8 Feryal Clark debates involving HM Treasury

Economic Growth

Feryal Clark Excerpts
Tuesday 14th November 2023

(5 months, 2 weeks ago)

Commons Chamber
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Feryal Clark Portrait Feryal Clark (Enfield North) (Lab)
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I am grateful for the opportunity to speak in this King’s Speech debate. After 13 years in power, five Prime Ministers, seven Chancellors, an economic crash and a Brexit without a plan, last week we were presented with a wafer-thin programme that honestly could be done by Christmas. Many of the Bills carried over are watered down and weakened versions of their original selves. One example is the Renters (Reform) Bill. We had to wait four years to debate the Bill. There were five months between First and Second Reading, yet the Bill goes nowhere near far enough to protect renters properly, particularly from no-fault evictions.

Court proceedings for no-fault evictions are at a seven-year high. My borough of Enfield has been hit particularly hard by this eviction crisis, having the highest number of section 21 evictions in the whole of London. It leads to a massive increase in homelessness, increased use of temporary accommodation such as hotels, a huge financial burden on local authorities as they try to grapple with the cost of that accommodation, and increased fear and anxiety for families across the country. I fear that the Government know all too well the impact that these evictions are having on people, but they either do not care or cannot stand up to their party.

Last week, we had the former Home Secretary, the right hon. and learned Member for Fareham (Suella Braverman), declaring war on the use of tents on the streets, disgracefully stating that homelessness is “a lifestyle choice”. According to the charity Crisis, the loss of private tenancy is the leading cause of homelessness. In Enfield, the risk of homelessness increased by 38% because of section 21 notices last year. This Government have chosen to delay banning section 21 evictions for four years. These are not lifestyle choices—they are hard evidence of Tory failure.

These evictions are not only deeply distressing to renters, causing grief and hardship, but costly to the public purse. In fact, Enfield Council faces spending an additional £20 million on temporary accommodation this year alone—that is £20 million that the local authority can no longer spend on public services, despite the dire need for investment and reform. That is funding it can no longer spend on housing or on stuff like social care—the list goes on. Rents in the UK were recently reported to be the highest on record. Far too few homes are being built, mortgage rates are spiralling out of control, and families in my constituency of Enfield North are paying an extra £350 on their mortgages every month, all thanks to 13 years of economic mismanagement and the Tory party’s mortgage bombshell.

Things like working hard, buying a home and raising a family are difficult enough as it is. People expect the Government to keep the economy stable so that their family’s future is secure, but meeting monthly payments is now forcing tough choices, from having to cut back on the weekly shop to abandoning family holidays. A food bank in my constituency recently told me that demand this year is out of control. All those problems demand the very best from the Government, but sadly they have no plan to fix them.

Our economy, like our country, is crying out for change. We need a Government who are on the side of working people and who have ambition, energy and ideas, but this is a tired Government who have lost their goal to govern. The Prime Minister and his Government have failed my constituents and the country. The only way to deliver the change he talks about and which the country needs is to call a general election.

Oral Answers to Questions

Feryal Clark Excerpts
Tuesday 7th February 2023

(1 year, 2 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Andrew Griffith Portrait The Economic Secretary to the Treasury (Andrew Griffith)
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My hon. Friend makes an important point. That is why the Financial Services and Markets Bill rightly improves the accountability of regulators to Parliament. It is about not just the cost of regulation, but the speed and efficiency of it. I read with concern work from TheCityUK suggesting that 90% of industry respondents thought that the speed of authorisations was either “somewhat” or “extremely” detrimental.

Feryal Clark Portrait Feryal Clark (Enfield North) (Lab)
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T4. It has been two weeks since it was revealed that the Treasury provided special dispensation for a sanctioned Russian warlord to use British lawyers to threaten a British citizen, Eliot Higgins. What has the Chancellor done in that time to get to the bottom of this outrageous scandal of the Treasury undermining sanctions and aiding our enemies to use aggressive lawfare tactics designed to intimidate those exposing the truth?

James Cartlidge Portrait The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (James Cartlidge)
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I answered the urgent question on this matter and said that we would consider what more can be done in these types of cases. That work is ongoing, but we will report in due course, when we have more to say.

