Outsourcing: Government Departments

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Wednesday 29th January 2025 Westminster Hall

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

It is an honour to serve under your chairmanship, Sir Jeremy. I wish the Minister, Members and staff kung hei fat choi—happy Chinese new year. I congratulate my good and hon. Friend the Member for Middlesbrough and Thornaby East (Andy McDonald) on securing this important debate on outsourcing, and also on the excellent and unseen work he has done in the background for many years.

Outsourcing has become deeply embedded in our public sector, yet it remains an inefficient and flawed model. Trade unions and MPs have repeatedly warned that it prioritises private profit over fair pay, secure jobs and quality services. My good and hon. Friend the Member for Alloa and Grangemouth (Brian Leishman) gave some excellent examples of that in prison maintenance contracts. I encourage Members of Parliament to visit the prisons serving their areas, speak to the governors and look at the eye-watering sums that are being charged by private contractors for really quite simple jobs. It is not value for money by any measure.

Colleagues have raised various concerns. In the two minutes I have got, I want to focus on two issues: the creation of a two-tier workforce and the failure to deliver value for money for taxpayers. From prisons to railways and Government Departments, outsourcing has become the norm, but for many workers this means low pay, insecure contracts and poor conditions, while private firms reap significant financial rewards at public expense. This cannot continue.

In the case of the civil service, every worker deserves dignity, respect and fair treatment, yet this is far from the reality for outsourced staff. Despite working alongside Ministers and civil servants, they are denied company or departmental sick pay, decent pensions and access to civil service pay scales. These exploitative employment practices exist at the heart of Government, and I respectfully remind the Minister that, in her own Department, outsourced workers are being denied sick pay from day one.

Beyond that, we need a complete overhaul of outsourcing in Government. At the very least, Government Departments must require private sector contractors to engage meaningfully with trade unions to ensure fair pay and conditions for all. Outsourcing companies are exploiting both the Government and the taxpayer. They inflate costs by charging excessive fees for contracts and extra services, while driving down wages and basic employment conditions to line the pockets of shareholders. It is a broken system.

Finally, will the Minister provide a clear update on her plans to deliver the Government’s insourcing commitment? In the interim, will she intervene in the ongoing disputes within Government Departments, including her own, to ensure that all workers receive basic rights from day one? If we truly want to build a high-wage economy and drive real growth, we need to start by guaranteeing that Government workers have fair pay, decent conditions and job security. That means ending wasteful outsourcing and cutting out the worst offending firms, which undermine workers and taxpayers alike.

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[Mike Wood (Kingswinford and South Staffordshire) (Con)]

I congratulate the hon. Member for Middlesbrough and Thornaby East (Andy McDonald) on securing this debate. He may not be surprised to learn that I do not agree with his general position. I thank the many Members who have contributed to the debate. I must admit that some of the contributions by Government Members left me feeling a little nostalgic, although I suspect that the Prime Minister and some Government Whips might prefer them to keep such views under wraps a little more.

It is a pleasure to speak in this debate on outsourcing, which, when handled well, delivers efficiency, value for money and innovation in the provision of public services. Unfortunately, however, the actions we have seen so far from the Government are further complicating and undermining effective public procurement. Rather than building on the progress made by the previous Government, Labour is making public procurement more burdensome, less efficient and increasingly dictated by trade unions. That will make it more difficult to make outsourcing work for service users and taxpayers.

The Procurement Act 2023 was introduced to ensure a streamlined, modernised and effective procurement system that would deliver better outcomes for taxpayers. The Act was designed to cut red tape, improve transparency and ensure that public contracts were awarded based on value and efficiency, but the new Government have delayed its implementation. They have announced plans for a new national procurement policy statement—

[Grahame Morris]

I am interested in the hon. Member’s contention about value for money. Does he actually believe that the prison maintenance contract delivers value for money for the taxpayer?

[Mike Wood]

Numerous reports, not least by the Institute for Government, have found that, in many areas of Government activity, outsourcing and public procurement from private providers improves service and value for money for the taxpayer. Of course, it can be done badly, and the Probation Service is the obvious example where it clearly never worked. Although the pandemic brought things to a critical point, it was becoming increasingly difficult even before then to argue that that private provision was providing a satisfactory service.

