no other reason than the availability of better deals from holiday companies does not represent a good reason for a headteacher to use any discretion they have, and it is certainly not exceptional circumstances. Any request from parents to take advantage of cheap deals should be firmly rejected under whatever regulations are in place. However, some scrutiny should fall on holiday companies, as hon. Members have said strongly during the debate, to encourage them to look again at their pricing mechanisms. They should not be, inadvertently or otherwise, encouraging truancy.

Schools, parents and children themselves want children to achieve their very best. All the evidence shows a strong relationship between attendance and achievement, but the subject is complex. As the hon. Member for Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock (Corri Wilson) emphasised in her perceptive contribution, real people lead complicated lives with complicated relationships. Headteachers need the discretion to use their knowledge of children, families and parents to make the right decisions to maximise achievement while supporting families.

Given the high level of concern expressed in the petition and echoed in the debate, it would be helpful if the Education Committee—I saw its Chair, the hon. Member for Stroud (Neil Carmichael), here earlier in the debate—were to undertake a thorough inquiry into the evidence on attendance policy. The Committee could look at how the policy operated prior to September 2013, and at the impact of the changes that were made at that time. As my hon. Friend the Member for Great Grimsby (Melanie Onn) pointed out, the National Association of Head Teachers surveyed its members on the matter, 90% of whom said that they would welcome more detailed guidance from Government on what constitutes exceptional circumstances. Is the Minister considering developing and issuing such guidance? Does he agree that the recent decision by magistrates has driven a coach and horses through the Government’s approach to term-time holidays and school absence? What conclusions does the Minister draw from that, and what action will he take to remedy the situation?

Finally, we all know how important family holidays are, and it is invidious that price hikes during the school holidays make family holidays unaffordable for many. What has the Minister got to say to holiday companies who put parents in such a difficult position by hiking up prices by thousands of pounds, as we have heard in the debate, during the school holidays?

[The Minister for Schools (Mr Nick Gibb)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship for the very first time, Mr Hanson. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for St Austell and Newquay (Steve Double) on securing this debate on a subject that is close to his heart. We met in July to discuss these very issues. I also thank the Family Holiday Association and the Parents Union for their briefing on the matter.

I am pleased that this debate gives me the opportunity to set out the Government’s position and to hear other colleagues’ views. We have had an interesting debate, with powerful speeches from my hon. Friends who represent some of the most beautiful parts of the country, including my hon. Friends the Members for Chippenham (Michelle Donelan), for Mid Worcestershire (Nigel Huddleston), for North Cornwall (Scott Mann), for North Devon (Peter Heaton-Jones), for Central Suffolk and North Ipswich (Dr Poulter) and for Stroud (Neil Carmichael). We also heard from the hon. Member for Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock (Corri Wilson).

We are talking about an important issue. It is part of our objective of pursuing social justice. All our education reforms are about social justice and about ensuring that every child, whatever their background, benefits from an excellent education, so that they have a chance to succeed in the modern and demanding economy that Britain has become. That is what our behaviour policy is all about. It is what our reforms to the curriculum are all about. It is what our focus on phonics in the early teaching of reading in primary school is all about. It is what ensuring that all children, regardless of their background and regardless of geography, attend school regularly is all about.

I listened carefully to the argument made by my hon. Friend the Member for St Austell and Newquay about the impact on the tourism industry in Cornwall of our objective of ensuring that all children attend school regularly. I want to start by clarifying what the 2013 regulatory changes actually change. There is a widespread misunderstanding that before 2013, parents were entitled to take their children out of school for a holiday. That was not the case, and it never has been. The amendments to the law in 2013 simply clarify the position. Previously, as the hon. Member for Scunthorpe (Nic Dakin) has said, headteachers were able to grant leave for the purpose of family holiday in “special circumstances” for up to 10 school days per year, and longer in other circumstances. That was, however, being interpreted as a right to take two weeks off every year, which has never been the case. We wanted to clarify the legal position to make it clear that it is not the case that every person has a right to take their child out of school on a term-time holiday. Even before 2013, it was not the case.

I understand that in some areas of the country with seasonal industries, whether agriculture, horticulture or tourism, there are particular challenges. We are currently reforming education in this country to create a school-led system, so that decisions can be made close to home, reflecting local needs. Therefore, schools and local authorities in the south-west have a clear role to play in supporting the tourism industry, without compromising children’s attendance at school.

If parents and schools want different term dates, we encourage them to discuss that with their local authority. Academies, foundation schools, voluntary-aided schools and foundation special schools can, even now, set their own term dates. As of January 2014, some 76% of secondary schools and 35% of primary schools, educating some 52% of all registered pupils, already had responsibility for their own term and holiday dates. That does not have to involve massive restructuring. This year, schools in Reading returned for the autumn term on 8 September, and next year they will close for the summer holiday on 26 July. Similarly, the David Young community academy in Leeds operates seven terms, or blocks. That enables parents to take their children on holiday outside the expensive peak holiday season. Although it is at an early stage, another example of innovation is Visit Cornwall’s development of a proposal for a family enrichment week for early years and primary schools in the spring of each year. It strikes me that Cornwall provides a perfect example of a situation where the local industry should prompt schools and local authorities to change their term dates so that families who work in the tourism industry can take their own holidays outside of the peak season. These examples show that measures can be taken to address the needs of a local tourism industry, while ensuring that children stay in school.

Keeping children in school is crucial for achieving our aim of educational excellence everywhere. Evidence shows that pupils with no absence from school during key stage 2—in primary school—are over four and a half times more likely to reach level 5 or above at the end of primary school than pupils who missed 15% to 20% of school time. The outcomes are similar at key stage 4, where pupils with no absence are nearly three times more likely to achieve five A to C grades in their GCSEs, including English and maths, and around 10 times more likely to achieve the English baccalaureate range of GCSEs than pupils missing between 15% and 20% of school time across key stage 4.

When evidence attests to the benefits of good school attendance so clearly, parents have a duty to ensure that their children attend school regularly. No one in the Department for Education says that holidays are not enriching experiences—of course they are—but schools are in session for 190 out of 365 days a year, leaving 175 days in a year in which parents can take their children away on holiday.

My hon. Friend the Member for North Cornwall made a thoughtful speech. I listened carefully to what he said, but I do not accept that two weeks in each year of a child’s education is a drop in the ocean. As my hon. Friend the Member for Central Suffolk and North Ipswich pointed out, even one week away from school in a year can make a significant difference. Some 44% of pupils with no absence achieve the English baccalaureate range of GCSEs, but the figure falls by a quarter to just 31.7% for pupils who miss up to 14 days of lessons over the two years in which they study for their GCSEs. My hon. Friend the Member for North Devon quoted Charlie Taylor, the Government’s expert adviser on behaviour. In his 2012 report “Improving attendance at school”, Charlie Taylor calculated that if children are taken away for a two-week holiday during term time every year and have an average number of days off for sickness and appointments, by the time they leave school at 16 they will have missed a year of school. It is for that reason that I cannot support the request set out in the petition.

