Institute for Apprenticeships and Technical Education (Transfer of Functions etc) Bill [Lords]

Debate between Helen Hayes and Nusrat Ghani

2nd reading
Tuesday 25th February 2025 Commons Chamber

[Helen Hayes]

I thank the right hon. Member for his intervention. I was delighted recently to visit a school in my constituency, and a careers fair that gave young people the opportunity to meet many employers and providers of further education face to face, in order to give real meaning and reality to what such opportunities might provide in the future. It is important that young people have those opportunities.

Recently, I was delighted to visit the Lambeth college campus in Vauxhall, which is part of the Southbank University group, with my hon. Friend the Member for Vauxhall and Camberwell Green (Florence Eshalomi). We met young people engaged in cutting-edge training in robotics, renewable energy installation, dental technology and game design and production. They were being equipped with valuable skills to help them to access high-quality jobs, with the possibility, in some cases, of progressing their training all the way to degree level at the university.

The college is a good example of a strategic vision being applied to skills at a local level to ensure that employers’ needs are being met, and that the best possible opportunities are made available to young people, but not everywhere can benefit from such a strategic approach at present. I therefore welcome the Bill, which will formally establish Skills England. It is encouraging that this Government are giving further education and skills the strategic prominence they need, and seeking to establish an effective national agency to deliver a step change in the strategy that underpins our approach to skills and the quality and availability of training opportunities.

Skills England has been operating in shadow form within the Department for Education since July last year. Following the passage of the Bill, it will become an executive agency. This important Bill will work to underpin many of the strategic aims of the Government, including the delivery of economic growth, the skills to provide the additional 1.5 million homes that need to be built, and the skills to drive the urgently needed transition of our energy sector to achieve net zero, and the much-needed improvements in our national health service and in social care.

As the first Skills England report highlights, we currently have a fragmented and confusing landscape that lets down learners, frustrates businesses and holds back growth. The current system that the Government inherited has been badly neglected and urgent action is needed to deliver the change and scale of ambition required.

While I welcome the Bill, there are a number of issues on which I would be grateful for further clarity from the Government. The Bill does not provide a statutory underpinning for Skills England, meaning that the Secretary of State and future Secretaries of State can make fundamental changes to Skills England or close it down without the consent of Parliament. That calls into question the ability of Skills England to deliver a stable long-term underpinning of the skills system over a period of time. I understand the Government’s urgency, but it is important that in delivering this change Skills England is placed on a really solid foundation.

In order to be effective in delivering the skills system that our country needs, Skills England will need to have leverage with a number of different Government Departments beyond the Department for Education, yet the chief executive of Skills England is the equivalent of a director-level post in the civil service, not a director general, calling into question the extent to which appropriately senior people from across Government will be required to act on its recommendations and work in effective partnership. As the Bill progresses, the Government should consider the seniority of the CEO in that light.

Partnership working with key stakeholders outside Government, including training providers, trade unions, employers and devolved authorities will also be critical to the success of Skills England, but none of that is written into the Bill, and the ways in which Skills England will be held accountable for effective partnership working are unclear. Will the Secretary of State take further action to address that?

The impact statement for the Bill states that there may be a drop in apprenticeship starts while the Institute for Apprenticeships and Technical Education’s functions are transferred to the Secretary of State and then to Skills England, with a disproportionate impact on adult apprenticeships, disadvantaged learners and disadvantaged regions. Will the Secretary of State explain what steps she will take to minimise and mitigate that potential short-term drop?

The success of Skills England will depend on a series of wider factors that should be considered at the point at which it is being established. There is a significant issue with the funding of sixth form colleges, particularly around inequities in pay between teachers in schools and colleges, exacerbated by the failure to extend the recent pay increase to teachers to those employed by colleges. It cannot be right that a teacher in a college can be paid less than a teacher in a school sixth form for teaching exactly the same subject.

To drive parity of esteem between pupils following an academic route and those following a vocational route, it is important that sixth form colleges are able to both recruit and retain teachers. That means addressing the lower pay in sixth form colleges compared with schools, and the gap between teacher salaries and the salaries that teachers could receive in industry. It is a real problem for colleges seeking to recruit teachers of vocational subjects that those who have the skills to teach trade can often earn far more by practising that trade in the private sector. There is currently very little obligation on industry to release staff to deliver vocational education or to help to secure the pipeline of vocational teachers, including through post-retirement options. The Government should give further consideration to the recruitment and retention of high-quality teachers in the further education sector.

