Historic Churches: Covid-19

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Thursday 16th July 2020 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

First, let me say what a pleasure it is to have you in the Chair, Madam Deputy Speaker, on a subject matter that I know you have great interest in. I am very pleased to have an Adjournment debate; I usually intervene in Adjournment debates, but on this occasion I actually have one. I want to put on record my thanks to Mr Speaker for making it possible. I know that it is due to his forbearance and interest in this matter. When I spoke to him about it a week or 10 days ago he was obviously quite intrigued to see what was going on and wanted to ensure that this House had a chance to hear the story.

Obviously, we are very pleased to see the Minister in his place. He and I came into this House at the same time and are friends. We have done the armed forces parliamentary scheme together, and many other things. I am very pleased to see him in his place, and I look forward to his response.

I am very thankful to have the privilege and honour of being the MP for Strangford, which boasts much rich heritage and history, with Greyabbey being noted as the best example of Anglo-Norman Cistercian architecture in Ulster. It was founded in 1193 by Affreca, wife of John de Courcy, the Anglo-Norman invader of East Ulster. Poor and decayed in the late middle ages, the abbey was dissolved in 1541, but in the early 17th century it was granted to Sir Hugh Montgomery and the nave was refurbished for parish worship until the late 18th century.

At the south-east edge of Newtownards, the substantial remains of a Dominican friary founded in 1244 may be viewed. They are the only ones of their type in Northern Ireland. Built by the Savage family, the buildings were destroyed by Sir Brian O’Neill to prevent English soldiers from using them. Sir Hugh Montgomery restored the church in 1607 and added a small chapel, but it fell into disrepair in the middle of the 18th century. We also are blessed to host the St Patrick’s trail in memory of the legacy of St Patrick, the British missionary to Ireland, and many of the abbeys that were erected as his legacy exist only as ruins and relics.

Members may wonder why I am bringing up the history of those churches, but the reason is clear. Although they were designed as houses of worship, they are now wonderfully rich pieces of history, having lost their true purpose, and it would make my heart ache to see world-renowned St Margaret’s, the parish church of Westminster, become another wonderfully rich old building that is not fulfilling its true design as a house of prayer and worship. It is also our church, as was discussed the other night. It is very clear that it is the church for MPs and Peers as well.

I was absolutely gutted to receive notification last week that services were to be halted at St Margaret’s, and as time has passed I see that I am not the only one to feel that way. I thank every person who has signed the online petition, with more than 1,300 people asking for us to be able to make a way forward to enable that church to be a tourist attraction, because if we look at the background, it clearly is a part of the ceremony of this place—the House of the Commons and the House of Lords—and we want it to do what it was built for: to be a place for seekers of Christ to meet and worship Him. That is what the congregation are asking for, and that is what I am asking in this place. I am looking longingly and beseechingly to the Minister for that purpose: to facilitate as best we can the costs of churches, which are tourism attractions and places of worship, to ensure that they can remain open.

I think of St Mark’s church in Newtownards, my main town. That beautiful historic building is a real central hub in the town, with children’s work, work for disabled people, the women’s institute, the men’s group and a thriving community hub, whose primary aim remains to glorify God. That is what we need to see in churches throughout this land, and the fact that something completely out of our control—covid-19—has put some of those things in jeopardy means that we need to step up and step in, as we have done for almost all facets of life affected by the coronavirus pandemic.

I want to put on record my eternal thanks to the Government for all they have done.

I am very pleased to see the hon. Member for Ipswich (Tom Hunt) in his place, and I know that he wants a couple of minutes to make a contribution, if the Minister is happy with that. I am very happy to let that happen. The hon. Gentleman wants to raise some pressing matters, similar to what I am asking for, but for his own constituency.

Church tourism is a massive income generator throughout the UK. Four world heritage sites in the UK specifically include church buildings—Durham Cathedral, Westminster Abbey, Canterbury Cathedral and Fountains Abbey. Of the 16,000 Church of England church buildings, 4,200 are listed grade I, representing 45% of all secular or religious buildings listed at that grade, and a further 8,000 are listed grade II. There are 340 listed buildings of national importance in the care of the Churches Conservation Trust and other listed faith buildings include 622 Roman Catholic churches, 537 Methodist churches, 306 Baptist churches, 69 Congregational churches, 28 synagogues and one mosque. So that is the magnitude of what we are asking for. A further 146 ecclesiastical sites are in the care of English Heritage or the National Trust.

Statistics for English tourism revealed that 55% of all day trips include at least one visit to a cathedral or a church—the third most visited of all types of attraction. Church tourism is phenomenal, and one of the largest attractions is our own Westminster Abbey, which incorporates St Margaret’s, just outside the House of Commons. It has an enormous number of visitors each year and creates a revenue that sustains Westminster Abbey and St Margaret’s. What we need is some help and assistance. The amount of revenue created through the visitors to Westminster Abbey and Saint Margaret’s is a loss somewhere in the region of £9 million to £12 million. It is enormous, and I spoke to the Secretary of State about it. I always feel a bit guilty when I see Ministers at tea time or at meals and say, “I’m sorry to bother you, but can I ask you…” I nab those opportunities and then think, “Oh, I hope he didn’t mind me doing that.” But he did not, and I am very pleased to see the Minister in his place.

A scoping study by the North West Multi-Faith Tourism Association estimated 17 million visits to 45 cathedrals and 52 places of worship. That is an incredible figure, suggesting that each parish church typically receives around 700 to 4,000 visitors each year. That tourism absolutely provides revenue to keep those wonderful churches open and working, although they may need regular work carried out and may have smaller congregations. We understand that the size of congregations in churches across the whole of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is decreasing, and not just because of covid-19. But the virus has exacerbated that and taken away that revenue stream. I read in the paper one day that one Church of England church had 150 people in the congregation, but when it went virtual there were 25,000 people. So there are other ways of doing church, but speaking personally, I love going to church. I have done so probably nearly all my life. I went because my dad made me go when I was a wee boy, but I now go because I want to go. I believe it is important to have the communion and the chance to pray and worship, and to do that in fellowship with other people. I am very much a people person and always have been. I find Zoom incredibly hard to get used to and I find the virtual Parliament extremely difficult, but I love coming here and intermingling with people. That is important to me.

