Middle East

Lord Collins of Highbury Excerpts

Tuesday 24th June 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Purvis of Tweed (LD)]

My Lords, every casualty in the Iran-Israel conflict is one that could have been avoided, but it is worth remembering that, in the same period, almost as many people have been shot in Gaza simply queuing for food, and the crisis in the region continues.

On Iran, the US clearly decided to escalate to de-escalate. It may yet re-escalate, because the whiplash of posts from the President this morning are hard to follow with a degree of reassurance, but I hope that a ceasefire can be operational, even though the most recent updates require us to be somewhere between pessimistic and cautiously optimistic. The Trump Administration seem to think that war plays out like a reality TV show, but this is real violence with real deaths and real-life consequences, not so much for egotistical men in their 80s and near-80s as for the victims, who are primarily civilians—women and children in particular.

The Tehran regime is clearly homicidal, but we may find out that it is probably not suicidal. The US and Netanyahu Governments are clearly tactical, but we will find out that they are probably not strategic. The Minister told the House last Thursday that the US was seeking to de-escalate at the very time it was deciding to escalate. The immediate repercussions are being seen, and we cannot now know for certain what will follow.

Trump and Hegseth said the Iranian nuclear programme was obliterated and ended. Now US officials are giving a more sober view of “damaged” and “delayed”. The IAEA’s information is probably more reliable: that it is likely that there has been significant damage—but this is difficult to verify. Even more difficult to verify is the impact the strikes will have on preventing weaponisation in the medium term. The IAEA warned against military strikes for the very reason that they would likely make it even harder to verify, and I suspect that may be the reality now.

Unquestionably, Iranian options in the next period are more limited than they would have been 10 days ago, but it is rash to think that we know whether Iran will continue to act immediately or play a game of time on a calendar it has operated under for many years. I was in Iraq the last time Iran claimed the US would pay irreparable damage, for the killing of Soleimani outside Baghdad Airport; instead, it signalled and then performed a largely performative display of attacks near Erbil. Full escalation or controlled tit-for-tat is a delicate dance where miscalculation is deadly, but it may well be being played out.

We therefore cannot predict the next 48 hours from Tehran, not to mention the next 48 days; nor for that matter, and with deep regret, can we necessarily predict that from the Trump Administration. We can predict heightened rhetoric taking on increasingly macho and jingoistic terms. From loose talk of regime change, the current Tehran regime will likely become even more repressive, and more secretive and patient in rebuilding its proxy relationships and other interests.

Last week in the Chamber, and just a few moments ago, we heard noble Lords drumming a jingoistic beat. We also heard—more rightly in my view—caution. I would advise the House to listen to the wise words of the noble Lord, Lord Lamont—the noble friend of the noble Lord, Lord Callanan. These Benches agree with the Government’s position of not participating.

As much as I agree that Iran should not have nuclear weapon capability—and I strongly agree that Israel should have the ability to defend itself against unacceptable calls for its destruction—we continue to see too many tacticians and too few strategists. As an Iraqi friend, who, incidentally, detests the theocratic dictatorship in Tehran, told me recently, Netanyahu was a cheerleader for regime change in Baghdad 20 years ago and helped persuade Bush and Blair. He handed it to Iran. He wanted Gaza to be in violent competition with the West Bank to prevent a two-state solution and bolstered Hamas. He successfully lobbied Trump for the US to leave JCPOA, which restarted the weapon capability path of nuclear Iran, and now he has positioned Trump into looking weak if he did not join his tactics on bombing and regime-change rhetoric. At each step of the way, quick tactical wins led to strategic errors.

We of course hope for a ceasefire with Iran, but we fervently hope for respite for the civilians in Gaza and the West Bank too—so I close with regard to the situation there. It is alarming, after all the suffering of the civilians within Gaza, to see the recent reports of Hamas now recruiting. The very circumstances exist now for Hamas to regain strength. This is what we were told would be inconceivable with the war aims of the IDF. Reconstruction preparedness is now even harder, given the policy choices for the Gaza Humanitarian Fund to be a mercenary and profiteering operation to supply food and medicine.

So I ask the Government: what work are they doing with our allies to ensure that food is being supplied, and on the restrictions at the border—not assisted by the Knesset law preventing UNRWA working with third parties to co-ordinate the delivery of food and medicine—to ensure that the people of Gaza no longer have to experience the indignity of queuing in danger areas for food? Will the Government provide clarity on the future funding for both programme and humanitarian assistance for the people of Gaza delivered through UNRWA after July?

