Funeral Plans: Regulation

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Wednesday 5th June 2019 Commons Chamber

[Neil Gray]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention, and it would not be an Adjournment debate without his intervening.

The hon. Gentleman raises an important issue, which is the current status of the Funeral Planning Authority, which I will come on to discuss in greater detail in my speech. He is right that it is a voluntary body at the moment, and there has been much debate about whether the best route of regulating this market is through putting the FPA on a statutory footing or through Financial Conduct Authority regulation. The Government appear to be looking at FCA regulation, which I am happy enough with, although I do have some concerns about the direction of travel, which I will ask the Minister to look at. The hon. Gentleman is right. At the moment, the FPA perhaps does not have the teeth to regulate the market properly. It would acknowledge that although it has done a great deal of work in this area since my ten-minute rule Bill was introduced, if it were to have a full suite of powers to regulate the market properly, that would require it to become a statutory body.

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

The hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) is right. My hon. Friend the Member for Airdrie and Shotts (Neil Gray) brings a great number of important issues to the Chamber, and this is one on which he has spoken many times. He will be pleased to know that this week I heard from a local family-run funeral service in my constituency, who expressed support for the Treasury proposals and for enhanced consumer protection. He made the point that most funeral firms, as we know from the Treasury proposals, are small and micro businesses. He is concerned, given that the majority of funerals are delivered by those businesses, that such businesses could be at competitive disadvantage compared with larger providers and threatened by the cost of FCA regulations. What are my hon. Friend’s thoughts on that?

[Neil Gray]

I am well aware of that family-run business, and I share its concerns. My hon. Friend speaks well for them, and it is a point that I wish to make. How do the Government protect competition in the market to make sure that smaller funeral providers and funeral plan providers are not squeezed out of the market by the burden of FCA regulation? Of all the criticisms of the route that the Government have chosen, that is the one that is expressed most keenly by people in the market.

Given the number of funeral plans that have been sold in recent years and the growth in the sector, it is critical that we get the regulation right and ensure that consumers are protected. The Citizens Advice report published a few years ago gave examples of mis-selling—people were promised particular aspects of a funeral, but when the plan was redeemed they were told that that was not part of the deal. Particular cars, coffins or flowers that were chosen for sentimental reasons, for example, were not delivered, although people thought they had paid for them. There have been widespread reports of bad sales practices such as cold calling, aggressive selling and the targeting of vulnerable customers.

Since I introduced my ten-minute rule Bill, which proposed the areas of regulation that the Government now appear to have adopted, a significant amount of change has taken place in the market. The FPA, as I have said, has taken great steps to reform its practices as a voluntary market regulator, and it suggests that 95% of the market has signed up to its regulatory model. There have been great moves across the market to reform practices, including by plan providers themselves. Some of them are moving away from the third-party selling model that appeared to be problematic and was part of the 5% issue that concerns us all. I am pleased that my Bill proposal, which was intended to spark debate and action for change, has led to that progress. I am grateful to the Minister for taking action.

Discrimination in Football

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Thursday 11th April 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mims Davies]

Our football experience, both home and abroad, is vital, and that is where we can use our standing. The Lionesses will play in the World cup this summer in France, alongside the Scottish women’s team. The Euro semi-finals are coming up, and the women’s European championship in 2021 will be played here in England. We can use the fact that all eyes will be on football on these shores to show that, both home and away, we do the right thing.

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

Sectarianism, racism and homophobia have no place in football, and some clubs—and indeed the FA—could look to the women’s game for good examples, or indeed to my own football club, Livingston FC, where I used to sell the odd pie when I was a student. I thank the Minister for her statement and her bold actions. The FA chairman has recognised the women’s game as a beacon of inclusivity. The Minister said that we do the right thing abroad, but let us not forget that the World cup will soon be held in Qatar—a country that should never have got it in the first place and where it is illegal to be homosexual. We must take stronger action against such countries, and perhaps consider withholding teams from going there, in order to send the strongest possible message.

[Mims Davies]

As ever, the hon. Lady makes some pertinent points, and I know she feels passionate about this issue. I have met representatives from Qatar, and said that when we send fans abroad we expect them to be safe, to enjoy the football, and to be who they want to be. Our fans should, and must, be supported.

Gambling-Related Harm

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Tuesday 19th March 2019 Westminster Hall

[Carolyn Harris]

I certainly do. It appears that we are able to protect the vulnerable only when we let the press know of such stories, because the industry refuses to take responsibility for its actions.

The first priority of our APPG will be to look at the harms caused by the growth of online gambling. According to recent reports on British gambling behaviour, the prevalence of problem gambling among those who gamble online—at the casino, the slots and the bingo-style games—is very similar to its prevalence among those who play FOBTs. Currently, there are close to 3 million problem and at-risk gamblers in the UK, and 10% of them play online casino, slots and bingo.

The size, scale and structure of the industry are driving the harms that are being caused. The APPG has heard that the remote gambling sector is being run in a way that is totally unsustainable; in some cases, online companies are actively seeking to drive harmful gambling behaviour and large-scale bets to ensure their own profitability. A recent PricewaterhouseCoopers report for the Gambling Commission found that 59% of the profits of remote gambling companies come from people with gambling addictions or problematic gambling behaviour. Those companies’ models are based not on building long-term relationships with loyal customers, but on extracting as much money as possible from people, particularly those who exhibit more risky behaviour and place large bets until they effectively run out of money. The companies then move on to find other customers, and they seek to incentivise their staff to do so. Their constant drive for profit and new customers means that they have no incentive to seek a reduction in problematic behaviour. Problem gambling and high-stakes play are entirely in their interests.