Economic Responsibility and a Plan for Growth

Feryal Clark Excerpts
Wednesday 19th October 2022

(1 year, 6 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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William Wragg Portrait Mr William Wragg (Hazel Grove) (Con)
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Thank you very much for calling me so early in the debate, Madam Deputy Speaker. If I may strike a conciliatory tone at the outset of my remarks, I thank everybody in this House who sent me remarkable support in the course of the summer recess. There is nothing unique about my having had issues with my mental health, but what is perhaps more unique than most in the country is that I have the platform and opportunity to highlight that and to speak empathetically, and I am very grateful indeed. In making this speech, there are a number of things in my life that I am struggling with at the moment, but, bizarrely, it seems that making a speech in the House of Commons is not one of them. I am not entirely sure whether that is attuned to my state of mind, and no doubt my hon. Friends on the Front Bench will tell me afterwards.

I want to speak on this important matter because I have not said a word to my constituents about the events of the last month or so. I watched on from home when the Chancellor gave his so-called mini-Budget, which should have been delivered as a full Budget, with the proper procedures of the House duly followed. As the time passed, I grew increasingly concerned by its nature. I am quite an old-fashioned person and, in respect of this House, I like to look at the wording of the motion. I also believe in speaking one’s mind, and I can only say that today is the exact centenary of a meeting in 1922, during which Conservative Back Benchers met to decide that they would stand on their own ticket in the 1992 general election, thereby depriving David Lloyd George of the opportunity to continue as Prime Minister. As vice-chair of the 1922 Committee—the foundation of which followed the events of that afternoon and evening—I think it is quite important to speak my mind. I realise there are some in my party who lament that state of affairs, but I hope they will indulge me, as I have indulged them over time.

Many things that have been said by those on the Front Bench are very true. There is an international situation, an illegal invasion of Ukraine and a spike in the international cost of energy. The Government have many things to be proud of—not least the employment record—but there is no escaping the fact that the measures contained within the financial statement directly caused the situation to be made worse. I am quite sure that was not intentional, but I cannot easily forgive the lack of foresight by senior members of the Government. My forgiveness is not what that the Government should seek at all; it should be that of our constituents, who are in a difficult enough situation as it is. To see this as a question of international turbulence inexplicably increasing the mortgage rates and inexplicably necessitating further cuts to public expenditure—I cannot easily forgive that.

In the course of the summer, I found the trashing of the reputations of independent organisations in this country, such as the Bank of England and the Office for Budget Responsibility, to be near to malice in its nature. Treasury orthodoxy came under attack. I am a Conservative, and I suppose that orthodoxy goes hand in hand with that. That is Conservative orthodoxy. Conservative orthodoxy is sound financial management and a balanced budget—not sticking pamphlets into a test tube, shaking it up and seeing what happens. That is not the way the Conservative party should ever govern.

Apparently I can be a little difficult to handle, and my hon. Friend the Member for Workington (Mark Jenkinson) must have wondered what he had done in a previous life to find me in his flock as my Whip. I always commiserate with my Whip when they are appointed; indeed, I have been round the block with a number of them, and I end up getting round to them all over again. But there is a serious point to all this: I am personally ashamed of what occurred with the financial statement, because I cannot go and face my constituents, look them in the eye and say that they should support our great party. The polls would seem to bear that out.

The next debate is apparently a confidence issue. Well, I am not going to fall into that trap. I oppose fracking and thought that we had come to a considered position on it, but there we go. I will vote with the Government Whip.

Feryal Clark Portrait Feryal Clark (Enfield North) (Lab)
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Will the hon. Gentleman be lending the Prime Minister his confidence vote in the next debate?

William Wragg Portrait Mr Wragg
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The hon. Lady is very charitable in giving me a further minute for my peroration, although it seems a shame to extend it too long. The fracking debate that follows has been made a confidence vote. If I voted as I would wish, I would lose the Whip. I would no longer be a vice-chair of the 1922 Committee. I would no longer maintain my position as a Chair of one of the Select Committees of the House. Indeed, because of that, my letter lodged with my hon. Friend the Member for Altrincham and Sale West (Sir Graham Brady) would fall, and I wish to maintain that letter with him.