The medieval scenes that we see, of people having to queue to receive food and medicine across an apocalyptic backdrop, mean that the current situation must end. The GHF approach has been a deadly failure, and the acute shortage of food, deliberately being withheld at the Gaza border, must end. I hope that, if there is breathing space with Iran and Israel, we can at least focus on getting the aid in, which is desperately needed.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office (Lord Collins of Highbury) (Lab)]

I thank both noble Lords for their contributions, comments and questions. I say to the noble Lord opposite that I am rather disappointed with his tone because I thought that, in the other place, the shadow Secretary of State made it clear that she was with the Government on putting forward peace and security. The security of this nation is vital. His tone rather underplayed those comments.

I make it clear that we have long had concerns about the Iranian nuclear programme, and we have been very clear that Iran cannot have nuclear weapons. The US has taken action to alleviate that threat. It is important that we now de-escalate the situation, stabilise the region and get all parties around the negotiating table. Although a ceasefire between Iran and Israel is an opportunity to secure much-needed stability, the events this morning clearly show how fragile and volatile the situation is. We strongly urge both sides to do their utmost to hold to the terms of the ceasefire.

On the action, the noble Lord, Lord Purvis, alluded to the assessment. One thing that President Trump has been absolutely clear about is that this action is not the end of the story in dealing with the nuclear threat in Iran. He has made it clear that he wants to negotiate a deal, and that is fundamental for the long-term security of the Middle East.

As I say, we have been very clear about the nuclear programme. It is important that we get all parties back around the negotiating table. We have strongly supported diplomatic efforts to reach a lasting settlement, as President Trump has indicated. This is now the moment of opportunity; we can have a diplomatic outcome, because only a diplomatic outcome will provide a lasting solution to Iran’s nuclear programme. We have made it clear to Iran: negotiate with the US. That is backed up by the E3, and that is what we as a country should do to make our position more secure.

I pay tribute to the Prime Minister and the Foreign Secretary for what they have been trying to do over the past three days. The Foreign Secretary has spoken to the US Secretary of State, Rubio, the Israeli Foreign Minister and the Iranian Foreign Minister to urge de-escalation. He has also spoken to other regional counterparts, including the Egyptian, Lebanese, Saudi, Emirati, Bahraini and Cypriot Foreign Ministers—all strong allies of the United Kingdom. We are absolutely committed to that diplomatic effort. The Prime Minister has spoken to President Trump, Prime Minister Carney, the King of Jordan, the Sultan of Oman and the German president to support de-escalation—all vital allies of this country—and provide security. The Minister for the Middle East met the Iranian ambassador yesterday to stress the need for a return to diplomatic efforts.

We made clear our condemnation of Iran’s attacks on Qatar and Iraq yesterday. Our focus again has been on de-escalation and diplomacy to end this crisis. The Foreign Secretary made it clear that we stand with our allies in solidarity with the US and Qatar, and we have let Qatar know that it will always have our steadfast support. We are aware that Qatar has communicated—it has sent a letter to the UN Secretary-General. It is, of course, up to the UN to respond to that letter.

The United Kingdom did not participate and is not participating in the Israeli and US strikes. We continue to urge restraint. Our priority is stability in the Middle East. The situation remains volatile, and we remain clear that Iran must never be allowed to develop a nuclear weapon. More broadly, we have always supported Israel’s right to self-defence and its right to protect its citizens. The UK has consistently pushed for a ceasefire since the escalations began, and we continue to work with international partners.

The Minister’s efforts over the past two days have been about protecting our citizens and trying to get UK citizens out of harm’s way. That is why we organised the flight from Tel Aviv—and, hopefully, another one took off today. The interests of our country are a priority, but our UK citizens are also a priority.

In relation to the noble Lord’s comments, I am not going to provide a legal commentary right now. As I said last week, all actors must abide by international law. The noble Lord is fully aware of the long-standing convention reflected in the Ministerial Code. It is not routinely disclosed whether the law officers have been asked to provide legal advice, and the content of that advice is not routinely disclosed. The convention provides the fullest guarantee that government business will be conducted at all times in the light of thorough and candid legal advice. However, I repeat: all our efforts are about ensuring the security of this country and peace in the Middle East.