For some students in the further education sector, their school days have not been the happiest days of their lives. College or an apprenticeship should be the place where they start to find the things that they can excel at and where their confidence is built because they start to succeed. The importance of a functional level of English and maths is universally accepted and understood, so something is badly wrong in our education system when 38% of students do not achieve a grade 3 or above in English and maths at GCSE. The cycle of failure ends up continuing in the FE sector, which requires them to resit again and again. There must be a better way to ensure the functional skills in these subjects that employers need within further education, while enabling young people genuinely to succeed, build their confidence and thrive.

Finally, I will raise the issue of the huge differential in the information provided to sixth form students as they decide on their next steps after school or college—a point made by the right hon. Member for South Holland and The Deepings (Sir John Hayes) earlier in the debate. When meeting with skills providers and school leaders in my constituency recently, many participants highlighted how a move to university was often presented as a natural, secure step, with multiple options and a well-trodden path through the UCAS process, while vocational options, including apprenticeships and degree apprenticeships, were not presented with the same clarity or coherence, or even within the same timeframe. That makes it harder for teachers to advise their students and for parents to have confidence in pathways that may appear less predictable and secure. If we want to see true parity of esteem between academic and vocational routes, that needs to change, and I hope that it will be a priority for the newly established Skills England.

The Education Committee recognises the strategic importance of further education and skills, and we have recently launched a substantial inquiry that aims to understand how the further education system can better equip young people with skills and qualifications for a range of sectors experiencing labour shortages while opening up a wider range of opportunities to young people and mid-career switchers. We will make our recommendations to the Government in due course, and we look forward to playing our part in scrutinising the work of Skills England.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Ms Nusrat Ghani)]

I call the Liberal Democrat spokesperson.

Higher Education Regulatory Approach

Debate between Helen Hayes and Nusrat Ghani

Wednesday 15th January 2025 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Ms Nusrat Ghani)]

I call the Chair of the Select Committee.

[Helen Hayes (Dulwich and West Norwood) (Lab)]

I thank the Secretary of State for confirming the Government’s approach to the implementation of the Higher Education (Freedom of Speech) Act 2023, and I welcome the clarity that she has provided today.

The implementation of the Act will present some challenges for universities and for students. The Secretary of State will know that there can sometimes be a fine line between free speech and hate speech, and between statements of views and opinions and incitement or encouragement to violence or intimidation in the real world. Can she assure the House that she will ensure that universities and students are absolutely clear about the limits to free speech, which are already enshrined in law, and that support will be provided on the interpretation of that when it is needed?

Professor Shitij Kapur, vice-chancellor and president of King’s College London, has said:

“Universities are not there to function as a Speakers’ Corner where anyone can stand up and express an opinion not necessarily supported by facts. If academic freedom is to mean anything, it must be accompanied by the academic obligation for ideas and claims to be accompanied by evidence and reason. Proponents have an obligation to engage and respond to those questioning their assertions and conduct that debate and discourse in a civil manner.”

How will the Secretary of State ensure—particularly as the erosion of fact-checking and moderation on social media is taking place before our very eyes—that the implementation of the Act results in a high quality of evidence-based discourse conducted in a culture of civility?

Children’s Wellbeing and Schools Bill

Debate between Helen Hayes and Nusrat Ghani

Wednesday 8th January 2025 Commons Chamber

[Sarah Dyke (Glastonbury and Somerton) (LD)]

The hon. Lady mentions school breakfast. Child obesity is up by a third and diabetes is up by a fifth. Does she agree that, while free breakfast clubs are a great opportunity to ensure children are fed, we must also ensure that school meals are healthy and nutritious; and that, alongside the Bill, school food standards need to be updated in line with the most recent nutritional advice, making it clear that they apply to breakfast?

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Ms Nusrat Ghani)]

Order. We have a very long speaking list, so interventions must be short.

[Helen Hayes]

I agree with the hon. Lady that school food, in whichever setting it is delivered, should be of the highest quality. She will know about the pressures on school budgets. My constituency has experienced among the highest drops in funding for local schools of anywhere in the country. That has eroded the money that schools have to spend on high-quality food. I know that that is one of the areas on which those on the Government Front Bench will be anxious to deliver over time as public finances permit.

The measures to support care leavers are welcome, but are limited to extended Staying Close support and requiring local authorities to publish the details of their offer. What further measures does the Minister intend to take to improve outcomes for care leavers and to ensure they get the same opportunities as their peers? Only 14% of care leavers go to university compared with 46% of non-care-experienced young people. What further measures will the Government take to support care leavers to access and stay in higher education? Why are the Government not proposing a national offer for care leavers to address the postcode lottery in care, in particular to provide care leavers with the confidence that if they choose to attend university away from home, because that is the best option for them, the same support will be available to them wherever they study?