We are still waiting for the national procurement policy statement, less than four weeks before the Procurement Act is due to commence. The new Government claim that the Act, in its current form, does not meet their vision for harnessing public procurement to deliver economic growth, value for money and social value, but it looks increasingly as though what they mean is that they want to use public contracts as a vehicle to expand trade union influence in Government, imposing costly and unnecessary regulatory burdens on businesses. In the absence of a national procurement policy statement, the Government are introducing further restrictions and bureaucracy through what they call “Make Work Pay”, but for a lot of employers that looks a lot like just making jobs more expensive.

Businesses seeking Government contracts are to be required to demonstrate trade union recognition, access for union organisers, collective bargaining arrangements, adherence to so-called fair work standards that go well beyond legal obligations, and other social commitments. Recent parliamentary answers have confirmed that those requirements will apply not only to large firms, but to small and medium-sized enterprises, undoing a lot of the good work in the Procurement Act that aimed to open up public procurement contracts to a wider range of smaller businesses.

This is not about ensuring fair treatment of workers. UK employment law already provides robust protections. This is about allowing unions to dictate the terms of our public procurement, favouring firms that meet ideological criteria rather than those that offer the best value and most efficient service.

Infected Blood Inquiry

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Tuesday 23rd April 2024 Commons Chamber

[John Glen]

Yes, I recognise that all delays are painful and frustrating and cause distress. That is why I am doing everything I can to move this forward as quickly as I can. I am sorry that that is repetitious, but it is the truth. I think I have updated the House meaningfully today on the legislation. I know what we need to do, which is to get to 20 May and, as soon as possible, come up with a comprehensive response on behalf of all those who have lost their lives and the families who have been ruined by this absolute scandal that has happened over 50 years.

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

May I also give my thanks to my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston upon Hull North (Dame Diana Johnson) for securing this urgent question? It gives me the opportunity to raise the case of my constituent Mark Fox, who contracted hepatitis C from infected blood when he was given a transfusion. He was just four years of age at the time. He was given contaminated factor VIII for his haemophilia. He was unaware of his hepatitis C diagnosis until he was 17, when he was in care. He has been living with the health consequences of this scandal for over 40 years. He lost his job, and we have mentioned the stigma. I say with all due respect to the Minister, because I know he is doing his best, that interim payments will offer a way of bringing relief to some of the survivors. Mark has asked me to ask the Minister how many more years he will have to wait before he receives either an interim payment or full and fair compensation for the suffering that he has endured.

[John Glen]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his heartfelt representation on behalf of his constituent Mark Fox, and I am sincerely sorry for what he has experienced. I am doing everything I can to bring as much clarity as possible, but I cannot give the hon. Gentleman a definitive timetable today. I am working towards—I hope—giving a definitive timetable at the point of, or very soon after, the publication of this final report. I will do everything I can to bring clarity to all groups involved.

Oral Answers to Questions

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Thursday 29th February 2024 Commons Chamber

[Dame Diana Johnson (Kingston upon Hull North) (Lab)]

4. What progress he has made on responding to the final recommendations on compensation by the infected blood inquiry.

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

6. What progress he has made on considering the recommendations of the second interim report of the infected blood inquiry.

[The Minister for the Cabinet Office and Paymaster General (John Glen)]

The Government recognise the urgency of the issue and are committed to progressing the work as quickly as we can. For that reason, we have appointed an expert group to advise the Cabinet Office on detailed technical considerations. On Monday in the other place, the Government committed to bring forward an amendment to the Victims and Prisoners Bill on Report, with the intention of speeding up the implementation of the Government’s response to the infected blood inquiry.

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[John Glen]

I explained to the right hon. Lady when I met her on 6 February, and again when I spoke to her on 8 February, the context of Professor Sir Jonathan Montgomery’s appointment. As she knows, Sir Brian recommends that eligibility for compensation includes those with hepatitis C, HIV and all chronic cases of hepatitis B.

On the right hon. Lady’s question about engagement with the groups, I am very keen to engage when the Report stage happens in the middle of April. I will then work on plans to engage with as many groups as possible across the United Kingdom, building on my conversations with representatives of the devolved Administrations on 6 February.

