Oral Answers to Questions

Caroline Spelman Excerpts

Thursday 17th March 2011 Commons Chamber

[Miss Anne McIntosh (Thirsk and Malton) (Con)]

1. What representations she has received on the report of the uplands policy review.

[The Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Mrs Caroline Spelman)]

I begin by informing the House that I have written to the Japanese Environment Minister, Mr Matsumoto, with whom I spent a great deal of time negotiating in Nagoya, to express our sincerest condolences. As the House would expect, I have also offered the services of my Department in respect of technical expertise on flood recovery, air and water quality and radiological decontamination.

I thank my hon. Friend and the Select Committee on Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, which she chairs, for highlighting the importance of the uplands. I have received numerous positive reactions from a wide range of stakeholders to the conclusions of the uplands policy review, which I announced last week.

[Miss McIntosh]

May I share in the Secretary of State’s expression of condolences and thank her for writing to offer the services of her Department? I also thank her for her answer.

The uplands are the jewel in our farming crown, but the continuation of active farming needs to be encouraged, particularly the keeping of livestock. My right hon. Friend will be aware of the difficulties that tenant farmers are currently suffering. Will she come up with some positive measures in the policy review to encourage them to maintain livestock in the uplands?

[Mrs Spelman]

We feel very strongly about the value and potential of our uplands, which have been overlooked for too long. That is why, as a new Government, we have prioritised our review of uplands policy. Our intention is to support and encourage all hill farmers to become more competitive, and we have made available up to £6 million a year more for environmental stewardship schemes. When I launched the review, I impressed on landowners that they should be constructive when they receive requests from tenants to participate in such schemes.

[Helen Goodman (Bishop Auckland) (Lab)]

The uplands review obviously came out of the excellent report produced by the Commission for Rural Communities last summer. Will the Secretary of State explain why she has attempted to frustrate the clearly expressed will of the other place by cutting the CRC’s budget by some 90%?

[Mrs Spelman]

It is not a question of frustrating the will of the other place. There has been a change of Government, and the two parties that together form the Government have Members of Parliament who mostly have rural constituencies. It is thus easier for us to champion rural causes, as in our uplands policy review. The hon. Lady’s Government had 13 years in which to do something about the uplands, but it has taken a change of Government to achieve that.

[Dr Daniel Poulter (Central Suffolk and North Ipswich) (Con)]

2. What recent representations she has received on the profitability of the pig farming sector.

--- Later in debate ---

[David T. C. Davies (Monmouth) (Con)]

7. What recent discussions she has had on the introduction of a prohibition on battery cages for laying hens.

[The Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Mrs Caroline Spelman)]

At the Agriculture and Fisheries Council on 21 February, some member states sought more time to implement the ban on conventional cages, which is coming into force on 1 January 2012. I was the first Minister to emphasise that any delay would be grossly unfair to egg producers in the UK and other member states that have made significant investments to adapt and enrich cages. The Government will continue to play a full part in EU discussions to find a practical solution.

[Henry Smith]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for that answer and for her excellent efforts. Did those discussions also include the importation of derived products into this country?

[Mrs Spelman]

Yes, I can give my hon. Friend that assurance. It is important that we are clear about the provenance of liquid-egg and dried-egg products. Many farmers in the European Union have made the investment to improve the welfare of laying hens, and therefore the deadline has to be respected.

[David T. C. Davies]

The Minister will be aware that many farmers in my constituency of Monmouth have worked extremely hard to comply with that legislation. I am grateful to her for saying that it would be unfair if other EU countries do not, but can she say what would happen if other countries, including new entrants, were exempt from that legislation?

[Mrs Spelman]

I am not talking about exemption. Obviously the Commission can threaten infraction proceedings against member states whose egg producers are non-compliant, but in my view that will not be enough. One of the options that we have suggested to the Commission is an intra-Community trade ban, which would restrict the sale of eggs that continued to be produced from conventional cages after the deadline had expired.

[Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op)]

Will the right hon. Lady show some caution on this? Those of us who are passionate about animal welfare remember when this country moved ahead on protecting young calves reared for veal from disgraceful conditions. Veal in this country is now well produced. The young animals have a decent life, but most of them are killed at birth, which means that we import badly produced veal from France.