--- Later in debate ---
Paula Barker Portrait Paula Barker (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab)
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Government Members should not think for one second that the Opposition will relent from holding them to account for this dog’s dinner, which is entirely of their own making. Like a broken record, the lame duck Prime Minister cites global economic headwinds, refusing to take any responsibility for the decisions that brought the British economy to the edge of disaster.

We have a Prime Minister in office but not in power, humiliated and bereft of ideas. Her manifesto drawn up by the libertarian right and the Institute of Economic Affairs has been cut to ribbons. The dogma espoused in “Britannia Unchained” must never again be allowed to reign supreme in Whitehall. In fact, the ideas must be consigned to the dustbin of history.

Now the Prime Minister has brought back an old foe, who underfunded our NHS for years, to implement austerity 2.0, and once again it will be communities like mine in Liverpool, Wavertree who suffer. This is a Tory crisis, and the damage has been done: an estimated 14,344 people in Liverpool will be paying higher mortgage bills next year as a result of this Government’s irresponsible actions. The Prime Minister and the Chancellor now admit that the mini-Budget caused mortgage rates to go up and borrowing costs to surge—a Tory cost we will be living with for years.

Working people have gone through enough. Now they are told that, to re-establish market stability, the responsibility is being shifted from the Government on to households, communities and working people. It all feels very 2011. Some are even saying that a previous Chancellor, the former Member for Tatton, is pulling the strings. The new Chancellor embodies a very different type of dogma from the Prime Minister’s, but it is dogma nevertheless—a school of economics that saw us enter the coronavirus pandemic with public services under-resourced and under-prepared.

Feryal Clark Portrait Feryal Clark
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Does my hon. Friend agree that it is not just public services, but local councils such as mine in Enfield, which faces a £100 million budget gap due to spiralling inflation, that are paying the price for this Government’s mismanagement of the economy?

Paula Barker Portrait Paula Barker
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My hon. Friend makes a pivotal point. Local authorities have been cut to the bone. They provide valuable resources and frontline services out in our communities, but they are being decimated yet again by this Government. Our public sector workforce is demoralised after a decade of pay restraint and cuts to frontline services.

If this Government think for one moment that our people will now put up with more of the same while bankers’ bonuses remain uncapped and millionaire bosses continue to rake in profits and dividends, they are sadly mistaken. The British people have woken up to the con. No longer does the promise ring true that each succeeding generation will have it better than the last. That promise, forged in the fire of the post-war consensus, is now in ruins after decades of short-termism and the dominance of capital over labour. We are not all in this together. Not once since 2010 have we all been in this together. Despite the empty rhetoric of a strong economy and levelling up, the Conservative party has always sought to look after its own class interests at the expense of the rest of us.

Young people in my Liverpool, Wavertree constituency now face their lives being put on hold because of this Government’s incompetence. They have done the right thing: they have gone out, worked hard and saved, only to be cheated and denied the opportunity of home ownership. Working people are up against real-terms cuts to their pay and our elderly are anxious about heating their homes in the run-up to winter. There is even more uncertainty for small businesses and charities, such as the amazing Love Wavertree in my constituency, which does incredible work. It announced today that the increase in its energy bills means it must consider whether it can continue to run its community shop, a lifeline for many people in my constituency.

History will not be kind to this Government, nor to anyone who has participated over the past 12 years. The Conservative party is lost. Thankfully, change is coming. As the Leader of the Opposition said so eloquently at Prime Minister’s questions today, we are the Government in waiting; the Conservative party are the Opposition in waiting. Frankly, that cannot come quickly enough.

Economy Update

Feryal Clark Excerpts
Thursday 26th May 2022

(1 year, 11 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Rishi Sunak Portrait Rishi Sunak
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I am proud that this Government worked to agree a new international taxation agreement, signed by over 130 countries, so that we can tax the profits of large digital companies more fairly. That will come into effect in the coming months and years. It is something we should all be proud of and can all get behind. I believe that the Labour party opposes the policy and would scrap that treaty.

Feryal Clark Portrait Feryal Clark (Enfield North) (Lab)
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My borough of Enfield has the 11th highest rate of child poverty in the country, and one in five people are on low pay. While the Chancellor has been dragged kicking and screaming to an inevitable outcome, families have been suffering for months. The measures today are welcome, but they need to be delivered efficiently and effectively. Can the Chancellor therefore outline what steps he will take to speed up the painfully slow council tax rebate, which is causing significant distress to my constituents?