Those companies’ frantic search for new customers and greater levels of spending has, in turn, led to a huge increase in gambling advertising. We have heard about cases of vulnerable gamblers being offered VIP status to encourage them to gamble and rack up huge losses. Equally, we have heard rumours about some operators not paying out to those who have rightly won money; they are happy to encourage those who regularly lose to gamble more, while restricting bets from more successful players. The message is clear: people should not go into online gambling with the expectation that they will win. The only customers that those companies want are those who lose.

There are now more diverse gambling products and experiences on offer than ever before, including live sports betting, in-play gaming and, more recently, mobile gaming. Those are relatively new products that differ from traditional bookmaking, and concerns have understandably been raised about player safety and protection, particularly for the vulnerable. Furthermore, the ease of deposit, the electronic nature of money spent, the slowness of withdrawals, the ability to reverse withdrawals, and the targeting of gamblers who win with offers to encourage further play all have the potential to create a harmful gambling environment.

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

The hon. Lady is making an excellent speech, and I commend her for the incredible work that she has done on problem gambling to date. Does she agree that the technology underlying a lot of these online games and gambling products is completely opaque? We have no idea how it is targeting people or how it works, and until we get to the bottom of that issue, much of this problem is going to be difficult to tackle.

[Carolyn Harris]

It has long been acknowledged that technology has left legislation way behind—in the dark ages, in some cases. Whereas there are clear limits on the maximum stakes, prizes and spin speed of gambling machines in betting shops and casinos, and big cash deposits are subject to fraud and money laundering checks, online gambling lacks similar limits. The APPG has met many times with Liz and Charles Ritchie, the incredibly courageous parents of Jack, who tragically took his own life in 2017 following an addiction that began on FOBTs. Jo Holloway’s son, Daniel, also took his own life after becoming addicted to online gambling. Those are terrible tragedies, but they are just the tip of the iceberg. Every day, approximately 70 to 80 people contact me—as I am sure they contact colleagues present—to tell me how desperate a situation they and their families are in.

What should we do to improve things? The APPG is undertaking its inquiry and will make a series of recommendations—I am sure Members would be disappointed if it did not. We will be looking at the need for new legislation, as the current legislation is unable to address adequately the loopholes created by this relatively new part of the gaming industry, and we will be taking detailed evidence from key stakeholders. Our initial view, however, is that there should be far more stringent affordability checks by gambling companies. Banks also have a role to play in carrying out those checks; a number of challenger banks and traditional banks have already put such measures in place, but it is important that all banks and financial institutions follow suit and implement that feature.

Online gambling companies should commit to funding blocking software, and offer it for free to customers who self-exclude from their sites. The sector needs to adopt a more responsible approach to advertising during sports programmes, especially to protect children and the vulnerable. I welcome the whistle-to-whistle television ban, but in order for the advertising ban to be truly effective, those companies need to go further and include shirt and league sponsorship, as well as digital advertising around pitches. Otherwise, children and vulnerable adults will continue to be bombarded with gambling adverts throughout those events.

It is also worth bearing in mind that it is the broadcasters that have been most resistant to the clampdown on advertising. The TV companies have to take an important role and admit that this issue needs to be tackled. Serious consideration must be given to a statutory levy to fund harm prevention projects, support for those who have been harmed by gambling, and research into gambling and suicide. We must also stop the use of credit cards to gamble online; it is inconceivable that somebody should be able to rack up debt in order to gamble.

Above all, the industry needs to take responsibility for itself. Remote gambling is a growing industry, and it must learn the lessons of fixed odds betting terminals. It cannot be that time after time the Government must step in to prevent large and financially powerful industries from disregarding the harm they are doing to the vulnerable in society. The scourge of online gambling is becoming a matter of national urgency. We cannot sit back and let those problems continue, and I will not do so.

--- Later in debate ---

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

It is a pleasure to speak under your chairmanship, Mr McCabe. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Inverclyde (Ronnie Cowan) not just on securing the debate but on his incredible, dogged work on the issue. He has pursued it with serious vigour and—as I am sure applies to other Members who have worked on the matter of fixed odds betting terminals—under huge pressure from betting firms.

I draw attention to what the Library briefing for the debate says about the statutory levy:

“Under section 123 of the 2005 Act, the Secretary of State can make regulations requiring gambling operators to pay an annual levy to the Gambling Commission.”

The reality is that there are powers. More needs to be done, but existing powers are not even being implemented. Many Members have given statistics and spoken about the challenges and issues, and the damage that gambling-related harm is doing to society and communities. I draw the attention of the Chamber to a study by Robert Lustig, who is a professor of paediatrics, with a focus on endocrinology, at the University of California, San Francisco. He is also the author of “The Hacking of the American Mind”. He told a conference on technology addiction that the brain reacts to technology similarly to the way it reacts to other addictive substances:

“Technology, like all other ‘rewards’, can overrelease dopamine”.

In 2017 we heard that the level of extreme internet use among UK teenagers is among the highest in the OECD. The think-tank, the Education Policy Institute, reported in 2017 that more than a third of 15-year-olds can be classed as extreme internet users—meaning that they use it for six-plus hours a day. If that is translated into online gambling and its proliferation we are heading for a serious crisis among young people—the adults of tomorrow.

Much has changed since I was an avid gamer, playing such games as “Sonic the Hedgehog” in search of gold rings. Loot boxes were not a thing. I have recently learned a lot more about them. I am the Scottish National party spokesperson on digital, culture, media and sport. The party takes online harms seriously and I have increasing concerns about them. I know that the Government want to get things right in the White Paper, but they need to speed up the process. There are clearly huge issues for young people—to do not only with gambling but with pornography. Loot boxes are clearly gambling, and we share the concern about them. They allow players of online video games—usually children—to pay money for an unknown prize. I read through some of the recommendations in ParentZone, which include measures such as not having credit or debit cards attached to children’s profiles.