The policies and practices of other Departments also have a profound effect on the experience of care leavers. Can the Minister confirm whether, outside of the Bill, the Government are still considering the expansion of corporate parenting duties, so that every part of the state is required to take seriously its duty to looked-after children and care-experienced people?

Finally, to deliver on the commitments in the Bill, those who work with children and families will need support. There are challenges in recruitment and retention across many of the professions, from social work to teaching to the early years. Will the Government set out a workforce strategy to ensure that training places, continuing professional development and effective recruitment strategies are in place to secure the staff we need to deliver the transformation our children deserve? The Bill will introduce a series of measures that will start the process of rebuilding support for children and their families, and that is very welcome. My Committee will continue to take an interest in the detail of the Bill and seek to ensure that it is as effective as it can be in delivering a system that can support every child to thrive, and in contributing to the debate about the further steps, beyond the scope of the Bill, that will also be needed.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Ms Nusrat Ghani)]

I call the Liberal Democrat spokesperson.

Child Sexual Exploitation and Abuse

Debate between Helen Hayes and Nusrat Ghani

Monday 6th January 2025 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Ms Nusrat Ghani)]

I call the Education Committee Chair, Helen Hayes.

[Helen Hayes (Dulwich and West Norwood) (Lab)]

Several years ago, I supported, over a number of months, a constituent of mine who suffered horrific sexual abuse as a child in the care of Lambeth council, as she prepared to give evidence to the independent inquiry on child sexual abuse, chaired by Professor Jay. It was unimaginably hard for victims and survivors to give evidence to that inquiry, reliving the abuse that they suffered and being retraumatised. The fact that they did so was exceptionally important, and I pay tribute to their courage. My constituent and thousands of other victims and survivors gave their evidence so that their experiences could be at the heart of Professor Jay’s recommendations. Does the Home Secretary agree that if we are really to put victims and survivors first, the priority must be to act on what they have already told us, and to implement the IICSA recommendations at pace, and in full?

Qualifications Reform Review

Debate between Helen Hayes and Nusrat Ghani

Thursday 12th December 2024 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Ms Nusrat Ghani)]

I call the Chair of the Education Committee.

[Helen Hayes (Dulwich and West Norwood) (Lab)]

I pay tribute to everyone who works in further education—a vital sector that makes a transformative difference, and whose importance is often not properly recognised. Vocational and technical courses and qualifications are a critical part of our education system, yet schools, colleges and students have faced great uncertainty as a consequence of the previous Government’s decision to defund a number of applied general qualifications. I welcome the additional certainty that the Minister has provided by committing to maintain some AGQs and pause any further changes until 2027.

The landscape of vocational qualifications is indeed too complex and confusing, but the cliff-edge approach adopted by the previous Government had significant adverse consequences. My Committee has heard evidence that the previous Government’s plans have already had material impacts, because some colleges have modelled the proposed reduction in courses and now face potential insolvency as a result. What support will the Government provide to colleges that have already planned and committed to their qualification offering for September 2025, based on the previous Government’s decision to defund, and now face further changes?

The Committee has also heard evidence of the success of T-levels for those who complete them, particularly in areas such as healthcare. However, T-levels account for just 10% of all vocational courses, and continue to have a worryingly high drop-out rate. What further work are the Government planning between now and 2027 to reform T-levels and make them accessible to a wider range of students, including students with special educational needs and disabilities, before any further changes to AGQs are made? My Committee understands the value and potential of T-levels, but it is vital that in pursuing this route as the predominant option for technical and vocational training, the Government are not locking some young people out of the opportunity to learn, succeed and thrive.

Respect Orders and Antisocial Behaviour

Debate between Helen Hayes and Nusrat Ghani

Wednesday 27th November 2024 Commons Chamber

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

I call the Chair of the Education Select Committee.

[Helen Hayes (Dulwich and West Norwood) (Lab)]

I welcome the measures that the Minister has set out today and the Government’s commitment to tackling antisocial behaviour, which is an urgent issue in my constituency, particularly in town centres. But the most urgent issue that we face in tackling these issues is the number of police officers. My hon. Friend will be aware that the previous Government allocated funding to recruit police officers, and then withdrew it when the Met was unable to meet its target due to a set of unique challenges in London. Can my right hon. Friend give her firm assurance that the unique challenges facing the Met are fully understood, and that the Government will provide it with the resources that it needs to tackle this very serious issue in our communities?