The issue was highlighted to me by members of St Margaret’s parish church who are desperate to find a way to retain their parish church. I believe there is a way to retain weekly worship, and I believe the House and the Minister can facilitate that. There has been a church on the site of St Margaret’s next to Westminster Abbey since the 12th century. In 1614, it became the parish church of the Palace of Westminster. It has a regular congregation of between 70 and 120 people and more than 250 on the community roll. When I first came here in 2010, I was made aware that there was holy communion once a month at St Margaret’s. That was my first attendance at a Church of England church on the mainland. I look forward so much to that Wednesday service. We were fortunate to have an opportunity for that just yesterday, not at St Margaret’s, but here in the House. I know that many MPs and peers look forward to the encouragement that we get on a Wednesday morning through a service, holy communion and then breakfast at Mr Speaker’s house. That cannot happen at the moment because Mr Speaker’s premises are being renovated, but we usually go there for breakfast and it is always part of the occasion—part of the fellowship and part of who we are.

Services at the church are spiritually uplifting and beautifully led by the priest vicars, and the choral music is absolutely exceptional. I have loved the choral services that St Margaret’s holds for the Palace of Westminster. We are blessed in the House to have some wonderful singers. Some right hon. and hon. Members have the most wonderful voices. I am sorry—I know their names, but I cannot remember their constituencies, so I will not name them because it is not appropriate. I have witnessed some of their contributions in St Margaret’s and they are truly uplifting.

The congregation of St Margaret’s is made up of an unusual mixture of local residents, employees at the Palace of Westminster, staff at Westminster School, Members of Parliament, parents of boy choristers, enthusiasts for top class choral music and many other congregants, some of whom come halfway across London on a Sunday. Not a week passes without a visit from a former chorister, or someone who was married at St Margaret’s, or someone who remembers it from their time working in London. I am sure that you personally, Madam Deputy Speaker, and hon. Members present can understand that because we meet people who have worshipped at St Margaret’s and they always say that it was a wonderful occasion. Tourists are not usually part of the congregation. Although they are welcome, they prefer to go to the Abbey. Sometimes the queues to get into the Abbey do not lend themselves to visitors being able to worship there.

There is an acknowledgement that worship will change—as has every church throughout the land. I understand that, but I honestly feel that aid from a specific churches fund will enable the Church to deal with the deficit caused by coronavirus. Indeed, perhaps new forms of income could be considered for during the week, such as conferences or exhibitions as long as Sunday worship is preserved. Sunday worship is critical for churches to survive. Could financial assistance be available through the £1.4 billion that the Government announced for culture, arts and heritage the week before last? Perhaps there is a way of doing that through the choral groups or the choristers. It is important to maintain St Margaret’s if we can.

I believe that, as a body that uses St Margaret’s when the need arises, we should play our part in this House not simply to secure that place. There are other historic churches that can normally stay open due to tourism income, but are struggling and I believe that we have a duty to protect them. It is not only about St Margaret’s and Westminster Abbey, which are important to us in this place; it is also about other churches. The hon. Member for Ipswich will refer to them during his contribution. It must be remembered that before this time, those churches were viable and the congregations were larger. They simply need support at this time, not in the long term. If we move towards pre-covid-19 normality—I do not know what normality is; I do not think any of us do, but we hope at some stage to get back to normal—we can resume services in churches and resume the tourism, and we will hear again the many different accents, languages and voices that we used to hear whenever we walked out of this place.

I look to the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport, which has striven to secure our arts venues. I look forward to the Minister’s response. I ask that historic churches, and on this occasion our very own St Margaret’s, receives the help that is needed to see her through this troublesome time.

In this time of fear and despair, the mental health impact of lockdown and bereavement is very real. It is very real to me personally, and I believe it is probably very real to every one of us who represents our areas, knows our people and knows the losses that there have been. I have had two good friends who have died through coronavirus. I was unable to attend both of their funerals and pay my respects personally to the families because of adhering to the rule on 10 people at a funeral. We hope to celebrate their lives at some later stage, and I believe we will, whenever we get back to normality—but that is not just yet. So this bereavement is very real to us all.

It is clear that churches, which have a vital role in our relationship with the Lord Jesus and our God, also have a role to play as essential community hubs. People want to seek God and his guidance and comfort, and to attend church at Sunday services with the prayer and worship that are a key component of this need. We must, I believe, facilitate that, and not see more churches falling or failing due to something out of their control—covid-19. I look to the Minister for the help that we need in seeing what can be done and what will be done to secure churches not simply as historic buildings but places of vibrant and spiritually fulfilling worship. Thank you so much, Madam Deputy Speaker, for giving me the chance, through this debate, to ask that in this House.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (Nigel Huddleston)]

First, I offer my sincere thanks to the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon), who is a very good friend, for introducing this debate on this important issue. As always, he spoke with great eloquence and knowledge about the matter. His passion for the Church and churches came through clearly, and we all know that that passion is shared by many of our constituents right across the country.

I also thank my hon. Friend the Member for Ipswich (Tom Hunt) for his comments, in particular about the important community asset that is St-Mary-at-the-Quay church. My understanding is that the Churches Conservation Trust is working to ensure that the space is able to reopen and serve his community again.

As the Minister for sport, heritage and tourism, I am always heartened to see our historic churches and places of worship of all faiths evoke passion and commitment. Our historic churches have served as focal points for their local communities for tens, hundreds and even thousands of years. Across the country, historic parish churches are the lifeblood of the communities they serve. The hon. Member for Strangford raised many important points, and I hope to give him some of the assurances he was seeking.