Earlier I mentioned education, and a couple of weeks ago there was a Westminster Hall debate on the importance of sex education in school, and of not removing children from that. It was concerning to hear the number of Members who backed what, to my mind, was an ill-informed online petition. Many people said that parents should be allowed to teach their children about sex and teach social and religious education at home, but in reality many children and young people are vulnerable, particularly online, and their parents may not have the facilities and information to support them at home.

Loot boxes are used in the context of an uptake in gambling by young people, and it has been reported that 40% of 11 to 16-year-olds engage in gambling. Horseracing was mentioned earlier, and I was recently visited by Bill Alexander, who runs an organisation called Sportjumping. He had some concerning facts, which I will write to the Minister about. His view was that the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport withheld information that levy contributions from the betting industry are offset as tax credits from the EU competition commission, and he queried state aid for the sport. Horseracing generates a huge amount of money and is very popular, but there are concerns about it, such as the fact that many jockeys suffer from osteoporosis, have to “sweat down”, or have depression as a result of weight loss, not to mention the number of horses that are killed. I hope the Minister will consider that issue.

HMRC Estate Transformation

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Tuesday 29th January 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mel Stride]

The simple fact is that the Government are adopting an efficient approach to the use of our resources, including across HMRC. We do that for a distinct purpose: it allows us to spend more money on the things that our country expects us to spend money on, such as vital public services, including the national health service, where we will be spending £84 billion more over the next few years than under the previous Labour Government. I make no apologies for doing things that drive efficiency and allow us to support health and public services.

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

On value for money, the Minister is either sadly mistaken or badly briefed, because the reality for the 1,000 staff in my constituency is that they are going to one of the most expensive retail units in all of Scotland when they move to Edinburgh. Does he think it acceptable that, as I understand it from the PCS union, staff will be expected to sit in armchairs about which occupational therapists have huge concerns and that staff who have disabilities or who are in wheelchairs have been told that if they cannot reach the screen or the plug sockets on their desks someone else can do it for them?

[Mel Stride]

Clearly, I am not in a position to comment on very specific remarks about armchairs, but if the hon. Lady would like to raise the matter with me outside of this statement, I would be very happy to discuss it with her.

Oral Answers to Questions

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Tuesday 29th January 2019 Commons Chamber

[Mr Hammond]

In a very short while, after a very important statement that is about to be made by my right hon. Friend the Financial Secretary to the Treasury, the Prime Minister will set out her case to the House, and the hon. Gentleman and all his colleagues will be able to consider carefully what is now in the national interest.

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

Can the Chancellor explain to people across the UK what the point is in balancing the books if it is done on the backs of the poorest in our society and they are being starved into shoplifting? In Dundee recently, a woman was left with £90 a month on which to live. The sheriff said that it was a matter of considerable concern that someone was trying to live on £90 a month. What does he say to the judiciary and what does he say to our citizens who are being starved into poverty?

[Mr Hammond]

Earlier in this session, I said that, if we want to have well-funded public services and a well-funded welfare support system, we must ensure that we have a sound economy. Part of having a sound economy is to get our deficit under control and our debt falling so that we are less vulnerable to shocks in the future. Our current levels of debt mean that this country is vulnerable in the event of an economic downturn. Such downturns come along from time to time, and we need to be able to manage them in order, precisely, to protect the poorest in our society.

Finance (No. 3) Bill

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Committee: 2nd sitting: House of Commons
Tuesday 20th November 2018 Commons Chamber

[Alison Thewliss]

That is indeed astonishing, and if it is a problem, the Government ought to be looking at it. People living in Scotland should pay the appropriate amount of tax, because that is the price we pay for living in a civilised society. That is what the Minister said in his speech earlier. We also have to look at what we get for our taxes in Scotland. We get a better, fairer society, which is good for us all. All the academics in this field recognise that a fair society is better for us all.

Last year, this Government opposed my amendment to the Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Bill that would have increased the transparency of Scottish limited partnerships by ensuring that those partnerships had bank accounts. We are still waiting for a response from the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy on the consultation that closed on 23 July this year.

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

I served on that Bill Committee with my hon. Friend, and the work that she did was excellent. Does she share my concern about the damage being done to Scotland’s reputation by Scottish limited partnerships? The partnerships are nothing to do with the Scottish Government, they have not been legislated for in Scotland and we have no power over them there, but they are doing serious damage to Scotland’s reputation internationally, and the UK Government need to act.

[Alison Thewliss]

This Government absolutely do need to act on this issue. It cannot be right that something we have no control over becomes a noose around our neck when it comes to our reputation internationally. I expect this Government to come forward with something on this soon, because their not doing so allows this to continue to happen. The Herald, whose journalist David Leask has been a constant campaigner on this issue, has reported that

“in the year to March 2016, 95% of SLPs were set up by offshore tax havens.”

That ought to ring alarm bells for this Government, given the likely sums of money involved in these tax havens. I have tabled more parliamentary questions on this today, but the last time I checked, no fines had been issued to those SLPs that have not yet registered a person of significant control. Even pursuing those fines against SLPs could have brought large sums of money into the strapped Treasury coffers, never mind dealing with the underlying lack of transparency surrounding SLPs.

It is no secret that SLPs are being abused to carry out crimes abroad and launder money and that the anonymity they provide enables all this, but this Government are simply not doing enough to stop it. There was some progress after the Salisbury attack, and there was talk of clamping down specifically on Russian dirty money, but we have not yet seen that happen. We need to know what the Government’s plans are, because we cannot allow this to continue. I commend to the Minister the investigation on Uzbekistan by David Leask and Richard Smith, because the sums of money and levels of corruption involved are absolutely hair-raising.

The SNP has put forward many sensible proposals to crack down on tax evasion and avoidance, but they have been rejected by this Government time after time. No action has been taken on enforcing the people of significant control rules governing SLPs. No action has been taken on the alternative investment market loophole that allows families to register homes as business properties, effectively overriding inheritance tax. No action has been taken to make online retailers liable for tax avoidance when they falsely classify their goods as gifts. And no action has been taken to create a legal framework to combat tech firms who avoid corporation tax by registering implausibly low profits in the UK.