[Grahame Morris]

Since the recommendations of the infected blood inquiry were announced, another 82 victims of the scandal have sadly died. I note what the Minister said about the appointment of Sir Jonathan Montgomery as chair of the experts offering technical advice on the compensation talks, but may I express the anger of one of my constituents, who is a victim of the scandal, about that appointment? He has asked me to ask: what confidence can victims have in the compensation process when an individual who is linked to pharmaceutical firm Bayer—a company that supplied infected blood—and chairs the Oxford University Hospitals NHS Foundation Trust, which was at the epicentre of the scandal, is advising the Cabinet Office?

[John Glen]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his question. The appointment of Sir Jonathan Montgomery was compliant with all the processes, similar to those used for the appointment of Sir Robert Francis and others. I recognise the concern expressed around Jonathan’s involvement with Bayer. That ceased at the end of October last year. He was part of an independent advisory group—not making executive decisions—for the pharmaceutical company. In the other place, the noble Baroness Brinton described Sir Jonathan as a “well-respected ethicist”. He has been asked not for further recommendations, but to advise the Government on the implementation of the recommendations made in the report. I hope that is helpful.

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[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

T3. I have raised the subject of the pressures facing prison officers on a number of occasions. Prison officers are part of the civil service pension scheme and must work until the age of 68 to retire on a full pension. Does the Minister recognise that that is unrealistic, given the number of assaults on them and the pressures they face? Will he work with me and the Prison Officers Association to seek an exception for prison officers, so that they can retire at 60 after 30 years’ services, as is currently the case for firefighters and the police?

[Oliver Dowden]

The hon. Gentleman rightly raises the matter of the enormous contribution of prison officers. They are often under-sung members of our public services, risking their life day in, day out, to protect us all from dangerous and violent criminals. Of course, as Ministers, we have a duty to protect the public purse. We have set out a clear principle on the age of retirement from government roles. We would be reluctant to start varying that for a further group of people, because it is very difficult to draw the line once we start unpicking that principle.

Protecting Steel in the UK

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Tuesday 23rd January 2024 Commons Chamber

[Ms Ghani]

I did follow the debate in the Select Committee, and I think the Secretary of State said that these decisions are commercial but that we will do everything that we can, and that our fundamental priority is to ensure that steelmaking continues in the UK.

Tata Steel’s decision has not been taken lightly. This consultation comes against the backdrop of a decade of losses, which were ignored by the Labour party when it was in power. Indeed, Tata’s managing director confirmed over the weekend that, as I mentioned earlier, the Port Talbot plant has been bleeding £1.5 million a day. Its decision also comes with a growing awareness that the UK steel industry has to modernise, because that is what customers want and the technology now exists. In those circumstances, businesses are compelled to make difficult decisions and tough changes. In fact, without the opportunity to install a modern electric arc furnace, the future of the plant would have been under serious threat.

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

The Minister and several of her colleagues have mentioned the losses at Port Talbot. Let me remind the House that Tata Steel paid dividends amounting to £1.4 billion to shareholders between 2019 and 2023, and that the group has reserves of £1.6 billion. Would not a sensible solution be to look at what the unions are proposing, and in particular at Unite the union’s proposal in its transition plan to retain blast furnace 4 during the transition and build a 3-megaton arc furnace to allow Port Talbot to take advantage of the dramatic increase in demand that we anticipate for green steel?

[Ms Ghani]

I believe that Tata has been sharing its business plans with the unions. There is anxiety about the multi-union plan because it does not deal with the basic economics of continuing to make steel at Port Talbot. Of course all of us here want to ensure that steelmaking continues in the UK, and this is the model that Tata has put forward to ensure that it does. Electric arc furnaces will be on line in a few years’ time, and I can assure the hon. Gentleman that we are using steel that is already in the UK system and can be recycled.