[Mrs Spelman]

Veal is not the same thing as eggs. None the less, the sentiment expressed in the hon. Gentleman’s question is important. The point is that member states and producers have known for 10 years that the change would come, and the accession countries seeking to join the Union knew full well before they entered that those were the welfare standards that would apply.

[Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab)]

Given the Secretary of State’s remarks, can she clarify whether she will be proposing a ban on shell, liquid and powdered egg from countries such as Poland that will not meet the deadline, and if so, will she also be banning products such as quiche and cakes from those countries?

[Mrs Spelman]

I can give the hon. Gentleman an assurance that the Commission is looking at this. He might be interested to know that the Minister of State and the Commission will both appear before the Select Committee on Environment, Food and Rural Affairs on 22 March, when there will be ample opportunity to debate in detail the application of measures to ensure that the deadline is respected.

[Rehman Chishti (Gillingham and Rainham) (Con)]

According to the European Commission’s social and economic report, a free-range egg costs just 2p more to produce than a battery egg. Does the Minister agree that this is a price worth paying for animal welfare?

[Mrs Spelman]

It is absolutely clear that the welfare of laying hens is improved by investment in enriched cages. However, it is also true that many consumers enjoy the choice of free-range eggs, and those choices should continue to exist.

[Laura Sandys (South Thanet) (Con)]

8. What measures her Department is taking to ensure its preparedness to respond to major flooding incidents.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con)]

14. What responsibilities she has for the Government’s policies on climate change.

[The Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Mrs Caroline Spelman)]

DEFRA leads on climate change adaptation in England and on engagement with the EU on adaptation. DEFRA works to reduce emissions domestically in the areas for which we have responsibility and also works across Whitehall to ensure that progress on mitigation is achieved in a sustainable way.

[Mr Bone]

The Prime Minister is keen on smaller and more efficient government. If the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills were to take back responsibility for energy, would the Secretary of State think it appropriate for her Department to take back the rest of the climate change responsibilities, because then we could get rid of a whole Department?

[Mrs Spelman]

If we are talking about efficiency, I can tell my hon. Friend that in my experience, reorganisation—including the attempted reorganisation of local government by the last Administration—is not always the most efficient thing to do.

[Mark Lazarowicz (Edinburgh North and Leith) (Lab/Co-op)]

The Secretary of State will know of the growing fear that, in the European Union and elsewhere, the understandable increasing use of biofuels is having a distorting effect on the food market, and particularly on food prices for some of the world’s poor. I do not want to make any assumptions about the implications of the tragic events in Japan, but it is clear that they might have implications for the energy market and biofuel prices. What is the Government’s current policy on biofuels at European level?

[Mrs Spelman]

If we are to increase the amount of renewable energy that we secure and reduce our dependence on fossil fuels, it is important for renewable energy from biomass to be in the mix. However, I agree with the hon. Gentleman that, faced with the challenge of food security, we must be careful to ensure that prime, productive agricultural land is there to provide the food that we are so obviously going to need.

[Gavin Shuker (Luton South) (Lab/Co-op)]

DEFRA has said that it is tackling climate change through its new strategy, contained in the document “Mainstreaming sustainable development”. The seven-page document, which was snuck out the night before the Government abolished the Sustainable Development Commission, has been attacked by the president of the National Farmers Union and slated by Jonathon Porritt, who said that it was

“without a doubt the most disgraceful government document relating to Sustainable Development”

that he had ever seen. How is the mainstreaming going?

[Mrs Spelman]

First, let me welcome the hon. Gentleman to his new position. I hope that he will convey our thanks to his predecessor for the role that he played.

Perhaps we could start off on a slightly better footing. We made a decision, as a Government, to mainstream sustainable development, and there is clear evidence from the business plans of the Government Departments that it has been mainstreamed. In addition, I have asked the hon. Gentleman’s colleague the Chairman of the Environmental Audit Committee, the hon. Member for Stoke-on-Trent North (Joan Walley), to hold Departments to account for the sustainable development that is mainstreamed into their business plans. DEFRA will continue to perform its role of scrutinising new policy on sustainable development. However, mainstreaming is an obvious step forward from the position when the hon. Gentleman’s party was in power, when sustainable development was outside the remit of Government and in the hands of an arm’s length body.