[Hannah Bardell]

On top of all that inaction, does my hon. Friend share my concern about the centralisation of HMRC offices? Highly skilled staff will lose their jobs because of this Government’s centralising agenda. In my constituency, more than 1,000 jobs are being moved from West Lothian to Edinburgh, which will create huge issues.

[Alison Thewliss]

I agree that that loss of expertise is a huge issue. I have a constituency interest, because many of these centralised offices end up being in Glasgow Central, but this also comes at a significant cost to the taxpayer. It is no secret that city centre office space in Glasgow is expensive, and there would be greater benefits in keeping those services in areas such as the Clyde Gateway, which is also in my constituency but much cheaper, or in Livingston. That would provide better value for money for the taxpayer than having them all in city centre offices.

Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Bill [ Lords ] (Sixth sitting)

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Tuesday 6th March 2018 Public Bill Committees

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

I am a little perplexed by what the Minister said. It seems that he conflated the comments of my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow Central with the intent of the amendment, which is to encourage—not to compel—Governments in overseas territories to do that. Perhaps I am mistaken and he can clarify that, but it seems that there is a misrepresentation.

--- Later in debate ---

Some of the checking that has been talked about is not necessarily as onerous as the Minister suggests. I am sure many of us will be familiar, if we try to buy tickets—something like that—with having to put in basic identification information. We have to put our name in; the system will check that our postcode matches our address. Currently, you do not have to go to those lengths with Companies House.

[Hannah Bardell]

Does the hon. Lady agree that we are letting our citizens down if we do not legislate properly and close these loopholes? I am sure we have all had constituency cases where people have lost money to unscrupulous companies and company owners. We have an opportunity to take action, and we must take it. The Government are letting citizens down if they do not accept the new clauses.

[Anneliese Dodds]

I am grateful to the hon. Lady for making the point clearly that our proposal has been portrayed as only a burden, when it could help to prevent our constituents from being ripped off by unscrupulous individuals who are able to set themselves up as a company with only minimum requirements for due diligence. As I said, they can be there by day, fly off by night, and leave the unfortunate person who dealt with that company in a very difficult position.

To end my remarks specifically on the Minister’s comments on new clause 13, many of us are worried that, in practice, there are TCSPs that offer UK company formation with a range of optional services, including setting up bank accounts in other jurisdictions such as Latvia, Belize, Switzerland and Cyprus. That would not necessarily be a problem, were it not for the fact that, time and again, we have seen in the cases we have discussed in this Committee that reliance on the third parties—the banks in those other countries—does not lead to a real assurance that money laundering provisions are being followed. The reality is quite the opposite.

In the Russian laundromat scandal, which we have already talked about, of the 440 UK shell companies used in the scheme—in itself, a staggering statistic—392 of them had Baltic bank accounts, with 270 UK firms using Latvian banks and 122 using banks in Estonia. It may be that we are fully confident in every case that anti-money laundering regulations were followed in those countries, but given some of what came out of the Russian laundromat scandal, it could be suggested that that is not the case.

We do need to get at this problem through another route. We need reform of the Companies House system, but we also need the use of another prong, which is requiring a UK bank account.

Question put, That the clause be read a Second time.

Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Bill [Lords] (Sixth sitting)

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Tuesday 6th March 2018 Public Bill Committees

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

I am a little perplexed by what the Minister said. It seems that he conflated the comments of my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow Central with the intent of the amendment, which is to encourage—not to compel—Governments in overseas territories to do that. Perhaps I am mistaken and he can clarify that, but it seems that there is a misrepresentation.

--- Later in debate ---

Some of the checking that has been talked about is not necessarily as onerous as the Minister suggests. I am sure many of us will be familiar, if we try to buy tickets—something like that—with having to put in basic identification information. We have to put our name in; the system will check that our postcode matches our address. Currently, you do not have to go to those lengths with Companies House.

[Hannah Bardell]

Does the hon. Lady agree that we are letting our citizens down if we do not legislate properly and close these loopholes? I am sure we have all had constituency cases where people have lost money to unscrupulous companies and company owners. We have an opportunity to take action, and we must take it. The Government are letting citizens down if they do not accept the new clauses.

[Anneliese Dodds]

I am grateful to the hon. Lady for making the point clearly that our proposal has been portrayed as only a burden, when it could help to prevent our constituents from being ripped off by unscrupulous individuals who are able to set themselves up as a company with only minimum requirements for due diligence. As I said, they can be there by day, fly off by night, and leave the unfortunate person who dealt with that company in a very difficult position.

To end my remarks specifically on the Minister’s comments on new clause 13, many of us are worried that, in practice, there are TCSPs that offer UK company formation with a range of optional services, including setting up bank accounts in other jurisdictions such as Latvia, Belize, Switzerland and Cyprus. That would not necessarily be a problem, were it not for the fact that, time and again, we have seen in the cases we have discussed in this Committee that reliance on the third parties—the banks in those other countries—does not lead to a real assurance that money laundering provisions are being followed. The reality is quite the opposite.

In the Russian laundromat scandal, which we have already talked about, of the 440 UK shell companies used in the scheme—in itself, a staggering statistic—392 of them had Baltic bank accounts, with 270 UK firms using Latvian banks and 122 using banks in Estonia. It may be that we are fully confident in every case that anti-money laundering regulations were followed in those countries, but given some of what came out of the Russian laundromat scandal, it could be suggested that that is not the case.

We do need to get at this problem through another route. We need reform of the Companies House system, but we also need the use of another prong which is requiring a UK bank account.

Question put, That the clause be read a Second time.