My hon. Friend the Member for North Devon said that no parent would use the two weeks of flexible term-time holidays every year, but he cannot guarantee that. We have heard powerful arguments about how important it is for parents to be able to take their children out of school; those arguments apply each and every year to all the pupils that that argument is deemed to affect. Instead, I encourage headteachers to use every measure they can to ensure that children attend school. Charlie Taylor found that the best schools work with parents to improve attendance and offer a wide range of support to help parents to get their children to school. If that is not successful, headteachers can, as a last resort, issue parents with a penalty notice or take them to court.

Criminal prosecution can result in fines of up to £2,500 and possible imprisonment. In 2012-13, about 52,000 penalty notices were issued. The number of prosecutions also increased in that period, but these measures have resulted in significant progress in reducing absence. Now 200,000 fewer pupils regularly miss school compared with five years ago—down from 433,100 in 2010. Overall, the absence rate is down from 6% in 2009 to 4.4% in the 2013-14 academic year, which means that 14.5 million fewer school days were lost to overall absence as a result of the combination of policies that we have introduced over the past five years. Some 3 million school days are lost due to holidays, and that figure is down significantly; 2.3 million more teaching days are happening as a result of clamping down on unauthorised term-time holidays. We should be proud of that if we believe that every child should have the opportunity of a first-rate start in life.

Headteachers continue to have discretion to approve term-time leave, but should only do so in exceptional circumstances. Many of my hon. Friends, including my hon. Friend the Member for St Ives (Derek Thomas), have called for more guidance. The National Association of Head Teachers published guidance in October, which made it clear that:

“If an event can reasonably be scheduled outside of term time then it would not be normal to authorise absence.”

It went on to say that children may need time away from school to visit a seriously ill relative or to attend the funeral service of a family member. However, term-time holidays and visiting family members abroad are not considered by the NAHT to be exceptional circumstances and it says that they should be scheduled only for holiday periods or outside of school hours.

My hon. Friend the Member for Chippenham raised the example of a family going through very difficult circumstances and wanting time off as a family, a request that was refused by the school. The NAHT guidance says:

“Absences to visit family members are also not normally granted during term time if they could be scheduled for holiday periods or outside school hours. Children may however need time to visit seriously ill relatives.”

[Nic Dakin]

I just want to check whether the Minister is commending the NAHT guidance to headteachers as a point of reference? He is drawing good attention to it.

[Mr Gibb]

Yes. The whole essence of our education reforms is to hand back more power to the teaching profession. It makes absolute sense for teachers and headteachers to rely on the guidance produced by the NAHT. The introduction to the guidance states:

“Term times are for education. This is the priority. Children and families have 175 days off school to spend time together, including weekends and school holidays.”

That is the NAHT’s view and we think that it is correct.

Oral Answers to Questions

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Monday 26th October 2015 Commons Chamber

[Nicky Morgan]

I know that petitions and signatures are being collected up and down the country, as in my Leicestershire constituency, where fair funding is also a huge issue. I can assure my hon. Friend that I am extremely aware of these issues, as are Ministers across Government.

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

The Institute for Fiscal Studies has shown that for the first time since the mid-’90s school spending per pupil will fall in real terms. Those in further education and early years already fear huge cuts. Will the Secretary of State assure this House that any increases in funding in one area of her budget will not be at the further expense of others?

[Nicky Morgan]

The hon. Gentleman will know that I cannot give any predictions about the forthcoming spending review until all the negotiations and discussion with the Treasury are concluded, but of course the issues of fairer funding that we have been discussing are a very important part of responding to the pressures on schools budgets across the country.

Fire Safety: School Buildings

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Thursday 22nd October 2015 Westminster Hall

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

Thank you, Mrs Gillan. I am sure that we will both bear that in mind. It is a real pleasure to serve under your chairmanship.

The redoubtable hon. Member for Southend West (Sir David Amess) said that he would not shut up on the subject that we are debating and that he was puzzled that the solutions to the problem, which are so simple, have not been seized by the Government. He is nothing if not consistent. In February 2014, he remarked in a debate on the subject that

“since the programme of introducing sprinklers into new school buildings, there has been a marked reduction in school fire losses—something I am sure we all welcome and wish to continue. Recently, however, there has been a decrease in the number of new schools built with sprinkler protection”—

a point he made again very well—

“and that is not good enough.”

He used similar language today. He continued:

“It gives the impression that protecting our children’s education from fire damage is no longer a top priority. I am absolutely certain that the Government whom I support”—

he reminded us today of his support for the Government—

“would not want to give that impression. Alternatives are being sought, because sprinklers are no longer considered to be mandatory, and developers are avoiding them to save money in the short term. That, however,”

he said, with precision and aplomb,

“is foolish in the longer term, and playing with our children’s future is simply not acceptable.”—[Official Report, Westminster Hall, 6 February 2014; Vol. 575, c. 170WH.]

He has done an excellent job of reminding us of all those points.

The hon. Gentleman was ably supported by the hon. Member for Eastbourne (Caroline Ansell), who spoke of the desperate energy, power and awfulness of a fire, and gave several examples from her constituency. She reminded us, with reference to the fire in her constituency, of the disruption that a fire causes to young people’s learning, and how it forces a head teacher to focus on things such as dealing with insurance agents and contractors while somehow maintaining the continuity of learning. The hon. Member for Rutherglen and Hamilton West (Margaret Ferrier), who speaks on behalf of the Scottish National party, captured that well when she said that “fitting sprinklers can save money” and that to do so in the first place can be, essentially, a stitch in time to save nine.

The hon. Member for Rutherglen and Hamilton West pointed out that we should not have a “safety lottery”. Sadly, as the hon. Member for Southend West has pointed out, we are closer to being in that situation than we have been in the past. In 2007, cross-party agreement in favour of installing sprinklers in schools was strong, and there was a significant increase in the number of sprinkler systems installed in schools through Building Schools for the Future. The hon. Gentleman is right to say that there was a 70% achievement level; that might not be good enough, but it is better than what has happened since 2010. That is why it is important to focus on what can be done to get the show back on the road.

Regarding the blaze at Shinewater primary school in Eastbourne, which has been mentioned, the chairman of East Sussex fire authority said:

“Sprinklers can significantly help reduce death and injury from fire, reduce risk for firefighters, protect property and heritage and reduce the effects of arson. The greatest impact of installing fire sprinklers is likely to occur in schools, residential care homes, premises housing highly vulnerable residents and certain large commercial properties.”