Rishi Sunak Portrait Rishi Sunak
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I know councils are working as hard as they can to get the payments to people, and we of course remain engaged with them, to help provide the support that they need to do that as fast as possible.

Yazidi Genocide

Feryal Clark Excerpts
Tuesday 8th February 2022

(2 years, 2 months ago)

Westminster Hall
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Westminster Hall is an alternative Chamber for MPs to hold debates, named after the adjoining Westminster Hall.

Each debate is chaired by an MP from the Panel of Chairs, rather than the Speaker or Deputy Speaker. A Government Minister will give the final speech, and no votes may be called on the debate topic.

This information is provided by Parallel Parliament and does not comprise part of the offical record

Feryal Clark Portrait Feryal Clark (Enfield North) (Lab)
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It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Hollobone. I start by paying tribute to the hon. Member for Argyll and Bute (Brendan O'Hara) for securing today’s debate, for his advocacy on the issue, as vice-chair of the all-party parliamentary group on British Turks and Kurds, and for setting out clearly the steps our Government can take to correct a wrong.

I am an ethnic Kurd and speak Kurdish—something I share with the Yazidi Kurds in Iraq. In 2014, I watched as thousands of Yazidis were dislocated from their homes and I felt really helpless. I wrote to my MP, and tried to get their voices heard and recognised. I am proud to be here as a voice for the Yazidis and to support colleagues in this debate.

I was pleased when a debate finally took place in the House in 2016; this is not the first time the issue has been brought to the UK Parliament. In April 2016, the voice of the House was expressed clearly when it voted 278 to zero to recognise the atrocities committed by Daesh against the Yazidis and other religious minorities.

Unfortunately, the Government did not listen then, deeming that it was up to a credible court to make such a designation. As we heard from the hon. Member for Argyll and Bute, the criteria have been met as a result of the conviction in Germany. I am keen to hear from the Minister the steps our Government will take in response. Too often, sadly, it feels as though these discussions are treated as symbolic—merely a gesture to be made. That approach completely fails to acknowledge the duty imposed on states under international law, the role that developed nations such as the UK should play, and the real stories behind the genocide.

By recognising genocide, we are not just making a statement. We are taking practical steps to support those affected by the atrocities committed. In the case of the Yazidi genocide, the stories from victims should compel all of us to act. Daesh did not seek only to eradicate the Yazidi people; they sought the utter destruction of a community, its culture and its dignity.

Article 2 of the convention on the prevention and punishment of the crime of genocide sets out the prohibited acts that constitute genocide. One such condition is:

“Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part”.

It is on this that I will focus the remainder of my remarks. By subjecting women to organised sexual violence and enslavement on such a massive scale, Daesh undoubtedly sought their physical destruction. Rape, mutilation, forced sterilisation—these are just some of the things Daesh subjected Yazidi women to. This was not just violence and it was not an act of war: it was an attempt to systematically break the spirit of a people and bring about their physical destruction.

We have heard harrowing accounts of Yazidi women and girls from other hon. Members. I will share a testimony from a girl captured by Daesh at just 12 years old. She said:

“We were registered. ISIS took our names…where we came from and whether we were married or not. After that, ISIS fighters would come to select girls to go with them. The youngest girls I saw them take was about 9 years old. One girl told me that ‘if they take you, it is better that you kill yourself.’”

This girl was just 12 years old when she was captured. She was held by Daesh for seven months and was sold in that period four times. She was not thought of as a child, as vulnerable; she was treated as a commodity to be traded for the gratification of ISIS men. Daesh had so low a view of the value of Yazidi life that they stripped away all basic humanity and treated these women as mere goods.

Recognising the Yazidi genocide is not a gesture. It is not symbolic. It is an acknowledgement of how these women suffered and a commitment to help them. We know that thousands of Yazidi remain missing, yet we do nothing. We know the humanitarian crisis is ever growing, yet we do nothing. We can no longer stand by and look the Yazidi people in the eye and do nothing. Recognition is not an end point; it is not the conclusion of our responsibilities. It is the start of properly understanding the events that took place and of playing our part in ensuring that they never happen again.