Sanctions and Anti-Money Laundering Bill [Lords] (Fourth sitting)

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Thursday 1st March 2018 Public Bill Committees

[John Glen]

I am very grateful for that clarification. I hope that I will be able to address that in my remarks and give sufficient reassurance about the Government’s plan.

I should make clear from the outset that the Government are in favour of good guidance and we intend to produce it. It is in the Government’s interest to produce thorough guidance, to improve sanctions implementation and to ensure that sanctions can be enforced robustly. It was clearly set out that amendment 27 would require Government to provide guidance on the definition of ownership and control on the face of the Bill.

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

Further to the points made by my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow Central about the efficacy of these amendments, Governments come and go, and I fully appreciate that the Minister is committed to giving proper guidance, but with the greatest respect, his party may not always be in power. Is it not important that if they have the intention, they should put these things on a statutory footing?

[John Glen]

I will address those points in my remarks, and I will be happy for the hon. Lady to come back if she is not content at the end.

Amendment 28 would broaden the scope of guidance to areas such as providing best practice on compliance with financial sanctions and establishing effective banking and payment corridors. As I said at the start, the Government are committed to producing clear and accessible guidance on sanctions implementation and enforcement. Clause 37 requires Ministers to issue guidance about any prohibitions and requirements imposed by sanctions regulations. There is already a mandatory requirement to provide comprehensive guidance for all those affected by sanctions and implementation.

The Government have been consulting extensively; across Whitehall, they have been meeting with NGOs and financial institutions that have asked for this guidance. I can reassure the Committee that we will give them what they have asked for. The Government do not believe that further amendments to clause 37 are needed to provide the type of guidance sought on “owned” and “controlled” in amendment 27. Where sanctions regulations contain prohibitions or requirements about entities that are owned and controlled by a designated person, we are already under a duty to issue guidance. I can reassure hon. Members that the Government already provide guidance on ownership and control and will continue doing so.

The additional guidance sought in amendment 28 would greatly extend the scope of the guidance to specific areas such as mechanisms to limit the impact of prohibitions and requirements on civilian and humanitarian activity, and establishing effective banking and payment corridors. Although I can understand the concerns of NGOs that lie behind this amendment, some of them clearly are beyond the remit of the Government to provide. For example, the Government do not have the powers to require banks to make payments on behalf of particular customer or to open new payment channels. Although I appreciate the spirit of the amendments, the Bill already caters for them in so far as it addresses matters within the Government’s control. Adding extra text to the Bill will only create confusion.

[John Glen]

I acknowledge what the hon. Lady says, but this is a non-exhaustive list. We intend to issue guidance on those issues listed in the Bill and more, as new issues evolve. We may also not need guidance in some areas that the sanctions do not cover. Where we are at cross purposes here is that people think the list is exhaustive when it is enabling and allows the Government to give the necessary guidance as required and as circumstances evolve.

We understand the concerns behind the amendments and have worked closely with NGOs to understand their needs, and we will continue to do so.

[Hannah Bardell]

I appreciate the Minister’s response to my hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow Central, but if he does not think it is the Government’s role to create those channels, whose role is it?

[John Glen]

I am not necessarily denying the role of Government in issuing guidance in a whole range of areas. What I am dealing with here is the necessity of adding the provision into the Bill when the need to give guidance is sufficiently catered for in the text of the Bill.

The Bill will put the requirements in a better place because of the new flexibility on exemptions, licensing grounds and the ability to provide general licences. We are therefore unable to agree to the level of guidance sought, and I ask the hon. Member for Bishop Auckland to withdraw her amendment.

--- Later in debate ---

Transparency International, which as colleagues will know has done a lot of research on the issue, suggests that 71% of all SLPs registered in 2016 were controlled by anonymous companies based in secrecy jurisdictions such as Belize, Seychelles and Dominica. Furthermore, 113 SLPs were used to launder $20 billion to $80 billion between 2010 and 2014 as part of what has been called the “global laundromat”. I will go into some of the different examples in a minute.

[Hannah Bardell]

I congratulate the hon. Lady on making an excellent speech. Will she join me in paying tribute to the former Member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath, our colleague Roger Mullin, who did a huge amount of work on this? Will she acknowledge as well that despite their name—Scottish limited partnerships —these companies have little to do with Scotland? They were introduced by the UK Government under Liberal Chancellor Herbert Asquith in 1907. The operation, regulation and dissolution of SLPs remain exclusively the preserve of Westminster, so it is vital that this legislation goes through and the changes happen.

[Anneliese Dodds]

I am very grateful to the hon. Lady for bringing those matters to light; I will return to the point about this being a UK Government responsibility later, because it is enormously important. It is important to raise our recognition of those who have done so much to uncover what has been occurring with SLPs. I also pay tribute to The Herald newspaper, which has done a good investigative job in this regard, and I know that Labour’s Jackie Baillie has expressed her concern about Scotland’s name being used potentially to enable offshore tax arrangements and worse. It is important that we look at these arrangements.

Also related to the hon. Lady’s comment, there is huge concern that the unfortunate link between the name SLP and Scotland itself is potentially darkening Scotland’s name. I understand that there is an advertisement that is run on a Belarus TV station, Varyag, saying,

“A company operating in the UK does not need to register with the tax authorities and is therefore automatically freed from any tax payments on an absolutely legal basis. Having registered a company in Scotland, by using offshore rules, you do not need to carry out any audits and, furthermore, there is no requirement to provide financial reports.”

The TV station stressed the kudos of Scotland and the fact that it is part of Britain:

“As a result of Scotland being part of the United Kingdom it does not fall in to the black list of offshore zones”,

presumably meaning either the OECD blacklist or the EU blacklist.