[Julian Sturdy (York Outer) (Con)]

15. What recent discussions she has had on reform of the common agricultural policy; and if she will make a statement.

[The Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Mrs Caroline Spelman)]

At this precise moment Lord Henley is attending the Agriculture Council, representing the United Kingdom. I hope Members will appreciate the presence of a full team of House of Commons Ministers here to answer oral questions. However, I have spent two full days this week in Brussels, where the Environment Council discussed CAP reform. I met Members of the European Parliament—including the officers and rapporteur of the Agriculture Committee —to discuss CAP reform, as the European Parliament has the power of co-decision.

[Julian Sturdy]

Let me begin by drawing Members’ attention to my declaration of interest.

Will the Secretary of State confirm that the negotiating position that she intends to take on CAP reform is different from that of the last Government, and that food security is at the heart of all decision-making processes?

[Mrs Spelman]

Yes, I can confirm a change from the traditional stance taken by the last Government. Calling for direct payments to end forthwith was unrealistic. Our farmers need those direct payments at the moment, although I can envisage a time when, given rising food prices, they may not be necessary. The new, more realistic position means that we are a player at the negotiating table, part of an important alliance of member states that want CAP reform so that we can confront the serious challenges presented by the need for food security and by climate change.

[Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab)]

According to farmsubsidy.org, the number of CAP millionaires rose by 20% in 2009 to 1,212, and they pocketed a total of €4.9 billion. Does the Secretary of State agree with those who say that there should be a cap—if Members will excuse the pun—on maximum payments to individual recipients, and that there should be far more transparency across Europe in relation to who is receiving such payments?

[Mrs Spelman]

We are calling for a substantial reduction in single farm payments, but we do not share the Commission’s view that a cap should be introduced. The capping of farms whose size made them eligible would result in the fragmentation of farm structures, which would prevent agriculture from becoming more competitive and market-oriented.

[Mary Creagh (Wakefield) (Lab)]

The CAP has two key roles: ensuring security of food supply and environmental management. On 17 December, The Daily Telegraph reported a secret stitch-up between the Prime Minister and President Sarkozy of France: no reform of the CAP in return for French support for the British rebate. Yet the right hon. Lady the Secretary of State told the Oxford farming conference in January:

“Now is the time to make very significant progress towards reducing our reliance on direct payments”,

but her colleague the Farming Minister, the right hon. Member for South East Cambridgeshire (Mr Paice), contradicted her in the Farmers Guardian saying:

“Farming could not survive without direct payments…we will be suggesting a long, long transition from the current CAP system.”

We know the Prime Minister has full confidence in all his Cabinet Ministers, but who is in charge of CAP negotiations?

[Mrs Spelman]

I think the hon. Lady should rely a little less on speculation reported in newspapers. She has been a politician for long enough to know that we should take what we read in the papers with a pinch of salt. She obviously was not listening when I very clearly set out our position. Her Government’s position on the CAP over their 13-year period in office was, frankly, not credible: they suggested that direct payments should end immediately. If the hon. Lady does not know enough about farming in this country to know that farmers cannot manage at this point in time without their direct payments, she has a lot of learning to do. Our new position is much more realistic: it is to look forward to the time when subvention will not be required, while in the intervening period helping the industry to adapt so that it is more competitive and market-oriented.

[Mary Creagh]

OECD reports show that UK food prices have risen by more than 6% in the last year, and families across the country are feeling the pain. The Foresight report says we need to increase production not just to feed the UK, but to meet growing demand for food across the world. The Environment Secretary told her officials she wanted to be briefed on the price of a loaf of bread. Can she tell the House by how much the price of a loaf has gone up in the last six months, and why does her newly published sustainable development strategy make no mention at all of the CAP, food or farming?

[Mrs Spelman]

I am sure the hon. Lady does the household shopping in the same way that I do, and it is interesting that the hike in world food prices has not yet fully translated through into the cost of the grocery bill. This issue is a concern not only in the UK, but in other countries. It was also a concern to her Government during the last price hike in 2008. She should also be concerned about the farm-gate price of food: farming input costs are rising, making it extremely difficult for farmers to provide us with food at a reasonable price. That is one of the reasons why we made it a priority in our business plan to support British food and farming in a way that her Government did not.