Veterans Welfare Services

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Tuesday 21st November 2023 Commons Chamber

[Johnny Mercer]

I thank the hon. Lady for her continued advocacy in this space. As everybody knows, levelling up what it means to be a veteran in Northern Ireland has been absolutely critical to the Government’s work, whether through the very, very difficult legacy Bill or the Northern Ireland Veterans Support Office. The NIVSO is the first directly funded workstream of £500,000 coming out of the Office for Veterans’ Affairs, which we are working with the Veterans Commissioner over there to deliver. There are key areas in the veterans’ ecosystem that are delivered by devolved authorities and we respect that. All we are asking is that all veterans get the standard they deserve and I am determined we will get there in Northern Ireland. I am going to Northern Ireland again on 4 and 5 December. I look forward to seeing her and everyone else who is always very kind to me when I come over.

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

I thank the Minister for the update. I wonder if he would listen to this voice from the desert from east Durham. Can I draw his attention to the terrific work the East Durham Veterans Trust does to provide mental health support, counselling and advice? It is a much neglected area. Indeed, the Minister’s colleague who is no longer in her place, the hon. Member for Stroud (Siobhan Baillie), mentioned the Veterans’ Gateway. There is some excellent work on a telephone-based app that I have seen, which was pioneered by the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers. I hope we will see a lot more of that. May I draw the Minister’s attention to early-day motion 51 in support of a veterans’ bank holiday? Will he look into that suggestion? In this country we are way behind in the number of bank holidays. I think it would be significant for the whole country to highlight veterans’ welfare through a new bank holiday.

[Johnny Mercer]

You will not find me arguing against more time off, Mr Deputy Speaker! I am always fighting for better services in the veterans space, and I will take that idea of a veterans bank holiday away with me.

When it comes to the issue of mental health, the hon. Gentleman is entirely right. Some small groups have done extraordinary work on the frontline over many years, sitting with veterans throughout the night when no one else is awake or watching, and plugging them into services. We have transformed mental health care services through Op Courage, spending between £22 million and £24 million a year, and there were 19,000 referrals in its first year. There is still a massive amount of unmet need, but we are determined to drive that down so that all these groups feel connected and plugged into services. It is my mission to ensure that no veteran, especially when poorly, does not know where to turn, and I will not rest until we get there.

Oral Answers to Questions

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Wednesday 25th October 2023 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

I know my hon. Friend is a passionate campaigner on this issue, having even introduced a private Member’s Bill on it earlier this year. I agree that his council should be working to ensure that it delivers good services for all its residents, including his constituents, and I will certainly arrange for the relevant Minister to discuss his concerns further with him. As my hon. Friend did not do so, maybe I can plug his event this afternoon in the Jubilee Room—a Keighley and Ilkley showcase. Perhaps the Minister can come to that event and discuss it in person then.

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

Q2.   Just a year ago, the new Prime Minister promised to unite our country, not with words but with actions. Quite rightly, voters make a judgment on actions, but in my constituency—as in many others—the Prime Minister has not delivered on his promises. Arbroath House in Easington Colliery is a GP practice without the funding to deliver basic community health services. Communities such as Shotton, South Hetton, Haswell and Horden lack the police officers to tackle crime and antisocial behaviour. We see sewage being dumped on our coastline at Seaham and Blackhall without prosecution of the privatised water companies, and we see investment for levelling up blocked for Horden. When will the Prime Minister call a general election and let Labour rise to the task of rebuilding Britain?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Gentleman raised crime. I am pleased to say that crime is now down by over 50% since Labour was last in office, and that includes significant reductions in antisocial behaviour, which he mentioned. Indeed, earlier this year not only did we meet our pledge to deliver 20,000 more police officers—a record number on our streets—but our antisocial behaviour plan is already making a difference, delivering immediate justice and clamping down on that type of activity.

Oral Answers to Questions

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Thursday 8th December 2022 Commons Chamber

[Alex Burghart]

A planned communication programme is coming this winter. Maybe we should be looking at the temperature in this House. Ambient though it is, would it not be better if we all had a chance to put on fresh jumpers to keep warm?

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

T5. As reported on BBC news this morning, tens of thousands of civil servants who are members of the PCS union have balloted overwhelmingly to strike over the coming weeks and months at Border Force, the Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency, National Highways and the Rural Payments Agency. Is the Minister aware that levels of pay and in-work poverty in some areas of the civil service are such that now the Department for Work and Pension’s own staff are themselves increasingly having to claim universal credit? That is a disgrace. What is he going to do about it in terms of increasing the offer?