I will briefly mention a couple of specific cases where SLPs have been shown to be problematic, before looking at the current legal context, why this is a UK Government responsibility, and why we require Government to act and hopefully to accept our amendment. The first, which is very worrying, is the Moldovan case. According to the Organised Crime and Corruption Reporting Project, in November 2014 $1 billion was reported to have gone missing from three Moldovan banks. Hon. Members will know that Moldova is not a well-off country—quite the opposite: although it is one of the most beautiful countries in Europe, it is one of the poorest. The corruption that was revealed in that case was enormously damaging for that nation, which has many governance challenges. The World Bank and the International Monetary Fund suspended financial aid to it after revelations about what had occurred in that siphoning off. Two companies registered on Brunswick Street in Edinburgh—a street I know well, as I am sure others do, too—kept coming up in the records for the case, which has had such a significant impact on that nation.

Another example that is commonly adduced in this regard is the Ukrainian one. A Lancashire-based firm called Fuerteventura Inter, which sounds rather like a football team, appears to have been used as an SLP. It was created in February 2015, and was used to siphon off funds from the sale of cannon shells to the United Arab Emirates. The SLP was an intermediary in that deal. The prosecutors allege that it enabled officials to take a large slice of the value of that contract.

Then there is the Azerbaijani laundromat, which I will come back to later. I am sure colleagues have heard of it, and I am sure we will hear a lot more about it in our discussions next Tuesday. “The Global Laundromat” was a piece of investigative journalism that looked into Russian money being laundered through different shell companies. That was going on until 2014. More recently, an investigation of Azerbaijani companies that came out in 2017 showed how companies including SLPs appear to have been used to hide the real ownership of payments.

This is not just about stealing from very poor people; it is about political influence. Some of the payments from the Azerbaijani laundromat were going to individuals who sit on Council of Europe working groups, including those involved in producing reports about human rights in Azerbaijan. Of course, many of the individuals involved have rejected any accusation that those funds had any influence on them. We will draw our own conclusions from looking at the paperwork and what has been said legally about that matter.

[Hannah Bardell]

I declare an interest: I represent my party in the Council of Europe. I spoke to some activists from Belarus, who raised that issue with me and talked about the damage and devastation it is causing in their country. That again highlights why this is so very important.

[Anneliese Dodds]

I am grateful to the hon. Lady for raising that issue. It is particularly important that highly respected international bodies are above any insinuation or reproach. It may be that there has been confusion and a lack of knowledge about the provenance of some of those funds, but we need to remove from the system any opacity that could give that impression.

Operation Car Wash, which came up only last month—it is funny that all of these cases use the washing metaphor, but it is clearly because they are about washing out the provenance of money—covered Brazil and Peru. A giant construction firm in those countries paid £1 billion in bribes for, it appears, political purposes, and it appears that some of the payments went through SLPs. When we look at the evidence, we see we need to have a far stronger grip on this problem.

In early summer last year, legislation was introduced by the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy to try to regulate SLPs, under which they were to be forced to disclose their beneficial owners within the next 28 days or face daily fines. I am concerned that we still do not know how many such firms have genuinely indicated their beneficial owners—I hope we will hear from the Minister on that now. I am not privy to information on how many fines have been levied, and most commentators suggest that not a single business has been prosecuted. Perhaps some have been fined but not prosecuted. Perhaps we can find out more about that.

The Opposition are concerned that more action needs to be taken. To return to our earlier exchange, it is important that the UK Government take responsibility, because they have reserved powers over Scots corporate law. The Scottish Government have asked the UK Government to act, and it appears that previous actions to require more ownership information may not have gone far enough. I hope the Minister will enlighten us on that and support our amendment.

--- Later in debate ---

[Hannah Bardell]

Does the Minister recognise the reputational damage to Scotland? We have a Liberal Chancellor to thank for that, but it is very important that we make these changes, because Scotland’s reputation is being damaged through no fault of its own and by legislation over which we have no power.

[John Glen]

Absolutely, and that is why it is important that the UK Government act. In June last year, Scottish limited partnerships were brought into the scope of the public register of corporate beneficial ownership maintained by Companies House. That was welcomed by the former Member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath, who is a leading campaigner on the issue, as was mentioned earlier. He said it was

“the first practical recognition SLPs have been a significant problem”.

That reform further required SLPs to submit an annual confirmation statement that information held on the register is accurate, and to keep the information updated on an ongoing basis. In cases of non-compliance with the duties to deliver information about people with significant control—PSC information—to Companies House and to keep it up to date, officers of Scottish limited partnerships convicted on indictment can face a sentence of up to two years’ imprisonment, a fine, or both.

Additionally, the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy sought views last year on whether changes need to be made to limited partnership law to further address the concerns that have been raised about misuse of structures, including Scottish limited partnerships. Responses to that call for views are being analysed and options for reform actively considered. BEIS will announce its next steps shortly, and after a response to the call for evidence is published, identified options for reform will be subject to public consultation in the usual way. That process will be used to inform any necessary further reforms to the UK’s treatment of limited partnerships, including Scottish limited partnerships.

I hope that I have addressed in detail the range of concerns about Scottish limited partnerships.

Trade Bill (Third sitting)

Hannah Bardell Excerpts

Committee Debate: 3rd sitting: House of Commons
Thursday 25th January 2018 Public Bill Committees

[Bill Esterson]

Q But what if one of the consequences of the negotiations to produce corresponding agreements was additional quotas that increased imports in your sector? Do you have a view on that?

Gary Stephenson: That is probably more in the food manufacturers’ area, because how the tariff rate quota is divided up is obviously for negotiation between the UK and the EU. I know that the World Trade Organisation has some influence on how it is divided up. This is where the specific industry sector should be consulted on what it believes would be the fair quota. Any of us is probably not in a position to set out a position on any specific quota. Take lamb as an example: what is a suitable quota that the UK would take back from the EU? It is a complex area, and I think it is best to ask that question of the sector responsible.

