Political Violence and Disruption: Walney Report

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd May 2024 Commons Chamber

[Tom Tugendhat]

I pay a huge tribute to the hon. Gentleman. He has been a voice of sanity and courage for many years, on many of these issues. His leadership on the Trojan horse scandal was inspirational, and his voice of clarity, standing up for members of the British public who do not wish to see their children or themselves pushed into supporting extremist ideology, has been an example to many of us. I am enormously grateful for his support and I would be delighted to work with him on the appalling issues he has faced himself.

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

Lord Walney has come up with a marvellous report. I am not surprised: I knew him when he was a Member of Parliament and he was an excellent Member of Parliament too. His report talks about preventing protests from going ahead on account of the “cumulative impact” of serious disruption. He is right to identify that; it is intimidatory and, as my right hon. Friend the Minister has already said, many Jewish people, Muslims and others are frightened of going on the streets because of it. If the report now leads to more legislation by this Government, how certain is the Minister that individual police forces, in particular the Metropolitan police, will implement those new laws?

Oral Answers to Questions

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Monday 26th February 2024 Commons Chamber

[Tom Pursglove]

I do not accept the depiction that the hon. Lady paints of the situation. We of course make appropriate case-by-case decisions about accommodation arrangements for individuals, reflecting the needs they have and with proper referrals made, as one would rightly expect, to any other agencies that may be required to ensure somebody’s health or wellbeing, and that any safeguarding issues are properly addressed. Migrant Help support is of course available for people to access 24/7 and raise any issues.

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

12. What recent progress he has made with his French counterparts on tackling illegal migration.

[The Minister for Countering Illegal Migration (Michael Tomlinson)]

Joint working with our French partners is crucial to stopping the boats. Thanks in no small part to that joint working, small boat crossings were down by 46% last year.

[Michael Fabricant]

My spies tell me that my hon. and learned Friend was in France just nine days ago. Were there any lessons to be learned from the French authorities about more co-operation that can go on to stop the boats even further?

[Michael Tomlinson]

My hon. Friend is right: I was in France nine days ago. Even while I was there, a boat was seized, but he is right to say that more needs to be done. Personnel, equipment and technology are key to breaking the business model of the criminal gangs. Having met the new Préfet du Nord, I am in no doubt that this is a joint mission.

Draft West Midlands Combined Authority (Transfer of Police and Crime Commissioner Functions) Order 2024

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Monday 26th February 2024 General Committees

[Chris Philp]

Yes, absolutely. We take into account the quality and weight of the arguments, rather than just the number. A number of copy-and-paste responses appear to have been organised, and that is something we were aware of in considering the responses.

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

On that point, will my right hon. Friend give way?

--- Later in debate ---

[Valerie Vaz]

On a point of order, Sir Graham. I understand that the hon. Member for Lichfield has a connection to the Mayor, and I wish that he could state what that is. Should he or should he not be taking part in the proceedings?

[Michael Fabricant]

Further to that point of order, Sir Graham. I am really grateful to the right hon. Lady for pointing that out. Legally, I am under no obligation, as I understand it—perhaps you can clarify this, Sir Graham —to declare an interest, because there is no pecuniary interest whatever. I am more than happy to say that Andy Street is a friend of mine, and I am sure he is a friend of many others. Indeed, I like to think I am a special friend of Andy Street’s, and I simply state that for the record.

[The Chair]

The point of order and the point raised further to it are not a matter for the Chair. It is for every Member of Parliament to reach a decision on what should and should not be declared in debates or elsewhere under the code of conduct. Any Member is, of course, at liberty to consult the Registrar of Members’ Financial Interests if they have any questions about that, but the points raised are not a matter for the Chair on this occasion.

[Michael Fabricant]

And now will my right hon. Friend the Minister give way?

[Chris Philp]

Yes, of course.

[Michael Fabricant]

On the number of cut-and-paste responses, it might be helpful to point out that, of the responses from the few people who actually took part in the consultation, over 900 were duplicates, and all of them said they did not want Andy Street. It was interesting that there seemed to be an assumption—I cannot think why—that Andy Street would be the Mayor after the election.