The Government must act now and take steps to call this what it is: a genocide. I look forward to the Minister’s response and to hearing his views on the criteria that have been met and what our Government will do.

Philip Hollobone Portrait Mr Philip Hollobone (in the Chair)
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We know come to the Front-Bench spokespeople, the first of whom will be Martyn Day from the SNP.

Government's Management of the Economy

Feryal Clark Excerpts
Tuesday 23rd February 2021

(3 years, 2 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Feryal Clark Portrait Feryal Clark (Enfield North) (Lab) [V]
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Covid has invaded every aspect of our lives. It has taken loved ones before their time, separated communities from one another and placed our NHS under unimaginable stresses. On 5 March, we will reach the one-year anniversary of the first Briton to die from the virus. It is only human for us to reflect on this sombre milestone and to ask, “What could we have done better, and how can we stop these failures happening again?”

This is the landscape in which we find this debate. The UK has suffered much and needs a compassionate, competent Government to act as its lodestar to a more secure future, but we find instead a Government who have presided over 10 years of economic mismanagement, which is typified by the approach to local government funding. Despite the Chancellor having served as local government Minister, he seems to have a complete blind spot when it comes to local government. Local authorities will play a vital role in supporting social and economic recovery as we emerge from the pandemic, yet they continue to face ongoing funding pressures under this Government.

Enfield, my local council, has done its utmost to protect frontline services and its communities during the pandemic, but it has had to do that with one hand tied behind its back. The Government have imposed cuts of over £170 million on Enfield over the past 10 years, making a tough job of protecting our communities even harder. Local authorities are the bedrock of our public services and they will be essential in supporting a green recovery, helping local people to regain skills, getting them into jobs and supporting our hardest-hit families.

That is why the Government’s council tax bombshell will blow apart families’ finances and undermine the long-term sustainability of the services that we will all rely on. This is a regressive tax increase, as it will hurt most those with the least. It will see areas with the lowest tax bases struggle to recoup lost Government central funding. Once again, we do not see a levelling-up agenda, but a “decay down” programme. In Enfield, many will see a tax hike of £100 thanks to this Government—that is £100 that can no longer be spent in local businesses to protect our local employees through this horrific time. It is short-termism writ large. The Budget in the coming weeks needs to be forward-looking, but I fear we will see yet more of the same old story of Tories abandoning communities in their greatest need.

Ministerial and other Maternity Allowances Bill

Feryal Clark Excerpts
Feryal Clark Portrait Feryal Clark (Enfield North) (Lab) [V]
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The thrust of the Bill is long overdue and much needed, and to that extent, it should be welcomed. For far too long, an artificial and arbitrary barrier has been put in front of women who wish to serve their constituents in government. It has been a case of naked discrimination hiding in plain sight. By allowing the Prime Minister to designate a Minister on leave, we will in some respects be bringing the world of public office in line with the world of work. It should go without saying that we should be an exemplar of workplace rights, but in truth, this place has all too often treated the many women elected to it as an irritant or an afterthought.

I still have many reservations about the Bill. Why, for instance, have the Government wasted this opportunity by making the Bill applicable only to Cabinet-level positions? If we want to see a Government and legislature that reflect our wider society, they must be a welcoming place for all those who work across them. The Government should revisit that aspect of the Bill and correct it immediately because, by continuing with such glaring gaps in the system, we are sending out a dangerous message to employees across the UK. We are saying that it is okay to think of women as secondary to the needs of the organisation, that a token effort is effort enough, that protecting the management is a job well done and that women should be grateful for whatever small breaks are afforded them. That type of thinking leads us further down a path where women are de facto excluded from decision-making roles and positions of power, while needlessly snuffing out the aspirations of future generations.

It is all well and good speaking in abstracts, but for me, this Bill is also very personal. As you know, Madam Deputy Speaker, I am both an expectant first-time mother and a first-time MP. When I stood for election, I did so because I wanted to do right by my constituents in Parliament and to stand up for a set of principles that should transcend party politics. And yet, as a Member of Parliament, with all the vast opportunity and privilege that that affords me, I am scared. I am scared about taking informal maternity leave when my baby arrives in two months; it is informal as there is no formalised maternity leave for Back-Bench MPs. I am scared that it will be used against me politically and, most depressing of all, I am scared that, beneath the warm words of good luck and congratulations, some Members will take a dim view of my taking maternity leave at all.