[Mr Speaker]

I am grateful to the Secretary of State for that answer. I call Simon Kirby. He is not here. I therefore call Yvonne Fovargue.

--- Later in debate ---

[Neil Parish (Tiverton and Honiton) (Con)]

T1. If she will make a statement on her departmental responsibilities.

[The Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Mrs Caroline Spelman)]

My Department takes responsibility for safeguarding the environment, supporting farmers and strengthening the green economy. In that regard, I draw attention to the written statement I have laid today, confirming the details of the independent panel to advise on the future direction of forestry and woodland policy. The panel will be chaired by the Right Reverend James Jones, the Bishop of Liverpool, and will be made up of leading experts in the field of conservation and woodland management, along with other representatives of the broad range of issues associated with forestry in England, such as access and timber supply.

[Neil Parish]

I very much welcome the Secretary of State’s statement on setting up this panel on forests. She talked about food prices rising, but one of the great problems is that the money is not going back to the farmers—too much is being taken out by the supermarkets and others. I know that the Business Secretary has to deliver this, but when is he going to put the grocery adjudicator in place?

[Mrs Spelman]

On 17 February, the Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills, my hon. Friend the Member for Kingston and Surbiton (Mr Davey) indicated during his Department’s questions that he would publish the relevant Bill in April. Obviously, Parliament is in recess for a significant amount of that month, but the Bill will be published some time around Easter.

[Mary Creagh (Wakefield) (Lab)]

I welcome the production of the forestry panel, but the trees are not yet out of the woods. This Sunday, thousands of people will gather in forests across the country to keep up the pressure on the Government to abandon their sale of 100,000 acres of England’s forests. People will be asking me in Dalby forest why their local organisations have been excluded from this panel. What should I tell them?

[Mrs Spelman]

I am delighted to tell the hon. Lady that the independent panel will hold its meetings in different parts of England, as was the original intention with the consultation, to come to people who have concerns about forests. A huge number of organisations—more than 70—applied to go on the panel, which will engage them all by seeking information, views and evidence from them all so that everyone feels involved.

[Claire Perry (Devizes) (Con)]

T2. May I return to the topic of the difficulties faced by pig farmers, which are particularly acute in my constituency? Is the Minister aware of the answer given by the Minister for the Armed Forces to my recent written question showing that under the previous Government less than 1% of the bacon served to our armed forces was British? Does he agree that if we are to do what we say as a Government and help British farmers, we should put our money where our mouth is and encourage the public sector to buy British?

--- Later in debate ---

[Dr Alan Whitehead (Southampton, Test) (Lab)]

This morning, the Secretary of State repeated her suggestion that the Environmental Audit Committee might take over the functions of the Sustainable Development Commission, which she has abolished, as a watchdog on sustainable development. Does she recognise that that will be a complete fantasy unless resources and organisation are fundamentally addressed? What efforts has she made to get resources for the EAC so that it can perform that role?

[Mrs Spelman]

The hon. Gentleman might have misunderstood what I said. There is a four-pronged approach to mainstreaming sustainable development, in which the Environmental Audit Committee might, I suggested, play the role of holding Secretaries of State to account in the way that Select Committees regularly do. Although the Select Committees are bodies of Parliament rather than Government, I have written to the Chair of the Public Accounts Committee to ask whether some of the 700 auditors in the National Audit Office, which comes under her jurisdiction, might be released to help the Environmental Audit Committee in that role.

[Mr Speaker]

I am grateful to the Secretary of State.

--- Later in debate ---

[Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland) (Lab)]

Does the Secretary of State believe that reducing funding by nearly a third to the national parks, such as the North York Moors national park in my constituency, is good for promoting tourism and helps small and medium-sized businesses in Guisborough and east Cleveland?

[Mrs Spelman]

I can give the hon. Gentleman an assurance. I visited the Lake District national park last week as part of launching the uplands policy and the park authority expressed itself quite capable of making savings, which are pro rata across the Department because we have to repair the finances after what was left behind by his Government. I am therefore confident that it can protect the front line while making savings in the back office. That park, in conjunction with many national parks, is setting about doing that constructively.

[Mr Speaker]

I call Mr Douglas Carswell. He is not here.