That is a fire professional’s view, and it concurs with the views of hon. Members who have spoken in the debate. Sadly, every week in the United Kingdom, 20 schools are damaged or destroyed by fire, often as a result of fires that are started deliberately. The number of major school fires has been rising, and that creates significant cost. All the research demonstrates that fitting sprinklers can virtually eliminate fire deaths and injuries. As someone who, at one point in my past, was involved in planning to build a new college, I know that the cost of sprinkler systems can make anyone in that position take a deep breath, so it is important to look at the longer-term benefit.

For that reason, I hope that the Minister, in responding to this effective debate, will focus on the questions that have been asked and give us some assurance that lessons will be learned. Will he review the lessons to be learned from what has happened since 2010? There seems to have been an improvement in performance between 2007 and 2010, but it did not continue after 2010. If a review is not already in place, will he look to establish one so that we can learn from those lessons? Will he ensure that proper consideration is given to installing sprinklers in new build schools? We note that that is mandatory in Scotland and Wales, and the arguments on that matter have been strongly made. Proper and full consideration, which involves the local fire authorities, needs to be given to that. Will the Minister ensure that local authorities collect information on which schools in their area have sprinkler systems, so that that intelligence can help to drive policy? On that note, and noting your earlier encouragement, Mrs Gillan, I will sit down.

Oral Answers to Questions

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Monday 20th July 2015 Commons Chamber

[Mr Gyimah]

Supporting local authorities to deliver sufficient places is one of this Government’s top priorities. Dudley local authority has been allocated £8.9 million of basic need funding for the period 2015-18. This will help to create the places required.

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

Surely a review of provision in an area ought to include all provision in that area, so why, in their publication “Reviewing post-16 Education and Training Institutions”, are the Government not including all provision, such as schools, UTCs and so on?

[Nick Boles]

I welcome the chance to clarify that regional schools commissioners—they are of course responsible for all schools, sixth forms and UTCs—will be involved with and invited to area reviews of post-16 education provision.

Vocational Qualifications Day

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Tuesday 9th June 2015 Westminster Hall

[Neil Carmichael]

I thank the hon. Lady for that intervention. My hon. Friend the Minister will have heard it—indeed, he is writing a note about it. Obviously, all areas of education have an interest in fair funding and more funding, but there is a cake and we have to slice it up in a sensible way. We will be having that debate throughout this Parliament.

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

I congratulate the hon. Gentleman on initiating this very important debate, but let me press him further on funding. Although further education colleges are in the vanguard of providing vocational qualifications, they have had to suffer, in addition to the cut in February that my hon. Friend the Member for Stretford and Urmston (Kate Green) mentioned, an in-year cut of £450 million in post-16 funding and another £450 million cut in FE and higher education funding—in-year and retrospective—for which they have not planned, so however brilliant they are, these are challenging times for vocational education.

[Neil Carmichael]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that intervention and for appreciating my success in securing the debate. The key point is really the one that I made to the hon. Member for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman). There are opportunities for FE colleges, working with business and working in their communities, to develop novel and interesting ideas about getting funding from sources other than the ones that hon. Members are talking about. That is what we should be thinking about, and I will articulate more thoughts about it as I progress through my speech.

--- Later in debate ---

[Neil Carmichael]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that intervention. I am a firm proponent and supporter of the FE sector. I have been a governor of two or three colleges and have worked hard for the success of them all, so hon. Members can be sure that for anything that happens about the FE sector, I will be there, fighting its corner.

In short, what we are hoping to do and should be doing is celebrate achievement and promote aspiration through vocational qualifications. That is a good strapline for this debate. Our purpose is essentially to enable people to fulfil their lives. That is a very important thing in the structure of my political beliefs. I want people from all walks of life and all places to be able to fulfil their lives, and they will do that through satisfying and rewarding work, which in many ways comes from good vocational training and qualifications.

Our purpose is also to ensure that we can create an economy that is full of opportunity, responsive and modern, and I think that that is completely in line with vocational qualifications and the whole framework around them.

Thirdly, we must ensure that our economy has the skills that it needs—the appropriate pools of skills in all the big sectors. For instance, in engineering, we will still need 83,000 new engineers each year to keep the show on the road, and many of them will be individuals with vocational qualifications. However, this is not just about engineering; the world of construction is just as thirsty for these kinds of qualification. That is an essential part of this debate.

We need an education system that is adaptive, responsive and aware of the changing framework in the world of work and in society. Our working patterns have changed, our aspirations are greater and our attitude to work is different, because we expect to find more opportunities, to advance in our careers and to change careers from time to time. That difference is reflected in our society as well, because we want our families to be able to develop their careers.

[Nic Dakin]

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that careers advice is crucial, and that it is unfortunate that even today, 63% of young people, when asked, can name A-levels but cannot name any vocational qualifications? That shows the distance that we need to travel to achieve the parity of esteem that we need if vocational qualifications are to deliver in the way in which he indicates, quite rightly, that we need them to.

[Neil Carmichael]

I will go on to address that issue, but I am glad that the hon. Gentleman has touched on it. As I will say in a few moments, we need to make it clear that it is not just A-levels that people need for future employment; there are a whole range of other possibilities.

We need to reinvigorate practical learning. We all know that that happened in the past and still happens now, but it must happen more. We need more specialist schools in the 14 to 18 sector to address the skills shortages—I have already alluded to some—that various sectors have identified. University technical colleges are part of that, but there are other ways of providing such schools, which have a relationship with the business world and the community, and which can run appropriate activities. We should be encouraging that.

I support a baccalaureate to recognise young people’s achievements up to the age of 18. That is in line with what the hon. Member for Scunthorpe (Nic Dakin) has said. A baccalaureate is the right way to demonstrate that huge achievement has been notched up through vocational qualifications, and I want to put that firmly on the agenda.

We have to work hard at bringing together the world of education and the world of business, the professions and employment in general. That is important not only for education, but for employers and organisations that might extend some form of training. Unless the interface between those sectors and organisations is improved, opportunities will constantly be missed because schools produce one kind of output and businesses require another.

I have come across that problem in my constituency, and I tackled it by setting up the Festival of Manufacturing and Engineering. One in every four jobs in my constituency is connected to manufacturing and engineering, but when I first went around the schools, I did not get the sense that they understood that at all. I felt that they were quite unaware of the appetite for skills in electronics, in certain aspects of the automotive sector and in aviation, so I got schools and businesses to work together and we came up with the Festival of Manufacturing and Engineering. It is held every year, and it really brings young people into the world of work. It ensures that schools understand what kind of job opportunities are coming along, and it underlines the need for vocational qualifications. We should recognise the importance of bringing those sectors together.