[Hannah Bardell (Livingston) (SNP)]

Q Happy Burns day to everyone, and I thank the witnesses for joining us today. Following on with the issue of cost, the meat sector is potentially looking at WTO tariffs on meat processors at 60%. If that is coupled with HMRC saying that 130,000 companies have never filled out a customs declaration, what impact, from a food and drink and meat processing perspective, do you think there will be on the sector, broadly and in terms of bureaucracy and staffing? Do you feel that adequate investigation and consultation has taken place?

Gary Stephenson: Wow, that is a big one. There are a number of elements to this. My company is in a fairly unique position in the food industry, in that we already import product into the EU, so we understand the complexities of that process. It is about whether the region you are from is authorised on the EU legislation side. Is your business registered within the EU as a registered business to produce that product? Other countries have similar issues. The US has similar legislation, which requires overseas suppliers to be registered with the Food and Drug Administration.

There is an additional piece: the export health certificates, which are not needed for the EU at present, but will be. Each one of those costs the business. It is not just the cost of the certificates—the vet must come to inspect. Have we got enough vets in the UK to provide that service? That is an additional challenge.

[Hannah Bardell]

Q Can you talk specifically about the vets?

Gary Stephenson: Yes. Every single shipment requires a certificate, which we get from Carlisle, from the Animal and Plant Health Agency. You would have an official vet come in to sign that certificate. For example, in our case, if we need four times more certificates after Brexit than we are currently using, that is four times the cost. I am not saying that the vet would come four times more often, but he would certainly be in there twice as often, so you would be looking at twice the cost. Some businesses have not yet been exporting and will need an export health certificate. All this is going to be new for them. They are going to need a new certificate, and they are going to need to pay the vet to come and sign that certificate.

The additional piece involves shipping agents and border inspection posts. If you are using a shipping agent to export your product, in order to get all the paperwork right and so on, that is going to cost you. As you mentioned, most businesses have not exported in a way that requires customs declarations and so on, so that is an additional cost to businesses that they are probably not very aware of. I cannot give an exact figure for how much more, but it is an extra cost.

[Hannah Bardell]

Q Is there not also a risk, given that we have 40 free trade agreements with 60 countries through the EU, that if we have not done all those bilaterals—with the greatest will in the world, it seems incredible that we would manage to do so, unless the Government have some magic up their sleeves—there will be additional bureaucracy with those individual countries? We have inspectors in each of those countries already inspecting products. Elspeth, can you talk about that?

[The Chair]

I remind witnesses to speak up. Some of those at the back are finding it difficult to hear. Please speak up as best you can.

Elspeth Macdonald: Gary makes some really valid points about the increased burdens and bureaucracy for business, but it is also important to be reminded that the additional level of checking and assurance that may be required in future is also likely to have a significant impact on local authorities, for example. They have an important function in providing assurance about standards and compliance with legislation in food businesses that export to other countries. There is absolutely the potential for a significant impact of a new requirement for veterinary checks and so on, but also, should more checks be needed in future than now, there could be significant impacts on local authorities.

Sarah Dickson: From a Scotch whisky perspective, we may not need the vets, but we benefit from the tariff reductions, the intellectual property protection and the non-tariff barriers given to us by the agreements. About 10% of our exports go to a country covered by an EU free trade agreement. One thing that we have been talking to Department for International Trade officials about is how business can help. We would be more than happy to see if there is any contribution we can make to make sure these agreements are carried over.

Gary Stephenson: There is an additional piece from Elspeth’s comments. Currently, importing countries’ manufacturing sites are visited by an EU vet to assess their suitability and whether they are meeting European standards. When we are outside the EU, that will become a UK responsibility. We do not have the resources available today to conduct those checks.

[Hannah Bardell]

Q On the protections, Sarah, we are all aware of the geographical indicators and their vital importance across different sectors, particularly for Scotch. What would be the impact if we lost our geographical indication?

Sarah Dickson: I am working on the basis that, because we will have the carrying over of all EU legislation into the UK, we will not lose the GI and an intellectual property system will be there to protect protected names such as Scotch whisky. We use it in all markets all over the world to make sure that people do not copy our product and produce lookey-likey fakes and that kind of thing. That is very important to our industry. We are working on the basis that that comes across lock, stock and barrel.

[The Chair]

We have a maximum of 20 minutes left and at least six people still wanting to ask questions. If we have short questions and concise answers, we can get as many people in to ask a question as is possible.

--- Later in debate ---

[Bill Esterson]

Q Again, when you are talking about trade deals, remember that the Bill is about the creation of corresponding deals. You are applying what you say to the provisions of the Bill as much as anything else.

Gordon MacIntyre-Kemp: Yes.

David Scott: Can I echo that? I think uncertainty is a killer at this point, specifically for my customers, whom I trade with on a global basis. They have a global supply chain and have to make contingency plans to ensure that whatever medicines they make are available to patients. Those contingency plans cannot wait until the eleventh hour or the last minute of any negotiations of any sort. I can tell you that they are starting to put those contingency plans in place now, and that they will have a massive effect on companies such as mine, and companies across the UK that support pharmaceutical R&D and the development and release of products on to the European market.

[Hannah Bardell]

Q Thank you for attending, and happy Burns day.

Perhaps I can start with you, David, and pick up on what has been said about confusion. The way I read your comments was that you were talking about concerns about legislative change under the Bill, and the ability to make changes in primary legislation. As we know, the Law Society of Scotland has raised issues concerning the timescale that that might mean for your organisation and sector. Could you talk about that a bit? Also, I notice from your photograph that you are MHRA and Food and Drug Administration approved. On the impact of leaving, and potential disjoint—we have already lost the European Medicines Agency to Amsterdam—can you talk about the impact on your sector and company?