--- Later in debate ---

[Mark Lazarowicz (Edinburgh North and Leith) (Lab/Co-op)]

At first sight, the independent panel on forestry includes three people who represent landowning or industry forestry interests but does not include anyone who represents the trade unions or the people who work in that area. The Institute of Chartered Foresters is represented, but that is very much a specialist interest. Is it not an omission not to have a trade union represented on the panel?

[Mrs Spelman]

When I made my statement on this matter in the House, I heeded very carefully the point that was made by Opposition Members that those who work in the forests ought to be represented on the panel. That is why Shireen Chambers of the Institute of Chartered Foresters will be on it. The panellists are there not as delegates but as representatives to look at the broad range of issues concerning forestry and woodland in England.

[Robert Halfon (Harlow) (Con)]

T9. Epping forest has 20% of all Travellers pitches in the east of England, over 80% of which are in Nazeing or Roydon in my constituency. Can the Minister reassure my constituents that local communities will now be free to choose how many Travellers pitches they accept rather than having them imposed from Whitehall?

[Mrs Spelman]

This is a matter principally for the Department for Communities and Local Government, which I know is striving to find a balanced solution for both the settled and the travelling communities. I have sympathy with my hon. Friend, as I also have to deal with this issue in my constituency. The abolition of regional spatial strategies puts an end to the top-down provision of sites in favour of local solutions to provide the authorised sites that the travelling community needs.

[Jim Fitzpatrick (Poplar and Limehouse) (Lab)]

Yesterday, there was a march on City hall by residents of Poplar and Limehouse who are very concerned about the possible loss of King Edward Memorial park due to the necessary building of the Thames tideway tunnel. Can the Secretary of State or one of her Ministers reassure me and my constituents that just as DEFRA will keep an eye on costs, as outlined on its website, it will also keep a conscious eye on the need to protect that precious open space, which is much loved by thousands of my constituents?

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op)]

Are we ever going to get a fair deal for farmers or consumers when ruthless monopolies such as Tesco dominate our retail trade? Tesco now has 30% of the trade—by my economic training, that is a monopoly that any Government have to recognise and take on.

[Mrs Spelman]

The Department’s business plan sets out clearly its priority of supporting British food and farming. Obviously, we are trying in the CAP negotiations to get a fair deal for British farmers, consumers and the environment alike. There was an investigation into abuse of competition through the Competition Commission, but the new element that we bring into play is the grocery adjudicator. As I said, the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills intends to introduce legislation on that around Easter.

[Duncan Hames (Chippenham) (LD)]

On taking sustainable development mainstream, the Secretary of State gave me her clear assurance during DEFRA questions on 4 November that she would continue to meet the designated green Ministers from each Department. Will she tell the House who the designated green Ministers in each Department are, and when they last met?

[Mrs Spelman]

I am delighted to be able to tell the House that DEFRA has instituted the green Ministers breakfast. Ministers from across the Government come to DEFRA once a month for this popular event. As you would expect, Mr Speaker, the Department of food and drink makes absolutely sure that they do not go hungry. The events have brought about the huge benefits of breaking down silos between Departments and putting in place a really joined-up approach to green issues and sustainable development right across the Government.

[Mr Speaker]

We are now much better informed and thank the Secretary of State.

--- Later in debate ---

[Andrew George (St Ives) (LD)]

Further to questions about the grocery adjudicator, I should declare an interest as chair of the Grocery Market Action Group, as well as because last week I met the Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills, my hon. Friend the Member for Kingston and Surbiton (Mr Davey), who confirmed that the draft Bill would be published after the purdah period in May. Will the Secretary of State reassure the House that she will use every endeavour to work with the business managers of this place and the Business Department to ensure that the measure is introduced this year and that we have effective regulation of the sector as soon as possible?

[Mrs Spelman]

I am happy to give my hon. Friend an absolute assurance that I will use all my best endeavours to ensure that we proceed swiftly. I pay tribute to his work on producing a Bill in this Parliament, which I hope will help to inform his colleagues in the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills. I know that the Deputy Leader of the House is anxious that we make good progress on the important Bill that my hon. Friend mentioned.

[Mr Speaker]

I thank colleagues for their co-operation which, not for the first time, has ensured that every question on the Order Paper has been reached and substantially more besides.