Oral Answers to Questions

Mark Harper Excerpts

Monday 8th December 2014 Commons Chamber

[Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab)]

2. If he will make it his policy to pay employment and support allowance during the period of mandatory reconsideration.

[The Minister for Disabled People (Mr Mark Harper)]

I am afraid that I am going to disappoint the hon. Gentleman. We are not going to change our policy in that way. When someone is found fit for work, they should claim jobseeker’s allowance and work with Jobcentre Plus to get back into the work force.

[Mr Cunningham]

I think that the Work and Pensions Committee has also termed the policy illogical, but does the Minister not realise that, by virtue of the fact that he is not prepared to change it, he is driving more and more people into hardship and that they, in turn, are having to use food banks? The Government must hold some sort of record on food banks, because under this Government their use is the only thing that is increasing.

[Mr Harper]

That was not the sort of question I normally expect from the hon. Gentleman. If someone is found fit for work, they should immediately apply for jobseeker’s allowance, which is paid at the same rate as the assessment rate of employment and support allowance, so there is no change in their income. They should then engage with their Jobcentre Plus contact so that they can be moved into work. That is the right way for someone to behave when they have been found fit for work, and there is no reason at all why their income should fall.

[Stephen Mosley (City of Chester) (Con)]

During my first couple of years in Parliament—2010-11 and 2011-12 —every week my constituency surgery seemed full of people concerned about appealing against ESA decisions. Recently, the number of appeals seems to have declined. Is that also the case nationally?

[Mr Harper]

We have seen a significant reduction in the number of appeals. The mandatory reconsideration process is helpful, because it means that we can make sure that the right decision is made more quickly rather than having to force someone to go through a very lengthy appeals process within the tribunals service.

[Dame Anne Begg (Aberdeen South) (Lab)]

I am surprised by the Minister’s answer, because my Select Committee made exactly this recommendation and the Government have turned it down. The situation has got worse for people who are reapplying for employment and support allowance, because they think that their ill health has got worse. In future, they are to be denied getting ESA at the assessment rate. Why does the Minister think that is the right approach rather than allowing people to claim an out-of-work benefit because they are too ill to work?

[Mr Harper]

The hon. Lady, notwithstanding her position as Chairman of the Work and Pensions Committee, has not outlined the change correctly. If someone’s condition has significantly worsened or if they are claiming for a new condition, of course they can claim employment and support allowance. What they cannot do is to keep reclaiming employment and support allowance for the same condition when they have already been found to be fit for work.

[Mr David Nuttall (Bury North) (Con)]

Will the Minister confirm that for no other benefit is payment usually made pending the claimant’s appeal for the benefit to be returned?

[Mr Harper]

I can confirm that that is right. In all other benefits, when someone is found not to be entitled to it and then chooses to appeal, they are not paid anything while the appeal is ongoing. My hon. Friend is right that employment and support allowance is rather odd in that regard.

[Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab)]

Nevertheless, the position is that when people do appeal, their ESA will be reinstated. There is no financial saving to the Government unless they expect people not to claim JSA during this period. It is therefore not just hard for the claimant but administratively expensive for the Department to put people through that process.

[Mr Harper]

This is about making sure that when someone goes for a work capability assessment and is found to be fit for work, the most important thing is that they then engage with the jobs market and get back into the workplace. It is not just about the benefits; it is about making sure that people are getting the benefit of getting into work. For most people with a mental health problem, it is very clear that working will not just be the right thing but will be better for their condition.

[John Pugh (Southport) (LD)]

3. What his policy is on the freezing of pensions of British nationals living abroad; and if he will make a statement.

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[Diana Johnson (Kingston upon Hull North) (Lab)]

5. What the average time taken is for a decision on an award of personal independence payment.

[The Minister for Disabled People (Mr Mark Harper)]

The delays that some people applying for PIP have experienced are unacceptable, as I have said a number of times in the House. Getting those delays down is my No. 1 priority. The hon. Lady will be aware of the Secretary of State’s very clear commitment, which the Department is working very hard to achieve.

[Diana Johnson]

My constituent Simon Brown waited seven months for his PIP application to be processed. That delay meant that he was unable to apply for other help—such as additional housing benefit—that a PIP award allows. Given that eventual backdated payments do not compensate for the hardship and misery that people experience while waiting for months, and given that benefit delays are one of the main reasons that people are accessing food banks and going to loan sharks, can the Minister say what specifically he is doing to make sure that other people do not suffer in the same way as my constituent?