Supporting historic churches protects our cultural heritage and our community cohesion. Although heritage is a devolved responsibility, I am pleased to say that the Government support the maintenance of historic churches throughout the UK through the listed places of worship grant scheme. The vast majority of historic working churches are listed buildings, as the hon. Gentleman said, and are therefore eligible for support under the scheme, which was established in 2001 to provide grants towards VAT paid on repairs and maintenance.

Since its inception, the scheme has made grants totalling more than £285 million and has played a significant part in ensuring that listed places of worship are in their best overall condition for many years. The scheme presently handles around 7,000 claims a year, is open to all faiths and denominations and is delivered UK-wide. In 2012, my Department and the Treasury became joint funders of the scheme, with the annual funding increased to £42 million. The level of funding is guaranteed up to 31 March 2021, and any extension to the scheme is on hold until the completion of the spending review.

Further, since 1994, the Heritage Lottery Fund has awarded more than £985 million to more than 6,400 projects supporting the UK’s places of worship. In response to the extraordinary times we are now all facing, the fund has refocused its efforts, temporarily halting new awards through its core programmes to provide a package of emergency support to help the country’s heritage sector navigate the covid-19 crisis.

Covid-19 has had a profound impact on many of the individuals who regularly attend our places of worship and are responsible for their everyday care. It has affected the income of places of worship, including income derived from regular giving, tourism, venue hire, fundraising and many other measures, as the hon. Member for Strangford mentioned. It has also affected the schedule of repair and maintenance for many places of worship, and over the past few months, I have had weekly calls with representatives from the heritage sector about the impacts of covid-19, including representatives from the Church of England. Those calls have been incredibly useful and provided valuable insight into the challenges that grassroots organisations and churches have been facing and the support they require.

The Government are committed to supporting all heritage organisations, including historic places of worship, through the coronavirus outbreak, and I would like to explain a couple of the measures we have taken. To help our historic places of worship get back on their feet, it is important that we help them reopen as soon as possible and as safely as possible. The heritage working group that I chair, together with the places of worship working group, chaired by my right hon. Friend the Member for Newark (Robert Jenrick), have provided input into the guidance we published last month on the safe use of places of worship during the pandemic. That offers a blueprint for safe, socially distanced worship from 4 July onwards. It offers in-depth guidance for places of worship, with specific advice for those based in historic buildings. Hon. Members will be aware that places of worship are still operating under a number of restrictions in terms of the types of activity that can be carried out. The Government are keeping their advice under close review and will continue to work with places of worship on the issue.

I will also set out some of the financial support package that we have recently launched. In response to feedback received from organisations across all sectors, the Government have announced an unprecedented stream of support schemes. The highly visible job retention scheme is one part of that, but, with regard to support specifically targeted at the heritage sector, Historic England and the National Lottery Heritage Fund are also administering grant funding worth more than £55 million.

That funding comprises the Heritage Fund’s £50 million heritage emergency fund, which was launched on 1 April and is already helping places of worship right across the UK to respond to the crisis by supporting them while closed and preparing them to reopen, and Historic England’s covid-19 emergency response fund, which was launched on 17 April and extends a safety net worth £2 million to small heritage organisations. The grants will help organisations, voluntary groups and self-employed contractors to survive the immediate challenges posed by coronavirus.

Historic England launched a second emergency fund on 9 June to help to fund urgent maintenance repairs and investigations for heritage at risk. The £3 million fund will award grants of up to £25,000. Of course, listed places of worship are not precluded from the support package for the cultural sector recently announced by the Chancellor, the £1.57 billion fund that the hon. Member for Strangford mentioned. The new funding will mean an extra £188 million for the devolved Administrations, including £33 million for Northern Ireland and £96 million for Scotland, while Wales will receive £59 million.

That funding will support our vibrant culture and heritage sectors, supporting hundreds of projects. It will also protect hundreds of jobs in our heritage construction industry through a £120 million capital investment programme supporting highly specialised skills and businesses such as architects and woodwork restorers.

[Jim Shannon]

I did ask whether there would be any help for the choirs and the choristers, because I understand, and the Minister understands, the importance of encouraging and retaining the choirs. We cannot lose that talent either.

[Nigel Huddleston]

It is not a debate without an intervention, as well as a main participation, from the hon. Gentleman. The eligibility criteria for that grant are still to be detailed, but they will be released very soon, certainly by the end of July. Hopefully that will give him further guidance.

Finally, on covid funding, the charity support fund is a £200 million fund to support registered or excepted charities, including eligible historic places of worship, to provide essential services for vulnerable people affected by the current crisis. We recognise that, notwithstanding these generous support schemes, there will still be challenges for our historic places of worship. They will face these challenges over the coming months as we resume normal activities following the pandemic, and we are committed to keeping the dialogue going and seeking to support this sector in whatever way we can.

My thanks again to the hon. Members who have contributed to today’s debate. I know how important our historic churches are and want to see them and the country recover and thrive. Our historic churches are vital assets, treasured for their heritage, community and social value, and they must be protected for generations to come and this Government will continue to vigorously support them.

Arts, Culture and Heritage: Support Package

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 7th July 2020 Commons Chamber

[Caroline Dinenage]

I set out earlier the road map that we are looking at. 

We hope to be able to have socially distanced outdoor performances very shortly, and soon after that, during the summer, we hope to be able to confirm when we can have socially distanced indoor performances. We are working at pace, alongside Public Health England, and doing pilots and other scientific studies to see how soon we can fully get all our theatres and public-heritage and cultural spaces up and running and back to full steam. We want desperately to do that, but we have to keep people safe.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I welcome the package, and my party welcomes it as well. What support is there to help churches such as St Margaret’s here in Westminster? Will the Minister consider a stand-alone scheme? As well as providing prayer, worship and communion services, such churches are also tourist attractions because of their wonderful history and beautiful buildings, but find themselves in dire straits financially because of their inability to access any grants and because they have no tourists or visitors because the business aspects of their buildings are closed.