To be very clear, as I have said before in this Chamber, I am a friend of Israel and have always recognised the threats to its security and the tough neighbourhood it lives in. The Government cannot accept what is happening in Gaza or the West Bank, but this must never undermine our support for Israel’s security. We have to be very candid with our ally about the situation in Gaza. We all understand what a frightening time it must be for Israeli citizens, running into bomb shelters. The Foreign Secretary has expressed his personal concern. That is why we are absolutely focused on ensuring that we contain this conflict and avoid escalation.

I am clear about the threat from Iran, but we will not give up on diplomacy or the interests of the people of Gaza. We plead with the Israeli Government to open the borders so that we can get the necessary aid in. We have made it absolutely clear that the hostages, or, sadly, the bodies of the hostages, must be returned immediately. We must see a ceasefire.

We are a very strong ally of the United States and we are working together. President Trump has made it clear that he wants to see a long-term deal on the possession of nuclear weapons in Iran. The United Kingdom and its E3 allies will support him in that effort. I hope the noble Lord opposite will do the same.

[Baroness Blackstone (Lab)]

My Lords, unlike the extraordinary accusations made by the spokesman for the Conservative Party just now, I congratulate the Government on the carefully thought-out and nuanced position they have taken on the military conflict between the US, Israel and Iran. I thank my noble friend and his senior colleagues for the efforts they are making to try to find a long-term and lasting diplomatic solution to the issue of nuclear weapons in Iran. Turning to what is happening in Gaza, can my noble friend tell the House a little more about what is happening with the replacement of the completely failed Israeli-American system of aid distribution, which I think the Conservative spokesman said he thought was fine? Have steps been taken to replace it with NGOs that are familiar with the best ways of distributing aid in Gaza, so that we do not see any more slaughter of Palestinian civilians desperately trying to get food aid for their starving children?

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

I thank my noble friend for her comments. To be absolutely clear, we are leaving no stone unturned in getting aid into Gaza. We are working with a range of NGOs—everyone possible—but we remain committed to the solution of ensuring that aid is properly distributed through the main agency, UNRWA. We have sought assurances on that and we have taken every opportunity that we have had to put it to the Israeli Government that they should open those routes to aid to ensure that it can get through. We are now in a desperate situation; as the noble Lord, Lord Purvis, said, those seeking aid through the US-Israeli agency are being shot as they approach the distribution points. That cannot be right. We must be able to get proper aid in through the appropriate agencies.

[Baroness Browning (Con)]

Does the Minister share my concern that the first port of call for the Iranians to be provided with something not immediately available in the world—scientific expertise in nuclear weaponry, to replace the nuclear scientists whom we know have been killed—was Moscow? Is the Minister confident that, against the backdrop of the talks that will necessarily take place, and as we cannot yet identify what has happened to the uranium and given that particular port of call, we will keep our eye on the ball over what Iran will do in future?

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

The noble Baroness is right, and we should be concerned that that was the Iranian Foreign Minister’s first port of call, and we should be aware of what Putin said to him. However, that means it is imperative that we support President Trump, who has made it clear that the only long-term solution to ensuring Iran does not have a nuclear weapons capability is to “do a deal”, as the President puts it. We will absolutely be supporting our ally in achieving that fundamental objective.

[The Lord Bishop of Leeds]

My Lords, I am grateful for the Statement and the commitments the Government are making, but history teaches us that you cannot bomb an idea or a resentment out of existence. Going back to the comments made by the noble Lord, Lord Purvis, about the difference between strategy and tactics, what scenario planning are the Government doing to address the next three or four generations of terrorists who are being born amid the traumas of the current violence?

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

The right reverend Prelate makes an important point: that our actions should not be only in international diplomacy but should look at our communities at home and how we bring them together. It is also important that we ensure that all our communities are safe, and that is why we are taking every possible action, particularly against malign states who intend to intervene. He is right that we should focus on community building and ensuring that the terrible conditions do not provoke people into taking the kind of horrendous actions we have seen in the past.