[Chris Philp]

Indeed. The copy-and-paste responses were on the negative side. Of course, if one discounted those, the balance of replies would have been different, wouldn’t it? It is important to stress that we do not know who the Mayor will be after the election. The election will take place, and the people of the west midlands will decide who will be the Mayor, exercising mayoral functions and, if the order is successful, PCC functions as well.

That is important, because the West Midlands police force is one of only a small handful of police forces across England and Wales in so-called special measures—it is called “formally engage”, but in substance it is special measures. I would also add that West Midlands police force is, I think, the second worst-performing police force in the country when it comes to detecting and clearing up crime. It strikes me that there is a great opportunity to improve the performance of West Midlands police force under new management, whoever the Mayor may be following the election on 2 May.

Let me make some more progress.

--- Later in debate ---

[Valerie Vaz]

The Minister really is, but this is important, and it is our job to question him—I thought that was what we were here for. The consultation took place over Christmas. Those are never good consultations, because people have other things to do. The Minister says there were just 7,000 responses, but I think that is quite a lot. Could he clarify what he means by “cut and paste”? If the question is, “Do you want this to happen?”, the answer is going to be only either yes or no. By “cut and paste” does he mean just a yes or a no? Lastly, there was a referendum on this very proposition in 2021 and the people of the west midlands decided against it.

[Michael Fabricant]

rose—

[Chris Philp]

I give way to my hon. Friend.

[Michael Fabricant]

I understand that the last time the consultation was done, they were strongly supportive of the Mayor. They thought it was a waste of money, actually.

[Valerie Vaz]

Are you the Minister? Are you answering the questions?

[Michael Fabricant]

No, I am intervening. The right hon. Lady keeps intervening, so I am sure she is not saying that I should not intervene, with the Minister’s permission. Am I not correct that, in fact, people were overwhelmingly supportive? Labour Mayor Sadiq Khan, Labour Mayor Andy Burnham and Labour Mayor Tracy Brabin all have control over the police, too. It saves money. It is not meant to be a job-creation scheme.

[Chris Philp]

My hon. Friend is quite right. Let me turn to some of those questions. The consultation period ran from 20 December to 31 January. It will not escape eagle-eyed Committee members that that encompasses the entire month of January, which by no stretch of the imagination can be described as “over Christmas”.

The right hon. Member for Walsall South referred to a referendum. I do not know if she was referring, perhaps, to the previous police and crime commissioner election—

--- Later in debate ---

[Jim McMahon]

There are two separate points there. The first is on whether there ought to be uniformity or it should be accepted that there are different powers in different places. The Labour Front-Bench position is that where boundaries are coterminous in a place with a police and crime commissioner and a directly elected Mayor of a combined authority, both powers should be brought together with local support and consent. Where they are not coterminous, it would not be right for a Mayor in one area to take on political powers that transcend the boundaries of the combined authority in that respect. That is certainly the issue in Merseyside.

The other, separate issue, which I touched on, is a fair one: given the judicial review, should the Government press ahead or not? Certainly, the advice that we have taken is that they are two linked but separate processes. Parliament and the Government will carry on with their process, and the courts will make a judgment on the JR and its merits. It will or will not have an implication, but that is no reason not to progress at this point given the advice we have had.

I certainly take the power of the objection and the concern about the way in which things have been done, because it is a unique situation in which there are such legitimate concerns. There is a danger that the concerns raised are dismissed because the Government have the votes to get the change through regardless, which would be a mistake. If we do not bring people with us and convince them that it is the right thing for their area and can make a positive difference, and it is done despite, not with, the will of local people, that is not the road to empower people to make a change for their area.

[Michael Fabricant]

I am listening to the argument presented by the hon. Gentleman. He says there is a will against it locally and so on and so forth; how can he say that? We have the objection of some politicos who do not like the idea that perhaps they may lose their job. We have 7,000 people out of 3 million—I will repeat that: 7,000 people out of 3 million—who responded. That is hardly a majority at all saying that they do not agree with it. The majority of people just want us to get on with the job.