[Mr Harper]

Yes, I can. Overall, I accept there has been a problem with PIP and I have set that out in the House on a number of occasions. As far as benefits across the Department are concerned, the Department now pays benefits more quickly than when we came to office, so that has improved. Since the start of the year the assessment providers have trebled the number of health professionals they employ. Since April we have doubled the number of monthly assessments and tripled the number of decisions made, and by the beginning of next year we will have almost quadrupled the number of health professionals. That is making a real difference to making decisions on a timely basis for the hon. Lady’s constituents and mine.

[Duncan Hames (Chippenham) (LD)]

Rearranging assessment appointments because of unrealistic expectations for the travel of disabled people has not helped with the timeliness of some decisions. Community transport providers in Wiltshire have a trusted reputation for assisting people with travel to medical appointments. Will the Minister consider opening discussions with volunteer community transport providers about the resources they would need to help people with travel to PIP assessments?

[Mr Harper]

I am familiar with community travel providers; I have a number of excellent ones in my own constituency, including a couple of very good dial-a-ride services, namely Lydney Dial-a-Ride and Newent Dial-a-Ride. My hon. Friend makes a very good point. We currently aim for a one-and-a-half hour maximum travel distance by public transport, and I will ask my officials to look at whether we could work more closely with those community providers. My hon. Friend makes a very good point that is worth further study.

[Clive Efford (Eltham) (Lab)]

It is no good the Minister coming here saying that he is very concerned about PIP and wants to do something about it. This has been going on for too long. Patients that suffer a downturn in their condition are suffering an extra 28-day delay and the Multiple Sclerosis Society says that that could lead to their missing out on up to £3,500. It is about time the Minister sorted this out, so what is he going to do about it?

[Mr Harper]

I do not think the hon. Gentleman was listening very carefully to the answer I gave to the hon. Member for Kingston upon Hull North (Diana Johnson). I set out that the assessment providers have hired more staff, that we have significantly increased the number of decisions we are making, and that backlogs are being reduced. I also set out very clearly the commitment made by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State, which I am working very hard to achieve.

[Tessa Munt (Wells) (LD)]

One of my constituents—a British citizen—returned to the UK, having lived in New Zealand for five years, to look after her ill mother. She now has cancer, but she cannot claim PIP due to the habitual residence test. Does the Minister agree that she is falling foul of regulations that are really meant to stop benefit tourism by EU migrants? Will he meet me to discuss this particular constituent’s plight?

[Mr Harper]

I do not know all the facts of that specific case, but I would be delighted to discuss it with my hon. Friend. The general position is that tests about habitual residence and past presence are meant to make sure that only people with a close connection to Britain are able to claim our benefits. I will, of course, meet my hon. Friend to discuss the specific case.

[Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab)]

Last week’s economic and fiscal outlook from the Office for Budget Responsibility shows that, following the PIP delays under discussion, spending on the benefit will be £1.2 billion higher than the Government planned last December. At the same time, disabled people are having to wait months for a decision, with more than 300,000 stuck in the queue, according to the most recent figures. In a Westminster Hall debate on 25 November, the Minister said that the DWP was receiving between 30,000 and 40,000 claims per month, and the most recent figures show 35,000 decisions per month being taken. The Minister is therefore running to stand still, so will he say exactly how he is going to bring down the backlog?

[Mr Harper]

Yes; obviously, I was talking about the figures that have been published so far. The hon. Lady will know, as she attended the debate in Westminster Hall, that I set out the timetable for publishing clearance statistics. Her general point is well made. I am very well aware of the delays—I have to reply to Members from across the House—and that is why we have put in a considerable amount of effort. Both the Department and providers are making considerable progress towards the Secretary of State’s commitment, and we will be able to say more about that in the new year.

[Kate Green]

Disabled people are being left, sometimes for months, without support. Some are very seriously ill, some have degenerative conditions, some are being hounded for a planned intervention—effectively, resubmitting their claim part way through their award—and, as my hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon Hull North (Diana Johnson) pointed out, some are losing their passported benefits. All that, alongside delays in processing employment and support allowance assessments and today’s decision on the closure of the independent living fund, mean that disabled people are facing huge anxiety and uncertainty. Does the Minister really think it is right that they should take the pain for the Government’s welfare failures?

[Mr Harper]

I do not agree at all with the way the hon. Lady has set that out. Right at the beginning of my answer I said that I was seized of the delays to PIP, and we have made a lot of progress in dealing with them. She refers to today’s judgment on the independent living fund. She will know, of course, that that has nothing to do with saving money; it is about making sure that people are using the care and support system, which will be further improved by the Care Act 2014 in the new year. The judge was very clear and gave a very clear decision today about the proper, robust decision making in the Department. The ILF is working closely with local authorities to make sure that the transition from ILF to local authority support is as seamless as possible.