We have talked a bit about further education, and I want to underline its importance. Right now, 3 million students are being equipped with valuable employment skills. That is a huge chunk of our young people, and it demonstrates the large footprint that the further education sector has in the matter. We need to recognise that the FE sector has a role to play. In my patch, as I have mentioned, a really good college has seen the strategic advantage of merging with another, and it is now able to produce a whole range of useful courses and training opportunities for young people and for adults who seek to change their direction of travel.

In fact, the arrangement is now so successful that we are going to have a new training centre at a disused—but properly maintained—nuclear power station. It will be known as Berkeley Green, and it will provide training opportunities for people who are interested in renewable energy, nuclear energy, manufacturing and other activities. That huge investment has been made because the college understands that there is a huge requirement for such skills in my constituency. That has led to another investment in a university technical college to ensure that advanced manufacturing opportunities are being offered and places are being filled by people who are properly trained, as we would expect them to be, at a UTC.

--- Later in debate ---

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to speak briefly in support of this debate. We should all seize the opportunity to celebrate vocational qualifications, and it is good that we are doing so today. Vocational qualifications play a huge part in the mix of qualifications that young people and older people gain throughout their lifelong learning and development. I was a co-ordinator for the Technical and Vocational Education Initiative back in the 1980s, and I know well that vocational education is a holy grail that politicians, academics, practitioners, the general public, parents, businesses and industry have been working towards for many years.

This is not a quick fix, but we must ensure that we take full advantage of this day that celebrates vocational qualifications. Further education colleges, along with other institutions, are the fulcrum of ensuring that things happen in that space. My local FE college, North Lindsey College, does an excellent job of bringing together the worlds of work and study, because it has a pivotal role in the local community. The college has lots of links with local companies and businesses, and students of all ages come to work and study at its various premises. Further education is a key partner, and it needs to be backed and supported. I illustrate that with a local example: the work that North Lindsey College is doing with Bradbury Security on Youth Engineering Scunthorpe, a scheme that gives people who have been out of work for some time an opportunity to come back into it, doing work that would otherwise not exist. That work is not displacing jobs that would otherwise be taken by other people; these are new jobs. The scheme is onshoring jobs that Bradbury Security previously delivered from China. We need such work in order to reskill, develop capacity and secure and grow new business.

[Mr Sheerman]

My hon. Friend knows more about this sector than almost anyone else in the House of Commons, and I defer to his great knowledge and professional experience. This is not party political, but does he agree that, across successive Governments, further education has been the neglected area of UK education? Does he agree that FE has been neglected in terms of budget, focus and interest for many years?

[Nic Dakin]

My hon. Friend is right that further education has been a Cinderella area of education and training. One reason why I applaud Vocational Qualifications Day is that it represents a real effort to rebalance what we are saying out there, and what is being said back to us. It is important that we seize that with both hands.

Careers advice is an area in which the Government need to up their game. We have a new careers and enterprise company in place, but it is not clear—the Minister might tell us that it is crystal clear—exactly what that company is doing, or how it will address the current deficit that means that whereas 63% of young people can name A-levels as a post-GCSE qualification, only 7% can name apprenticeships and only 26% are able to name national vocational qualifications as post-GCSE qualifications. Despite the plug that the hon. Member for Stroud (Neil Carmichael) gave for BTECs, only 19% of pupils were able to name them. When I was a college principal, I expanded the BTEC curriculum within my college because it acts as a very good bridge between the academic and the vocational. That applied learning is the sort of bridge we need in order for people to develop and move on to both vocational and academic pathways, as he described.

[Kate Green]

My hon. Friend is right to highlight the importance of careers advice in raising young people’s awareness of alternative education and qualification routes, but will he say something about what can be done better to inform parents? Parents influence their children’s choices, and many parents assume that a university education is the best and only suitable option for their children.

[Nic Dakin]

Absolutely. That is where there is a real danger in the fragmentation of schools, academies, UTCs and other provision. Sadly, the evidence is that in schools with their own sixth form, the quality of careers education, as regards raising awareness of the various pathways available, is lower than in schools that do not have their own sixth form. We must ensure that impartial advice is available to all young people, wherever they undertake their secondary education. That includes connecting better with parents and ensuring that they get information about the range of available pathways from the secondary school, which is the main vehicle through which they receive such information. Research commissioned by the Association of Colleges shows that only 14% of 11 to 16-year-olds have heard of apprenticeships, which is just not good enough. That is evidence that, collectively, we all need to up our game.

The hon. Member for Stroud mentioned LEPs, which are well placed to maximise the value of careers education locally. They seem to be the other player in the mix, with a good connection with the worlds of work and education. LEPs are in an opportune place to bring those things together. Given that LEPs are becoming more mature as organisations, any opportunity to allow them to show more leadership with regards to careers information, advice and guidance would probably benefit young people in their area. I commend Humber local enterprise partnership for its work in promoting gold standard awards for quality in careers information, advice and guidance in the Humber area. It is an example of good practice.

The adult skills budget is disappointing. Vocational qualifications are not just for younger people; they are for older people, particularly because many people will lose one job and have to retrain for another. Given that people are living longer, that is likely to be a challenge for older as well as younger people. It is disappointing that the adult skills budget was cut by 24% in February 2015, as my hon. Friend the Member for Stretford and Urmston (Kate Green) said earlier. It is equally disappointing that just last week, further cuts were announced of £450 million to the non-schools budget and £450 million to the further and higher education part of the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills budget.

Those cuts will cause challenges and pressures, particularly if there are retrospective funding cuts. As a former principal of a college, I know what it is like to set out my stall and put my plans in place. If schools are told halfway through the year that they need to save more money, it is difficult to do so, even for the best-run organisations. I have concerns about the impact on providing the better vocational education and better pathways that we all want for young people, as well as better understanding and support for older people retraining. We might accidentally achieve the opposite. I know that the Minister is passionately committed to ensuring that this works, and I am sure that he did not decide to decrease funding in certain areas to benefit the bit of the world that he champions. I am sure that he will take away from this debate the desire to bat even harder in private for the people whom we want to deliver well for us in public: that is, young people coming into the workplace, as well as older people needing retraining. For both those groups, vocational qualifications are a key underpinning of bridges and platforms into the future.

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[Caroline Nokes (Romsey and Southampton North) (Con)]

It is a pleasure to see you in the Chair, Sir Roger, for a Westminster Hall debate early in the new Session. Like other hon. Members, I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Stroud (Neil Carmichael) on securing this interesting and important debate to celebrate national Vocational Qualifications Day.