[Jeremy Quin]

As I have already said in this House, I very much regret the decision of those concerned to go on strike. I think it will impact people, and I very much regret that that is the decision taken. The hon. Gentleman will have to accept that there are constraints on the public finances, partly because of the money we are providing to ensure that we try to help people through what we recognise is a very serious point at the moment in terms of their personal finances. That support is available to all, including those on lower incomes—including those who may be choosing to go on strike.

Oral Answers to Questions

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Thursday 14th July 2022 Commons Chamber

[The Minister for Brexit Opportunities and Government Efficiency (Mr Jacob Rees-Mogg)]

This is a key part of the Procurement Bill. It is simplifying the system so that, instead of 350 pieces of EU law and four different regimes, there will be one UK law and one regime. There will be a pipeline that makes it known to small businesses when contracts are becoming available, giving them a better chance to get involved. Payment terms for small businesses will be improved. Many things in the Bill will be specifically designed to help small and medium-sized enterprises.

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

T2. Clearly, this Government cannot organise the processing of passports or driving licences on time. There are repeated errors in issuing visas to the correct location. Ambulances are stacked outside A&E units. NHS dentist appointments are as rare as hen’s teeth, and now the Minister wants to close the Seaham Department for Work and Pensions office in my constituency. Can the Cabinet Ministers join the dots, and recognise that cutting and undermining jobs in the public service is not the answer?

[Mr Rees-Mogg]

The reason that some DWP offices will not be needed is that unemployment did not rise in the way that was anticipated. We have the lowest level of unemployment in this country since 1974, and the highest number of people in payroll work, and it is only right that the estate of DWP meets the requirements of the DWP. We get huge efficiencies by implementing technology better. That has become clear in many Government activities. Labour party members always want to keep people on the payroll and then they do not want them to go into work: they either want to be on the picket lines helping them to strike, or they want to have them working at home.

Oral Answers to Questions

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Wednesday 20th April 2022 Commons Chamber

[Alok Sharma]

I commend my hon. Friend for his work as the UK’s trade envoy to Brazil; he is doing a brilliant job. During my recent visit, I encouraged the Government to formally submit their 2030 emission-reduction targets of 50% under the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, and they have done that now. We also discussed Brazil’s plan for a significant expansion of renewables, and I offered to share the UK’s experience on expanding our own offshore wind sector.

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

T3. This month, a set of floating wind projects under Cerulean Winds, worth a potential £10 billion, was announced alongside a memorandum of understanding with wind turbine manufacturer, Lamprell. Unfortunately, most of the fabrication work for these projects seems destined to be carried out in the United Arab Emirates. Does the Minister agree with me, the GMB union and other manufacturing unions that we must do better in building back better and greener and providing UK-based manufacturing jobs?

[The Minister for Energy, Clean Growth and Climate Change (Greg Hands)]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that question. Floating offshore wind is a key part of the energy security strategy announced by the Prime Minister last week with a 5 GW target ambition by 2030. On securing and improving the UK supply chain, floating offshore wind is still a relatively nascent technology, but I will make sure that I take the point that he raises to the supply chain taskforce.

Oral Answers to Questions

Grahame Morris Excerpts

Wednesday 9th March 2022 Commons Chamber

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right that food security is a crucial issue. It is affected of course by the cost of energy, and the energy inputs into agriculture are certainly something that we need to address. There is also a separate issue to do with childhood obesity. The House passed measures already in the autumn—the ones to which he refers—and we are giving the industry more time to adjust to the impact of those measures.

[Grahame Morris (Easington) (Lab)]

Q2. In addition to the increase in fuel prices, our constituents are reporting to us that the energy companies are doubling standing charges. In France, energy supply company EDF has had energy price rises to domestic customers capped at 4%, but this Government’s price cap allows EDF to increase prices to UK customers by 54%. My question is: why?

[The Prime Minister]

We have an overall cap, and obviously EDF is incorporated differently in the UK from its incorporation in France. We will do everything in our power to abate the costs of energy across the country, as we already are, but what is needed is a short-term, medium-term and long-term energy strategy so that we have sustainable supplies.