[Lord Mohammed of Tinsley (LD)]

My Lords, I welcome the Statement from the Minister and urge the Government not to follow the drumbeat of escalation and to learn the lessons of Iraq in 2003. On the understandably delayed UN conference initiated by the French and the Saudis, and now that we have this window of opportunity with the ceasefire between Israel and Iran, what actions are the Government taking to bring forward as soon as possible the date for that meeting? It is urgently needed; we cannot take our eye off what is happening in Palestine, particularly in Gaza.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

The noble Lord is correct and as I said last week, we were extremely disappointed about the postponement of the conference, but it was inevitable because it was not going to be possible for all the participants who needed to attend to be there. Let me reassure the noble Lord that we are working very closely with the French and the Saudis to ensure that the two-state solution conference takes place as soon as possible. The Government will be working very hard to ensure that the conference is a success and that we can look towards the long-term future.

[Lord Hain (Lab)]

My Lords, I strongly support my noble friend the Minister in his position and observe that the stance taken by the noble Lord, Lord Callanan, is at complete variance with what his Government did in 14 years of power—which was not to start nuking everybody and seeking to attack aggressively, but to pursue the very diplomacy that he seeks to promote now. As a former UK Middle East Minister, I suggest that we need to recognise the two main fault-lines in this region: first, Palestine and Israel, and, secondly, Shia/Sunni, which means Iran and Saudi. What is needed is a regional summit of the Saudis, the Gulf states, Egypt, probably Jordan, certainly Israel and Iran as well, to try to provide a long-term stable plan for the region.

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

I agree with my noble friend and, as I said in response to the earlier question, that is why we have been working with France and the Saudis on the two-state solution. Of course, it looks extremely difficult to apply, but in working hard with allies in the region, I believe that that can be the long-term secure future that can resolve those issues.

I repeat that the Prime Minister, the Foreign Secretary and the Minister for the Middle East, not just in the past few days but all this week, have constantly been in touch with all our Middle East allies—across those divides, if you like—to ensure that we focus on long-term security, stability and de-escalation. That is what we have been focused on. The long-term solution to Iran’s nuclear capabilities is what President Trump said: do a deal and secure the long-term future.

[Lord Pickles (Con)]

My Lords, I congratulate the Government on their decision to move towards proscribing Palestine Action. I urge them to take the next logical step and proscribe the people who are paying for Palestine Action and for terrorism on our streets in Europe: the IRGC. Can they act quickly, because we need to make our streets safer?

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

I totally agree with the noble Lord that we need to make our streets safer. Iran’s destabilisation of the Middle East, human rights violations and nuclear escalation also include threats to people in the UK. All these actions are absolutely abhorrent, and we will not hesitate to take the most effective measures against the regime and the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. We are working at pace to identify further ways to deal with state threats, including those from the IRGC. On 4 March, we announced that we will place the Iranian state, including its intelligence services and the IRGC, on the enhanced tier of the new foreign influence registration scheme. As the Home Secretary announced to Parliament on Monday 19 May, the review of Jonathan Hall KC delivers a suite of recommendations to tackle state threats, and we are committed to taking them forward, including the creation of a new state threats proscription tool. I hope that the noble Lord will understand that we are focused on dealing with that threat.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

My Lords, I welcome and admire the way my noble friend the Minister has presented the case for the Government today, in his calm and measured way—in stark contrast to the belligerence of the Opposition spokesman. I am glad that my noble friend is in charge of these things and not the Opposition spokesman.

I ask my noble friend to reflect with me—and, I hope, come to the same conclusion—that western intervention in the affairs of the Middle East rarely seems to end happily, whether it is drawing boundaries, supplying arms or changing Governments. Can he assure me that the watchword of this Government—going forward on this series of crises, with new things happening every day—will be one of extreme caution? It is so much easier to get embroiled in a conflict there than it is to get out of one.

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

I appreciate my noble friend’s comments. I reassure the House that I am absolutely committed to working with all sides, including shadow Ministers opposite, to ensure that we put the security of this country first. There is no partisanship here; we want to work together to ensure the security of this country. My noble friend is right that, in a situation that can escalate so quickly, caution is absolutely essential. The key element here is how we work with our allies, not just those across the Atlantic but particularly those in the region. The noble Lord, Lord Ahmad, has not been provoked yet to ask me a question, but he has been absolutely right in his past contributions, particularly as Minister for the Middle East and North Africa, when he focused on building strong alliances with our allies. This Government and I are determined to follow in those footsteps.

[Lord Green of Deddington (CB)]

My Lords, as the Minister knows better than most of us, this is a very complex situation. The Government have handled it rather well so far; it has been a very complex week and the decisions taken have been very accurate. Nevertheless, I hope that the Government will be extremely careful in relation to Iran; that is where the difficulties will arise and where we could find ourselves, at short notice, in a very difficult situation.