Romsey and Southampton North is quite unusual in that within the constituency there is no 16-to-18 state sector provision, which means that those in that age range are effectively exported out. That is sometimes seen as a negative, but I regard it as something of a benefit, because it gives me the opportunity to work with a range of college principals, albeit at the edge of my constituency.

For example, I am an advisory governor at the further education college in the constituency of my hon. Friend the Member for Eastleigh (Mims Davies). For many years I have been invited annually to Eastleigh College to present the awards at its apprenticeship celebration event. That is exactly the sort of initiative that we want to happen everywhere, to celebrate the apprentices and their achievements, as well as the achievements of the employers who have taken the plunge and taken apprentices on. Many employers arrive annually having been nominated by their apprentices for the brilliant experience that they give young people in the Hampshire area.

We want more vocational qualifications and more high- quality apprenticeships. It is crucial that apprenticeships should provide the quality training that young people deserve. I have been pleased over the past nearly 12 months to have a business administration apprentice in my office. That has been a learning curve for us and for her. I hope that she has benefited from the experience. I guess we will know about that at the end of it, and I hope that she will get a good certificate, which she will be able to take to future employers, or potentially to university. We have a responsibility to practise what we preach, and that was one reason for my taking on an apprentice. I was struck by Eastleigh College’s determination to promote its provision and to make things as easy as possible for the employer. That is crucial. Sometimes there are far too many barriers, although many are perceived rather than real.

[Nic Dakin]

The hon. Lady is right that taking on an apprentice—and I have taken on two so far in my current role—helps to educate us as employers about the challenges in taking on such a responsibility. It is hugely rewarding, and we should celebrate the employers’ role.

[Caroline Nokes]

The hon. Gentleman is right. Taking on apprentices is great for us, for the employers, and for the economy and everyone else. I have long held that the first rung on the employment ladder is the hardest, and that is why vocational qualifications are so important. They provide a fantastic bridge from school to work. Whether they be tech-levels or technical awards, and at whatever age they are achieved, we need the suite of qualifications of which they are part to be attractive and available to students, and we need it to have parity of esteem, as various hon. Members have said.

Life is about more than a clutch of good GCSEs. It is about acquiring the life skills necessary to make the transition to the world of work. My hon. Friend the Member for Stroud mentioned the soft skills that can be obtained from work experience and vocational qualifications—whether in retail, catering or the example that he used of sport. Such opportunities can also build confidence, which is important for young people who too often have just experienced the classroom, and who lack the interaction that they will need in later life to play a constructive role in the world of work.

Southampton has some great vocational qualification providers, such as City College in the constituency of my hon. Friend the Member for Southampton, Itchen (Royston Smith) and the Southampton Engineering Training Association, which I enjoyed visiting last summer for its annual presentation and celebration evening. There are hundreds of courses for thousands of students, which all provide obvious and successful routes into work. City College makes much of the fact that its young people who undertake vocational qualifications often go on to be self-employed. They will be small business owners, employing other people. We need to encourage that, because if every small business employed one more person we would have zero unemployment.

At the SETA evening, 70 young men and one girl received engineering qualifications. We still have an enormous amount of work to do to encourage young women to take up engineering qualifications and follow that vocational route. We must make sure that, just as GCSE and A-level results are celebrated annually in local papers, when we see young people with brilliant achievements and fantastic certificates, there is also an opportunity to celebrate just as vehemently and vigorously those who get vocational qualifications. It is great to see exactly that happening on the website of the Edge Foundation, but I would love to see more of it in my local paper.

The hon. Member for Scunthorpe (Nic Dakin) made a point about careers advice, which is crucial. In my constituency there are some great examples of best practice, with opportunities to expand on career options and choices. The Romsey School has done brilliant work, particularly with young girls, on vocational qualifications. They set up their own beauty studio in the school, to try to get across the message that science qualifications are needed to go on vocational courses in beauty and hairdressing. That was a practical way of conveying to girls the importance of continuing with science studies, when perhaps they were not finding them that interesting.

Just up the road is The Mountbatten School, which has done brilliant work linking up with local businesses. That is crucial; we must have such opportunities to bring companies into schools, so that young people can see the opportunities and the range of jobs out there. I take part annually in what The Mountbatten School refers to as its enrichment day. The poor year 10 children have to do a mock interview with me. They appeared slightly horrified the first year I did it, because they were used to doing it with their teachers, but the event has expanded every year, and the school now brings in the Rotary Club and eminent members of the local chamber of commerce. The children are confronted with real live employers and they go through a real interview, so they understand how tough it can be to make that important first impression. We must make sure that 14-year-olds make the right decisions about their future, based on what they want, enjoy and are interested in, and that they avoid the age-old problem of choosing to do exactly what their friends are doing.

I congratulate the Edge Foundation, which has done great work on establishing, celebrating and promoting VQ Day. It plays a crucial part in reinforcing parity of esteem between academic and vocational qualifications. In the words of Lord Baker,

“By 2022, 90% of the most in-demand job areas will be accessible through technical, practical and vocational learning.”

That gives a very clear steer about the scale of the opportunity, and we must make sure that we grab it with both hands.

Today I have given some local examples of best practice throughout Hampshire, and there are others throughout the country. We need to celebrate and promote them, and make sure that they are rolled out across the country.

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[The Minister for Skills (Nick Boles)]

Sir Roger, it is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship during my first outing in Westminster Hall since the election and my reappointment as Skills Minister.

I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Stroud (Neil Carmichael) on securing this important debate. He congratulated the Edge Foundation on setting up this day of celebration of all that is good in technical and professional education, and all those people, young and not so young, who take advantage of those opportunities to secure qualifications that enrich their lives and promote their careers. This is an excellent debate with which to kick off the deliberations in this five-year Parliament. Technical and professional education has an important role to play in making our economy more productive and providing opportunities for all people in all parts of the country.

Before getting into the meat of my argument, I want to deal with a few issues raised by hon. Members. First, it is important to say that the 24% cut in the adult skills budget—in the allocations offered to colleges and providers —is obviously an average figure and, more importantly, relates to the non-apprenticeship portion of the adult skills budget. It does not take a genius to work out that if the overall scale of a budget is reduced and the size of an important element in it is doubled, there will be larger reductions in what is left. Even I could work it out. That is what has happened to the non-apprenticeship portion of the adult skills budget. We have reduced the overall budget and doubled the spending on adult apprenticeships funded out of that budget. That has necessitated rather larger cuts in that particular area.

[Nic Dakin]

Does not the Minister agree that by doing that certain activities currently very much valued by employers will disappear from the offer that is available locally?