Coronation: Policing of Protests

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Tuesday 9th May 2023 Commons Chamber

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

The Minister rightly said that hundreds of people protested against the once-in-a-generation coronation. Hundreds of thousands of people were present to celebrate the coronation, and millions in the United Kingdom and around the world were watching. I am getting pretty fed up with the police apologising all the time. Ordinary police officers who do a decent job, as they did on Saturday, find their morale at rock bottom when, after being instructed by the Metropolitan police on 3 May that

“We will deal robustly with anyone intent on undermining this celebration”,

someone apologises because they did just that.

[Chris Philp]

I recommend that Members on both sides of the House read the Metropolitan Police Commissioner’s article in today’s Evening Standard robustly setting out the background and defending the police’s approach to the coronation. My hon. Friend refers to the expression of regret that those six people were unable to join the hundreds of others who protested peacefully. Those hundreds of others were exercising their right to peaceful protest, as they are perfectly entitled to do. It is worth mentioning in passing, as he did, that they were in a tiny, tiny minority, but that does not undermine their right to protest if they so choose.

Chinese Police Stations in UK

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Wednesday 19th April 2023 Commons Chamber

[Chris Philp]

My hon. Friend makes an extremely important point. It is a long-standing principle in this country that we will ensure the freedoms and rights of all those who reside on our soil. We will protect them from threats to their freedom by whoever might perpetrate them, including, and perhaps even especially, foreign states. He makes an important point, and he is right to make it.

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

I thank the right hon. Member for Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford (Yvette Cooper) for tabling this urgent question, although I doubt whether the Chinese community will be thanking her after she made her cheap political point, which rather spoiled the questions she was asking. My right hon. Friend the Minister will be aware that, with regard to foreign actors, it is not just China that is active in this country, but Iran. What does he think he can do to protect journalists who correctly seek to criticise not only the regime in China, but what is happening in Tehran and the rest of Iran?

[Chris Philp]

First, I associate myself with the comment my hon. Friend made at the beginning of his question. In relation to press freedom, it is a long-standing, centuries-old principle in this country that the press is free and should be free from interference, including by foreign states, and that includes Iran. I suspect we are working closely with the Iranian media outlet that was shockingly, shamefully and disgracefully targeted by the Iranian regime, to ensure that it can and will continue to operate from UK soil, as it is perfectly entitled to do.

Seasonal Worker Visas: Sponsorship Certificates

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Thursday 8th December 2022 Commons Chamber

[Robert Jenrick]

There is no significant evidence to suggest that the UK labour market varies so greatly between the nations that we need to take different approaches in England, Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland. It is better that we remain within the United Kingdom and that we have one single immigration policy covering the whole Union.

On the hon. Lady’s central suggestion that leaving the European Union has led to a diminution of workers available within the economy, that simply is not true. We have just seen figures published showing that net migration was over 500,000 last year and that 1 million people entered the UK last year. They are very substantial numbers. The Home Office issued 350,000 work visas last year. We are ultimately a small country with finite resources, limited housing and pressure on public services. It is right that the Government take their responsibilities seriously, take decisions in the round and try, over time, to bring down net migration.

The seasonal agricultural worker scheme exists to fill in some gaps. The choice of 40,000 does appear to have been broadly borne out by the evidence that we are close to the end of the year and there are still 1,400 places outstanding, so the decision made by my predecessors has been broadly correct. We are in the process of analysing whether we need to continue or expand it next year, and I will make a statement on that very soon.

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

Horticultural operations around Lichfield will, I think, be very reassured by what my right hon. Friend has said today. When I voted for Brexit, I voted for sovereignty. I certainly did not vote to say that we should not have immigration—with a name like Fabricant, which originates in France, I would certainly not be against that. It is illegal immigration that we all object to. Is the Home Office investigating other processes to get seasonal workers in the UK, for example the system that the SNP representative, the hon. Member for Edinburgh North and Leith (Deidre Brock), spoke about for a two-year validity?