Covid-19: Support for UK Industries

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Thursday 25th June 2020 Commons Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (Nigel Huddleston)]

It is a pleasure to contribute on the Government’s behalf to this debate, which comes as countries across the world continue to battle one of the worst public health emergencies in our history. I thank Members on both sides of the House for their valuable contributions, both in this debate and in the months and weeks before, and their work to highlight issues that I know we all care very deeply about.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Will the Minister give way?

[Nigel Huddleston]

It would not be a debate without an intervention from the hon. Gentleman.

[Jim Shannon]

We discussed this this morning: can I request the Minister’s help for Bombardier in Belfast and Newtownards in my constituency, where 600 manufacturing jobs are under threat? Would he accept the letter from me with Bombardier’s 16-point plan and be so kind as to arrange a response?

[Nigel Huddleston]

I would be happy to take the letter and ensure that the hon. Gentleman gets an appropriate response from the correct Minister.

The importance of this debate is demonstrated by the fact that hundreds of thousands of people signed the petitions. Of course, we are in an unprecedented global crisis, and this Government have provided an unprecedented, wide-ranging level of financial support in response to protect jobs, businesses and incomes across the country. Under the coronavirus job retention scheme, we have supported over 10 million people and at least 1 million businesses. We have supported 2.6 million self-employed people and given out £26 billion in bounce back loans alone, not to mention the support in the form of grants for small businesses and for those in the retail, hospitality and leisure sectors. Given the direct and acute impacts of the covid-19 pandemic on those latter sectors, the Government have also provided a business rates holiday for businesses in retail, hospitality and leisure, so that all eligible businesses will pay no business rates for 12 months. This support is worth almost £10 billion to those businesses.

Several Members, including my right hon. Friend the Member for Chipping Barnet (Theresa Villiers), asked about nurseries. We absolutely recognise the important role that nurseries play in young children’s lives at the very start of their education. Recognising that, we made sure that nurseries were also on the list for the business rate holiday.

On the broader financial package, when it became clear that more help was needed, the Chancellor announced in May that the furlough scheme would continue until the end of October, and in its current form until the end of July, supporting furloughed workers as they gradually return to work.

The Government have provided a wide and unparalleled level of financial support during the pandemic to help workers in every sector and in every region of the UK, but we knew that as we entered lockdown, as part of our battle against this disease we would need a number of targeted interventions to protect jobs and businesses in some of our most beloved and hardest-hit sectors, including those identified in the petitions. We have had a good and thorough debate about those sectors today. Working groups have been set up by various Departments to work on the path to recovery and to identify what further support may be required, and discussions with the Treasury are taking place.

BBC Regional Politics Coverage

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Monday 22nd June 2020 Commons Chamber

[Neil Parish (Tiverton and Honiton) (Con)]

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker, for granting this debate tonight. I think we have five hours for the debate, so I feel a speech coming on, but I promise you I will try not to go on for more than 4 and a half hours. I called for the debate because BBC regional programmes could well be under threat. MPs across the House will be alarmed at the direction of travel.

During covid-19, valued programmes such as “Inside Out” and the regional “Sunday Politics” shows have had to be taken off air, with no return date as such at the moment, although I just learnt today that ITV’s programmes are returning by September. BBC executives have said that the cuts are to do with safety, but a review of English programming is taking place, which is looking to save costs. Many regional journalists fear that they will be cut and never return to work on those vital programmes. If that were the case, that would be a great loss to all of us and our constituents.

The “Sunday Politics” show covers 11 regions of England, from the south-west to the north-east and Cumbria. Those shows are a crucial part of our local and national democracy, holding us all to account throughout the year. All our regions have their identities. This is essential. With the Government looking towards more regional representation, such a step by the BBC would be a retrograde one.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Member on bringing the debate to the Chamber. The number of right hon. and hon. Members present illustrates how deeply interested we are in it. Does he not agree that the boost that regional TV provides to communities, and the information it contains, is essential to addressing regional issues? While the BBC must cut its cloth to suit, perhaps it should look at renegotiating contracts with some of its higher paid broadcasting staff as well as its directors, which would easily pay for regional programming.

[Neil Parish]

My hon. Friend the Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon)—I got the constituency right—makes a really good point. Northern Ireland, Wales and Scotland have quite a lot of regional coverage, and rightly so. They could do with more, but so could the rest of the regions.

The merging of those 11 shows into one “Politics England” programme deprives local communities of properly funded regional and relevant politics.

--- Later in debate ---

[Neil Parish]

My hon. Friend is right. We from the provinces and the sticks—not all Members present are, but I am—want those different types of flavour, and London wants its flavour as well. That is the whole argument for regionally-based programmes. London is a very large region with a lot of people, so it is right that it has not just the national news but London-based news.

[Jim Shannon]

Does the hon. Gentleman recognise the importance of local, regional opportunities so that people can shine and then move on to bigger jobs elsewhere—for instance, in the London circle? Many people in my constituency and in Northern Ireland as a whole have had opportunities in the regional BBC and then progressed. Does he recognise that that progress is very important to bring us all together? This is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, all together.

[Neil Parish]

The hon. Gentleman makes an interesting point. Sometimes when we publish a Select Committee report, I do regional radio across the whole country, and I often have to ask which radio station someone is from because their accent is not from the region. It just shows that, through radio and television, people move around the whole country, and that is really good. My hon. Friend and neighbour, the Member for East Devon (Simon Jupp), is a case in point: not only did he do well in the BBC, but he is now here in Parliament. That is probably a retrograde step—I did not say that, did I?

Kidsgrove Sports Centre

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 9th June 2020 Commons Chamber

[Jonathan Gullis]

My hon. Friend will know from the many conversations we have had that I am certainly a non-state-interventionist Conservative, but there are times when the Government must intervene. Kidsgrove has a dry ski slope as well, and I completely understand how important it is to protect such sporting facilities, because once they are gone, they do not come back. I am sure the people of Bracknell will be absolutely delighted to hear that my hon. Friend will champion the ice rink and ski slope. Why should they not be enfranchised to have something that they can be proud of and access in their local area, especially as summer holidays are unlikely to be going ahead as normal? That could be the only source of relaxation for people in Bracknell.