[Nick Boles]

I fear that cuts often require difficult choices to be made. Colleges are all trying to ensure that they make economies chiefly through efficiencies and in areas of lower value. Following on from that, I should like to correct something said by the hon. Member for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman), who is no longer in the Chamber, about the relative value of full-time FE courses and apprenticeships. I am not for a minute suggesting that full-time FE courses do not have a positive impact—they do—but their positive impact on people’s earnings between five and seven years later is not nearly as high as the positive impact of apprenticeships. We have just done one of the biggest data studies undertaken by Government, matching people’s education performance and their earnings as recorded by Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs. Almost 500,000 individuals were covered by this study, which found that a level 2 apprenticeship leads to approximately a 16% improvement in the individual’s earnings five to seven years later, whereas the impact for a full-time level 2 is roughly 6%. At level 3 it is 16% for those on an apprenticeship, against 4% on a full-time course. There are positive impacts from full-time courses and some of those courses—not least the BTEC mentioned by my hon. Friend—may well have a higher value, but the averages suggest that it is sensible to do what the Government have been doing and shift resources out of full-time FE courses into apprenticeships, while continuing to invest in full-time FE.

My neighbour, the hon. Member for Scunthorpe (Nic Dakin), mentioned the in-year cuts to both the DFE and BIS budgets. Although I cannot go into detail, because it would be way above my pay grade to do so, he should not assume that the only way of cutting the unprotected part of the DFE budget is by cutting funding for 16 to 19 education, including funding for FE colleges. He should also not assume that the only way of cutting the part of the BIS budget that has been subject to in-year cuts is by cutting funding for FE colleges. No doubt everybody will have to make a contribution, but he should not assume that those cuts involving large figures will fall entirely on the sectors that he so admirably represents in the House and in this debate.

We are at the start of a five-year Parliament, so we have a bit of time to think and plan and be strategic, and to try to build something that addresses some of the problems that have afflicted us as a country for decades. There has been a huge amount of agreement across the House about the nature of the productivity challenge that we face as a country. We have lower productivity—all that means is how much value people are producing for every hour that they work—in part, I am glad to say, because we manage to find jobs for people with very low skills who are less productive. Of course, a large number of the least productive workers in countries not too far from here are not employed, and by necessity that means that their average productivity per hour of employment is higher. I prefer to live on this side of the channel rather than on the other side, where that is so, but that does not in any sense diminish the challenge to us of ensuring that the productivity of everybody, whether relatively low-skilled or high-skilled, is improving so that they can command higher wages, pay higher taxes and have better lives for themselves and their families. That is, of course, a fundamental challenge for this Parliament.

The Opposition spokesman was right to say that Members of all parties have long bemoaned our inability to create a system of technical and professional education that commands the same level of understanding in the country, and in families and schools, and in this House—not to mention the level of respect—as the academic education system, which is admired around the world. He is absolutely right to challenge the Government in these early weeks to grapple with the problem systematically, rather than in a piecemeal way, and I hope and intend to rise to the challenge.

I will resist the temptation, long though my legs are, to show too much of them in my response to the debate. That is not because I am coy, because I am not naturally that coy, as you may have noticed, Sir Roger, but because it is a little premature for me as a Minister, although I was in this post for 10 months before the election, to start rushing to judgment. I would like to hear from others, and it has been tremendously useful to hear the contributions of my hon. and right hon. Friends and Opposition Members on the elements of the system that they see as needing to be reformed, changed or improved.

I also want to learn from other countries. The Opposition spokesman referred to the example that we always beat ourselves over the head about: the German system of technical education. He is right to say that we honourably and admirably had some part to play in creating that system, but it is also right to observe that it is the product of a deep economic, educational and social culture that is somewhat different from ours. We need to ensure that we are looking to learn from relevant examples that are, in a sense, transferable and applicable to our system. I am keen to look at—I encourage Members to come forward if they have better example—the Dutch example. The Dutch economy is more similar to our own in culture and approach than the German one. It is smaller, but it has what we would see as—I am not sure that the Dutch would accept this—Anglo-Saxon features. As the Opposition spokesman said, they seem to have a better system of clear routes through education to high, degree-level qualifications.

School Funding Formula

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Tuesday 10th March 2015 Commons Chamber

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

I congratulate the hon. Member for Worcester (Mr Walker) on his leadership of this debate and on his leadership on this issue during this Parliament. He sets an example to us all.

It is clear what the motion is asking the next Parliament for:

“the speedy implementation of a fair and transparent…funding formula”

on an acceptable time scale. Of course, what is fair and transparent to one person is not necessarily so to another—and therein lies the challenge for the Front-Bench team when it is time to deliver. The hon. Member for Beverley and Holderness (Mr Stuart), the Chairman of the Education Committee, is right when he says that this needs to be fair and just. We can all sign up to that, but, as the hon. Member for Worcester says, it should not be an accident of geography that determines how much funding a school, a pupil or a student gets. It should be done fairly and transparently.

[Heather Wheeler (South Derbyshire) (Con)]

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that, as we now have an extra chunk of money from the last Budget, it should be put on the baseline, as was suggested by my hon. Friend the Member for Worcester (Mr Walker)? At least that would give future Governments a fairer point from which to start.

[Nic Dakin]

Any progress should certainly be built on by a future Government. North Lincolnshire, the area that I represent, is historically underfunded. We stand to benefit and to be a potential winner, but the change must be smoothed for those who are less advantaged, and I think that the F40 principles will help in that regard. Core entitlement at pupil level is the main building block that will give schools access to similar resources for basic classroom costs, wherever those schools may be, but pupil needs beyond the core entitlement will also be recognised. Factors such as deprivation, special educational needs and the existence of small schools in small communities should be taken into account. That is the second building block. As for the third, the existing dedicated schools grant structure should continue to be part of the framework. I think that those three principles will be helpful to any future Government.

When we talk about school budgets, we should recognise that funding for those over 16 has been particularly badly affected in recent years.

[Richard Graham]

The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. It is hardest for schools with sixth forms, and those that do not have a very large percentage of disadvantaged pupils who receive the pupil premium. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that it is essential to get the core funding right for the F40 group, so that those schools can balance their books in the next few years?

--- Later in debate ---

[Nic Dakin]

It is indeed. We should focus on giving young people equal opportunities wherever they are.

[Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab)]

As my hon. Friend knows, debates about the school funding formula have been continuing for many years. I remember them taking place about 25 years ago. What is more important is that a quarter of the further education budget is to be cut at Coventry City college.

[Nic Dakin]

My hon. Friend has made a good point, which illustrates the complexity of the issue and the challenges that it poses. For example, sixth-form colleges currently receive no VAT relief, whereas other institutions do. One political party is going into the next election promising to create 500 new institutions. We have to ask ourselves whether that is good value for money when there is pressure on the basic budgets for young people who are in our existing institutions. It is a simple observation, and with that simple observation I shall end my speech.