[Robert Jenrick]

I am sympathetic to the proposal that we create a scheme that is of multi-year duration, enabling employers to plan over the longer term. We have just been through one or two of the most exceptional years in which access to labour was heavily reduced as a result of covid and travel restrictions, but now would seem to be a sensible time to explore whether we can create a longer-term scheme that gives industry the certainty it requires. We also need to be working closely with the agricultural sector itself, to ensure that it is embracing automation and new technologies, and training the next generation of British workers to enter the sector and enjoy successful careers. As I said in answer to an earlier question, we have 5 million economically inactive people in this country and we need to draw on our domestic labour force as much as possible.

Oral Answers to Questions

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Monday 14th November 2022 Commons Chamber

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

12. What recent discussions she has had with her French counterpart on illegal cross-channel movements.

[The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Suella Braverman)]

The Prime Minister and I are committed to reducing dangerous illegal migration into the UK, which is why I was in Paris today with my French counterpart, Gérald Darmanin, to agree a new joint strategy and operational plan, which will drive forward our next phase of co-operation and make this route unviable eventually.

[Michael Fabricant]

I congratulate my right hon. Friend on her agreement in Paris today but, as she herself has said, there is no silver bullet. Given that there are so many hundreds of miles of French coastline to be policed, will this agreement be a game changer?

[Suella Braverman]

As my hon. Friend says, on its own, this agreement will not fix the problem—it is important that everyone is clear about that. However, I am very proud of the co-operation that the UK and France have led in recent years. This deal represents a step change and a big step forward in our joint challenge. For the first time under this new integrated approach, UK officers will join law enforcement colleagues in France as embedded observers to share real-time information relating to small boats. The deal will include significant investment in intelligence capability and information sharing that all agencies will use, including the National Crime Agency and Europol. I believe that this is a big step forward and I encourage everyone here to get behind it.

Homes for Ukraine: Visa Application Centres

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Thursday 28th April 2022 Commons Chamber

[Kevin Foster]

The simple answer is no. They will usually be done in date order, unless there are particular compelling and compassionate circumstances. Given the nature of the situation that people have left in Ukraine and eastern Poland, in many ways virtually all applications have compelling and compassionate circumstances. We do not order applications based on how close a relative they are. As the hon. Gentleman will know, the list of relatives we will accept is quite extensive. In addition, if someone was for example a godparent, that would not qualify under the family scheme, but we would look to see whether it could be transferred into the Homes for Ukraine scheme and whether the person concerned could act as a sponsor for the individual instead.

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

After what happened in Salisbury, I urge my hon. Friend not to take the rather reckless advice of the SNP. Due to the fog of war, there undoubtedly—[Interruption.] The hon. Member for Cumbernauld, Kilsyth and Kirkintilloch East (Stuart C. McDonald) is trying to intervene on me, but he is reckless in his suggestion, and after Salisbury—[Interruption.].

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Just a moment. Let us hear—[Interruption.] Order. Mr McDonald, you will be wanting to catch my eye in a second, and the best thing to do is to hold your breath until then.

--- Later in debate ---

[Michael Fabricant]

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Undoubtedly, due to the fog of war, there were long delays, and still are in some instances. However, I ask my hon. Friend the Minister to thank the people in the Home Office who have been working very hard of late. The Lichfield constituents are very generous and want to house Ukrainians. I and my staff have been dealing with numerous cases, most of which are now resolved. I thank the people of Lichfield and I thank particularly Home Office officials, who have been working almost a 24-hour day to resolve this.

[Kevin Foster]

I thank my hon. Friend for his comments; I know the team who have been working on these schemes will very much appreciate what he has just said. As we have touched on several times, nearly 90,000 visas have now been issued and we are seeing significant numbers of people arriving in the UK. That is a tribute not only to the generosity of spirit of people such as those in Lichfield who are looking to host families and provide what support they can, but to those teams that have worked to stand up the scheme. It is worth noting that the British national overseas passports scheme was over about one year and dealt with 100,000 people. This has been 90,000 within a matter of weeks.