Education and Opportunity

Debate between Helen Hayes and Nusrat Ghani

Wednesday 24th July 2024 Commons Chamber

[Helen Hayes (Dulwich and West Norwood) (Lab)]

May I start by congratulating you, Madam Deputy Speaker, on your election, and say what a great pleasure it is to see you in your place? I also congratulate the Secretary of State on her appointment. I know how deep her commitment is to increasing opportunity and adjusting disadvantage for children across our country.

Education from the early years through school and on to further and higher education is arguably the most important tool in the Government’s box for addressing disadvantage. I am therefore delighted to see that breaking down the barriers to opportunity at every stage is one of the core missions of this Labour Government.

Labour has always recognised the importance of education as a route to addressing poverty, disadvantage and inequality, as well as to driving economic growth. It is at the heart of what we believe in and at the heart of what we have always delivered in government—from comprehensive schools to the Open University, from Sure Start to the London Challenge for school improvement.

This new Labour Government will continue in that proud tradition of delivering for our children and young people with free breakfast clubs in every primary school; new nursery places across the country; open access mental health support in schools and communities; more teachers in our schools; a new fit-for-purpose curriculum; a further education sector to deliver the skills that young people need to thrive and our economy needs to grow; and new support to protect young people from serious violence.

I wish to highlight today, as we discuss the commitment of this new Government and also the mess that they have inherited after 14 years of Conservative cuts to children's services, some of the issues that are most pressing in my constituency. Services are now really stretched to the limit as they seek to support children, young people and their families.

The first issue is the funding crisis facing maintained nursery schools, which often provide a gold standard of early years education. Some 64 % of them are located in areas with the greatest deprivation. I have two in my constituency: Effra nursery school and children’s centre and Dulwich Wood nursery school. They are constituted as schools, and therefore have the additional expertise—and also the additional costs—of fully qualified headteachers and teaching staff. The number of maintained nurseries has already dropped dramatically and only 400 now remain, many of which face severe financial difficulties. I therefore urge the Government to bring forward measures in the Budget to ensure that the depth of knowledge, expertise and quality in our maintained nursery schools is not lost, and that they are put on a sustainable financial footing.

The second issue is special educational needs and disabilities support. I am grateful to the Secretary of State for mentioning the work that I did in this regard when we were in opposition. In the context of the decimation of local authority funding since 2010 and with increasing presentation of additional needs across the country, local councils and schools are simply buckling under the pressure of resources that they do not have and needs that they cannot meet, while families are suffering the consequences.

At a recent visit to an outstanding school in my constituency, the headteacher broke down as she described the conflict of seeking to be an inclusive school with the reality of simply not having the funding that she needed to deliver for children with additional needs. Increasingly, local authorities are being driven to the edge of financial viability by the costs of SEND support and SEND transport. I really welcome this Government’s focus on the inclusivity of mainstream schools, but they will need to work very closely with the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government and the Department of Health and Social Care to ensure that there is a sustainable approach to funding SEND support, which schools cannot deliver in isolation.

Thirdly, the outcomes for care-experienced people after 14 years of Conservative Government are utterly disgraceful. The system is so broken that frequently the state takes the decision to remove a child from their family because they are not considered to be safe, and places them in an environment in which they are even less safe and secure. Care-experienced people are so over-represented in both the criminal justice system and the homeless population because they are being so badly failed. If the Government are serious about tackling these challenges, they must turn their attention to delivering better support and better outcomes for care-experienced people.

One way that this situation could be turned around is through the development of a new care experience covenant, placed on a statutory footing, requiring every part of the public sector to take the responsibilities of corporate parenting seriously, supported by a national care leaver offer. I wonder whether the Minister is able to make any commitments in that regard today.

Finally, the Conservative Government changed the schools funding formula to remove the disadvantage weighting. That had the effect of proactively funnelling funding away from schools in constituencies such as mine with high levels of deprivation to more affluent areas of the country, and my local schools are really feeling the impact as they seek to provide an excellent education for every child.

Will the Minister give an undertaking to look at the schools funding formula, to ensure both that schools in the most disadvantaged areas of the country have the resources they need to deliver for every child, and that the formula itself is no longer pitting different areas of the country against each other, but represents a genuine levelling up of the resources for our schools?

I know that this Government will transform the life chances of children and young people across our country and make sure that no child is left behind. I look forward to seeing further plans come to fruition, as children, young people and their life chances are once again placed where they should be—at the centre of our national life.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Ms Ghani)]

As we have many maiden speeches to enjoy and Back-Bench contributions, may I ask those on the Front Bench to keep their speeches short? I call the Liberal Democrat spokesperson.