To be frank with the Minister, my constituents are frustrated. Although I remain committed to being a critical friend of the Government, I understand why my constituents are frustrated. Kidsgrove has long been neglected. Around one in 10 children aged four to five in Staffordshire and Stoke-on-Trent are obese. If that is not shocking enough, the number doubles to one in five by the time they are 11. Around two in three adults in Staffordshire and Stoke-on-Trent have excess weight—I include myself in those figures—while one in four are obese, with rates higher than the national average. Obesity has been reported as an issue that the Prime Minister wishes to tackle head on since falling ill with the coronavirus. I know that it is also close to the heart of the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon).

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

[Jonathan Gullis]

I will indeed—what an honour!

[Jim Shannon]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for giving way. May I first commend him for his energy, interest and commitment and for very quickly learning the ropes for how to do things in this House? May I also say how nice it is to see eight new Members present, which augurs well for the future?

As the vice-chair of the all-party parliamentary group on obesity, I am really concerned about the restrictions on children exercising and getting to clubs. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that it is essential that funding is given to sports clubs that are community led and driven? For that very reason, I fully support him in his battle for his constituency, and indeed all other hon. Members who are battling as well.

[Jonathan Gullis]

I do not think any Member can have an Adjournment debate without the honour of being intervened on by the hon. Gentleman. I completely agree with him. He tirelessly champions his work on obesity. If we do not tackle this issue, there will be health implications and pressures on our NHS, as well as the mental health aspects. We also need to be aware of the bad education that leads on for generations. I completely agree with the hon. Gentleman that we need community-led, community-run sports clubs that are funded partly by central Government and partly from elsewhere to best serve our constituents.

To restore the heart of Kidsgrove, the project must secure funding for the sports centre to be renovated and modernised to meet the highest health and safety standards, as well as current and future leisure needs. The cost of renovation is significantly lower than that of a rebuild. I endorse unreservedly the expansion of sports provisions, but I cannot say that, when the Jubilee 2 centre was built at a high cost to taxpayers across the county, I did not understand the annoyance and frustration of the residents of Kidsgrove. It should now be Kidsgrove’s turn to see investment.

The cost of a fully functional renovation has been projected to be £5.5 million, and the council has already committed £3.1 million towards the project. However, we are all aware of the cost of covid-19 for local councils, and Newcastle-under-Lyme Borough Council is no different. Government funding of £1.3 million has been secured, and that has reduced the immediate pressure on council finances, but that sum is sufficient only to cover the council’s lost income and additional costs for the first three months of the year. The council will be required to draw down all of its revenue reserves, in addition to taking action to restrict all non-essential expenditure, at a time when our communities are looking to the council to lead our local recovery efforts.

Birmingham Commonwealth Games Bill [Lords]

Jim Shannon Excerpts

2nd reading & 2nd reading: House of Commons
Monday 9th March 2020 Commons Chamber

[Nigel Huddleston]

Absolutely—volunteering is at the heart of these games; it always has been and I am sure always will be. We saw that in the fantastic Glasgow Commonwealth games, and indeed in the Olympic games. We are expecting around 10,000 volunteers, perhaps substantially more, and excitement is already building, particularly among schoolchildren in the region, about the opportunities to participate. More news about those opportunities will be coming in due course.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

First, I congratulate the Minister on getting his position; I look forward to his contributions on many occasions, all positive, in this House.

Does the Minister agree that the exclusion of shooting sports from Birmingham 2022 will have a negative impact? The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland has always excelled at shooting, and Commonwealth countries have followed the United Kingdom’s lead in that. Does the Minister share my disappointment that those in that most law-abiding and responsible section of the community have been excluded? Can the Minister confirm that his job in the future, if he still has this position—I hope he does—will be to ensure that shooting sports are included in the next Commonwealth games?

[Nigel Huddleston]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for intervening. It would not be a debate without his intervention; I am just surprised that he was not first.

On the shooting championship, I think we have a reasonable compromise that everybody—or most people—are quite happy with. The Commonwealth games are happening in summer 2022, and the championships for shooting and archery will take place in the January. The events will be separate, but at the end of the games there will be a Commonwealth sport medal table. I think that is a reasonable conclusion to what has been quite a challenging situation; I do not know whether it will set a precedent for future games, but I think that in these particular circumstances we have come to a reasonable conclusion.

Huawei and 5G

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Wednesday 4th March 2020 Westminster Hall

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Thank you, Mr Paisley. It is a pleasure to speak in the debate. I thank the right hon. Member for Chingford and Woodford Green (Sir Iain Duncan Smith) for introducing it, for setting the scene so well, and for speaking for the majority of us in this House and in the Chamber today, and the majority of those outside as well.

I am no tech expert—far from it—yet I have had concerns from the outset about the safety of allowing Huawei into the 5G network. When I find myself at a loss regarding the nuances of an issue, I always turn to those who understand it much better. For that purpose, I have looked at the relations of other nations with Huawei, and the facts cannot be ignored. My concerns have led me to question the Minister, today and on previous occasions.

Security and democracy must have priority. Defence of the realm, as the right hon. Member referred to, for this great nation of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland must be protected. Our first duty must always be to our citizens and constituents. They have told me that they share the deep concerns that so far all Members bar one have expressed in the Chamber today.

My fears and concerns have not been assuaged since the question I asked the then Minister, the right hon. and learned Member for Kenilworth and Southam (Jeremy Wright), in April last year. I said:

“Huawei has been banned from the core of 5G, but it is to be allowed to operate at the edge. The edge includes masts and antennas, which are also very sensitive. Canada and New Zealand have expressed concern, and Australia and the United States of America have said there is no relevant distinction between the core and the edge of 5G networks. What discussions has the Minister had with those four countries, and has their determination had any influence on our decision?”—[Official Report, 25 April 2019; Vol. 658, c. 892.]