[Stephen Metcalfe (South Basildon and East Thurrock) (Con)]

6. What comparative assessment he has made of unemployment rates in the UK and other European countries.

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[John Healey (Wentworth and Dearne) (Lab)]

9. What legal costs his Department has incurred in legal proceedings involving disabled people relating to the under-occupancy penalty and the closure of the independent living fund.

[The Minister for Disabled People (Mr Mark Harper)]

The Government have robustly defended their policies in relation to the closure of the independent living fund and the removal of the spare room subsidy. The total known legal costs to date, in respect of both policies where disability formed part of the grounds of the claim, are £415,000: £236,000 for the ILF and £178,000 for the removal of the spare room subsidy.

[John Healey]

That is a part answer to a very direct question about the cost to the taxpayers of Government lawyers defending the indefensible—axing the ILF and introducing the hated bedroom tax. Will the Minister not recognise that many severely disabled people flourish with the fund but are now frightened of losing their independence when he shuts it down next year? He might have won the legal case this year, but he has lost the moral and policy arguments, so even at this eleventh hour will he rethink the protection available to ILF users?

[Mr Harper]

No, I will not. I have talked to disability organisations about this matter, and they agree with the Government. More than 1 million people get social care through the mainstream social care system. The Government are not making any savings by moving the ILF to local authorities and devolved Administrations, and we are working closely with each local authority to ensure that the amount of money being transferred at the point of closure next year will be exactly what is needed and what is being spent by the ILF, meaning that disabled people will be protected.

[Barbara Keeley (Worsley and Eccles South) (Lab)]

Some £4.3 billion has been taken out of adult social care budgets over the past four years because of the Government’s cuts. If that funding transfers across, as is planned, it will plug only a very small part of the gap. If they will not rethink this policy, as my right hon. Friend the Member for Wentworth and Dearne (John Healey) just suggested, will Ministers require that the funding be ring-fenced to ensure that 70 people in Salford and 18,000 people across the country with disabilities can look forward to keeping their independence and to this continuing support?

[Mr Harper]

Of course local government has had to play its part in the savings, but local authorities can make choices. My local authority in Gloucestershire has protected the value of social care because it thinks that protecting older people—[Interruption.] No, my local authority has faced cuts, like all local authorities, but it has chosen to—[Interruption.] If Opposition Members want me to answer their hon. Friend’s question, they should stop yelling. My local authority has prioritised funding for older people and people of working age. Clearly, the hon. Lady’s local authority has made different decisions. If those on her local authority want to ring-fence the money transferred from the ILF, they are absolutely free to do so, so I suggest she take that up with them.

[Mr John Leech (Manchester, Withington) (LD)]

10. What estimate he made of the potential savings to the public purse that would arise from implementation of the under-occupancy penalty; and what estimate he has made of the amount saved to date by that implementation.

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[Steve Rotheram (Liverpool, Walton) (Lab)]

11. What steps he has taken to accelerate the processing of personal independence payment applications.

[The Minister for Disabled People (Mr Mark Harper)]

The hon. Gentleman will know from my earlier answer some of the things we have done, including increasing the number of health professionals employed by the providers and opening more assessment centres. He will know that the latest set of statistics published in September showed that from March to July we more than doubled the number of cases cleared, and our performance continues to improve.

[Steve Rotheram]

Actually, the latest DWP figures show that of nearly 530,000 applications for the personal independence payment, only 206,000 decisions on eligibility have been made. That means 323,000 disabled people, with 1,000 in Liverpool, Walton alone, have been left in limbo, facing additional costs to cope with ill health or disability. Given his earlier answers, why is the Minister prepared to leave disabled people bottom of his list of priorities?

[Mr Harper]

I do not think the hon. Gentleman is listening. I very clearly said—and I have said it a number of times here—that fixing delays to the PIP process is not at the bottom of my list; I have been very clear that it is at the top of my list of priorities. I have said that from the time I started doing this job and we have made considerable progress. We will be able to set out the up-to-date position when I give evidence to the Work and Pensions Select Committee chaired by the hon. Gentleman’s colleague, the hon. Friend Member for Aberdeen South (Dame Anne Begg). I have been invited to give an update at the end of January and I will be delighted to do so.

[Mr Clive Betts (Sheffield South East) (Lab)]

12. What estimate he has made of his Department’s expenditure on in-work housing benefit for migrant workers from the European economic area who have arrived in the UK within the last (a) six, (b) 12 and (c) 24 months.

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[Jesse Norman (Hereford and South Herefordshire) (Con)]

13. What steps he is taking to help unemployed adults with disabilities to secure and sustain employment or self-employment.