Draft Data Protection Act 2018 (Amendment of Schedule 2 Exemptions) Regulations 2022

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Tuesday 18th January 2022 General Committees

[Kevin Foster]

I appreciate the points raised by hon. Members. As has been said, we have not appealed the Court of Appeal’s judgment. In response to the SNP spokesperson, we felt it better to engage with the issues and seek to resolve some of the concerns. I understand the point about why not address all of the concerns in primary legislation but we felt that given concerns to do with data-processing, primary legislation raises certain issues, whereas published guidance is available, and in fact we have already published in draft and we have received comments. We expect that to be an evolving document. Of course, there would be an issue had we decided to issue private guidance, and questions would be asked about whether we were trying to avoid scrutiny.

We expect the published guidance to balance the need to give individuals access to information where appropriate and, for the sake of argument, not requiring the need to inform someone that we are taking immigration enforcement action or the details on what intelligence we may or may not have on activities, particularly on those who may be involved in potential criminal activity. Although we recognise that there is a crime exemption, we believe that there are circumstances where we need a specific immigration exemption as well, rather than try to extend the criminal exemption to cover immigration. Hence the action we have taken.

We believe that the regulations meet the objectives that were set out in the judgment. We appreciate that there will always be those who take a different view, and there will always be opportunity for oversight from the ICO and judicial oversight. We cannot change the regulations at will if that then undermined the purpose of the core legislation. We believe the regulations represent a positive step forward that will resolve the core concerns. In particular, it is made very clear that their use is restricted to the Secretary of State, given that the purpose is to maintain effective immigration control, not to give an excuse to third parties to try to withhold data that should be released. That core point has been raised by many, but we should be clear that the exercise of the power lies with the Home Secretary in terms of defence of the immigration system, and not with a landlord or agent who may seek to argue the exemption when required to declare information.

We believe that the regulations are the appropriate step forward. We recognise that we are responding to a court judgment, but we did not seek to appeal the matter to the Supreme Court because we thought that the points made in the judgment were reasonable and ones that we could accept. I repeat that the document will be an evolving one.

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

Will my hon. Friend give way?

[Kevin Foster]

Briefly.

[Michael Fabricant]

A very brief one, indeed. Is my hon. Friend confident then that there will not be another appeal? My hon. Friend would then be back here again coming up with another amendment. Does the SI actually meet the requirements of the court and the judgment?

[Kevin Foster]

We believe that it does. I can never guarantee that someone will not take legal action against the Home Office. The campaigners won and it would have been the Home Office that would look to appeal to the Supreme Court. As the hon. Member for Paisley and Renfrewshire South noted, we decided not to appeal but to engage with the judgment and introduce additional safeguards instead. The principle of having this type of legislative exemption was deemed to be perfectly rational, but it was felt that there was a need to be clearer and to have certain published safeguards on its use.

Given some of the data-sharing arrangements with the European Union on adequacy arrangements and the carve up it applied, we have engaged with the European Commission, and we are confident about our policy. Can I guarantee that no one will launch a legal challenge against the Home Office in future? No. We live in a country where people are able to do that. I have set out the purpose of the regulations, however, and the need for them. As I said, this is not about taking away anyone’s rights or weakening any protections on data access, rather the regulations are designed to strengthen those protections and to produce a living document that can respond to emerging issues and trends, and can be amended where appropriate.

Question put and agreed to.

Oral Answers to Questions

Michael Fabricant Excerpts

Monday 17th January 2022 Commons Chamber

[Rachel Maclean]

All of us speak to and work with victims of horrendous crimes. Ministers are constantly engaged in that kind of work. That is why we are putting more funding into the police to enable them to tackle these hideous crimes. The hon. Lady has referred to a number of specific cases. She has not been clear which police areas or local authorities are involved, but we are very happy to work with her on these specific cases. To be clear, let me say that funding for these important specialisms has been increased, and we are increasing funding to the police to the tune of £15.9 billion.

[Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con)]

The two points made by Labour Members were very powerful and have had a huge impact on the House, and I thank them for making them.

I simply rise to say that there also needs to be a very careful balance, because, from time to time, people are accused of rape when they are innocent. I do not want to see the pendulum swing from one extreme to another and injustice being done in another way.

[Rachel Maclean]

I thank my hon. Friend for raising such an important issue. These and many other issues are captured in the rape review. Every Member of this House will be concerned about the level of rape prosecutions, which is why the Government are working across Departments to improve the system overall, and it is absolutely right that we do so.