David Scott: Yes, the potential impact is massive. The whole of the medicines regulation is about harmonisation and working under one single set of standards, which are beneficial and mean that the speed to market of life-saving medicines is reduced. If we try to come up with a different set of regulations or way of working, and have duplication of effort, which is what would happen under the current proposal if we became a third country outside the EEA, pharma will look at us and think, “Is the market big enough?”

We are now a net exporter of pharmaceuticals into the European Union and have a trade surplus. We want to avoid anything that puts us into a deficit. If we cannot get some harmonisation and cannot stick with the current harmonisation, I am concerned that we will lose our reputation—or not our reputation, because the MHRA is one of the best in the world, as far as I am concerned, but the ability to get joined-up connectedness. That would have a massive impact on my industry and my company, without question. I would then be forced, contingency-wise, to say “What do I do? I can’t serve some of my customers’ needs in a different regulatory system.” It is a massive thing for us.

[Hannah Bardell]

Q Gordon MacIntyre-Kemp, I know that you did a survey recently that said businesses—your members—did not have faith in the UK Government to act on their behalf. Can you talk about the findings of that survey? You mentioned some of the concerns earlier. The definition of free trade agreements was mentioned by the Law Society of Scotland in its briefing. We know from history some of the challenges and impacts on Scotland, for example on fishing, from trade being negotiated on Scotland’s behalf. Can you talk a bit about the importance of the Scottish Government and business having a say and an active role in those trade deals?

Gordon MacIntyre-Kemp: For sure. In the survey we did, we did not just want to survey our members; we surveyed companies across Scotland. The feedback was surprising to us as an organisation. We had sensed that Scottish business was not happy with how this was being handled, but we have some quotes from non-members of Business for Scotland. A director of a FTSE 100 company said:

“When the virtually inevitable car crash happens the Scottish end of the business will most probably be moved to Europe which is a crying shame as the expertise at home is unsurpassed in our market segment. However with no likelihood of stability it will be a logical step to move.”

A director of a New York stock exchange limited company with 800 employees in Scotland said:

“Stop now and ask the people, do they want to continue with this process, knowing what they know now?”

A director of a UK bank left a pithy statement. He just said: “Absolute bloody shambles.” That was the sort of feedback we were getting. Some 79% want a second EU referendum after the deal is done.

In terms of the Trade Bill itself, what I am finding is that Scottish business is not engaging with the detail of Bills such as this. The information they are being asked to understand is so confusing that the only answer they have psychologically is to keep their heads down and hope that it will all be okay. That is why I suggested that through the whole process there has to be a lot more consultation.

In terms of fisheries, food standards and health, which I mentioned before, there are lots of areas where promises have been made. There are issues around tariffs and protections. For instance, I was told during one debate that it is far better to do a trade deal with India because it is so big and so on, but the wages in manufacturing in India are about 79p an hour, and we are approaching £8 an hour here. If a trade deal is done that opens up markets without the right level of consent from devolved Parliaments and industry groups, that will not be a trade deal but a bonfire of manufacturing in the United Kingdom. There have to be checks and balances in that. Multiple sectors will have to feed that in, because if we do not know that, we are going to be signing trade deals that will have unforeseen consequences, and I think that will be very damaging to the UK economy.

[Hannah Bardell]

Q I have just one final question for Jonathan on control over standards. I understand that standards are one of the key aspects for the furniture industry and the manufacturing of furniture, particularly in respect of fire retardancy and flammability. There have been many stories in the press over the years on the dangers of not maintaining those standards. What are your feelings on what the Bill does and the potential impact of leaving the European Committee for Standardisation? What are the threats or, indeed, the opportunities?

Jonathan Hindle: We have made recommendations to the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy for some updating of and amendments to the flammability regulations in particular. On a more broad basis, I understand that the British Standards Institution is looking to remain a member of the European Committee for Standardisation and the European Committee for Electrotechnical Standardisation, for example, to keep that continuity. That is what the industry is looking for. By and large, those standards, if they remain in place, are adequate. It is our ability to police, surveil and properly address transgressions that has much more been the issue for the industry. A plethora of products are making their way into the country that do not meet our stringent standards.

[Hannah Bardell]

Q Is there an issue that if we lose the ability to monitor that, we could be looking at substandard products?

Jonathan Hindle: That would be a big concern for the industry. It already is under the current regime, and we are looking for improvements.

David Scott: To Gordon’s point specifically, there is a complexity here that we do not really understand. As you said, my company knew nothing about the Trade Bill or these sorts of things until we were asked to look into this. We focus on our bits. I think that Gordon is absolutely right: if we put in a trade Bill, there will be unforeseen consequences for certain sectors that you cannot foresee at this point in time.

Part of that is the safety element. Regulated drugs are there for a reason. If we start to loosen those regulations to make trade easier, then we open ourselves up to all sorts of problems, in terms of the fitness for purpose of the products that are brought into this country for use by patients.

[Craig Whittaker]

Q I have two questions, if I may. First, I just want to ask David a question. You said earlier that it would be a disaster if the pharmaceutical industry did not operate under the same regulatory framework as Europe—that would be a disaster for pharmaceuticals in this country. Correct me if I heard wrongly. However, is it not true that no matter what country you want to deal with, as an industry you have to comply with the regulation of whatever country you are dealing with anyway? So why on earth would you, as an industry, put yourself at risk anyway and not comply with EU regulations, whether we were in or out of the EU?

David Scott: We would always want to comply with the highest standards of good manufacturing practices—GMP—for the pharmaceutical industry. What we do not want is to see any easing-up of the requirements of that to make trade easier with other parties. That is what I was trying to say. We need to be part of a harmonised system that works on a global basis, because if we have our own system then it becomes much more—not difficult to trade with us or to get things regulated, but we would set up an extra set of barriers. Currently, 60% of all medicines that are used in Europe are released from the UK.