[The Minister for Disabled People (Mr Mark Harper)]

The Government have published today a paper called “Disability Confident Britain” about some of our programmes. I know that brandishing documents here is generally deprecated, but because this is a copy of the House magazine of 28 November, I draw the attention of hon. Members to page 42, which featured an article about “Disability Confident Britain” and about the excellent event I attended in Gloucester hosted by my hon. Friend the Member for Gloucester (Richard Graham). I urge all hon. Members who have not already done so to hold such events in their own parliamentary constituencies.

[Jesse Norman]

The Minister will be aware of the excellent work done by the Royal National College for the Blind, which is based in Hereford, with blind and partially sighted people from all over the country. It has struggled in recent years with a series of annual contracts for residential training. Will the Minister provide a clear date by which a long-term solution will be in place?

[Mr Harper]

I am familiar with this issue. We set out in the paper published today the fact that we have extended the contracts until next September. I am making every effort to make sure that we can announce a long-term solution before the general election next year, so that those colleges can have some confidence in the future. My hon. Friend can give my assurance to the college principal that I will strain every sinew to do so and will keep him fully informed.

[Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab)]

Figures show that the Work programme is performing very badly when it comes to helping disabled people into work. Why are its contracts being extended for another year even though it is clearly not doing the job it was intended to do?

[Mr Harper]

As the hon. Lady will see if she looks at the latest figures, the programme’s performance has improved considerably—indeed, it has been more successful than previous programmes—and Work Choice is also performing very well. I think that she should have a little more confidence. The document that I published today refers to a range of programmes initiated by Departments whose spending we have protected, at a time when difficult decisions are having to be made across Government to deal with the deficit.

[Mr Henry Bellingham (North West Norfolk) (Con)]

15. What estimate he has made of the annual change in unemployment in the North West Norfolk constituency over the last three years.

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[Sir George Young (North West Hampshire) (Con)]

T4. Does my right hon. Friend agree that as unemployment continues to fall, we have a golden opportunity to offer work to those with a learning or physical disability? Will he confirm that programmes such as Work Choice and Access to Work and the work of his Department’s disability employment advisers will continue to have top priority, so that we can make yet further progress?

[The Minister for Disabled People (Mr Mark Harper)]

I completely agree with my right hon. Friend. In fact, the latest labour market statistics show that disabled people are sharing in the jobs that are being created, with more than 258,000 more disabled people in work over the last year, including 75,000 in the south-east, which will cover his constituency, and there are particularly sharp rises in the number of those with learning disabilities getting jobs, which he specifically asked about.

[Kelvin Hopkins (Luton North) (Lab)]

T3. The former Minister for Disabled People, the right hon. Member for Hemel Hempstead (Mike Penning), repeatedly assured the House during the passage of the Mesothelioma Act 2014 that the planned 3% levy on insurers to fund pay-outs to victims was not “going anywhere”—in other words, it was not going to change. In a written ministerial statement on 28 November, however, the current Minister announced that the levy would amount to just 2.2%. A 3% levy could have funded more generous pay-outs, helped to fund research or covered more asbestos-related diseases. Is it not disgraceful that the Minister has put the interests of the insurance industry ahead of the interests of victims?

[Mr Harper]

We have introduced a scheme, and introduced a levy to pay for it. This continues the work that we agreed on when the previous Government introduced a similar scheme under the Child Maintenance and Other Payments Act 2008. I am proud of the scheme we have introduced. It will go a long way towards helping people who have been affected by this dreadful industrial disease.

[Chris White (Warwick and Leamington) (Con)]

T7. Last month, there was a debate in this Chamber on promoting the living wage. May I congratulate the Department for Work and Pensions on being the first Department in Whitehall to pay its staff and contractors the London living wage? Does the Secretary of State agree that we should encourage all Government Departments to follow suit?

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[Mr William Bain (Glasgow North East) (Lab)]

Ministers promised to cut the waiting period for assessments for PIP to 16 weeks by the end of the year, but will they apologise to 900 people in my constituency and the hundreds of thousands more across the country who have been left to wait for months on end in severe financial hardship?

[Mr Harper]

I am happy to do so. I have said before that that is not acceptable; I made it clear during my first time at the Dispatch Box. I am happy to say that the Government should have made sure that we did not make that mistake. People should not have had to wait that long. I am making sure that we are doing something about it, as has the Secretary of State, so that people will not have to wait for such a long time in the future.

[Stephen Metcalfe (South Basildon and East Thurrock) (Con)]

My daughter is on a zero-hours contract as a care assistant, which suits both her and her employer as it allows her to choose when to work and when to study. Does my right hon. Friend agree that as long as there is no exclusivity clause, such flexibility in employment is helpful?