The then Minister’s response was that discussions with our Five Eyes partners were ongoing, yet we appear to have dismissed that, while still allowing that there is a safety implication of Chinese interference and reliance on that technology. Again, I find myself uneasy and desirous that, even at this stage, we rethink this massive step. That is the feeling of the majority in the Chamber.

China is guilty of some of the worst, barbarous, evil, surgical human rights abuses against its own citizens. The right hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland (Mr Carmichael) and others have referred to the Uyghur Muslims, but it is not just them; there are also the Christians, the Falun Gong, and many other people. China has tried to re-educate them through forced labour and surveillance of what they are doing, and has used Huawei 5G to do so. Huawei has also been deeply involved in organ harvesting—commercial harvesting of organs from people who just happen to have a different faith.

The Financial Post has given this summary:

“The United Kingdom has now broken ranks with many of its closest allies”—

allies in whom we have great trust—

“including fellow members of the Five Eyes intelligence-sharing club. The British government classified Chinese company as a ‘high-risk vendor’ and banned it from the core network that manages access and authentication, but nevertheless permitted it to compete for up to 35 percent market share in the country’s access network—that is, its antennae and similar equipment.”

I am only one of 650 Members of this House, and I absolutely believe in the tenets of democracy, but I will not stay silent. I do not believe that what the Government are doing is in the best security interests of this nation, and if steps can be taken to pare it back, those steps must be taken. We have been known as security giants, and I do not like the idea that we are now standing on the shoulders of Chinese giants. We have stood alone, and can do so again, but it is always best that we stand with our allies. The Chinese may hopefully be strong trading partners post Brexit, but by no stretch of the imagination can they ever be considered our allies; their human rights abuses cannot be ignored. This issue is concerning, and we must not leave it here.

[Ian Paisley (in the Chair)]

I call Tom Tugendhat.

Elgin Marbles

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Monday 2nd March 2020 Commons Chamber

[Margaret Ferrier (Rutherglen and Hamilton West) (SNP)]

Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to debate a subject that has long been of historical interest but has taken on new significance in the current political climate.

The Elgin, or Parthenon, marbles are one of the British Museum’s most notorious artefacts. In the early 1800s, Thomas Bruce, the seventh Earl of Elgin, gained access to the temple of the Parthenon and other buildings that comprise the Acropolis in Athens. With a team of assistants, Thomas Bruce removed many items of significant cultural interest, including 57 slabs from the frieze of the Parthenon. The excavation was completed in 1812, and the marbles were eventually sold to the British Government in 1816 and placed in the British Museum.

The legality of the excavations that Elgin performed remains fraught with controversy to this day. At the time of the excavations, Greece was ruled by the Ottoman empire, and the Parthenon itself was used as a military fort by the Ottomans. The vulnerable position that that imperial occupation placed on Greece, coupled with Elgin’s privileged position, made it easier for him take the action that he took in removing the figures, metopes and frieze panels from the Parthenon. Elgin claim to have obtained a firman, or written permit, from the sultan to access the Acropolis in carrying out the removal of sections of the Parthenon frieze, as well as other parts of the Acropolis. Some allege that Elgin bribed the Turkish authorities to obtain permission to enter the Acropolis, while others suggest that the exchange of gifts between Elgin and the sultan was customary at the time, given Elgin’s position as British ambassador to Constantinople.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I thank the hon. Lady for giving way; I asked before the debate for her permission to intervene. Does she not agree that the significance of having the Elgin marbles in situ in the British Museum is that that gives a taste of, and indeed encourages people to make the journey to, historically and culturally rich Greece, particularly Athens, to see more, and that this must be part of any discussions regarding any return of the Elgin marbles to the people there?

[Margaret Ferrier]

I agree that many visitors will have enjoyed a visit to the British Museum and marvelled at these fantastic sculptures, but the hon. Gentleman will not be surprised to discover that I believe they should actually be repatriated to Athens where they could be appreciated in full in their original context. However, I thank him for his intervention.

The only record of the firman that we have is an Italian translation of the document, and the veracity of the document remains heavily disputed. Although a Select Committee of the House of Commons eventually voted to purchase the marbles from Elgin in 1816, the stand-out feature of the Committee’s questioning of Elgin was the vagueness of his responses regarding the permission given to take the Parthenon sculptures. According to Geoffrey Robertson QC’s excellent book, “Who Owns History?”, Elgin was unable to produce the firman during the Committee’s consideration of the purchase of the marbles and, astonishingly, told the Committee that he never kept his own personal copy of the permissions he was given.

Those admissions by Elgin himself led many people to denounce his actions in taking the marbles, even among those who supported their purchase by the British Government. Lord Byron was one of the most vociferous critics of Elgin, denouncing his actions in the strongest terms:

“Dull is the eye that will not weep to see

Thy walls defaced, thy mouldering shrines removed

By British hands, which it had best behoved

To guard those relics ne’er to be restored”.

Elgin’s actions were not the only source of controversy at the time of the sale of the marbles to the British Government. The public’s reaction to Elgin receiving £35,000 from the Government—around £3.5 million in today’s money—was understandably angry. In the same year that the British Government purchased the marbles, a cartoon by George Cruikshank depicted a satirical figure of John Bull purchasing the marbles while his children cried out for bread. That is not the first time that the House of Commons has made decisions that benefit the privileged few at the expense of the many.

Whether or not the firman is authentic and the means used to obtain it were dubious or illegal, the legal position on the marbles has, to date, favoured their retention in the UK. The British Museum Act 1963 is the primary piece of legislation here, and it makes it clear that the objects and collections of the British Museum are held by its trustees. Disposal or selling of objects in the British Museum collection is forbidden except in limited circumstances, which include printed materials where duplicates exist or objects that were illegally looted by the Nazis.