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

I appreciate the comments of the noble Lord. We are determined to actually focus on all those diplomatic tools we have available. We are absolutely focused on that. I also reassure noble Lords that we did not participate in the US or Israeli strikes. We were given due notice, as we would expect as close allies of the US. We have been moving assets to the region to make sure that we are in a position to protect our own interests, personnel, assets and allies. Our first duty is to ensure that our forces and bases in the region are safe and secure. We have been moving assets to the region for that reason.

I agree with the noble Lord. We are cautious and absolutely focused on diplomatic efforts, but we remain committed to protecting our troops and assets.

[Lord Hussain (LD)]

My Lords, I welcome the Government’s Statement on the de-escalation of the crisis in Iran, but my heart bleeds for the people of Gaza who are being killed—men, women and children—while trying to collect food and water. According to Reuters, 44 people were killed by Israeli strikes in Gaza on Friday while collecting aid. Can the Minister assure the House that British weapons supplied to Israel are not used to kill innocent men, women and children in Gaza?

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

The simple answer to the noble Lord is that I can give him that assurance. We have absolutely complied with those licences. We stopped issuing licences for exports to Israel that could be used in Gaza. We are absolutely complying with what he says.

[Baroness Foster of Oxton (Con)]

My Lords, for more than 30 years, the leaders of the Arab League and its friends, the EU and Europe as a whole have sat on their hands and looked on as this despotic Islamic Republic of Iran has acquired nuclear capability. Does the Minister support the military action taken by the USA in endeavouring to destroy the imminent danger, not only to Israel but to the rest of the world in general? Would he also agree with me that securing the release of the 50 hostages still held in Gaza might go some way in alleviating this conflict?

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

I agree with the noble Baroness on the last part of her question. We have been very clear that the immediate release of all hostages is vital and we have been absolutely clear on the demand for an immediate ceasefire.

The noble Baroness implies something that is not necessarily the case. The US has taken action to alleviate the threat that Iran poses. As President Trump has repeatedly said, and said this morning, the long-term solution of stopping that threat—stopping Iran having nuclear weapons—is a deal, and I have confidence in President Trump in achieving that.

[Lord West of Spithead (Lab)]

My Lords, I have to congratulate the Government on the way they have been handling the current situation. I fought in a number of wars, and there is nothing like fighting in a war to make you realise that you do not want one. The actions we are taking I think will help stop that. Historically, bombing campaigns tend to never win a war, and they do not get you in that direction. Looking back historically, I worked at length with the Americans, our very close allies, in stopping Netanyahu attacking the Iranian nuclear facilities—this is going back a few years. The Minister will probably remember that they actually did dress rehearsals at time.

Can I just clarify with my noble friend the Minister that, if we want to have long-term security for Israel, the only way is to stop fighting and negotiate?

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

My noble friend is absolutely right and I pay tribute to him for his service to this country. He is absolutely right that in the long term—I keep repeating this—the US actions have resulted in alleviating the threat. President Trump has made it clear that the long-term solution is a deal, and that is what this Government will be focused on supporting. We have made it clear, and the Prime Minister and the Foreign Secretary have said to Iran, “Negotiate with the US and reach a deal that removes this threat for ever”.

[Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle (GP)]

My Lords, the noble Lord has spoken about short-term tactical victories versus long-term strategic outcomes. Iran is known to have had 400 kilograms of 60% purity enriched uranium. If it went to 90%, which is relatively easy, it could produce about 10 warheads. The International Atomic Energy Agency and JD Vance have both said they do not know where that uranium now is, and it can be moved in scuba tank-sized objects. A spokesperson for the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace said:

“It’s difficult to overstate what a big deal this is”


and called this a “potential disaster” for nuclear non-proliferation. Do the Government agree with that analysis?

[Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab)]

We absolutely agree about the threat that this poses. Nobody could have been more concerned to see, prior to the attacks on those nuclear sites, the long truckloads. We do not know where they were going or what was in them, but I think we can all assume that it was not just empty packages that were being taken out. That is why—I am sorry I keep repeating myself—President Trump knows that the actions that he took are not sufficient to remove this threat in the long term. A negotiated deal, with the presence of proper inspection that we have had, is absolutely vital for the future security of the region and the world as a whole.