Today we need to fix immediately the fundamental failing of the Bill before us, even while accepting its fundamental necessity. We must view this as a chance not to fix a problem for a Minister but to right a wrong for countless women—Members and staff—and start changing the culture around maternity rights in this place. We can send a signal to all employers that this is not just the right thing to do here; it is simply the right thing to do. That is where the majority of the country is. It is time that Parliament starts to follow in the nation’s footsteps and recognise the huge benefit that women bring to this workplace and countless others.

Rosie Winterton Portrait Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Rosie Winterton)
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I thank the hon. Lady for her speech, and I would like to offer, on behalf of everyone here, our sincerest congratulations and warmest wishes to her.

The Economy

Feryal Clark Excerpts
Wednesday 8th July 2020

(3 years, 9 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Olivia Blake Portrait Olivia Blake (Sheffield, Hallam) (Lab)
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It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Telford (Lucy Allan), who has spoken passionately about Telford’s tenacity. Today we are debating the state of our economy, which is in urgent need of discussion and desperate need of action. As the Chancellor pointed out in his statement, covid-19 resulted in a 25% drop in GDP in April, compared with February. That is unprecedented. Technically we are not in recession yet, but the writing is on the wall: there is worse to come. We know that we will be living with this crisis for a long time.

Many of the measures that the Chancellor has outlined today are welcome, but they do not go far enough to address either the current unprecedented crisis or the long-term problems that have caused the UK to be one of the G7 economies hit hardest by the coronavirus. Before covid19, we were in no position to weather a financial storm. Ten years of anaemic growth have seen wages stagnate in real terms, and people’s rights at work have been eroded. Take the care workers the Prime Minister has clapped for on Thursdays and then scapegoated on the following Monday—on zero-hours contracts, poverty wages, and often unacceptable statutory pay. This was a problem created in the past 10 years, not six months. In my city, we have seen central Government funding cut year in, year out, with vital services stretched and starved of funding. We now face a £23 million shortfall in the council’s funding this year.

Feryal Clark Portrait Feryal Clark (Enfield North) (Lab)
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Does my hon. Friend agree that local authorities are essential in our recovery from covid, and that local authorities have been abandoned by the Chancellor in this mini-Budget, and by this Government?

Olivia Blake Portrait Olivia Blake
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My hon. Friend makes a very valid point. The work that local authorities have been doing should be commended and rewarded. The Government have made promises that need to be kept in terms of funding, and I will watch to see whether they will fulfil them.

Nothing the Chancellor has said today addresses these issues. We were promised a green new deal. The £3 billion for home retrofits and energy efficiency in public buildings is welcome, but it is not a green new deal. It falls well short of the funding we need to kick-start a faltering economy and deliver the growth and green jobs that are vital for our recovery. We will see Governments across the globe act on a green recovery, and I am afraid that this will be a missed opportunity for the UK to help with a future crisis in the wake of this pandemic. We know that we are not out of the woods yet and we may be facing further hardship as a result of coronavirus. The medium to long-term impacts could be felt for generations. We need the Government to forge a path from which we can emerge with greater opportunities and a greener economy.

I welcome the extended access to funding for apprenticeships, but we cannot escape the fact that our further education sector has been decimated. We need accessible, lifelong learning to help us to pull through this global crisis. I am shocked that the only mention of universities in this whole package is £300 million for infrastructure and labs. That undermines the fact that research in this country is completely down to the amazing researchers that we have. We have seen redundancy processes started at multiple universities across the country, and this will be harmful to gender and black, Asian and minority ethnic representation in early careers. We risk having a lost generation of researchers in this country, and that will serve only to make us weaker in the future and reduce our productivity. It is absolutely vital that we see more from the Government on this.

The scale and ambition of the economic response to the coronavirus must match the scale of the challenges we face. As we come out of this public health crisis—if we do indeed come out of it—building back better requires that we do more than provide a plaster for the damage inflicted on the economy. It means addressing the fundamental problems in our economy—low growth, stagnating living standards, and poor pay and conditions. Unfortunately, the Government continue to offer nothing to address those issues. They say they will follow the science. I may have taken my lab coat off, but I hope I have given some food for thought.