The general principle of that legislation and subsequent amendments to it is designed to protect cultural assets and provide the proper independence between Government and museum trustees. Because the legislation is drawn up in that manner, the Greek Government have been disinclined to put the legal position to the test in international courts. However, there is scope for the British Museum Act to be amended to cover the specific circumstances of the repatriation of the Parthenon marbles. I believe that potential amendments to legislation should form part of a process of mediation and dialogue between the Greek Government and the UK Government regarding the future of the Parthenon sculptures.

I turn to some of the other arguments that are often used to justify the Elgin marbles staying in Britain. Those who argue for retention of the marbles use cultural preservation as a key support. Their argument, encapsulated in the universal museum declaration, effectively places immediate cultural preservation above considerations of the circumstances in which treasures and other artefacts of major cultural significance were acquired. Some go as far as to suggest that Elgin’s actions were heroic and that the marbles would have been destroyed had he not acted in the way that he did by bringing them to Britain.

I have some sympathy with the idea that, had they not been acquired by museums outwith their countries of origin, many of the world’s cultural treasures would have been lost. Sadly, we have seen some despicable acts of cultural vandalism in recent years. In Syria, we have seen Daesh’s wanton destruction of parts of Palmyra, the great mosque of Aleppo and the old city of Damascus, which are just a few of the culturally significant sites that have suffered in that brutal conflict. But to compare what has happened in Syria with the proposed repatriation of the Elgin marbles would be to compare apples and oranges. The parts of the Parthenon frieze that have been retained in Greece have survived two world wars, a civil war, a military dictatorship and bankruptcy of the Greek state.

Regardless of views on whether the marbles should be returned to Greece or remain in Britain, it is reasonable to suggest that they would be preserved and secured for many years to come. Both Greece and the UK can offer outstanding museum facilities to showcase the marbles, and the new Acropolis Museum has already demonstrated how that would work in practice. The argument on cultural preservation comes down to one question: artistically, does it make sense for the Parthenon marbles to be reunited, placing them in one location where they could be appreciated and admired the world over? That is not only the right thing to do; it would enable the marbles to be appreciated in the original context in which they were sculpted.

Online Harms Legislation

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Thursday 13th February 2020 Commons Chamber

[Matt Warman]

My hon. Friend is right that we need to make sure that the companies themselves step up to the plate, which they have not yet done enough, but the fact that we are doing this through legislation is an important indicator that we do not think it is simply down to the companies; the Government have to act.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

rose—

[Thangam Debbonaire (Bristol West) (Lab)]

rose—

--- Later in debate ---

[Matt Warman]

Yes, the figure we have talked about in the consultation is that no more than 5% of UK businesses will be affected by this legislation. We are mindful of the challenges presented by technology, but this is a profoundly pro-tech Government. We see those opportunities, and we will make sure that businesses, small and large, can seize them in a way that is safe for all our citizens.

[Jim Shannon]

Will the Minister in particular underline the fact that there is a duty of care for digital users that extends not simply to monetary impropriety but to ensuring that digital forums are not seen as a mechanism for bullying under the freedom of expression banner. Will the duty of care be enshrined in law and enforced vigorously?

[Matt Warman]

Yes, is the short answer. The duty of care is a central part of this piece of legislation. It is the way in which we protect children and vulnerable people from exactly the kind of disgraceful behaviour that the hon. Member describes.

Media Diversity

Jim Shannon Excerpts

Tuesday 11th February 2020 Commons Chamber

[Marsha De Cordova (Battersea) (Lab)]

I am pleased to have secured this important debate. The media is a fundamental part of the way that we see and understand the world. According to Ofcom, 79% of adults get their news information from broadcasters and 40% from newspapers, but, while white adults are using TV, radio and newspapers, people from ethnic minority backgrounds and young people are turning away from them. Instead, they are using the internet, social media and alternative media sources. That is because traditional media sources are failing to represent the society on which they report. Today, I will talk about how there continues to be a systemic lack of race, class, disability, LGBT plus and gender diversity across the media, but particularly in broadcast and newspaper journalism.

Last week, the BBC misidentified me as my hon. Friend the Member for Brent Central (Dawn Butler), Britain’s first black female Minister, while I was making a speech in this House. The error was compounded by the report on the issue in the Evening Standard, which confused a picture of my hon. Friend the Member for Streatham (Bell Ribeiro-Addy) with me. The Evening Standard had used photos from Getty Images which had wrongly captioned me as my hon. Friend the Member for Streatham—you quite literally could not make this up. In the space of a few days, three separate news outlets, Getty Images, the BBC and the Evening Standard, had confused me with another female black MP. This was not the first time: it has happened time and again to me and my other colleagues of colour in Parliament. As journalist Gary Younge put it:

“The message is clear. It really doesn’t matter how prominent, accomplished, integrated, qualified or celebrated non-white people become to a significant number of others, including their peers. They will always just be another black person: interchangeable.”

In the eyes of much of the media, it is impossible for me to have my own identity outside of being a black woman. In that sense, I am invisible to them. This is one of the many incidents that exposes a problem within our media—a problem that exists because the workforce who make up our media, the journalists, producers, commentators, editors and presenters, do not reflect modern British society. Jobs across the sector continue to be inaccessible to those without privilege or resources. Just 7% of the UK is privately educated, and roughly 1% graduate from Oxford and Cambridge, but according to the Sutton Trust, 43% of the top figures in news media are privately educated and 36% went to Oxford. We should never forget that Oxbridge makes more offers to one school, Eton, than to all the children on free school meals. It is almost as though there is a direct pipeline from Eton, Harrow and Westminster to Oxbridge and to the heart of our media.

It simply is not getting any better. Social mobility in the United Kingdom is low and not improving.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

I congratulate the hon. Lady, who is a doughty campaigner on many subjects in this House. I wish her well on this one. Does she agree that there should be a natural spread of disability, gender, age, colour, class and creed in the media and the paid rates for this diversity must equate to fitness of purpose for the job and not what sex a presenter or reporter is? The way to do that is better enforcement of pay structures in both the public and private sectors.