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

International Women’s Day

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Thursday 5th March 2015 Commons Chamber

[Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab)]

I apologise for not being here at the start of the debate. I had not originally intended to participate, because I have taken part in similar debates in the Chamber as well as Westminster Hall many times over the past 30 years, and in those debates a variety of Members, male and female, have joined in the call for greater equality for women in this place and elsewhere.

To strike a consensual note at the beginning, I agree with the right hon. Member for Meriden (Mrs Spelman) about Lynda Chalker. I shadowed Lynda Chalker for a number of years, and always thought she should have been in the Cabinet—Margaret Thatcher should have put her there. I am therefore pleased to support the idea of having a portrait of Lynda Chalker somewhere on the parliamentary estate. She was an excellent Minister and she continues her work elsewhere.

I am here because I was listening to the debate and realised that no one was going to mention female genital mutilation. I introduced legislation to amend the Prohibition of Female Circumcision Act 1985, yet there have been no successful prosecutions. I view prosecutions as essential, because they will provide a real warning to the people who continue to carry out this practice. Unfortunately, I doubt whether it will be stopped without prosecutions. An attempt at a prosecution was mounted a few months ago. A piece I read about it was headed: “FGM Trial. Why has no one ever been convicted in Britain despite the practice being illegal for 30 years?”

Everybody knows that “female genital mutilation” is a collective term for a number of procedures, including the removal of parts, or all, the external female genitalia for non-medical reasons. FGM has no health benefits, and its dangers include severe bleeding, problems with urinating, infections, infertility, complications in childbirth and increased risk of death for the new-born. It is internationally recognised as a violation of the human rights of girls and women.

The World Health Organisation estimates that more than 125 million girls and women world wide are currently living with the consequences of FGM. The UK Government estimate that up to 24,000 girls under the age of 15 are at risk of FGM in the UK. A report from City university London, undertaken in collaboration with Equality Now, estimates that approximately 60,000 girls up to the age of 14 were born in England and Wales to mothers who had undergone FGM.

There is a large minority Somali community in some areas, particularly in Wales. I recently attended a talk by an assistant police commissioner who failed even to mention the subject of FGM. I wonder whether the efforts made in education, medical circles and so forth are enough to contribute to stopping this practice in those communities. The legislation that I pushed through Parliament in 2003 raised the maximum penalty for FGM from five to 14 years in prison, and made it an offence for UK nationals or permanent UK residents to carry out FGM abroad, even in countries where it is legal. I hope there will be lots of campaigns. One led by Fahma Mohamed and supported by The Guardian and change.org. called on the Government to require all schools to teach about FGM and raise awareness of its associated dangers. A related e-petition, “Stop FGM in the UK Now”, has been signed by more than 200,000 people. As a result, the Education Secretary wrote to all schools and issued new guidance on the teaching of FGM.

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

I have been listening carefully to my right hon. Friend’s contribution to this very important debate. I am sure she will be pleased to hear that I shall be joining an assembly at Frederick Gough school tomorrow at which an outside organisation will be giving a presentation on the very matter she is talking about. Education is going on today in our schools.

[Ann Clwyd]

That is very welcome information. I am sure those on the Front Benches will have further information on measures that have been taken to stamp out this abhorrent practice.

Oral Answers to Questions

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Monday 2nd March 2015 Commons Chamber

[Nick Boles]

We absolutely recognise this “anomaly”, as my hon. Friend calls it, which also applies to further education colleges. It goes along with other freedoms that schools and academies do not have—sixth-form colleges have the freedom to borrow in a way that academies do not—but we nevertheless recognise that this issue is of concern to a lot of sixth-form colleges, and we are actively discussing ways in which we might ameliorate it. However, to get rid of the problem entirely would cost many tens of millions of pounds, which would require us to identify savings that we cannot find at the moment.

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

I understand that the Minister, who recognises this “anomaly”, has in his rather amiable way when visiting sixth-form colleges been encouraging some of them to consider going for academy status. When that happens, however, his noble friend Lord Nash says, “This isn’t on mate”. Which is right? Can colleges go for academy status or not?

[Nick Boles]

Lord Nash and I are not only great friends but we agree entirely on this issue. It is legally possible under existing provisions for a college to convert to academy status, but there are issues around how the VAT will be dealt with, and how any debt that it has already amassed will be dealt with on its balance sheet. Those issues are tricky, but we are looking at them.

--- Later in debate ---

[Nicky Morgan]

I was delighted last month to be able to announce £6 billion of investment in school buildings for school blocks in the worst condition, but of course, sadly, demand always outstrips supply. If my hon. Friend would like to send me further details, I shall ensure that I or one of the Ministers respond, and perhaps meet him to have a chat about it.

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

I welcome the Secretary of State’s statement that she is against top-down imposition. Will she therefore admit that her predecessor made a huge mistake when he ordered the decoupling of AS and A-levels, and put that right before it is too late?

Careers Advice (14 to 19-Year-Olds)

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Wednesday 25th February 2015 Westminster Hall

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Eastbourne (Stephen Lloyd), who did well to secure this debate at an opportune time. Indeed, what better time could there be for game changing in relation to careers information, advice and guidance? Of all the things that need addressing urgently in the education landscape, this is it. I know that because the Humber local enterprise partnership asked me back in 2013 to chair a skills commission for it, and we interviewed businesses across the Humber. What they said—this was business people speaking to us, working on behalf of the LEP in the Humber—was that there was a universal need for better careers information, advice and guidance. I know from my lifetime in education that careers advice is more broken now than it has ever been, but it was interesting to hear that message coming from the business sector.

The hon. Gentleman is right in his analysis that we are in an education landscape that is more fragmented than ever, with free schools, UTCs and other things. In that fragmented landscape, created by the current Government, we need more than ever someone who holds the ring for young people and for UK plc and who is a resource of information, advice and guidance in an independent way.

The changes made in 2012 have upskittled what was there and made things much worse. The hon. Gentleman is right to say that employers are willing to get involved—by crikey they are! People working in education are also willing to get involved. There is great good will on both sides, but this will not happen until there is some resource in the middle. That is what has been taken out, what is missing. It will not happen unless there is some resource in the middle—careers advice or whatever we want to call it—that makes it happen, because people are looking at their bottom lines. The hon. Gentleman talked about the bottom line of accountability, in terms of results, Ofsted and all that, in the education sector. The bottom line of accountability for businesses is literally the bottom line of their profit and loss account. Unless we have something that will put those things together and we resource it properly, that will not happen, despite the good will on both sides, so it is crucial.

The National Union of Students captures the position in its statement that the provision of impartial, quality careers information, advice and guidance is of fundamental importance to individuals and society. It is a win-win situation. Why are we not investing in that? Why have we dismantled it?

As a result of the report produced by the Humber LEP, “Lifting the Lid: The Humber Skills Challenge 2013”, there have been good initiatives in the Humber area. There is the gold standard recognition for those parts of the Humber that are seeking to produce high-quality careers information, advice and guidance. That approach is bearing dividends. Also, as Anne Tyrrell, the principal of North Lindsey college, points out, the work that has been done on the Humber-wide portal for careers, Bridging the Gap, where information can be accessed, is making some difference. There is other good practice—for example, the work that Baysgarth school is doing with John Leggott college. Institutions are working together to make the provision of information, advice and guidance better. However, those initiatives are undertaken within a busy day, without being properly resourced from the centre.

Let us examine a few statistics from the University and College Union, to add to statistics that we have already had. Just 39% of learners surveyed said that they had spoken to a careers adviser. Less than half, 46%, of young people say that they have received group advice from a teacher at their school. Fewer still, 39%, said that they had had a talk from a local careers officer or careers adviser, and only 10% had spoken to a business professional. Those statistics paint the picture of where we are at the moment, and it is not good enough for our young people or our society.

[Andy McDonald (Middlesbrough) (Lab)]

Does my hon. Friend agree that one issue that we urgently need to address is the knowledge base of teachers themselves as to the industrial and commercial basis of their own hinterland? If some training days were devoted to acquiring knowledge of what is going on in their own territories—the industries, the commerce and the job opportunities available for the pupils they teach—surely that would pay dividends in terms of the destinations that our young people reach when they qualify.

[Nic Dakin]

It absolutely would and does. Schools, colleges, teachers and support staff up and down the land have undertaken that sort of activity and will recognise that it benefits them and the young people they teach or support. However, it needs to be resourced. If a teacher is going on a week’s placement in industry, someone else needs to be in front of the kids, teaching them. A cost is involved—this is not a nil-sum game. There are things to be gained and to benefit from, but resource is needed to make it happen. Good words and fine language do not make it happen. It needs to be properly resourced.

I was therefore pleased when the new Secretary of State for Education, surveying the landscape of wreckage and chaos that she had inherited from her predecessor, identified careers information, advice and guidance as one of the things that needed fixing. I felt that in her announcement on 10 December, she was making heavy weather of what needed to be done, but at least she was recognising that something needed to be there and she talked about a new careers and enterprise company being set up. I would be grateful if the Minister, in answering the debate, could update us on progress on that, because it has all gone rather quiet. What are the main priorities on which Government expect the careers company to focus? How will Government know whether the careers company is successful? What are the desired outcomes? What are the measures? What role will local enterprise partnerships have in relation to the careers company? LEPs are well placed to do the job of bringing education and the world of work together in a locality and making things happen. Properly resourced, they are absolutely in the right place to make that happen, so I would like to know how the new company will work with people on the ground so that things change for the better and we do not just see a lot of money going into the pockets of consultants and others without reaching and affecting young people on the ground.

I want to draw attention to the excellent Association of Colleges campaign “Careers Guidance: Guaranteed” to which the hon. Member for Eastbourne has already alluded. It does what it says on the tin. If we can guarantee careers guidance in a proper way for our young people, everyone will be a winner. The campaign that the AOC has been running is one that I hope everyone could sign up to. It talks about

“improved access in a locality where colleges, schools, universities, Jobcentre Plus and local authorities come together led by the LEP to form a clearly signposted careers hub. This would provide a single point of information”.

Alongside explanations of the benefits of an academic education and progression to university, those career hubs should provide young people with an opportunity to try their hand at various vocational options. They would provide that practical experience, but also provide other opportunities.

The hon. Gentleman talked about using ambassadors. I know that schools and colleges use ambassadors well, but, again, resource is needed to manage that, to make it happen, to draw people in, to lubricate the wheels. A careers information hub based within the LEP would deliver that. Together with all that, says the AOC,

“careers education needs to be introduced and embedded into the curriculum. This would give children and young people the right grounding to make informed decisions and the right choice for them. This education should include understanding different types of businesses, how stereotyping affects career decisions, the qualities needed to enhance employability and looking systematically at the choices available and what is required…for particular jobs. It should complement visits from local businesses and work experience placements.”

I shall end as I began. This issue is crucial. It is crucial to the young people in our schools and colleges, to their individual futures, but it is also crucial to UK plc; it is crucial to all of us. Let us game change, get it right and put things in place for a better future for us and for them.

[Several hon. Members]

rose—

Oral Answers to Questions

Nic Dakin Excerpts

Thursday 12th February 2015 Commons Chamber

[Greg Clark]

My right hon. Friend is absolutely right. He and I had the privilege to be at the Royal Society last night, where awards were presented for some of the key figures who are translating some of our most brilliant ideas into practice, especially in advanced manufacturing. Across all the sectors there is confidence that the prospects for this country are better than ever. That is a tribute in large part to the work that my right hon. Friend did in office.

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

The steel unions, supported by steel employers, launched a “Stand Up for Steel” campaign after the debate in this Chamber on the future of the steel industry. With there still being uncertainty about the future of Tata long products, what are the Government doing to stand up for steel, a crucial part of our manufacturing industry that is famous for its innovation and crucial to the future success of this country?

[Greg Clark]

Anyone who was born on Teesside cannot fail to be aware of the importance of the steel industry. It is an important part of our industrial base, and this Government have made significant strides in supporting it. For example, we have reduced the energy costs that would otherwise have been incurred. The hon. Gentleman will know that my right hon. and hon. Friends have regular discussions with representatives of the steel industry and will continue to support it.

--- Later in debate ---

[Vince Cable]

I have indeed discussed that directly with the chief executive of Barclays, in response to my hon. Friend’s very persistent campaigning and that of her Liberal Democrat opponent, who has been equally assiduous. We recognise the need in St Agnes for a bespoke solution, since the post office is not the ideal vehicle, and I think we are working towards a satisfactory outcome.

[Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab)]

As the hon. Member for Cleethorpes (Martin Vickers) pointed out, there is an announcement today about restructuring by Total of its facility at Lindsey oil refinery. In addition there is uncertainty about the future of Tata Steel Long Products in Scunthorpe. Will the Government ensure that the necessary support is given to manufacturing industry in north Lincolnshire, so that it has a strong and prosperous future?

[Matthew Hancock]

Absolutely we will. I understand that the changes announced today by Total are set to take place over a number of years, so there will be time to ensure that we get the systems in place to support people who are affected, whether they stay within Total or are looking for jobs elsewhere or are seeking early retirement. We will do all we can to help.