[Marsha De Cordova]

I thank the hon. Member for that intervention. He is absolutely right, and I will come on to talk about the pay gaps and problems in those structures.

As I said, things are simply not getting better, and according to the Sutton Trust elite voices continue to dominate our media, as they have since the 1950s. In fact, according to the Government’s own figures, journalists are second only to doctors as the most exclusive profession in Britain, with the majority of journalists coming from middle-class backgrounds.

The lack of working-class representation in our media also means a lack of black, Asian and other minority ethnic group representation. A study by City University and the Sutton Trust shows that 94% of journalists are white and only 0.2% of journalists are black. In a recent report, Ofcom criticised this “woeful” lack of diversity in broadcast television. And I can understand why. There is not a single high-profile British news programme or current affairs series headed by a non-white person. Growing up, I was used to seeing Trevor McDonald and Moira Stuart on my screen. As I grew older I expected to see more people of colour reading the news or providing political commentary, but progress seems to have ground to a halt. The National Council for the Training of Journalists found that the proportion of black broadcast journalists has remained unchanged at 1% since 2002. Figures from Ofcom show that only 10% of those in leadership roles in news and current affairs at the BBC are from a black, Asian or minority ethnic background and that only 7% of ITV and 11% of Sky employees working in journalism are from a black, Asian or minority ethnic background.

There are 8 million black and ethnic minority people in this country and 14 million disabled people, but neither group is given a proper voice in our media. The United Nations convention on the rights of disabled people is clear that all disabled people should have the right to

“effectively and fully participate in…public life on an equal basis with others”,

and that includes the media. The failure to recruit disabled journalists has done little to change that. It is time that we saw blind and partially sighted people like me and disabled people anchoring the news on TV and radio and as political commentators. It is time that we read more columns, op-eds and analysis by wheelchair users. And it is time for all broadcasters to recognise their responsibilities by ensuring that disabled people are recognised in our media.

We cannot forget that diversity in our media means off-screen diversity as well as on-screen diversity. Under a third of TV occupations are held by women, and less than a fifth are from a working-class background. From 2013 to 2016, just 2.2% of British TV episodes were made by ethnic minority directors. That means that entire series of dramas, comedies, sketch shows, reality TV shows, and their story arcs, have been created without any black, Asian or minority ethnic group input. It is time that Ofcom introduced a regulatory mechanism to monitor the make-up of all workforces, on-screen and off-screen. We must not be afraid to say that, like many other areas and sectors of society, our media are a bit pale, a bit male and a bit stale.

I recognise all the important work done by broadcasters and news organisations across the media, but we must ask why there has been so little improvement. Some key factors are making this systemic lack of diversity worse. First, unpaid internships continue to be a key way in which people enter journalism. Recent figures reveal that more than 80% of new entrants to journalism do internships that are unpaid. Working for free is something that can only be done by a select few—that is, by people who live in urban centres and who are supported by their families. An element of the old boys’ club still reigns strong in the media; in some instances, it seems to be a case of not what you know, but who you know. Any Government who are committed to a real living wage and believe that everybody should have an equal chance to work should act to abolish unpaid internships. Secondly, the decimation of local news sources has had a negative impact on aspiring journalists from outside the urban centres, because it has removed the pipeline from local and regional up towards national press and broadcasting.

When the Minister responds, will he tell me whether he agrees that there is a systemic problem with diversity in the media? What are the Government doing to ensure that they fulfil the commitments set out in the industrial strategy, and deliver a media sector that is open to all talented people, irrespective of their race, disability, class or gender? Will he call on all major media corporations to report on all aspects of the diversity of their workforce, including their socioeconomic make-up, and will he legislate to ensure that these organisations publish their pay gap data for gender, disability and ethnicity? Will he introduce a regulatory requirement for organisations to publish the data on their black, Asian and minority ethnic, disability and LGBT workforce from senior executive level to entry level? And will he confirm that the rumours circulating that the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport will be dissolved are not true?

As I come to the end of my speech, I would like to put on record my recognition of the important work done by organisations, such as Channel 4, to increase socioeconomic and regional diversity in their workforces. I commend it for its target to have 12% disabled staff across the organisation by 2023. But we know that there is an unacceptable divide between media and society, as was articulated well by Jon Snow from Channel 4. In the aftermath of the Grenfell Tower tragedy, he lamented the media’s failure to recognise what was happening, saying:

“in an increasingly fractured Britain, we in the media”

have

“little awareness, contact, or connection with those not of the elite.”

A media dominated by the elite means that broadcasters, newspapers and our stories do not reflect the rich diversity of our society. For instance, with so few Muslim journalists—0.2%—it is no coincidence that over a third of newspaper articles “misrepresented or made generalisations” about the Muslim community, according to the Muslim Council of Britain. When disabled staff make up just 5.5% of off-screen staff at major broadcasters, it is no wonder that they are not represented on our TV screens.

Without a diverse workforce made up of every part of our society—without reporters with an understanding of, say, Bristol and Birmingham, and without executives from Oxton as well as Oxbridge—the media will always fail to speak for us all. It is time for real action and time for real change so that our media is by us, for us and about us.

[The Minister for Sport, Media and Creative Industries (Nigel Adams)]

I am delighted to respond to this debate and really grateful to the hon. Member for Battersea (Marsha De Cordova) for securing it. Before I came here this afternoon, my son said to say hello as she is his local MP, so he is delighted that we are having this debate.

[Jim Shannon]

Will the Minister give way?

[Nigel Adams]

Indeed. It is a great surprise to be giving way to the hon. Gentleman.

[Jim Shannon]

Did the Minister’s son vote for the hon. Lady?

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Dame Eleanor Laing)]

Order. I think that is an inadmissible question.